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Does this teach racism? (sorting)


Janeway
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Crazy idea came to my head. I look around and see what I do and want to make super sure I am not teaching racism, even though I am not a racist, if anything I do or expose my children to might be teaching it. Nope. I see nothing. My children have dolls of all races. 7 yr old was playing a video game and picked a black person to be his wife just because she was most like us. Daughter loves Disney princesses which might be an issue, except she loves Rapunzel, Elsa, and Tiana the best. Ok..seems ok....

 

Then today, I got out the counting bears. (don't roll your eyes, just really think about this) and showed them to my toddler. I sat them on the table and stood the bears up. I had a red one, blue, green, yellow, and purple up front. Then I handed him another red one and asked him where it goes. He puts it by the purple one. And I said, "look, this is how we do it, red bears go with red bears" and I picked up a purple one and said "see, purple goes with purple" And explained to him that bears need to stay with their own color. Then I sat back and thought...ummm.....and then I actually shoved all the bears together and said bears of all colors like to play with each other, everyone is different and that is fun. 

 

AM I overreacting? Because perhaps teaching putting like colors with each other so early is such an easy skill to teach a toddler, but it might ingrain in his head these ideas. Not like he cannot wait until he is older to learn to catagorize colors? I know we go with the colors first thing because it is easy for toddlers. But perhaps I skip this step and move on to animals or shapes or something. I know that would be harder and he is probably still too young.

 

What do you think? Am I just seriously over thinking this? Are you laughing at me now and saying "wow! I always knew Janeway was off her rocker, but this proves it!" 

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You're overreacting and overthinking. People like to group things and categorize, but that doesn't mean they're automatically holding racist tendencies by doing it. It's okay. As he ages I say it's great to get into discussions on what is and isn't different among cultures and some of the wrong ideas about it through history, but at this age I'd just let him sort as he wants. Some little kids can be very rigid about that but I wouldn't jump to it being a sociopolitical problem just yet ;)

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Don't overthink it. However if you are worried, do sorting with things like Lego bricks? My kids enjoyed sorting Lego by color and size when they were toddlers. They were also sorting gummibär and skittles but that is because they don't like certain flavors. Then they sorted M&M because they wonder if each pack has equal amounts of each color.

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Ime one doesn't explain it that way. most kids would look at the pattern and extend, not look at colors and sort. So if the student doesn't do what you expect,ask him to explain his reasoning. If you had asked to sort by color or size he would have done so. You basically asked 'whats next' so dc did what you would have done and made that bear next in the line he saw set up. In the end, they realize there are all sorts of attributes, not just color. You do have bears of more than one size?

 

Have fun with the next holiday with candy. Sorting and using them like pattern blocks to make shapes is fun.

Edited by Heigh Ho
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I do think you are overthinking it, but you can certainly sort and pattern other ways if it bothers you. You can use the bears this way: "I'm making a pattern, see? Red bear, yellow bear, green bear. Red bear, yellow bear....green bear." You can sort other things by other descriptors: shapes, size, tactile effect. I would not worry that the concept is advanced; I did these things with my kids very young and they learned it. For example, I had blocks that were not only square, triangle, rectangle, but I also had a cone, a sphere, a cube. I taught my kids parallelogram, lol.

 

I don't think it was a horrible idea to push them together and say they all like to play with each other, no matter what color they are, but I do think it's possible to go to far the other way, as if we are paranoid kids may notice different races. They will notice. It's okay.

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Are we seriously debating the role of counting bears in respect to developing racism?

 

There.are.no.words. I feel like this conversation needs a hashtag.

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Well, I guess it could be racist if you explained to your child that all the red bears work in construction, the yellow bears clean houses, and green bears can grow up to be doctors and lawyers.  Otherwise...  

 

Yeah, sorry, this is so ridiculous.  Being able to identify skin tones, and *gasp* say person x and person y have the same skin tone, which is different than person z... is not racism.  It's observation of a natural phenomenon related to melatonin concentrations.  Pretending differences don't exist is not the same thing as not being racist.  And noticing differences is not the same thing as racism.  

 

Just... no.

 

 

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I vote absolutely not. And I can't imagine anyone will say it will.

 

I will say though, since Janeway is thinking about it. I think it's totally natural for kids to not only sort the bears by color, but also to sort people by color in their heads. And that's one of the reasons that it's good to not only have dolls and show movies (which are awesome, excellent steps!) but also to explicitly point out that in the past people have tried to sort people by race and that we have to actively decide not to do that. This is basically the research presented in Nurtureshock.

 

But rainbow bears aren't going to encourage that or discourage it. Nor will sorting shapes. Or sorting numbers. Or anything... I can see a mild relationship in that our brains like to put things in categories and young children will learn to do that (even without the bears and the activities) as part of learning to make sense of the world. And that can become a negative thing for kids by elementary school because they'll inevitably want to sort people as well - nice and mean, adult and child, child and baby, tall and short, girls and boys, black and white. So we have to talk to them about that. But probably in a separate way from sorting primary colors and toys.

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Now, if Janeway had asked if she was inadvertently teaching her children to enjoy the Grateful Dead, I think I'd give a resounding yes. ;)

Hahaha!

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Now, if Janeway had asked if she was inadvertently teaching her children to enjoy the Grateful Dead, I think I'd give a resounding yes. ;)

 

I intentionally taught my children to enjoy the Grateful Dead starting at a very young age--one must have their priorities.

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I intentionally taught my children to enjoy the Grateful Dead starting at a very young age--one must have their priorities.

Yes! Priorities. My kids learned to like the Dead early, along with Indigo Girls and Ben Folds. That was very intentional.

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I can imagine this being a concern if you live in a place with very little diversity ... everyone is Irish except a small family of color, for example . As it is there is such a variety of skin tones that few people are really easy to categorize , at least in my world .

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Crazy idea came to my head. I look around and see what I do and want to make super sure I am not teaching racism, even though I am not a racist, if anything I do or expose my children to might be teaching it. Nope. I see nothing. My children have dolls of all races. 7 yr old was playing a video game and picked a black person to be his wife just because she was most like us. Daughter loves Disney princesses which might be an issue, except she loves Rapunzel, Elsa, and Tiana the best. Ok..seems ok....

 

Then today, I got out the counting bears. (don't roll your eyes, just really think about this) and showed them to my toddler. I sat them on the table and stood the bears up. I had a red one, blue, green, yellow, and purple up front. Then I handed him another red one and asked him where it goes. He puts it by the purple one. And I said, "look, this is how we do it, red bears go with red bears" and I picked up a purple one and said "see, purple goes with purple" And explained to him that bears need to stay with their own color. Then I sat back and thought...ummm.....and then I actually shoved all the bears together and said bears of all colors like to play with each other, everyone is different and that is fun.

 

AM I overreacting? Because perhaps teaching putting like colors with each other so early is such an easy skill to teach a toddler, but it might ingrain in his head these ideas. Not like he cannot wait until he is older to learn to catagorize colors? I know we go with the colors first thing because it is easy for toddlers. But perhaps I skip this step and move on to animals or shapes or something. I know that would be harder and he is probably still too young.

 

What do you think? Am I just seriously over thinking this? Are you laughing at me now and saying "wow! I always knew Janeway was off her rocker, but this proves it!"

We always knew you were off your rocker, Janeway, but this proves it! :lol:

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If it were, I don't even want to think about the implications of my decided preference for red gummy bears over those nasty, good for nothing green gummy bears.   :lol:

 

Fie on you--green gummi bears are the best! The best, I say! Fie!!!

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You are sooooooo welcome to all of my green gummy bears and "buttered popcorn" jelly bellies. I will live out my life as a candy bigot.

 

I have a weird love of the buttered popcorn jelly bellies. As a kid, when they were really new, I used to buy bags of just them and eat them in front of people to freak them out.

 

Dh won't eat any of the green candies though. He really likes candy and around Halloween he actually makes a whole bowl of the greens from everything.

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You are sooooooo welcome to all of my green gummy bears and "buttered popcorn" jelly bellies. I will live out my life as a candy bigot.

The buttered popcorn are my favorites!

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The first music my son ever heard was a Dark Star from Paris in 1972.

 

But despite my best efforts, I have not successfully drawn him into the cult of the Grateful Dead.

 

Bill (bad parent)

 

And I think counting bears are evil. No counting!

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You are sooooooo welcome to all of my green gummy bears and "buttered popcorn" jelly bellies. I will live out my life as a candy bigot.

 

Eww, no thank you on those popcorn jelly bellies. When we get a bag of jb's we immediately sort and toss out all the popcorn beans--buttered and caramel. I'm with you on those.

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You are sooooooo welcome to all of my green gummy bears and "buttered popcorn" jelly bellies. I will live out my life as a candy bigot.

Ugh! Those Buttered Popcorn jelly bellies! Some flavors should not be a jelly, clearly.

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I have a weird love of the buttered popcorn jelly bellies. As a kid, when they were really new, I used to buy bags of just them and eat them in front of people to freak them out.

 

Dh won't eat any of the green candies though. He really likes candy and around Halloween he actually makes a whole bowl of the greens from everything.

Have you ever had the Bertie Bot jelly bingo thing where you might be getting Kiwi or you might be getting Grass Clippings...might be Coconut, might be Gym Socks? Those are awful. I'm clearly not much of a gambler because we trashed those after a sleepover guest vomited over Rotten Fish or whatever flavor he got.

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Have you ever had the Bertie Bot jelly bingo thing where you might be getting Kiwi or you might be getting Grass Clippings...might be Coconut, might be Gym Socks? Those are awful. I'm clearly not much of a gambler because we trashed those after a sleepover guest vomited over Rotten Fish or whatever flavor he got.

 

My kids think those are a hoot. I find them pretty scary. I just happen to like the buttered popcorn!

 

I know, it's literally, in the whole universe, probably just me and Arctic Mama. I have almost never met anyone who agrees it's good.

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My kids think those are a hoot. I find them pretty scary. I just happen to like the buttered popcorn!

 

I know, it's literally, in the whole universe, probably just me and Arctic Mama. I have almost never met anyone who agrees it's good.

 

buttered popcorn used to be my favorite, when I ate jellybeans

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My kids think those are a hoot. I find them pretty scary. I just happen to like the buttered popcorn!

 

I know, it's literally, in the whole universe, probably just me and Arctic Mama. I have almost never met anyone who agrees it's good.

My husband and one of my friends like them too. Y'all are strange birds. Edited by LucyStoner
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I have a weird love of the buttered popcorn jelly bellies. As a kid, when they were really new, I used to buy bags of just them and eat them in front of people to freak them out.

 

Dh won't eat any of the green candies though. He really likes candy and around Halloween he actually makes a whole bowl of the greens from everything.

I'm coming to your house after next Halloween. Green is the BEST!!

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My kids think those are a hoot. I find them pretty scary. I just happen to like the buttered popcorn!

 

I know, it's literally, in the whole universe, probably just me and Arctic Mama. I have almost never met anyone who agrees it's good.

We will take our piles of delicious jelly beans and laugh at the unenlightened while sorting our bears guiltlessly.

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I agree. It's much better to teach kids to treat all people with kindness and respect.

And, according to research, to specifically acknowledge racism and teach kids explicitly about its effects and the need to avoid treating some people better than others because of their skin color or other factors.

 

The tendency among white parents who want to avoid racism has been to pretend racial issues don't exist--that hasn't been effective. Skin color is pretty obvious to kids and does become a way to sort people even without adult reinforcement. Seems we have to actively teach If we really want to make progress.

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And the Beanboozled Jelly Belly Challenge!

DH and the kids went through a Beanboozled phase. When one of them almost lost it over a dirty sock flavor, and another fumigated the kitchen chewing a skunk, I relegated them all to the back yard.

 

It's all fun and games til someone draws a vomit.

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DH and the kids went through a Beanboozled phase. When one of them almost lost it over a dirty sock flavor, and another fumigated the kitchen chewing a skunk, I relegated them all to the back yard.

 

It's all fun and games til someone draws a vomit.

 

:ack2:  :ack2:  :ack2:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

 

Oh man, you made me crack up with that one!

 

I saw today they have Dead Fish. WHY?!?! I would love to see the job description on the flavor developer. "Must have an excellent palate- ability to develop flavors that make people cry, heave, or vomit." 

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I don't know posters very well and their back stories....

 

Is this thread some kind of inside joke???

 

I don't think it was, but I think it might be from this point on!  :laugh:

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Color is just one way to categorize things and animals and people.  We can also categorize by size, shape, career, geography, etc.  Color is a physical characteristic, not a judgment.

 

If this worries you, don't use words like "red bears like to be with red bears," but rather "right now we are grouping them by color, so let's put all the red bears in the red group for now."  It might make more sense if you use more than just 1 kind of counter.  When my kids were learning that stuff, they would group all sorts of different yellow things together.  Yellow game pieces, blocks, beads, hair clips ....  Or, skittles / M&Ms ....

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