How to "choose" professors (good vs. not rated profs)

[klmama]

1 hour ago, DawnM said:

 

I think most people think CC is like high school, where you can't really pick your teachers.  

 

Yes, but they're wrong.  When one of my dc was going to take classes at the CC, I helped dc look up all of the professors.  When dc went to register, the people there were amazed that somehow dc managed to register for the best profs on the campus.  Dc loved all of them and did great.  The next semester, I left it up to dc, who decided it wasn't worth the trouble because "all of the professors there are good."  You guessed it; dc had some not-so-terrific profs (who matched their RMP descriptions perfectly).  Live and learn. 

[DawnM]

2 minutes ago, klmama said:

Yes, but they're wrong.  When one of my dc was going to take classes at the CC, I helped dc look up all of the professors.  When dc went to register, the people there were amazed that somehow dc managed to register for the best profs on the campus.  Dc loved all of them and did great.  The next semester, I left it up to dc, who decided it wasn't worth the trouble because "all of the professors there are good."  You guessed it; dc had some not-so-terrific profs (who matched their RMP descriptions perfectly).  Live and learn. 

 

Yeah, but many of them also have jobs and/or live far away, and have to juggle scheduling too.  One friend has two sons there and only one car for them to use, so they had to work out scheduling.

For my own son, he was in a. specialty program where there were literally no alternatives.  

[G5052]

1 hour ago, klmama said:

Yes, but they're wrong.  When one of my dc was going to take classes at the CC, I helped dc look up all of the professors.  When dc went to register, the people there were amazed that somehow dc managed to register for the best profs on the campus.  Dc loved all of them and did great.  The next semester, I left it up to dc, who decided it wasn't worth the trouble because "all of the professors there are good."  You guessed it; dc had some not-so-terrific profs (who matched their RMP descriptions perfectly).  Live and learn. 

 

I have 20+ years at two different community colleges, and there are definitely good and bad professors. In my second year the professor teaching the class in the room before abruptly quit one night in front of the students.Apparently he really didn't know the subject at all, and finally just gave up. The department head ended up finishing the course for him. Some years later, I was taking an online course at another community college, and the professor didn't grade anything after the midterm. I contacted the school and got an email back that the professor was going to get caught up by the end of the semester. At the end, she gave me an "A" with empty scores in the gradebook. The next day, all of the scores had been filled in with 100's, and I knew that some of my work had been "B" level. I work for that college now, and she was still there when I started and recently retired. She had very poor scores on RMP.

[sheryl]

13 minutes ago, G5052 said:

 

I have 20+ years at two different community colleges, and there are definitely good and bad professors. In my second year the professor teaching the class in the room before abruptly quit one night in front of the students.Apparently he really didn't know the subject at all, and finally just gave up. The department head ended up finishing the course for him. Some years later, I was taking an online course at another community college, and the professor didn't grade anything after the midterm. I contacted the school and got an email back that the professor was going to get caught up by the end of the semester. At the end, she gave me an "A" with empty scores in the gradebook. The next day, all of the scores had been filled in with 100's, and I knew that some of my work had been "B" level. I work for that college now, and she was still there when I started and recently retired. She had very poor scores on RMP.

OK,, I appreciate this reply.  It's objective!

Just want y'all to know that I don't want my dd to have an "easy" hand-out-A-with-very-little-effort prof type.  HOWEVER, dd has been homeschooled ALWAYS!  I do believe there should be "some" grace for the awkward 1st semester cc student - NOT A PASS!  But, a little grace. It's a transition for them.   I would like to go forward finding teachers that will stretch her but be fair.  I know that is subjective to a point.  How do we define fair?  So, it goes back to reviews perhaps.  There will be A students with little or no effort.  How reliable is their review?  There will be D/F students and how reliable is theirs?  I like what one pp mentioned and I replied to the suggestion and that is to email the teacher and/or obtain a syllabus before class (if that's possible).  We will need to study up now on the teachers and their courses.  That will be now as open enrollment is now for current students!  

[kiana]

18 hours ago, regentrude said:

I got an angry comment that I was helping students only for three hours with their homework that was due the next day.

 

It is a shaaaame that you don't really caaaare ? /sarcasm

[kiana]

17 minutes ago, sheryl said:

OK,, I appreciate this reply.  It's objective!

Just want y'all to know that I don't want my dd to have an "easy" hand-out-A-with-very-little-effort prof type.  HOWEVER, dd has been homeschooled ALWAYS!  I do believe there should be "some" grace for the awkward 1st semester cc student - NOT A PASS!  But, a little grace. It's a transition for them.   I would like to go forward finding teachers that will stretch her but be fair.  I know that is subjective to a point.  How do we define fair?  So, it goes back to reviews perhaps.  There will be A students with little or no effort.  How reliable is their review?  There will be D/F students and how reliable is theirs?  I like what one pp mentioned and I replied to the suggestion and that is to email the teacher and/or obtain a syllabus before class (if that's possible).  We will need to study up now on the teachers and their courses.  That will be now as open enrollment is now for current students!  

 

This is a good plan. Look at the course policies. Look at the percentage of grade from tests and see how that accords with your dd and what you know about her. For example, if she has test anxiety and 90% of the grade is from tests, that is probably not a good fit. 

Most CC profs (I'm at one now) build in a fair amount of grace. For example, they may not take late homework, but instead drop the lowest 15% or something. It's built in in some way. Because CC, and especially first-year CC classes, are "how to college" as well as "subject 101". 

For a student taking something that they know is only for general education (for example, a prospective engineering major taking music 101 for a distribution requirement), there is absolutely nothing wrong with taking the "easy A" instructor. Just make sure to pair those with the "tough but you will learn so much and be prepared for your next class" professors in the major, supporting classes for the major, or anything that might turn into the major. Like, even if you are going for nursing, you do not want the "she gives so much extra credit" algebra professor, because you still need that algebra even if math isn't your favorite subject. My general education classes are a lot easier on you than the algebra for STEM majors classes, and they have to memorize a lot less -- for general education I want them to appreciate math and learn something that they can use and be able to think about things quantitatively, but for STEM majors they really need to know their skills all the way through. I know I get some bad reviews from people who really don't understand that you cannot get passed through trigonometry on magical end-of-semester extra credit and then somehow expect to be prepared for the calculus class that comes next. But then I get thank-you notes from people who are doing well in calculus or in graduate school, and those actually mean a lot more ?

I would have your dd ask for a syllabus (not you) -- be warned that they may very well not have one. I've only just learned what I'm teaching in the spring. But I'd be happy to send a fall semester syllabus with the caveat that this may very well change but should do as a guideline. 

Some reviews that are things to avoid:

• Does not return work on time/does not give feedback on work.
• Cancels class all the time/does not hold posted office hours/takes personal calls in class/other totally unacceptable behavior that is still sometimes tolerated for some reason. 
• Goes off on irrelevant tangents if coming from multiple students.
• Adds assignments without warning or moves dates earlier (changes dates is not necessarily bad, often the class is going slowly and the due date will be moved back, but surprise oh-this-is-due-in-two-days is bad).
• Does not reply to emails in a timely manner if coming from multiple students (if from only one in otherwise good reviews it may very well be the type of person who emails at 3am and is surprised not to receive a reply until 9).

[sheryl]

1 hour ago, kiana said:

 

This is a good plan. Look at the course policies. Look at the percentage of grade from tests and see how that accords with your dd and what you know about her. For example, if she has test anxiety and 90% of the grade is from tests, that is probably not a good fit. 

Most CC profs (I'm at one now) build in a fair amount of grace. For example, they may not take late homework, but instead drop the lowest 15% or something. It's built in in some way. Because CC, and especially first-year CC classes, are "how to college" as well as "subject 101". 

For a student taking something that they know is only for general education (for example, a prospective engineering major taking music 101 for a distribution requirement), there is absolutely nothing wrong with taking the "easy A" instructor. Just make sure to pair those with the "tough but you will learn so much and be prepared for your next class" professors in the major, supporting classes for the major, or anything that might turn into the major. Like, even if you are going for nursing, you do not want the "she gives so much extra credit" algebra professor, because you still need that algebra even if math isn't your favorite subject. My general education classes are a lot easier on you than the algebra for STEM majors classes, and they have to memorize a lot less -- for general education I want them to appreciate math and learn something that they can use and be able to think about things quantitatively, but for STEM majors they really need to know their skills all the way through. I know I get some bad reviews from people who really don't understand that you cannot get passed through trigonometry on magical end-of-semester extra credit and then somehow expect to be prepared for the calculus class that comes next. But then I get thank-you notes from people who are doing well in calculus or in graduate school, and those actually mean a lot more ?

I would have your dd ask for a syllabus (not you) -- be warned that they may very well not have one. I've only just learned what I'm teaching in the spring. But I'd be happy to send a fall semester syllabus with the caveat that this may very well change but should do as a guideline. 

Some reviews that are things to avoid:

• Does not return work on time/does not give feedback on work.
• Cancels class all the time/does not hold posted office hours/takes personal calls in class/other totally unacceptable behavior that is still sometimes tolerated for some reason. 
• Goes off on irrelevant tangents if coming from multiple students.
• Adds assignments without warning or moves dates earlier (changes dates is not necessarily bad, often the class is going slowly and the due date will be moved back, but surprise oh-this-is-due-in-two-days is bad).
• Does not reply to emails in a timely manner if coming from multiple students (if from only one in otherwise good reviews it may very well be the type of person who emails at 3am and is surprised not to receive a reply until 9).

THANKS!  This was equally helpful!  I appreciate your thoroughness and insight!   As an aside, this prof actually does fit the bill above to some degree.  He assigned an extra credit paper.  I had dd go to the school's writing tutor and she met with him at 11:30 this morning.  The writing tutor said that some of the terminology used/objectives for paper were vague.  This has been the case again and again with this guy.  I thought it was my dd who just wasn't "meeting the standard" (and there is room for her to improve) but she's trying with a professor who is considered vague and more by a writing tutor! 

I can get that.  For non-major classes the objective may be a "bit" more relaxed than for major classes.