How to cite a poem (by different author) within a short story using MLA format?

[Pegasus]

Not finding a good description online how to cite a real poem by a different author that is used in a fictional short story.  Supposed to follow MLA format.

 

Any ideas or sources for clear directions?

 

Thanks!

[Lori D.]

I assume you mean for both in-text (parenthetical) citation and for full citation in the Works Cited page at the end of the paper?

 

Need more details. How exactly will the poem be used/referenced in the paper?

 

Is it in the larger context of quoting or referencing a passage in the short story, which contains the poem? Or will *only* the poem be referenced or quoted?

 

Is the *poem* the focus of what is being discussed at that point in the paper -- or is it the short story that happens to have the poem in that section that is being discussed at that point?

Edited January 29, 2018 by Lori D.

[katilac]

"A title is italicized if the source is self-contained and independent. Use quotation marks for a short story/essay/poem from an anthology/collection; episodes of television series; song titles; articles from journals; and a posting/article from a Web site."

 

from https://www.ivcc.edu/stylebooks/stylebook4.aspx?id=14718

[Pegasus]

1. I assume you mean for both in-text (parenthetical) citation and for full citation in the Works Cited page at the end of the paper?

 

2. Need more details. How exactly will the poem be used/referenced in the paper?

 

3. Is it in the larger context of quoting or referencing a passage in the short story, which contains the poem? Or will *only* the poem be referenced or quoted?

 

4. Is the *poem* the focus of what is being discussed at that point in the paper -- or is it the short story that happens to have the poem in that section that is being discussed at that point?

 

1. Mainly needing the in-text (parenthetical) citation unless I'm mistaken about simply including only the short story in the Works Cited.

 

2&3. The poem is "There will come soft rains" by Sara Teasdale  which appears in full in Ray Bradbury's short story by the same name.  Several lines of the poem are being quoted in an essay using a blocked quote format in a paragraph discussing the similarities and differences between the poem's meaning and the short story itself.

 

4. The essay is on the short story but at this point in the paper, it is focused on the poem.

 

Thank you!

[Pegasus]

"A title is italicized if the source is self-contained and independent. Use quotation marks for a short story/essay/poem from an anthology/collection; episodes of television series; song titles; articles from journals; and a posting/article from a Web site."

 

from https://www.ivcc.edu/stylebooks/stylebook4.aspx?id=14718

 

Thank you for the link.  I've been able to find similar guidance but they all seem to be referring to collections/anthologies.  I'd be all set if the poem was in a collection of poems and short stories. My situation is a poem that appears within a short story of a different author.

[katilac]

I want to say that the poem will just be cited as would any other reference work used in writing the paper, but definitely don't go by that. It's time to ask the teacher! 

[Lori D.]

1. Mainly needing the in-text (parenthetical) citation unless I'm mistaken about simply including only the short story in the Works Cited.

 

2&3. The poem is "There will come soft rains" by Sara Teasdale  which appears in full in Ray Bradbury's short story by the same name.  Several lines of the poem are being quoted in an essay using a blocked quote format in a paragraph discussing the similarities and differences between the poem's meaning and the short story itself.

 

4. The essay is on the short story but at this point in the paper, it is focused on the poem.

 

Thank you!

 

NOT an expert here, but here's what I would do... Since the poem is integrated fully into the short story (and not from a separate source):

 

1. For the Works Cited page, you only need the full citation for the source of the short story.

 

2. For the short story in-text citations, use the usual MLA format as usual -- author last name and page number(s). Example:  (Bradbury 96)

 

3. For the block quote format, count the lines of the poem and in parenthesis at the end of the last line, indicated which lines were quoted. Also, because you will be discussing two authors and two, include the poet's last name  Example: the Teasdale poem is 12 lines long, and if just block quoting lines 6-10, then it would look like this:

 

     Robins will wear their feathery fire 

     Whistling their whims on a low fence-wire;

 

     And not one will know of the war, not one

     Will care at last when it is done.

 

     Not one would mind, neither bird nor tree

     mankind perished utterly; (Teasdale 6-10)

 

For clarity, I would make sure to introduce the block quotation as being selected lines "from the 12-line poem", so that you are making it clear to the reader that when citing the poem you are talking about LINE numbers, which will be different from the short story in-text citations which will be PAGE numbers.

 

3. In-text citations:

 

- For the poem, after the block quotation, as you discuss specific parts of the poem, use the poem's line numbers (which you have made clear from the block quotation) for the in-text citation. Example: The fire that consumes the house at the end of the story is foreshadowed by the poem's image of robins that "will wear their feathery fire" (Teasdale 6)

 

- For the short story, use the page number in parenthesis. Example:  (Bradbury 96)

 

- Follow the usual MLA rules for including/not including author names in the in-text citations when you have two or more authors being quoted/referenced. The rule is that for each new mention of an author, include the author's last name and the page or line number; after that just use the page or line numbers in parenthesis, until you switch to the other author, and repeat (first new mention is both author name and page or line number, then just the page or line number for subsequent in-text citations, until you switch to talking about the first author again).

 

Here are the two pages at OWL at Purdue: in-text citation basics, and in-text citations of quotation, block quotations, etc. The very last example on that page may be of interest, as it shows how to block quote a poem if using selected lines and dropping out several lines in between, in case the block quotation of the poem is not all contiguous lines. Example:

 

     There will come soft rains and the smell of the ground, 

      . . . . . . . . .

 

     Robins will wear their feathery fire 

     Whistling their whims on a low fence-wire;

 

     And not one will know of the war, not one

     Will care at last when it is done.

 

     Not one would mind, neither bird nor tree

     mankind perished utterly; (Teasdale 1, 6-10)

 

 

The main point of formatting is clarity and consistency. You can't always find a "rule" that fits every single situation, so when in doubt, follow what rules are closest to your situation, and then be consistent and clear. :) Good luck! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited January 29, 2018 by Lori D.

[Mom22ns]

I would refer you to this explanation of how to cite a secondary source: http://libguides.murdoch.edu.au/mla/secondary

 

Basically it comes down to using "qtd. in" at the beginning of your in-text citation. (qtd in author page#)

 

There is no special treatment needed on the works cited page.

[Lori D.]

I would refer you to this explanation of how to cite a secondary source: http://libguides.murdoch.edu.au/mla/secondary

 

Basically it comes down to using "qtd. in" at the beginning of your in-text citation. (qtd in author page#)

 

There is no special treatment needed on the works cited page.

 

So appreciate you linking this. :)

 

The only issue I see with using this formatting is that you don't get the extra help of the in-text citation in keeping the two different authors straight, and you don't get the extra help of referring to the poem lines in the in-text citations to help make it clear:

 

- no author and only page number: (qtd in Bradbury 96)

- vs. second author and specific poem line reference: (Teasdale 6-10)

 

(Having edited all of DH's papers on books of poetry and individual poems for his Master's in creative writing, I can tell you first-hand that having line number references makes talking about poems SO much clearer and more specific, rather than having to rely on page numbers! ;) )

 

BEST of luck, whatever you decide, original poster! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited January 30, 2018 by Lori D.

[Mom22ns]

So appreciate you linking this. :)

 

The only issue I see with using this formatting is that you don't get the extra help of the in-text citation in keeping the two different authors straight, and you don't get the extra help of referring to the poem lines in the in-text citations to help make it clear:

 

- no author and only page number: (qtd in Bradbury 96)

- vs. second author and specific poem line reference: (Teasdale 6-10)

 

(Having edited all of DH's papers on books of poetry and individual poems for his Master's in creative writing, I can tell you first-hand that having line number references makes talking about poems SO much clearer and more specific, rather than having to rely on page numbers! ;) )

 

BEST of luck, whatever you decide, original poster! Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

Lori,

If they have access to the original poem, I would completely agree that it should be cited on its own. However, if they only have it as a secondary source, the above is the correct citation method.

 

Having tutored college level writing for a couple of years and currently working on my MA in English lit leaves me pretty comfortable with this too :)

[Lori D.]

Lori,

If they have access to the original poem, I would completely agree that it should be cited on its own. However, if they only have it as a secondary source, the above is the correct citation method.

 

Having tutored college level writing for a couple of years and currently working on my MA in English lit leaves me pretty comfortable with this too :)

 

Agree. And you're probably right. I just don't like it. :laugh:  (The method, not you, or your wisdom. Which I like a lot.  :) ) 

 

Using the "quoted" citation means that you have to write all that info out in the text of the paper, every single time you are referencing the poem, because the citation you're required to use is only letting the reader know that Bradbury himself quoted the poem.  :( It doesn't allow the citation to streamline the writing by making it clear that the quotation or reference is naming the author AND clarifing the specific line(s) in the poem being discussed, as with: (Teasdale 6) -- 

 

In other words, I find this example, using the "quoted" style of citation to be much less elegant and clear, and much more cumbersome:

The fire that consumes the house at the end of Bradbury's short story is foreshadowed in his use of Teasdale's poem, specifically in the poem's line 6 image of robins that "will wear their feathery fire" (qtd Bradbury 96).

 

than this example, which cites the second author and specific spot referenced:

The fire that consumes the house at the end of the short story (Bradbury 98) is foreshadowed by the poem's image of robins that "will wear their feathery fire" (Teasdale 6).

 

Totally not arguing with you, Momto2Ns. Just venting annoyance at an imprecision in the system. LOL! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited January 30, 2018 by Lori D.

[Pegasus]

Awesome!  Love it when a subject sparks a genuine good-natured debate.  Sincerely appreciate everyone's input and guidance.