Is requiring this "to be fine" reasonable?

[Bluegoat]

Black bears aren't like grizzlies or polar bears - they really don't require a gun, they don't see people as prey.  Usually the recommendation is to just speak calmly and back away, or even make yourself look large and speak more aggressively to movethem if you can't move.  They really aren't keen to bother people unless you are a threat to cubs or something like that.

[LucyStoner]

I guess I am wondering why he has veto power over your leisure plans with the kids.  Does he have anxiety?  

[Selkie]

We have loads of bobcats around here and I have never heard of one being aggressive towards humans. They eat small pets, but not people.🙂 They are usually pretty small - like 20ish pounds.

[SKL]

One thing they have around here is guided hikes.  An experienced guide (ranger? or park volunteer) will take a group of people on a planned trail in the national park.  In my area, there are a nice variety of trail options of varying difficulty levels.  Perhaps this would be a way to ease into the situation as the kids get a little older.  As the kids get big, your husband may get more comfortable with the whole group of you going.

But call me a rebel - I would stop off and take a hike alone if I wanted to (I do this when I have a little time here and there).

It's not that I don't believe you should respect your husband's concerns.  It's just that I don't think you need to ask permission to do a perfectly normal everyday thing.  If it was skydiving I'd feel differently.

[SKL]

This discussion is reminiscent of when I was a kid and various husbands didn't want their wives driving.

[catz]

I think there is a difference between being respectful of a spouse's anxiety and making life limiting decisions not based on factual info to appease an anxious spouse.  Talking through the situation with him is good.  Limiting options because of irrational thoughts is not doing kids any favors either.  I've seen black bears, moose, wolves, coyotes, lynx and the wild and have not had issues by following some basic safety rules.  I've seen Grizzly bears in national parks too.  

I'd also have no problem tossing pepper spray into my backpack or clipping to a strap, internally eye rolling and moving on if that would somehow make him feel better however.   

[Farrar]

I'm still unclear what the underlying issue is... like, is he just controlling of you? Or, is he just an anxious person? Or, is he just one of these people who have so little experience in the outdoors that they don't understand what's risky and what isn't? Because those might require different approaches.

I'm remembering now times that I've had students who had never been outside a city/suburbs environment. My very first year teaching, I drove a bunch of 8th grade girls to the 8th grade retreat at a camp out in the middle of nowhere. As we're on this tiny one lane highway, one of the girls suddenly goes, "There's not another road right on the other side of those trees!" And I'm like, uh, no, there's not...? She had never in her life been anywhere where there were more trees than a park. She was the daughter of immigrants. They'd never traveled. A couple of years later, on an all school retreat, a girl who wasn't usually anxious had a panic attack the day before the all school camping trip. It turned out she'd never left the city. She had no idea what to expect. She thought the bugs and the snakes and who knows what else might be super dangerous. When we talked to the mom... it turned out she was the exact same. We ended up bringing the mom with us too so it was both of their first experience in the woods. By the end of the year, the daughter wasn't worried at all. It's so foreign to me because I grew up in the middle of nowhere, but for some people, it's... I don't know... every horror movie in the woods, every freaky nature film, every killer creature.

[Janeway]

I think mace or a taser are not a big deal. I would not want to carry a gun either (but support the rights of those who do). If that is all it takes to appease him, I would just carry one of those things. He wants his children protected too, and you. 

[EMS83]

2 hours ago, Carol in Cal. said:

I think he is being unreasonable, but I also think it would be unreasonable to take the kids somewhere against his will that he thinks is dangerous.  It's reasonable to go yourself, but not to bring the children.  So discussion is in order for sure.

That's a good point; I may tend think of these things in a one-sided manner.  Though I never got the impression it was against his will, per se.  And it wasn't a specific place he thought was dangerous.  Part of what he said recently was "camping" is too vague.  He wants a detailed plan first, really.  But I don't see the point in the effort of fully planning something if the concept itself isn't approved first.  It's like, let's get this new product ready to hit the shelves before we know whether we want to develop it or not, kwim?

40 minutes ago, Farrar said:

I'm still unclear what the underlying issue is... like, is he just controlling of you? Or, is he just an anxious person? Or, is he just one of these people who have so little experience in the outdoors that they don't understand what's risky and what isn't? Because those might require different approaches.

No he's camped before, just not much, and he doesn't like it.  He'd also be uncomfortable with a "co-ed" trip--like a friend's husband.  He doesn't say don't go...just that he's not comfortable with it and isn't it sort of weird that the guy wants to go?  I don't know if that's controlling or not.  I've never tried to just go anyway, because of course I wouldn't want that done to me.  But, then I grade my comfort levels.  See below:

1 hour ago, LucyStoner said:

I guess I am wondering why he has veto power over your leisure plans with the kids.  Does he have anxiety?  

Not sure?  Social, I think, for sure.  And I do, too.  I just use it differently.  I use it to maintain order or avoid exposing them to content they're not mature enough to handle (lots of profanity or sexual themes, things I know will give the youngest nightmares, etc.).  But my personal view on video games is the less the better, and we wouldn't have them at all, or one system at most, if I had my druthers.  So I simply identify what I'm really not ok with at a given stage.  He does ask me before starting a game run with them, though.  I mean, we don't see eye to eye on things like content and what's safe, obviously, so...

I guess bear spray isn't a hill to die on, though.  I think I'd just hurt myself with a taser, so maybe not that.  😄 

[EMS83]

Oh, and car camping is where you can pull right up to the campsite.  Usually there's also a spigot at the site and possible electric hook up.  It's really, really not even remotely backwoods.

[ktgrok]

Car camping in a state park usually means each campsite has a little driveway that you pull into next to a clearing for a tent, and there will often be a fire circle and a picnic table. Often electricity and running water as well. You are only a stones throw from all the other little driveways and clearings, and in the center of all this is a building with bathrooms, showers, laundry facilities, etc. This shows the set up at a state park near me.  They also have park rangers that provide security. 

Edited January 16, 2019 by Ktgrok

[SereneHome]

4 hours ago, Bluegoat said:

 

Hence the "may well be."  

But just having wild animals around doesn't mean they are actually very dangerous.  We have lots of black bears in the woods here, lots of coyotes, but the chance of them harming a person is very slim.  It's happened, at least as far as a coyote goes, in my memory, but it is vanishingly rare statistically speaking.  So, she would really have to look at the statistics in the park.  My guess is that in a car camping area and well-used trails, it's not common - the park authorities are likely to be pretty careful about animals hanging around those kinds of areas.

Personally, I am more afraid of mice than bear, so..... 🙂

[livetoread]

FWIW, bear spray is a larger canister than self defense pepper spray, so it’s heavier, bulkier, and more expensive. We got some bear spray and carried it in Yellowstone, and while I was glad to have it, it wasn’t convenient. Unless there were bears where I was hiking, I’d stick with the smaller canister of pepper spray that you could tuck into a pocket.

[EMS83]

I was thinking bear spray could be dual purpose... 🤐  But I like cheap, too, and I'm indeed not worried about bears. 

[Junie]

I don't really like camping, but a lot of that is probably because I've never been camping.  I've stayed in cabins at a private campground and I've stayed in my parents' motorhome.  I am uncomfortable with sleeping out in the open -- with no door/lock to protect me from whatever may be out there.  I don't want to come face-to-face with a psycho, a bear, a squirrel -- nothing.  I want to sleep.  Undisturbed.  And I can't do that without a door.  I wouldn't be able to relax.  I would hear every single tiny noise and wonder what was causing it.  And if my family were camping without me I would wonder every single second if they were ok.  Now, if dh took the kids camping often, I would eventually become more comfortable with it.  But the first few times would be gut-wrenching.

 

[busymama7]

4 hours ago, CES2005 said:

That's a good point; I may tend think of these things in a one-sided manner.  Though I never got the impression it was against his will, per se.  And it wasn't a specific place he thought was dangerous.  Part of what he said recently was "camping" is too vague.  He wants a detailed plan first, really.  But I don't see the point in the effort of fully planning something if the concept itself isn't approved first.  It's like, let's get this new product ready to hit the shelves before we know whether we want to develop it or not, kwim?

No he's camped before, just not much, and he doesn't like it.  He'd also be uncomfortable with a "co-ed" trip--like a friend's husband.  He doesn't say don't go...just that he's not comfortable with it and isn't it sort of weird that the guy wants to go?  I don't know if that's controlling or not.  I've never tried to just go anyway, because of course I wouldn't want that done to me.  But, then I grade my comfort levels.  See below:

Not sure?  Social, I think, for sure.  And I do, too.  I just use it differently.  I use it to maintain order or avoid exposing them to content they're not mature enough to handle (lots of profanity or sexual themes, things I know will give the youngest nightmares, etc.).  But my personal view on video games is the less the better, and we wouldn't have them at all, or one system at most, if I had my druthers.  So I simply identify what I'm really not ok with at a given stage.  He does ask me before starting a game run with them, though.  I mean, we don't see eye to eye on things like content and what's safe, obviously, so...

I guess bear spray isn't a hill to die on, though.  I think I'd just hurt myself with a taser, so maybe not that.  😄

 

Ok to be clear, is he uncomfortable with you and friend:s husband taking the kids camping or he is uncomfortable with you ,your friend and her husband all going on the same trip?

Neither my husband or I would be ok with the former, in either direction. However, the second scenario is totally fine in our opinion. I was just curious what exactly you meant by that. 

[Arcadia]

We went yurt camping at an off peak season. We didn’t see any security or park rangers for the two days we were there except for the ranger at the entrance. There were very few RV campers around when we were there so it was kind of isolating. The whole park felt deserted. My husband stuck to hotels after that. 

Link is to campground map which shows plenty of RV spots/sites https://www.sccgov.org/sites/parks/parkfinder/Documents/ValleyViewCampgrounds.pdf

We go to a Half Moon Bay beach often which has RV camping facilities. That beach is very popular with RV campers. A short walk down the road are homes. Many people go to the beach there.

[kiwik]

5 hours ago, Ktgrok said:

Car camping in a state park usually means each campsite has a little driveway that you pull into next to a clearing for a tent, and there will often be a fire circle and a picnic table. Often electricity and running water as well. You are only a stones throw from all the other little driveways and clearings, and in the center of all this is a building with bathrooms, showers, laundry facilities, etc. This shows the set up at a state park near me.  They also have park rangers that provide security. 

I thought it meant sleeping in your car.  Mace is illegal her but I am assuming it comes in a smallish container and maybe bear spray too?  I am just struggling to imaging going hiking with the kids with a loaded gun or taser in my hands/in a holster.  I can see it in my pack but in that case by the time you get it out it may be too later 

[EMS83]

8 hours ago, busymama7 said:

 

Ok to be clear, is he uncomfortable with you and friend:s husband taking the kids camping or he is uncomfortable with you ,your friend and her husband all going on the same trip?

Neither my husband or I would be ok with the former, in either direction. However, the second scenario is totally fine in our opinion. I was just curious what exactly you meant by that. 

It was originally a "Mommy and me" type trip, but one mom has 6 kids and at that time the youngest was a baby, and her husband was going to come to help out and tow their pop up camper thing.  She didn't feel confident towing it, backing, it and all that.  I mean, the rest of us could have helped out with babies and toddlers.  The fact that he would have been there at all was the source of discomfort.

[EMS83]

10 hours ago, happysmileylady said:

Actually, I don't see it like that at all, and I am sure he doesn't either.

To me,  giving a spouse a reasonably detailed plan of XYZ trip isn't an unreasonable request whether that trip is camping or not.  For example

 

Last summer, I went on a yard sale trip.  I am sure that doesn't make sense to most folks but for me it means that mom and I and my girls (though not DS6 because he's just not old enough,) travel down a particular US highway to a certain point, get a hotel room and the start yard sale-ing at like 8am, heading up that particular US highway.  We hit whatever yardsales we want, but certain points, like the hotels we stay in, about when we expect to be there, are fairly certain.  So I give those plans to DH.

 

Likewise, when he travels for work, I get a fairly detailed plan of when he leaves the office, about what time he should arrive at XYZ destination, which hotel he is at, etc etc.  When he is flying, honestly, I track his plane on the airline's tracking site and often text him when it shows he has landed, even if that's at 2am.  I just want to be comfortable that he is ok.  And knowing where/when he is/will be is comfortable to me.  It doesn't mean I will freak out if something goes out of whack, but shoot..........I email DH every day just to know when he will be home lol  

Yeah but the initial question is: Are you cool with my going on a yard sale trip?  Or, are you going to be ok when I go on my business trip?  Likewise, the very first broaching of this topic was: I'd like to take the kids on hiking trips to our various state parks, camping at the ones that are over an hour away.  The immediate response: you ought to CC, otherwise I'm not comfortable with the idea.  At that time (that was 4ish years ago), I didn't have any self confidence to push back, it was a rough time of my life, etc.  Now the conversation is going better and that's where the "want a safety plan" and "camping is too vague" and "let's compromise with pepper spray" is coming in.

[Granny_Weatherwax]

If he has little to no experience in the outdoors, his fears may stem from ignorance and naivete. This is what I would do (and have done) so you can do what you want and possibly assuage his fears. You may have done some of these things already.

Take a wilderness first aid course - the Boy Scouts offer these for minimal cost. Check with your local council.

Take a Leave No Trace course - most good courses will have segments on safety and planning.

Create a day pack with a great first aid kit, emergency rations, a good Swiss Army Knife, a compass, etc. Your local Boy Scout Council may have Orienteering courses that are offered to the public.

Learn what wildlife is in the area you're planning on visiting and learn how to deal with that wildlife. 

Learn how to look for and use naturally occurring weapons or items that you will carry- a downed branch, a rock, your trekking poles, a whistle. Many backpacks have these built into the chest clip. Make sure your kids can learn this skill as well. It's easy to teach and is the basis for survival skills.

Create an outdoor activities journal - within the journal list everything you can about where you're going, where you'll park, how long you plan on being gone, when you plan to return, the phone numbers of the ranger station (if there is one), the local PD, etc. Get as much info as you can. This is actually something you should be doing already. Know before you go. Plan and prepare.

Get online and bookmark or print a few pictures of the area you are hiking and camping in. Visuals may help him understand where you are and may relax him while you are away.

Ask him to help plan the outing. Have him help check and pack the gear. Maybe knowing how well prepared you are will help alleviate anxiety.

Educate yourself and your children about anything associated with the outdoors. It's fun and worthwhile. You'll be more comfortable and your DH might relax when he sees that you are an outdoor rock star.

--

As far as carrying a gun. Unless you go through training, don't do it. The last thing you want to do is pull an unfamiliar gun on a Bad Guy and give him the opportunity to take it from you and, unless you are willing to fire it, pulling a gun on a bear or a bobcat is pointless; they will not be intimidate by the visual.

[Murphy101]

I think you are grown woman and don't need permission to go anywhere.

If he thinks you need protection, he can either come provide it or trust your judgement.

No, you shouldn't get a weapon that you don't want and don't know how to handle just to appease him.

You should have a safety plan.  That is just good travel sense, especially with kids.  A map of the park for each traveler, including kids who can read it.  Never walk away from your basecamp without a days worth of water and food and first aid.  Keep an eye on weather and have a back up plan if it turns ugly.  Make sure your vehicle is checked so there's no surprise oil or battery or what all problems.  Have a plan in case there is a car problem.  I do keep an ankle knife on me.  It just comes in handy for lots of reasons in the outdoors.

But if you are doing that stuff and he has a problem, he needs to get over it.  It's not like you are sky diving.  (*cough*my dh wants to*cough*)

 

[PeterPan]

3 hours ago, CES2005 said:

Yeah but the initial question is: Are you cool with my going on a yard sale trip?  Or, are you going to be ok when I go on my business trip?  Likewise, the very first broaching of this topic was: I'd like to take the kids on hiking trips to our various state parks, camping at the ones that are over an hour away.  The immediate response: you ought to CC, otherwise I'm not comfortable with the idea.  At that time (that was 4ish years ago), I didn't have any self confidence to push back, it was a rough time of my life, etc.  Now the conversation is going better and that's where the "want a safety plan" and "camping is too vague" and "let's compromise with pepper spray" is coming in.

I'd just like to say I admire you for making the effort. My dd wanted to camp and my dh didn't.  I waited around for him to pick up the clue phone and he never did, so we never got to do ANY of those great trips together. Now with ds, same thing. I'm being more brave on traveling by myself (taking a cruise in 2 weeks for the first time!) because dh is just not game for stuff. So yeah, if the list from Accidental Coach works for you, go do it!

Have you seen the tiny campers? https://www.highcamptrailers.com/teardrop-trailer-galley-kitchen/

Edited January 16, 2019 by PeterPan

[busymama7]

3 hours ago, CES2005 said:

It was originally a "Mommy and me" type trip, but one mom has 6 kids and at that time the youngest was a baby, and her husband was going to come to help out and tow their pop up camper thing.  She didn't feel confident towing it, backing, it and all that.  I mean, the rest of us could have helped out with babies and toddlers.  The fact that he would have been there at all was the source of discomfort.

 

So you didn't go?  We are extremely conservative with regards to this kind of thing. Much more than many on this board per a thread awhile ago. We are never alone with opposite gender, don't have friends unless its a couple we are friends with etc. But this doesn't even cross our mind as not appropriate.  He if anything feels a bit relieved that there will be a man or two present just in case. 

This would bother me a lot if this was keeping me and the kids from doing things. I would want to get to the bottom of it. 

[EmseB]

I've read the thread, but I can't figure out being nervous about camping, but not being nervous about sending a firearm along with someone who doesn't want it and doesn't have kids trained to handle it to go camping.

I mean, I get the, "What would you do as a woman alone with your kids if you run into an unsavory character while camping" question, but adding an unwanted firearm to the mix seems totally illogical as far as a plan for safety.

[Lady Florida.]

47 minutes ago, happysmileylady said:

I guess I just don't approach it from a "are you cool with me going" standpoint.  I tend to approach these things from a "I am planning XYZ, is there a scheduling conflict with that" standpoint.  DH does the same, and I expect him to as well.  If he has some safety concerns, we discuss those, but they are from a standpoint of "this specific thing (vehicle breaking down, quality of the hotel, etc) is concerning me" rather than a generalized standpoint.

 

This is how we handle things too. 

[regentrude]

16 hours ago, Junie said:

I don't really like camping, but a lot of that is probably because I've never been camping.  I've stayed in cabins at a private campground and I've stayed in my parents' motorhome.  I am uncomfortable with sleeping out in the open -- with no door/lock to protect me from whatever may be out there.  I don't want to come face-to-face with a psycho, a bear, a squirrel -- nothing.  I want to sleep.  Undisturbed.  And I can't do that without a door.  I wouldn't be able to relax.  I would hear every single tiny noise and wonder what was causing it.  And if my family were camping without me I would wonder every single second if they were ok.  Now, if dh took the kids camping often, I would eventually become more comfortable with it.  But the first few times would be gut-wrenching.

But I assume you would recognize that it is your problem and attempt to handle it, and not restrict your family's movements just because you can't handle it.

Edited January 16, 2019 by regentrude

[regentrude]

6 hours ago, CES2005 said:

It was originally a "Mommy and me" type trip, but one mom has 6 kids and at that time the youngest was a baby, and her husband was going to come to help out and tow their pop up camper thing.  She didn't feel confident towing it, backing, it and all that.  I mean, the rest of us could have helped out with babies and toddlers.  The fact that he would have been there at all was the source of discomfort.

That sounds seriously controlling. WTH is his problem?

[RoundAbout]

I wouldn't worry one wit about 1-2 mile hikes in state parks. I've done that many times. For camping I prefer to camp with friends if my DH isn't there. We've had issues with obnoxious drunk people in some state parks and though I doubt they were real threats, I could see feeling vulnerable in those situations. If I were to camp alone, I'd make sure I was near a ranger station or some retirees rather than off on my own. 

[regentrude]

1 minute ago, RoundAbout said:

 For camping I prefer to camp with friends if my DH isn't there. We've had issues with obnoxious drunk people in some state parks and though I doubt they were real threats, I could see feeling vulnerable in those situations. If I were to camp alone, I'd make sure I was near a ranger station or some retirees rather than off on my own. 

Actually, experienced female solo hikers recommend camping at least 1 mile from a trail head - because the obnoxious drunk idiots don't stray far from the road. Back country camping is safer than camping where people can drive. 

[kiwik]

Do buy an emergency locator beacon.

[Bluegoat]

14 minutes ago, kiwik said:

Do buy an emergency locator beacon.

 

That seems like overkill for short well used trails in parks.

[regentrude]

29 minutes ago, kiwik said:

Do buy an emergency locator beacon.

For a 1-2 mile hike in a developed park???

[SKL]

Having read the OP's most recent comment, I just have to push back some more.

I'm a single mom and I take my kids camping with AHG.  There are dads there.  Nobody is there to fool around with other people's spouses.  That sounds like a bad TV plot.

I also want to say that I personally feel it's important to get kids out camping at some time or other.  It's one of those life experiences that people should have if at all possible IMO.  And it's a lot easier to enjoy when you're a kid vs. a stiff sleep-deprived adult with a year-round work schedule.  (It's OK if they try it and decide they don't love it, but they should know what it is.)

At my age, I don't enjoy sleeping upon roots on the ground wrapped in 25 coats and blankets, though it used to be a big thrill when I was a kid.  I do send my kids off to camping experiences without me from time to time, because it's important in my opinion.

I would continue to look for a solution here rather than deny the kids the opportunity to camp and hike while young.

[hshibley]

I’m not sure if the main concern is other people or animals. Either way it’s not founded in reality. I’ve camped and hiked alone with my kids in state parks many times. If you want to brush up on techniques for animal/trail safety you may want to read Backpacking A Women’s Guide. It has some good tips that can apply to car camping and hiking. 

I would not let someone else’s irrational fear stop me from making memories with my kids. You can camp with your kids. Your husband can join you or not. 

[Junie]

2 hours ago, regentrude said:

But I assume you would recognize that it is your problem and attempt to handle it, and not restrict your family's movements just because you can't handle it.

Well, yes.  I offered my post as a possibility of what the OP's spouse might be concerned about.  She said that she wasn't sure what the sticking point was and I offered my point of view.

I think that the OP should try to figure out exactly what the reluctance is about and try to work with that.

 

[hshibley]

Double post

 

Edited January 16, 2019 by hshibley
Double post

[Tanaqui]

OP, does his discomfort or fear often cause you to curtail plans and not do things you'd like to do, or is it really only hiking and camping?

[Arcadia]

8 hours ago, CES2005 said:

It was originally a "Mommy and me" type trip, but one mom has 6 kids and at that time the youngest was a baby, and her husband was going to come to help out and tow their pop up camper thing.  ... The fact that he would have been there at all was the source of discomfort.

 

That would be beyond a safety issue, the discomfort with a dad being there. Your scenario has so many moms, kids and a dad. Not a scary scenario at all. My husband would tag along because our two kids were running in different directions out of excitement when they were younger. Our local “drunks” go anywhere, not just stay at trailheads. That’s why my husband prefers a large group of hikers if we go hiking at state parks. Someone went into Peet’s Coffee to rant at everyone there a few days ago, it was just bizarre. 

[EMS83]

17 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

OP, does his discomfort or fear often cause you to curtail plans and not do things you'd like to do, or is it really only hiking and camping?

Well camping and hiking are the main things I'd like to do that seem to fall through.  Most of what else I'd like to do can be done at home.  But maybe?  If I wanted to go to Atlanta with friends, it would probably be a hard sell.  It hasn't come up yet, because that's not the sort of things I really like.  I don't know how much is me, though... it was a habit of mine to assume I was wrong if my understanding or opinion differed from others'--for always.  He's the "who cares what people think" type.  I'm seeing a counselor to figure out how/why I became that way and how to quit.  🙂 

[EMS83]

20 hours ago, regentrude said:

That sounds seriously controlling. WTH is his problem?

I have a past?  idk.  I can't say.  I mean, I felt that anxiety when we were dating and he went somewhere completely public with a friend and a friend's girlfriend.  For me it's been my faith that has helped me feel more secure.  Though I still have a hard time figuring out where the line is--that's a whole other topic.  But no, he's definitely in the "men and women can't be friends" camp.  We had a thread about that here somewhere.  He's not willing to be friends with other couples, so that level of protection is off the table.

[hshibley]

18 minutes ago, CES2005 said:

I have a past?  idk.  I can't say.  I mean, I felt that anxiety when we were dating and he went somewhere completely public with a friend and a friend's girlfriend.  For me it's been my faith that has helped me feel more secure.  Though I still have a hard time figuring out where the line is--that's a whole other topic.  But no, he's definitely in the "men and women can't be friends" camp.  We had a thread about that here somewhere.  He's not willing to be friends with other couples, so that level of protection is off the table.

So it really has nothing to do with camping and hiking. He’s not comfortable with any mixed group situation. That needs to be dealt with separately. It’s not something I would put up with. I camp and hike with a state wide mixed group. I worked in a male dominated field and went to a college with 5 guys for every 1 girl. I can’t imagine socializing with only women. I socialize with people which I share things in common. Knitting group is all female. Classes at the gym are coed. You need to sort out your personal standards on this issue. 

[Frances]

28 minutes ago, CES2005 said:

I have a past?  idk.  I can't say.  I mean, I felt that anxiety when we were dating and he went somewhere completely public with a friend and a friend's girlfriend.  For me it's been my faith that has helped me feel more secure.  Though I still have a hard time figuring out where the line is--that's a whole other topic.  But no, he's definitely in the "men and women can't be friends" camp.  We had a thread about that here somewhere.  He's not willing to be friends with other couples, so that level of protection is off the table.

I’m sorry. This all sounds so sad and limiting to me. I hope therapy helps you.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Trust seems to be a big issue in your marriage. He needs to trust that as an adult you have common sense and the ability to handle situations that come up in a relatively safe setting. Unless you have demonstrated the opposite, most adults have a mental “safety plan” that will allow them to handle normal situations. 

You both need to trust each other to remain faithful to each other in group settings where I assume that you would not be going off for alone time with someone else’s husband. 

[regentrude]

34 minutes ago, CES2005 said:

  But no, he's definitely in the "men and women can't be friends" camp.  We had a thread about that here somewhere.  He's not willing to be friends with other couples, so that level of protection is off the table.

So that means he requires you to keep exclusively female company? That sounds severely limiting and controlling. I don't think hiking/camping is the actual issue.

[EMS83]

37 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Trust seems to be a big issue in your marriage. He needs to trust that as an adult you have common sense and the ability to handle situations that come up in a relatively safe setting. Unless you have demonstrated the opposite, most adults have a mental “safety plan” that will allow them to handle normal situations. 

You both need to trust each other to remain faithful to each other in group settings where I assume that you would not be going off for alone time with someone else’s husband. 

Well when we met, I was binge drinking and smoking pot and driving intoxicated, so yeah.  And occasionally now I do something incredibly stupid and dangerous.  I mean, incredibly.  Like driving when I know I'm at risk for falling asleep at the wheel.  One time I jumped out of the driver's seat with the van going down the road.  It's random, but yeah.  I have.  99% of the time I'm fine.  Sometimes, something misfires.  Or with the fatigue thing, I felt like I didn't have another option.  My solution (camping) was shot down, and I didn't explore my other overnight options like I should have.

42 minutes ago, regentrude said:

So that means he requires you to keep exclusively female company? That sounds severely limiting and controlling. I don't think hiking/camping is the actual issue.

I ended a 7 year friendship with a great, totally platonic guy friend, so yes.  Though I think he had a crush on me at times.  But I was ok with it, and remorseful of all my less chaste and modest behavior.  It made sense.  But...I just stopped sharing my location on my phone (we've had it on 24/7 for a couple of years now), and despite saying it was a safety thing for both of us and he was leaving his on, he stopped sharing his.  I'm not unaware.  But now I don't know what's reasonable and what's not--but did I ever?  Hence counseling.  And this thread.  I don't want to overreact to a reasonable request.

[Jean in Newcastle]

6 minutes ago, CES2005 said:

Well when we met, I was binge drinking and smoking pot and driving intoxicated, so yeah.  And occasionally now I do something incredibly stupid and dangerous.  I mean, incredibly.  Like driving when I know I'm at risk for falling asleep at the wheel.  One time I jumped out of the driver's seat with the van going down the road.  It's random, but yeah.  I have.  99% of the time I'm fine.  Sometimes, something misfires.  Or with the fatigue thing, I felt like I didn't have another option.  My solution (camping) was shot down, and I didn't explore my other overnight options like I should have.

I ended a 7 year friendship with a great, totally platonic guy friend, so yes.  Though I think he had a crush on me at times.  But I was ok with it, and remorseful of all my less chaste and modest behavior.  It made sense.  But...I just stopped sharing my location on my phone (we've had it on 24/7 for a couple of years now), and despite saying it was a safety thing for both of us and he was leaving his on, he stopped sharing his.  I'm not unaware.  But now I don't know what's reasonable and what's not--but did I ever?  Hence counseling.  And this thread.  I don't want to overreact to a reasonable request.

Based on this, his concern for your children's' safety does seem warranted. 

[EMS83]

I guess so.  😞  In that case, a firearm definitely would be a bad solution, though.  So it still doesn't make sense to me.

[ktgrok]

Not trusting you to be alone with the kids is a separate issue - sounds like driving with them would b more dangerous than hiking in a public area with them. 

And that you can't be around men, AT ALL??? Even with the man's wife right there? And a lot of other people, so a public situation????? What does he think is going to happen, an orgy in front of the man's wife? That makes no sense. 

[regentrude]

28 minutes ago, CES2005 said:

Well when we met, I was binge drinking and smoking pot and driving intoxicated, so yeah.  And occasionally now I do something incredibly stupid and dangerous.  I mean, incredibly.  Like driving when I know I'm at risk for falling asleep at the wheel.  One time I jumped out of the driver's seat with the van going down the road.  It's random, but yeah.  I have.  99% of the time I'm fine.  Sometimes, something misfires.  Or with the fatigue thing, I felt like I didn't have another option.  My solution (camping) was shot down, and I didn't explore my other overnight options like I should have.

And he wants you to carry a GUN? That's crazy.