Two questions about moving to Canada or UK

[ktgrok]

1. I see different lists of jobs that are prioritized on different websites. My husband is in cyber security. Some list that, some don't...anyway to really find out the deal here?

It IS listed on this list for the UK, but is this a legit up to date list? http://www.workpermit.com/immigration/united-kingdom/uk-tier-2-shortage-occupation-list#uk

 

 

2. If we managed to get him approved to move there and work, I know that dependents get to go, so me and the littles. But..what about our 18 year old? If he's a student does he count as a dependent?

Edited October 3, 2017 by ktgrok

[Guest]

Bumping for more visibility for the more knowledgable.The EEAA family permit says:

 

Family members covered by this visa include married and civil partners, unmarried partners, children, grandchildren, and dependent parents and grandparents.

so I certainly think so. Your 18 year old isn't financially independent yet, is he?

[Arcadia]

From Canada’s official website http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/sponsor/aod-tool.asp

 

“Canada’s definition of a dependent child, for the purposes of Immigration, has changed. As of August 1, 2014, only children under 19 years of age are eligible as dependants. The former definition allowed children under 22 years of age to be eligible as dependants.

 

The new definition applies to immigration applications received on or after August 1, 2014.

 

Full-time students, 19 years of age or older, are no longer considered dependants.

 

Applicants 19 years of age or older can apply to come to Canada as foreign students or through other immigration programs.â€

Edited October 3, 2017 by Arcadia

[ktgrok]

Bumping for more visibility for the more knowledgable. The EEAA family permit says:

 

so I certainly think so. Your 18 year old isn't financially independent yet, is he?

 

 

No, lol. He can barely manage to remember to brush his teeth on his own. 

[ktgrok]

Well hell. So if we want to do this as an entire family, it has to be in the next year. Not even sure that is feasible. That adds a wrinkle. 

From Canada’s official website http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/sponsor/aod-tool.asp

“Canada’s definition of a dependent child, for the purposes of Immigration, has changed. As of August 1, 2014, only children under 19 years of age are eligible as dependants. The former definition allowed children under 22 years of age to be eligible as dependants.

The new definition applies to immigration applications received on or after August 1, 2014.

Full-time students, 19 years of age or older, are no longer considered dependants.

Applicants 19 years of age or older can apply to come to Canada as foreign students or through other immigration programs.â€

 

[FaithManor]

Well, if you could make the move to Canada and get him enrolled in a college there then I would think that after the age of nineteen he could apply for a student visa.

[ktgrok]

This brings up, how hard is it for a student to get a student visa, I wonder?

[MEmama]

Well hell. So if we want to do this as an entire family, it has to be in the next year. Not even sure that is feasible. That adds a wrinkle.

I'm sure you are aware that the process itself can take well over a year, even with a job. Not to discourage you at all, but it isn't exactly simple or quick.

[MEmama]

Well, if you could make the move to Canada and get him enrolled in a college there then I would think that after the age of nineteen he could apply for a student visa.

Some visas require that you apply from outside the country (for example, permanent residency). I don't know if it's true for a student visa but it would be something to research.

 

Also, spouses aren't always to work if you are there on a work visa for your husband's job. Again, I don't recall the specifics but it's worth looking into carefully so you don't get surprised.

[MEmama]

This brings up, how hard is it for a student to get a student visa, I wonder?

Several Canadian universities recruit high school students in our area. I'm sure you can contact his university of choice for information. It's definitely do-able, but you'll want to be careful that the requirements work with your immigration status.

[Arcadia]

This brings up, how hard is it for a student to get a student visa, I wonder?

When we asked the visitor center of the Canadian universities while on vacation there, it was get an acceptance first then apply for student permit and it has to be clear that you don’t have intention of migrating (as in you are using the college route with the intention of becoming a permanent resident).

 

I don’t know how much is sufficient funds because all my friends who went to UBC or U of Toronto had enough in the bank to full pay all the years of their Bachelors at one shot (more than $200k) in a bank account.

 

Below is the instructions from U of Waterloo which we toured and is in our potential college list.

 

“The following are required for you to apply for a study permit:

 

A valid passport from your government. It is advisable to get a passport that is valid for the entire duration of your study in Canada, if possible. If you require a Temporary Resident Visa (TRV) to enter Canada, the visa office will need your original passport during the application process.

 

Your official Letter of Acceptance from the University of Waterloo.

 

Evidence of sufficient funds. You must provide proof that you have enough money to cover your tuition and living expenses for you and your accompanying dependants (ie. a spouse/common-law partner and/or children).

 

In addition to the above requirements, you will also need additional supporting documents for your application. This could include a medical exam by an IRCC approved doctor.â€

https://uwaterloo.ca/international-students/study-permit

Edited October 3, 2017 by Arcadia

[Guest]

 

No, lol. He can barely manage to remember to brush his teeth on his own. 

 

 

Normal. He'll be your best buddy and your hero by the time he's thirty. It used to drive me nuts when people said that to me when I had 18 year olds but it turned out to be true so I'll just share the misery, whack you with my cane, and remind you to pay it forward when the time comes. ;)

[Twolittleboys]

Depending on your plans for your 18 year old is (or his own) you might also check about university entrance requirements in the countries you are looking at. They can vary quite a lot. In some cases it may be best for the young adult to stay behind in the country of origin and finish their education there.

[Guest]

 

This brings up, how hard is it for a student to get a student visa, I wonder?

 

 

I'm sure it's worse now than during the GWB years. We wanted to get dd out of the US then and thought we could just because "Love it or leave it!" "Move to Canada, hippie!" memes and trolling--not saying that there wasn't any of this during the Obama years because I wasn't part of that scene then.

 

It turned out to be impossible for our unique circumstances. I clicked because I thought that was what you were talking about and wanted to save you the heartbreak.

 

There's more to the internet than predominantly US and UK based websites, though. My little travels the world with his mind.

[ktgrok]

I'm sure you are aware that the process itself can take well over a year, even with a job. Not to discourage you at all, but it isn't exactly simple or quick.

yup. Thats what I meant by not feasible.

 

If he attended school in the states, he could still come stay with us on breaks I'd think? But not work.

[Happy2BaMom]

I highly recommend, if you are looking to leave the U.S., to check out Tim Leffel's blog & his book "A Better Life for Half the Price" (sorry, running short on time otherwise would link). There are many, many more countries that are cheaper & easier to get into than Canada or the U.K. Work for your husband may be an issue in some, or language barriers, but I've been surprised just how many good options there are out there, including places with excellent medical care & schools. Or perhaps your husbanc could work virtually - worth checking out.

 

Hubby & I are deep into looking at leaving U.S. as well right now. I no longer am interested in arguing gun control (it will never happen in this country anyway....never. Just MHO, am not seeking to start a debate & won't respond accordingly) and I'm not comfortable adopting the philosophy that "statistics tell me it is highly probably that it won't be me or my children, just other people".

 

I will tell you that Canadian universities tend to be ~1/2 the cost of most U.S. based universities, some of them are world class, and many welcome U.S. students, so if you end up in Canada your child could probably easily attend school there. 

[Twolittleboys]

Yes, you might look into some other countries that could work (though depending on distance it might be more difficult for your oldest if he can't move with you). It isn't easy but I know a couple of people from the US who have moved to Europe. 

[Guest]

Don't dismiss Mexico--that's where my kid's online tutor lives and there is so much misinformation about it embedded into US culture wars culture. Our friend sent us some pictures of his apartment and his doctor's office and it looks really nice, not like some war torn third world country we need a wall for.

 

Don't judge the whole country on the border towns. Yea, I've been there too and wanted to rescue/kidnap just one little kid who asked, "One penny, mister!" when I was young and stupid and didn't think I was homeless because I lived in a campground, lol.

 

My "second mother" lived in Vera Cruz. She got medical care for stomach cancer there after the US doctors pretty much told her to get her affairs in order and make peace with her maker. She came back because she had a son in the US, but only had glowing things to say about the place and the people.

 

Brazil is in political turmoil right now. Don't just don't just don't.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Guest

[Lanny]

I know a family (from TX) who lived in the UK for the past 6 years. Approximately 3 weeks ago, they moved to the EU.  He was transferred from TX to the UK for his job.  I am certain his company paid for the Attorneys who did the work to obtain their Visas. At that time, they had 3 children under the age of 18. I am almost positive their eldest child is now over 18.  I remember that the paperwork was *extremely* invasive when they applied for their visas.  They were very happy living in the UK.

 

I do not have the answer to your question about a family member over the age of 18 being able to get a visa to live there, along with the rest of the family. That's a good question to ask...

 

GOOD LUCK!

[Happy2BaMom]

Cheapestdestinationsblog.com. It's a lot of travel stuff, but there is expat info in the archives and his book is largely focused on expating. 

 

He also recommends Mexico, and has lived there for nearly 5 years. There are many peaceful, quiet parts and healthcare is excellent and affordable.

[ktgrok]

I'd probably love Mexico. I like warm weather,  have a bit of spanish that is rusty, and I'm good with languages. (I have come to realize this is because my hearing sucks, so I'm used to guessing meaning by context, a skill that helps with foreign language.) My husband sucks at foreign language learning. He's really really bad. And he hates the heat. So...probably not an option. 

[Lanny]

Some visas require that you apply from outside the country (for example, permanent residency). I don't know if it's true for a student visa but it would be something to research.

 

Also, spouses aren't always to work if you are there on a work visa for your husband's job. Again, I don't recall the specifics but it's worth looking into carefully so you don't get surprised.

 

I was writing a reply to this and we had a momentary power failure (Lightning around us) and I discovered the battery in the UPS serving our LAN needs to be replaced.  I'll try again...

 

2 good points in the quoted post.  First of all, one should ALWAYS apply for a Visa from another country. Not after one has arrived in the destination country. That can get extremely dicey.

 

Secondly, the family we know that just moved from the UK after 6 years, I am not sure if the Wife could have worked, because she is a SAHM. However, after their oldest child graduated from High School, I know that she had a part-time job.

 

Additionally, we know a family that is currently in the USA for one year. He is on a Diplomatic VIsa. His wife CANNOT work in the USA.

[Lanny]

If you do this, get the employer to pay for all of the legal fees and visa fees and fees for accountants to do your Tax Returns  in the country you end up in (Possibly the UK or Canada) and the U.S. tax return.  The USA is one of 2 countries in the world that taxes citizens on worldwide income. The other country is a country in Africa. I forget which country.

 

Also, it can be very difficult for U.S. Citizens who are Overseas, to open and maintain a bank account with a bank overseas, because of the ramifications that has for them with the U.S. authorities. It can also be very difficult to open or maintain a bank account in the USA, for the same reasons, but the ACA (see below) now has a deal with the State Department FCU that their members can take advantage of.

 

If you are at all interested in this, I would suggest spending some time on the ACA (American Citizens Abroad) web site and paying for a membership. Lots of very knowledgeable people there.  https://www.americansabroad.org/  As you can see from their Home Page, they are actively working, trying to get the USA to go to Residence Based Taxation.

 

Back in the day, I remember getting a phone call from a job shop in Paris. The contract assignment was in the South of France. In the end, the client corporation couldn't get Security Clearances for Foreigners. I understand that. I'm sure DoD wouldn't allow that except under highly unusual circumstances.

 

And I went to FL to interview with a German company for a temporary job assignment there, but during the interview I discovered it was much more short-term than I was willing to accept, for tax reasons.  I think the I.R.S. rule is that one needs to be working overseas for 18 months, before qualifying for the Foreign Earned Income Exclusion.    So, I lost interest in that assignment, during the interview.

 

Australia might be another possibility for the OP and her family, since her DH isn't into foreign languages.

 

If he knew Spanish, there are probably a lot of corporations in South Florida that would be interested in him, because of their clients in Latin America.  

[Lanny]

OH... OP.   Check out the jobs with various U.S. Government departments and agencies.  You would need to pay U.S. Income Tax, but you could see the world...

[Guest]

Lanny, I've been kind of surprised at what a valuable currency English is. Maybe that would be a job possibility for the OP's husband?

 

We trade English lessons/practice for the tutoring. Our friend wants to speak English like a native and just needs a native speaker to practice with. A nine year old chatterbox must be good enough, because the guy has the patience of a saint and ds actually listens to him about tech/netiquette stuff that would just be ignored if it came from me.

 

Again, just a thought and just armchair quarterbacking; not in the cards for me and mine but it sure sounds like it could be for the OP.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Guest

[Audrey]

I hate to be a party-pooper, but it's highly unlikely that your 18yo will be able to get a student visa if the rest of the family is applying for entry as well.  It's most likely that they'll flag his application as a fraud risk.  You aren't supposed to be applying for a student visa as a means of gaining permanent entry into the country.  He will have to give your names as parents, and they will cross-check you.  Once they find that you're applying for a work visa and visitor or permanent resident status, he'll likely be invalidated for the student visa. 

[Audrey]

yup. Thats what I meant by not feasible.

 

If he attended school in the states, he could still come stay with us on breaks I'd think? But not work.

 

Yes, of course he can visit sans visa as long as he visits for less than 6 months in a 12 month period. For more than that, he'd have to get a visitor visa. 

[Guest]

I can't "like" your other post, Audrey, but I do want to thank you for taking the time to answer the OP's question and wording it the way you did.

 

I'm probably the reason all y'all want to build that wall.

 

Oh yea, that's not you, that's us.

 

< cringe >

Edited October 4, 2017 by Guest

[hornblower]

I hate to be a party-pooper, but it's highly unlikely that your 18yo will be able to get a student visa if the rest of the family is applying for entry as well.  It's most likely that they'll flag his application as a fraud risk.  You aren't supposed to be applying for a student visa as a means of gaining permanent entry into the country.  He will have to give your names as parents, and they will cross-check you.  Once they find that you're applying for a work visa and visitor or permanent resident status, he'll likely be invalidated for the student visa. 

 

 

So.... I used to work at CIC and I'd say this is not quite accurate. I wouldn't flag it. 

 

People have immigrated and then their adult children come to study at university here. It's not really a flag for anything. The adult child who is on the student authorization has to qualify on their own merits but they're treated as an adult - so long as they have funds to support themselves, it's fine but after their schooling is over, they have to leave. 

Of course the adult kids later can apply for work authorizations or to immigrate on their own as well, or for more student authorizations to study in grad school.  

 

Once they're no longer a dependent and not eligible to immigrate with you, they're just judged on their own application. 

 

 

Edited October 4, 2017 by hornblower

[Rosie_0801]

Australia might be another possibility for the OP and her family, since her DH isn't into foreign languages.

 

I wouldn't recommend it.

[hornblower]

I wouldn't recommend it.

What do you think about New Zealand? 

[Rosie_0801]

What do you think about New Zealand? 

 

You're better off asking the New Zealanders that. :)

[creekland]

Hubby's still trying to talk me into living aboard a sailboat and seeing multiple countries while he continues his own job working remotely most of the time.  Doing cyber security, my oldest son can (and does) work remotely.  He only needs to go into the office about once per quarter if I recall correctly.  Is that an option for you?

 

After many of our top choice Caribbean Islands got devastated, it's getting pretty tempting.  When one works remotely, they can work from anywhere.  Otherwise, getting work visas is pretty darn difficult in many countries (since we're so tough on workers coming here - they return the favor).

[Twolittleboys]

It might be best to start your search from the other side i.e. by looking at possible job opportunities for your husband. Most/many countries allow some sort of at least temporary visa if you have a job offer in a professional field. So I would look at either large multi-national corporations or bigger overseas companies to get an idea where he might get hired. Employers will generally help with getting the visa in that case.

[Melissa in Australia]

Regarding moving to Australia. It took dh 3 years to get his residency visa before coming here. It is faster if a company is sponsoring you over. Australian universities are very welcoming of international students. It is a big money maker for them. I would think it would be way easier for your son to get a study visa than the rest of you to get a residency visa

[Melissa in Australia]

There are, of course the one year work/ travel visas that are easy to get.

[Guest]

Melissa (or any random Aussie) what do you pay for rent/mortgage? I pay $1,000 USD every month for a mumble mumble bedroom on half of a lot with a back yard for my container garden and maybe a couple of chairs and a table if I was into patio furniture and a wading pool if I had a toddler. My neighbour has to go through my yard to get to his mailbox and he (actually the people who lived there before he moved in) used to have to go into my house to use the laundry room before the landlord added one to their house.

 

I think the OP might find housing costs a useful piece of information about Australia based on armchair travelling.

 

I think that she is accustomed to a larger home than I am in a different sort of neighbourhood.

Edited October 4, 2017 by Guest

[Rosie_0801]

Melissa (or any random Aussie) what do you pay for rent/mortgage?

 

It depends heavily on where you live. Unfortunately, the OP's hubby's line of work would almost certainly require choosing between outrageously high rental prices, or high rental prices plus a long commute. It would suck to be stuck in a foreign country with a bunch of kids and a husband who isn't around to help out.

 

If she wants to play "let's pretend to move to Australia" http://www.seek.com.au and http://www.realestate.com.au

[Melissa in Australia]

I am 400 km from a capital city. Rent in my very remote area would be from $190 per week up. BUT my son who lives in Melbourne is paying over $200 per week JUST FOR A BEDROOM in a share house full of uni students. I have no idea how much the rent would be in a city for a house

[ktgrok]

Australia is just too far away from family to be feasible. (there's that word again!)  We'd need to be somewhere where it wasn't a huge deal to hop on a plane to visit family. Plus, I think it would be very difficult to bring our pets to Australia. 

 

As for living....we are currently in a 1,400 sq foot (no basement or attic) house with the 6 of us. We do have a yard but don't use it much because the kids say it is "creepy" with "too many bugs". Yeah....Florida is buggy. I grew up in smaller and with fewer amenities, including living for many years with no air conditioning....in florida. So I'm not too hard to please. 

 

As for never having husband home because of long commutes, yeah....that's normal...he's gone a lot already. Left yesterday at 8:30 am and got home around 11pm. Every other month he teaches at a local private college, night classes, so yeah. Plus professional get togethers, etc....it's rare he's home two evenings in a row. 

 

But I talked to him last night and he's fairly happy I think at his current job....so looks like this is going to get shelve again for now. He had been frustrated with it but sees some possibilities on the horizon that are keeping him there for now..possibly moving into a management role. Of course it helps that today he got to try to break into the building to test some security features, and he always likes that stuff :)

[Lanny]

Lanny, I've been kind of surprised at what a valuable currency English is. Maybe that would be a job possibility for the OP's husband?

 

We trade English lessons/practice for the tutoring. Our friend wants to speak English like a native and just needs a native speaker to practice with. A nine year old chatterbox must be good enough, because the guy has the patience of a saint and ds actually listens to him about tech/netiquette stuff that would just be ignored if it came from me.

 

Again, just a thought and just armchair quarterbacking; not in the cards for me and mine but it sure sounds like it could be for the OP.

 

That would depend upon the pay. I believe here in Colombia, English teachers in the many private language schools receive very low pay.  My wife attended several courses in one of those, many years ago, and that's the only one she had first hand experience with, so we recommend that one if people ask.

 

Another option, for someone who has credentials (Bachelors minimum in Education, plus working experience as an Educator) would be to teach in an overseas school that is accredited in the USA.  DD attended one of those when she was very young, for 3  school years, until our income dropped a lot. I don't think they make a lot of money, but more than in a private language school.

 

With Software, almost anywhere in the world, it is written in English. Possibly bad English, but in English, so English is the common denominator for computer people.   Her DH could probably do well in other non-English-speaking-countries, such as Germany.  Lots of people in Europe speak English. 

 

Many people overseas speak English. Some of them speak excellent English, some speak horrible English, but it is the universal language now and often one can communicate in English.

[Lanny]

Hubby's still trying to talk me into living aboard a sailboat and seeing multiple countries while he continues his own job working remotely most of the time.  Doing cyber security, my oldest son can (and does) work remotely.  He only needs to go into the office about once per quarter if I recall correctly.  Is that an option for you?

 

After many of our top choice Caribbean Islands got devastated, it's getting pretty tempting.  When one works remotely, they can work from anywhere.  Otherwise, getting work visas is pretty darn difficult in many countries (since we're so tough on workers coming here - they return the favor).

 

Interesting that your oldest son is doing Cyber Security, because I think that's what the DH of the OP does. If your DH had some kind of Satellite Internet connection on the Sailboat, then he could Telecommute...   I   don't have any recent working experience, but if some client needs experience I have, and would let me Telecommute, we have 50 Mbps FTTH service in the house and I'm available. 

 

I think you might find that many countries are tougher on people getting work visas than the USA is.  The USA has H1B visas, which many corporations in the USA abuse and they hire people from overseas and not U.S. Citizens, to reduce their overhead. I think the government may cut down on that.  I think the UK and Canada, for example may be pretty tough regarding visas.

 

Although I did have interest in temporary job assignments in Germany and France years ago, when I was contacted about those, when there were things in Canada, the legal ramifications seemed very hostile and I don't think I ever permitted my resume to be submitted to a client in Canada. Those were as I recall in Quebec and possibly also in Ontario.

[Laura Corin]

It might be best to start your search from the other side i.e. by looking at possible job opportunities for your husband. Most/many countries allow some sort of at least temporary visa if you have a job offer in a professional field. So I would look at either large multi-national corporations or bigger overseas companies to get an idea where he might get hired. Employers will generally help with getting the visa in that case.

I agree. When Husband first worked in the UK, before he naturalised, he first searched for jobs, then the firm sorted out his visa for him. This was a big UK bank.

[Guest]

 

It depends heavily on where you live. Unfortunately, the OP's hubby's line of work would almost certainly require choosing between outrageously high rental prices, or high rental prices plus a long commute. It would suck to be stuck in a foreign country with a bunch of kids and a husband who isn't around to help out.

 

If she wants to play "let's pretend to move to Australia" http://www.seek.com.au and http://www.realestate.com.au

 

 

Since mods don't have like buttons, I have to quote you and say "Thank you" like a real human being. Sorry about that, Katie. I know I'm a busybody who needs to mind her own business and I'm working on that.

[Mabelen]

It is easier to get the job first. If the company hires your husband knowing his foreign status, they should sort all the immigration for you.

 

You mentioned pets. The U.K. used to have extremely stringent policies regarding pets. Have they changed recently?

[Laura Corin]

It is easier to get the job first. If the company hires your husband knowing his foreign status, they should sort all the immigration for you.

 

You mentioned pets. The U.K. used to have extremely stringent policies regarding pets. Have they changed recently?

I know it's possible to bring dogs from the US. Our dog was born in Oregon.

[Mabelen]

I know it's possible to bring dogs from the US. Our dog was born in Oregon.

Did it have to go through quarantine or did documentation prove sufficient?

[Guest]

 

That would depend upon the pay. I believe here in Colombia, English teachers in the many private language schools receive very low pay.  My wife attended several courses in one of those, many years ago, and that's the only one she had first hand experience with, so we recommend that one if people ask.

 

Another option, for someone who has credentials (Bachelors minimum in Education, plus working experience as an Educator) would be to teach in an overseas school that is accredited in the USA.  DD attended one of those when she was very young, for 3  school years, until our income dropped a lot. I don't think they make a lot of money, but more than in a private language school.

 

With Software, almost anywhere in the world, it is written in English. Possibly bad English, but in English, so English is the common denominator for computer people.   Her DH could probably do well in other non-English-speaking-countries, such as Germany.  Lots of people in Europe speak English. 

 

Many people overseas speak English. Some of them speak excellent English, some speak horrible English, but it is the universal language now and often one can communicate in English.

 

 

Sorry again Katie and glad he's feeling better today.

 

Lanny thank you so much. This is very valuable information for my youngest child or, perhaps, my daughter now that she has grown up a bit and actually has more than one BA. My intent with the TMI was just to communicate that different people are accustomed to different ways of living.

 

My 9yods, of course, has a different paradigm about what good software is and what the goals of software development are than the OP's DH. Much as I hate to use words like "hobby" and "amateur" (a derivative of the Latin word amo, which means "I love" because amateurs are people who do things because they love them, not just to increase their earning potential), they do effectively communicate the facts that our friend and tutor wants to learn English for other reasons than financial security and that our motivations for helping him are slightly different than just not wanting to use cash for tax purposes or hiring the cheapest cyberbabysitter we can or something.

 

It sounds like teaching English overseas might be a wonderful opportunity for one of my kids, if they were motivated enough to do the legwork to find what seemed invisible to me twelve years ago, but not an option for Katie's husband, the provider of a much larger family than my own who may well have bigger debt to worry about than "I shouldn't have put that RAM upgrade on my credit card".

[ktgrok]

It is easier to get the job first. If the company hires your husband knowing his foreign status, they should sort all the immigration for you.

 

You mentioned pets. The U.K. used to have extremely stringent policies regarding pets. Have they changed recently?

 

Yup, much easier now. I did make sure to follow the rules when I last had the pets vaccinated...basically a microchip that is ISO and then rabies vaccine. 

 

And yeah, if we do this he'll contact headhunters that work with other countries, and get a job first. 

[ktgrok]

No offense to the question about living standards, it is a valid thing. I can imagine houses would be older for sure, and bathrooms smaller, unlikely to have a clothes dryer, etc. I'm just getting to the point that universal healthcare would be worth having to hang my clothes to dry or downsize belongings. 

Edited October 4, 2017 by ktgrok