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FINAL UPDATE: Help me figure this out. Is someone being scammed?


jewellsmommy
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FINAL UPDATE: Apparently the seller is still selling.  :glare:  So, I left negative feedback. I do notice that they are no longer selling the same CBD items. But since there are multiples of the same tea pot I figure they have just moved on to a different store/vendor. A scammer is going to scam, I guess. There is nothing more I can do. I just wanted to finish it up for ya'll.

 

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Last week I went on Ebay and was looking at Chemistry texts for dd next year. Based on a thread here and other reviews, I decided I wanted to go with Jay Wiles new Chemistry that he did after splitting from Apologia.

 

I found the book listed as New on Ebay for $36. The standard price seemed to be $59 elsewhere. I decided to go ahead and get it. I have had to list new, unused homeschool material before for one reason or another or something barely used. Haven't most of us btdt? I figured this was a similar circumstance. 

 

I wasn't expecting the book til next Tuesday based on an auto-email so I was surprised when I got a delivery today. I got a box from Christianbook.com. It was not a reused box either. I open it and there is my brand new textbook. There is also an official CBD invoice inside that says BILL TO: (me & my address), SHIP TO: (me) and a price with shipping of $73.16.

 

At the bottom it reads: This order was generated from our website as transaction # blah, blah, blah.

 

I called CBD and they are going to call me back. They show a credit card # ending in 4 digits that is not mine having paid for it.

 

But no one is going to pay $73 and sell to me for $36. Is my name now attached to someone's stolen credit card? Is it someone who works for CBD pulling a fast one on the company? What do you think?

Edited by jewellsmommy
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Last week I went on Ebay and was looking at Chemistry texts for dd next year. Based on a thread here and other reviews, I decided I wanted to go with Jay Wiles new Chemistry that he did after splitting from Apologia.

 

I found the book listed as New on Ebay for $36. The standard price seemed to be $59 elsewhere. I decided to go ahead and get it. I have had to list new, unused homeschool material before for one reason or another or something barely used. Haven't most of us btdt? I figured this was a similar circumstance. 

 

I wasn't expecting the book til next Tuesday based on an auto-email so I was surprised when I got a delivery today. I got a box from Christianbook.com. It was not a reused box either. I open it and there is my brand new textbook. There is also an official CBD invoice inside that says BILL TO: (me & my address), SHIP TO: (me) and a price with shipping of $73.16.

 

At the bottom it reads: This order was generated from our website as transaction # blah, blah, blah.

 

I called CBD and they are going to call me back. They show a credit card # ending in 4 digits that is not mine having paid for it.

 

But no one is going to pay $73 and sell to me for $36. Is my name now attached to someone's stolen credit card? Is it someone who works for CBD pulling a fast one on the company? What do you think?

 

 

Wow.  It does sound like there's some sort of stolen credit card involved somewhere.

 

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Curious: If you go to the CBD website and punch in that order number, what shows up?

 

CBD looked it up when I called them. It shows ME ordering this book with my info as billing and shipping and a credit card that expires at the end of this month ending in #### that does not match any card I own. And that $73.16 was billed to that card. 

 

There was no one available from the dept they needed to have look into this so I left my phone number. They are supposed to call back.

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Maybe the seller realized after they processed their order that they didn't actually have the book.  So they fixed it by buying a book new for more money and had it shipped directly to you.  No scam in that situation but a seller that goofed and fixed it with no harm to you. 

 

This happens all the time.  Sellers don't lose money by buying new product at full price, they just say they lost the book and cancel the sale.

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Maybe the seller realized after they processed their order that they didn't actually have the book.  So they fixed it by buying a book new for more money and had it shipped directly to you.  No scam in that situation but a seller that goofed and fixed it with no harm to you. 

 

 

That would be nice. That thought did occur to me as well, but I am not used to life living up to my dreams.  :lol:

 

 

What threw me off of this thought is that I went to CBD and put the textbook in a cart so I could see shipping cost (because on the invoice the shipping is listed at $14 and the book at $59). That shipping seemed a bit high. When look at the order with regular shipping it is $7 to ship. The person paid for expedited shipping. According to ebay, I am not supposed to even receive it til the 12th on the seller's timeline. So if a seller is already out money why would they lose any more for faster shipping when regular shipping would suffice?

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CBD looked it up when I called them. It shows ME ordering this book with my info as billing and shipping and a credit card that expires at the end of this month ending in #### that does not match any card I own. And that $73.16 was billed to that card. 

 

There was no one available from the dept they needed to have look into this so I left my phone number. They are supposed to call back.

Maybe you did order it, but through eBay?  Does CBD sell on eBay?   Or could a relative have purchased this book for you? 

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Maybe the seller realized after they processed their order that they didn't actually have the book.  So they fixed it by buying a book new for more money and had it shipped directly to you.  No scam in that situation but a seller that goofed and fixed it with no harm to you. 

 

This is what I'm thinking too.  I mean, scammers don't buy stuff for you and have it delivered to you while using their own (or someone else's) credit card. 

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Maybe you did order it, but through eBay?  Does CBD sell on eBay?   Or could a relative have purchased this book for you? 

 

Nope, CBD says it was direct from their website. Sadly, no relatives other than my mom know anything about dd's subjects etc. I was on the phone with my mom when I opened the box and the mystery unfolded. Not her.

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Rats! CBD just called. They said they looked into it. The credit card that purchased the book under my name is stolen. They asked me to report it to ebay. If I can get my money back, they asked me to return the book to them! 

 

I am all kinds of confused. How did the credit card even work with my info attached to it!????

 

I guess the seller gets his/her $36, uses a stolen card to purchase from a distributer, the buyer gets a brand new book for less and never asks questions. Seller gets good feedback and lists another book.  :001_huh: ...Except I had to be the difficult one and ask questions. Now I get to call ebay and paypal. sigh.

 

I don't know that paypal will even refund without me returning the book to the seller? But the book didn't even come from the seller. Ugh. I'm off to call.

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Sure they do. That's one way to convert a stolen credit card number to cash. The scammer gets the money OP paid through eBay and the person they stole the card number from pays for the book. Many people don't pay close attention to their credit card statements, so as long as they keep the purchases small they have a good chance of it going unnoticed.

Well, how would that work?  How does the person get the cash from the card?  (Pardon me if I am being dense). 

Card is stolen.  Crook buys stuff with with stolen card, sending that merchandise to to someone else, like the OP.  Where does he get any money? 

 

It's probably so obvious but tell me.  Is he stealing from the Paypal account attached to eBay or what? 

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Crook lists book for sale on eBay for $42. Buyer orders book from eBay listing, pays crook $42. Crook then places order for book with CBD, using stolen credit card. Crook doesn't care that book costs $72, because crook is using stolen card and thus paying $0. Buyer gets book for $42, crook gets $42, person whose card was stolen loses $72.

Ah, ok. 

But how is the eBay seller crook accessing the funds?

Also, I sell on eBay and never see all the detailed selling information from the buyer.  I don't even know how he pays or with what card.  It just shows up in Paypal.  How is the crook accessing all of the details required to buy with a credit card, because the Buyer's info doesn't go straight to the seller.  The money just appears in Seller's PayPal.

Of course, I've not been a seller very long. Maybe I'm missing something. 

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Well, how would that work?  How does the person get the cash from the card?  (Pardon me if I am being dense). 

Card is stolen.  Crook buys stuff with with stolen card, sending that merchandise to to someone else, like the OP.  Where does he get any money? 

 

It's probably so obvious but tell me.  Is he stealing from the Paypal account attached to eBay or what? 

 

The buyer pays their bid price in cash to the seller.

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Ah, ok. 

But how is the eBay seller crook accessing the funds?

Also, I sell on eBay and never see all the detailed selling information from the buyer.  I don't even know how he pays or with what card.  It just shows up in Paypal.  How is the crook accessing all of the details required to buy with a credit card, because the Buyer's info doesn't go straight to the seller.  The money just appears in Seller's PayPal.

Of course, I've not been a seller very long. Maybe I'm missing something. 

 

PayPal.  The buyer pays the seller via PayPal.  That has nothing to do with the stolen credit card.  The buyer has nothing to do with the stolen card.  The seller gets the money in cash from PayPal.

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how long has the seller been active on ebay and what's their feedback?

 

Low. They were obviously new but had only positive feedback. Because they accept paypal, I wasn't too concerned about losing my money in the deal. I never thought about this type of scheme though. 

 

I am outting them. Here is their ebay id:  toiyhancoc-0

I want to leave a scathing feedback report, but I don't want to tip them off so Ebay has a chance to do their thing. If Ebay doesn't "catch" them then they could create a new ID and start all over again.

 

I should have looked more closely at their past sales. I was all researched out, honestly, having been debating Chem texts for awhile. I like to buy next years stuff so I can get a leg up on planning and purchasing resources etc.

 

 

 

*They have another of the same book up for BIN currently!! Why only this Chem book? Their past sales look like stuff you can buy on CBD too. Communion cups!! Their last sale was communion cups!  :glare:

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So, into the crook seller's Paypal account.  Right? 

 

 

I know. That seems weird to me too. Unless they have a fake name for their Paypal accnt. it would seem as if that would lead right back to them?

 

On my paypal transaction it gives their paypal accnt. name as Cindy ************ (don't want to list the actual name)

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I reported to Ebay who, after a few questions finally understood the situation, said they were opening an investigation. They told me I could open a dispute to try and get a refund and return the book. I told them CBD wants it back. They said to talk to Paypal. (I already planned to do that anyway).

 

I called Paypal and the lady was very nice, but she said that it was up to ebay to pursue. She said it doesn't actually involve me. She asked if I got the right book. Yes, I did. She asked if it was in the expected condition. Yes, even better actually. Then she said she would make note of the conversation but otherwise it was up to ebay and/or the credit card company, that I had no part  so I shouldn't worry about it etc. And there was not a way for me to get my money back if I returned it to CBD. 

 

So, I called CBD back to update them. The person I spoke with was already gone for the day but will call me back tomorrow.

 

What a mess!

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It's seems like a crazy amount of work to make less than $50. I wonder how long they keep on it. I guess you could probably check and see if they're still selling stuff in a few weeks and leave a nasty comment in case ebay doesn't feel like they're worth pursuing.

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Sounds like someone who has access to a church's credit card, where purchases from CBD wouldn't raise red flags on a cc statement? Otherwise, why would the cc still be active?

Card info can be stolen by skimmers at restaurants or gas pumps so the owner still has possession of original, or even hacked from online databases.

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Low. They were obviously new but had only positive feedback. Because they accept paypal, I wasn't too concerned about losing my money in the deal. I never thought about this type of scheme though. 

 

I am outting them. Here is their ebay id:  toiyhancoc-0

I want to leave a scathing feedback report, but I don't want to tip them off so Ebay has a chance to do their thing. If Ebay doesn't "catch" them then they could create a new ID and start all over again.

 

I should have looked more closely at their past sales. I was all researched out, honestly, having been debating Chem texts for awhile. I like to buy next years stuff so I can get a leg up on planning and purchasing resources etc.

 

 

 

*They have another of the same book up for BIN currently!! Why only this Chem book? Their past sales look like stuff you can buy on CBD too. Communion cups!! Their last sale was communion cups!  :glare:

 

they also have communion cups from cbd

and melisa and doug, and playmobil toys.

and multiples.  where are they getting the stuff.

 

Sounds like someone who has access to a church's credit card, where purchases from CBD wouldn't raise red flags on a cc statement? Otherwise, why would the cc still be active?

 

 

It's seems like a crazy amount of work to make less than $50. I wonder how long they keep on it. I guess you could probably check and see if they're still selling stuff in a few weeks and leave a nasty comment in case ebay doesn't feel like they're worth pursuing.

 

they get it set up, it's not a lot of work once up and running, and they aren't paying for any of it.  they aren't even handling the material or shipping it - they just take the order and put in the order to the vendor.  and something is hinky through this one. 

 

I had bought something once I THOUGHT the person actually had it in her possession.  no, she was selling on ebay and then would and order from her supplier to send to the person who bought it.  she never handled it. (the supplier was sold out, so I bought it somewhere else.)

 

 

there is also paypal, the cbd (from where stuff was shipped), there are federal agencies that handle fraud - even though you aren't the one paying for the fraud - making them aware could be helpful.

it needs further investigating.

 

were you paying via paypal?  that makes it really really weird it showed another cc #

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I was just sitting here backtracing from their feedback list and entering those item on CBD's website and yes, CBD does sell them all!

So I am wondering, Why CBD? Wouldn't it be safer to spread the fraud around through multiple places? 

 

After selling, he/she is then hitting the re-list button. Another communion cup auction just ended on the 12th. So this person has stuff in the works now. If you click on 'view this item' it says 'this item or one like it has been relisted.'

 

I paid through paypal. The seller has to have that money going into an accnt that is tied to a bank accnt in the same name. 

 

I intend to give all the info to the CBD person tomorrow: the seller ID, the name attached to the paypal, the items that have sold that I can see and the current for sale Chem book.

 

 

they also have communion cups from cbd

and melisa and doug, and playmobil toys.

and multiples.  where are they getting the stuff.

 

 

 

 

they get it set up, it's not a lot of work once up and running, and they aren't paying for any of it.  they aren't even handling the material or shipping it - they just take the order and put in the order to the vendor.  and something is hinky through this one. 

 

I had bought something once I THOUGHT the person actually had it in her possession.  no, she was selling on ebay and then would and order from her supplier to send to the person who bought it.  she never handled it. (the supplier was sold out, so I bought it somewhere else.)

 

 

there is also paypal, the cbd (from where stuff was shipped), there are federal agencies that handle fraud - even though you aren't the one paying for the fraud - making them aware could be helpful.

it needs further investigating.

 

were you paying via paypal?  that makes it really really weird it showed another cc #

 

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I was just sitting here backtracing from their feedback list and entering those item on CBD's website and yes, CBD does sell them all!

So I am wondering, Why CBD? Wouldn't it be safer to spread the fraud around through multiple places? 

 

After selling, he/she is then hitting the re-list button. Another communion cup auction just ended on the 12th. So this person has stuff in the works now. If you click on 'view this item' it says 'this item or one like it has been relisted.'

 

I paid through paypal. The seller has to have that money going into an accnt that is tied to a bank accnt in the same name. 

 

I intend to give all the info to the CBD person tomorrow: the seller ID, the name attached to the paypal, the items that have sold that I can see and the current for sale Chem book.

 

could easily be one of their own employees.  (which would make them an embezzler.) if they are - they would have access to cbd computers to generate orders without arousing in-house suspicion. most embezellers aren't very imaginative.  they do little bits over time before they get caught.   but when you look at it over time - it can be a lot.

unless there is a good accountant at cbd who really does investigation for where did that darn dime go . . it can easily be missed until it has really added up.  what get's most embezzlers caught - is pure greed and they start looking for a bigger payout.

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could easily be one of their own employees.  (which would make them an embezzler.) if they are - they would have access to cbd computers to generate orders without arousing in-house suspicion. most embezellers aren't very imaginative.  they do little bits over time before they get caught.   but when you look at it over time - it can be a lot.

unless there is a good accountant at cbd who really does investigation for where did that darn dime go . . it can easily be missed until it has really added up.  what get's most embezzlers caught - is pure greed and they start looking for a bigger payout.

 

Agreed. This is my mom's theory. She thinks either the person or their spouse or a partner-in-crime work at CBD.

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It's seems like a crazy amount of work to make less than $50. I wonder how long they keep on it. I guess you could probably check and see if they're still selling stuff in a few weeks and leave a nasty comment in case ebay doesn't feel like they're worth pursuing.

 

No work at all. They just list something for sale, then use the stolen credit card to buy it when someone orders.  They don't even have to ship anything.

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NM

Rats! CBD just called. They said they looked into it. The credit card that purchased the book under my name is stolen. They asked me to report it to ebay. If I can get my money back, they asked me to return the book to them! 

 

I am all kinds of confused. How did the credit card even work with my info attached to it!????

 

I guess the seller gets his/her $36, uses a stolen card to purchase from a distributer, the buyer gets a brand new book for less and never asks questions. Seller gets good feedback and lists another book.  :001_huh: ...Except I had to be the difficult one and ask questions. Now I get to call ebay and paypal. sigh.

 

I don't know that paypal will even refund without me returning the book to the seller? But the book didn't even come from the seller. Ugh. I'm off to call.

 

Edited by reefgazer
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CBD shipped the book to her. Paypal told her if she ships it back they can't get her money back.

No, this is CBD's issue.

 

 

Yes, and I expect that the credit card company will still be paying CBD.

 

 

Unless CBD proved to me that the credit card company was refusing to honor the payment, I'd hang tight to the book.

 

I also wouldn't consider giving up the book until the original payment was refunded to me.

 

 

Yes, the OP might end up with a "free" (stolen) book. But the OP has already had to deal with a major headache over it and time straightening it out.

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I talked to the CBD rep again today. I gave them the name attached to the seller's pp account, their ebay ID, and told them about past items listed. I explained to her what Paypal told me, essentially that I don't have grounds for a claim (through pp against the seller) because I got the book I ordered in the condition I expected. They acknowledge that the situation is 'wrong' but that I, personally, can't evoke the paypal protection. I can request a return from the seller, but would have to return the book to the seller (as I suspected). The paypal rep said that this on ebay to investigate etc.

 

I told her that I am happy to help anyway I can, but I can't afford to return the book to CBD AND then turn around and buy the book again from somewhere else without getting this money back. The CBD rep said she understood, but still added (again) if I ever did get refund to contact them and they would send a return label for the book.

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Someone at Ebay took it seriously, as that seller no longer has any items listed for sale.

 

I hope that's the case. But I looked at 'completed listings' and see that she did sell another chem book yesterday. Why this particular book?

 

I will now be forever paranoid about shopping on ebay. If I feel like I am getting a good deal, it must be stolen or a scam. sigh 

Before last week, I hadn't shopped on ebay in a long while. I bought this book and some extra Thomas  wooden trains for nephew (so my mom could have some at her house too). Dd is letting him use most of her old ones, but there were a few she didn't want to share  :lol: . I just hope when they arrive that they are just old scuffed up wooden trains.

 

 

 

ETA: The trains are from a different seller! Thank goodness.  :tongue_smilie:

Edited by jewellsmommy
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I talked to the CBD rep again today. I gave them the name attached to the seller's pp account, their ebay ID, and told them about past items listed. I explained to her what Paypal told me, essentially that I don't have grounds for a claim (through pp against the seller) because I got the book I ordered in the condition I expected. They acknowledge that the situation is 'wrong' but that I, personally, can't evoke the paypal protection. I can request a return from the seller, but would have to return the book to the seller (as I suspected). The paypal rep said that this on ebay to investigate etc.

 

I told her that I am happy to help anyway I can, but I can't afford to return the book to CBD AND then turn around and buy the book again from somewhere else without getting this money back. The CBD rep said she understood, but still added (again) if I ever did get refund to contact them and they would send a return label for the book.

CBD needs to figure this out with the credit card company, this is not your problem.
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I told her that I am happy to help anyway I can, but I can't afford to return the book to CBD AND then turn around and buy the book again from somewhere else without getting this money back. The CBD rep said she understood, but still added (again) if I ever did get refund to contact them and they would send a return label for the book.

 

I'm kind of surprised that they didn't just tell you to keep the book and I think it kind of reflects badly on their customer service that they didn't. It really is not your problem, nor your fault.

Edited by luuknam
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