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PSA for those interested in Univ of CAs


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Re geometry in 7th/8th grade.

 

I am signed up for the monthly counselor bulletin and just saw this:

 

Application verification coming soon

Students randomly selected to verify information in their application will be notified by the end of December. The deadline to respond is Jan. 31. A small number of students will be asked to provide documentation of 7/8th grade geometry as well. Failure to respond to the request by the deadline will result in cancellation of the application.

 

When applying to UCs, you are not required to send in official transcripts unless they ask for it. Accepted students will send transcripts to the college they've chosen around about July (IIRC). Everything is self reported (note: SAT/ACT test scores are also self reported and score reports need to be ordered by Dec). While I've heard that random students might be asked to show proof of extra-curriculars, this is the first time that I've heard that you might also need to show documentation of 7/8th grade geometry.

 

So if your DC did geometry early, do not throw those books/ notes/ proofs etc. away!

 

Go ahead and self report geometry like you would with any other course in the application but keep all proof for as long as possible (I'm considering keeping stuff after any acceptance too in case DS needs to challenge a requirement).

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I thought UC allowed validation of geometry through a higher-level course for which geometry is a prerequisite, but it looks like that is no longer the case:

 

Geometry: The omission of a yearlong geometry course cannot be validated by advanced-level math courses (e.g., Algebra II/ Trigonometry, Trigonometry, Math Analysis, Precalculus or Calculus). However, validation applies in the following cases:

 

• The omission of the first semester of geometry can be validated by successful completion of the second semester of geometry with a letter grade of C or better.

 

• The omission of a yearlong integrated course with sufficient geometry content (e.g., Math II) can be validated by a higher level integrated course (e.g., Math III) with a letter grade of C or better, provided that the higher-level course shows clear evidence of geometry content.

 

• The omission of the first semester of an integrated course with sufficient geometry content (e.g., Math II) can be validated by successful completion of the second semester of an integrated course with sufficient geometry content with a letter grade of C or better.

 

Please note: Standardized exams (SAT, ACT, SAT Subject Test, AP, IB, etc.) cannot validate the omission. However, we will accept a “challenge†examination, administered by the high school (e.g., the school geometry course final exam), to demonstrate proficiency to validate the course omission if the high school awards both grades and units for the successful completion of such an exam.

 

http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/counselors/files/quick-reference-2016.pdf

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What if we took it in 6th? Does it matter? We will have aops transcript but it will be prior to 7th.

 

It really depends how you report each grade and the year for that grade. If you are not graduating your child early, the only grades allowed (ETA: for self reporting on the application) prior to high school are 7th and 8th grade (math and foreign languages only). There are spaces to add comments and I would guess it's best to mention this fact in one of those spaces.

 

You probably will not need to send in AoPS transcripts. Usually students only send in the official high school transcript and any transcripts for college classes taken in high school. But do keep them in case your DC is one those called up in the random audit. Good luck!

 

Edited by quark
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It really depends how you report each grade and the year for that grade. If you are not graduating your child early, the only grades allowed prior to high school are 7th and 8th grade (math and foreign languages only). There are spaces to add comments and I would guess it's best to mention this fact in one of those spaces.

 

You probably will not need to send in AoPS transcripts. Usually students only send in the official high school transcript and any transcripts for college classes taken in high school. But do keep them in case your DC is one those called up in the random audit. Good luck!

 

No, we aren't planning on graduating him early.

He is half way through the book and we planned on taking the class starting in January. Now I am wondering if we should wait (let him work through the book) and let him double up next year and take geometry and intermediate algebra together in seventh officially. I know my kid will object (because he will feel like he is going backward), but I will insist if there is a solid reason for it. So frustrating.

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No, we aren't planning on graduating him early.

He is half way through the book and we planned on taking the class starting in January. Now I am wondering if we should wait (let him work through the book) and let him double up next year and take geometry and intermediate algebra together in seventh officially. I know my kid will object (because he will feel like he is going backward), but I will insist if there is a solid reason for it. So frustrating.

 

Yes, you could play it safe. Or you could let him do it now and demonstrate rigor by level of course work by the time he is a senior. Really I don't think his whole application will depend on this one thing. Especially if you are targeting the "more holistic" UCB and UCLA. You homeschool for a reason right?! :thumbup:

 

There is a lot of opportunity to explain out of the box experiences. The essays are one way. The academic history section has a 550-character box and the end of the application offers a 550-word box.

 

ETA: My kid took high school geometry in 4th and another semester of college level geometry in 5th and I reported these as geometry and advanced geometry respectively (with the 3+-year grade skip, the stars aligned for us to report them as 7th and 8th grade work). For your DS, you could have him do whatever geometry he is doing now and if he loves geometry, add more advanced coursework in 7th so that you are still reporting geometry. One way to do it so it all works out. Seriously, though, you should not worry about it now. At this rate, he is on track for calculus by around 8th/ 9th/ 10th right? Let that speak for itself.

 

Edited by quark
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Another problem I'm finding out is if your student has done geometry in middle school, the local public high school will still want geometry taken in 9th grade in order for the student to graduate. I don't think even a UC approved geometry course will be accepted. It has to be on a high school transcript.

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Another problem I'm finding out is if your student has done geometry in middle school, the local public high school will still want geometry taken in 9th grade in order for the student to graduate. I don't think even a UC approved geometry course will be accepted. It has to be on a high school transcript.

No way! That's so frustrating. Our district offers integrated math. I wonder how they will handle it.

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Another problem I'm finding out is if your student has done geometry in middle school, the local public high school will still want geometry taken in 9th grade in order for the student to graduate. I don't think even a UC approved geometry course will be accepted. It has to be on a high school transcript.

 

That really stinks. :sad:

 

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i think highly capable homeschooled math whizzes are very seriously considered by the UCs. from so many of those on WTM accepted into UCs, so many don't have all these uber-documented everything. i think the fact your kid is taking high school geometry in 6th grade is  far superior than meeting a geom credit by taking it in 9th grade. i have a feeling if the rest of your transcript meshes up for a highly performing kid, it'l likely be ok. at a reent colleg fair we attended, several of the UCs did say they take a holistic approach. only one seemed super stringent and that was cal poly slo, i think (not UC). we won't be applying there. ;-) 

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i think highly capable homeschooled math whizzes are very seriously considered by the UCs. from so many of those on WTM accepted into UCs, so many don't have all these uber-documented everything. i think the fact your kid is taking high school geometry in 6th grade is far superior than meeting a geom credit by taking it in 9th grade. i have a feeling if the rest of your transcript meshes up for a highly performing kid, it'l likely be ok. at a reent colleg fair we attended, several of the UCs did say they take a holistic approach. only one seemed super stringent and that was cal poly slo, i think (not UC). we won't be applying there. ;-)

True, but that's only if your kid homeschools all the way. If you decide to send her to HS, then you have to be careful which school district you choose. I think with the district over where Arcadia is, it's different. You test into whatever level. But I have to confirm that - it's the next thing I need to do on my list. If you choose the district that I just asked, well, you really need geometry on the HS transcript or your kid can't graduate.

 

I have to justify it somehow. There is honors geometry - they don't use AOPS for that. They use Moise; is that harder than AOPS?

 

I'm not abandoning you all, just looking at options. We still have a couple of years.

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i think highly capable homeschooled math whizzes are very seriously considered by the UCs. from so many of those on WTM accepted into UCs, so many don't have all these uber-documented everything. i think the fact your kid is taking high school geometry in 6th grade is far superior than meeting a geom credit by taking it in 9th grade. i have a feeling if the rest of your transcript meshes up for a highly performing kid, it'l likely be ok. at a reent colleg fair we attended, several of the UCs did say they take a holistic approach. only one seemed super stringent and that was cal poly slo, i think (not UC). we won't be applying there. ;-)

Please do tell about cal poly! It seems such a reasonably priced school for engineering. What didn't you like about their requirements?

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We spoke to at least 10-12 schools, my son always asking if there are any special requirements for admissions for homeschooled students (good public speaking practice, I thought). All seemed very warm and welcoming (UCBerkeley, UCLA, UC Santa Barbara, UC Irvine, UC Davis, UC San Diego, and many out of states).... But I don't remember exactly why Cal Poly SLO rubbed me the wrong way, but I cemented it in my mind, that that's a school we definitely won't apply to. I think it was that you have to meet A-G requirements, but they won't look at AP or SAT II scores - only A-G approved classes. Maybe that was it? I'm afraid I don't recall exactly. We're really looking toward UC schools in particular, so it's no big sweat - it's not a school we were really looking at. But they made a very negative impression in my mind. If you're really interested, certainly you should call them and find out!

 

 

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We spoke to at least 10-12 schools, my son always asking if there are any special requirements for admissions for homeschooled students (good public speaking practice, I thought). All seemed very warm and welcoming (UCBerkeley, UCLA, UC Santa Barbara, UC Irvine, UC Davis, UC San Diego, and many out of states).... But I don't remember exactly why Cal Poly SLO rubbed me the wrong way, but I cemented it in my mind, that that's a school we definitely won't apply to. I think it was that you have to meet A-G requirements, but they won't look at AP or SAT II scores - only A-G approved classes. Maybe that was it? I'm afraid I don't recall exactly. We're really looking toward UC schools in particular, so it's no big sweat - it's not a school we were really looking at. But they made a very negative impression in my mind. If you're really interested, certainly you should call them and find out!

I think calling and asking is often a great idea. I did this last year with Drexel. They reviewed and revised their requirements. However to lack of timeliness to their revision (about a month after they said it would be out) and the demands of the requirements after revision led ds to not bother applying.

 

On the other hand, schools like Worcester PI and Arizona State were very helpful with clarifying what they were looking for.

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A message board friend had the most bizarre experience this year with the UC verification process this past application season. Her child had to verify facts shared in his essay.

 

That would mean that child is probably being considered on "Admission by Exception"....instead of looking at fulfilling requirements they just look at the essay and random things and decide.  It means they are going WAY WAY out for that child, and he or she is VERY lucky that someone in the admissions is taking the time to notice him/her!!  They should feel blessed, actually.

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