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SAT essay - should I be concerned? - new update 8/20


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Dd is retaking the SAT next weekend.  She took it for the first time last year and scored much better than we expected and wants to improve her score.  She did not take the essay portion last year and we signed her up for it this time because it's probably the last time she'll take the test and we want to make sure she has it done since she doesn't know which colleges she's applying to yet.

She has been spending a lot of time (too much time IMO) prepping to take the SAT again - mostly reviewing math because she says she doesn't remember things.  But, she's never written a timed essay before and I know that the SAT essay score is based on certain things so, even though dd is a good writer, she can't just read the passage and answer the prompt off the top of her head.  And, once again, she's never written a timed essay before.  

I had planned on having her practice the timed essay and study the strategies this summer but she ended up taking two DE summer classes, starting her first job, learning how to drive, and I had major surgery.  Dd gets stressed/anxious easily and I didn't want to overwhelm her about the essay but I assumed she was working on it (she's really responsible about things like that).  I talked to her about it tonight and she told me that she hasn't done anything on it and is still working on math and will work on essay prep in time for the test.  Inside, I'm freaking out because we're just over a week away and I don't see how she won't bomb the essay portion with so little practice but I don't want her to know that. 

So, I guess my question is...am I right in being concerned that there is no way for her to be ready for the essay portion?  I know that many colleges don't care about it and the other scores are the ones that count (and she's good on those) but I don't want her to do awful on it either.  

 

Edited by Kassia
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The new SAT essay is similar to one of the essays tested on the AP English Language exam.   If your daughter is familiar with rhetorical devices, she will probably find the essay fairly straight forward.  Fwiw, I use the workbook written by College Panda with my tutoring students who are sitting for the essay.  The workbook gives quite a few example essays along with a suggested template for those who find it difficult writing under time constraints.  I don't have very many students who sit for the essay, but those who do have found the workbook helpful.

Good luck to your daughter!

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Sounds like you are BOTH prone to anxiety & becoming stressed out.

I wouldn't stress your dd out any more than she already is. Let it be. Even if she was an amazing writer, she might get a poor score on the essay section of the SAT. She might not end up needing it anyway, so you stressing out and stressing her out isn't going to help anything. IMO, chill.

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7 hours ago, EKS said:

Have you looked at the list of colleges that actually require or recommend the essay?  It's like the University of California and three other schools.  

 

I will do that.  Since she's not sure where she's applying yet I thought it would be best for her to get it done but I have no idea how many or how few schools want the score.  

 

8 hours ago, RootAnn said:

Sounds like you are BOTH prone to anxiety & becoming stressed out.

I wouldn't stress your dd out any more than she already is. Let it be. Even if she was an amazing writer, she might get a poor score on the essay section of the SAT. She might not end up needing it anyway, so you stressing out and stressing her out isn't going to help anything. IMO, chill.

 

Yes, we are both high-strung!  I *think* I am good at hiding my anxiety and doing my best to soothe her, though.  I am very careful to do what I can to keep her anxiety levels down and don't want to ever do anything to stress her out even more.  She doesn't know I'm worried about the essay.  Or, if she does, she knows I'm not going to do anything or say anything to pressure her.  I'm going to try to find more info on which colleges require/recommend it and if there's no possibility they are schools she'll be interested in, maybe we'll just drop the essay from the test.  

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14 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

This is a list from May this year of those colleges that recommend/require the SAT essay. Note that it is already out of date since at least Duke doesn't require it anymore. (The list is longer than EKS alleged, but most on the list are "recommend" vs. "require.")

The list is more out of date than that.  Add Yale to the list not requiring it.  And this article states that Duke still does.  So, it is definitely becoming less and less an issue.

Quote

Few schools now require applicants to take the tests with essays. Among those that do are the University of California and Stanford, Princeton, Duke and Brown universities. Most of the Ivy League has dropped the requirement. Many admission professionals say that while they highly value writing skills, the essay scores obtained from the two tests are not useful

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2018/06/01/another-big-name-university-drops-satact-essay-requirement/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.9aa54e776fb8

Edited by 8FillTheHeart
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LOL, I should have read the link I posted before posting it!  The bottom of that article stated Princeton was reviewing the issue.  So, I just googled Princeton drops SAT essay and found a link from July where Princeton and Stanford both dropped the essay.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2018/07/05/princeton-drops-requirement-that-prospective-students-take-sat-or-act-essay-test/?utm_term=.d44f4b2da9c7

ETA: FWIW, it sounds like one of the main reasons they are dropping it is b/c many of the in-school day tests are administered without the essay which puts students in the quandary of having to take it again just for the essay.  

Edited by 8FillTheHeart
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54 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

This is a list from May this year of those colleges that recommend/require the SAT essay. Note that it is already out of date since at least Duke doesn't require it anymore. (The list is longer than EKS alleged, but most on the list are "recommend" vs. "require.")

 

Thank you.  This is exactly what I was looking for.  None of the schools she's looking at now (and we aren't even close to really knowing where she'll end up) require or recommend the essay.  But the link you posted mentions National Merit scholarships possibly requiring the essay.  I have no idea if she'll qualify but she hopes to.  

 

40 minutes ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

The list is more out of date than that.  Add Yale to the list not requiring it.  And this article states that Duke still does.  So, it is definitely becoming less and less an issue.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2018/06/01/another-big-name-university-drops-satact-essay-requirement/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.9aa54e776fb8

 

You are always so helpful.  Just wanted to let you know how much I appreciate you always sharing your advice and experience.  

 

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Yep! I knew that article was out of date, but the only one I could definitely remember dropping the essay was Duke (since DD#1 just got a recruiting email the other day with that info in it). Obviously, more recently dropped it.

Kassia - National Merit doesn't require the SAT w/essay. Promise! All she would need would be a "qualifying SAT score" to prove the PSAT performance isn't a one-day fluke. This year (for rising seniors, i.e. last year's juniors), that number is at least a selection index (SI) of 212. You get the SI by taking the ER+W score * 2 and adding it to the Math score and dropping the zero.

Say a 720 English + a 710 Math (72*2 + 71 = 212) or 

680 English + 760 Math (68*2 + 76 = 212) or

740 English + 640 Math (74*2 + 64 = 212)

Anything at that level or higher should be fine. No essay!

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40 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

 

Kassia - National Merit doesn't require the SAT w/essay. Promise!

Anything at that level or higher should be fine. No essay!

 

I didn't think so, but I read this in the link you provided:  Many scholarships (such as National Merit) require you to submit SAT scores, and some specifically want SAT with Essay scores.

Okay, duh, I think I misread it.  It's actually stating what you posted - National Merit requires SAT scores.  Oops - sorry!  

Thank you for pointing that out.  It will help a lot with our final decision.  ?

 

ETA:  I have chronic insomnia and struggle with processing things!  That's my excuse...

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16 hours ago, EKS said:

Have you looked at the list of colleges that actually require or recommend the essay?  It's like the University of California and three other schools.  

But that's not true.  The state U near my house that isn't anything super special recommends the essay. If my little state u that's not elite by any stretch of the imagination recommends it, then anyone could recommend it.  And from what I understand, "recommend" often means "requires", and especially so for homeschooled students.

The list is pretty long, really.  It's not just 4 schools.  https://blog.prepscholar.com/schools-that-require-the-sat-essay

I don't meant to be a stick in the mud, and I don't think you should get super anxious about it, but sometimes people give a quick easy answer that isn't always true.  Like, when people say, "You can homeschool in 2 hours a day!" or some other unicorn type of statement.  

Your daughter ought to review what the essay is about and practice a few of them.  There's not enough time to do too much about it, so you'll have to release the worrying, but it's something to prep for a bit.  And I don't agree that you can just say, "Eh, we probably won't apply to a college that wants it," when the list is actually long enough to have to scroll and scroll and scroll down the page.

Edited by Garga
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12 minutes ago, Garga said:

The list is pretty long, really.  It's not just 4 schools.  https://blog.prepscholar.com/schools-that-require-the-sat-essay

You're right.  I was intentionally exaggerating to make a point.  But it is pretty amazing how few schools neither require nor recommend it.  Probably because they realize that it is a stupid test.  The other thing is that it seems as though less selective schools are actually *more* likely to require it.

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3 hours ago, EKS said:

You're right.  I was intentionally exaggerating to make a point.  But it is pretty amazing how few schools neither require nor recommend it.  Probably because they realize that it is a stupid test.  The other thing is that it seems as though less selective schools are actually *more* likely to require it.

I know.  I’m not trying to be combative, but on this board there are plenty of people whose kids will go less selective schools, like my guys. And I’ve been discovering more and more that things I’ve read or been told in the past that I thought were universal (because the threads made it seem that way), actually apply only to kids who are super smart and going to schools that are selective.  I don’t want someone like me bumping into a thread like this in the future and thinking, “Oh look!  Almost all of the schools don’t even want the essay! We won’t bother with the essay!” And then, like me, they discover that the closest state U to their house *does* want the essay.  So, I’m just throwing that out there for the people whose kids are middle of the road and may end up in less selective schools.

 

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School dependent, but some of the schools who don't recommend the essay explicitly say on their website that they don't even look at the essay portion if it is sent. (I haven't actually seen a school's website that says they will consider the essay score if they don't recommend or require it.) Many of them just say, "We don't require the essay portion of the ACT or SAT."

13 minutes ago, Kassia said:

One more question:  If dd chooses to take the essay portion and does poorly on it, will that reflect badly on her if she sends the score to schools that don't consider the essay?  

 

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1 hour ago, Garga said:

I know.  I’m not trying to be combative, but on this board there are plenty of people whose kids will go less selective schools, like my guys. And I’ve been discovering more and more that things I’ve read or been told in the past that I thought were universal (because the threads made it seem that way), actually apply only to kids who are super smart and going to schools that are selective.  I don’t want someone like me bumping into a thread like this in the future and thinking, “Oh look!  Almost all of the schools don’t even want the essay! We won’t bother with the essay!” And then, like me, they discover that the closest state U to their house *does* want the essay.  So, I’m just throwing that out there for the people whose kids are middle of the road and may end up in less selective schools.

Absolutely.  I think in my original post about this I mentioned taking a look at the list.

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I would not assume that recommended essay means required for homeschoolers. Have you actually seen any school state that? I have seen required subject tests from homeschoolers that they don't from traditional school students. But I personally have never seen a school require the essay. My kids won't be taking it.

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33 minutes ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

I would not assume that recommended essay means required for homeschoolers. Have you actually seen any school state that? I have seen required subject tests from homeschoolers that they don't from traditional school students. But I personally have never seen a school require the essay. My kids won't be taking it.

No, I haven’t seen it literally.  But from what I’ve read many, many times from many locations (here, online articles about colleges, another board), when a college says something is “recommended” it means that if you don’t have it you run a risk of your application being rejected early in the application process.  Kids who have the recommended materials may get farther along in the application process, because there’s more information that the college is familiar with, with which to assess each application. 

Add to that the fact that colleges aren’t sure if homeschoolers have inflated mommy grades, colleges have to use whatever outside critique is available to assess the student, so a “recommended” essay becomes more of a “required” essay for a homeschooler, though not literally.  

And again....if your kid has started foundations and is fluent in ancient Viking and has a 1520 on the SAT, then the essay isn’t as important.  At all.  The “recommended” essay is probably barely looked at.  But if your student is like mine, who has some moderate interests but nothing that makes him stand out, then the essay at a school that recommends it suddenly becomes important as they try to weigh who gets accepted.  For us, if I have my son skip it, I run a real risk of having his application get rejected.  I don’t have the luxury to say, “Son, you don’t need to do the essay.  It’s just recommended.”

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didn't read the other replies... but in my D1's case, her stellar ACT scores were not negatively impacted by her significantly-less-than-stellar ACT essay scores - even at the schools that, at that time, required the essay (which were several three years ago...) - and were very selective.

DD just isn't a timed-essay writer. Never has been. Never will be. So far, it's had exactly zero percent impact on either college applications or college success. ?

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6 hours ago, easypeasy said:

didn't read the other replies... but in my D1's case, her stellar ACT scores were not negatively impacted by her significantly-less-than-stellar ACT essay scores - even at the schools that, at that time, required the essay (which were several three years ago...) - and were very selective.

DD just isn't a timed-essay writer. Never has been. Never will be. So far, it's had exactly zero percent impact on either college applications or college success. ?

 

My older sons all did the essay but they are quite a bit older and I think more colleges required them at the time.  My oldest son got a high score on the ACT essay and a low score on the SAT essay.  Another son, who is a great writer, got a low score on the one essay he did.  Dd is an excellent writer but has never written a timed essay and I don't think she would do well writing under those conditions.  

Thanks for sharing your experience.  

 

 

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On 8/16/2018 at 4:19 PM, Garga said:

I know.  I’m not trying to be combative, but on this board there are plenty of people whose kids will go less selective schools, like my guys. And I’ve been discovering more and more that things I’ve read or been told in the past that I thought were universal (because the threads made it seem that way), actually apply only to kids who are super smart and going to schools that are selective.  I don’t want someone like me bumping into a thread like this in the future and thinking, “Oh look!  Almost all of the schools don’t even want the essay! We won’t bother with the essay!” And then, like me, they discover that the closest state U to their house *does* want the essay.  So, I’m just throwing that out there for the people whose kids are middle of the road and may end up in less selective schools.


Totally appreciate your point here Garga, and that is a great reason for taking the essay. Better to have it and not need it, then need it and not have it, as we say around here. (:D Because, yes, there will always be exception schools who do want it.

And, likewise, I am not trying to be combative, but I will just add that our 2 middle of the road DSs did not do the essay for either the SAT or ACT (they each took 1 of each test), and it was never a problem here. And that was almost 10 years back when doing the essay was much more standard. Even at that time, a majority of schools -- not just selective/top tier schools, but a majority of state universities and second tier private colleges -- did not include the essay exam score as part of what they looked at for admissions,  because it is scored subjectively, and they only wanted the objectively scored Math & Critical Reading sections.

Mostly what I was seeing at that time was not that colleges wanted to see SAT/ACT essay scores from homeschoolers -- if they wanted confirmation of parent-awarded grades, they asked for course descriptions and samples of student work. The current trend seems to be even fewer colleges look at the essay, and more colleges are accepting homeschooling transcripts without wanting validation of some kind (AP or CLEP or ACT/SAT or SAT Subject score, portfolio/sample work, etc.). More frequently, colleges run all in-coming freshmen through their placement tests, which allows them to also double check Math, Reading, and Writing levels in order to make sure students are up to speed, or, if they need to take a remedial or pre-requisite course first.

Again, that's great to the do the essay for peace of mind, if nothing else, as my experience may not be the experience of others. : ) BEST of luck to all in your standardized testing! Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

Edited by Lori D.
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I see you've decided to drop it but thought I'd add our experience just in case it helps someone. My dd took the essay section just in case. None of her schools actually needed it but I heard about a somewhat obscure school near here that required it so thought we would just do it in case. I've also heard that it does not really reflect badly on you if you don't do well but that is just hearsay on my part. Anyway, my dd just went through the essay section in the prep book, saw the things they were looking for, practiced one timed essay and did one or two outlines and was able to score a perfect score on the essay section. So my take away from that was, see what they want and give it to them and you will probably do ok.

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39 minutes ago, TCB said:

I see you've decided to drop it but thought I'd add our experience just in case it helps someone. My dd took the essay section just in case. None of her schools actually needed it but I heard about a somewhat obscure school near here that required it so thought we would just do it in case. I've also heard that it does not really reflect badly on you if you don't do well but that is just hearsay on my part. Anyway, my dd just went through the essay section in the prep book, saw the things they were looking for, practiced one timed essay and did one or two outlines and was able to score a perfect score on the essay section. So my take away from that was, see what they want and give it to them and you will probably do ok.

 

Congratulations to your dd!  That is impressive!

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1 minute ago, Kassia said:

 

Congratulations to your dd!  That is impressive!

Thanks, but honestly I think a lot of it was being able to see exactly what the examiners were expecting and looking for, and being able to figure out how to give it to them. So I honestly think that looking at that helps a huge amount.

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UPDATE:  I called College Board today and they said it's too late for them to cancel the essay, and dd should tell the proctor on test day that she'd  like to drop the essay.  That will only be allowed if they have room in the area where students taking the test without the essay are seated and extra materials.  I contacted the school administering the test hoping to find out early if dd could drop the test but was told she won't find out until test day.  ?  So I guess she'll have to prepare a little for it anyway.  If she still wants to drop it we have to get her there early and she has to find a specific person to talk to about it.  She may just choose to do the essay to avoid the aggravation.  

 

 

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3 hours ago, Kassia said:

UPDATE:  I called College Board today and they said it's too late for them to cancel the essay, and dd should tell the proctor on test day that she'd  like to drop the essay.  That will only be allowed if they have room in the area where students taking the test without the essay are seated and extra materials.  I contacted the school administering the test hoping to find out early if dd could drop the test but was told she won't find out until test day.  ?  So I guess she'll have to prepare a little for it anyway.  If she still wants to drop it we have to get her there early and she has to find a specific person to talk to about it.  She may just choose to do the essay to avoid the aggravation. 

Ooh, I should warn you that if she does end up not doing the essay, her score might be delayed because switching from essay to no essay (or vice versa) is an anomaly to the CB so they sometimes delay the score release.

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42 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

Ooh, I should warn you that if she does end up not doing the essay, her score might be delayed because switching from essay to no essay (or vice versa) is an anomaly to the CB so they sometimes delay the score release.

 

Thank you for the information.  I did not know that.

Ugh - what a mess.  I feel terrible about the whole thing.

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17 minutes ago, Kassia said:

 

Thank you for the information.  I did not know that.

Ugh - what a mess.  I feel terrible about the whole thing.

Do you need her score quickly though? If not than a short delay might not be too bad. Also wanted to add, I don't think the consequences for not doing well on the writing portion are too bad, so maybe not something to get too stressed about if she ends up taking it anyway.

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39 minutes ago, TCB said:

Do you need her score quickly though? If not than a short delay might not be too bad. Also wanted to add, I don't think the consequences for not doing well on the writing portion are too bad, so maybe not something to get too stressed about if she ends up taking it anyway.

 

No, we don't *need* it quickly but it would be helpful for a couple of reasons.  Do you have any idea how long the delay would be?  In any case, she will drop the essay if possible.  

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3 minutes ago, Kassia said:

 

No, we don't *need* it quickly but it would be helpful for a couple of reasons.  Do you have any idea how long the delay would be?  In any case, she will drop the essay if possible.  

I'm sorry I don't know how long the delay would be but they really do get the regular results back so quickly these days so it seems hard to imagine it being ages. But I honestly haven't done it myself so don't know.

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2 hours ago, Kassia said:

No, we don't *need* it quickly but it would be helpful for a couple of reasons.  Do you have any idea how long the delay would be?  In any case, she will drop the essay if possible.  

I only personally know one kid who dropped the "with essay" on test day. That's where I heard the story about his scores being delayed. It seemed weird to me because I thought it would be pretty common to add or drop the essay on test day. Who knows. The scores could be released in the first batch regardless. Think positive!

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