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WTMA has posted their 2017-18 schedule and course descriptions


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Did prices rise for this year? I am seeing $624 for science lab, plus $60 annual non-refundable registration fee (same as before) and then $40 annual technology fee (I don't remember this from last year). Total of $724 - while I believe it was $659 for us total this past year. Just curious.  :)

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Did prices rise for this year? I am seeing $624 for science lab, plus $60 annual non-refundable registration fee (same as before) and then $40 annual technology fee (I don't remember this from last year). Total of $724 - while I believe it was $659 for us total this past year. Just curious.  :)

 

Yes.  I believe prices are up and the tech fee is new.  I was not surprised as WTMA was on the more affordable end of live class offerings and the quality is excellent.  But it does add up.  Sigh.  

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Also, have you noticed their aops sequence completely skipped over Intermediate Algebra book? They went from Intro to Algebra to Precalculus text. Aren't we lacking on polynomials without the Intermediate book? My kid doesn't know how to multiply or divide polynomials (I know it's not hard to teach), so their sequence assumes he is ready for precalculus? As somebody not versed in those issues, are we to assume Aops Intermediate textbook is just optional fun?

 

That is frustrating. I hadn't noticed that. Why would they do that? I was really hoping that we could use WTMA to get through AoPS, since the regular AoPS courses move so quickly.

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Yes.  I believe prices are up and the tech fee is new.  I was not surprised as WTMA was on the more affordable end of live class offerings and the quality is excellent.  But it does add up.  Sigh.  

 

Agreed, but after the Landry debacle, I'm trying not to complain. I'd rather pay a bit more and have them stay in business I think. :)  I just wish there were more classes my daughter could take with them, and it would make the fees less painful, but unfortunately there's only one that will work for us this fall. :( 

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Agreed, but after the Landry debacle, I'm trying not to complain. I'd rather pay a bit more and have them stay in business I think. :) I just wish there were more classes my daughter could take with them, and it would make the fees less painful, but unfortunately there's only one that will work for us this fall. :(

Agreed! And yes the reg fee and tech fee are more painful for one class. At least my ds will have three classes. I think the classes are worth it, but cheaper is always nicer 🙂

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That is frustrating. I hadn't noticed that. Why would they do that? I was really hoping that we could use WTMA to get through AoPS, since the regular AoPS courses move so quickly.

My guess is they are attempting to bring aops flavor to a regular school sequence, so they dumped out all the "extra" content that isn't found in the traditional school sequence and supplemented polynomials with a workbook.

Your kid is young still, but he might surprise you with aops classes. My DS thrives on fast paced class. He is obsessed with answering quickly and seeing his name on the board. I couldn't imagine him taking a regular WTMA math class. He would fall asleep. I am considering WTMA for his younger sibling though.

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I am sorry I was such the bearer of bad news. I was just idly looking at pricing and didn't recall any of that from last year... so a bit surprised and wanted to share & check with y'all. I've been so pleased with WTMA so far and still plan to enroll in 1 course next year. If only we needed a 2nd course with them for same ds, it would be better - but alas, that is not the case. ;) 

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It seems pretty much in line with the going rate for online classes from the better providers. 

 

Nobody goes into education for the money. I'm sure the providers are doing everything they reasonably can to keep prices down for the families while still paying their teachers a fair rate. Don't know what the costs are for administrative "overhead," not just to pay the folks running things, but also to pay for any needed CPA/legal support, the technology and tech support, etc.

 

I bet all the online academies are on a razor.thin.margin, but, yes, it can be painful for us home schoolers on a single income. Don't know that there's any way around it if we want quality classes with quality teachers. It's a closed system with no extra money floating around.... Home schoolers want the best classes and teachers when we outsource, but most homeschoolers are on a single income so we're keenly aware of the cost. Even if it's lower than the private high school down the street, it's still makes us think. Quality teachers have to make a living, or at least break even for the time and effort they put in, but home schoolers can only afford so much. It's quite a bind, both for home schoolers who want to outsource and for the online class providers.

Edited by yvonne
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I agree with yvonne.

I think the rates have been artificially low as WTMA is so new, too. They might finally be approaching the real price needed to make a thin profit. The fees are probably their way of being more affordable as they can charge those per kid vs per class - making it cheaper for families to take multiple classes from them over all. (Rates are now comparable to WHA.)

 

[Edited later to add:  I realize that the rates aren't better or equal to WHA ($650/class except for AP ($700-$730) & Great Conversations ($800)), but they are now comparable. And WTMA's refund policy is much more grace-filled.]

 

[Also, I must have been thinking about this thread last night because I had a dream that WTMA had to raise their rates because they had to pay more for the base material they use for the classes. Each seat in each class is made up of the tears that someone doesn't shed for another when they should have compassion for them. And the people who sold these unshed-tears had finally realized what they were worth & thus raised the price. I'm not sure what that means I think, but it sure was weird.]

Edited by RootAnn
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I used to tell people that WTMA is top notch and the most affordable for the quality.  I can no longer plug the affordable part but I knew things didn't exactly line up with the other similar online academies and I did think prices would increase.  I believe Kolbe Academy is still higher than WTMA.  It has been a couple years since we used them but it is a similar set up and they have gotten high too. 

 

People see my kids' success and want to know what I have done.  The answer always includes that it is expensive to do it our way.  It just is.  I admire the parents that do it all on their own and I know parents that do it well.  Not my family.  But to us it is an investment.  So far online classes have filled a need and prepared my guys to be successful at de (which is cheap here) and do well on the ACT to gain scholarships.  My oldest has done well his freshman year in college while many of his peers have failed classes.  He has a high gpa and will keep his scholarships as well as stay on track to finish his degree on time.  The money we plugged into outsourcing some key areas has been more than recouped already.

 

For my family, stretching the budget from 8th grade-10th grade is an investment that has paid off.  Of course it is not in reach for everyone.  

Edited by teachermom2834
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  • 2 weeks later...

We've been a little disappointed that classes my daughter had looked forward to taking have been removed from the following year's schedule.   :sad:

 

Historian's Craft and Philosophy & History of Science are two that come to mind...

 

Philosophy & History of Science is being offered after all! It wasn't on the earlier posted schedules, but it's open for registration.  I wonder if they'll ever bring back Historian's Craft...

 

Hmm....now to contemplate schedules again...

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Also, 15% off discount for returning families who register by 3/31. Works out to about $100 discount on foreign language class for us, effectively waiving the registration fee & tech fee. I'm a happy customer!

 

I enrolled my son in two classes this morning. I was very happy to get the discount! Every little bit helps.  :)

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I still do not understand why online providers do not hire a NATIVE French speaker?! It is so frustrating! Spending summers in Europe is not equivalent. Teaching ESL in Europe is not an equivalent. Having a BA or MA in French from an American university is not an equivalent. Someone who's done these things will probably have better spoken French than someone who hasn't, but they are unlikely to be as good as a native speaker.

 

I was a French lang & lit major, at a selective college where all the French lit classes were conducted solely in French. I spent a year in French-speaking Geneva as a fully-matriculated student, with a full course load, at the University of Geneva. I graduated with honors. Yet, I would not teach French here! There are better options; native speakers who, assuming they are also good teachers, can, obviously, teach their native language better than I can. For my own children, even with a French husband and with all the exposure my kids get to French from my husband's speaking to them only in French and from his entire side of the family in France, I want a good teacher, who is a native of France, to teach my kids the language.

 

An online provider who hired a native speaker would have the corner on the market. There must be some issue I just don't see. Otherwise, someone would have done it by now. In the meantime, as consumers, we have to just look for the best of the less-than-ideal online class options we have available. (And supplement with a native speaking tutor.)

To the bolded: I haven't actually found this to be true. You did mention that they must be good teachers, which covers a lot of the problem I have seen with native teachers (the fact that you speak the language does not mean that you know how to teach it) but one thing I have observed about teaching in general is that the very best teachers are often people who have had to really struggle to gain the skill they are teaching. From this perspective, some non-native teachers really are better than native--they have had to experience learning the language themselves using methods other than organic immersion in childhood and have a better understanding of the kind of work their students need to do.

 

As for finding native speaking teachers for online classes being easy because of lack of geographic limitations, I believe that WTMA classifies their teachers as employees not as independent contractors; this means that they have to deal with employment laws and taxes for wherever the teacher is located as well as their own headquarters. If memory serves, this does very much limit where they can hire their teachers from (maybe all within their state?) because things rapidly become extremely complicated from a legal and accounting perspective otherwise (which would require hiring more back end people and increasing the cost of classes).

Edited by maize
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Also, have you noticed their aops sequence completely skipped over Intermediate Algebra book? They went from Intro to Algebra to Precalculus text. Aren't we lacking on polynomials without the Intermediate book? My kid doesn't know how to multiply or divide polynomials (I know it's not hard to teach), so their sequence assumes he is ready for precalculus? As somebody not versed in those issues, are we to assume Aops Intermediate textbook is just optional fun?

 

No, AoPS Intermediate Algebra is NOT optional fun. It is necessary for PreCalc (and Calc). 

 

It is part of the core sequence. 

 

If you were moving to non-AoPS for PreCalc, you can skip the AoPS Intermediate Algebra. (As AoPS covers much more content/depth than other math programs, and so while Int Alg is part of the core AoPS sequence, it is not necessary for traditional/typical PreCalc and/or Calc courses.)

 

I'd be very curious to see reports from students and teachers who taught using the sequence skipping Int. Algebra about how that went. I'd also be curious to hear the justification for skipping Int Algebra. Has anyone from WTMA discussed this with AoPS? (They are very responsive to questions!) 

 

https://www.artofproblemsolving.com/store/recommendations.php  

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