If you received your "last written warning" at work, would it be better to quit?

[gardenmom5]

Yes, except that he's sleeping while "guarding" an empty pool.  He wakes up if someone comes in. But it's not uncommon for the pool to be empty for hours.

 

I'm not saying it's OK, but the "unthinkable" is only going to occur when there are people in the pool.

 

and he could sleep through someone coming in.  if he wakes up when people come in - how did he get caught sleeping on the job? twice?

 

how about he reads a book?

[OneStepAtATime]

1.  He is in a warm, moist, quiet, boring environment with very few people ever coming in to swim.

2.  He is not allowed headsets, audio books, or anything else to keep him focused during the hours long stretches when there are no swimmers.

3.  His shift is sometimes 8 hours long with no breaks, no lunch, no nothing to break up the monotony.

4.  He is required to wear a shirt and pants NOT a swimsuit, so he can't even get in the pool and swim a lap or two for some physical exercise.

5.  There is no other lifeguard on duty to even talk with.

 

This job sounds mind numbingly boring and a set up for continued failure.  I could probably do that job for a week or two.  After that, I'd be falling asleep too.  I agree with others, go into the meeting, apologize for falling asleep then maybe stay on for another week or so but in the meantime he should be writing a letter of resignation and quit ASAP.  What an awful sounding job.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

If I thought my kid was set up to fail in a way that could ruin his life, by an employer not following regulations and possibly laws, there is no way I'd want him to risk another mistake in that place. If he was still under my authority (like a high school student with a work permit), he'd be quitting with no notice.

 

"I was unaware that my son was expected to work as a lifeguard on alert, over an empty space, for eight hours without lunch breaks, physical exercise, or mental rest. I am withdrawing my permission for my son to work for Pool Hell, effective immediately."

 

When I say life ruining, I mean if somebody came in there and drowned. I don't care about the odds of the child getting that far away from his carers, or the low risk that he wouldn't hear an adult who came in, and got a leg cramp or had a heart attack. It's a pool. He's guarding it. It would be his life ruined.

[athomeontheprairie]

Not never. Some jobs it's ok to sleep.

Agreed. I really just spoke too soon. My bil sleeps on the job. Of course he's at work and on call for 48 hours straight...

[gardenmom5]

8 hr shifts, no breaks, doesn't sound reasonable. Not even sure that would be legal.

 

Here, There's supposed to be a 'food' break every four hours, plus two 15 minute breaks in an 8hr shift. The pools here, have rotations. I think every 30 minutes they switch.

[gardenmom5]

If the pool is going against the law in your area, I would not feel any guilt about not giving notice before quitting. Age is irrelevant.

[LucyStoner]

I think there's space to say sleeping is not ok as a lifeguard without chiding a mom for being, naturally, defensive of her son.  

 

If he were nodding off on a 4-hour shift with well-planned rotations, I could see that he might just not be a good lifeguard, ever. Heck, I might say get a sleep study for apnea. But 8 hours without breaks?  That's a labor law violation in my state, and I am guessing many others. 

 

Sometimes employers share culpability in errors or mistakes that an employee makes.  Truckers and train engineers scheduled too little time to sleep come to mind as a possible similar but more extreme scenario.  

 

Reading it all, I think he should quit and I don't think he owes them notice either.  A better run pool wouldn't create this situation.  That is not to say it's ok to sleep on the job.  It kinda goes without saying that it's not and it doesn't seem to me like the OP is defending him doing so, even by accident.  

Edited March 13, 2018 by LucyStoner

[Tsuga]

I didn't do a sample letter - you probably meant Patty Joanna's?

 

Yes. I'm sorry about that. I fixed it. It was a very good format.

[Suzanne in ABQ]

I'm wondering why a life guard is even needed in this situation.  It sounds like a small, indoor lap pool, like you might find in a hotel or apartment complex.  Yet, I've never seen a life guard in any hotel or apartment pool.  There is always a sign that says Swim At Your Own Risk, and forbids anyone under 14 from swimming without an adult present.  

 

But, to get back on topic, I would advise him to quit, but not because he is failing.  He needs a job that is stimulating, or educational, or helps him further his career, or gives him some other opportunity to grow as a person.  This job could be salvaged if he were allowed to study, or read, or exercise, or do something productive.  This "job" is mind numbing and a waste of his valuable time.  

[Ausmumof3]

Quitting the job shows responsibility on that he can recognise he's not able to perform it.

 

Just an aside as I haven't read the whole thread but there's no medical reason why he's unable to stay awake is there?

[Bluegoat]

I'd quit.

 

I think you are right to be defensive, actually.  The managers are the ones creating the problem.  There is a good reason real life-guarding situations have a lot of rules - because it isn't sustainable to do it other ways.  Like 6 hours without a break and nothing else to do.  And wearing pants?  That is a bad idea in terms of heat and in terms of saving someone.

 

I might be inclined not only to resign, but write a letter outlining the issue.  Maybe send it to the owners of the facility or the board, if there is one.

[Bluegoat]

Sleeping on the job as a lifeguard is against the law.

 

He needs to quit.   I am very surprised they didn't fire him the first time it happened. 

 

It doesn't sound like a realistic expectation to keep someone alert for 8 hour shifts doing this job.  That doesn't make it right to sleep and put others at risk.  If a customer walked by the window and saw this, they could start devastating social media storm which would hurt the business and your son.  

 

It sounds like he isn't actually a life-guard at all.  The managers have hired him for what is really an entirely different sort of position, and are trying to make it look like he is a lifeguard.

[JFSinIL]

Is he only paid if/when a body is in the pool? No - he is paid for all his time there, right? If sitting next to an empty pool makes him sleepy, then instead of sitting he should walk around the pool, find something to tidy, ANYTHING except sit and nod off. He can ask his supervisor what they want him to do when there is no one to guard.

 

OK, now that I HAVE read the entire thread - I agree with others, this is a bad job, and he needs to quit yesterday. No one can spend eight hours w/o a break in such an environment. If they must have lifeguards, it has to be shorter p/t shifts. Perhaps only have lifeguard in certain times of day when pool most likely to be used, and a sign "No Lifeguard on Duty" posted for other times.

Edited March 13, 2018 by JFSinIL

[JudoMom]

I think he should resign.

 

There are two issues:

 

1. It's a miserable job in an environment not conducive to him doing his job with an unreasonable employer.

 

2. He's falling asleep when he's supposed to be doing his job. His job is to prevent tragedies, so even if the chance of one occurring is so miniscule it's almost zero, he's not doing his job when he falls asleep.

 

Point 1 doesn't make point 2 okay, but it does explain it. I'm pretty certain I couldn't stay awake under the conditions you've described, so I'd have to resign as soon as I could, too.

[plansrme]

Just reading about that job makes me sleepy.  

 

 

[Joules]

It sounds like he isn't actually a life-guard at all.  The managers have hired him for what is really an entirely different sort of position, and are trying to make it look like he is a lifeguard.

 

Nope, he is in a "check the insurance company box with minimal effort/money" job.  It does not make sense to work that long in boredom with no breaks.  I took a look at the American Red Cross guidebook:

http://www.redcross.org/images/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m3240080_LifeguardManagement.pdf

 

 

• Lifeguards must have a clear and in-depth understanding of what is expected of them.
• Lifeguards must have the following characteristics: maturity, reliability, effective com- munication skills and effective decision- making skills.
• Lifeguards must have current certification in lifeguarding, first aid and CPR/AED for the professional rescuer.
• Lifeguards must have the proper rescue and personal protective equipment.
• Lifeguards must be properly positioned for patron surveillance.
• Lifeguards need to have frequent breaks or rest periods to maintain effective patron surveillance.
• Lifeguards need to practice and have a working knowledge of the facility’s emer- gency action plans (EAPs), rules and regula- tions and personnel policies.
• Lifeguards need to have regular in-service training to maintain knowledge and skills. Ongoing knowledge and skills review and practice are essential!
• Lifeguards need to be rewarded for doing a good job and corrected immediately for problem behavior.
• Lifeguards and members of the aquatic safety team must work together with the lifeguard supervisor and each other to make the facility as safe as possible.

 

Other quotes from the book:

 

 

• Lifeguards should take a break at least once an hour. In one system of surveillance, a lifeguard might spend 20 or 30 minutes at one station, rotate to another station for 20 or 30 minutes and then take a 20- or 30-minute break. In another system, a lifeguard might spend 45 minutes at one stand, take a break for 15 minutes and then go to an- other stand. 

•  

• Reduce the effects of fatigue by rotating your lifeguards frequently and providing appropriate breaks and water. 

•  

• Periodic rotations from one station to another, along with breaks, help your lifeguards stay alert and decrease fatigue. 

 

I think this should be a lifeguard/staff member position.  So when there is no one swimming he does other productive jobs in the facility. Keep the pool locked.  On the occasion that a patron wants to swim, he unlocks the door and puts full effort into lifeguarding.  When they leave, lock it again and go back to productive work.

[Cosmos]

Nope, he is in a "check the insurance company box with minimal effort/money" job.  It does not make sense to work that long in boredom with no breaks.  I took a look at the American Red Cross guidebook:

http://www.redcross.org/images/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m3240080_LifeguardManagement.pdf

 

Other quotes from the book:

 

I think this should be a lifeguard/staff member position.  So when there is no one swimming he does other productive jobs in the facility. Keep the pool locked.  On the occasion that a patron wants to swim, he unlocks the door and puts full effort into lifeguarding.  When they leave, lock it again and go back to productive work.

 

That's a really good idea.

 

Realistically, it it were me, I would just quit, because the job sounds awful.

 

In an ideal world, I would be the kind of person who went to management with a list of my concerns and a proposed solution, such as Joules' idea. That would be showing some strong leadership skills.

 

But I am a hypocrite because, while I might encourage my son to do that, I myself probably would not.

[SparklyUnicorn]

This sounds like a lousy job.  As said already they are setting one up for failure.  I'd quit. 

[marbel]

OP, I understand your feelings.

 

I would tell my son to quit.  I would also be tempted to encourage him to research the laws for lifeguards in your town/county/whatever jurisdiction, and report this employer if they are in violation.  I don't know much about lifeguarding and managing a pool, but I don't know of any job where a person can legally be made to work 8 hours without a break.  Or even 6, if the other lifeguard was on time.  

 

:grouphug:

[Bluegoat]

Nope, he is in a "check the insurance company box with minimal effort/money" job.  It does not make sense to work that long in boredom with no breaks.  I took a look at the American Red Cross guidebook:

http://www.redcross.org/images/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m3240080_LifeguardManagement.pdf

 

Other quotes from the book:

 

I think this should be a lifeguard/staff member position.  So when there is no one swimming he does other productive jobs in the facility. Keep the pool locked.  On the occasion that a patron wants to swim, he unlocks the door and puts full effort into lifeguarding.  When they leave, lock it again and go back to productive work.

 

Didn't it say earlier in the thread though that he was hired in a different category than a life0guard, which is why he wasn't required to follow certain rules that are there for life guard positions?

 

I think if that is the case, they are trying to get away without paying for safety supervision while giving the appearance of having it.

[Katy]

If he's falling asleep at work he IS endangering lives.  You're deluding yourself if you think otherwise. 

 

If the system is set up to fail, he needs to quit.  Because if a quiet person slips into the pool while he's asleep and drowns, he will be criminally liable.  As in potentially go to jail.  No job he's not capable of doing properly is worth that.

[maize]

He should quit because the job is a bad fit and management clearly has no interest in taking care of their employees.

 

8 hours with no breaks is I suspect a bigger violation on their part than falling asleep is on his.

[OneStepAtATime]

I thought about this again and frankly I would be helping him research right now (as others have mentioned) whether they are violating laws in your state.  It certainly sounds like it.  Management is trying to check boxes and circumvent labor laws in a pretty slippery, smarmy way it sounds like to me.  What they are doing is dangerous and unethical, whether it is legal or not.  They are putting people's lives at risk.  I would consider, if I were him, going into that meeting with a letter of resignation and a clear explanation in writing of WHY this is an unsafe job that puts lives at risk, along with references to any regulations/laws they may be violating.  

 

 

[Tap]

It sounds like he isn't actually a life-guard at all.  The managers have hired him for what is really an entirely different sort of position, and are trying to make it look like he is a lifeguard.

If the company is legally required to have someone there even if it is called a "pool babysitter", and if that person is sleeping, they are in violation of the law.

 

I would never want my kid to work in a position like this and would advise them to quit. Not providing legally appropriate lunch and not allowing him something to entertain himself, is an accident waiting to happen.

[gardenmom5]

Quitting the job shows responsibility on that he can recognise he's not able to perform it.

 

Just an aside as I haven't read the whole thread but there's no medical reason why he's unable to stay awake is there?

 

 

quitting the job with no notice shows he recognizes THEY are violating the employment/safety laws,  at least in the jurisdictions of some of us.

[gardenmom5]

I thought about this again and frankly I would be helping him research right now (as others have mentioned) whether they are violating laws in your state.  It certainly sounds like it.  Management is trying to check boxes and circumvent labor laws in a pretty slippery, smarmy way it sounds like to me.  What they are doing is dangerous and unethical, whether it is legal or not.  They are putting people's lives at risk.  I would consider, if I were him, going into that meeting with a letter of resignation and a clear explanation in writing of WHY this is an unsafe job that puts lives at risk, along with references to any regulations/laws they may be violating.  

 

and if he can find the references for the laws in your local - I'd include them in the letter.   - it might help to speed things up be asking at a "normal" pool situation what the laws are, and where to find them.

if you can find the exact violations- I'd seriously consider reporting them to the appropriate authority.

[poppy]

I think it's utterly bananas they didn't fire him!
This isn't a judgement against him, just, these are not smart or good people to work for. 

[Scarlett]

It sounds like a horrible job and I would encourage him to quit.  There will be plenty of time for needing to keep horrible jobs, but this is not one of them.   

 

If he really does not want to quit I would suggest he meet with them in the spirit of 'I know it is not acceptable for a lifeguard to EVER sleep on the job, can you help me brainstorm some changes to the way this is set up because I can't be the only one who can't stay awake.'

[Bluegoat]

If the company is legally required to have someone there even if it is called a "pool babysitter", and if that person is sleeping, they are in violation of the law.

 

I would never want my kid to work in a position like this and would advise them to quit. Not providing legally appropriate lunch and not allowing him something to entertain himself, is an accident waiting to happen.

 

If I understand what a pool babysitter does, it's really just monitor the pool.  Not the people.  I don't think there is a law that says you have to have someone do that at all.

[mathnerd]

It does not matter if the pool was empty or not. Sleeping on a job, however boring is unacceptable. Even more so if the job involves the safety of others. I have held super boring jobs for years - I never once dozed off, it is unprofessional - I used to get up on my feet and walk around to keep myself busy when I was stuck with boring jobs.

 

His excuse that there was nobody in the pool and hence it was OK to sleep is like telling a cop that you ran a STOP sign or red light only because there were no other cars on the road when you did it. There are rules for a reason and breaking them means that you are not suited for that job nor are you suited to follow those rules. He should quit. Quitting is better than teaching himself that he can bend the rules because it is safe to do so based on his judgement. He is teaching himself to work around an employer's policies and this will have longer lasting effects on his attitude towards his career as an adult.

 

He has another job and you said that he can get extra hours at that other job. So, why not stick to that other job?

[Bluegoat]

It does not matter if the pool was empty or not. Sleeping on a job, however boring is unacceptable. Even more so if the job involves the safety of others. I have held super boring jobs for years - I never once dozed off, it is unprofessional - I used to get up on my feet and walk around to keep myself busy when I was stuck with boring jobs.

 

His excuse that there was nobody in the pool and hence it was OK to sleep is like telling a cop that you ran a STOP sign or red light only because there were no other cars on the road when you did it. There are rules for a reason and breaking them means that you are not suited for that job nor are you suited to follow those rules. He should quit. Quitting is better than teaching himself that he can bend the rules because it is safe to do so based on his judgement. He is teaching himself to work around an employer's policies and this will have longer lasting effects on his attitude towards his career as an adult.

 

He has another job and you said that he can get extra hours at that other job. So, why not stick to that other job?

 

If the conditions of a job require alertness, and are also prone to create inattention or sleepiness, to the point where it is regulated in order to make sure people stay alert, is that really down to being an unprofessional employee if the managers don't follow the rules?

 

Take truck drivers for instance.  For many years, and even now, it was understood that truck drivers need to be awake and alert, and the conditions of the industry tend to push people to make them work under conditions where they cannot stay awake and alert.  So there are regulations about hours they can drive with relation to sleep.

 

If the company won't let the driver sleep as much as the regulations say, and he isn't able to stay alert, does that make him unprofessional?  And should he have to leave the job while the employers look for others who are willing to do the job anyway?

 

Really - I think this kid should not work here.  But it's a bit rich to call him out when his employers are the ones making a dangerous situation.

Edited March 13, 2018 by Bluegoat

[mathnerd]

  But it's a bit rich to call him out when his employers are the ones making a dangerous situation.

If the employers are not following employment regulations that allows for regular breaks etc, then, the kid should not work there. That is a separate issue from sleeping while you are expected to be working. I still maintain that it is unprofessional to be caught dozing off while you are supposedly working. I would consider myself acting unprofessionally if my boss caught me taking a nap when I am on the job. I subject myself to the same standards and would be mortified and quit if I am seen constantly taking naps because business was lean and no one was around.

[amy g.]

I sympathize, OP.

 

My son got an office job where he was to proofread contracts and do whatever extra jobs his boss wanted him to do.

 

His boss got super busy, was always out of town and didn’t get around to giving my kid enough work.

 

Once, executives from Germany were visiting the Houston office. The first thing that they saw was my kid sleeping at his desk.

 

It wasn’t pretty.

 

My son admitted that it was unacceptable and told his boss that he was making an appointment with a neurologist to rule out a physical cause since he does have a sibling with a sleep disorder.

 

This kind of muddied the waters about firing him.

 

Soon after, a different VP said he wanted DS in his department and he started getting interesting work that he is well suited for.

 

Now he has been promoted several times since then, and they tease him saying, “And just think, we almost fired you!â€

 

All that is to say that understanding how to be a good employee is a learning process.

 

I think it is pretty common for kids to have a few bumps along the way. What is important is that they learn from them.

 

No matter what the work environment, I would not be encouraging my kid to blame the company.

 

I’d stress that he isn’t a good fit and that he has better options available.

[katilac]

If it were my child, I would prefer for them to quit. I can't decide if I would insist if they disagreed, if they were 18. 

 

Agreed that it's a terrible work environment that is very conducive to sleeping, but, if he wants to stay, it's on him to figure out ways to stay awake. 

 

The first step is obviously going to be a lot less sitting in the chair. He doesn't need to walk and stand for 6 to 8 hours straight, but he does need to be moving frequently and keeping himself alert. 

 

If he is able to have his phone, he can set alarms to go off every 20 minutes, as a reminder to change activities and position. He needs to make a list of what he can do that will follow the rules and also keep him awake. 

 

He can do yoga, stretching, and other exercises, experimenting with what works best to keep him alert. I'm guessing that's going to be short, frequent intervals such as every 15 minutes for 5 minutes or even 3 minutes.

 

Slow walks around the pool. 

 

He can clean the deck again no matter how silly it is to do so. The point is not cleaning the deck but staying awake. 

 

When he does sit, he is much less likely to fall asleep if he sits on the ground versus the chair. He can switch around from sitting cross-legged to sitting on the edge of the pool with his feet in the water. 

 

Splash his face with water, dip hands and feet in the water.  

 

Bring a handheld fan that sprays water, add ice to make it cold water. 

 

Recite poetry or Latin declensions.

 

Sing his favorite songs. 

 

Bounce a tennis ball. 

 

Use a fidget spinner. 

 

I'm sure he can come up with some to his liking, he just needs to think about it. 

 

Basically, he needs to keep moving and keep active. Plenty of jobs do require being on your feet for 8 hours and longer, so I think he needs to regard sitting in the chair as something he does on self-assigned breaks, as opposed to sitting being the default that is occasionally broken up by other things.  

 

I think the workplace is wrong for not providing ways to break the monotony, but it is what it is. If he wants to keep the job, he needs to break the monotony himself. 

 

One more thought: can he observe the other workers or ask them for advice? 

 

 

[happi duck]

I don't think any of the information here implies that the op's kid is *deciding* to take a nap.

 

Haven't any of you ever thought "I'll just sit down for a minute" and nodded off?

 

I do hope he quits but the conditions this job insists upon are really not conducive to an alert employee.

[LucyStoner]

The other thing I will say is that if he’s scheduled to work 6 hours and he’s working 8 because the next guy is 2 hours late, that’s not his problem. He should leave at the end of 6 hours. Keeping him 2 extra hours without notice isn’t ok. Sometimes workers are asked to or offered extra time because of callouts but it seems like this is a regular thing and that’s nuts.

 

When I was his age, I most often would have had to leave when my shift was scheduled to end because I was probably heading to another job or a class. I don’t understand the nerve of the employer to put staying on him.

[Tsuga]

Haven't any of you ever thought "I'll just sit down for a minute" and nodded off?

 

Well, no, I honestly have never done that in 25 years of working.

 

That said I do very much agree that the working conditions were bad if not illegal. But when you find yourself in dangerous conditions: leave, and blow the whistle. Don't just stay on and sleep.

 

I made plenty of mistakes when I was 18. I am not judging OP's son's character. He's probably a better lifeguard than I could ever be, and possibly a better person. I am sure this isn't going to be the end of his career, just a lesson learned.

 

I'm just commenting on this particular question.

[poppy]

I don't think any of the information here implies that the op's kid is *deciding* to take a nap.

 

Haven't any of you ever thought "I'll just sit down for a minute" and nodded off?

 

I do hope he quits but the conditions this job insists upon are really not conducive to an alert employee.

 

The first time is an "oops" , but beyond that it's a known  risk.

I wonder if it's happened more than twice & he's only been caught twice?

He might not even be aware, in those conditions.

[Bluegoat]

If the employers are not following employment regulations that allows for regular breaks etc, then, the kid should not work there. That is a separate issue from sleeping while you are expected to be working. I still maintain that it is unprofessional to be caught dozing off while you are supposedly working. I would consider myself acting unprofessionally if my boss caught me taking a nap when I am on the job. I subject myself to the same standards and would be mortified and quit if I am seen constantly taking naps because business was lean and no one was around.

 

There is a reason regulations like that exist - people can't stay awake and alert under those conditions.

 

It's like driving, which is why I used that example.  Falling asleep while driving is a real danger if people are tired, or get road-zombi effects.  No one decides to take a nap while driving so, calling it unprofessional is kind of silly.  It's just the way the brain and body work.  That is why it's considered a more serious risk even than texting and driving.

[Bluegoat]

I've been in jobs where I had to stay awake under difficult conditions, and there are ways to make sure you do, but a lot of them are things these people won't seem to allow.

[Joules]

Didn't it say earlier in the thread though that he was hired in a different category than a life0guard, which is why he wasn't required to follow certain rules that are there for life guard positions?

 

I think if that is the case, they are trying to get away without paying for safety supervision while giving the appearance of having it.

 

I did see something on that later (not sure if it was after I posted or I just missed it the first time.)

 

You are right, they are giving the appearance of a lifeguard without actually having one.  No one can stay as attentive as necessary under those conditions.  The Red Cross suggestions are designed to keep people safe. I think those at the pool would be better off with a No Lifeguard On Duty sign, if they aren't going to have conditions for safe lifeguarding.

 

OP, I do think your son should quit or go to those in charge with some of these alternate suggestions.

[Joules]

One thing to remember is this is not like falling asleep at a boring job.  The level of alertness that is required to lifeguard properly is absolutely exhausting. You have to be watching and ready every second. If he has two straight hours with people in the pool, it's not surprising that he would conk out when they are gone.  Seriously the Red Cross recommends 15-20 minute breaks every hour!!  Eight hours with only potty breaks is really unacceptable.  It's not safe for anyone.

[Tap]

If I understand what a pool babysitter does, it's really just monitor the pool. Not the people. I don't think there is a law that says you have to have someone do that at all.

Op said he had to know CPR and have soneone watch the pool when he went to the bathroom. That implies it is a requirement that someone be there to react in case of emergency. Sleeping people cant react and groggy people may have impaired judgement.

[Wheres Toto]

I think he should go into his meeting armed with information about the laws in your state, apologize for falling asleep but also be prepared to discuss the working conditions - he should not be working 2 extra hours without a lunch break, he should be getting more frequent smaller breaks, they need to rethink their requirements for long pants (??), and consider other changes.  I don't know why reading wouldn't be okay if there's nobody in the room.  I do like the idea above about a clipboard with puzzles.   

 

Basically, they seem way to concerned about appearances and not concerned enough with actual safety and possibly, laws.

 

I would actually tell my kid to quit a job like that, but if he really wants to stay he needs to get improvement to the working conditions.

[SarahB82]

He needs to quit. It is a poor working environment and he isn’t suited for the job. If he doesn’t want to quit I would recommend he walk the entire shift. It may not be fun but he will stay awake.

[Bluegoat]

Op said he had to know CPR and have soneone watch the pool when he went to the bathroom. That implies it is a requirement that someone be there to react in case of emergency. Sleeping people cant react and groggy people may have impaired judgement.

 

Yes, that's right, I'd forgotten that.

 

But then I am wondering, how is he not a lifeguard?

 

He is supposed to watch, presumably save people who are drowning, potentially give CPR.

 

There is no way anyone can lifeguard in pants and a shirt for 8 hours without a break.

[SereneHome]

Things must have really changed over the last few decades in the employment world bc I couldn't imagine worrying about being fired at 18 from a job that was not a "career" type of job.

 

I am pretty sure I got fired from a clothing store when I was that age, I can't honestly even remember

[Bluegoat]

Things must have really changed over the last few decades in the employment world bc I couldn't imagine worrying about being fired at 18 from a job that was not a "career" type of job.

 

I am pretty sure I got fired from a clothing store when I was that age, I can't honestly even remember

 

I just left a few crappy jobs as a young person.  I never put them on my resume.  I tend to assume everyone leaves some things off, for relevance sake if nothing else.  

[*LC]

His pool is tiny, 2 lanes, 4 feet deep. He's the only guard on duty for 6 - 8 hours, and generally there's 1 - 2 adults in the pool swimming laps for about 1/2 of it, and it's empty for 1/2 of it.

....

He works 5 a.m. to 11 a.m., but his replacement is routinely up to 2 hours late, hence the 8 hours. Somehow that's not fireable, but since his shift is 6 hours, they don't need to give him a lunch break. If he needs a bathroom break a member of the maintenance staff covers for him, usually at some point when the pool is empty.

.....

But the other is what I call a "pool babysitter". They check the pool chemicals, and stay in the pool area and are responsible for calling 911, and doing CPR, but they aren't technically watching the pool, so they don't need breaks etc . . . and someone CPR trained can cover for them.

 

At the pool at our building the "pool babysitter" reads most of the time, and apparently that's legal, but DS's company has decided it gives them a bad reputation if someone looks in the window and sees the lifeguard reading.

,.........

 

 

 

 

DS does watch the people swimming. It's the most exciting thing he has to do, beside mopping, but it's not quite the same as a lifeguard at a large public pool.

 

....

No, he needs to wear a T shirt and long pants, so he can't get in the pool, unless I guess he's saving someone.

 

....

 

If you think this is reasonable, I challenge you to go to sleep tonight sometime after 10 pm.

 

Then get up at 4:30 am. Get dressed in pants and t-shirt. Leave all devices, books, etc, in your bedroom.

 

Leave a note for someone in your family to relieve you sometime between 11 am and 1 pm.

 

Report to the bathroom in your home, turn the fan on, turn on the heater and wait.

 

You can mop, but no other cleaning.

 

Sit or stand, your choice.

 

You may use the bathroom once, but you cannot leave the bathroom.

 

Wait for a family member come find you after 6 to 8 hours.

 

Report in tomorrow to tell us how it went. If it went well, repeat tomorrow night.

 

OP, two of my kids have been lifeguards. One was with a group where they rotated around different guard posts. The other worked at small neighborhood pools where there may or may not been anyone else there. She could not have a cellphone, but books were fine. She used the time to study for the ACT. She did this job for three years; she would not have stayed a month under the conditions your son works under if she had another job available.

 

It is ok for your son to quit or to negotiate better conditions, such as being allowed to read when no one is at the pool.

Edited March 13, 2018 by *LC

[*LC]

Dp

Edited March 13, 2018 by *LC