Question about a community and its home educators

[SamanthaCarter]

Dh and I are hatching a possibly hair brained scheme, but first it would require an answer to this question:

 

Are there any benefits to a locality making itself attractive to homeschoolers? Or is it purely neutral whether they are or are not doing anything to attract them?

 

Any thoughts? (Not trying to be political or controversial)

 

 

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Edited August 14, 2017 by SamanthaCarter

[Lang Syne Boardie]

This is totally unanswerable without knowledge of the type of business, IMO. Can you give us a category?

[purpleowl]

Edit: Okay, my post wasn't at all related to what you were asking.

Edited August 14, 2017 by purpleowl

[Arcadia]

I don't know but my extended family choose housing based on jobs availability regardless of country as long as we feel relatively safe. We come from generations of afterschoolers and even my relatives who went to elite schools were afterschooled.

For us it might actually be a negative because we are atheist-agnostic and homeschooling for purely academic reasons.

 

How do you define attractive to homeschoolers?

I can walk to the library, bike or long walk to the nearest community college, take the train to the state university and the satellite campus of another community college.

However many dual income family in my area send their kids to private school and pick my area because housing is cheaper than the zip codes with famous (high ranked) public schools.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Arcadia

[Carol in Cal.]

I think that homeschooling is common enough now that a business model of trying to get homeschoolers to move to a specific area is pretty unlikely to be very successful.

The first thing homeschoolers need is stable employment for the breadwinner(s) so that homeschooling is even possible.

Also, just in general, people don't move very quickly unless there are huge employment shifts.

So a business based on making homeschoolers move is going to be slow and possibly unsuccessful.

JMHO

 

OTOH, if you're already in a highly populated area and want to attract homeschooling business that pretty much already exists but is done, say, online, or in little coops, that might be more successful

[SamanthaCarter]

I'm talking about the presence of homeschoolers in your town or neighborhood. The case could be made, for instance, that your neighborhood is safer from burglary if there are a bunch of homeschoolers there during the day.

 

Are homeschoolers any better at volunteerism? Are they an attractive tax base? Etc?

 

 

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[chiguirre]

Are homeschoolers any better at volunteerism? Are they an attractive tax base? Etc?

 

 

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IMHO, that's two nopes. Homeschoolers are mostly single income (so overall they earn less than 2 income households) and the SAHP is super busy homeschooling and volunteering in coops or HS specific extracurriculars so they don't have a lot of time to volunteer in the community until their youngest kids are older.

[Sarah CB]

IMHO, that's two nopes. Homeschoolers are mostly single income (so overall they earn less than 2 income households) and the SAHP is super busy homeschooling and volunteering in coops or HS specific extracurriculars so they don't have a lot of time to volunteer in the community until their youngest kids are older.

 

Though I have heard that kids who are homeschooled are much more likely to volunteer in their community.

[desertstrawberry5]

I'm talking about the presence of homeschoolers in your town or neighborhood. The case could be made, for instance, that your neighborhood is safer from burglary if there are a bunch of homeschoolers there during the day.

 

Are homeschoolers any better at volunteerism? Are they an attractive tax base? Etc?

 

 

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I'm not sure I understand the question.

I don't think that the presence of home schoolers is beneficial to the community at large. Not in a tangible way. Unlike great public schools, or higher end neighborhoods, or a great parks and recreation department, no one really benefits from homeschooling in the same, direct way, except the people doing it. Homeschooling isn't offering a service. Quite the opposite. It's withdrawing from the community.

I don't like the idea of home schoolers being marketed as being available for volunteering or neighborhood watch duties. Our first obligation is to teach our children. I would not like to feed the perception that we are home doing nothing all day and need something to keep us busy.

[EKS]

I would say no, that there are no benefits, at least no immediately obvious benefits, in a community making itself attractive to homeschoolers.

 

For example, in the town where I live, the school district is the largest employer.  The presence of a large cohort of homeschoolers in the community would, in theory, reduce the per pupil funding the schools receive.

 

In general, homeschoolers have less money to spend because (frequently) only one spouse is working, but the homeschooling spouse is not free during school hours to give back to the community as they have the full time job of homeschooling.

 

Also, homeschoolers as a group may be less inclined to work to change things for the greater good.  Their decision to homeschool may be seen as symptomatic of a tendency to withdraw to protect their own.

[QueenCat]

IMHO, that's two nopes. Homeschoolers are mostly single income (so overall they earn less than 2 income households) and the SAHP is super busy homeschooling and volunteering in coops or HS specific extracurriculars so they don't have a lot of time to volunteer in the community until their youngest kids are older.

 

Most homeschoolers I know are either single income or single plus a bit of part time but the income range is wide. Single income can mean $30k, it can mean 300k, and everything in between. Most of my closer friends, when we still homeschooled, volunteered pretty much everywhere (scouts, community groups, church (if they went), etc) while still homeschooling. Maybe less with preschoolers but certainly by the time the youngest was in early elementary school. Granted, I have no idea how much those that I wasn't as close to volunteered....

[Arcadia]

Are homeschoolers any better at volunteerism? Are they an attractive tax base? Etc?

The strongest volunteers locally are the SAHMs and working parents of kids in public school especially when their youngest enter Kindergarten. Companies like Intel and Cisco nearby let their employees chalk up a certain amount of volunteer hours in school as part of their outreach. The dual income families are the most attractive tax base, other than all the big tech companies surrounding my area.

 

To the public schools, working parents are an attractive monetary donations base because of employee matching. When I go to the public library, many volunteers in their 30s and 40s have kids in public schools so they help reshelve books or run the friends of the library bookstore until 2/3pm.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I don't think that someone's educational method has anything specifically to do with how community minded they are. Sure, lots of homeschoolers volunteer. My Dd volunteers extensively. And she is on our city youth council. But she volunteers alongside public and private school teens . And she's on the city youth council alongside public and private schooled teens.

 

 

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[Janeway]

In our town, the town and the surrounding ones have nothing for home schoolers. In some towns further to the east, I know the libraries and rec centers have tons of activities for home schoolers. Even our local pools are adult only during the school day where I live. I would consider that to be home schooler unfriendly. 

[Arcadia]

Though I have heard that kids who are homeschooled are much more likely to volunteer in their community.

Here the public high school students are supposed to chalk up 100 to 200 hours of community service depending on their school district policy as part of high school graduation requirements so no shortage (and oversupply) of high school volunteers here.

[kroe1]

Interesting question. Random thoughts:

 

1. Public schools here in Florida still get federal dollars for the homeschoolers, I believe. That is why they have to register with the local school district. I am not sure, however, if those who choose the cover school option get federal dollars since a cover school is thought of the same as a private school in Florida. Someone please check my limited knowledge.

 

2. Florida has a gazillion opportunities for home schools from the amusement parks, zoos, etc. Therefore, they must be financially desirable to business. This thought makes me want to attend Disney Homeschool Days again even though I no longer have any kids left to homeschool.

 

3. Our community has many opportunities for homeschoolers during the day. This keeps some businesses or people working during the day that otherwise would only have customers during after school hours.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Here the public high school students are supposed to chalk up 100 to 200 hours of community service depending on their school district policy as part of high school graduation requirements so no shortage (and oversupply) of high school volunteers here.

Here too. I will say that Dd is seen as a welcome anomaly who is volunteering because she truly wants to, instead of many of the other teens who are going through the motions. I have been told that more than once by volunteer coordinators.

[heartlikealion]

Hmm the volunteer thing could go either way, depending on the family's precise available hours and interest in volunteer work that they find. Part of me hoped that I could volunteer at the public school sometimes on the mornings dh goes into work later. But in reality we are both needed home. Today he did school with ds while I tried to occupy dd. Even with me home it was hard. She wanted to draw on the dry erase board with Daddy, started to cry when I told her that she needed to let her water color book dry, etc. lol

 

Depending on the ages of the children, yes, I could see volunteering working out well. The at home parent could take the child with them to a food pantry or nursing home or something.

 

Of course that depends on the family's school obligations, the organization's rules about children, etc.

 

Are there any benefits to making an area attractive to homeschoolers? Maybe if you're trying to draw up business during hours in which homeschoolers are the only client (or primary client). We have a bowling alley an hour from us that offers a homeschooling day. I know two homeschool groups that meet there in the morning at least once a month.

[SamanthaCarter]

All good thoughts! Thanks. I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them...

 

 

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[QueenCat]

All good thoughts! Thanks. I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them...

 

 

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I'd view those programs as meeting the needs of a portion of their residents.

[EKS]

All good thoughts! Thanks. I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them...

 

They tend to partake in such activities during school hours, which is time that those entities have available.  So, perhaps that aspect is a benefit.

[Arcadia]

I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them..

This would be location specific though.

 

I have to drive 30mins off peak for a homeschool meetup at a library and the library is not the organizer but just the location for the meetup. PE programs for homeschoolers are run by private businesses. Parks and Recs programs cater for the under 5 during school hours and the school aged kids after 3pm.

 

There are businesses who cater to homeschoolers and most take the independent study (public charter) stipends. My kids attended a school time science lab class that cater mainly to homeschoolers using charter school stipends/funds to pay. The classes were nice but the annual tuition increases are steep so we stopped going and look for businesses whose main revenue isn't from people using charter school funds.

 

ETA:

My neighborhood libraries aim for the under 5 crowd with baby story time, bilingual toddler story time, Lego playtime.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Arcadia

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Various public entities might try to meet the needs of diverse demographics (eg libraries) but no community wants to *attract* hs'ing families for one reason that has nothing to do with hs'ing:

 

It's antithetical to public school promotion to vaunt hs'ing in any way. It just doesn't work. They are opposing messages, which one learns when one is criticized for homeschooling in a good school district ("why would you, our schools are great") or tolerated for hs'ing in an area with failing schools ("I understand, wish I had options").

 

This is also because ps has to be competitive in the voucher era. So if the community has "good schools" that's what's promoted to families, and that's what local businesses support. Schools are seriously played up, with as little distraction from other Ed. choices as possible.

 

Independent enterprises of private families do not have the same cache for fundraising, sponsoring a ball team or doing a fundraiser at a restaurant, box tops for education, community drives for angel tree, etc. and of course, the neighbors know that some of their tax money supports schools, and the vast majority of kids attend, so there's some buy in from the public for ps.

 

While hsers can choose to be very community oriented (my family is, and so are many others), hs'ing isn't a community thing. It's the opposite.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Tibbie Dunbar

[heartlikealion]

All good thoughts! Thanks. I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them...

 

 

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I have not seen that. I know one library that offers a "homeschooling 101" class once a year, but that's because someone that works at the library is a homeschooler and they host it. I have never been able to attend as it's not close to me and now I don't know if I'd get as much out of it.

 

I don't understand how "programs" = "beneficial" necessarily either.

 

I know of a martial arts class aimed at homeschoolers, but that's because the instructor was homeschooled and wanted to offer that to the homeschool community.

 

In my particular community I am not aware of any homeschool specific events for Parks and Rec or libraries. There is the summer reading program open to all. Story hour open to all (which is during school hours so this is really daycare children and Head Start kids that attend from nearby centers. When we have attended I think we were the only homeschool family). Our library is open 2 days a week. I do know of homeschoolers setting up events and looking at libraries as a potential meeting place, but not sure how often they do that. 

 

I was under the impression that Parks and Rec classes happened in the afternoon/evening so not specific to homeschoolers. Another person mentioned something for younger ones. I didn't know that even existed. Maybe just certain areas.

[MistyMountain]

I think it is good for a community to have a variety of education options with a good homeschooling community. I think it is a positive thing when an area has lots of options for groups and activities for those that homeschool. I also think it is positive when an area has an option that is not required where you can get some of the state money for education for homeschooling. That helps people with a lower income able to afford curriculum and extra curricular activities. It also helps the businesses that get their business. There are activities through private businesses and parks and recreation that are during the day for homeschoolers. I think it is mainly a positive for the families with school age children who would consider homeschooling in the community.

Edited August 14, 2017 by MistyMountain

[J-rap]

Are you trying to attract homeschooling families to your community?  Or are you trying to convince people in general that homeschooling families add a positive aspect to your community?  I'm confused about who your target audience is.  But either way, you could certainly pull out the positives of homeschooling in your community.

 

We live in a small rural community that happens to have a good amount of homeschoolers.  Many of them are quite mainstream, and take some classes at the local public schools or are on their sports teams, etc.  We have a good relationship with the schools here.  Homeschoolers have a public presence in our community too.  (They're not hidden away!)  They work at some local cafes over the lunch hour, they babysit babies and preschoolers for the local MOPS program, they assist in pre-kindergarten screenings because those take place during the school day and homeschoolers are available.  I think homeschooling in our community is a win-win!  Anyway, those are the kinds of examples I see in our community.  Is this along the lines of what you're thinking?

 

 

 

[Clemsondana]

I don't know that it typically does, but homeschooling can free up your schedule to do certain volunteer jobs. I've done a weekly after-school volunteer gig for 4 years, and most other parents can't fill that time slot because they're picking up their own kids. Another family at our co-op used to do science/cooking hands-on demos in a local elementary school. Another person at our co-op got involved in a number of groups (lego competitions, academic competitions) when their own kids were young and continue to lead homeschool and underserved teams now that their kids are mostly in college.

 

Another thing that I've found is that teaching lessons to homeschool kids is a nice bonus for people who teach at their home. My kid's violin teacher has a bunch of homeschool students because she can teach during the day when her kids are at school - she's got a waiting list for her few after-school slots. My other kid takes a private sports lesson, and that instructor has several homeschool kids that he teaches during the day.

 

I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for...

[desertstrawberry5]

I'd view those programs as meeting the needs of a portion of their residents.

 

 

Our libraries and parks are not targetting homeschoolers. My kids attend programs targeted at prek and public schooled kids. They do make exceptions to include my children, but that's not the goal. 

 

Where we were before, Homeschoolers were abundant. A lot of facilities invited homeschoolers in during off hours because it was guarenteed income during a time when they didn't usually have customers. For instance, homeschool ice skating was hugely popular. One of the owners gave the keys to a homeschooling friend to unlock the doors. She put the payments in the cashbox. The rest was self serve. The ice was already there. easily 50 skaters showed up every week. at $5 a kid, of basically free income, that's a good deal. 

[MrsBasil]

All good thoughts! Thanks. I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them...

 

 

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In my area we have a public library district and homeschool library programs are not the norm. There is currently a Friday offering, but it only started being offered after a very large charter school went to a 4 day a week schedule.

 

There are some rec classes available to homeschoolers, but, like all rec classes in my area, they cost money.    The teachers often get a portion of the cost or are otherwise compensated for the teaching.  A not insignificant number are taught by people who are working on building  their businesses(like dance teachers and a pottery studio owner).  I could be wrong, but I imagine there's some motivation to earn money and expand their client base in this way.  I mean, one of the dance teachers clearly loves teaching dance(or is a superb actress), but she's also trying to start a studio and asks to put the parents of the students on an email list about what other classes and camps she'll be offering.

[Rebel Yell]

All good thoughts! Thanks. I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them...

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Not every place has this. My community doesn't even have a parks/rec program, let alone anything aimed at homeschoolers. And the few things promoted to homeschoolers are for preschool-age 10.

[QueenCat]

There are some rec classes available to homeschoolers, but, like all rec classes in my area, they cost money.    The teachers often get a portion of the cost or are otherwise compensated for the teaching.  A not insignificant number are taught by people who are working on building  their businesses(like dance teachers and a pottery studio owner).  I could be wrong, but I imagine there's some motivation to earn money and expand their client base in this way.  I mean, one of the dance teachers clearly loves teaching dance(or is a superb actress), but she's also trying to start a studio and asks to put the parents of the students on an email list about what other classes and camps she'll be offering.

 

Why wouldn't they cost money?

[jewellsmommy]

I'm not sure if this is what you are asking, but there are some businesses that can benefit from the home school population.

 

For instance: Private businesses that are service providers like Martial arts who can offer homeschool classes while ps kids are in class. So: art classes (like Wine & Design, ceramics places), sport classes, horseback riding, dance/ballet, music lessons, etc. can fill lesser used time slots. This only benefits the business and some homeschooling family.

 

I do know that a local museum takes advantage of the homeschooling schedule by filling their volunteer docket with homeschool teens during school hours. But, again, it benefits the museum, not the community at large.

 

[TravelingChris]

In every town I have lived in, there were a lot of benefits for the town or area from homeschoolers.  Homeschoolers tended to be involved more in many community aspects from Scouting and 4H to citizen scientists to volunteers in the community - like high schoolers who go tutor kids in school or families that help at food banks.  One of mine volunteered at the library shelving books while she was 13 and was particularly helpful to them because she could do it in school hours.  Many homeschool families are quite patriotic and community minded so I have known many homeschoolers who went into the military or a few who became police or fire.  One of my sons as a homeschool graduate is a Cave rescuer.  Some others have volunteered for fire departments.  Others volunteer at hospitals, camps for kids, play in community orchestras and sing in community choirs,etc, etc.  

 

Now I was just mostly talking about the students but the parents were generally involved in volunteering for something or other occasionally to often.  ANything from being soccer coaches or team parents or similar things in other sports, to helping with Scouts or 4H and that helped non homeschooling children too to community theatre volunteers to Botanical Garden volunteers to lots of other things too.

 

 

[MrsBasil]

Why wouldn't they cost money?

 

They absolutely should cost money!    I was typing while distracted and it looks like my meaning muddled. 

 

I was trying to reply to a post about library programs and rec programs being targeted to homeschoolers and the differences I have seen in my community.    Library programs are free here, but almost never target to homeschoolers.  Rec classes cost and some are targeted to homeschoolers, but it doesn't seem to be for the reasons the OP was asking about and I was trying to explain that.   Also, some areas offer free rec programs and I was trying to limit my response to my area and experience.

[Sarah CB]

Here the public high school students are supposed to chalk up 100 to 200 hours of community service depending on their school district policy as part of high school graduation requirements so no shortage (and oversupply) of high school volunteers here.

 

Except that for homeschoolers, volunteering is usually done voluntarily and it continues into adulthood. 

 

 

• 71 percent of the homeschool graduates participate in ongoing community service activities compared to 37 percent of U.S. adults - The survey of 7,300 homeschooled adults was conducted on behalf of the Home School Legal Defense Association (HSLDA)

[Lecka]

Another benefit to homeschool day classes, is they take the pressure off of facilities to schedule everything in the after-school hours.

 

I think it is a real benefit for everyone.

 

Some homeschool classes offered, are a version of an outreach they take to children at public and private schools (and sometimes daycares and pre-schools).

 

I think that is fair and the mission of the programs!

 

That is what homeschool Zoo Days are like frex, and some library programs where kids are brought in on buses.

 

I don't think the mission of a library, zoo, or parks and rec should be exclusionary to homeschool kids. They are part of the community, too, and what is good for them is good for the community.

[SparklyUnicorn]

No.  Homeschools vary so much they hardly seem to have anything in common (in my experiences).  I mean you'd THINK homeschooling is something to have in common, but oddly...no. 

[ChocolateReignRemix]

 

Except that for homeschoolers, volunteering is usually done voluntarily and it continues into adulthood. 

 

 

• 71 percent of the homeschool graduates participate in ongoing community service activities compared to 37 percent of U.S. adults - The survey of 7,300 homeschooled adults was conducted on behalf of the Home School Legal Defense Association (HSLDA)

 

 

If it is the survey I am thinking of I wouldn't place much value on its accuracy.  One major flaw is that the population of homeschool graduates has an average age much lower than that of the rest of the population, which likely skews the results.  HSLDA also asked for volunteers for the survey which self selects the sample.

[heartlikealion]

While I can appreciate that many homeschoolers may start out volunteering young and continue to do so later, I would hesitate to think they did it willingly as youngsters. Might have been mandated by parents or other authority lol

 

When I worked at Vacation Bible School one summer there was an overflow of "volunteer" teens. I put that in quotes because many didn't do much or weren't needed. They were either there for community hours (I was told they could earn service hours) and/or Mom and Dad signed up younger siblings so thought, hey, I'd rather older sibling tag along than sit in empty house alone all morning.

[Bootsie]

All good thoughts! Thanks. I do wonder, if homeschoolers aren't a benefit, why there are library and parks and rec programs aimed at them...

 

 

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Can you explain what you mean by this?  To me libraries, parks and rec programs are set up to benefit members of the community.  The programs that are provided are not related to the demographics being served being a benefit to the community.  

[Hilltopmom]

Here, places that run day time activities for homeschoolers started doing so because the homeschool families kept asking them to & they finally realized there was a market for that (YMCA swim & gym, homeschool art or dance classes, museum days, etc).

Edited August 15, 2017 by Hilltopmom

[LMD]

I do think that having a robust homeschool community is a plus for attracting homeschoolers. When homeschool families move, they tend to seek out others. I know that some have kept in mind things like 'huge weekly park group with teens' and 'co op' as pluses and signs of a healthy, thriving community. It may not be top priority, but it might tip the balance. I know people that have been happy to leave an area with an unhealthy-ish group.

[Farrar]

When I lobbied our local government over something awhile back, a side point I tried to make was that we, as homeschoolers, had provided an overall benefit simply by not leaving town when our kids reached school age. Pretty much every family we met when our kids were toddlers at the park and so forth left the neighborhood. But we were able to choose to stay because we planned on homeschooling. And that added a value to the neighborhood in that we weren't just flipping a house and we were a stable family, paying taxes, etc. I was like, we're exactly who you want in our neighborhoods. That's a pretty specific situation though that only came about because I live in a gentrifying inner city and lived through the tipping point here.

 

I think there are pros and cons to homeschoolers in an area. We add value in many ways like volunteering, creating community, etc... but probably not monetarily. We're more likely to be single income so that's less taxes and we tend to use services to the nth degree, I find. Which is fine. But it means we're not chipping in a ton to the pot and we're taking out every penny we can. Again, I think that's what government should do, but... 

 

 

[KungFuPanda]

I think in most areas there are too few homeschoolers to really impact the feel of the community. Even where they are plentiful, they're not working as a unit. I wouldn't plan my livelihood around the habits of homeschoolers. Also, as a group, they're too diverse to say "These people are more special than people who don't homeschool." We're just not and making that pitch would be really tricky to do without generating eye rolls from the non-homeschooling public. Yes, we have our superstars, but the community at large has more of those. We also have our fair share of wackadoos. Homeschoolers, as a group, aren't so stellar that you can sell them as some sort of community gem. We're "homeschoolers" because of how we educate our children. When we're out in the world doing regular stuff, we're no different than anyone else volunteering at the library or wherever.

[katilac]

It's such a small percentage of the population that I'm not sure it would be worth much effort. Admittedly, I'm not even sure what you mean by a locality making itself attractive to homeschoolers. I don't think non-h/s'ers would care at all how many h/s'ers are present (ie, the example about being safer from burglary). 

 

If we had to move for a job, and several neighborhoods were equally viable options, an active h/s community would be attractive if (and this are big ifs) it was either very inclusive and diverse, or if it was of 'my' type. As Arcadia notes, a large h/s community of the 'wrong' type can actually be a turn-off: secular people may not want to feel surrounded by religious h/s'ers, and the same in reverse. And S*Unicorn echos my experience - you'd think homeschooling would give you some common ground, but . . . 

[Catwoman]

Dh and I are hatching a possibly hair brained scheme, but first it would require an answer to this question:

 

Are there any benefits to a locality making itself attractive to homeschoolers? Or is it purely neutral whether they are or are not doing anything to attract them?

 

Any thoughts? (Not trying to be political or controversial)

 

 

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Are you thinking of starting some kind of business? I'm not exactly sure what you're asking.

 

I'm not sure why a town or city would make a specific effort to make itself attractive to homeschoolers. How would that benefit them?

 

Sorry to sound so clueless!

[Hilltopmom]

Things homeschoolers are likely to look for when planning a move: museums, parks, town sports programs up to teens (especially if homeschoolers are not allowed to do school sports), places for lessons like dance, art, music, etc.

 

An active homeschool community with already set up support groups, co ops,,field trips, a homeschool resource center, etc would be a plus, of course.