College and living away from home

[PeterPan]

You might look into turmeric. I've been taking it for my asthma and just googling it seems like it can help the inflammation of other things too. https://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/triple-strength-curcumin-900-mg-120-capsules/vs-2564  this is the one I'm taking. It's not cheap, but it works really fast, like noticeably better in a day. I take 1 capsule 3-4 times a day (breakfast, lunch, dinner, bed). 

[Pawz4me]

7 hours ago, PeterPan said:

You might look into turmeric. I've been taking it for my asthma and just googling it seems like it can help the inflammation of other things too. https://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/triple-strength-curcumin-900-mg-120-capsules/vs-2564  this is the one I'm taking. It's not cheap, but it works really fast, like noticeably better in a day. I take 1 capsule 3-4 times a day (breakfast, lunch, dinner, bed). 

FWIW--My rheumatologist says 500 mg. of turmeric twice a day is plenty. That's for me (RA); I don't know if it would be different for people with other conditions. But what you're taking really seems like a huge, huge dosage. You might could cut back, save some money and still get the same results.

[DawnM]

8 hours ago, PeterPan said:

You might look into turmeric. I've been taking it for my asthma and just googling it seems like it can help the inflammation of other things too. https://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/triple-strength-curcumin-900-mg-120-capsules/vs-2564  this is the one I'm taking. It's not cheap, but it works really fast, like noticeably better in a day. I take 1 capsule 3-4 times a day (breakfast, lunch, dinner, bed). 

 

I have seen that mentioned.  Not sure he will take it.  He would have to break them open and eat it.  He can't swallow pills.

[PeterPan]

2 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

FWIW--My rheumatologist says 500 mg. of turmeric twice a day is plenty. That's for me (RA); I don't know if it would be different for people with other conditions. But what you're taking really seems like a huge, huge dosage. You might could cut back, save some money and still get the same results.

Interesting. I arrived at it because it's what it is taking to keep my asthma under control. That's interesting though. And when I first started (9 months ago) I had to take 4 a day or I had breakthrough symptoms. Now I'm usually fine at 3 a day. So maybe I was just terribly inflamed? I don't know, lol. My GP said turmeric is hard on the kidneys and that that would be the thing to watch. I wouldn't be surprised if they're balancing concerns like that. I was getting pneumonia and bronchitis 4 times a year and spiraling down, so I was just glad it worked. I could play with it and see if I stay stable at 2X a day. I've got spring coming up, so I'm going to be pretty cautious.

So do your labs for your RA alter when you take the turmeric? How dramatic have been the changes with it? 

[PeterPan]

This was the study I first read when deciding to try the turmeric. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4190737/  It's saying up to 3.6g/day is GRAS (generally recognized as safe) for a period of 1-4 months. The study got progress with 2g/day but that was add-on therapy. I think I decided to be generous because I was trying to get completely off my inhalers. So even at 4 capsules a day I'm within GRAS levels. 

The other issue is that the products say one thing on the bottle but are standardized to a different level. So something might say this or that on the front and be standardized to a much lower level. But they're saying it can be safe up to 8g/day.

As for cost, I was paying $60 for the one inhaler and the 2nd was going to be $200 once my "free year" ran out. And I was still getting sick on top of that. So I'm saving money big time, lol. Yeah, the turmeric is expensive. We'll see. Spring is coming up and I'm going to be careful. I probably should take an antihistamine (wool rugs, dog, etc.) but it gives me headaches. 

Edited March 24, 2019 by PeterPan

[Pawz4me]

30 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

 

So do your labs for your RA alter when you take the turmeric? How dramatic have been the changes with it? 

I'm on two prescription DMARDs as well as turmeric. And I started the second DMARD at the same time I started turmeric. So it's not possible to really determine which of them is helping most, or if it's the combo of all of them.

[PeterPan]

57 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

I'm on two prescription DMARDs as well as turmeric. And I started the second DMARD at the same time I started turmeric. So it's not possible to really determine which of them is helping most, or if it's the combo of all of them.

Interesting. Well you could flip it and see for yourself. What I'm reading doesn't seem to indicate that 500mg is some sort of max. They're going much higher in these studies. Of course I don't have RA and it might be that for RA that caps the benefit. But for the asthma, yeah they're taking it a lot higher. I definitely feel the difference and can measure the difference with my peak flow meter.

[Pawz4me]

2 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Interesting. Well you could flip it and see for yourself. What I'm reading doesn't seem to indicate that 500mg is some sort of max. They're going much higher in these studies. Of course I don't have RA and it might be that for RA that caps the benefit. But for the asthma, yeah they're taking it a lot higher. I definitely feel the difference and can measure the difference with my peak flow meter.

Flip it? You mean go off the DMARDs? No heck no. I've seen up close and personal what happens when someone thinks they can treat RA with all natural stuff. It's not a risk I"m willing to take. The joints might be feeling okay while silent damage is being done to heart, lungs, eyes, etc.

[PeterPan]

20 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

Flip it? You mean go off the DMARDs? No heck no.

Oh I totally agree. I just meant flip the argument mentally. You were saying 500mg was enough, and I was saying what if you flipped that and asked what is a dose that would max out the benefit for your situation. That's what I did with mine and it was much higher. But yeah, I agree no pipe dreams on the RA meds. I know someone who did natural stuff and her family was like please, please use meds. It's the problem I don't ever want, ugh. 

[DawnM]

And ARGH!  He just missed one class 4 times.  If he misses 5 it is an automatic F.   School rules.  We will be calling him Thur, his last day of class, to make sure he makes it.  

DH and I are strongly considering making him stay home next year or at least a partial year, so that he can decompress and get some help.   He is very depressed and a mess right now.  He could stay a student by taking some online classes and maybe a few CC classes, with pre-approval, for Gen Ed stuff he still needs to do.

If you are the praying type, please say a prayer for him.  He has today and tomorrow and then is done.  He is currently getting two Bs.  We thought we would let him take 2/3 the load this quarter and it would help and he could get two As and give himself a buffer in grades for keeping his 3.0 scholarship even if he ended up with a C down the road in a Gen Ed that he hates, etc.....but NOPE, he is hovering right at that 3.0 for everything and if he gets an F he will lose his scholarship.

This is SO HARD and STRESSFUL for all of us.

Between this, my dad being in the hospital last week, the house sale and purchase, end of the school year testing at work, and a few other things going on right now, I am not sleeping well, have sciatica bad, and just need the summer to START!

 

[8filltheheart]

Sorry to read that Dawn. I understand your frustration. Our ds sabotages himself by making incredibly poor decisions that ultimately close doors that he says he wants open. 

[PeterPan]

4 hours ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

Sorry to read that Dawn. I understand your frustration. Our ds sabotages himself by making incredibly poor decisions that ultimately close doors that he says he wants open. 

And the kicker is, even if he wants the doors open, that doesn't mean he can do what's on the other side. That's like me buying a car. There's what I want (literally want, ie. a sports car, a Mustang), and then what I'm willing to put up with stuff to make happen (what other people mean when they say want).

My dd is at this same stage right now, where she has to maintain a 3.0 to go to her school. We cut the load, like op, and it helps. Reality though is it's hard and things are going to get hairier depending on if she adds a certification in that she's considering. For me, I'm just trying to be pretty detached, like if she holds it together and stays I'm good with it and if she doesn't and can't I'm good with it too. 

Edited May 29, 2019 by PeterPan

[Innisfree]

I'm sorry, Dawn. No advice, but I get it.

[DawnM]

I love his advisor, she has been so helpful to us.

She just emailed me exactly what he could still take online, what he could still take at a different college for transfer (and how to fill out the paperwork) and how many classes he has to take to still get his scholarship and financial aid, and how long he could be away from his college without having to reapply.  

It gives us a solid look at decision making for next year.

[DawnM]

He is HOME!

Solid B in one class and we are waiting for the grade in the other.  Bs will keep his scholarship,  but he is beating himself up over not getting As.  

He has asked that we drop all summer online classes he was signed up for and go to therapy and get help. We have signed him up for an Aspie group and are looking into CBT or Ind. therapy as well.

His advisor and I devised a plan for him to stay home next year and take some CC classes and online classes through his college and still stay on track and go back his Sr. year but it is up to him.

[PeterPan]

On the counseling, he might like a mix of people. Like a p-doc for the anxiety, someone who knows autism better for working through life skills and social questions. What we're finding is no one person typically has all the answers to all the questions, so a mix of people works better. If he's taking a break in the summer, it's a good time. My dd came home from college with a lot of questions, and that's what we did, giving her access to a variety of providers so she could address the *range* of questions she had. That's a really good sign when he's having them for himself. Just saying don't limit it. More can be more better on this. Or it can be fatiguing, lol. But it really can be like rocket fuel when they realize THEY have the questions and are given access to the people (on 1:1) who want to discuss those things. 

You could also look for an educational therapist, someone who does a lot with EF. Definitely don't stick to just one person. In parts of the country you can find one provider or another type more easily, so look across those categories and blend. 

Does he do well with online classes? For my dd they're lacking in structure. Hopefully he'll be fine, and if he's done them before he knows how they'll roll. They're definitely not my dd's favorite way to learn.

[Lecka]

Personally I would look for ways to add structure to his day.  

I’m guessing you will be available in the summer and then back at work in the Fall.

I think if he can have some routine like — going to a gym, attending a church breakfast group, or anything like that, that could continue when you are back at work, it can go a long way.  

A part-time job can add structure and a social group for some people.  

For my cousin getting isolated can lead to a malaise and then to sleep problems.

Something volunteering where he sees the same people could also be some structure and social.  

It is a lot of hours in the day while (I assume) you and your husband are out of the house, and it is easy to feel isolated then if he doesn’t connect with people at CC.  

When I went to CC for a summer years ago, they had a really neat foreign student club, and it is something I would have joined, and some of the foreign students did hang around at the CC a lot.    They were full-time students waiting to pass their English language test to transfer, or just spending a year in the US taking English language classes.  

[Lecka]

Anyway — I think that sounds good, and I am glad he is home!  I just would be most concerned about being isolated next year, I think it’s something that is worth trying to prevent.  

[DawnM]

While I appreciate the suggestions, some of that just doesn't apply to him.  He does not need life skills help.  He learned most of that in boy scouts and at home.  It is when the depression sets in that everything goes to pot and that is the biggest piece we need to figure out.

And he chose to go out to a friend's party last night and stayed out until 1am so I am thrilled that he had a good time and stayed late.  He needed it.

Online classes may not be the perfect answer, and we wouldn't do all online, but he can't go to school and live at home because there are no schools here that offer his major.  He can stay home and do some general eds for a year.

[Lecka]

Okay, when he is depressed, does he need more support to get out and do things?  That is really all I meant.  

For some reference, my cousin is in a program where people with some things (including depression) can go in the day for structure and for job help, it is (from my understanding) really supposed to help people who are depressed not to be alone too much, or without structure too much.  (If they know it is not good for them, specifically.)

But this is more adults, it might not be the same at all for someone living with their family.  

If it doesn’t apply to you, that is great.  But if he is going to have longer periods of time alone, I think it is worth thinking about.  

If he has a lot of local friends, that is a good sign, too.  It’s probably not really an issue then if he maintains his social life.  

[DawnM]

8 minutes ago, Lecka said:

Okay, when he is depressed, does he need more support to get out and do things?  That is really all I meant.  

For some reference, my cousin is in a program where people with some things (including depression) can go in the day for structure and for job help, it is (from my understanding) really supposed to help people who are depressed not to be alone too much, or without structure too much.  (If they know it is not good for them, specifically.)

But this is more adults, it might not be the same at all for someone living with their family.  

If it doesn’t apply to you, that is great.  But if he is going to have longer periods of time alone, I think it is worth thinking about.  

If he has a lot of local friends, that is a good sign, too.  It’s probably not really an issue then if he maintains his social life.  

 

Gotcha.

He said today, "Mom, I feel so much better being home with family."

Sigh.....I wish there were a local college option.  I mean, he COULD change majors, but it would no longer be something he is overly passionate about.  

The hardest thing for me is that people do like him at school.  He gets invited out, has people asking to do things with him, but he gets in a funk and will say no.  He doesn't do that as much at home.

 

[Lecka]

This is also how it is with my cousin..... if he starts missing things, we know he isn’t doing as well.

If there are weekly things (or even one thing) then it can make it easier to know “okay he has missed this thing, now he has missed it two weeks in a row, now he has missed it three weeks in a row.”  So that can be an easy way to know — okay, it seems like it’s a little worse, is something not working, is he taking his medicine (may not apply), do we need to see his counselor sooner, etc.  

On the other hand, if there is a weekly thing and he is going and looking forward to it, etc, then you can know “things are going good, the medicine is going good, the frequency he sees the counselor is going good.”  

That could be harder to tell than if — maybe his friends are busy that week and that’s why he doesn’t go out, etc.  

If he is likely to get together with friends weekly anyways when he is home — then you can just go by that a lot I think.

This may not be the same kind of thing, but we know if my cousin skips his church group then he is probably not doing well and it is better to try to see what is going off-track, earlier. 

And then too, if he is around people at that point it is a lot better.  But for us that looks more like — relatives going to pick him up to eat dinner.  My aunt and uncle see him every day and will be aware when he is skipping things, but he doesn’t live with them.  

 

[Lecka]

My understanding is it’s a bad spiral, where — my cousin is this way — he will stop doing as much, and then while he isn’t going as much, he gets worse.  He does better when he is doing things.  

So it’s partly a sign things are going worse, and it also makes things get worse.  

 

[Lecka]

I hope you can find someone to get specific advice for your son.  

This is just something else about my cousin — he is pretty dutiful.  That is part of his personality.

For him — if he has a standing commitment and he is expected, he is MUCH more likely to do that than to do something that is not a standing commitment.  It will also be less stressful for him because he can know what to expect, and not wonder what it will be like.  That is a part for him.

So this is where — having a commitment that would be mentally healthy and work for him, can be good.  I do think CC could be that.  Online school I doubt it, unless it has a lot more interaction than I would expect.  On the bright side, it could be much lower stress.  

But for my cousin he is less likely to skip a commitment, and some commitments are very, very positive for him.

If he has friends who get together regularly and he won’t skip on them because he has known them longer ———— that could be perfect.  

I think it can also be good to have another thing going, just in case school does not go as well as he wants.  

I think it is going to be a really good sign if he gets back to himself in the next few weeks.  Then I would not worry.  

If he is not back to himself in a few weeks, I think that will be different.  You can just see if he is back to himself with being home.  Hopefully he will be 🙂. 

It sounds like he already he is, since he has already gone out with friends.  That is such a good sign 🙂

[DawnM]

5 hours ago, Lecka said:

I hope you can find someone to get specific advice for your son.  

This is just something else about my cousin — he is pretty dutiful.  That is part of his personality.

For him — if he has a standing commitment and he is expected, he is MUCH more likely to do that than to do something that is not a standing commitment.  It will also be less stressful for him because he can know what to expect, and not wonder what it will be like.  That is a part for him.

So this is where — having a commitment that would be mentally healthy and work for him, can be good.  I do think CC could be that.  Online school I doubt it, unless it has a lot more interaction than I would expect.  On the bright side, it could be much lower stress.  

 

He has actually done online classes through the community college before.  It isn't his preference, but he got good grades with them.

5 hours ago, Lecka said:

But for my cousin he is less likely to skip a commitment, and some commitments are very, very positive for him.

If he has friends who get together regularly and he won’t skip on them because he has known them longer ———— that could be perfect.  

I think it can also be good to have another thing going, just in case school does not go as well as he wants.  

I think it is going to be a really good sign if he gets back to himself in the next few weeks.  Then I would not worry.  

If he is not back to himself in a few weeks, I think that will be different.  You can just see if he is back to himself with being home.  Hopefully he will be 🙂. 

It sounds like he already he is, since he has already gone out with friends.  That is such a good sign 🙂

 

[PeterPan]

On June 1, 2019 at 3:26 PM, DawnM said:

 

Gotcha.

He said today, "Mom, I feel so much better being home with family."

Sigh.....I wish there were a local college option.  I mean, he COULD change majors, but it would no longer be something he is overly passionate about.  

The hardest thing for me is that people do like him at school.  He gets invited out, has people asking to do things with him, but he gets in a funk and will say no.  He doesn't do that as much at home.

 

I'm just going way outta the box here, because hey why not. What if you took out an apartment and came to visit him on the weekends? Or do people tend to stay in the dorms at this school all 4 years?

[DawnM]

6 hours ago, PeterPan said:

I'm just going way outta the box here, because hey why not. What if you took out an apartment and came to visit him on the weekends? Or do people tend to stay in the dorms at this school all 4 years?

 

We actually talked about ALL options last night.  Not in a "let's decide right now" kind of way, but in a "what do we do to help this kid" sort of way.

The problem is, the area immediately around where he needs to be isn't all that safe, and he doesn't drive, so it would have to be walking distance.  He was offered the chance to live about 2.5 miles away in an apartment, but the bus system would mean prob an hour, and the area is so congested that a bike wouldn't be safe either.  He doesn't want to spend and hour going back and forth.  I get it, but.....

I did go through his CC account last night.  He only needs 5 classes to get his AA and 4 of them are classes that should transfer back to . his 4 year college.  We would get pre-approval of course, but they are all classes that came up in conversation with his advisor.

So, if he takes those 5, gets his AA, and maybe takes 3 online through his current college, he should be able to stay on track.  Now, whether or not he will agree to it, or whether or not he can ever go back is the issue.   

But we DID say we will be visiting more often starting next quarter.  We started by doing 3 visits per 10 week quarter, so, about every 3 weeks.  Then we went to 2,  and now 1.  He may need 3 again.

We are trying to be positive and encourage him, but it is hard not to just say, "DUDE!  You are screwing up and we can't keep funding this!"  

 

[PeterPan]

1 hour ago, DawnM said:

he doesn't drive, so it would have to be walking distance.

If you download the uber or lyft apps, you can watch them and see how often and dependably they have drivers available. I didn't drive till grad school, so I walked. But now uber/lyft would be the way to do it. 

If he gets his associates, is he employable in his field of interest?

[DawnM]

2 hours ago, PeterPan said:

If you download the uber or lyft apps, you can watch them and see how often and dependably they have drivers available. I didn't drive till grad school, so I walked. But now uber/lyft would be the way to do it. 

If he gets his associates, is he employable in his field of interest?

 

Not ubering or lyfting daily.   That would add a significant amount of $$.  And stress for him to get into a car with a stranger.  He wouldn't even do it to the grocery store, he wanted to just do Shipt and have it delivered.

Not really sure about employ-ability, he can get *A* job, but not the level he wants to be at.

[PeterPan]

On the anxiety, you could look into the TPH2 defect and taking 5HTP or meds.

Edited June 3, 2019 by PeterPan

[DawnM]

5 hours ago, PeterPan said:

On the anxiety, you could look into the TPH2 defect and taking 5HTP or meds.

 

Are you talking about using meds to get an Uber or Lyft?  I wouldn't put him on meds to get an Uber.....he has less stress in the on-campus apartments without an Uber or the added time.

[PeterPan]

No, you were saying he has anxiety, and I was thinking the anxiety showing up there is probably showing up other places in his life and thus a goal to work on this coming year. It probably explains some of his difficulties with problem solving, his absences, etc. I'm not a fan of meds either, but working on the TPH2 defect by taking 5HTP gets you to a similar place simply by replacing what isn't being made in the body.

tryptophan-->5HTP-->serotonin and melatonin.

So if the TPH2 gene for the enzyme to convert tryptophan to 5HTP isn't working well you end up with insomnia and anxiety/depression, which kinda sounds like a fair chunk of the spectrum population. Some researchers were looking at tryptophan as a marker for ASD but it didn't quite work out. 

[DawnM]

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

No, you were saying he has anxiety, and I was thinking the anxiety showing up there is probably showing up other places in his life and thus a goal to work on this coming year. It probably explains some of his difficulties with problem solving, his absences, etc. I'm not a fan of meds either, but working on the TPH2 defect by taking 5HTP gets you to a similar place simply by replacing what isn't being made in the body.

tryptophan-->5HTP-->serotonin and melatonin.

So if the TPH2 gene for the enzyme to convert tryptophan to 5HTP isn't working well you end up with insomnia and anxiety/depression, which kinda sounds like a fair chunk of the spectrum population. Some researchers were looking at tryptophan as a marker for ASD but it didn't quite work out. 

 

Ah, ok.  Well, something to consider.  He is pretty anti taking anything, although his brother takes melatonin dummies and he has tried some in the last couple of nights.  So, he may be more open

[PeterPan]

And if he gets interested in the idea of genetics, then he might be more engaged. Nobody wants to be fixed or treated, but when you can see the genes and go ok here's the issue, then it's pretty logical to take stuff. Like you can see the vitamin D receptor gene defect and you take vitamin D.

[DawnM]

32 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

And if he gets interested in the idea of genetics, then he might be more engaged. Nobody wants to be fixed or treated, but when you can see the genes and go ok here's the issue, then it's pretty logical to take stuff. Like you can see the vitamin D receptor gene defect and you take vitamin D.

 

Interested in genetics......🤣🙄😖No, he won't get more interested in genetics and that won't  "engage him."  You are talking like he is neuro-typical, "If you just get him to see X, then he will rationally think Y."  That never happens with him.  Never.  

[DawnM]

Just a little update.

He did not fail anything, but he is teetering right at the 3.0 mark for college right now, which we wouldn't care as much about if his scholarship didn't require a 3.0 or above.  And he has to repeat one class as you have to have a B or above in all classes in your major.

But, he has taken it upon himself to sign up for group therapy for the Fall, at his college.  We are hoping he sticks with it as it will be a condition of his continuing to go there.  But we are thankful he signed himself up.

 

[DawnM]

We are in discussions.  He says he doesn't want to go back.  Loves the school, loves the idea of school there, but the reality of it isn't working.

So, we discussed a couple of options last night.

1. Finish your CC AA degree....5 more classes, 4 of which will transfer back to your current college if you decide to go back.

2. Transfer to an online program at a different school and live at home while you do the online program (not nearly as prestigious as your current school, but that dream may have to go)

3. Take a break completely

[Storygirl]

You may have said this already, but I've forgotten. Will the AA degree qualify him for certain type of jobs in his area of interest? I can see a benefit of getting the AA, working a few years, then completing the bachelor's if needed and wanted at that time.

I hope that you guys are able to work out a plan soon, so that he can get things lined up for the fall, if needed. I also know you are in the middle of house selling stress, so that you have a lot going on, all at one time!!

[PeterPan]

1 hour ago, HeighHo said:

a skype call on family occasions

Total aside, but you can do this with the Echo Show from Amazon I think... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HZJ64WD/ref=ods_gw_ha_h1_d_cs_061719?pf_rd_p=52543d6a-ab26-46e2-96e3-d92ae4f47408&pf_rd_r=6CJ8Z9662YZ6YJ2CW5TV  I was thinking about getting my mother one to make it simpler to skype. 

2 hours ago, DawnM said:

He says he doesn't want to go back.

Sigh, I'm sorry it's hard. If it's any consolation, I'm waiting for my dd to say the same thing. Her grades are fine, she has held her scholarship but I think the whole thing is just kind of interminable and hard. I think it's also this interference with her LIFE. Like it wasn't like she had no life and was going to find one. That's why she's been sewing and cooking and finding herself again this summer. 

Will the AA do anything for him? Or is it more like completing what you started, feel better about what happened? I'm just asking. If it allows him access to something he wants to do, that seems worth it. If it doesn't, I'm not sure that here or there matters. May he do really well with online and CC courses, sure. And I think being at home could be good if it worked for him before. 

Can he pause his other university and go back in a year if he's in a better place and wants to? How is he doing pursuing the depression treatment and counseling? 

Ok, so this is my two cents, and I'm going way out here. I think it's a very common scenario (with spectrum individuals) to get a degree and not work in it. So then it's really how important is it to him, what is he really going to do, maybe at this point he'd rather just go do it. Like it's nice to say oh I want to work in my field of intellectual interest, but not everyone does. Not everyone has the social skills or stamina to do it. 

I don't think I'd want him back home not working. If he's not going to do schooling, I'd want him in a job and with some plan for leisure and possibly counseling so he's not sitting in the house a lot. You've probably already thought through that. 

I think any answer you guys decide together can have a good outcome.

 

[DawnM]

The AA may get him somewhere, not 100% in his field of study, but somewhere.  And 4 out of the 5 classes WILL transfer back, so that is helpful if he decides to go back.

He already signed up for weekly group therapy at their counseling center so if he goes back, he will do that.  We already talk to him more than once a week, sometimes Skype sometimes just phone.   Communication with us isn't the issues.  We used to go down every 3 weeks, but we stopped.  We have decided if he goes back, we will be doing that again.

We are just in the talking it out phase and I am working on getting more info from the online program for him.

[Lawyer&Mom]

I hope you can find a path that doesn’t involve him giving up completely on his dream field yet.  Because as an Autistic adult who had a *bumpy* undergraduate experience, I know that things might get easier for him in a few years.  Me in grad school in my mid twenties was a whole different person than me really struggling my senior year.  It took a few difficult years of living at home, but I was eventually able to get back on track.  We are 3-4 years behind.  We can really blossom with time.

[DawnM]

21 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Total aside, but you can do this with the Echo Show from Amazon I think... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HZJ64WD/ref=ods_gw_ha_h1_d_cs_061719?pf_rd_p=52543d6a-ab26-46e2-96e3-d92ae4f47408&pf_rd_r=6CJ8Z9662YZ6YJ2CW5TV  I was thinking about getting my mother one to make it simpler to skype. 

Sigh, I'm sorry it's hard. If it's any consolation, I'm waiting for my dd to say the same thing. Her grades are fine, she has held her scholarship but I think the whole thing is just kind of interminable and hard. I think it's also this interference with her LIFE. Like it wasn't like she had no life and was going to find one. That's why she's been sewing and cooking and finding herself again this summer. 

Will the AA do anything for him? Or is it more like completing what you started, feel better about what happened? I'm just asking. If it allows him access to something he wants to do, that seems worth it. If it doesn't, I'm not sure that here or there matters. May he do really well with online and CC courses, sure. And I think being at home could be good if it worked for him before. 

Can he pause his other university and go back in a year if he's in a better place and wants to? How is he doing pursuing the depression treatment and counseling? 

Ok, so this is my two cents, and I'm going way out here. I think it's a very common scenario (with spectrum individuals) to get a degree and not work in it. So then it's really how important is it to him, what is he really going to do, maybe at this point he'd rather just go do it. Like it's nice to say oh I want to work in my field of intellectual interest, but not everyone does. Not everyone has the social skills or stamina to do it. 

I don't think I'd want him back home not working. If he's not going to do schooling, I'd want him in a job and with some plan for leisure and possibly counseling so he's not sitting in the house a lot. You've probably already thought through that. 

I think any answer you guys decide together can have a good outcome.

 

 

Oh, sorry, thought i answered all of this.
He is back in group therapy here at home.  He started last week.  I want him to do some ind. therapy as well and possibly some CBT, but I have been too busy to look into it closely (ie: go talk to one of the therapists about it)

Yes, he can pause his school for a year.  He can stay out for one full year (4 quarters) and jump right back in, keeping his scholarship.  If it is more than one year, he has to reapply.  My thinking is that if he can even take one online class that 4th quarter, that can restart the clock another year, just in case.

The other idea is that if he wants to do the online program, finish up in 12-18 months and then go to his school of choice for a grad program, that would work too.

However, he is leaning towards Community College and finishing that up right now.  

It is hard FOR ME.....he had such a dream to go to this college and finish up and get a great job.  He is very talented and honestly, his major comes very easily to him academically, but the social-emotional is killing his dream.  It makes me very sad.

[DawnM]

20 hours ago, Lawyer&Mom said:

I hope you can find a path that doesn’t involve him giving up completely on his dream field yet.  Because as an Autistic adult who had a *bumpy* undergraduate experience, I know that things might get easier for him in a few years.  Me in grad school in my mid twenties was a whole different person than me really struggling my senior year.  It took a few difficult years of living at home, but I was eventually able to get back on track.  We are 3-4 years behind.  We can really blossom with time.

 

Yeah, and maybe a year or so at home will help gain some perspective.  

[PeterPan]

4 minutes ago, DawnM said:

honestly, his major comes very easily to him academically, but the social-emotional is killing his dream. 

Sigh, it makes sense. I was thinking about this some more, and I see such a movement towards self-advocacy in the autism community. It seems like that's the piece he's missing. It was the very first thing the counselor talked with my dd about when she started, and I'm like WHY ARE YOU WASTING TIME, SHE'S FINE. But they're like nope, self-advocacy is where it's at. And when I mentioned that with the genes before you were kinda like not realistic. So I don't know if that's a male/female thing and all the people self-advocating for their disabilities are women? I see a LOT of self-advocacy online. Is it an age thing? I don't know.

I was pretty oblivious at this age. Like I don't know if I self-advocated, because I just kinda got through, living in little niches where I survived. So in a way it's a standard (self-advocacy) that I doubt I myself did. That's a good question whether I do it now. Maybe? I have a hard time predicting where my problems will be in order to self-advocate and head them off. I get in a lot of pickles from that lack of prediction, sigh. 

I don't know, I'm just thinking out loud here. I get that he's not, but if he's not doing it in college it will be hard in the workplace also. And those are discussions they would have in the 1:1 counseling, yes. Finding the right fit is tricky. With my dd I ended up giving her access to two counselor, one for practical (issues with walking, her praxis, confidence, how to self-advocate, disability stuff) and the other for emotional/life stuff (what if I hate my parents or wish I were a polar bear, I don't know). He might find a mix is useful.

I think the other thing for my dd right now, same gig, two years in, is just fatigue. I was talking with a friend who works at a university who says that part is NORMAL. And I think the disability-related issues pile on top of the mid-process SLUMP and that could be really disastrous for b&w thinkers who are like nope, done, let me outta here. And my dd was definitely feeling that. She's spent the whole summer cooking, riding horses, and I think sewing medieval costumes for a wedding (I kid you not). Like it's the most bizarrely unproductive summer ever, lol. But she's getting rested enough that she's now saying she'll go back, she'll plow on.

Maybe can your ds volunteer in his field of interest or do an internship or something? I don't know, just thinking. My dd is a doer, so getting back to her doing (which college had gotten in the way of) has been restorative. You might be able to get that 1:1 through a transition services coordinator (BCBA, whomever). If he volunteers in his field a bit, he would have issues to talk over with that person.

[DawnM]

10 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Sigh, it makes sense. I was thinking about this some more, and I see such a movement towards self-advocacy in the autism community. It seems like that's the piece he's missing. It was the very first thing the counselor talked with my dd about when she started, and I'm like WHY ARE YOU WASTING TIME, SHE'S FINE. But they're like nope, self-advocacy is where it's at. And when I mentioned that with the genes before you were kinda like not realistic. So I don't know if that's a male/female thing and all the people self-advocating for their disabilities are women? I see a LOT of self-advocacy online. Is it an age thing? I don't know.

I was pretty oblivious at this age. Like I don't know if I self-advocated, because I just kinda got through, living in little niches where I survived. So in a way it's a standard (self-advocacy) that I doubt I myself did. That's a good question whether I do it now. Maybe? I have a hard time predicting where my problems will be in order to self-advocate and head them off. I get in a lot of pickles from that lack of prediction, sigh. 

He has been self advocating.  That isn't the issue.  But when he has a complete meltdown, he can't function.  And he has been through years of therapy, so "he just needs to learn coping skills" isn't the answer.  He has learned them, he just struggles to apply them in the moment.

 

10 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

I don't know, I'm just thinking out loud here. I get that he's not, but if he's not doing it in college it will be hard in the workplace also. And those are discussions they would have in the 1:1 counseling, yes. Finding the right fit is tricky. With my dd I ended up giving her access to two counselor, one for practical (issues with walking, her praxis, confidence, how to self-advocate, disability stuff) and the other for emotional/life stuff (what if I hate my parents or wish I were a polar bear, I don't know). He might find a mix is useful.

We are aware the workplace may pose issues, we are just hoping he either will come after he has matured more, or he can do work from home or partially from home.

10 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

I think the other thing for my dd right now, same gig, two years in, is just fatigue. I was talking with a friend who works at a university who says that part is NORMAL. And I think the disability-related issues pile on top of the mid-process SLUMP and that could be really disastrous for b&w thinkers who are like nope, done, let me outta here. And my dd was definitely feeling that. She's spent the whole summer cooking, riding horses, and I think sewing medieval costumes for a wedding (I kid you not). Like it's the most bizarrely unproductive summer ever, lol. But she's getting rested enough that she's now saying she'll go back, she'll plow on.

I am hoping that he either takes some time away and regroups, or does the online program and can move on.  

I am not sure what you mean by unproductive, emotional healing for an Aspie is most definitely productive in my book.  And he needs it.

10 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Maybe can your ds volunteer in his field of interest or do an internship or something? I don't know, just thinking. My dd is a doer, so getting back to her doing (which college had gotten in the way of) has been restorative. You might be able to get that 1:1 through a transition services coordinator (BCBA, whomever). If he volunteers in his field a bit, he would have issues to talk over with that person.

He tried to get an internship and couldn't.  And no volunteering opportunities.  He is working on a project and hoping to put that in his portfolio, etc.....but I honestly don't know what all he has done towards it.

[Lawyer&Mom]

I love that *you* believe in him.  My mom did so much advocacy for me after my college implosion.  I thought I was forever broken, she (correctly) thought there was another chapter out there for me.  I didn’t have a diagnosis at the time.  (No one like me would have back then.)  I just fear that if I had had a diagnosis someone might have told my mom to permanently scale back my plans because “ASD.”

The undergrad implosion is so common when I talk to other Autistic adult professionals online.  Yes, be practical and realistic, but struggling with college is definitely time for regroup, “presume competence” and add supports, and not “abandon ship!”

Self advocacy:  I was okayish in high school which was a comfortable, familiar environment.  I was dreadful in undergrad. I went back to okayish in grad school due to maturity and a smaller program.  (I do better when people know me and I’m not asking a complete stranger for help.)  Self advocacy is so important, but it’s not a static thing.  It comes and goes situationally, it improves with maturity and practice...  If it’s not there now, during a crisis period, doesn’t mean it won’t ever be there. 

[PeterPan]

2 hours ago, DawnM said:

But when he has a complete meltdown, he can't function. 

No wonder he doesn't want to go back, sigh. When my ds has had that level of experience, he pretty much gives up on the place. 

2 hours ago, DawnM said:

I am not sure what you mean by unproductive

Unproductive in the sense of get a job, do an internship, something. It has been what she needed, definitely. 

2 hours ago, DawnM said:

He tried to get an internship and couldn't.  And no volunteering opportunities. 

Bummer. 

Well plow on. You're doing the right things. 

[PeterPan]

Dd ran into that too, that internships didn't come with housing but lower paid (entry level) summer staff got housing. I was flabbergasted. She was literally going to pay to work for them, so she didn't take the job. Well that and she wasn't happy with the offer, thought there were other things going on. But yeah, that wasn't what I expected, that's for sure.

[DawnM]

As of today, he still doesn't want to go back in the Fall.  I am not giving up his spot just yet.  Payment is due in Aug and we will wait until then.

He is going to group therapy and wants to invite the group over for a pool party at our new house next week.  So, yay!  And he wants to get a job.  Last night we looked at a few possibilities.  His therapist said to just get a "regular job" for now.  Two openings are for a Vet office to just work with the animals, which might be great for him.   

No more mention of CC and when I brought it up he said, "I dont' want to talk about any school right now."  So, I let it go.  Classes may be filled up by the time he is ready to commit, but I can't worry about that.  It is what it is, and DH and I know that the student loans will start coming in if he isn't signed up for enough classes in the Fall.  Thankfully we only took out student direct loans, $5k per year, so we will owe less than $10k.  But still.

[Storygirl]

Ugh about the money, but I'm sure you are right to not push and give him time.

I'm glad he is bonding with his therapy group. I think that's a big deal!

DS15 was diagnosed with ASD just this last week, but I have been certain that he has it for a long time. The psych recommends that he starts therapy, and, while I think that is the right thing to do, I also worry, because the other times he has done therapy (with two psychs and with SLPs and social groups), he has not really been willing to work on things, so we haven't seen a lasting effect.

The fact that your son is willing to go to therapy and also wants to invite the others over --- that seems really positive to me.

I hope he finds a good summer job!