M.I.T. just became a possibility.

[LisaKinVA]

Not for LEGOManiac, but for PonyGirl.  They have indicated an initial interest in recruiting her to swim at MIT (she's a strong student, so her test scores aren't shabby). I'm having a moment of excited panic.  This is one of those schools that you put on the list and kind of wish upon a star... but now it seems like that is an application that will be going out.  

Now, I want to make sure she's doing everything to be as academically prepared for a school like this.  Any suggestions for Junior/Senior years?  Math-wise, she's taking every MIT online scholars course she can (she should complete all of them currently available).  She's taking University Physics (both semesters of AP Physics C) next year (or possibly over 2 years).  

Pinch me... and bring me back to earth ;)

Princeton (and multiple others) have already reached out academically -- but she would still need swimming to get in, and most of those schools are D1 -- she's close, but not there yet, it's a strong possibility the next 12 months).

[Corraleno]

I can't really speak to the academics, but I would ask the swim coach some very clear and explicit questions about how much pull he actually has with admissions. Does admissions give him actual designated "slots" he can use to guarantee acceptance to recruited students? If so, how many does he have, and where does your DD rank on that list? Or does his support just offer a little bump, so if adcoms are choosing between two similar kids, his vote is the tie-breaker? I have read in multiple threads on the CC Recruiting forum that MIT coaches actually have very little pull, and students really need to get in on their own. That is not true, of course, at Ivies, where coaches can offer Likely Letters to a select handful of recruited athletes who have passed the pre-read. So I would be sure to keep all options open right up to the point where a coach offers a guaranteed acceptance in return for an ED application. Good luck to your DD!

[LisaKinVA]

As far as I know, Swimming gives a "bump" to otherwise qualified students at MIT.  They do have to field a team, and are a pretty competitive D3 team though -- so that usually means some sort of significant recruiting bump is there. DD needs to fill out some forms online, and send an email.

I'm more concerned about the academic side.  Unlike swimming at most other schools, keeping up grades and swimming will be a bit more difficult at MIT.  The other consideration is it would be the most expensive school for her to attend -- bar none.  Most of the other schools she is considering would be free, or nearly so after swimming and academics are brought into the mix.    Looking at the raw numbers, and our estimated income at that time, she'd be looking at close to $20k a year for tuition/room and board.  

[Lanny]

Awesome LIsa:  From an Engineering standpoint, IMO M.I.T. is the top of the pyramid, or very close to the top, depending on the discipline.  As with any scholarship, you would need to know what G.P.A. is required to maintain the scholarship and then also, what would happen if she is dropped from the Swimming  team?  Engineering or anything related to that is a really tough Major and I am awed by people who do that and are on an athletic team too. When do they have time to study or sleep?   There are as has been pointed out, a lot of things to investigate.  OT: One of my late Uncles got his Ph.D. at Stanford and then was a Full Professor of Electrical Engineering there. After he went into industry, he taught at Cal Tech.  I remember when I was about 15 years old, he told me, "I wish I had gone into Physics instead of Electrical Engineering"     I can only imagine the number of Recruiters who are at M.I.T. interviewing graduating Seniors...

[8filltheheart]

Before she gets too excited, have you sat down and looked at if you can really afford $80,000 for her without it impacting the other 4's options.  If you are paying $15,000/ yr directly for her (assuming she is paying $7500 and possible cost increases/expenses) her jr yr, how will that impact PokeMan's choices? Will you be able to offer him $15,000/yr, so paying $30,000 yr for those 2 yrs? But, then not really 2 yrs, bc what about Blondie and Boo? Can you spend $30,000 per yr for that many yrs? Will paying the $15,000 offer the older one opportunities while impacting negatively the the daily opportunities of the younger kids?

For us, it is a much bigger picture than where they get accepted.  It is what is fair in terms of how our decision with 1 will turn around and impact the lives of all the others. Can we offer the others the same level of support in the future?

Fwiw, kids do watch what is going on (adult ones and younger ones), and even if they don't have the personalities of "keeping tabs," they know.  We are up front with our kids that we don't parent equally, but we do try to keep it fairly close.  When we don't, we make our intentions clear to all of them (adult ones and younger ones). For example, we just bought a newer car  for our current college Dd than the typical old  beater that our college kids usually drive. Why? She has to drive over very rural mtns with dead cell zones. It is a safety issue for us, not a she deserves a better car issue.  (The only one they don't "watch "is their autistic brother who will probably never be fully independent.) 

 

[Kathy in Richmond]

Lisa, we found ways to spend quite a bit less than the published cost of attendance at MIT. Our son loved living in Random Hall, which is one of the low cost dorms, especially if you get a double room. He cooked for himself, too. Meal plans are optional in some dorms there, and his floor had a nice big kitchen with the grocery store just a block away. And yes, we knew at least one athlete on his floor who did cook for herself. Also, you can save on the cost of books/personal items by buying used or borrowing books from friends. Many courses had no book cost at all; the course material was either online or in handouts.

Ds took out the full federal loan amounts, but he was able to pay it all back within one year of graduation. And that was with him paying for all of his food and personal expenses during his four years there. We paid for his room and travel, his grant paid for tuition, and he did the rest. His school year jobs (research on campus, working for AoPS, and staffing the front desk in his dorm) paid for those expenses. His summer internships (which led to a job that he absolutely loves) paid for the loans and a new car on top of that :-)

Lanny, MIT scholarships are all need-based and have no minimum GPA requirements. No need to worry there. Grades are pass/fail the first semester to give kids some time to adjust.

There are many athletes who do well academically at MIT. In fact, it helps to have something besides academics there. Ds was not an athlete, but he was highly involved in a few extracurriculars in addition to his jobs and academics. The balance helped him keep things in perspective. He still did very well academically and got plenty of sleep at night.

Good luck to your daughter!

[plansrme]

My swimmer dropped a lot of time in her junior year, so definitely be open to faster programs.  The Ivies are super-fast these days, and the lack of athletic scholarships is a real bummer, but they can definitely give you a bump in admissions.  I agree that, although the lore is that MIT doesn't officially give you a bump, it seems like it kind of has to unofficially.  Another fast D3 program that does offer merit aid is Emory, which people seem to love despite the fact that it's located in Atlanta (which mystifies me no end).  Best of luck to you and your daughter!

[LisaKinVA]

Right now, she's only excited about the opportunity -- attending MIT has not been her life-long dream, so she's not getting carried away.  I think I'm more excited by the possibility (ha!  I did the same thing when she got the letter from Princeton, although that one wasn't about swimming, it was all about applying to Princeton, and why they felt she'd be a good fit for their school).  She's really just starting to think about college, and has a list of about 47 schools she's exploring.  Finances will be a huge part of the decision.  It's good to know there may be other funding to keep costs at MIT down.  She needs to keep costs (out of pocket) down to under $10,000 per year (including all fees, transportation, etc.)

Right now, she is looking good for D1-D3 swimming (not Stanford, UA, UT - D1, but a solid middle-tier D1 program).  Currently, with the majority of D3 programs she'd be part of the conference team in all but the most competitive schools, and could fit nicely into a number of D2 programs.  Her swimming goals could change, but right now, she wants a swimming program that challenges her (room for growth), an academic environment that allows her to maximize her opportunities without debt, and move onto a graduate program easily (and free).  She knows that she wants very small to medium sized schools with a traditional campus.  

Thus far, her top choices include schools like:

• Princeton (swimming is currently an easy reach).
• USNA, USAFA (swimming is a reach)
• Liberty (free, academically -- swimming an easy reach by time, but in looking at the roster, there seems to be a certain "type" of swimmer the coach goes after -- and she's not even close to the height range -- I'm wondering if their head coach recruits based on statistics than the individual)
• Gardner-Webb (probably free -- swimming is a reach, but they are watching from afar, as they want her academically)
• Hillsdale
• Campbell (most likely free)
• Messiah (would be free)

As you can see, it's quite a diverse list. Every swimming letter she's gotten is from small-medium, northern schools in MN, IA, MA, and NY...brrrr  At most of these schools, if she were swimming there today, she'd be in the top 3 or 4 in her events (hence, the reason they are going after her).  An "easy reach" basically means she'd be in the top 6-10 on their squad right now, and a "reach" is anything where she'd be ranked below their slowest swimmer.  She's spending the next year working on her list, and as letters come, adding them to her consideration.  Our goal is to have this list down to 20 by the end of her junior year, and down to 10 or 15 by the time she applies.   Most of this will be based upon scholarships, discussions with the coaches and math departments.  She's visited 10 schools so far, I expect she'll visit 10 more during the summer of her junior year/fall of her senior year.

Time will tell!  I have so much to do these days though... I thought I'd be done with LEGOManiac, but his gap year makes a bit more work for me.  Keeping up with PonyGirl's letters and scholastic choices is getting dizzying... we have to prepare to move somewhere stateside in 2019...homeschool decisions and planning, and running the swim team here.  I'm just very happy she has these choices.  She's now studying hard for AP exams and SAT2s (trying for those 750 on Biology and Math 2 to keep the MIT dream alive).

 

 

 

[8filltheheart]

That **IS** a diverse list.  I had never heard of Gardner-Webb until recently.  Now I drive by it every time I go to visit my sister.

[GoodGrief]

Just commenting to say that my daughter had both Princeton and Messiah in her final four at the end of the application season. She was looking to run at Messiah. Really wonderful school, and loved the running coach. Free wasn't happening for her there though, so ultimately cost took it off the table.

[plansrme]

We know and have known multiple swimmers at Gardner-Webb, and they all have had positive experiences.  They definitely do not recruit according to a specific body type--nearly everyone we know there, male and female, is short for a swimmer.  Their conference meet is a blast.  

[LisaKinVA]

40 minutes ago, GoodGrief1 said:

Just commenting to say that my daughter had both Princeton and Messiah in her final four at the end of the application season. She was looking to run at Messiah. Really wonderful school, and loved the running coach. Free wasn't happening for her there though, so ultimately cost took it off the table.

DD has visited Messiah -- she loved the campus and the feel of the school.  She hasn't visited Princeton yet -- we'll see how communications with the coach go over the next year.  She probably needs swimming to get into that school.  

21 minutes ago, plansrme said:

We know and have known multiple swimmers at Gardner-Webb, and they all have had positive experiences.  They definitely do not recruit according to a specific body type--nearly everyone we know there, male and female, is short for a swimmer.  Their conference meet is a blast.  

Loved our visit with Gardner-Webb.  The coach's father reached out to me and told me about their program... we also met with the coach (his son) last summer.  They definitely recruit based more on times and heart than height statistics.  We learned a lot about what questions to ask, and what to look for on their rosters thanks to Gardner-Webb and my time at Navy last summer.  Just a few more months until we can hear from D2 and D1 programs...

[Ann.without.an.e]

She will probably be fine academically since it sounds like she is prepared.  Just keep pushing higher thinking.  The biggest thing you can do for her is to make sure she isn't stuck on grades.  DD is at a top ten and let me tell you ---- A's don't happen easily.  All of these high achieving students completely melt down freshman year because they are working harder than ever and aren't making straight A+'s.  I think it is almost intentional to get them beyond a letter grade and to just think and enjoy the process and see learning itself as the prize.  They even told us in parent orientation "every single child calls home at some point and says that they don't belong here, admissions made a mistake, or that they aren't good enough".  

I also wanted to mention that dd has a friend who is an incredible swimmer who was recruited by Harvard, Duke, Stanford, and MIT.  Each one had a testing cut off they had to make in order for it to work with admissions.  It wasn't quite as high as regular admissions.  I think the expected score for a student getting into Duke is usually 33-36 but this kid had to get a 28 to make his application to work.  Find out what that cut off is and make sure she has it or preps for it.

It sounds like your dd has some exciting opportunities.  

[LisaKinVA]

DD took her first SAT2s... apparently she got so comfortable on the Math2 test (it was so much easier than she expected), that instead of pushing to finish, she relaxed too much and ran out of time (she was so mad with herself...kind of funny).  She only scored a 650 on the math, so will retake it.  She at least now knows that she knew the material well enough to score a 750+ on it (she's a sophomore... so she has time).  She got a 720 on the Bio -- not high enough for MIT (they want 750), but will take Physics next year and try again.  She's spending her summer going through an honors Physics course just to solidify concepts and then will begin AP Physics C in August, completing both courses by April -- giving her a month to study and prep for exams.

This is her big test prep summer... PSAT, SAT, 3 SAT2s, and 4-5 APs (not sure about one, because it depends upon the schools she wants to focus upon and their CLEP/AP policies).  still hoping she can have some fun, though.

 

[GoodGrief]

9 hours ago, LisaK in VA is in IT said:

DD took her first SAT2s... apparently she got so comfortable on the Math2 test (it was so much easier than she expected), that instead of pushing to finish, she relaxed too much and ran out of time (she was so mad with herself...kind of funny).  She only scored a 650 on the math, so will retake it.  She at least now knows that she knew the material well enough to score a 750+ on it (she's a sophomore... so she has time). 

 

Taking lots of sample tests this summer will help with those sorts of issues. Good luck to her!