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Mrschrissy007

Please help 4th grade math curriculum

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have a question my daughter will be 9 in June and she is in 3rd grade , I have been doing Singapore Math 2A and she is struggling with the math concept of subtracting with boworring and I feel that I would like to change curriculums, as she is going to be in 4th grade and still hasn’t started multiplying . I need something that has lots of review , was engaging, colorful (but also not to important if it wasn’t colorful) most important that she would enjoy! We have tried math-u see and was just to 👎🽠We also did Saxon it wasn’t to bad but it was just a little to much ,and now we have added life of Fred apples as just something fun to do? I was wondering if anyone had any advice if possible which math you think might help her? I’m debating on these:

Saxon again( as it wasnt bad and does have a lot of review but don’t know if I should have her repeat 3rd grade math as I was told not to hold her back cause her reading and comprehension was already above grade level.

Horizons I was told was good as it had a lot of review

Abeka the same thing

Or if I just stick to Singapore ?

 

She is homeschooled and in the 3rd grade going into 4th.

 

Please any advice will be a blessing.

 

Christina

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What about Rightstart?

 

Or at the very least, a set of base 10 cards and some basic instruction with them in subtraction.

One of the points RS makes is that they do not use the term "borrowing".  It's confusing for students.  Instead, you trade.  So if you have 4712-3698, you build the 4712 with  base ten cards with two columns for each place value.  So you literally lay out 4 cards (2x2) with a picture of a thousand cube on them.  Then seven cards with hundred flats on them.  Then one card with a line of ten on it, then two cards with a single cube on each.  And there you have 4712 cubes laid out.

 

Then you start building the second number by taking *from* the first number.  So you have enough thousand cards to do it.  And enough hundreds cards.  Oh, but you don't have enough tens cards.  So you take one of your hundreds and trade it in to the pile for ten tens cards.  Lay them out, then take the nine of them that you need to build the second number.  And then your ones, oops, not enough of those either, so you trade in a ten and get ten ones.  It's extremely visual, extremely concrete, and blindingly obvious why you wind up with one less hundred and one less ten than you thought you were going to at the start.

 

Of course once you've done that a few times you don't bother with the cards any more, you do it on the abacus.  And once you've done that enough, you just do it on paper instead.

 

RS is not colourful though, at least not on the pages.  The manipulatives are colourful.

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Do you happen to use the home instructor guide with Singapore? I don't always either, but I think the guide recommends that you teach it as "regrouping" rather than"borrowing". There are some manipulative game ideas in the guide that might help. Regrouping made a lot more sense to my kid.

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I use Horizons but I use the place value discs from Singapore to demonstrate regrouping. You could use popsicle sticks or whatever. You really need the instructors guide from Singapore, or you could watch some education inboxed videos to see how to do it with cuisenaire rods. http://www.educationunboxed.com/addition-and-subtraction-to-100/ I drew out a chart with a place for ones, tens, hundreds, thousands and had my kids physically move the manipulatives from place to place so they could really see how it works. It clarified things immensely for me too-- I was taught to memorize the algorithm :) Like you I did various different curricula when my oldest was young but found what works for us now. You really need to use the IG for Singapore. Otherwise it's just another workbook.

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That is a challenging concept! Like others, I'm not sure that a change of curriculum is what you need.

 

Can you talk about the ways you've tried to approach the subtraction algorithm so far? Does she have a firm understanding of place value? Maybe we can help you get over this hump. Stick around and feel free to go into detail as many of us LOVE talking about teaching and learning math.

 

Kids who are behind in math can catch up, but moving a kid ahead despite not understanding key concepts is really a huge waste of time-- theirs and yours. If your child doesn't fully understand place value and regrouping, that's going to really hinder her ability to progress in general. It's why when we hit a wall like this my urge is always to look back and see what we've missed rather than anxiously look ahead to what we're not getting to. A rock solid foundation will help her progress faster later on. Sure, if you need a break and she's extremely frustrated, work on single-digit multiplication for a change, and come back to this, but the levels of math as tied to specific ages and grades are artificial and worth ignoring a little in favor of attending to your child's learning.

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have a question my daughter will be 9 in June and she is in 3rd grade , I have been doing Singapore Math 2A and she is struggling with the math concept of subtracting with boworring and I feel that I would like to change curriculums, as she is going to be in 4th grade and still hasn’t started multiplying . I need something that has lots of review , was engaging, colorful (but also not to important if it wasn’t colorful) most important that she would enjoy! We have tried math-u see and was just to 👎🽠We also did Saxon it wasn’t to bad but it was just a little to much ,and now we have added life of Fred apples as just something fun to do? I was wondering if anyone had any advice if possible which math you think might help her? I’m debating on these:

Saxon again( as it wasnt bad and does have a lot of review but don’t know if I should have her repeat 3rd grade math as I was told not to hold her back cause her reading and comprehension was already above grade level.

Horizons I was told was good as it had a lot of review

Abeka the same thing

Or if I just stick to Singapore ?

 

She is homeschooled and in the 3rd grade going into 4th.

 

Please any advice will be a blessing.

 

Christina

 

Repeating a specific subject is not the same thing as "holding her back." Of course she would still be "4th grade." And the next year she would be "5th grade." And so on.

 

Historically, in the one-room schools, children were grouped according to ability for each subject. A child might be 7th grade reading and 2nd grade math, even if she were in 3rd grade. Homeschooling is the ultimate one-room school. :-) You can have your child do whatever she is able to do and still call her [insert grade level here]. Grade level has no real significance; it is only a way for textbook publishes and classroom teachers to group children of approximate age and ability. Homeschooled children aren't really in grades. They are learning. We only need to know their "grade level" so we can tell their grandparents and Sunday school teachers and random people who don't know how to relate to children by age instead of grade level. :-)

 

I don't know if you should continue with Singapore or go back to Saxon. Personally, neither one appeals to me (although I do like Saxon beginning with Math 54). I'm more of a traditional math person: Rod and Staff Publishers is my favorite. If *you* really like Saxon or Singapore, then stick with it, and make sure you're using all the tools that come with it (teacher notes, manipulatives, whatever).

 

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I am also wondering whether you use the instructor guide and manipulatives when introducing concepts.

 

With one of my children, we worked those sorts of problems with base-10 blocks many, many times before they got it and could reliably do it on paper.

 

We use Singapore Standards edition which has more built-in review than the US Edition, and Extra Practice books available if needed. I don’t know about review with other Singapore editions. One thing I have found is that if a child is absolutely stuck on something, sometimes it helps to move on to the next unrelated topic in the book, and just keep practicing a few problems in the difficult topic, but together, each day.

 

Be careful about switching math too often through elementary. Sometimes a switch absolutely makes for a better education and experience for a child, but you will also sometimes hear people say that they regret switching math and trying too many different programs.

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What was her problem with MUS? That would be your normal recommendation for hands-on, showing the concepts, being able to move the concepts. 

 

You might have more going on. She could have an SLD or some sequencing or attention issues. She's struggling enough that you are probably going to want to consider evals pretty soon. Has anyone bio to her struggled with math or school work? What was the explanation for their difficulty? 

 

In general, I would go back to MUS, use the placement test to make sure you're at the right level, and figure out what's going on. The ps can do evals on her for FREE. You make a written request, sign and date it, keep a copy for your records. Federal right to evals through them. 

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