Menu
Jump to content

What's with the ads?

lexi

Why not Memoria Press?

Recommended Posts

I’m making my lists for next school year and the catalogs are arriving. I’m drawn to some Memoria Press stuff because it seems clean, straightforward, easy to use, and reasonably priced. (Plus the covers are pretty!)

 

I’m tempted by Latin and logic and maybe some history and poetry resources.

 

I’ve never tried Memoria in the past because it seemed dry.

 

But I’ve been using some CAP stuff and some of it seems like busy work and I’m not loving Latin for Children.

 

We’re having a baby this summer so I need to plan school stuff now and I’d like stuff that is easy to use and fairly straightforward.

 

So tell me the pros and cons of Memoria stuff. Is this what I’m looking for in a few subjects?

 

I don’t think I want a full grade package because I’m happy with our science (BJU online) and some of our other subjects.

 

Why not use Memoria Press? Tell me what I need to know about their materials please!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think their Form Series (Latin) is fantastic. This is a subject where systematic "kill and drill" produces great results. I think MP does well with these type of subjects, but for more imaginative subjects like literature their materials can be very dry.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think their Form Series (Latin) is fantastic. This is a subject where systematic "kill and drill" produces great results. I think MP does well with these type of subjects, but for more imaginative subjects like literature their materials can be very dry.

This is really helpful. I’ve tried a Lit guide in the past and it was terribly boring.

 

But this sounds like it might be what I need for logic and Latin. I want it systematic with lots of drill. So I think I’m definitely going to try Latin. Their logic looks good too.

 

If I were to pick a few subjects from Memoria which ones does everyone recommend?

 

And I wish I could find an upper elementary and a middle school spanish course I liked. Sigh....

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We enjoyed their Latin.  We did Prima Latina, Latina Christian, First & Second Form Latin.  My kids also did some literature guides from them in middle school and enjoyed them very much.  We did these with friends.  The girls did a book and the work on their own, and did discussion together once a week.  The boys the same way.  It was a fun way to share lit with another homeschool family.  After finishing, both groups watched a movie for their book.  I would get more of those lit books.  

It's definitely more workbook style, but my kids enjoyed that kind of learning.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We are finishing MP Kindergarten and 3rd this year. I did not get R&S math.

Latina Christiana has been good (we did Prima last year). I am looking forward to digging deeping into First Form next year.

I have enjoyed the literature guides, they have been a good springboard for discussions about the books, and the selections have been excellent.

Not a huge fan of English Grammar Recitation. It is set up catechism style, but does not always have a clear question to ask.

Not a huge fan of Spelling Workout, but it is independent which I needed.

All Things Fun & Fascinating has been once a week, and has worked well.

Christian Studies has been basic, but I love the drill questions in the back of the book to make sure we have "the facts" solid.

Greek Myths is ok. The workbook is great, but the tests are insane for 3rd grade. I again love the drill questions in the back of the book.

States and Capitols has been a bit dry, but we are mastering them and I like that they are arranged by region instead of alphabetically.

Astronomy has been great. I have not had to come up with any science demonstrations, and both me and my son have now memorized the night sky well enough to look up anytime it is dark and find many constellations.

I like the Timeline, it is nothing fancy, and there are not a huge number of events to master each year.

The read-alouds have been excellent. The American studies books have been fine.

 

I have already bought 1st and 4th for next year.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think their Lit guides are deadly dull.  Kill any enjoyment of the books.  The Latin looks great.  I'm not crazy about their approach to science and geography.  But it's fine.  Just not my preference. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My kids LOVE the lit guides—like first subject every day, love them. Even my dyslexic kid doesn’t hate it. However, we don’t complete all the books each year.

 

Their Latin program is awesome—no frills, and clear and concise.

 

We do like English Grammar Recitation especially with the new Core Skills LA scheduled in. It goes well with their Latin program. I only wish there were more emphasis on punctuation.

 

Their Classical Comp is another favorite subject for my oldest. We don’t do it completely on schedule and I’m not paying to finish any of that.

 

We don’t use their science or history, although I’m tempted to go MPOA for science this year. That’s the online academy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have done K-4 MP cores, without the Latin, with my 4th grade dd after homeschooling my older three kids pulling everything together myself. I love MP cores and I have not once regretted the decision or wished I was still pulling it all together myself. I plan to stick with them perhaps even all the way through high school.

 

BUT- I don't think I would love any of the pieces the way I do the whole. I love the simplicity and the way it all fits together and the reasonable cost. I don't know that I would enjoy any of the parts as stand alone (though the Latin is popular).

 

We have liked the Lit guides but we do them orally and fly through them. We have enjoyed the books and doing the lessons together on the couch and have not gotten bogged down in them at all.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love their middle history. I get the guides but rarely have Ds write the answers. Instead we go through it orally and use it as a discussion springboard.

 

I have to talk myself out of buying the whole shebang every year. Ultimately, it's a lot. It would cut into the kid's "just go read" time. Otoh, we might gain some worthwhile time somewhere else. It's v appealing!

 

If I could get a rush order on the next few levels of simply classical cores, I'd be on that like white on rice!!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have done the Enrichment K-2 and K was my favorite. That would be a fun choice if you need help making plans while in baby fog. I like a lot of the aspects of MP Jr. K but there’s a lot of problems trying to sync up with it. At first DD wasn’t ready for the writing but loved the literature and questions and crafts. Now that she is writing well the writing is too simple. The First Start Reading was great and a great compliment to AAR.

 

Have you checked out the Veritas lit guides? They seem more fun here and have fun little parts to them, like coloring, cooking or little projects.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We used full MP for a couple of years, took a year + off, and now are back to full MP (and I've already ordered next year's books).

 

We left for some of the same reasons mentioned above.  I was getting bored and wanted more freedom to just read and notebook, without doing the guides and tests and such.  What I found was that it became harder, not easier, for us to do that than simply follow MP plans, and my kids were retaining far less.  Sure they enjoyed just reading and making a notebook page more than working in a guide and studying for a test, but they weren't mastering any of the material and forgot it so quickly.  

 

No, MP isn't necessarily fun or entertaining.  The joy comes in thoroughly learning the material, and reaping the benefits of hard, disciplined work.  I feel like MP is helping me teach my dc good study habits because they are learning that they have to constantly review material.  These skills will help them succeed in the future with any kind of class or work they find themselves doing.

 

Don't look at the student books as workbooks!  They are meant to be guides.  They guide the student through the readings by helping them thoroughly understand and remember what they have read.  This is so different than just reading a chapter, or even than reading plus narrating (which we always did).  This requires them to pay attention to details that they might have missed, and helps them weed through all the information and pull out the main ideas and facts worth remembering.  Even the tests themselves are great tools for this!  They force the kids to work and re-work with the material until they actually know and understand what the book is about.  

 

Kids can do a lot of this independently, which I love!  However, I do make sure to meet with the olders to go over their guides each day because it is so helpful to discuss the material together.  

Edited by ALB
  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love MP materials for Latin, Composition, and History/Geography, but I use the sequence set out by Kolbe for those subjects and leave the rest. You have to really love workbooks to mesh with MP’s whole curriculum and it would be way too much for my kid so we do a lot of what MP materials we do like orally.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm considering using a lot more MP components next year for at least one of my school kids, but possibly both (I'm forever considering this LOL). I wonder how to organize the schedules when using it piecemeal, but using *a lot* of piecemeal. With just one or two components, it's NBD you just plug it into your day. I've read all the threads I could find on the MP forum about it. But I'm thinking if I go that way I might just have to get a core and kind of work backward and sit down and hammer it out one day. Because I know that the pacing of materials is something that full-core users say make it feel like it's not "too much." But for whatever reason, when we use things here and there we get the pace wrong so then we look at a whole core and think well gee whiz that will take 8 times the amount of time I'm already taking with just this ONE thing. 

 

Just a thought. I think I'd have to see how they actually put it all together to accurately pace individual components. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We just switched to a complete Memoria Press core this year, and I CANNOT say enough good things about it!   I mean SERIOUSLY, it has been a great school year.   We use our own math and spelling, but besides that, we are using the core guide as written.

 

I too thought that the material seemed dry, so I didn't try their stuff for years.   However, my kids have loved using memoria press products!   (See this article)   They are thriving on the routine and predictability.   We love their literature, their Latin, their poetry/art/music material, their timeline, their geography....all of it is so easy to teach, well put together, and affordable.  

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We just switched to a complete Memoria Press core this year, and I CANNOT say enough good things about it! I mean SERIOUSLY, it has been a great school year. We use our own math and spelling, but besides that, we are using the core guide as written.

 

I too thought that the material seemed dry, so I didn't try their stuff for years. However, my kids have loved using memoria press products! (See this article) They are thriving on the routine and predictability. We love their literature, their Latin, their poetry/art/music material, their timeline, their geography....all of it is so easy to teach, well put together, and affordable.

Are you doing grammar and recitation as laid out? That was one area that made me hesitate. It seemed like alot of memorization of facts. Are your kids doing ok with that? I wasn't sure how mine would respond.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We just switched to a complete Memoria Press core this year, and I CANNOT say enough good things about it! I mean SERIOUSLY, it has been a great school year. We use our own math and spelling, but besides that, we are using the core guide as written.

 

I too thought that the material seemed dry, so I didn't try their stuff for years. However, my kids have loved using memoria press products! (See this article) They are thriving on the routine and predictability. We love their literature, their Latin, their poetry/art/music material, their timeline, their geography....all of it is so easy to teach, well put together, and affordable.

I am tempted every year to make this switch. But then I look at the packages and we've read most of the books already (as in, we'd need fourth and fifth next year and there is only one book we haven't read). Did you run into this? Is there any way around it?

 

Add to that that we've only done very minimal Latin until now and... maybe we've missed the boat for MP?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Love, love, love their Latin instruction!  We've used the Form Series on our own, starting with Middle Schoolers and a parent that didn't know any Latin, and we all did fine!  We are now doing Henle with MPOA (their online academy) and my ds is learning tons with Mr. & Mrs. Timmis.  Plus Latin has become one of his favorite classes and I NEVER would have expected that in a million years!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love MP for Latin and a few other subjects and specific programs, but I would not use it as my primary or core curriculum because I don't want my children to miss out on modern and more diverse studies. When do Highlands Latin School students learn about Frederick Douglass or Barack Obama, for example? That is a serious question. I've never been able to find the answer.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love MP for Latin and a few other subjects and specific programs, but I would not use it as my primary or core curriculum because I don't want my children to miss out on modern and more diverse studies. When do Highlands Latin School students learn about Frederick Douglass or Barack Obama, for example? That is a serious question. I've never been able to find the answer.

 

They do American studies, mainly history, for at least 3 or 4 years. Their online school offers three different American history classes.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love MP for Latin and a few other subjects and specific programs, but I would not use it as my primary or core curriculum because I don't want my children to miss out on modern and more diverse studies. When do Highlands Latin School students learn about Frederick Douglass or Barack Obama, for example? That is a serious question. I've never been able to find the answer.

I can only speak to the younger cores because dd is in 4th but she has picked up a lot of US History from the American Studies reading. It includes biographies and historical fiction. Odd facts are included in the daily recitation and there are modern dates on the timeline. It is not a systematic study by any stretch but my dd is already making connections.

 

My 9th grader who has never done any MP is taking College Prep US History through MPOA this year and it is a very solid class. I am assuming some foundation is laid in the middle school years but we are not there yet.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love their Latin program and their literature guides. I moved to the literature guides because one of mine wasn't retaining information well and he's improved massively.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Several of you have mentioned that MP’s format helped your children retain information...do you think writing the answers into the workbooks was an important part of that, or would it be okay to use them orally? (I am considering Traditional Logic for my oldest next year, but I know so much writing in a workbook will irk her).

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love MP for Latin and a few other subjects and specific programs, but I would not use it as my primary or core curriculum because I don't want my children to miss out on modern and more diverse studies. When do Highlands Latin School students learn about Frederick Douglass or Barack Obama, for example? That is a serious question. I've never been able to find the answer.

This was my hangup until they added their American History readings. I do think kids learn a lot that way...

 

I also don't want to do Latin from an early age and worry about too much review. I think both of these can be handled - just don't do Latin until you want it (because there is so much review). I'd probably jump in at First Form Latin or even Henle, depending on the kid. And fit the review to the kid, not vice versa.

 

Emily

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All of these thoughts have been really helpful. I think we will try some Memoria stuff next year. I need something new and something that is no frills and straightforward. I think this will get done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you doing grammar and recitation as laid out? That was one area that made me hesitate. It seemed like alot of memorization of facts. Are your kids doing ok with that? I wasn't sure how mine would respond.

 

Here is my long-winded answer to that question:

 

I decided that a big part of the "lure" of memoria press (for me) was that they put together a complete curriculum package for the year.   And not just any curriculum package, but a beautifully rich classical education filled with truth, beauty, and goodness.   A package that had been tried and tested with REAL kids, and yielded top-notch academic results.   (Not just some theoretical plan someone put together on paper hoping it would work and not be "too much" or "too little".)   I also wanted an education focused on depth with fewer (more important) subjects instead of a light overview of many subjects.   (Multum non multua).  

 

I had been trying to plan my own classical education for years.  And homeschooling had sort of taken over my life.    We had these very long school days trying to check all of the boxes off in TWTM.  And I spent all of my spare time researching and planning and prepping.   I decided that I wanted things to change.   I wanted to put homeschooling back in its place.   I wanted it to be a part of my life, not all consuming.    I wanted time to still be a mom (not just magistra!); I wanted time to workout and plan healthy meals;  I wanted time to explore hobbies.   

 

SO--I made the decision that if I was going to buy a complete core, I was going to try to mess with it as little as possible. :)   So I had to resist, resist, resist messing with the guide!   That was really hard for me because  I tweak everything---and I am always trying to make things "better" and chose the "best" curriculum out there...you know?  

 

So, my answer to your question is....yes!   We do all of the recitations as laid out in the guide.  I feel like the recitations and drill questions are important, and one of the reasons kids retain so much using Memoria Press curriculum.  

 

My kids have never complained about recitations or drill, but each child is different.   Plus, each family is different!   If my kids complained about drilling math facts or Latin conjugations or their history timeline, I would listen and try to make it as enjoyable as possible.   However, sometimes, real learning/growth takes a lot of drill and practice.   (Think of learning a musical instrument or doing reps with a weight to get stronger.)   So I would try to be encouraging to my kids, but I wouldn't necessarily let them out of something IF I felt was good for them.  And I do feel that the recitations and review are really important to mastering the material for the long term.   (That is what I choose for my family.  However, like I said, each family is different.)   

 

Like I said, my kids have never batted an eye with the recitations.   However, memory work and drill are nothing new to my kids.  We did that before moving to Memoria Press.    We drilled math facts, memorized poems, reviewed important historical dates, etc. etc.    

 

Now, I tried to do what I could to make it less teacher intensive.   I loaded the morning recitation questions and subject related flashcards into an electronic flashcard tool named ANKI.  (It uses spaced repetion to help with memory.)  I assign the kids 15 minutes (total) of independent review each day across all subjects.   I did a little training with the kids so they can do this themselves.   Then, I spot check them every now and then to make sure they are really reviewing on their own.   ;)  

 

 

I am tempted every year to make this switch. But then I look at the packages and we've read most of the books already (as in, we'd need fourth and fifth next year and there is only one book we haven't read). Did you run into this? Is there any way around it?

 

Add to that that we've only done very minimal Latin until now and... maybe we've missed the boat for MP?

 

Yes!  We did run into this!   When my kids were younger, we mostly followed TWTM.  However, we often used Sonlight (and other HS companies) for ideas on our read alouds and readers.   That meant that we were reading A LOT of books each year for our literature studies.   

 

So, we had read many of the books scheduled in their literature packages.   However, because we were reading SO MANY books, we never really went into much depth with these books.   For example, my son just re-read Cricket in Times Square this year.   He loved the book the first time he read it, but he never took the time to look up maps of New York City; look at pictures of times square and central station.  Same thing with Homer Price.  I had read that book aloud a few years ago.  However, doing it again with the lit guide, I realized that there were a lot of ideas presented in the book that my kids didn't really grasp.  For example, we wouldn't stop a chapter to watch a video on the first assembly line, etc. etc.   I think this, for me, was an example of the concept of multum non multa.  Reading a few books really slowly, sometimes even re-reading chapters twice, and taking the time to really explore all of the words, implied meanings, ideas, and references in a chapter.   We still do just read a lot of books for enjoyment, but there is something to be said for reading a few books deeply each year.  

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love MP for Latin and a few other subjects and specific programs, but I would not use it as my primary or core curriculum because I don't want my children to miss out on modern and more diverse studies. When do Highlands Latin School students learn about Frederick Douglass or Barack Obama, for example? That is a serious question. I've never been able to find the answer.

 

Yes!  I struggle with this too.  The way they study history each year is very different than a lot of neo-classical education models.   I'm still not sure what my final thoughts on their history will be.    

 

However, if you are interested, here is how I *understand* the theory behind an MP education...

MP Is much closer to the "classical" education received by the likes of C.S. Lewis, Churchill, or Tolkien.   It is much closer to an "Old Skool" classical education :)  than our modern day take on things.  

 

I think because MP is tested with real kids, they have discovered that there IS limited time in the day.   There is only so much time each day and so you have to be intentional in how you use it.   Looking back, I spent a TON of time with my older kids in grades K-3 studying history.  We read SOTW, made notebooks, mummified chickens, etc. etc.    However, they didn't retain a whole lot from their studies.   Sure, it created fun memories and hopefully an overall "good feeling" attached to history.   But was ALL OF THE TIME worth it for something they have little memory of?   I don't know.  I still ask myself that question.   :)    Would they have been better off with more free time and a few carefully selected read alouds on the topic at night?   Again, I don't know.  :)   

 

 So here is the breakdown on MP history (as I see it):

 

1)   Grade pre-k to 2nd:   In these years, kids are spending the VAST majority of their time learning how to learn.   Again, there is only a limited amount of hours in the day.  The question is:  how do we use them best?   It is one thing to make a theoretical plan on paper saying that kids should learn to read well, learn to spell well,  learn math well, learn to write well, learn history well, learn art well, learn science well, etc. etc.   It is another thing to actually learn all of these things well with the time we are given.  Right?  

 

SO, MP's theory is that they are going to go hard and strong with the basics and everything else will be treated like icing on the cake.  With MP, the vast majory of their school time in early elementary is spent learning phonics REALLY well, learning arithmetic REALLY well, learning proper penmanship REALLY well, etc. etc.   They are working hard on the basics.  That isn't to say they aren't studying history or science or art or music.   However, those are done more casually through read alouds and enrichment.    The emphasis is much more on doing the basics well, reading aloud to your child, and then making sure they have plenty of time to play and explore their world.

 

TWTM model has kids these ages doing a full grammar program (e.g. fll), a history study (e.g.SOTW) and a full science study (e.g. RSO biology or Elemental Biology) in addition to learning all of these basics.   So time is much further divided among many subjects.  If you look at a standard school day that results in either a) longer days or b) less time spent on the basics.  

 

Which is better?  Well, I still don't know what I am going to do with my 4 year old!  :)   I think about it a lot actually! 

 

1  Grades 3-7:  At this point, it is assumed that the kids are reading, writing, and able to do math.   

A.   Kids will complete a western focused "classical study" each year as well as a modern/American study each year.  This will be studied in depth, facts will be reviewed and drilled for the hope of long-term mastery.   (Not just exposure, but mastery.)      

 

3rd-4th grade:  In-depth study of Greek Mythology (to prepare them for their ancient history studies and some of the literature choices scheduled in high school e.g. Dante, Shakespeare, and others.)  

5th Grade:  Famous Men of Rome

6th Grade:  Famous Men of Greece (Scheduled later because the topics are a bit more graphic than the Rome book.  This also corresponds to their introduction to learning the Greek langauge.)

7th Grade:  Famous Men of Middle Ages

 

In addition, since their main study is biographical in nature when they are younger, kids are supposed to read through (or listen) to SOTW 1-4 in their free time (or over the summer).  There is NOT an indepth study scheduled for these books.  They are read or listened to for enjoyment to give them context to the people they are studying about and exposure to other cultures.   However, the in depth study is definitely western focused.   

 

B.  Modern / American History:   Again, the topics are not taught with exposure in mind, but mastery.

Grades 3-6

At these early ages, geography is the focus and what is mastered.  That way kids have some context to the places mentioned in future history studies.   

 

Kids are also exposed to a lot of history through their independent "American Studies" reads and discussion with parents.    (These books are meant to be enjoyed.  They are not expected to master these topics yet.)   

 

Grade 7:

In depth study of American History.  At this point, American history is expected to be mastered.

 

C.  Timeline

They also complete timeline assignments where various events (in ancient and modern history) are memorized.   The idea here is to help kids organize all of the people and events they read about in their minds.    Parents read aloud a description of the event from the timeline text, kids make a journal page with art and written narration in their timeline composition book,  and then post the event to their own wall timeline.   Kids also have timeline flashcards to review these dates.  

 

Grades 8-12:

At this point, they make another sweep through both classical and modern history.   (Mostly western focused).   They read through and study history books written at a higher level.   However, their classical studies start to morph into literature with an in-depth study of the Illiad & Odyssey (8th grade), The Aeneid (9th grade), and various Greek Tragedies (10th grade).   

 

They do another sweep through Geography (a lot more like earth science instead just political boundaries), and another in-depth sweep through American History.

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is my long-winded answer to that question:

 

I decided that a big part of the "lure" of memoria press (for me) was that they put together a complete curriculum package for the year. And not just any curriculum package, but a beautifully rich classical education filled with truth, beauty, and goodness. A package that had been tried and tested with REAL kids, and yielded top-notch academic results. (Not just some theoretical plan someone put together on paper hoping it would work and not be "too much" or "too little".) I also wanted an education focused on depth with fewer (more important) subjects instead of a light overview of many subjects. (Multum non multua).

 

I had been trying to plan my own classical education for years. And homeschooling had sort of taken over my life. We had these very long school days trying to check all of the boxes off in TWTM. And I spent all of my spare time researching and planning and prepping. I decided that I wanted things to change. I wanted to put homeschooling back in its place. I wanted it to be a part of my life, not all consuming. I wanted time to still be a mom (not just magistra!); I wanted time to workout and plan healthy meals; I wanted time to explore hobbies.

 

SO--I made the decision that if I was going to buy a complete core, I was going to try to mess with it as little as possible. :) So I had to resist, resist, resist messing with the guide! That was really hard for me because I tweak everything---and I am always trying to make things "better" and chose the "best" curriculum out there...you know?

 

So, my answer to your question is....yes! We do all of the recitations as laid out in the guide. I feel like the recitations and drill questions are important, and one of the reasons kids retain so much using Memoria Press curriculum.

 

My kids have never complained about recitations or drill, but each child is different. Plus, each family is different! If my kids complained about drilling math facts or Latin conjugations or their history timeline, I would listen and try to make it as enjoyable as possible. However, sometimes, real learning/growth takes a lot of drill and practice. (Think of learning a musical instrument or doing reps with a weight to get stronger.) So I would try to be encouraging to my kids, but I wouldn't necessarily let them out of something IF I felt was good for them. And I do feel that the recitations and review are really important to mastering the material for the long term. (That is what I choose for my family. However, like I said, each family is different.)

 

Like I said, my kids have never batted an eye with the recitations. However, memory work and drill are nothing new to my kids. We did that before moving to Memoria Press. We drilled math facts, memorized poems, reviewed important historical dates, etc. etc.

 

Now, I tried to do what I could to make it less teacher intensive. I loaded the morning recitation questions and subject related flashcards into an electronic flashcard tool named ANKI. (It uses spaced repetion to help with memory.) I assign the kids 15 minutes (total) of independent review each day across all subjects. I did a little training with the kids so they can do this themselves. Then, I spot check them every now and then to make sure they are really reviewing on their own. ;)

 

 

 

Yes! We did run into this! When my kids were younger, we mostly followed TWTM. However, we often used Sonlight (and other HS companies) for ideas on our read alouds and readers. That meant that we were reading A LOT of books each year for our literature studies.

 

So, we had read many of the books scheduled in their literature packages. However, because we were reading SO MANY books, we never really went into much depth with these books. For example, my son just re-read Cricket in Times Square this year. He loved the book the first time he read it, but he never took the time to look up maps of New York City; look at pictures of times square and central station. Same thing with Homer Price. I had read that book aloud a few years ago. However, doing it again with the lit guide, I realized that there were a lot of ideas presented in the book that my kids didn't really grasp. For example, we wouldn't stop a chapter to watch a video on the first assembly line, etc. etc. I think this, for me, was an example of the concept of multum non multa. Reading a few books really slowly, sometimes even re-reading chapters twice, and taking the time to really explore all of the words, implied meanings, ideas, and references in a chapter. We still do just read a lot of books for enjoyment, but there is something to be said for reading a few books deeply each year.

Thank you so much for this amazing response. This was incredibly helpful.

 

We are a classical homeschool and like you used to, I put it all together. Partly, if I was honest, because I LOVE curriculum and find it satisfying to do so. Next year though we will have a busy schedule and there is this part of me that really wants to give up control a bit and try it.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wanted to say "Thank You!!" to Attached Mama for sharing all that detailed info about Memoria Press.  I am considering this for next year, and you're descriptions and experience were very helpful.  Thank you so much for taking the time to type all that out. 

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think because MP is tested with real kids, they have discovered that there IS limited time in the day. There is only so much time each day and so you have to be intentional in how you use it. Looking back, I spent a TON of time with my older kids in grades K-3 studying history. We read SOTW, made notebooks, mummified chickens, etc. etc. However, they didn't retain a whole lot from their studies. Sure, it created fun memories and hopefully an overall "good feeling" attached to history. But was ALL OF THE TIME worth it for something they have little memory of? I don't know. I still ask myself that question. :) Would they have been better off with more free time and a few carefully selected read alouds on the topic at night? Again, I don't know. :)

 

So here is the breakdown on MP history (as I see it):

 

1) Grade pre-k to 2nd: In these years, kids are spending the VAST majority of their time learning how to learn. Again, there is only a limited amount of hours in the day. The question is: how do we use them best? It is one thing to make a theoretical plan on paper saying that kids should learn to read well, learn to spell well, learn math well, learn to write well, learn history well, learn art well, learn science well, etc. etc. It is another thing to actually learn all of these things well with the time we are given. Right?

 

SO, MP's theory is that they are going to go hard and strong with the basics and everything else will be treated like icing on the cake. With MP, the vast majory of their school time in early elementary is spent learning phonics REALLY well, learning arithmetic REALLY well, learning proper penmanship REALLY well, etc. etc. They are working hard on the basics. That isn't to say they aren't studying history or science or art or music. However, those are done more casually through read alouds and enrichment. The emphasis is much more on doing the basics well, reading aloud to your child, and then making sure they have plenty of time to play and explore their world.

 

TWTM model has kids these ages doing a full grammar program (e.g. fll), a history study (e.g.SOTW) and a full science study (e.g. RSO biology or Elemental Biology) in addition to learning all of these basics. So time is much further divided among many subjects. If you look at a standard school day that results in either a) longer days or b) less time spent on the basics.

 

This is something I've been thinking about a lot recently too... I spent a lot of time on history and science with my oldest two kids, was it worth it? IDK... I know I'm not doing it with my younger two. :O

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

Yes!  We did run into this!   When my kids were younger, we mostly followed TWTM.  However, we often used Sonlight (and other HS companies) for ideas on our read alouds and readers.   That meant that we were reading A LOT of books each year for our literature studies.   

 

So, we had read many of the books scheduled in their literature packages.   However, because we were reading SO MANY books, we never really went into much depth with these books.   For example, my son just re-read Cricket in Times Square this year.   He loved the book the first time he read it, but he never took the time to look up maps of New York City; look at pictures of times square and central station.  Same thing with Homer Price.  I had read that book aloud a few years ago.  However, doing it again with the lit guide, I realized that there were a lot of ideas presented in the book that my kids didn't really grasp.  For example, we wouldn't stop a chapter to watch a video on the first assembly line, etc. etc.   I think this, for me, was an example of the concept of multum non multa.  Reading a few books really slowly, sometimes even re-reading chapters twice, and taking the time to really explore all of the words, implied meanings, ideas, and references in a chapter.   We still do just read a lot of books for enjoyment, but there is something to be said for reading a few books deeply each year.  

 

This is very helpful, thank you! Lots to think about - I'm looking at the MP package more closely. I appreciate what you're saying about reading deeply and think my girls would enjoy some of that, so even if we don't go 'full package', I might work in some of the guides. I do like how intertwined all of the subjects are... food for thought.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So much amazing info. Thank you all for responding! It’s really helping me clarify my plan for next year.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

However, if you are interested, here is how I *understand* the theory behind an MP education...

MP Is much closer to the "classical" education received by the likes of C.S. Lewis, Churchill, or Tolkien. It is much closer to an "Old Skool" classical education :) than our modern day take on things.

 

I think because MP is tested with real kids, they have discovered that there IS limited time in the day. There is only so much time each day and so you have to be intentional in how you use it. Looking back, I spent a TON of time with my older kids in grades K-3 studying history. We read SOTW, made notebooks, mummified chickens, etc. etc. However, they didn't retain a whole lot from their studies. Sure, it created fun memories and hopefully an overall "good feeling" attached to history. But was ALL OF THE TIME worth it for something they have little memory of? I don't know. I still ask myself that question. :) Would they have been better off with more free time and a few carefully selected read alouds on the topic at night? Again, I don't know. :)

 

So here is the breakdown on MP history (as I see it):

 

1) Grade pre-k to 2nd: In these years, kids are spending the VAST majority of their time learning how to learn. Again, there is only a limited amount of hours in the day. The question is: how do we use them best? It is one thing to make a theoretical plan on paper saying that kids should learn to read well, learn to spell well, learn math well, learn to write well, learn history well, learn art well, learn science well, etc. etc. It is another thing to actually learn all of these things well with the time we are given. Right?

 

SO, MP's theory is that they are going to go hard and strong with the basics and everything else will be treated like icing on the cake. With MP, the vast majory of their school time in early elementary is spent learning phonics REALLY well, learning arithmetic REALLY well, learning proper penmanship REALLY well, etc. etc. They are working hard on the basics. That isn't to say they aren't studying history or science or art or music. However, those are done more casually through read alouds and enrichment. The emphasis is much more on doing the basics well, reading aloud to your child, and then making sure they have plenty of time to play and explore their world.

 

TWTM model has kids these ages doing a full grammar program (e.g. fll), a history study (e.g.SOTW) and a full science study (e.g. RSO biology or Elemental Biology) in addition to learning all of these basics. So time is much further divided among many subjects. If you look at a standard school day that results in either a) longer days or b) less time spent on the basics.

 

Which is better? Well, I still don't know what I am going to do with my 4 year old! :) I think about it a lot actually!

 

1 Grades 3-7: At this point, it is assumed that the kids are reading, writing, and able to do math.

A. Kids will complete a western focused "classical study" each year as well as a modern/American study each year. This will be studied in depth, facts will be reviewed and drilled for the hope of long-term mastery. (Not just exposure, but mastery.)

 

3rd-4th grade: In-depth study of Greek Mythology (to prepare them for their ancient history studies and some of the literature choices scheduled in high school e.g. Dante, Shakespeare, and others.)

5th Grade: Famous Men of Rome

6th Grade: Famous Men of Greece (Scheduled later because the topics are a bit more graphic than the Rome book. This also corresponds to their introduction to learning the Greek langauge.)

7th Grade: Famous Men of Middle Ages

 

In addition, since their main study is biographical in nature when they are younger, kids are supposed to read through (or listen) to SOTW 1-4 in their free time (or over the summer). There is NOT an indepth study scheduled for these books. They are read or listened to for enjoyment to give them context to the people they are studying about and exposure to other cultures. However, the in depth study is definitely western focused.

 

B. Modern / American History: Again, the topics are not taught with exposure in mind, but mastery.

 

Grades 3-6

At these early ages, geography is the focus and what is mastered. That way kids have some context to the places mentioned in future history studies.

Kids are also exposed to a lot of history through their independent "American Studies" reads and discussion with parents. (These books are meant to be enjoyed. They are not expected to master these topics yet.)

Grade 7:

In depth study of American History. At this point, American history is expected to be mastered.

C. Timeline

They also complete timeline assignments where various events (in ancient and modern history) are memorized. The idea here is to help kids organize all of the people and events they read about in their minds. Parents read aloud a description of the event from the timeline text, kids make a journal page with art and written narration in their timeline composition book, and then post the event to their own wall timeline. Kids also have timeline flashcards to review these dates.

 

Grades 8-12:

At this point, they make another sweep through both classical and modern history. (Mostly western focused). They read through and study history books written at a higher level. However, their classical studies start to morph into literature with an in-depth study of the Illiad & Odyssey (8th grade), The Aeneid (9th grade), and various Greek Tragedies (10th grade).

 

They do another sweep through Geography (a lot more like earth science instead just political boundaries), and another in-depth sweep through American History.

This was really interesting. Is all this information on the site somewhere? I'm interested in reading up more about the way MP structures their course and the theory behind it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This was really interesting. Is all this information on the site somewhere? I'm interested in reading up more about the way MP structures their course and the theory behind it.

 

 

I'm sure the pp will have more info, but in the meantime, request a MP catalogue! They include great articles about their philosophy and products in each one. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We have used many MP products over the years.  I think the only one we didn't care for was their writing (Classical Compositions).  In all fairness, we've yet to find a writing program we like.   Sometimes I just buy their teacher guide and use it as a teaching/discussion guide.  This is usually what we do for the lit. guides.  This coming year we are using their Latin (Prima, First Form, and Henle) and their classical studies (Greek Myths for younger ones and Book of Ancient Greece/Iliad/Odyssey for my oldest two). 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This was really interesting. Is all this information on the site somewhere? I'm interested in reading up more about the way MP structures their course and the theory behind it.

yes, all of this is gleaned from their website, their curriculum packages, but most of all, their catalog.   They have a BUNCH of articles from past catalogs on their website.   

 

Edited by TheAttachedMama

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yes, all of this is gleaned from their website, their curriculum packages, but most of all, their catalog. They have a BUNCH of articles from past catalogs on their website.

Thankyou. I'll have a search and order their catalogue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Several of you have mentioned that MP’s format helped your children retain information...do you think writing the answers into the workbooks was an important part of that, or would it be okay to use them orally? (I am considering Traditional Logic for my oldest next year, but I know so much writing in a workbook will irk her).

I think you are ok to do it orally if you are only interested in using the course for the content of that particular course. In the classrooms, they do the questions out loud, then write down thorough, fully-formed sentences as answers. It’s part of developing fluency in writing. I think the good retention is from focusing on fewer items, but focusing more intently. They also include more review in the content areas than other publishers. Those cumulative reviews and quizzes make use of the spacing effect for better long-term retention. It gives a more solid “hook†on which to hang ancillary information gleaned through other reading or daily life.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’m making my lists for next school year and the catalogs are arriving. I’m drawn to some Memoria Press stuff because it seems clean, straightforward, easy to use, and reasonably priced. (Plus the covers are pretty!)

 

I’m tempted by Latin and logic and maybe some history and poetry resources.

 

I’ve never tried Memoria in the past because it seemed dry.

 

But I’ve been using some CAP stuff and some of it seems like busy work and I’m not loving Latin for Children.

 

We’re having a baby this summer so I need to plan school stuff now and I’d like stuff that is easy to use and fairly straightforward.

 

So tell me the pros and cons of Memoria stuff. Is this what I’m looking for in a few subjects?

 

I don’t think I want a full grade package because I’m happy with our science (BJU online) and some of our other subjects.

 

Why not use Memoria Press? Tell me what I need to know about their materials please!

 

Lexi, I'm always drawn in, too, but to my regret. Plain and simple, MP is boring. However...

 

We do use some of it. We use it for Geography I, but the textbook is so boring. So we add in other things to make it more interesting. We're still going to use it for Geography II next year, though, because it's a simple way to line up a "spine" for memorizing the countries and capitals, doing some map work, doing review, and taking quizzes. I print out "Big Maps" to go along with the continent we're working on, so that adds interest. And the girls are learning their geography.

 

http://www.yourchildlearns.com/megamaps.htm

 

We use MP for Poetry (Poetry for the Grammar Stage). This one is not too bad. We work through about two poems per month, and we'll finish up next year at that pace. I would have to say we've actually enjoyed this resource, so I suppose it isn't all regret with MP.

 

Latin, though... I have a ton of MP Latin in my basement. LOL. At night, I can hear the spiders conjugating. "Amo, amas, amat, amamus, amatis, amant."

 

MP Literature Guides -- Story Time Treasures was great for 1st grade, but otherwise, IMO, the guides are a waste of time, IMO.

 

I think that if you selectively use MP, it might be okay. HTH.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...