How educated are you?

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I am not saying that the college educated are all well informed and wise, nor that those who never went to college are ignorant. I'm saying, to quote Jesus, "he who has ears to hear, let him hear!" Or put another way, "If the shoe fits, wear it."

 

If a potential hs'ing parent realizes she knows nothing of the world, she should find out instead of just congratulating herself on her native intelligence that is probably superior to everyone else's. I've seen that SO many times that I now warn against it.

 

I don't think college guarantees wisdom or provides all the answers, but I hope that access to education does help a person begin to know the questions...

[rebbyribs]

No, the person who did not finish and defend her thesis has not actually earned a PhD. You don't receive the doctorate until after your thesis defense.

 

Not all programs require you to defend your PhD thesis.  In my department, the defense was optional and more a public presentation of your work than a grilling.  

 

In some programs, you can be awarded a Master's degree after finishing the coursework portion of the PhD program, whereas in others you would not get the Master's degree but could say you were A.B.D. to indicate the post-graduate work you had completed.

[madteaparty]

I have a JD from a top 10 school. I don't think that makes me particularly educated though.

[Heather in OK]

I have a Bachelor's in Elementary Education.  I also completed midwifery school (non-degree program) and have a nationally recognized credential.

[wintermom]

No, the person who did not finish and defend her thesis has not actually earned a PhD. You don't receive the doctorate until after your thesis defense.

 

I don't believe people are using this the expression PhD ABD for resumes or any official documentation, it's a term used verbally when talking with people. 

 

It is still an accomplishment to finish off those courses and exams, and there are a million factors that can prevent people from completing the dissertation - most of them have NOTHING to do with a person's brain power or ability. It's nice to be able to say to someone at some point, "Yes, I have gone beyond a Masters. No, I'm not a PhD." 

[wintermom]

Not all programs require you to defend your PhD thesis.  In my department, the defense was optional and more a public presentation of your work than a grilling.  

 

In some programs, you can be awarded a Master's degree after finishing the coursework portion of the PhD program, whereas in others you would not get the Master's degree but could say you were A.B.D. to indicate the post-graduate work you had completed.

 

Interesting. I don't doubt it. There are all kinds of different ways to complete Master's degrees and other graduate degrees. Some graduate programs jump right over a Master's and onto PhD. 

[Frances]

I'm also assuming there's only so long you can sit on that before it is no longer "fresh" enough to present for dissertation, right? So, your sister couldn't just pick it back up after a hiatus, finish writing the thesis, present for the board, and recieve the degree. I'm guessing it becomes null at some point, though I don't know how long; maybe it depends on the subject researched.

At my university it was five years without an appeal, but they were known for being pretty lenient about granting appeals. I think my sister-in-law was ten years out of coursework before she finally definitely decided she was never going to finish the dissertation. I'm not sure how many extensions she requested.

[Frances]

I don't believe people are using this the expression PhD ABD for resumes or any official documentation, it's a term used verbally when talking with people.

 

It is still an accomplishment to finish off those courses and exams, and there are a million factors that can prevent people from completing the dissertation - most of them have NOTHING to do with a person's brain power or ability. It's nice to be able to say to someone at some point, "Yes, I have gone beyond a Masters. No, I'm not a PhD."

I've seen ABD, not PhD ABD, on resumes and vitas. Maybe it's more common in some fields than others.

[Guest]

I have a JD from a top 10 school. I don't think that makes me particularly educated though.

Yeah, but you get to say that...ðŸ˜

 

You'll have to excuse me. I have educational attainment envy. I want a do-over.

[Janeway]

I'm not sure what you're referring to with "post graduate" work. This, to me, means something very specific, such as medical education. Graduate studies, such as Masters or Doctorate, is something different.

Post graduate work is anything after a bachelors.

[regentrude]

4. When your child does outpace your ability to direct and facilitate his studies, admit it. (There's that humility again.) There is NO shame in hitting the wall - when care of younger children and household, need to work a paying job, or just topping out on your own capacity to learn at your child's speed - and you know it's best for them to outsource more or to enroll in school. But if you keep hs'ing past the point where he's able to learn and grow, then you should be ashamed that your stubborn pride or outgrown convictions are holding your child back! If the day comes that he needs more, give thanks for your time together and for the excellent foundation that YOU were able to provide, and let him go.

 

This, irrespective of parent's educational attainment.

 

My PhD in physics meant nothing for my (in)ability to homeschool French to fluency.

Edited August 7, 2017 by regentrude

[Frances]

Post graduate work is anything after a bachelors.

That's how I always though of it with a distinction between professional degrees (MBA, JD, MD, etc.) and academic degrees (MS, MA, PhD, etc.).

[3 ladybugs]

I have my AAS in Early Childhood Education. DH has his PhD in Biochemistry. 

 

I do English, Writing, Spelling, Latin, Art, Comprehension, Reading, Vocabulary for our older son and everything for our younger son. DH takes care of Math, Science and History for our older son. 

[heartlikealion]

An AA can be for a trade program, but isn't always. I got an AA with an undeclared major. Just general studies type classes and some electives. Mainly in case something happened that interrupted my university plans and/or job hunting in which I wanted to say I had a degree. I went on to get a BA in Advertising with a minor in sociology. I personally feel like I have gaps in my education. There are so many people here very well read. I wouldn't say that about myself. I did take English and journalism classes and three semesters of creative writing (the CW for fun), but as far as knowing the classics, eh. There are many that were not required reading and so I just never bothered.

 

I also feel incompetent and intimidated when it comes to research papers to an extent. I just want to write something, not have to double check an MLA handbook and fret about minor details. I still think it's stupid we add an apostrophe to say "As" for grades. It's not possessive. In the right context I think you would know it's not the word "as."

 

Periodically dh says he just knows I'm going to go back to school for my Master's and I told him to knock it off. That is not on my wish list of things to do. I don't think it would really advance my career (if/when I return to work) and I would hate the writing component most likely. After graduating college I did enroll for an undergrad class twice. I took one and the other I had to drop after the first day of class because we found out we were moving. You don't get a full refund when you attend the first day. And we didn't do anything.

[Ali in OR]

I have a BS in Industrial Engineering and an MA in Education (teaching credential in math/English). What I think enhanced my ability to home school was being in a high-level university environment. There were some truly amazing students there, and many came from high schools that were so far beyond what my high school provided for me. I later taught in one of those high schools. What being around well-prepared students gave me is a vision of what a good education looks like. That's knowledge that's useful whether you homeschool or put your kids in public school. My kids' high school and the feeder middle school will auto-direct kids to a level of education that's not top-tier. Parents who have gone to a competitive university know to put their kids into Spanish in middle school so they can eventually take the Spanish AP, make sure your kid is in Biology and not the freshman science class, and better yet, have them take bio and chem freshman year so they can take two different science AP courses in high school. These parents know to have their kids take the required health class at the CC or online so they can have space in their schedule for more worthwhile courses. When I homeschooled, this vision of what a good education looks like also helped me recognize where outsourcing would be useful.

 

I think homeschoolers can pick up this knowledge of what a good education looks like from sites like this where you can learn from more experienced homeschoolers. Or read The Well-Trained Mind. I think I feel more confident in my choices because of my college experience, but I absolutely believe parents can pick up that information from other sources; picking up the confidence may be a little harder.

[TravelingChris]

I don't ever pretend to have a PhD.  Depending on the survey or the question someone is asking, I will tell about my education past the master's level.  So if they are counting years of education, I have 19.  If they ask for highest degree, it is an MS.  There are myriad of ways of asking about education so my answer varies upon what is being asked and what reason they are asking.  But I never say I have a PhD because I don't.  I am definitely an ABD but the D is very important.  However, in my field, there was a whole year of additional classes for the PhD along with extra exams on statistics, theory, and more.  I had done those classes and passed the exams. 

 

I didn't find that writing the thesis was the hard part. I liked doing research and I liked writing the thesis.  I would have loved to do a doctoral dissertation and do the research for that but my health made me realize that I would not be able to do what I wanted.  I decided to focus on things I could still do which led to my homeschooling my children.  And I certainly don't regret homeschooling them since I believe that especially with all of them being 2E, they really did much better at home with me than they would have at school.

[meganrussell]

I definitely have self educated myself. I read voraciously, I am always researching topics for my kids school work, I love watching documentaries and informative shows, I have learned more in ten years of homeschooling my kids than eleven years of attending public school. Anytime I have a homeschool mom say to me that she thinks she won't be able to homeschool in middle or high school, I always suggest self education! It's so worth it!

 

I have a high school diploma and a vocational diploma - I was a medical assistant. I have four entirely Hs'ed sons.

 

The eldest was a national merit finalist and went to college on a dean's scholarship. He is in the honors program, halfway through his bachelor's program. He is majoring in religion with concentrations in Greek and something administrative (?), and minoring in philosophy. If he continues as he has begun, his mentor believes he will receive full merit tuition to seminary. His goal is to be a healthcare chaplain. He will graduate debt free; he works over thirty hours per week to pay his very small loans, and is also able to support himself in shared, off campus housing. He's something of a go getter.

 

Son #2, after planning to go into skilled labor like his dad, decided at the eleventh hour to go to college. He received merit scholarships as high as his brother's and is also projected to graduate debt free. He starts school in three weeks. He plans to be a physical therapist, but if he finds he's good at going to college, he would like to go on to become a doctor - specifically, an osteopath.

 

Son #3 is a rising eleventh grader. He is proficient in Greek and Latin, and total nut over history and classical literature. He's decided he doesn't like the careers associated with those passions, so he has decided to pursue another interest: He wants to be an orthotist and prosthetist. He has a health condition that makes him very familiar with this field, and he already has mentors and support. Right now he's working his butt off for merit scholarships. I think he'll make it.

 

Son #4 is being moved from seventh to eighth grade this year, because his academic skills are proficient enough, he's got the maturity, and we want to get him into dual enrollment or early college opportunities as soon as possible. He's something of an artistic genius, and has mentors and teachers in our city who are helping him to prepare for art college.

 

So that's us. I won't get into the reasons I didn't go to college, or explain how I learned to succeed at hs'ing. I will share a few opinions, for those who are considering hs'ing:

 

1. Success doesn't just happen. Not sending them to school does not mean they'll learn more, contrary to many hs'ing families' opinion! I cannot count the number of hs'ers I've known who think their kids are smarter for not having gone to school, yet they haven't taught them, or filled the house with books, or anything. I'm sorry, but these are nearly all Gothard/ATI families (think Duggars). There's a word for what they are training their children in, and that word is ignorance. I am very concerned about the next generation of hs'ing in these families. The young mothers are not well educated enough to teach, have never seen it modeled, and don't even know what they're lacking.

 

2. For others without a college education who do not intend to neglect your children, please find out what you don't know. "I think I'm pretty smart" doesn't fill in any gaps at all. Have the humility to open the door to the whole wide world. SWB's WTM and WEM are an excellent place to start! Get some subscriptions, or go to the library to read periodicals about a wide swath of life: Scientific American, The Economist, Forbes, National Geographic, Smithsonian Magazine. Read newspapers from the east coast. Add flavor with The Atlantic, New Yorker. Read something from another country, I like The Guardian from the UK. Listen to NPR. You can't broaden your child's mind or horizons if you won't broaden your own.

 

3. Don't expect things from your children that you can't do yourself, or you'll top out on your ability to evaluate their work too soon. Work out those exercises yourself, the night before you assign them to your child. If your child is frustrated or fatigued by outlining, long division, composition, try it yourself so you'll know why it's hard! Model the discipline to conquer it. Learn together.

 

4. When your child does outpace your ability to direct and facilitate his studies, admit it. (There's that humility again.) There is NO shame in hitting the wall - when care of younger children and household, need to work a paying job, or just topping out on your own capacity to learn at your child's speed - and you know it's best for them to outsource more or to enroll in school. But if you keep hs'ing past the point where he's able to learn and grow, then you should be ashamed that your stubborn pride or outgrown convictions are holding your child back! If the day comes that he needs more, give thanks for your time together and for the excellent foundation that YOU were able to provide, and let him go.

[Crimson Wife]

That's how I always though of it with a distinction between professional degrees (MBA, JD, MD, etc.) and academic degrees (MS, MA, PhD, etc.).

 

Plenty of clinical health programs award a M.S. or M.A. Speech & Language Pathology is sometimes a M.S. and sometimes a M.A., typically depending on whether it is part of the School of Education vs. the School of Health Professions. Ditto for Occupational Therapy. Audiology is now a clinical doctorate (AudD.) but until recently it was a M.S. or M.A.

[DawnM]

Two classes into a master's that may never be finished.

 

What is your undergraduate degree in?

[Moonhawk]

Some college. I have enough college credits to have a BA, but not in the right classes (switched majors/colleges, then got sidetracked exploring a different 3rd major, then the requirements for the 2nd major changed and I stopped). People assume I graduated college, just because of my personality, though I rarely talk about college and certainly don't try to mislead them. I try to avoid the topic. I guess I feel like I went to college, and since I have credits I feel...fulfilled? in this section, but it does make me annoyed/vaguely sad that I don't have an actual degree. I think about going back, but it isn't the best option for my current situation, and I just don't have the drive/passion to really make a go of it right now. 

 

eta: Also, I spend a lot of my free time at the university library working on a personal research project, so I think I am getting the fun part of college still, though not the practical (ie degree) part, so that impedes my personal drive to finish up a degree.

Edited August 8, 2017 by Moonhawk

[Moonhawk]

dp

Edited August 8, 2017 by Moonhawk

[Rosie_0801]

I wish I'd been trained in research and have lived to regret not doing my honours year.

 

Such is life.

[Roadrunner]

I have an MA in a completely unrelated field. It certainly didn't help me trying to figure out basic chemistry problems today. 😳

I outsource everything I don't feel I can teach well.

Edited August 8, 2017 by Roadrunner

[SKL]

Some college. I have enough college credits to have a BA, but not in the right classes (switched majors/colleges, then got sidetracked exploring a different 3rd major, then the requirements for the 2nd major changed and I stopped). People assume I graduated college, just because of my personality, though I rarely talk about college and certainly don't try to mislead them. I try to avoid the topic. I guess I feel like I went to college, and since I have credits I feel...fulfilled? in this section, but it does make me annoyed/vaguely sad that I don't have an actual degree. I think about going back, but it isn't the best option for my current situation, and I just don't have the drive/passion to really make a go of it right now. 

 

eta: Also, I spend a lot of my free time at the university library working on a personal research project, so I think I am getting the fun part of college still, though not the practical (ie degree) part, so that impedes my personal drive to finish up a degree.

 

I abandoned my education major in my junior year, having decided to go to law school instead.  My advisor suggested the Bachelor of General Studies, which allowed me to build my own "major" from a combination that included a minimum of credits from various areas.  I did end up having more credits than most graduates, but not as many as if I'd started a new major at that time.  Is that a possibility for you?  It was long ago, and I don't know if BGS even exists any more.

[JFSinIL]

I'm not sure what you're referring to with "post graduate" work. This, to me, means something very specific, such as medical education. Graduate studies, such as Masters or Doctorate, is something different.

 

Or could include those of us stuck at PhD ABD   ..all but dissertation since life got in the way

[JFSinIL]

I don't ever pretend to have a PhD.  Depending on the survey or the question someone is asking, I will tell about my education past the master's level.  So if they are counting years of education, I have 19.  If they ask for highest degree, it is an MS.  There are myriad of ways of asking about education so my answer varies upon what is being asked and what reason they are asking.  But I never say I have a PhD because I don't.  I am definitely an ABD but the D is very important.  However, in my field, there was a whole year of additional classes for the PhD along with extra exams on statistics, theory, and more.  I had done those classes and passed the exams. 

 

I didn't find that writing the thesis was the hard part. I liked doing research and I liked writing the thesis.  I would have loved to do a doctoral dissertation and do the research for that but my health made me realize that I would not be able to do what I wanted.  I decided to focus on things I could still do which led to my homeschooling my children.  And I certainly don't regret homeschooling them since I believe that especially with all of them being 2E, they really did much better at home with me than they would have at school.

 

I am ABD right with you.  Did the two full years of classes (more than UCLA required for the MA), did the student teaching of the lowly undergrads,  passed the three day written test with high praise from the profs...spent a year on research for thesis topic #1 only to find someone doing exact same topic farther along then I at a conference.  Switched topics, chugging away, then car crash with bad whiplash the day before a long-planned three week research trip, all of which had to be postponed several months, then got pregnant with twins and on bed rest....this was before home internet/computers, really, and I could not get out and do the research I needed. Then twins, one had autism, yada yada  plus NU had a rule, five years max to get dissertation turned in (to prevent folks milking the system as eternal grad students).   So I got my PhD ABD and my MRS and my MOM instead :-)

 

Figured my twins (and later two more babies) needed an attentive mom more than the world needed a dissertation on Image of Women in the Hollywood Biographical Film 1930 - 1959.    Still think I could get a decent coffee table book out of it ;-)

 

Oh, and at the time, film departments were heavy into French Structuralism, not the more Brownlow-type film research I love, and Marxism.  I should been a film historian 10 or 20 years earlier.  If you know who he is,  I grew up wishing I was Kevin Brownlow.   Sigh.

 

Edited August 8, 2017 by JFSinIL

[Bluegoat]

Plenty of clinical health programs award a M.S. or M.A. Speech & Language Pathology is sometimes a M.S. and sometimes a M.A., typically depending on whether it is part of the School of Education vs. the School of Health Professions. Ditto for Occupational Therapy. Audiology is now a clinical doctorate (AudD.) but until recently it was a M.S. or M.A.

 

Generally speaking I'd still make the distinction that those are professional programs rather than academic in orientation.

[heartlikealion]

I have an MA in a completely unrelated field. It certainly didn't help me trying to figure out basic chemistry problems today. 😳

I outsource everything I don't feel I can teach well.

 

Good point!

 

If ds went to brick & mortar school this year they would be doing a bug collection. Translation, I would be helping do a bug collection. Instead, we're signing him up for botany at the co-op which will entail him doing a leaf collection. Now I feel like I can mentally check off "did some collection for science" off a list lol. I'm thinking of buying the DK plant book to go along with that. Dh can probably be way more helpful in that stuff than me, too, so if we need to do any of the collecting at home he can probably be in charge of that or at least help us.

 

[luuknam]

Some college. I have enough college credits to have a BA, but not in the right classes (switched majors/colleges, then got sidetracked exploring a different 3rd major, then the requirements for the 2nd major changed and I stopped). People assume I graduated college, just because of my personality, though I rarely talk about college and certainly don't try to mislead them. I try to avoid the topic. I guess I feel like I went to college, and since I have credits I feel...fulfilled? in this section, but it does make me annoyed/vaguely sad that I don't have an actual degree. I think about going back, but it isn't the best option for my current situation, and I just don't have the drive/passion to really make a go of it right now. 

 

 

Given your kids' ages, it would probably make sense to wait to finish that degree until just before you're planning on re-entering the workforce (if you're planning on doing that, and if you're not currently working already). I figure that having a 'fresh' degree then would probably be better than having one now and then waiting several years before using it. Except, of course, if something were to happen to DW, in which case I'd have to get a job now. Ideally, I'd like to finish my BS now and then do an MS while my youngest is in high school, but we'll see. At least I'm still young(ish).

[DawnM]

Plenty of clinical health programs award a M.S. or M.A. Speech & Language Pathology is sometimes a M.S. and sometimes a M.A., typically depending on whether it is part of the School of Education vs. the School of Health Professions. Ditto for Occupational Therapy. Audiology is now a clinical doctorate (AudD.) but until recently it was a M.S. or M.A.

 

 

I actually wish I had gone into Audiology years ago.  It is in high demand and pays more than a teacher or school counselor.  And it is one on one or very small groups, so dealing with classroom discipline isn't a huge issue.  

 

I think now it is just too much for me to go back and work full time.  If I go back at this point, I will finish up my School Psych.  It pays a little more, although the job prospects aren't that great.  

 

Or, I will just remain a school counselor until I retire and retire at a lower rate.  Not the end of the world.

[Arcadia]

I think now it is just too much for me to go back and work full time. If I go back at this point, I will finish up my School Psych. It pays a little more, although the job prospects aren't that great.

The psychologist that tested my kids is a retired school psychologist who still works ad-hoc for the school district. She was a lot more affordable that the psychologists at a private testing center that does LD and IQ testing.

 

There is a demand for private school counselors here for college applications guidance by public school parents because the public school counselors are overloaded.

[ScoutTN]

I graduated from a prestigious NE boarding school.  I have a BA and an MA. Not sure that my degree of education has anything at all to do with my degrees, though!

 

High school was a waste of time because I was unhappy and barely scraped through. A Lord of the Flies type experience. Lots of learning, most of it not academic. 

 

I loafed in undergrad (at a very selective public university), learning many truly useful lessons, just not from books or professors. I worked hard in a few classes, read voraciously all the time, enjoyed new intellectual vistas, and enjoyed interacting with and learning from a wide variety of people. I just rarely studied what was actually assigned and preferred to work making money over going to class. 

 

I studied hard in grad school at a small, not-renowned school and grew tremendously in both academic and personal ways. The years in grad school and immediately after were by far the most intellectually demanding of my life. Learning in true community was a powerful experience. 

 

 

 

 

 

[DawnM]

The psychologist that tested my kids is a retired school psychologist who still works ad-hoc for the school district. She was a lot more affordable that the psychologists at a private testing center that does LD and IQ testing.

 

There is a demand for private school counselors here for college applications guidance by public school parents because the public school counselors are overloaded.

 

I am WAY too invested in the state retirement system to get out and do private and lose it.  

[Arcadia]

I am WAY too invested in the state retirement system to get out and do private and lose it.

I meant to be a public school psychologist until retirement and then work as a private psychologist after retirement because there is a market for private psychologists especially those experienced in 2E.

[DawnM]

I meant to be a public school psychologist until retirement and then work as a private psychologist after retirement because there is a market for private psychologists especially those experienced in 2E.

 

If I retire before age 70 I will keep that in mind!

 

:lol:

 

That is what happens when you take 10 years off to raise kids......you get behind.  I could still retire at a lower rate, but for the higher rate, I will be working a long time.

[Moonhawk]

I abandoned my education major in my junior year, having decided to go to law school instead.  My advisor suggested the Bachelor of General Studies, which allowed me to build my own "major" from a combination that included a minimum of credits from various areas.  I did end up having more credits than most graduates, but not as many as if I'd started a new major at that time.  Is that a possibility for you?  It was long ago, and I don't know if BGS even exists any more.

I looked at the last university I was at. they have "general studies" with emphasis: entertainment emphasis, social emphasis, science and health emphasis, etc. I'd have to see if my credits would fill up enough of an emphasis. Or what I'd need to do. If there was a "general studies, general emphasis" I'd probably be good, lol. 

 

Given your kids' ages, it would probably make sense to wait to finish that degree until just before you're planning on re-entering the workforce (if you're planning on doing that, and if you're not currently working already). I figure that having a 'fresh' degree then would probably be better than having one now and then waiting several years before using it. Except, of course, if something were to happen to DW, in which case I'd have to get a job now. Ideally, I'd like to finish my BS now and then do an MS while my youngest is in high school, but we'll see. At least I'm still young(ish).

 

Yes, this has been my reasoning/solace recently: better to wait so the degree is more up-to-date. The sacrifices we'd have to make financially (loans), lifestyle (no homeschool), postponing long term plans (business would be totally on DH so forward momentum would stall), just don't add up to the amount of benefit I'd see out of it immediately (dust on shelf). And, if the business goes well, I probably won't use the degree for a long time. If the business completely tanks, or something happens to DH, well that would change things, but it's a calculated risk. 

[fralala]

I have my AAS in Early Childhood Education. DH has his PhD in Biochemistry. 

 

I do English, Writing, Spelling, Latin, Art, Comprehension, Reading, Vocabulary for our older son and everything for our younger son. DH takes care of Math, Science and History for our older son. 

 

Interestingly, for early childhood, my spouse and I have actually found the opposite to be true: the higher our educational attainment in a subject area, the less patience and ability we have for teaching little kids at an elementary level. I'm going to leave the calculus to him, but he's absolutely terrible at moving in any logical order or sequence when it comes to math and science-- he wants to skip ahead to the things he finds interesting and that stimulate his mind, and to share this with kids who are totally lost but trying desperately to hang on. And I understand the, "What? You don't just get that? Isn't it just intuitive?" because it's absolutely my impulse with the subjects I know so well I can't remember ever struggling with.

 

It's good to have the confidence to teach a subject, I think, along with the humility to approach it with a beginner's mind (to borrow from the Zen concept).

[Ausmumof3]

Interestingly, for early childhood, my spouse and I have actually found the opposite to be true: the higher our educational attainment in a subject area, the less patience and ability we have for teaching little kids at an elementary level. I'm going to leave the calculus to him, but he's absolutely terrible at moving in any logical order or sequence when it comes to math and science-- he wants to skip ahead to the things he finds interesting and that stimulate his mind, and to share this with kids who are totally lost but trying desperately to hang on. And I understand the, "What? You don't just get that? Isn't it just intuitive?" because it's absolutely my impulse with the subjects I know so well I can't remember ever struggling with.

 

It's good to have the confidence to teach a subject, I think, along with the humility to approach it with a beginner's mind (to borrow from the Zen concept).

I find this. I am a far better teacher on the stuff that is new and therefore interesting to me than the stuff I know well.

 

I suspect I'm not really a natural teacher though so most of our homechool looks more like "assisted learning"

[Bluegoat]

Interestingly, for early childhood, my spouse and I have actually found the opposite to be true: the higher our educational attainment in a subject area, the less patience and ability we have for teaching little kids at an elementary level. I'm going to leave the calculus to him, but he's absolutely terrible at moving in any logical order or sequence when it comes to math and science-- he wants to skip ahead to the things he finds interesting and that stimulate his mind, and to share this with kids who are totally lost but trying desperately to hang on. And I understand the, "What? You don't just get that? Isn't it just intuitive?" because it's absolutely my impulse with the subjects I know so well I can't remember ever struggling with.

 

It's good to have the confidence to teach a subject, I think, along with the humility to approach it with a beginner's mind (to borrow from the Zen concept).

 

We haven't found quite that, in so far as interest goes.  My mathy dh is happy to teach math, and it just isn't my favourite thing.

 

But my kids, at the elementary level, do find it easier to have me teach it most of they time.  They feel like dh skips steps and assumes they know things which they don't.  And I can see when he teaches them that he doesn't point out things that they find helpful.  I think it is just too intuitive for him.

Edited August 10, 2017 by Bluegoat

[2_girls_mommy]

I completed an Associate's Degree, plus hours towards a bachelor's I haven't finished. I put a check on some college, but I think there should be one towards an Associate's. 

[nixpix5]

I actually wish I had gone into Audiology years ago. It is in high demand and pays more than a teacher or school counselor. And it is one on one or very small groups, so dealing with classroom discipline isn't a huge issue.

 

I think now it is just too much for me to go back and work full time. If I go back at this point, I will finish up my School Psych. It pays a little more, although the job prospects aren't that great.

 

Or, I will just remain a school counselor until I retire and retire at a lower rate. Not the end of the world.

Audiology is my "wish I had more time I would be a..." passion. I just didn't even know this career existed until my daughter was born with hearing loss. Their job just looks so fun! Here in Washington State though, depending upon where you work, Audiologists and School Psychs make comparable salaries.

[FaithManor]

I agree about adding voting for Associate's Degree because that is completion of a degree vs. having only taken a semester or two of college.

 

I also think there may need to be a professional licensing category. Paramedic School is a program that is college level and six semesters of intensive study because they do not take summers off or really, any of the breaks that college students get. So it isn't traditional college, but it is college level study, and at its terminus is medical licensing, but not really a trade either. There are a few other professional programs like this that are kind of their own little niches without traditional terminology to describe the education.

 

It might even need to be "holds one professional license" vs. "holds multiple professional licenses". I know of firefighters with A.A. degrees in Fire Science who also hold EMT licenses as well as FEMA certifications, and others as well.

Edited August 10, 2017 by FaithManor

[Liz CA]

I agree about adding voting for Associate's Degree because that is completion of a degree vs. having only taken a semester or two of college.

 

I also think there may need to be a professional licensing category.  Paramedic School is program that is college level and six semesters of intensive study because they do not take summers off or really, any of the breaks that college students get. So it isn't traditional college, but it is college level study, and at it's terminus is medical licensing, but not really a trade either. There are a few other professional programs like this that are kind of their own little niches without traditional terminology to describe the education.

 

It might even need to be "holds one professional license" vs. "holds multiple professional licenses". I know of firefighters with A.A. degrees in Fire Science who also hold EMT licenses as well as FEMA certifications, and others as well.

 

Your post set me straight on Associate's Degrees. I always thought them as rather useless. When I got one just "accidentally" on my way to the BA, I tossed the piece of paper into the drawer. And in my field it would not mean much...however, as you have pointed out, it is the completion of a degree and come to think of it, I know firefighters and even some law enforcement who started with an Associate's.

[DawnM]

Audiology is my "wish I had more time I would be a..." passion. I just didn't even know this career existed until my daughter was born with hearing loss. Their job just looks so fun! Here in Washington State though, depending upon where you work, Audiologists and School Psychs make comparable salaries.

 

Yes, here as well.  However, the jobs are more plentiful for Audiologists/Speech Therapists!

[FaithManor]

Your post set me straight on Associate's Degrees. I always thought them as rather useless. When I got one just "accidentally" on my way to the BA, I tossed the piece of paper into the drawer. And in my field it would not mean much...however, as you have pointed out, it is the completion of a degree and come to think of it, I know firefighters and even some law enforcement who started with an Associate's.

Right. We would not consider an ADN to be uneducated past high school due to lacking a BSRN, and yet it is more than "some college" as many would think of it. So in terms of formal education there is a lot more to say than high school, trades, some college, bachelor, masters, PH.D.

[Guest]

Well I'm technically a high school and college dropout due to life circumstances. I'm still very intelligent and well educated, but I had to leave high school to start college early (thus an equivalency) and ended up having babies instead of finishing my degree. It's not at all an issue of ability or even desire.

 

Don't fall into the trap of comparing time enrolled in school with quality or even quantity of education. One can be well educated with fairly minimal time spent in a traditional classroom and no official degrees. There is, as they say, more than one way to skin a cat ;)

Edited August 10, 2017 by Arctic Mama

[Wheres Toto]

I have a Bachelor degree in Business Administration, Marketing.  I have an Associates degree in Biology with only one course needed to complete a Bachelors degree (but that one course is Organic Chem 2 and I would have to retake Organic 1 and possible G Chem 1 and 2 in order to pass it at this point).  I have all coursework and the Praxis completed for Elementary Education but never did my student teaching.  I have a few medical CEU credits and one graduate level course completed.

 

I don't think much of it helps homeschooling, except maybe that it's only been 10 years since I took a college level math course instead of 30 years.

[nixpix5]

Yes, here as well. However, the jobs are more plentiful for Audiologists/Speech Therapists!

We actually have a school psych shortage in Washington State. It was one of the reasons I decided to work on my Ed.S. I was already a licensed Mental Health therapist and was lucky enough to segue into school counseling due to working as a director of a mental health program within a high school for addicted teens. This got my foot in the door of schools and was able to then easily get counseling jobs in private schools and with contracted groups that are stationed in public high schools here. I thought maybe I wanted to work in public schools as a school psych but honestly, I just love the one on one work with kids and teens and running small groups. One of my favorite parts of working in schools was running social thinking groups. It was a blast. Now that I am homeschooling I am taking a bit of time off but will probably transition back to private practice in the evenings next year. I like the flexibility of mental health counseling much more then the shackled to your lab bench hours of being a neurobiologist. I figure I have been lucky enough to have a few different careers so my DH would probably riot if I said I wanted to go be an audiologist now :)

 

SLPs have awesome jobs! My best friend is an SLP and I tap her for all of my speech and reading questions. Such a great career!

[Liz CA]

Yeah, but you get to say that...ðŸ˜

 

You'll have to excuse me. I have educational attainment envy. I want a do-over.

 

I am sure you heard about this before but someone like you can easily CLEP out of several units. When I went back to finish my degree work, I took over 15 units in CLEP. You study on your time and at your own pace. You go in, take the test. I immediately received the results - pass/fail and you move on.

Saves quite a bit in tuition. Back when I took the CLEP, I think I paid around $80 per test.

[DawnM]

We actually have a school psych shortage in Washington State. It was one of the reasons I decided to work on my Ed.S. I was already a licensed Mental Health therapist and was lucky enough to segue into school counseling due to working as a director of a mental health program within a high school for addicted teens. This got my foot in the door of schools and was able to then easily get counseling jobs in private schools and with contracted groups that are stationed in public high schools here. I thought maybe I wanted to work in public schools as a school psych but honestly, I just love the one on one work with kids and teens and running small groups. One of my favorite parts of working in schools was running social thinking groups. It was a blast. Now that I am homeschooling I am taking a bit of time off but will probably transition back to private practice in the evenings next year. I like the flexibility of mental health counseling much more then the shackled to your lab bench hours of being a neurobiologist. I figure I have been lucky enough to have a few different careers so my DH would probably riot if I said I wanted to go be an audiologist now :)

 

SLPs have awesome jobs! My best friend is an SLP and I tap her for all of my speech and reading questions. Such a great career!

 

I know when we were looking at moving to WA state eons ago (I went to college there) I was told I could do private counseling with my degree.  The other 2 states I have lived in don't allow that, unless I go back to school and get my clinical counseling license.

 

Interesting about your school psych shortage.  

 

I just went to 2 days of training for the new district I just got a job in, and they said they do have a teacher shortage.  No surprise there, I think most of the country is heading that way.....