Spelling Help. . . UGH

[ByGrace3]

My youngest is a terrible speller. terrible, horrible, no good, very bad speller. I don't understand it at all. She is in 3rd grade and we just started AAS 3. We are DRAGGING through AAS. We did level 1 and part of level 2 in first grade. Level 1 was ok but she super struggled with level 2 so we set it aside and began in the beginning of 2nd grade with level 2 again. (started it over). It took ALL year to get through. We took the summer off and she is now acting like she has no idea what any of this is . . .it's baffling. She is getting review words wrong every day for the last two weeks. The.same.words. "Our" has been missed every day for weeks. I have her spell missed words 5X. Today I made her spell "Our" 20X's. I'm losing my mind. I don't want spelling to be a battle. I either need to way back up on my expectations of AAS...struggle through and trust it will get better....even if it takes two years to get through level 3... OR is there something else out there? 

This child completed AAR pre-level through level 4 and she STILL struggles with giving all the sounds for the phonograms (cards; she reads them usually just fine).

I might add we don't use the tiles...would that be a game changer? My other kids never needed them... We only used the syllable tiles...

[HomeAgain]

AAS didn't work for us.  It was too disconnected from context for it to touch my son's writing.  He could memorize the sounds and the rules but couldn't apply them.

Maybe something like Spelling You See or Spell By Color would work better for your dd, where each part is color coded for reinforcement (and SYS uses copywork/dictation to reinforce the lesson all week)

[Lori D.]

Typical school year start-up lag?
(traditional schools often spend the first 6-9 weeks of the new year reviewing the previous year's concepts before moving into the new topics/materials)

She might have some sort of LDs or processing issue that is starting to come to light.
(Is stealth dyslexia a possibility -- can read, but struggles with spelling and writing.) 

Perhaps she's a "late bloomer" in developing/maturing in the parts of the brain that process spelling?
(some kids don't "click" until age 10+)

Or, perhaps she just needs a different approach that is a better fit?
(Apples and Pears? Barton?  Spalding? Spelling You See? Stevenson Learning Skills (mnemonic instruction)?)

_______________________


I know this will not be of help, but our DS#2 was a struggling speller (and struggling writer and math struggler). He absolutely did not even begin to click with spelling until age 12. We tried a lot of different spelling programs. In 4th grade, I kind of gave up for the year and we just spent that year memorizing about 150-200 of the most commonly-used words (many of which were "sight" types of words like "our").

And I had to do a lot of very visual individualized remedial work with him to scaffold spelling -- using the whiteboard and different colors of markers to show vowel pairs and draw little pictures/stories to make visual connections for homophones ("meet" vs "meat"); strengthening auditory-sequential memory through back and forth oral spelling practice with me; practicing simultaneously writing and spelling through dictating short sentences (like 6 words long) with 2-3 spelling words in each sentence, and he outloud repeated the sentence and spelled aloud each word as he wrote it. Things like that.

Hugs and patience! Remember, your child is NOT failing to click with spelling or failing to remember the rules just to annoy you, and the calmer you can remain, and keep lessons short and focused, the less it will stress out your student -- stress and "feeling stupid" shuts down their thinking! BEST wishes for quickly finding what helps you both start moving forward with spelling! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Lori D.

[MerryAtHope]

35 minutes ago, ByGrace3 said:

I might add we don't use the tiles...would that be a game changer? My other kids never needed them... We only used the syllable tiles...

 

Hard to say but they really were a game-changer for my kids. I didn't find AAS until mine were older (they started with level 1 in 4th and 6th grades), after years of other methods (including the "write the misspelled word X times" types of methods failed.) My son once spelled ask "aic" just before we started--to give you a picture of what our challenges were like!

And even with starting in 4th grade, it took my youngest 2 years to automatically remember all of the sounds for the letter U. She just had a huge mental glitch for that one! I finally learned to just review it every single day (in fact, I found it helped to do it twice a day--once at the beginning and once at the end of each lesson. Over-teaching like that really helped when my kids were stuck on something.) I'll also say that if you took all summer off, expect to spend about 2 months in review. I always had to limit our summer breaks to about 6 weeks or my kids just forgot everything--it was so disheartening!

I think what made the tiles critical for my kids was because I was making them teach the concept back to me. Each day I would quickly review the concept we were working on. For example I'd say, “This week we are learning how to add silent E. Do you remember how silent E changes a word?”

or, “This week we are studying how to spell the /k/ sound at the end of a word. Do you remember what our choices are for that sound?” If your child remembers, great, praise her! Then ask a follow-up question, such as, “How do we decide which one to use?” At whatever point she doesn’t remember, review it. Then, walk through a tile demonstration whether she remembered or not, and finally have her teach it back to you.

This act of having the child teach it back to you makes them learn on a deeper level. They don't just memorize letters or learn a concept for that lesson but then forget it. They have to learn it more deeply in order to be able to explain it. Hearing and seeing are more passive ways of learning, while explaining and doing are more active--so you want to make sure that you incorporate all of those aspects until she finds the concept easy. Do this type of review daily until your child can easily remember the new concept and teach it back to you with the tiles without your help or prompting (but while she is working towards mastery, give all the help and prompting needed. Don’t stop helping/prompting until it’s obvious she doesn’t need it.)

Then pick up where you left off in the book. If you get to the 10 words the first day, review the 10 words with a different medium (if she used tiles day 1, write on a white board on day 2, or go outside and use sidewalk chalk, or use one of the other kinesthetic methods). You may or may not get to sentences yet this day.  Put all of the words in daily review.

For kids who struggle like this, you really need to do spelling daily, and you need daily review. Often I kept many of the words in daily review for another full week after mastering a lesson, mixing them in with other words that needed review so it wasn’t all one type of spelling pattern in a row. Cards should stay in daily review until your daughter can answer them quickly and easily, without self-correcting or having to stop and think about them. I also used to wait until a Monday to move any cards to the Mastered section. This way they have to remember over the weekend, and it seems to stick in their long-term memory better. When I started doing that, we had a lot less forgetting. And if they missed it on Monday, it stayed in review until the next Monday, and so on.

Don’t move on from a step until she is very solid on the concept. (However, cards stay in daily review even after the step is mastered, until each word is also mastered.) You’ll know she thoroughly understands a step when she can easily teach it back. If she forgets something in a dictation later on, go to the tiles for that word and have her teach it back again, unless she can correct her mistake readily. Put that word back in daily review. Really customize the review box for a student like this. She's not going to remember easily like your other kids--her gifts are in other areas (and it's good to help our kids see that too so they don't too get down about something like spelling struggles). For my kids, I didn't drop mastered cards but kept reviewing them. Some people choose 2 each of the mastered red, yellow, and blue cards to review each day and just keep rotating through them, and then 5 mastered word cards. I'd back up until you hit a point where she is remembering the words more easily, and then restart there. 

"Our" was taught at the end of Level 2, so it's not too surprising if you ended the year on 2. She may need to just redo several of those steps if you had a full summer off. I usually had to back up several steps because everything learned at the end was lost. It doesn't sound to me like just writing it and repeating it works, so I'd change things up. Build the word our with the tiles. Ask her to segment it into the individual sounds. Ask her how the /ow/ sound is spelled in "our." If she tends to easily remember another ou word, try connecting the words--"our cloud" or something like that.  Write the phrase on the board and have her underline the /ou/ sound in each word. Let her draw a picture on the board of a cloud and write the word "our" on it. What shape would our cloud be? She can make it any shape she likes. Let her use a yellow or white colored pencil on the word card to highlight the OU sound (highlighter won't work but colored pencils are nice and bright on the green.) Let her read the word card daily for a week and note how the /ow/ sound is spelled each day. Let her write the word with her finger in sand or cool whip or some tactile surface--get as multi-sensory and varied as you can when a kid gets stuck on a particular word instead of just trying the "rewrite" method. 

My daughter was stuck on "float" for the longest time. She could remember oats though, so I made "oats float" in the bathroom sink by putting the lid from our oatmeal container in there. And whenever she forgot after that, I could say, "oats float" and she would remember. Most words didn't take quite as much repetition, but that one took a lot for some reason! She did get it though.

Sorry she's struggling so much! For us, time and review and creativity in really maximizing the materials made a huge difference. I hope it does for your daughter too, or I hope you find something that does make things click for her!

[MamaHill]

I'm sorry you're struggling with finding the right approach.  Boy, I've been there done that.  Sigh. My oldest is a very natural speller, but the next three in line?  Not so much.

I've been a faithful user of AAS for 8+ years, but I had to change this year and see if another approach would be better.  My 6th grader is using Megawords and I'm not sure that's such a great fit for her, but we'll see.

My 4th grader is using Rod and Staff Spelling and my 2nd grader is using Traditional Spelling from Memoria Press.  If you only knew how I loathed having a list of spelling words to work through each week, you'd be shocked at these choices. ?

But the way I'm making it work: My 4th grader and I go over the spelling rules provided in R&S. I find the teaching of the same rules in How to Teach Spelling and use their method to supplement. We go through the practice words in HTTS, and use their dictation one day per week.  Between the two resources, her spelling has definitely improved.  I'm thrilled with her progress so far, and we're in the 6th week of school.

Traditional Spelling is a lovely program, however, it still uses a spelling list.  As we move through, I just teach my daughter the spelling rules from AAS (Find Gold, for example), as we come upon them.  Her spelling has *drastically* improved.  

Both my 4th and 2nd graders needed to work with words and analyze them in a different way than what AAS offered. They both learn better writing and using their pencils and not using letter tiles or the letter app (despite how we  enjoyed the change of pace!)  I love AAS and its rules and how methodical it is, but I needed a different approach for these particular children.

See if you can find a cheap copy of How to Teach Spelling and see if it would work.  It is just the right fit (for now), when combined with a spine-type program.  (If I had known How to Teach Spelling had an accompanying workbook before buying R&S, I would have tried it first.)

[Peaceseeker]

AAS was a bust for us around the end of level 2.  My child could never memorize all the rules.  (Rote memorization was always a problem)  We took a year off from formal spelling around that age and switched to a copy work program that incorporated a lot of commonly used words (Spelling Wisdom) in their context from literature.  That clicked much better than writing a word so many times ever did with my kid. We then switched to Sequential Spelling in 4th grade and have made a lot of improvements in spelling over the last 4 years.

AAS felt tortuous for my kid by a certain point. And there was just no retention- nothing was sinking in.  I think my child just needed to write more for the common words and see them in context.  Then later we needed the patterns/word families approach of Sequential Spelling.  It did take a while for spelling to start clicking.  Sometimes I think everything we did before fourth grade in spelling was a complete waste of time. But my no good, very bad, horrible speller is now an average to good speller armed with a word processor to clean up the edges.  There is still plenty of time for things to turn around with your little one too.  Hang in there!

[Ellie]

Spalding.  IMHO, it's more comprehensive than AAS, and it addresses all modalities (visual, auditory, kinesthetic). And you make a one-time purchase of the manual (Writing Road to Reading) and the phonogram cards, and you're good to go forever.

[ElizabethB]

I would overlearn the sounds and focus on sounds and oral spelling for a while.  Use my sound charts:

1. first, basics, organized by sound, use one page chart on page 6.

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On Reading/Resources/40LChartsCombined.pdf

2. Then, will help with our, the colored sound vowel chart.  OU/OW, red ow ouch.  OU- red ou then /er/ makes our. You could make up a story about fighting over something everyone wants, blood, no, it's not theirs, its ours.

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On Reading/Resources/OnePageVowelChart.pdf

Instead of tiles, use my sound cards from link 1 to sound out, then write spelling if alternate, for example, /k/ /a/ /t/ is on card top, alternate spelling for /k/, c is on card, place letters down, then write out words actual spelling below or above cards.

You also might need to work on phonemic awareness.

 

 

[ExcitedMama]

I’m sorry about the trouble you are having together! If you want to try tiles you could try the app. I’m starting my second child through AAR and I’m loving doing it with the app and not keeping track of the letter tiles. 

FWIW when DS misses a word I just have him try it again next time. I’m not sure writing it out that many times would help him. He’d probably just start copying and not really be spelling at that point. My son is a natural speller but for the longest time he kept adding an extra m to woman or women. He was writing out that word a few times a week over the summer before he finally remembered how it’s spelled. Sometimes it can take awhile. You might want to review the rules for the words she is missing. 

[nixpix5]

She might be a visual spelling learner (most of my kids are) and a combination of reading a lot and copy work based spelling is all that works for our family. AAS was how I started one of my kids and it was a bust. Our switch to SYS is what worked. Having talked to lots of homeschool parents it seems if AAS works then copy work doesn't or vice versa. It really just depends on how a child processes written language. I have also seen AAS work really well for struggling spellers who didn't start AAS until later (4th and up). It could be that ruled based spelling application takes some maturity to be able to use effectively. 

Edited August 23, 2018 by nixpix5

[acresoft]

Some review may be needed in the beginning of a school year, besides she's still pretty young. If AAS with the tiles don't work, there is Words Their Way, SnapWords from Child1st, or Spelling You See.

[SporkUK]

I agree with others on trying different methods, possibly multiple short ones daily, and that a review period is pretty common after time off particularly in the earlier years.

Part of what worked here for my very rules-just-make-it-worse spellers is a combined effort. My older three have independent spelling (previously written but now we use SpellingCity which encourages mine to practice more), dictation sentences on a whiteboard, a few challenge words which are marked and put into sentences, and spelling checks on their literature summaries and composition work.

Self-checking has been helpful as well - having them underline anything they think is wrong - and I'll underline anything I catch before I add all the words to their word bank which I build the independent spelling lists from weekly and discuss it with them. Some words get rotated on and off their lists. Having them check their own work and making that check just part of the writing process has helped and made our lives easier with writing which for two of my kids has long been a struggle. 

[ElizabethB]

Here is a basic phonemic awareness test.

https://www.spelfabet.com.au/2013/02/free-phonological-awareness-test/

[Classically Minded]

My dd struggled with spelling, so we did AAS up to Level 5 and it really, really helped her!  I would have finished Levels 6 & 7 (I still have them), but I didn't want to teach it.  I still regret that because, even though she spells better and finished up all the levels of Spelling Workout, her spelling is lagging from what it could have been.  Reading is what helped her the most, the more she read the better her spelling and grammar/writing.  We used the tiles.  Even though she is in 9th grade now, she still talks about AAS, she absolutely loved it!

Edited August 24, 2018 by Classically Minded

[homemommy83]

On 8/22/2018 at 5:13 PM, Lori D. said:

Typical school year start-up lag?
(traditional schools often spend the first 6-9 weeks of the new year reviewing the previous year's concepts before moving into the new topics/materials)

She might have some sort of LDs or processing issue that is starting to come to light.
(Is stealth dyslexia a possibility -- can read, but struggles with spelling and writing.) 

Perhaps she's a "late bloomer" in developing/maturing in the parts of the brain that process spelling?
(some kids don't "click" until age 10+)

Or, perhaps she just needs a different approach that is a better fit?
(Apples and Pears? Barton?  Spalding? Spelling You See? Stevenson Learning Skills (mnemonic instruction)?)

_______________________


I know this will not be of help, but our DS#2 was a struggling speller (and struggling writer and math struggler). He absolutely did not even begin to click with spelling until age 12. We tried a lot of different spelling programs. In 4th grade, I kind of gave up for the year and we just spent that year memorizing about 150-200 of the most commonly-used words (many of which were "sight" types of words like "our").

And I had to do a lot of very visual individualized remedial work with him to scaffold spelling -- using the whiteboard and different colors of markers to show vowel pairs and draw little pictures/stories to make visual connections for homophones ("meet" vs "meat"); strengthening auditory-sequential memory through back and forth oral spelling practice with me; practicing simultaneously writing and spelling through dictating short sentences (like 6 words long) with 2-3 spelling words in each sentence, and he outloud repeated the sentence and spelled aloud each word as he wrote it. Things like that.

Hugs and patience! Remember, your child is NOT failing to click with spelling or failing to remember the rules just to annoy you, and the calmer you can remain, and keep lessons short and focused, the less it will stress out your student -- stress and "feeling stupid" shuts down their thinking! BEST wishes for quickly finding what helps you both start moving forward with spelling! Warmest regards, Lori D.

You are an awesome mom...I love to see moms work so hard to help their kiddos.  Thank you for your detailed and honest replies.

Brenda

[scholastica]

On 8/22/2018 at 3:52 PM, ByGrace3 said:

My youngest is a terrible speller. terrible, horrible, no good, very bad speller. I don't understand it at all. She is in 3rd grade and we just started AAS 3. We are DRAGGING through AAS. We did level 1 and part of level 2 in first grade. Level 1 was ok but she super struggled with level 2 so we set it aside and began in the beginning of 2nd grade with level 2 again. (started it over). It took ALL year to get through. We took the summer off and she is now acting like she has no idea what any of this is . . .it's baffling. She is getting review words wrong every day for the last two weeks. The.same.words. "Our" has been missed every day for weeks. I have her spell missed words 5X. Today I made her spell "Our" 20X's. I'm losing my mind. I don't want spelling to be a battle. I either need to way back up on my expectations of AAS...struggle through and trust it will get better....even if it takes two years to get through level 3... OR is there something else out there? 

This child completed AAR pre-level through level 4 and she STILL struggles with giving all the sounds for the phonograms (cards; she reads them usually just fine).

I might add we don't use the tiles...would that be a game changer? My other kids never needed them... We only used the syllable tiles...

If you’re not using the tiles, IMO, you’re not really doing AAS. The tiles are an integral part and having to learn what sounds go with what letters and pausing to make sure you have assembled all the sounds to make a word is key. Also, review of the rules and concepts is important. If she doesn’t have all the sounds down, you’re not going to get anywhere. Learn those sounds first before trying to use them in words. Reading and spelling are 2 different skills. Spelling takes a lot of thought and recall of all the potential ways to spell a sound. I would get the tiles and work on that. Also, there’s nothing wrong with taking a whole year to finish a level.