SanDiegoMom Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 (edited) So my 19 year old dd got tested recently for ADHD. They did the WAIS-IV along with attention related testing (measures of impulsivity and attention). They could not give her a FSIQ and did not give her a GAI (not sure why -- she went the the appointment alone). She did get diagnosed with ADHD, though the tests measuring impulsivity and attention were both in the average range. The psychologist thought her scores were definitely all over the place, but as she is following up through her campus psychologist, she basically just went through the report with her and wished her well. Does anyone see anything I am missing, other than that she is kinda all over the place? She definitely is an odd mixture of achievement and struggle in life -- she is doing awesome academically but loses her possessions non-stop, trips and falls or bangs into things constantly, and has struggled for years with executive functioning and procrastination. Just wondering if ADHD is it or if the large gaps in these scores have any other meaning I am missing! Verbal Comprehension -- 141 Similarities -- 15 Vocabulary -- 19 Information -- 16 Perceptual Reasoning -- 121 Block Desgin -- 15 Matrix Reasoning -- 16 Visual Puzzles -- 10 Working Memory -- 100 Digit Scan -- 10 Arithmetic -- 10 Processing Speed -- 117 Symbol Search -- 15 Coding -- 11 Edited December 20, 2018 by SanDiegoMom in VA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 How are her pragmatics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SanDiegoMom Posted December 20, 2018 Author Share Posted December 20, 2018 45 minutes ago, PeterPan said: How are her pragmatics? I am not sure what that refers to. She just had the IQ test with the 10 subtests and then the measures of attention and impulsivity - which I guess we're computer based (hit the space bar when you see an x kind of thing). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 You've got a spread of 20 between verbal and perceptual, which is significant. The working memory and processing speed you expect with ADHD, but that 2 standard deviation spread between the verbal and perceptual is not explained by ADHD. And you could say it's not 30 and it's right on the line, sure. I'm just saying it's there and that looking at the bigger picture would tell you if there's more going on. Here's a study to get you started. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2394183/ Did the psych screen for anything?? She's being handed off so the next psych will do more? Honestly, this would be the type to sit down with a private, really good psych, and get things explained. You're not going to do these kinds of evals a lot more times. What is going on that is driving this? She needs accommodations? Access to services? What's the bigger picture here? That banging into thing can be some mild praxis/motor planning or it can be vision or both. It's just the kind of stuff you could check into. My dd had a bit of both going on, so we ended up doing some vision therapy, which corrected her depth perception, and some OT. Some kids you need to unwrap. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 Pragmatics would be your umbrella term and hit your conversation, social skills, etc. The issues can be *subtle* with an exceptionally bright/gifted girl, and she could be masking. It's not going to look like a boy, if that makes sense. At 18 she's maxing out the tests, and yet it could be there's more going on there that needs to be unwrapped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SanDiegoMom Posted December 20, 2018 Author Share Posted December 20, 2018 She wasn't a psych that inspired much confidence in me to be honest - just the one that was allowed by insurance so we went with her. We did it to get an ADHD eval so that she could just understand herself better, maybe see meds if they were warranted. She has no need for time accommodations - she is doing extremely well in college academics, is a copy editor for the school newspaper, etc. But also loses things on a daily basis and is chronically late for everything, sprains ankles regularly and has hit three parked cars making our insurance skyrocket. (We only rarely let her drive now). Social skills are a mixed bag. She does a lot better now, and luckily had three best friends from 4th to the present who are like family. But it took her years to clue into nuances of social situations. Now she is very attuned to tone, body language, etc, and is attuned to what she says when she's not PMS-ing, lol. She has made many friends this year, goes out regularly with people, and gets along very well with her roommates. She's pretty happy this year, socially. She does dwell A LOT when things go wrong or she doesn't get a certain achievement. And I mean A LOT. Weeks to get over something. Months when she didn't make the higher editor position. But I don't know what that has to do with anything other than making me into long distance counselor for days on end! I wll have her look into the motor planning, and she's going in to get contacts soon. Usually the bumps or falls happen when she is also talking to someone or thinking about something. But the losing things and being late - yesterday was a great example - I tried to help her plan on how to be on time for lunch with her father at work (followed by an iD appointment where she needed her license and passport.) She was 15 min late leaving the house, she lost her keys on the way to the car, forgot where her wallet was and had to go back to look for it, drove to base and realized her driver's license wasn't in her wallet, drove home and found her license, went shopping after the appointment and left her debit card with the cashier. That is a typical bad day, and it usually happens around twice a month, with normal bad days of losing one thing happening much more frequently. So, yeah, assuming ADHD! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 I would get a developmental vision exam. That might help rule in or rule out some other possibilities. The other possibilities: Nonverbal learning disorder (NLD or NVLD) Dyspraxia/developmental coordination disorder (or some other label that is similar) My kiddos are all over, but both my kids have had improved visual spatial scores after vision therapy and overall improved scores after getting on ADHD meds. One of them still has a gap between visual spatial stuff and verbal, but there are highs and lows in both categories, and a more thorough look indicates that it's more consistent with a straight coordination issue. Said child also has developmental vision issues even after VT--it's just much better than it was and also has some physical things that are associated with motor clumsiness. You might be able to access scoring charts for the test and calculate your own FSIQ and GAI and see if they are close together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 Would your insurance cover further evals? She definitely sounds like she could use an OT eval. It sounds like she's been doing a lot of compensating for sensory and self-awareness issues. The word you're looking for there is interoception. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SanDiegoMom Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 Thank you all! You have given me lots of new leads to follow! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heathermomster Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 (edited) If she was diagnosed with ADHD, the uni DSS office should accommodate her with extended test-taking time and testing in isolation. The uni may also provide an EF person who will sit down with her weekly to discuss her class assignments. ETA: If your student is doing well at uni, they will likely not accommodate because her grades don't seem to be affected. I would still speak to DSS and discover whether they can provide EF support with a person who sits down with her weekly. Your DD has average working memory; however, that is an extreme disadvantage when compared to her verb comp and perceptual reasoning scores. A thirty point difference between wm and pr and wm and vc is a two stanine difference. Your child is intellectually gifted and challenged. My DS has been tested with similar numbers with the exception of the processing speed, which was significantly lower. My DS stumbled and was very clumsy. He eventually worked with a ped PT and improved his posture, left side weakness, balance, and bilateral coordination. He was 15-16 yo at that time, and the PT suspected DCD/dyspraxia. Son’s balance improved and he played football for two years. He’s not a super athlete; however, the PT work helped. As an armchair observer, it seems like your DD needs EF support. My DS worked with a CBT for a year and took a time management class with Marydee Sklar. I read and implemented ideas from the book ADHD Friendly Ways to Organize Your Life. Son uses both analog and digital timers to stay on task. His schedule is taped to his dorm room wall where he can see everything. He keeps a bookshelf with cubbies and stores his books and work by the day of the week. Son uses the timers when he showers to stay on task. Your DD might benefit from the Marydee Sklar class and possibly medication for the ADHD/anxiety. Lastly, check out the EF thread pinned to the top of the General Ed board. Good luck! Edited December 21, 2018 by Heathermomster 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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