Would this bother you?

[Janie Grace]

My dd is 19 and a college sophomore. Recently my sister was visiting from across the country. She didn't mention anything to me about this, but dd informed me that my sister invited her to come to her house for spring break (my sister would pay). And then just today, dd informed me that my sister has invited her to spend the whole summer (and has her excited about internships she may be able to set up). 

I think it's strange that my sister wouldn't talk to me about this first. Not asking permission but running it by me. I know dd is an "adult" but still... it feels weird. Would this bother you? 

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Janie Grace said:

My dd is 19 and a college sophomore. Recently my sister was visiting from across the country. She didn't mention anything to me about this, but dd informed me that my sister invited her to come to her house for spring break (my sister would pay). And then just today, dd informed me that my sister has invited her to spend the whole summer (and has her excited about internships she may be able to set up). 

I think it's strange that my sister wouldn't talk to me about this first. Not asking permission but running it by me. I know dd is an "adult" but still... it feels weird. Would this bother you? 

Yes it would bother me.  But I have been accused of being a control freak. So there is that.

We just have to remember that our adult kids go on to have independent relationships that we are not really a part of.

[Selkie]

Yeah, that would bother me. Just curious, is this the same sister from the non-gender child thread?

[maize]

I wouldn't necessarily think to run something by a parent first that involved an adult niece or nephew.

I know that young adults in college are usually not really independent, more in a transitional phase, but we have to start treating them as adults some time. If she weren't in college but were working and living on her own, or married and starting a family, would you expect your sister to run any invitations by you first?

I think it is up to the child, not the sister, to discuss invitations and possible arrangements with parents.

Edited November 9, 2018 by maize

[Janie Grace]

8 minutes ago, Selkie said:

Yeah, that would bother me. Just curious, is this the same sister from the non-gender child thread?

 

Yes. Their worldview (and their world itself) is very, very different from ours. 

[Arcadia]

In general I wouldn’t be bothered as I was a latchkey kid and my relatives while quirky aren’t manipulative and good with boundaries. My aunts took me on international vacations without my parents when I was a kid and my parents let me coordinate plans with my aunts directly.

If it is my husband’s parents, brother (and his wife), I would be concerned even if my kids are already of legal age because they have been manipulative (intentionally or otherwise) in the past.

My husband’s sister (and her husband) and aunts are okay, no hidden agenda, and they are welcomed to take my kids on vacation even now.

Edited November 9, 2018 by Arcadia

[Bootsie]

I would not necessarily be upset about it.  I have two sister, one of which I am very close to and the other that I am not close to.  The second of the two, DD talks to much more than I do.  At 19, I would not expect someone else to ask me before they discuss a trip with friends.  For example, I would not expect the university to contact me about a potential spring break trip before mentioning the possibility to my children.  I would not expect the parents of my children's roommates to contact me before they invited my child to their house for spring break.  

[SKL]

If I were speaking to my adult niece / nephew about such things, I would assume that the niece/nephew would tell his/her parents about the conversation.  I would not think there was a need for two conversations about the same topic.

So, if my adult daughter told me "Aunt Sue invited me to spend the summer with her" I would not be offended.

[Miss Tick]

The part that I would find odd is that the sister visited you from across the country and it didn't come up in conversation. Maybe since it hadn't been settled she didn't want to dive into it. But I would consider the possibility that she didn't want me to sway dd against it and how I felt about that. In the end I would try to not let it become a big deal because there is no pleasant end in sight at the end of that tunnel.

[Selkie]

I think it's odd that she was visiting you but didn't mention it. That seems like she was intentionally trying to keep it from you.

[rdj2027]

At 19 my kid is an adult and I would not expect to be asked.  I stay out of my adult kids' lives unless asked for advice or input.

[Janie Grace]

I think it's odd because I have had phone/text contact with my sister since she extended these invitations and she hasn't mentioned them. So that makes me feel like it's secretive or something. She went and saw dd when she visited me and when I asked about their time, she was dodgy in terms of answering. I don't know but I feel like perhaps dd is questioning some of our beliefs and this aunt represents an extreme alternative view; perhaps my sister feels a bit awkward about that. (This is just my hypothesis but I think there's a good chance it's accurate.) So I guess it feels weird because of that underlying dynamic... 

I could see inviting a 19yo niece/nephew to come visit but I would DEFINITELY mention it to the sibling (their parent) in next conversation. To not mention it seems like concealing it.

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

I agree with @Selkie .  The issue is not the direct invitation to your dd, but rather your sister's (seemingly intentional) keeping you out of the loop.  

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Janie Grace said:

I think it's odd because I have had phone/text contact with my sister since she extended these invitations and she hasn't mentioned them. So that makes me feel like it's secretive or something. She went and saw dd when she visited me and when I asked about their time, she was dodgy in terms of answering. I don't know but I feel like perhaps dd is questioning some of our beliefs and this aunt represents an extreme alternative view; perhaps my sister feels a bit awkward about that. (This is just my hypothesis but I think there's a good chance it's accurate.) So I guess it feels weird because of that underlying dynamic... 

I could see inviting a 19yo niece/nephew to come visit but I would DEFINITELY mention it to the sibling (their parent) in next conversation. To not mention it seems like concealing it.

 

1 minute ago, Monica_in_Switzerland said:

I agree with @Selkie .  The issue is not the direct invitation to your dd, but rather your sister's (seemingly intentional) keeping you out of the loop.  

Yep.  I would not  be happy at all. But ultimately she is an adult....

[Janie Grace]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

 

Yep.  I would not  be happy at all. But ultimately she is an adult....

 

So would you bring it up to your sister? I'm PISSED. I don't want to make a big scene and I also don't want to act like she's required to go through me. I don't know how to communicate "this feels sneaky and weird and how would YOU like it?!" without sounding crazy.

[sheryl]

YES indeed, it would bother me! 

I know that our 19 year olds are considered an "adult" but that's only as defined by the government (well, 18 begins).  BUT, how did the government come up with that age.  Why not 19, 20.  Obviously kids go to college and graduate around 22 but honestly.  I've always said and it's my opinion that just b/c the government calls you a legal adult for most things, it doesn't mean that aged person is "really" an adult.   I have just talked to people, overheard people, read articles where it seems the parents are anxious to start their child on adulthood (and, yes, all parents should at the right time) and once they turn 18 then they can make all of the decisions.  I don't agree with that.  At all.  It really irks me.  With age comes responsibility and freedoms.  But, those freedoms are not always in the best interest of a young adult.  (That's it, young adult.  There are many "young adult" church groups and the ones I know begin at 18 and will go to mid-upper 20's.  Adults would follow that).  It's almost like society says, ok, we're done now so you're on your own.  I say no. Your dd will always be your baby, child, adult child, daughter and you will always be her Mom. 

OK, rant over.  This topic really set me off. Your sister while probably well-meaning did usurp you, imo.  She should have asked you first, run it by both of you simultaneously (phone call, Skype) or at the very least suggest the idea only to your dd stating that dd needs to talk it over with you.   I'll just have to stop here b/c I feel I could keep going.  LOL!

If she was older then perhaps, but honestly, she's only 19! 

[Junie]

If my sister did something like this (and it's possible that she would), I would shoot her an email:

Hey sis,

Dd was telling me something about internship opportunities.  Sounds interesting.  Do you have more info?

[Scarlett]

5 minutes ago, Janie Grace said:

 

So would you bring it up to your sister? I'm PISSED. I don't want to make a big scene and I also don't want to act like she's required to go through me. I don't know how to communicate "this feels sneaky and weird and how would YOU like it?!" without sounding crazy.

Well, you are going to have to check your anger.  But yes bring it up....at the very least just mention in passing your dd told you about it so she is aware there is no secrecy.

I think the biggest problem is her attempt to sway your dd away from your beliefs.  Is this an aunt that you have encouraged a relationship with as your dd was growing up?

[Peaceseeker]

I would just be sad if my kid didn't want to spend any time at spring or summer break with me.  That is pretty much going from Christmas til fall break.  But I am clingy like that, lol...

I would just casually toss out in your next conversation with your sister "so DD mentioned you invited her over for spring and summer break this year.." and see what she says.  It shouldn't be too awkward since your daughter told you about it now.  Unless you make it awkward by getting upset with her for issuing an invitation which seems a little bit of an overreaction out of fear.

I wouldn't worry about the world view thing so much.  I understand your concerns, but honestly there isn't much she hasn't seen by now as a sophomore in college these days unless she goes to a very  conservative Christian college or something.  You had her formative years and now she will experience other viewpoints.  In the end she will have to make up her own mind as an adult about what she believes.  

 

 

[Pawz4me]

No, I don't think it would bother me at all. And we actually did have a somewhat similar situation--DH's sister worked to arrange an internship for DS19 and it was pretty much a done deal before we knew about it. We were thrilled because it was a very good opportunity for him (although unlike your situation it didn't involve him traveling a long distance). Anyway, in general I don't have any problem with my adult kids functioning like autonomous adults. That's been my goal for them since birth.

[Catwoman]

17 minutes ago, Selkie said:

I think it's odd that she was visiting you but didn't mention it. That seems like she was intentionally trying to keep it from you.

 

That is my impression, as well.

14 minutes ago, Monica_in_Switzerland said:

I agree with @Selkie .  The issue is not the direct invitation to your dd, but rather your sister's (seemingly intentional) keeping you out of the loop.  

 

Yes, it’s not the invitation; it’s the secrecy.

9 minutes ago, Janie Grace said:

 

So would you bring it up to your sister? I'm PISSED. I don't want to make a big scene and I also don't want to act like she's required to go through me. I don't know how to communicate "this feels sneaky and weird and how would YOU like it?!" without sounding crazy.

 

I would probably say, “This feels sneaky and weird and how would YOU like it?!” — the same thing you really want to say to her.

If it was a member of my family and I was angry, I would come right out and tell her how I felt. Why do you feel you need to be super-diplomatic or treat your sister with kid gloves? Why not just tell her how you feel? 

I can understand how some families would be fine with a situation like this, but it’s not fine with YOU, so I see no reason not to be open and honest with your sister. 

[Peaceseeker]

Well we have to make the line for adult somewhere.  Sure young adults still need our support and guidance, but they don't need us to control all of their decisions for them so that we can (obviously) make the right choices for them.  I disagree that the sister should have to call and check with mom first.  Sure for an underage minor, but that seems very controlling for adult relationships.

  My goal would be to have the kind of open relationships where everyone would be totally comfortable discussing things though.  Obviously the daughter is comfortable telling mom about the invites but the sister wasn't.  This probably has more to do with the two sisters relationship than anything with the daughter. Perhaps the sister knew mom would be upset, doesn't approve of her lifestyle, etc.. but still wanted to extend an offer to her adult niece and decided to let niece deal with mom about it.  

[regentrude]

No, it would not bother me. I'd expect my adult child to mention it in conversation with me, but I would not expect my sister to tell me about her invitation.

 

[Catwoman]

21 minutes ago, rdj2027 said:

At 19 my kid is an adult and I would not expect to be asked.  I stay out of my adult kids' lives unless asked for advice or input.

 

My ds is nearly 19 and I can’t imagine staying out of his life unless he specifically asked me for advice or input. Honestly, I think if I did that, he would probably think I didn’t love him any more, because we talk about pretty much everything and if I stopped asking him about things and offering to help him when I thought he needed it, he would wonder what was going on.

[Scarlett]

My adult niece is 30 now, but when she was 19 I did invite her to live with me.  I don't remember at all discussing it with her mom, BUT I also don't remember any attempt to keep it from her mom.  So that is really the difference.  You are feeling, rightfully so I think, an attempt by your sister to pull your dd away from you and how she was raised.  That is bound to be annoying and hurtful and infuriating....but your sister is just showing her true colors.  She sounds like someone you need to limit contact with anyway. 

[HomeAgain]

1 minute ago, regentrude said:

No, it would not bother me. I'd expect my adult child to mention it in conversation with me, but I would not expect my sister to tell me about her invitation.

 

This.  I think a 19yo is old enough to make their own decisions, but as someone who is responsible for the household and their parent I would hope that they would respect me enough to share with me their plans and let me mull over pros/cons to bring up to them.

[maize]

33 minutes ago, Janie Grace said:

I think it's odd because I have had phone/text contact with my sister since she extended these invitations and she hasn't mentioned them. So that makes me feel like it's secretive or something. She went and saw dd when she visited me and when I asked about their time, she was dodgy in terms of answering. I don't know but I feel like perhaps dd is questioning some of our beliefs and this aunt represents an extreme alternative view; perhaps my sister feels a bit awkward about that. (This is just my hypothesis but I think there's a good chance it's accurate.) So I guess it feels weird because of that underlying dynamic... 

I could see inviting a 19yo niece/nephew to come visit but I would DEFINITELY mention it to the sibling (their parent) in next conversation. To not mention it seems like concealing it.

The dodginess and apparent secretiveness would bother me.

I understand the concerns about an alternative worldview and potential ... for lack of a better word ... recruitment efforts.

Is your relationship with your daughter such that you could discuss your concerns with her?

[bolt.]

It wouldn’t bother me.

(It’s okay that it bothers you, though.)

[Arcadia]

21 minutes ago, Janie Grace said:

I don't know how to communicate "this feels sneaky and weird and how would YOU like it?!" without sounding crazy.

 

Just say your daughter mentioned the trips and discuss the trips like a typical school field trip. You won’t want your daughter to stop or worry about communicating with you either. My dad worries a lot so people give him the bare minimum of necessary information because they don’t want to hear all his worst case scenarios.

Unless your sister implied to your daughter not to let her parents know, I won’t call that sneaky. It puts you in a defensive mood/position.

My in-laws literally said “don’t tell your parents” which shocked FIL’s sisters who overheard. That is downright sneaky.

I would feel weird if anyone has to let my parents know before inviting me once I had my own copy of the house key as a kid. It’s like “you trust me to be home alone but I need a consent form to go somewhere” kind of feeling. I would have let my parents know when details were finalized or if I need their inputs.

[Bootsie]

I would simply mention it to my sister and see how she reacts.  She may not have been trying to intentionally keep it from you.  She may have mentioned it in passing to your daughter, and it is a bigger deal to your daughter than your sister realized it would be.  It may not have occurred to her to mention it to you. Also, this may be more about how your sister views your niece as an adult at this point and that she is trying to build and adult-aunt/niece relationship with her. 

[lispy]

If you're hypothesis is correct about dd questioning some of your beliefs,  it is possible she has sought out other opinions from others,  including her aunt.  If that is the case,  it could be that the aunt was simply leaving it up to your dd as to who dd felt comfortable sharing her plans.  I don't necessarily see this as keeping it a secret from you,  but keeping the confidences of her niece. 

I don't think I'd be bothered, but it's heard to say for sure as I have no btdt. But since you are bothered,  I'd say just mention it in a casual way to your sister and go from there. 

[Miss Mousie]

Hmm... a tough one.

Originally I was right there with you, Janie, but then in reading other responses I started to change my mind.

But it in the end, here's where it stands for me:  if it were (almost literally) anyone else, I wouldn't have a problem with it.  But if it were one of the women in my family?  I'd definitely smell ulterior motive and I would definitely be pissed and try to steer my kid clear of them.  Kind of interesting, though, that I have one brother that I think I'd be OK with - even though his wife is pretty much at the top of my "beware" list.

Yeah, I have family issues.  ?

[happi duck]

I wish people would treat my dc (ya) like individual adults instead of as happi duck's kids.  I especially wish this of family.

[katilac]

If someone offered to try and set my kid up with an internship, I'd be too busy falling to my knees in gratitude to worry about anything else, lol. 

No, I would not be upset with an aunt or uncle for this. I would not expect them to talk with me first, and I probably wouldn't think twice about extending a similar offer to a nibbling or other young adult. It likely came up in conversation: dd talking about summer plans or lack thereof, and auntie saying, oh, you should come here, I can start asking around about internships! 

You are getting all kinds of mad and upset when you actually don't at all know that she was intentionally keeping it from you.  You say she was dodgy in terms of talking about their visit, but I think you might be reading into things. Why would she have to be evasive about the visit in general? She could tell you a million and one details without mentioning this in particular. And your dd seems to be telling you about it as they go along (first spring break then summer and internships), I don't see any secrecy there. 

Why not assume the best? Your sis loves your dd and wants to both see her and help her. Assuming the worst doesn't get you anywhere and doesn't change anything. 

[marbel]

I don't know that I'd be annoyed or angry, but it would seem weird to me.  I think it's just something that a sibling would mention, particularly since she is visiting at your house. Maybe she is trying to establish an adult relationship with your daughter without you in the middle. Obviously she wouldn't have to ask your permission, but it seems odd that while she was visiting she wouldn't even mention it to you.  Based on my own sibling relationships, I would find it a little troubling.  Again, not to the point of anger but just... what the heck? Why not talk to me about it?

[LMD]

I think that if I'd just been making a very big effort to respect their worldview, at their specific request, especially in regards to how they raise their child, and they didn't even mention (awkwardly avoiding by the sounds of it) asking my child to live with them for months - yeah, I'd be feeling very disrespected and hurt.

'Hey sis, dd told me about your offer. Why didn't you mention it to me?'

Is their young child their only child? Has she had a close relationship with your dd growing up?

[Mbelle]

Technically they are both adults.  However, there is more to relationships than legalities.  There is basic respect, courtesy and their value of your place in your childrens lives just to start with.  If this were my family I would wonder what they think of the relationship my adult child and I have and why they want to interfere in that behind my back?  Why are they keeping this under the radar? 

 

[City Mouse]

I wouldn't be upset about it, but my suspicious nature would make me think than Aunt  might be looking for free child care over the breaks, so I might suggest that DD clarify the expectations with Aunt in advance.

[SKL]

3 hours ago, Catwoman said:

 

That is my impression, as well.

 

Yes, it’s not the invitation; it’s the secrecy.

 

I would probably say, “This feels sneaky and weird and how would YOU like it?!” — the same thing you really want to say to her.

If it was a member of my family and I was angry, I would come right out and tell her how I felt. Why do you feel you need to be super-diplomatic or treat your sister with kid gloves? Why not just tell her how you feel? 

I can understand how some families would be fine with a situation like this, but it’s not fine with YOU, so I see no reason not to be open and honest with your sister. 

I would not burn a bridge for my kid though.  I would most likely encourage my kid to explore the internship opportunity and decide based on that whether to stay with Auntie for the summer.  It isn't easy to find a good summer job.

Edited November 9, 2018 by SKL

[scholastica]

3 hours ago, rdj2027 said:

At 19 my kid is an adult and I would not expect to be asked.  I stay out of my adult kids' lives unless asked for advice or input.

This is only true in my house if the adult child is not being financially supported by me any longer. If my dollars are involved, I get some say.

[Carol in Cal.]

I would not expect to be asked, but I would expect to be informed at least, particularly if I were in regular contact.

At an earlier age than college, I would be furious.  A SIL who was not my friend on facebook friend requested DD when she was about 12, and I thought that was pretty weird.  DD and I agreed on how to handle it, but that whole going straight to the kid thing pretty much does not work for me.

[SKL]

Another thought.  If this aunt is not playing with a full deck, then your daughter will figure that very quickly if she camps out there for a while.  Which may be a good thing under the circumstances.

[Carol in Cal.]

7 minutes ago, SKL said:

Another thought.  If this aunt is not playing with a full deck, then your daughter will figure that very quickly if she camps out there for a while.  Which may be a good thing under the circumstances.

It's a long way away, and she could feel pretty trapped.  That's not good.

[LMD]

I mean, if my kid had spent weekends and holidays (sans parents) regularly at aunts house, and aunt had always been respectful and supportive of our different worldviews, and aunt had proven a trustworthy ally in strengthening/supporting the parent-child bond, then I could chalk it up to navigating new young adult relationship awkwardness.

I would not react well if there was a whiff of undermining my relationship with my own child.

[Tanaqui]

Is it possible she brought it up to your kid thinking your kid would run it by you and that, therefore, her asking you was superfluous? It seems to me that if she wanted this to stay on the down-low, she ought to have communicated that to your kid better.

At any rate, unless you want to risk damaging the dynamics between the three of you, you can't vent at your sister much. Just contact her and say "Heard about the invite, do you have more information on this internships?" like this is all perfectly normal and reasonable.

[happi duck]

I had an evil aunt who actually did try to undermine the relationship between my sister and mom, when sister was newly on her own.  She told my sister to keep things from my mom.  She visted my sister and gave her lots of gifts.  "Don't tell your mom" was a red flag and my sister didn't fall for it.

[SKL]

I agree with bringing it up in a friendly, conversational way just like anything else you'd talk about.  I would not confront unless there was clear evidence that the aunt did not mean well toward the niece.

[HS Mom in NC]

I don't think there's enough evidence with the OP to act on the assumption that aunt is doing something bad, but how bad could it be?  If she's trying to persuade a 19 year old into different values, that's life. There are people who are going to do that and our adult children are free to accept or reject it. I can't stop others from sharing their values with adults willing to listen.  I can't stop my adult children from hearing out people of all types of values. Why would I want to?  I expect my adult children to question everything for themselves because that's part of becoming an adult.  I never once told myself that my kids would grow up to share every value I have.  I expect different values to be within the realm of possibility for my children because they're their own people.   We made sure our kids were around people of different values than we had because that's who is out in the world and they needed to be prepared for that.

I have kids in that age range.  Nope, it's not even a blip on the radar for me.  I don't expect people to run things by me when it comes to my adult kids.  I think it's very strange to be upset about it.  When I heard about it from my kid I would call my sibling and thank them for extending visiting and internship opportunities, not confront them. I honestly don't think there's a way to bring it up the aunt without sounding crazy because it doesn't seem rational to expect anyone to run anything past the parent of an adult child or to mention things about the adult child. Yeah, I think it would naturally come up in a conversation, but expecting it to happen and if it doesn't getting upset about it weird to me. 

My brother did call in favors at work to get our niece (daughter of our step-brother) an interview.  I can't imagine that he called her daddy to run it by him or to make him aware beforehand or immediately after out of obligation.   Maybe he did, but she's 19, not a child, so expecting it sounds weird to me. Yeah, I'm sure he mentioned it the next time he saw her daddy or talked to him,but that's just things in common chit chat.

[Shoeless]

6 hours ago, Janie Grace said:

So would you bring it up to your sister? I'm PISSED. I don't want to make a big scene and I also don't want to act like she's required to go through me. I don't know how to communicate "this feels sneaky and weird and how would YOU like it?!" without sounding crazy.

 

Yes, I would bring it up.  I would not yell about it, but I would say "So DD told me you invited her for the summer.  I'm surprised you didn't mention it to me when we last spoke or when you visited.", and then be silent.  Your sister's reaction will tell you everything you need to know about her intentions.  People who are "guilty" of shenanigans tend to yammer on to fill the uncomfortable silence.  People who are simply clueless, forgetful, or operating with different standards will respond with something like "Yes, I did.  Is that a problem?", and genuinely want to know why you are bringing up the subject.    

[Shoeless]

34 minutes ago, Homeschool Mom in AZ said:

I don't think there's enough evidence with the OP to act on the assumption that aunt is doing something bad, but how bad could it be?  

 

 

If my family did something like this, I'd be hopping mad.  My family of origin has extremely poor boundaries and feels entitled to meddle in my family's personal business.  Within the context of a dysfunctional family, an invitation like this is concerning and frustrating because it can have a lasting, negative impact on the parent-child relationship.  

 

Edited to add: I do understand that the DD in question is 19 and a legal adult, and one really can't stop her from doing what she wants.  I'd still be hopping mad if any of my relatives circumvented me to invite my semi-dependant adult child to live with them for several months. 

Edited November 9, 2018 by MissLemon