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Speaking of Vaccines.... Rabies

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Yes, because all we need is people NOT getting a rabies vaccination because they will never be able to afford it....

Family mourning dad's rabies death receives hefty bill for relatives' vaccines: report

https://www.foxnews.com/health/family-mourning-dads-rabies-death-receives-hefty-bill-for-relatives-vaccines-report?utm_source=quora&utm_medium=referral

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This was a jaw dropper quote for me. 

Quote

At the time of her husband’s death, Juanita Giles told media outlets that the couple allowed bats to land on their hands and lick their fingers because they hadn’t known they were infected with rabies. She told KSL-TV that they woke up to find the bats walking on the couple’s bed.

I kind of feel like in the name of public health, the city should eat the $50k and use this as an extreme cautionary tale in PSAs. Do not let bats in your house! Much less lick you! No bats walking around in your bed!!!! This is very, very bad!! 

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Just now, Æthelthryth the Texan said:

This was a jaw dropper quote for me. 

I kind of feel like in the name of public health, the city should eat the $50k and use this as an extreme cautionary tale in PSAs. Do not let bats in your house! Much less lick you! No bats walking around in your bed!!!! This is very, very bad!! 

Yeah, I was cringing....who does that??

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Wow. My ds had to get rabies shots after a bat collided with him and our insurance paid in full.

I shuddered while reading that article - they had bats in their house and would let the bats crawl on them and lick their fingers, and they would wake up with bats on their bed. Yikes...

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What person in their right mind thinks it’s ok to have free-roaming BATS inside their house???

It’s hard to imagine that a middle-aged couple and their children could have lived all those years without ever having heard that bats can carry rabies.

Yikes.

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DH was bitten by a bat 4 years or so ago.  We'd just moved into a new house (like, that day) and there was a small black lump near the fireplace.  DH sort of nudged it with his toe, realized it was a bat.  Later that night he was looking more closely at the toe and saw that there were two very small pinpricks; I drove over to my mom's and looked up bat bite on the internet, at like 3 in the morning, and off he went to the ER.  They gave him all the injections, which he says were intensely painful, I guess partially because the toe is sort of a closed-off area, so it became swollen with the stuff they injected.

It cost I think $5k; we don't carry that kind of health insurance so we paid out of pocket over the course of a year or so.  

Turned out the fireplace was leaning outward from the house and there was a gap between the fireplace and the wall just wide enough for a bat.  The landlord could not be convinced that the bat could have come from there; he thought it must have flown in while we were moving, during broad daylight, landed near the fireplace, and passed out.

Bat did not turn out to have rabies.

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We got a separate bill from the attending physician by the way, for like $700; his involvement was this: 

walk into exam room.  listen to DH say he nudged a bat with his toe and has these marks on his toe which the internet said looked like a bite. look at toe for 2 seconds. say "yep, bat." walk out, order rabies immunoglobulin (sp?).  

$700!  I know it is standard, and all, but what does this guy make, $10,000/hr????

ugh, ER prices.

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I don't understand why the family would think the treatment would be free. People with other life threatening medical conditions expect to pay for it even if the treatment is not successful. How do hospitals normally handle billing after a patient dies? 

my DH had to get the rabies shots, but it was do to a work related exposure, so it was covered as part of workman's comp. the difficult part was actually getting the vaccines delivered to our very small town. It had to come from several hours away.

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3 minutes ago, City Mouse said:

I don't understand why the family would think the treatment would be free. People with other life threatening medical conditions expect to pay for it even if the treatment is not successful. How do hospitals normally handle billing after a patient dies? 

my DH had to get the rabies shots, but it was do to a work related exposure, so it was covered as part of workman's comp. the difficult part was actually getting the vaccines delivered to our very small town. It had to come from several hours away.

This. And did they not have health insurance?

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11 minutes ago, Frances said:

This. And did they not have health insurance?

That was their cost AFTER insurance. That's our country's messed up medical care system. After he died and they learned it was from rabies, they (I think county health department) said everyone who visited him in ICU had to get vaccinated, and she said they told her not to worry about cost.

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When my dad died the hospital sent the bill to him at home; if he'd had an estate I guess the estate would have paid it.  He had nada, though.

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31 minutes ago, City Mouse said:

I don't understand why the family would think the treatment would be free. People with other life threatening medical conditions expect to pay for it even if the treatment is not successful. How do hospitals normally handle billing after a patient dies? 

my DH had to get the rabies shots, but it was do to a work related exposure, so it was covered as part of workman's comp. the difficult part was actually getting the vaccines delivered to our very small town. It had to come from several hours away.

The thing is, it is a public health issue that people exposed to rabies should get rabies vaccinations.  Of course most of us are knowledgeable enough that we would cough it up in payments for however long we had to, because we would know better than to take any chances with rabies.  But my thoughts when I read this story were that someone not (trying to be generous here?) aware enough to realize that what they were allowing with the bats was dangerous, might not be aware enough to realize that YOU MUST get vaccinated whether you are going to get a giant bill or not.  I could totally see a person maybe even hearing about or reading about this story, then getting exposed and thinking, it's probably fine.  I'm not going to pay $5000 when I might not even have it.

I am appalled at anyone having to go into debt for ANY medical treatment.  But surely society has an interest in people getting vaccinated for what could be a public health issue?  I would be absolutely in favor of having things like that covered by the state or the feds for the uninsured or underinsured.  There should not be an economic reason not to get a rabies vaccination if you have been exposed.

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I don't believe there should be such a thing as $50,000 bills for life saving health care in a nation wealthy as ours. This family had insurance. Yeah, they clearly made a bunch of mistakes. But this is madness.

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5 minutes ago, Pen said:

That's horrible... our current system is not sustainable.  I don't know how anyone can think it is.  Without some kind of cost control or negotiating power, even private insurers will not be able to cover things without charging more than anyone can afford.  We are SO CLOSE to that already.

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I looked at a couple articles about this and the details are pretty vague.

There were 25 family members who got the vaccine and they now owe a total of $50,000. Insurance must have paid a big chunk of the bill, because the vaccine costs way more than $2000/person. Maybe among those 25 people, there was $50,000 worth of deductible.

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The whole thing is appalling. Their lack of judgment, the for profit cost of medicine in this nation, just everything. But, I do have to wonder this. They didn't confirm he had rabies until post mortem. So the hospital didn't know what he was dying of at the time. They let 25 people visit him in the ICU without knowing what he was dying of and if he was contagious. Is there some sort of liability for public health risk to the hospital itself? I mean, normally when there is the potential of a communicable disease that has not been identified, the patient is isolated, and only medical staff attend that person, maybe close family gets gowned, gloved, masked, and can go in. I am just wondering about this aspect.

Definitely not a fan of how we do health care in the US. Sick of it actually.

But, I'm slightly freaked out. Three days ago our cat caught a bat in the house. Dh wore gloves to retrieve it and seal it in a baggie to put in the trash since the ground is too frozen to bury it. But now my brain is feeling a little twitchy! The cat has been vaccinated, but it isn't like we the household humans have.

Stupid bats!

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I received bills for my mother after her in hospital death.  some were covered by insurance, but not all.

 

I'm speechless these people were feeding bats out of their hands, and allowing them to lick their fingers - and they thought it was safe.   the lack of common sense - and the fact there are warnings in dozens of places that bats (and rats) carry rabies.  

but this is the same mentality who feed other kinds wild animals (there's someone on my local FB group who posts pictures of himself doing this).  not as high a risk for rabies as bats, but that's just one reason it's stupid to feed wild animals.   despite the local ranger telling people it is dangerous and they need to stop doing this type of stuff.  when you tell them what it could lead to - they don't want to hear it because they want to do what they want to do.

this family - put other people at risk with their recklessness.  I'm sorry the dad died, but once rabies symptoms show - it's terminal.  you don't mess around with this - it is a public health issue.

 

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1 hour ago, Farrar said:

I don't believe there should be such a thing as $50,000 bills for life saving health care in a nation wealthy as ours. This family had insurance. Yeah, they clearly made a bunch of mistakes. But this is madness.

I agree our healthcare system is a complete mess, and I would love some form of universal healthcare, so things like this would not even be an issue. But it is $2k per person, not $50k for one family.

Edited by Frances
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25 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

The whole thing is appalling. Their lack of judgment, the for profit cost of medicine in this nation, just everything. But, I do have to wonder this. They didn't confirm he had rabies until post mortem. So the hospital didn't know what he was dying of at the time. They let 25 people visit him in the ICU without knowing what he was dying of and if he was contagious. Is there some sort of liability for public health risk to the hospital itself? I mean, normally when there is the potential of a communicable disease that has not been identified, the patient is isolated, and only medical staff attend that person, maybe close family gets gowned, gloved, masked, and can go in. I am just wondering about this aspect.

Definitely not a fan of how we do health care in the US. Sick of it actually.

My understanding from the animal side of medicine is that rabies is confirmed only upon death where you can access the brain.  In animals it can present in many different ways until the very end.  In other words he could have been admitted initially for something that didn't resemble a communicable disease.  

 

In regard to your cat, I'd get the rabies vaccine boostered.  

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One of my family members needed post exposure prophylaxis for rabies a couple of years ago and cost was a definite problem. The immuneglobulin shot could only be given at an ER, adding to the cost of the injection itself the cost of an ER visit. Of the other shots, one was received through the county health department but they warned us we might be stuck paying all of that out of pocket as they had no contract with our insurance (don't remember exactly but cost was $hundreds) the others we were able to order in to a pharmacy and have administered by our pediatrician so regular copay/co-insurance rates applied.

Altogether it was an expensive course of treatment.

Edited by maize
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36 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

The whole thing is appalling. Their lack of judgment, the for profit cost of medicine in this nation, just everything. But, I do have to wonder this. They didn't confirm he had rabies until post mortem. So the hospital didn't know what he was dying of at the time. They let 25 people visit him in the ICU without knowing what he was dying of and if he was contagious. Is there some sort of liability for public health risk to the hospital itself? I mean, normally when there is the potential of a communicable disease that has not been identified, the patient is isolated, and only medical staff attend that person, maybe close family gets gowned, gloved, masked, and can go in. I am just wondering about this aspect.

Definitely not a fan of how we do health care in the US. Sick of it actually.

But, I'm slightly freaked out. Three days ago our cat caught a bat in the house. Dh wore gloves to retrieve it and seal it in a baggie to put in the trash since the ground is too frozen to bury it. But now my brain is feeling a little twitchy! The cat has been vaccinated, but it isn't like we the household humans have.

Stupid bats!

In our county any encounter with a bat (including one cought by a cat) has to be reported to the county health department. We have done this twice with bats our cat brought in. The department picks up the bat and tests it for rabies. There are protocols for the cat depending on whether it is up to date on shots and whether the bat tests positive or negative for rabies.

Edited by maize
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27 minutes ago, Frances said:

I agree our healthcare system is a complete mess, and I would love some form of universal healthcare, so things like this would not even be an issue. But it is $2k per person, not $50k for one family.

Ah, I didn't understand that. There are 25 people in that one family? Okay then. Still in favor of it not being something that people forgo because of cost or that could ruin a single family's finances...

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11 minutes ago, Sharpie said:

 

 

In regard to your cat, I'd get the rabies vaccine boostered.  

She had it done a month ago at her annual check up.

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6 minutes ago, maize said:

In our county any encounter with a bat (including one cought by a cat) has to be reported to the county health department. We have done this twice with bats our cat brought in. The department picks up the bat and tests it for rabies. There are protocols for the cat depending on whether it is up to date on shots and whether the bat tests positive or negative for rabies.

We don't have that here. But then our county has cut most of its services to the bone due to economic issues.

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1 minute ago, Farrar said:

Ah, I didn't understand that. There are 25 people in that one family? Okay then. Still in favor of it not being something that people forgo because of cost or that could ruin a single family's finances...

I completely agree. But I’m not sure making this case somehow special so they don’t have to pay does anything to help us get to a reasonable healthcare system in this country. It often takes crazy cases like this for people to see the light.

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The treatment for post-exposure rabies isn't just the vaccine.  It is immunoglobulin as well.  It is the immunoglobulin that is the (more) expensive part.  This is because it is derived from humans that have been exposed to rabies and developed antibodies.  It's a *big deal* to manufacture it.  The article said nothing about this because, I suspect, it added complexity that would attenuated the rage they were intending to incite.

That said, healthcare costs too much in this country because the focus of everyone with any sort of power is on profit.

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I think it’s pretty outrageous that the widow seems to think the vaccines should be free, when she and her husband are the ones who caused this situation and put their family at risk by playing with bats.

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1 minute ago, Selkie said:

I think it’s pretty outrageous that the widow seems to think the vaccines should be free, when she and her husband are the ones who caused this situation and put their family at risk by playing with bats.

I think it is an easy mistake to make though from the standpoint that in many states vaccinations are free through the county health department. It might be confusing. What she may not have understood is how rare it is to give out this shot series so it isn't a health department service, and of course immuneglobulin is not a vaccine. Most people would not be aware of how expensive those shots are.

They are stupid for sure, keeping bats as pets! But I can see how someone could be unaware that rabies is not like the other vaccines. I doubt that many people who have never gone through cancer treatment with a family member on medicare would know that some chemo shots are $3500 a piece and not covered. We learned that the hard way with my mother's husband. Ya. After the bill on that first one, there were no more even though it was the best practice treatment for his cancer.

I doubt that most people know that the 30 day course of treatment for infantile spasms which affects approximately 1200 babies per year, costs $750,000.000 (no, I did not make a mistake with those zeros. It averages $21,000 per injection). Most insurance companies will not pay it. The child dies without it. I think families are often entirely blindsided by health care costs when the diseases are not common.

So I don't blame for the family for being flabbergasted.

 

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4 hours ago, moonflower said:

DH was bitten by a bat 4 years or so ago.  We'd just moved into a new house (like, that day) and there was a small black lump near the fireplace.  DH sort of nudged it with his toe, realized it was a bat.  Later that night he was looking more closely at the toe and saw that there were two very small pinpricks; I drove over to my mom's and looked up bat bite on the internet, at like 3 in the morning, and off he went to the ER.  They gave him all the injections, which he says were intensely painful, I guess partially because the toe is sort of a closed-off area, so it became swollen with the stuff they injected.

It cost I think $5k; we don't carry that kind of health insurance so we paid out of pocket over the course of a year or so.  

Turned out the fireplace was leaning outward from the house and there was a gap between the fireplace and the wall just wide enough for a bat.  The landlord could not be convinced that the bat could have come from there; he thought it must have flown in while we were moving, during broad daylight, landed near the fireplace, and passed out.

Bat did not turn out to have rabies.

 

They injected his TOE?  The rabies globulin shot should be given in the rump.  Subsequent shots you have to get can be given in the arm.  But the rump ones ARE painful.  Adults need two very large amounts for those initial injections.....but at least they are no longer in the stomach.

We had to get them.  It was $1500 for all 5 of us if I remember correctly....so $300 per person????  After insurance.

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2 minutes ago, DawnM said:

 

They injected his TOE?  The rabies globulin shot should be given in the rump.  Subsequent shots you have to get can be given in the arm.  But the rump ones ARE painful.  Adults need two very large amounts for those initial injections.....but at least they are no longer in the stomach.

We had to get them.  It was $1500 for all 5 of us if I remember correctly....so $300 per person????  After insurance.

As much of the HRIG as possible gets injected into the site of the bite

We Canadians like to complain about our health care: wait-times etc.  But situations like this highlight how good our system really is - RIG, Rabies vaccine and hospitalization would all have been paid for by the state, with no out-of-pocket or up-front cost to the patient.

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Just now, wathe said:

As much of the HRIG as possible gets injected into the site of the bite

We Canadians like to complain about our health care: wait-times etc.  But situations like this highlight how good our system really is - RIG, Rabies vaccine and hospitalization would all have been paid for by the state, with no out-of-pocket or up-front cost to the patient.

 

Interesting that they give it at the site.  Maybe most of the people I have known who have gotten them have not known if they have been bitten.

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DH thinks maybe the nurse who gave them was feeling particularly sadistic as she expressed sympathy for the bat and consternation that it was nudged/kicked. I think "oh, poor bat" is not really what you need to hear when you've been bitten through no fault of your own by a potentially rabid bat in your own home and you are at the ER at 3am getting very expensive, very painful injections.

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FWIW, I also would prefer single-payer health care to the current no-control-on-costs system we have here.  But in Canada I'd be paying something like $30k more a year in taxes, which would sort of negate our health expenses here, bat incident nonwithstanding.

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1 hour ago, moonflower said:

FWIW, I also would prefer single-payer health care to the current no-control-on-costs system we have here.  But in Canada I'd be paying something like $30k more a year in taxes, which would sort of negate our health expenses here, bat incident nonwithstanding.

But health is a very unpredictable thing. While costs for your family might be low today, anything could happen tomorrow. I’m fortunate that we pay very little for our healthcare, including medical, vision, and dental due to excellent employer plans with very low employee contributions and deductibles. And we rarely use it. But I’d happily pay more taxes so that others could have what we have. I’m certainly glad my contributions help to fund the excellent care my parents receive with Medicare. 

I’m curious if your $30k is based on the Fraser Institute study or another source?

Edited by Frances
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21 minutes ago, Frances said:

But health is a very unpredictable thing. While costs for your family might be low today, anything could happen tomorrow. I’m fortunate that we pay very little for our healthcare, including medical, vision, and dental due to excellent employer plans with very low employee contributions and deductibles. And we rarely use it. But I’d happily pay more taxes so that others could have what we have. I’m certainly glad my contributions help to fund the excellent care my parents receive with Medicare. 

This.  Anyone can have a sudden Very Expensive Medical Expense - trauma, cancer, heart attack.  I'm very fortunate that my out-of-pocket expenses for doctor and hospital bills will be zero.  No matter who I am or who I work for (or don't work for).   Well baby visits, vaccines, hospital care, urgent care, family doctor visits, homecare - all billed directly to the the state.  I pay a nominal "premium" as part of my income taxes.  I think I pay about $900 a year - covering the whole family. If I were low income it would be zero.

ETA - the hospital does bill privately for non-medical services - parking, private rooms, internet access etc.

Edited by wathe
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5 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

The whole thing is appalling. Their lack of judgment, the for profit cost of medicine in this nation, just everything. But, I do have to wonder this. They didn't confirm he had rabies until post mortem. So the hospital didn't know what he was dying of at the time. They let 25 people visit him in the ICU without knowing what he was dying of and if he was contagious. Is there some sort of liability for public health risk to the hospital itself? I mean, normally when there is the potential of a communicable disease that has not been identified, the patient is isolated, and only medical staff attend that person, maybe close family gets gowned, gloved, masked, and can go in. I am just wondering about this aspect.

Definitely not a fan of how we do health care in the US. Sick of it actually.

But, I'm slightly freaked out. Three days ago our cat caught a bat in the house. Dh wore gloves to retrieve it and seal it in a baggie to put in the trash since the ground is too frozen to bury it. But now my brain is feeling a little twitchy! The cat has been vaccinated, but it isn't like we the household humans have.

Stupid bats!

 

I am shocked that your vet didn’t insist that you and your dh be treated for rabies, because if there was a bat in your house, it could have bitten you while you slept at night and you probably wouldn’t have even felt it. 

Thank goodness you guys are okay!!!

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4 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

I think it is an easy mistake to make though from the standpoint that in many states vaccinations are free through the county health department. It might be confusing. What she may not have understood is how rare it is to give out this shot series so it isn't a health department service, and of course immuneglobulin is not a vaccine. Most people would not be aware of how expensive those shots are.

They are stupid for sure, keeping bats as pets! But I can see how someone could be unaware that rabies is not like the other vaccines. I doubt that many people who have never gone through cancer treatment with a family member on medicare would know that some chemo shots are $3500 a piece and not covered. We learned that the hard way with my mother's husband. Ya. After the bill on that first one, there were no more even though it was the best practice treatment for his cancer.

I doubt that most people know that the 30 day course of treatment for infantile spasms which affects approximately 1200 babies per year, costs $750,000.000 (no, I did not make a mistake with those zeros. It averages $21,000 per injection). Most insurance companies will not pay it. The child dies without it. I think families are often entirely blindsided by health care costs when the diseases are not common.

So I don't blame for the family for being flabbergasted.

 

 

Your information about ACTH is inaccurate. Maybe things have changed since you last heard about it? 

Thankfully, ACTH treatment is covered by most insurance companies, and the manufacturer of the drug says that they will help ensure that every child who needs the treatment will receive it, even if the family is uninsured and financially unable to pay for it.

https://www.actharis.com/find-help-getting-acthar

Edited by Catwoman
Forgot the link!
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5 hours ago, Catwoman said:

 

I am shocked that your vet didn’t insist that you and your dh be treated for rabies, because if there was a bat in your house, it could have bitten you while you slept at night and you probably wouldn’t have even felt it. 

Thank goodness you guys are okay!!!

 

My entire family had to get them.  And the CDC got involved (LONG story short.  I posted a "We woke up to a bat flying around our bedroom last night" on FB.  A friend saw the story and started calling around.  She called the CDC and they said we should get shots.  She called me back and told me to contact the CDC.  We did (I don't remember if they called us at that point or if we called them) and they said that anytime they know of a story, it has to be reported and then we can refuse shots or not, but it will go on record.  So, we got the shots.

I posted about it here I believe, but it was about 10 or so years ago.

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6 hours ago, Catwoman said:

 

Your information about ACTH is inaccurate. Maybe things have changed since you last heard about it? 

Thankfully, ACTH treatment is covered by most insurance companies, and the manufacturer of the drug says that they will help ensure that every child who needs the treatment will receive it, even if the family is uninsured and financially unable to pay for it.

https://www.actharis.com/find-help-getting-acthar

Again, regional. This is not true in Michigan. I know of three children in Mid Michigan who would be dead - Dup 15Q kids - were it not for private foundations. St. Joseph's in Ann Arbor - Quarter million dollars.

St. Jude's does a lot for these children, but aren't anywhere close and most kids end up in Ann Arbor. It took more than a week of our pastor's six month old seizing over 200 times per day to get the finances worked out through a foundation, and he almost didn't make it because of this. He's profoundly brain damaged from the wait.

Please do not tell me I don't know what has happened to the people who live two blocks from me whose son I've done music therapy for. I was in the waiting room with them when the hospital billing department asked them how much money they had because Blue Cross Blue Shield would not pay, and it was too expensive of a treatment for the hospital to absorb without finding a payer up front.

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3 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

Again, regional. This is not true in Michigan. I know of three children in Mid Michigan who would be dead - Dup 15Q kids - were it not for private foundations. St. Joseph's in Ann Arbor - Quarter million dollars.

St. Jude's does a lot for these children, but aren't anywhere close and most kids end up in Ann Arbor. It took more than a week of our pastor's six month old seizing over 200 times per day to get the finances worked out through a foundation, and he almost didn't make it because of this. He's profoundly brain damaged from the wait.

Please do not tell me I don't know what has happened to the people who live two blocks from me whose son I've done music therapy for. I was in the waiting room with them when the hospital billing department asked them how much money they had because Blue Cross Blue Shield would not pay, and it was too expensive of a treatment for the hospital to absorb without finding a payer up front.

 

I have no idea what happened to the family you know, but your information is simply not current, so I am assuming that things have changed for the better since your friends’ child was treated. How many years ago was this?

Michigan Blue Cross Blue Shield does cover ACTH (Acthar) treatments.

https://www.bcbsm.com/content/dam/public/Consumer/Documents/help/documents-forms/pharmacy/specialty-drug-program-member-guide.pdf

https://www.bcbsm.com/content/dam/public/Consumer/Documents/help/documents-forms/pharmacy/custom-drug-list-formulary.pdf

Infantile spasms are so incredibly rare, with only 2,500 cases a year in the whole country. It’s awful that you personally know 3 families whose babies were diagnosed. I hope all of the babies are ok now. It is such a terrifying diagnosis. 😞

 

 

Edited by Catwoman
Why do I always forget to add the links???
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10 hours ago, DawnM said:

 

My entire family had to get them.  And the CDC got involved (LONG story short.  I posted a "We woke up to a bat flying around our bedroom last night" on FB.  A friend saw the story and started calling around.  She called the CDC and they said we should get shots.  She called me back and told me to contact the CDC.  We did (I don't remember if they called us at that point or if we called them) and they said that anytime they know of a story, it has to be reported and then we can refuse shots or not, but it will go on record.  So, we got the shots.

I posted about it here I believe, but it was about 10 or so years ago.

 

I would have gotten the shots, too! 

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so glad we don't have rabies here. We have bats in our bedroom just about every night. We cannot work out how they keep coming in. Dh ushers them out the door . We have a door to outside in our bedroom.

 Bats here however do have some terrible disease, Australian Bat Lyssavirus and Hendra virus   which are deadly. it is pretty rare for someone to get it though. 

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22 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

I think it is an easy mistake to make though from the standpoint that in many states vaccinations are free through the county health department. It might be confusing. What she may not have understood is how rare it is to give out this shot series so it isn't a health department service, and of course immuneglobulin is not a vaccine. Most people would not be aware of how expensive those shots are.

They are stupid for sure, keeping bats as pets! But I can see how someone could be unaware that rabies is not like the other vaccines. I doubt that many people who have never gone through cancer treatment with a family member on medicare would know that some chemo shots are $3500 a piece and not covered. We learned that the hard way with my mother's husband. Ya. After the bill on that first one, there were no more even though it was the best practice treatment for his cancer.

I doubt that most people know that the 30 day course of treatment for infantile spasms which affects approximately 1200 babies per year, costs $750,000.000 (no, I did not make a mistake with those zeros. It averages $21,000 per injection). Most insurance companies will not pay it. The child dies without it. I think families are often entirely blindsided by health care costs when the diseases are not common.

So I don't blame for the family for being flabbergasted.

 

 

11 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

Again, regional. This is not true in Michigan. I know of three children in Mid Michigan who would be dead - Dup 15Q kids - were it not for private foundations. St. Joseph's in Ann Arbor - Quarter million dollars.

St. Jude's does a lot for these children, but aren't anywhere close and most kids end up in Ann Arbor. It took more than a week of our pastor's six month old seizing over 200 times per day to get the finances worked out through a foundation, and he almost didn't make it because of this. He's profoundly brain damaged from the wait.

Please do not tell me I don't know what has happened to the people who live two blocks from me whose son I've done music therapy for. I was in the waiting room with them when the hospital billing department asked them how much money they had because Blue Cross Blue Shield would not pay, and it was too expensive of a treatment for the hospital to absorb without finding a payer up front.

Cite your sources regarding the cost of the drug and the cost of treatment for IS. I have been patiently correcting your misinformation about Infantile Spasms and the treatment of it for years and yet you keep on with these erroneous posts.

@Faith-manor

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22 hours ago, wathe said:

This.  Anyone can have a sudden Very Expensive Medical Expense - trauma, cancer, heart attack.  I'm very fortunate that my out-of-pocket expenses for doctor and hospital bills will be zero.  No matter who I am or who I work for (or don't work for).   Well baby visits, vaccines, hospital care, urgent care, family doctor visits, homecare - all billed directly to the the state.  I pay a nominal "premium" as part of my income taxes.  I think I pay about $900 a year - covering the whole family. If I were low income it would be zero.

ETA - the hospital does bill privately for non-medical services - parking, private rooms, internet access etc.

 

Yep, two weeks in the ICU - bill to us - zero. 

Thank goodness. 

 

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2 minutes ago, StellaM said:

 

Yep, two weeks in the ICU - bill to us - zero. 

Thank goodness. 

 

 

How is he doing now? I hope he is feeling better and getting some of his strength back.

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2 hours ago, Catwoman said:

 

How is he doing now? I hope he is feeling better and getting some of his strength back.

 

Getting there. Thanks Cat.

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Ugh.  We haven’t had any indoor bat issues, but two raccoons tested positive in our area last month... and we have a LOT of raccoons! After reading all this, I may turn from aware to paranoid!

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On 2/10/2019 at 10:49 PM, moonflower said:

DH thinks maybe the nurse who gave them was feeling particularly sadistic as she expressed sympathy for the bat and consternation that it was nudged/kicked. I think "oh, poor bat" is not really what you need to hear when you've been bitten through no fault of your own by a potentially rabid bat in your own home and you are at the ER at 3am getting very expensive, very painful injections.

 

My friend's dad's dog bit her daughter in the face in the 80s . Like, really attacked her. Scarred her for life, and from looking at the scar down her throat it seems to me like it could have killed her. She says that the first thing her dad said was, "Poor Rambo! Rambo's such a good boy!" Like while she was holding her bleeding child in her arms waiting for the ambulance.

For this guy, and for the insane bat people, there is truly no accounting for crazy!!

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