Fast pass for school pick up?

[teachermom2834]

Is this a thing where you are?

 

I just found out the local middle school sells a limited number of "fast passes" to bypass the drop off/ pick up line. $100 and there is some kind of list you need to get on. You have to be "in the know" or have connections to be one of the select few.

 

I am kind of floored this is a thing. On the other hand I am sure I would be trying to get my hands one if I had a kid in the school. The line is insane.

 

Have you ever heard of this?

[Rachel]

What?!!?!

[Seasider]

Talk about your have and have nots. Don't guess they'll be talking about school uniforms at any upcoming PTA meetings.

[Rachel]

Talk about your have and have nots.

That's what I was thinking.

[Word Nerd]

I've heard many complaints about dropoff/pickup practices IRL and on social media from friends in different areas and types of schools, but that's a new one!

Edited July 17, 2017 by Word Nerd

[PeachyDoodle]

That's ridiculous. I would complain -- LOUDLY.

 

But then I still hold a grudge against the stupid teen boy who cut in the pick-up line at the middle school every. single. day. when I was in high school. (We were both there picking up younger siblings.) I despise people who are too good to wait their turn. :rolleyes:

[idnib]

No, this sounds terrible unless they are reserving them for people who have particular disabilities that make it difficult to sit in the car for a long time, and the line makes it hard to get to disabled parking.

 

I could also see giving it out to carpools, where parents are picking up 4 or more kids. Yes they could all be from one family, but likely they would be picking up at least one non-family kid and reducing the line by a car or two.

Edited July 17, 2017 by idnib

[heartlikealion]

I'm too cheap. I'll wait :lol:

 

Actually, our line wasn't too bad... I deliberately came early or late sometimes. Early because dd would nap in the car and I'd get some peace and quiet waiting for school to let out or late because ds wouldn't be organized or quick to get in the car at the speed the line demanded sometimes.

[heartlikealion]

Is this public or private school? Either way I'm thinking this is a clever way for the school to make money.

[teachermom2834]

No, this sounds terrible unless they are reserving them for people who have particular disabilities that make it difficult to sit in the car for a long time, and the line makes it hard to get to disabled parking.

 

I could also see giving it out to carpools, where parents are picking up 4 or more kids. Yes they could all be from one family, but likely they would be picking up at least one non-family kid and reducing the line by a car or two.

It is most definitely not for disabilities or carpool. A friend of mine got on the list because a teacher friend of ours told her who to call. And she paid $100.

 

I think it is terrible. In fact, I would not even believe it if I read about it on a message board.

[teachermom2834]

Is this public or private school? Either way I'm thinking this is a clever way for the school to make money.

Public

[bolt.]

I'm having trouble with the idea of a pick up line for middle school in the first place... how much greater is my astonishment with preferential passes available for cash.

 

(What is with pick up lines anyhow? Are school busses and ordinary classroom or school-door types of dismissal really that rare in countries other than Canada?)

[OneStepAtATime]

We had abhorrent lines at the schools here.  Really awful.  At one it was often an hour and a half to two hour wait to get a kid.  Who has time to sit for that long?  I could easily see people coming up with the money to try avoiding a line like that.  But this is really not right, IMHO, if it is only for those "in the know" and that have the financial resources to pay for that.   First come, first serve sign up sheet?  Yeah maybe.  Otherwise, nope, not right.  Private school is a different animal but public I'd be very unhappy, even if I was one of the privileged few that were with that in crowd and had the money.  

Edited July 17, 2017 by OneStepAtATime

[Caroline]

We only allow seniors to park at school, however, the school's foundation auctions off two parking spaces for juniors. They generally go for $5000 a piece. This money is used for teacher grants.

 

Lots of schools sell Queen of the Carpool. The money goes for lots of different things. At our local elementary school, it helps fund the science and computer teachers. It's a lot more than $100 for Queen of the Carpool, though, here.

[Caroline]

I'm having trouble with the idea of a pick up line for middle school in the first place... how much greater is my astonishment with preferential passes available for cash.

 

(What is with pick up lines anyhow? Are school busses and ordinary classroom or school-door types of dismissal really that rare in countries other than Canada?)

One day a week, my daughter has tennis practice right after school. She is picked up from school so she has time to get a quick snack and get to practice on time.

[DawnM]

In my new job, my "duty" is the carpool line.  Joy, joy.  I guess I will see what it is like.

I rarely take or pick up my kids.  Our rule once they went to local PS is that they take the bus until they can drive their own car.  Oldest (Sr. next year) drives.  Upcoming 8th grader rides the bus.

[OneStepAtATime]

I'm having trouble with the idea of a pick up line for middle school in the first place... how much greater is my astonishment with preferential passes available for cash.

 

(What is with pick up lines anyhow? Are school busses and ordinary classroom or school-door types of dismissal really that rare in countries other than Canada?)

Lots of kids in Texas ride buses since anyone beyond 2 miles gets bused by the school without cost (or at least it used to be that way).  Apparently that is not true in all states.  Unfortunately, there are some bus schedules here where kids are on the bus for a really long time.  My niece when she was in middle school would sometimes get out at 4 but not get home until 6 or later.  Therefore, when possible, her parents would try to find ways to get her a ride home.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by school-door type of dismissal.  Do you mean the student walking home?

[Daria]

We only allow seniors to park at school, however, the school's foundation auctions off two parking spaces for juniors. They generally go for $5000 a piece. This money is used for teacher grants.

 

Lots of schools sell Queen of the Carpool. The money goes for lots of different things. At our local elementary school, it helps fund the science and computer teachers. It's a lot more than $100 for Queen of the Carpool, though, here.

 

I've only seen it as an auction item, and it always goes for more than $100 here.  It's a big ticket item, raising a lot of money.

 

The people I know who have bought it generally have some kind of reason why carpool is particularly challenging for them.  For example, I have one friend whose kids go to 2 different schools, 25 miles apart, because of disability related issues.  Both are Catholic schools, which means no school bus. Neither is walking distance. The only reason she can do both pick ups and drop offs is because she has the "skip the line" pass at her young child's school.  

 

I know other families with kids with disabilities who simply can't handle the speed with which you need to transition in a carpool line, making for a rocky start.  So, they buy the parking space which lets them take a few minutes to settle their child at the start of the school day.  

 

Finally, I know families where the carpool pass is what makes juggling school and work possible, because it allows them to pick up a kid, drop at Grandma's and make it back to work in a 30 minute lunch break, or whatever.

 

If families are willing to pay for something that makes their routines work, and it doesn't impact me, and leads to more money in the school coffers, then it doesn't bother me.  However, the secretive nature of the list and needing to be "in the know" that OP describes, would. 

[bolt.]

One day a week, my daughter has tennis practice right after school. She is picked up from school so she has time to get a quick snack and get to practice on time.

Yeah, we have that too, but (after grade 2) the student simply walks out of the school and finds their parent instead of getting on the bus as they normally would. I don't know where a line up comes into it.

[Ravin]

I could see giving it out to carpools, but not charging individuals for it. I would protest that, loudly and often.

 

DD's school (enrichment program run by public school)'s pickup line is insane. They want you to have a placard thingie. We've never bothered. DD takes public transit home all but Mondays, and some days catches a ride with a friend.   DS's school is also crazy. DH will go through the line, but I would walk over on days I picked him up; when he goes back for 1st in a few week we'll have him walk home. 

[Daria]

Lots of kids in Texas ride buses since anyone beyond 2 miles gets bused by the school without cost (or at least it used to be that way).  Apparently that is not true in all states.  Unfortunately, there are some bus schedules here where kids are on the bus for a really long time.  My niece when she was in middle school would sometimes get out at 4 but not get home until 6 or later.  Therefore, when possible, her parents would try to find ways to get her a ride home.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by school-door type of dismissal.  Do you mean the student walking home?

 

Where we live we have the 2 mile bussing rule, but there are lots of kids that it doesn't apply to.  For one thing, they'll only drop you at your home, so a kid who goes to Grandma's or soccer practice afterschool needs to be picked up.  It also doesn't apply if you've transferred to a different school for a "choice" program like Spanish immersion.  However, there are also many families who either don't feel that their kids are ready to walk 2 miles unsupervised, or who don't want to walk 4 miles round trip to pick them up.   And, of course, private school kids either don't have buses or need to pay extra.  

 

We're in an urban enough area that having parents park and walk in to pick up at the school door doesn't work.  Parking around schools is enough of an issue here that there are usually long battles at the zoning commission about exactly how kids will be picked up and dropped off every time a school opens, moves, or adds spots.  There are at least 2 schools in our area which have agreements with the neighbors that no students will be driven to campus, or that kids will be driven only under very specific conditions (e.g. one school will allow you to drive if you have a carpool with at least 3 students, or if your student weighs less than 40 lbs.  They will also make an exception if you have written proof of a medical appointment).  They solve this problem by bussing the students to several alternate locations and having shorter carpool lines there.  

[JudoMom]

Yeah, we have that too, but (after grade 2) the student simply walks out of the school and finds their parent instead of getting on the bus as they normally would. I don't know where a line up comes into it.

The cars are in a line, not the kids.

 

The way I've seen them work is there is about 10-15 cars that are in the pickup zone. Kids go to their car when it's on the zone. As cars leave, others move up.

 

Does that make sense?

[Mergath]

I think it makes sense to let some people skip the line. Like, someone whose kid has to get to their chemo appointment by three or whatever. But letting the people who have enough disposable cash buy their way out of the pickup line while the single mom working two jobs has to sit and wait because she can't swing the hundred bucks is icky. I'd have a big problem with that if my child went to a public school that did that.

Edited July 18, 2017 by Mergath

[Daria]

Yeah, we have that too, but (after grade 2) the student simply walks out of the school and finds their parent instead of getting on the bus as they normally would. I don't know where a line up comes into it.

 

Where are the parents waiting?  

[bolt.]

Where are the parents waiting?

In the field chatting with each other, or in parked cars at pre-arranged nearby locations.

 

It wouldn't work to pick up the entire population of a school, but, the majority of students are either bussed home or walk home, or they go to after care. Picking up students (especially daily) is not the usual method of transportation for most students.

[regentrude]

Yeah, we have that too, but (after grade 2) the student simply walks out of the school and finds their parent instead of getting on the bus as they normally would. I don't know where a line up comes into it.

 

Oh, but that's "not allowed", for liability reasons.

Parents get in line with their cars half an hour before school is dismissed. Kids are allowed to only walk to the 2-3 cars that are directly in front of the school, and have to wait until their parents are in that zone.

Mornings is similar; people wait in line to drop off their kids directly at the school entrance. They could save a lot of time if they just let them get out half a block away and walk - but oh no, walking!

 

My biggest peeve at the middle school was that the kids who were walking (and parents had to get them a special pass) had to stay at school until all car riders had left. In effect it was punishing the kids for walking; they were forced to stay at school for 20 minutes longer than everybody else. 

[ErinE]

I'm having trouble with the idea of a pick up line for middle school in the first place... how much greater is my astonishment with preferential passes available for cash.

 

(What is with pick up lines anyhow? Are school busses and ordinary classroom or school-door types of dismissal really that rare in countries other than Canada?)

 

The local schools don't do bus routes within 1.5 miles of the school. There aren't good sidewalks for certain homes and neighborhoods within that radius. And many parents do drop off/pick up their kids even when there are good sidewalks. My kids usually walk as we live at most 3/4 mile from the schools, but in the shoulder months, when the afternoon heat is 95+, I will pick up my kids.

[bolt.]

Oh, but that's "not allowed", for liability reasons.

Parents get in line with their cars half an hour before school is dismissed. Kids are allowed to only walk to the 2-3 cars that are directly in front of the school, and have to wait until their parents are in that zone.

Mornings is similar; people wait in line to drop off their kids directly at the school entrance. They could save a lot of time if they just let them get out half a block away and walk - but oh no, walking!

 

My biggest peeve at the middle school was that the kids who were walking (and parents had to get them a special pass) had to stay at school until all car riders had left. In effect it was punishing the kids for walking; they were forced to stay at school for 20 minutes longer than everybody else.

I think that's the difference. There is no sense of "liability" here for the choices parents make for their children before or after school hours.

 

Making rules beyond school property or detaining children after dismissal would be seen as an incredible over reach of school authority. The boundaries of school property and school hours are really clear.

 

If a parent isn't there to care appropriately for their child after the school releases them, it's more likely that the school will call protective services than that the parent would consider the school to blame! (Neither of those is really likely. It's most likely that the child would wait in the office while calls were made to try to get ahold of a parent or emergency contact.)

 

Only the smallest kids are handed off with eye contact from teacher to parent.

[regentrude]

I think that's the difference. There is no sense of "liability" here for the choices parents make for their children before or after school hours.

 

Making rules beyond school property or detaining children after dismissal would be seen as an incredible over reach of school authority. The boundaries of school property and school hours are really clear.

 

Yeah, but this is the US. In this sue-happy society, schools are doing everything to cover their asses.

Edited July 17, 2017 by regentrude

[JumpyTheFrog]

I don't like the idea of fast passes being sold. If the line is too long, it needs to be solved some other way, not by just charging parents extra.

[Crimson Wife]

My DD's elementary school auction has a reserved parking place in the staff lot as one of the items. I have no idea how much it goes for because I just walk my DD to & from school.

 

I don't have a problem with it being used as a fundraiser so long as everyone has the opportunity to bid. Keeping it all "hush hush" is wrong IMHO.

[Daria]

I think that's the difference. There is no sense of "liability" here for the choices parents make for their children before or after school hours.

 

Making rules beyond school property or detaining children after dismissal would be seen as an incredible over reach of school authority. The boundaries of school property and school hours are really clear.

 

If a parent isn't there to care appropriately for their child after the school releases them, it's more likely that the school will call protective services than that the parent would consider the school to blame! (Neither of those is really likely. It's most likely that the child would wait in the office while calls were made to try to get ahold of a parent or emergency contact.)

 

Only the smallest kids are handed off with eye contact from teacher to parent.

 

As a school administrator, I don't think it's so much about "liability" as it is about efficiency.

 

I've worked at, and sent my kid to, many schools, and only one of them has been in a situation where there was enough parking in the neighborhood or on campus for what you describe to work.  Even if 1/10th of the parents drive and pick up at our local middle school, that would be 130 cars circling the block and fighting for spaces.   So there needs to be a system where people in cars can get to their kids, and systems usually mean lines.

 

And it needs to be safe, and relatively efficient.  I don't worry about my students getting hit by cars because I might be "liable".  I worry because they are people I care about, and I don't want to see them hurt.  

 

I agree that holding back all the walkers to wait for the carpool line is a little absurd, and provides an incentive for parents to pick up to speed things up..  At our middle school it was the reverse.  The bell rang, walkers left and bus kids headed to their buses.   The carpool parents were asked to stay still until the buses had rolled out, which meant that by the time they started driving, there weren't kids crossing the parking lot in front of them.  Middle schoolers were also allowed to walk down the carpool line, looking for their ride.  

[bolt.]

As a school administrator, I don't think it's so much about "liability" as it is about efficiency.

 

I've worked at, and sent my kid to, many schools, and only one of them has been in a situation where there was enough parking in the neighborhood or on campus for what you describe to work. Even if 1/10th of the parents drive and pick up at our local middle school, that would be 130 cars circling the block and fighting for spaces. So there needs to be a system where people in cars can get to their kids, and systems usually mean lines.

 

And it needs to be safe, and relatively efficient. I don't worry about my students getting hit by cars because I might be "liable". I worry because they are people I care about, and I don't want to see them hurt.

 

I agree that holding back all the walkers to wait for the carpool line is a little absurd, and provides an incentive for parents to pick up to speed things up.. At our middle school it was the reverse. The bell rang, walkers left and bus kids headed to their buses. The carpool parents were asked to stay still until the buses had rolled out, which meant that by the time they started driving, there weren't kids crossing the parking lot in front of them. Middle schoolers were also allowed to walk down the carpool line, looking for their ride.

Yeah, I can see that it wouldn't work with large numbers of pick-up parents. I'm mostly surprised at the idea that so many parents aren't using bussing, or that bussing/walking is not the norm for various other reasons. Bussing is cheap and efficient, and it seems to have been the norm until recently. Pick up lines feel recent to me. Edited July 17, 2017 by bolt.

[ktgrok]

In the field chatting with each other, or in parked cars at pre-arranged nearby locations.

 

It wouldn't work to pick up the entire population of a school, but, the majority of students are either bussed home or walk home, or they go to after care. Picking up students (especially daily) is not the usual method of transportation for most students.

 

There is no where around the school to park to meet the child. They are in neighborhoods, so you'd be parking on the road in a residential area..which some people do but it isn't really a great idea. It makes it very difficult to drive down the street with cars parked on the street (the streets are not wide enough for it). The actual parking lot at the school is only big enough for the staff and a few visitors. 

[ktgrok]

Yeah, I can see that it wouldn't work with large numbers of pick-up parents. I'm mostly surprised at the idea that so many parents aren't using bussing, or that bussing/walking is not the norm for various other reasons. Bussing is cheap and efficient, and it seems to have been the norm until recently. Pick up lines feel recent to me.

 

Yes to this, I walked or rode my bike when I was in school, as I was too close to be bussed (2 mile radius). But not many people do anymore. (my kids did) In fact, when a cashier at the department store heard me say my son was walking she was shocked and dismayed I'd let him do something so reckless. um, it's 1/3 of a mile, in an area with lots of people, and a crossing guard!

[Daria]

Yeah, I can see that it wouldn't work with large numbers of pick-up parents. I'm mostly surprised at the idea that so many parents aren't using bussing, or that bussing/walking is not the norm for various other reasons. Bussing is cheap and efficient, and it seems to have been the norm until recently. Pick up lines feel recent to me.

 

When I was in school in Ottawa, the rules were similar to the rules in my current county.  Buses were only for kids who lived beyond a certain distance, and in more urban areas that meant that many kids didn't qualify.  

 

I do think that some of this has changed, in part because of the number of families where all the parents work.  I know that I drove my kid to a school that was within walking distance, because I felt that he was too young to walk alone, and because if I'd turned around and walked home to get my car to get to work, I wouldn't have made it on time.  Part of the issue is also changing norms around letting kids walk alone.

 

But part of it is also urban vs. less urban.  For schools located in densely populated areas you'll have a higher percentage of kids who don't qualify for the bus, and schools will be larger.  Those two things combined will mean many more parents picking up, which can lead to traffic issues.   

[regentrude]

Yeah, I can see that it wouldn't work with large numbers of pick-up parents. I'm mostly surprised at the idea that so many parents aren't using bussing, or that bussing/walking is not the norm for various other reasons. Bussing is cheap and efficient, and it seems to have been the norm until recently. Pick up lines feel recent to me.

 

Bussing is cheap for the parents (expensive for teh school, though), but definitely not efficient. If a child spends an hour on the bus as opposed to fifteen minutes in the car, I can see why parents do not choose bussing.

Some kids are getting picked up at 7am for an 8:10am starting time and don't arrive at home until after 4pm when school is out at 3. 

Edited July 18, 2017 by regentrude

[regentrude]

Yes to this, I walked or rode my bike when I was in school, as I was too close to be bussed (2 mile radius). But not many people do anymore. (my kids did) In fact, when a cashier at the department store heard me say my son was walking she was shocked and dismayed I'd let him do something so reckless. um, it's 1/3 of a mile, in an area with lots of people, and a crossing guard!

 

We live 0.7 mile from the elementary school. We were the only family on our street that walked to school. Everybody else drove (ironically, all SAH parents, who then returned home). I had people stop and offer me rides, some even 300 yards from the school.

[PeachyDoodle]

Yeah, I can see that it wouldn't work with large numbers of pick-up parents. I'm mostly surprised at the idea that so many parents aren't using bussing, or that bussing/walking is not the norm for various other reasons. Bussing is cheap and efficient, and it seems to have been the norm until recently. Pick up lines feel recent to me.

 

My mom picked us up from school in the 80's and 90's, until I was old enough to drive. It was pretty common here then, and even when my mom was in school, she often bummed rides from older friends in order to keep from having to ride the bus. The routes are long and spread out, and you could easily be on the bus for two hours. We are over 5 miles from our assigned elementary school, on roads with a 55mph speed limit and no sidewalks. Almost no one walks to school here.

[MooCow]

At my kids former elementary school they have a "spot" you buy "sponsoring" the carnival they put on.

 

It's totally ridiculous.

[Wheres Toto]

Our town generally has "courtesy bussing".  Every kid can take the bus, even if they live right next to the school (and there is a kid that used to get on right before the bus turned into the school driveway).    The state has the 2 mile rule, but there are no sidewalks and lots of hilly, winding roads in town so even within that 2 miles there are a lot of places it isn't safe.   One year when the state drastically cut budgets, they cut out the courtesy bussing but you could pay to have your kid bussed still if you wanted to.  Many people did but enough didn't that the lines out onto the main road were crazy during morning drop-off and afternoon pick-up.   Crazy enough that people trying to get to work (it was a main connecting road) would end up sitting behind cars for 30 minutes waiting to be able to pass the school.   Luckily it was only one year before it went back to the majority of kids taking the bus.  There are a few older kids that walk home if they are right off that main road (it's a K-8 school).

 

If the bus driver sees a bear at a bus stop and no parent is there, they will not stop, take the kids back to school, and the parents will have to pick them up there.

[TXBeth]

I would happily let my kids walk to school if we lived close enough, but they will ride a school bus over my dead body.

[regentrude]

If the bus driver sees a bear at a bus stop and no parent is there, they will not stop, take the kids back to school, and the parents will have to pick them up there.

 

That makes sense. Where do you live?

[Wheres Toto]

That makes sense. Where do you live?

 

New Jersey.  We have a real bear problem in our area.

[luuknam]

We had abhorrent lines at the schools here.  Really awful.  At one it was often an hour and a half to two hour wait to get a kid. 

 

Why on earth wouldn't you just tell the kid to walk several blocks, and then meet them there 10 min after school ends or w/e? Maybe not practical for younger elementary aged kids, but definitely for middle schoolers. 

 

Oh, but that's "not allowed", for liability reasons.

Parents get in line with their cars half an hour before school is dismissed. Kids are allowed to only walk to the 2-3 cars that are directly in front of the school, and have to wait until their parents are in that zone.

Mornings is similar; people wait in line to drop off their kids directly at the school entrance. They could save a lot of time if they just let them get out half a block away and walk - but oh no, walking!

 

My biggest peeve at the middle school was that the kids who were walking (and parents had to get them a special pass) had to stay at school until all car riders had left. In effect it was punishing the kids for walking; they were forced to stay at school for 20 minutes longer than everybody else. 

 

 

That's crazy for middle school, and I'd seriously contemplate suing the district over that (some class action thing maybe?). 

[scoutingmom]

Yeah, I can see that it wouldn't work with large numbers of pick-up parents. I'm mostly surprised at the idea that so many parents aren't using bussing, or that bussing/walking is not the norm for various other reasons. Bussing is cheap and efficient, and it seems to have been the norm until recently. Pick up lines feel recent to me.

Watch "Mr. Mom" that movie is from the early 80's and shows a pickup line at the kid's school. (It took him a while to learn the rules)

 

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk

[heartlikealion]

Pick up lines feel recent to me, too. It's all foggy now, but I think my mom drove us sometimes. I do remember walking and not having a school bus to our home at my first elem. school. I don't recall a "pick up line" scenario, though. Like an organized thing with parents pulling up and teachers assisting. I think buses parked right out front (in jr. high) so not sure where parents were to go. But like I said it's all kind of a blur now.

 

I don't remember really thinking about pick up lines til a few years ago when my mother-in-law told us about picking up the grandkids and sitting outside the school for 30 min. Then I experienced it for the first time when ds went to school and the school van solution fell through for us. Some of the adults involved could be quite rude (pull up!!) and a bit ignorant (trying to get my then 8 yr old in the front seat. Um no he sits in the back).

Edited July 18, 2017 by heartlikealion

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

Yikes.  

 

As much as my American self yearns for a house and yard, the suburban sprawl really does make some things crazy difficult.  

[Rachel]

Pick up lines were not a thing when I was growing up and neither was bussing in town. Kids rode their bikes or walked to school and a few were dropped off. Kids were also allowed to play outside at the school before and after school, schools around here don't allow that anymore. I think that's part of why car lines are such a big deal now, parents need to have their kids picked up in a smaller time frame. When my mom picked me up, she had me play 15-20 minutes first so there wasn't a line to wait.

 

Where I currently live my kids are within one mile of a school where they could walk or ride a bike to, it's all in neighborhoods but the neighborhood nearest the school has no sidewalks. I would be ok with my 7 and 9 year getting there without me, but not my 5 year old. The way the roads are it would take me 15 minutes to drive them. The school we are districted to attend does not have a sidewalk from our neighborhood and it's a narrow country road. The bus picks our neighbor kids up at 6:45 for a 7:40 start time even though we are a mile from the school. If we didn't homeschool, I would drive them but I would wait until the line died down so I wouldn't have to sit so long.

[bettyandbob]

There's a private school that auctions something like that near me.