playing violin - practice questions

[EmilyGF]

Hi everyone,

 

After 22 months of playing violin, dd8 seems to be doing well (sounding pretty good, making good progress, on the last song of Suzuki book 2). She enjoys learning new songs and playing violin. For example, she got it out to play for guests without being asked. She enjoys group class. She always does exactly what her teacher tells her at lesson.

 

But practice has been increasingly frustrating for me recently. She sometimes snarls and starts plucking while I talk. If I ask her to "choose one thing to work on" she'll always say, "the notes" (which would be fine if she were learning the piece or if this were the answer some of the time). 

 

I try to sandwich what she needs to improve with what she does well (but if she's like me, which I think she is, she probably tunes those out knowing they are the "required" positives). Because practicing is no longer fun (and it was fun for about 18 months) I don't like it and we're practicing less (maybe 20 minutes a day instead of 30). I think this means her progress is slower, and since her favorite thing is learning new songs, she gets more frustrated.

 

Another note is that her first teacher moved away in May and this is the sort of girl who is really connected to people. For a while she wouldn't make new friends because she felt like it was betraying her best friend.

 

ETA: She has a new teacher who is a good personality fit. Her new teacher is much more strict about exact correctness, but she's already crossed all those hurdles and is learning new songs. Both teachers have been bubbly young women in their twenties who are warm and friendly.

 

This is my Martha Stewart child who is well organized and well planned and possibly a perfectionist. 

 

How can I work on making things good again?

 

Emily

Edited August 2, 2017 by EmilyGF

[MamaChicken]

A couple ideas:

Play games. You can google them. Any practice task can be turned into a gamer

Use a white board to lay out the practice. Have the teacher give you a general idea of what to include. Set time or rep numbers for each task. Use a timer.

Reward with m&ms occasionally.

Start a 100 day practice challenge. Have a prize at 10 days, 25 days, etc. let your daughter plan the prizes. We did this as a family (we all took the challenge). We had prizes like pizza, a long bike ride, bowling, mini golf, a concert. The kids made it for 1000 days. This was probably the best practice thing we ever did.

Go see live music. Talk to the musicians. Buy the cd for your daughter.

Find a group or ensemble music opportunity for your daughter.

Play more games. I'm serious. My son is 13 and studying with a college prof at a very high level. We'll still break out a card game when he's in a funk.

Remember that doing hard things (like playing the violin) isn't always fun. Practicing is hard and sometimes discouraging, particularly if you feel like someone is aways evaluating you. My younger son does better when I'm not in the room. He knows he can ask for help is he needs it but he'd rather make mistakes by himself.

 

There are some great books, including Helping Parents Practice.

 

Ask your teacher to organize a beginning of the year parent forum where a couple of experienced parents talk about their experiences and answer questions.

 

Play a video every day on YouTube. One of our favorite teachers had a list called "Violin is not 10 Books". Let me see if I still have it.

 

Remember that it's worth it. There are so many benefits to learning To play an instrument well and it sounds like your daughter is off to a great start.

[MamaChicken]

Here's a link to the list in my long defunct blog: http://threesongsafterdinner.blogspot.com/2014/09/violin-isnt-10-books.html?m=1

[KSinNS]

It doesn't surprise me that things are getting difficult. About 1/2 way through book 2 things start to get difficult-especially with technique, and most kids will want to learn notes and not focus on the details, but the details become really necessary in order to progress further on. This frequently results in practice issues, and 8 is often a bit of a turning point for kids developmentally and musically. Some thoughts:

 

I find it important to acknowledge that it's hard work. Practice frequently is not fun, but it is important in order to do the fun stuff-learn new songs, play in ensembles, get better. Sarah Chang and Itzhak Perlman have some great quotes on how much they don't like practicing. 

 

It helps to have a list. We work on technique, scales, etudes, new songs, old songs (technique from lesson), then review (working on technical point). I'll intersperse some fiddle stuff in there for a "fun" part. The list can be written or implied (based on child), and some kids enjoy practicing more if they get involved in writing the list. Alternating "fun" and "necessary" is often a good strategy. And what will be fun depends on the kid. 

 

Limit practice time, with the teacher if necessary. 1/2 hour is not unreasonable at 8, but don't let it stretch out so long that the kiddo becomes overwhelmed or bored. Some kids can practice more than others. 

 

Games-can help, but it depends on the kid. At 8, games can make it easier, but I have noticed that there are kids who only practice because mom or dad makes it fun, which is a lot of work for mom and dad, and that backfire around 10 or 11 (again depending on the kid) when that is no longer enough motivation. I certainly use some, but fade them out as much as possible, and often bring them back when we need to get over a hurdle. You do want your kiddo to eventually take ownership of the violin, and if it's just fun, fun, fun, it can get in the way of that happening, because the kid needs to accept that work is necessary to learn the material, which allows them to get to the fun parts. 

[Tess in the Burbs]

my ds started violin this year as a teen, but his teacher said to practice well, not based on time.  She did say that for some kids, 20 min of good practice is more effective than 30 min of not being focused practice.  She expects him to play a song multiple times with the goal of improving something during that practice.  He was over practicing early on b/c he just wants to be able to play something awesome with no effort ;-)  But like i said, his teacher said to focus on a good practice session and not being long in length if the focus isn't there.  Which means he often does short practices but many a day.  

My dd does piano and when she's bored of the music she doesn't want to practice.  Could the teacher give some fun item to learn?  

[smily]

22 months is a short amount of time to go through 2 Suzuki books. Make sure she's doing lots of review (sounds like it won't be her favorite) and the teacher should be facilitating this as well as making sure all the foundational technique is super solid.

 

For my Suzuki violinists, a short amount of practice time is basically"goof off" time. They play around and learn to play whatever they want by ear (read: chicken dance, star wars cantina, etc. But NOT future Suzuki songs). But the rest of practice is super disciplined. And they get candy rewards based on how hard they try.

 

Her current level is really increasing in difficulty and if she loves playing she will have to tackle the tedious technique work. It pays off but not immediately. So yes, incorporating some games in practice time will help, but it's still hard work. And in my experience practicing with the parent is more about the parent/kid dynamic and respect than it is about playing the violin.

Best wishes!

[LMD]

I agree with lists but I would have it between her and her teacher. The teacher can write her a basic practice routine. Then she's arguing with the paper/teacher, not you!

[wintermom]

Agreeing with PPs about this being the time when things get hard, practicing gets longer, techniques get more challenging.  However, sound quality is getting better, which is great!  By Suzuki books 3 and 4, our Russian classically trained teacher started introducing technical exercises from the Schradieck book, as well as adding in scales and eventually double stop scales. These are not particularly "fun" for every child but they are amazing for building technique and add in variety. Yes, it's branching off from Suzuki, so it may not work with your teacher.

 

Not to burst any bubbles here, but to be honest, things aren't going to get easier as far as technique and the need for quality practice. I know that our teacher slowed the pace of going through the Suzuki repertoire in book 4, and focused on excellent quality and technique, as well as good intonation. Having group classes and playing in ensembles with others is really motivating for my dc. They work hard on their pieces so that they play well in their group. 

[EmilyGF]

It is encouraging to know that this is just a hard time in the book. Come to think of it, the end of book 1 was an uphill battle, too. We added to it, though, with a trip followed by a recital that put off a new piece by three weeks (no new piece for vacation, then polishing for recital). 

 

This helps me reframe where we are. 

 

I think my daughter has been so self motivated and driven until now that I just didn't know what to do when she wasn't the one driving practice. Thanks for the encouragement to just keep on over this hill - and I know the beginning of book 3 will be easier because the pieces are starting to "pop" out when I give her noodle time.

 

Emily

[KSinNS]

Glad you are feeling some perspective. The kid's interests will wax and wane. Totally normal at that age. Just a warning, the beginning of book 3 does not get easier technically like the beginning of book 2 (always depressing, but it helps to know :-}). The level of piece is about the same, and they are long-fortunately book 3 doesn't ramp up a ton in terms of difficulty-the last 2-3 are somewhat harder, but not the challenge of Boccherini or Gossec. . That being said, book 3 is lovely! My kids really liked it. And they grow so much musically through book 3. It's great that she is listening ahead. It'll really help.