Need advice quickly about custody issues

[foxbridgeacademy]

I need advice on how to file for custody of a child that lives in a different state.  DH's 16 year old daughter has come for a visit.  She has for the last 4-5 months been living with her Aunt in Indiana.  Her mother and step father split up and she went to stay with the Aunt while the mother is currently homeless (no idea where she's staying) and likely doing drugs with her (the mom) new boyfriend who is a felon.  DSD hates living at her Aunts, she doesn't have a bedroom, unless you count the 9x9 room she shares with a 10 and 11 year old.  She usually sleeps on the couch.  She takes care of most the cleaning and cares for the younger cousins since their brother, who is 15, is to violent and can't be trusted alone with the kids.  Also the Aunt, who is actually a nice person who probably thinks she's doing the best for her niece, has let DSD's 17 yr. old boyfriend move in.  The Aunt complains about being broke and not getting any help from DSD's parents.... we pay $550 a month in child support, the mother is using it to fuel her drug abuse.  The aunt, I think is just overwhelmed and is passive-regressively taking it out on DSD.  

 

DSD is pretty much refusing to go back, even though she's sad about the boyfriend she is miserable.

 

So what do we do?  Do we file for emergency custody in our current state? Her state? Do we call CPS?  I know Lawyer, but we have absolutely no money for that.  I don't think the Aunt will fight us, she only has DSD with a power of attorney from the mom, so not a lot she can do anyway.  The mom on the other hand will fight tooth and nail.  We have no address for her, only a # to text..... 

 

 

ETA- Update in 34, 37, 72

 

Thanks for all the advice, we'll be breathing a lot easier after Wednesday when her mom is supposed to sign papers giving us temporary custody. The woman is..... unbalanced but hopefully she follows through for the good of her child.

Edited November 21, 2016 by foxbridgeacademy

[displace]

Sorry to hear that :(. Is the relationship such that you can call/text mom and aunt to tell them she refuses to return home? I'd do that so it doesn't look like kidnapping. Then probably social services in her state to see next steps.

[Code Lyoko]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

No suggestions but hugs.  

[Anne in CA]

You need a GOOD attorney. Not just an average one. You will pay more up front, but less over time. Spend the money for someone that you KNOW goes to bat for you. You don't have to send the dsd back to the aunt. I know this from experience. You DO have to file for custody and understand that you need to keep currant on child support for as long as the custody battle goes on. She isn't going to fund a legal dispute and her drug habit with the child support money and drugs will come first. Her well meaning relatives (or a charity) may fund her a lawyer, but it will be a cheap nobody so that's why you need a shark. 

[kiwik]

Not very helpful.

Edited November 20, 2016 by kiwik

[LucyStoner]

At that age, I'd probably just wait for the mom to contact us. Unless your husband's parental rights were severed, he's not going to get a kidnapping charge for not returning her to her Aunt's home. And if mom takes him to court, she's a homeless drug user who left her with an aunt. I would start collecting statements and any evidence that she's a drug user.

Edited November 20, 2016 by LucyStoner

[Melissa in Australia]

Here a child at 16 can choose which parent they want to live with. ( I think)

[bettyandbob]

Get documentation that the 16yo was living with aunt not the mother while the mother was collecting child support. I assume custody was legally with the mother.

 

I am not sure it will save you in the long run to avoid an attorney. But the documentation will help whichever direction you go.

[Ottakee]

What is the original custody arrangement between your dh and the mother?

[Carrie12345]

Considering her age and physical custodian's situation (I'm assuming here that her mother is still the listed primary physical custodian), I wouldn't panic.

 

Like you acknowledged, a lawyer would be best.  Without one, you can still file a petition to change custody with whichever court holds the case right now.  In some states, it may be quicker to request a mediation session, where changes would be fast tracked for a judge's signature.  Of course, that varies by state.

[Lanny]

I think you should call CPS  in the state where you live and explain the situation to them and see how they respond. Your DH is her father. He should be the one that speaks with CPS about his daughter.  She is there, in your state, with you now, so I hope that will make it easier than if she were  in a different state. 

[Code Lyoko]

I agree that a lawyer would be the best route but since you feel that is not an option, is the aunt currently demanding she come home?  Has the mother demanded that she return to the aunt?  Or did the aunt expect her to come home and the daughter is refusing?  Is she enrolled in school or are you homeschooling her currently?  What are the legal custody arrangements between Mom and your DH?

 

If the aunt is willing to let her stay with you, dad has the legal right to see his daughter and the mom hasn't actually said anything, and the daughter is getting a legal education of some kind while living with you, maybe just doing a bit more investigation and getting more documentation in place proving that Mom is not actually taking care of her daughter before activating any agencies might be more prudent?

[maize]

I wonder if the mother would fight for custody only because she would lose child support of dad won. And if it would be legal (and cheaper than a court fight...) to buy her off somehow...

[Scarlett]

Not a big fan of lawyers. I wouldn't hire a lawyer and I wouldn't contact DHS. Why get them involved? They hurt as often as they help. Dh needs to tell the aunt the dd is not going back to aunts house. Via txt for documentation.

 

If the mom is a drug user it is doubtful she will fight for custody. If I could stop paying cs I would do that too. If the mom gets an attorney or calls cops claiming 'kidnap' then you can respond then.

 

I mean did the mom notify Dh through proper channels that the dd was no longer living with her?

[Scarlett]

Just as an example.....dss15 came to live with us this summer. 6 months ago. We still have nothing legal in place. I have been able to enroll him in a virtual state school, take him to several doctors etc. no one has asked for legal documents yet.

[Scarlett]

I wonder if the mother would fight for custody only because she would lose child support of dad won. And if it would be legal (and cheaper than a court fight...) to buy her off somehow...

If she is on drugs I doubt she will fight anything. Even if cs is stopped she probably won't fight bcause she know she will be held accountable.

 

 

Op does you Dh pay the girls mom cs directly? Or through an agency! What are the states involved? You might be able to file some change of custody/cs papers on your own depending on the state.

[Scarlett]

And even though we have nothing legal in place, (thanks to the ineptness of the high price 'great' attorney we was told by attorney to stop cs when dss arrived here. But we pay direct. You can't do that if it is through an agency because they will come after you until there is a court order changing cs.

 

But the good thing about being through an agency is that sometimes THEY will help you when a significant change of circumstance happens. Like mom being homeless, dd being shipped to an aunt and now dd refusing to go back to aunt.

 

Oh and no matter what I wouldn't send her back to the aunts. No court will make her go back to mother or aunt.

Edited November 20, 2016 by Scarlett

[Anne in CA]

Um, I disagree about no court will let her go to the mother. If the mother somehow acquires a place to live, even if the girl testifies she doesn't want to live with the mother, the court may order it. Family court is not a fair or reasonable place. The mother may have relatives who will help her get a temporary place, just long enough to show up for court in. It is not impossible. I know people feel like they cannot afford an attorney, but you really cannot afford not to have one. State agencies give bad advice ALL THE TIME. They tell people things that are not right or legal and get people in trouble. Just calling CPS is not enough. Especially not if you live in a state where CPS is overwhelmed and the person you are talking to just wants you off the phone. 

[ChocolateReignRemix]

Not a big fan of lawyers. I wouldn't hire a lawyer and I wouldn't contact DHS. Why get them involved? They hurt as often as they help. Dh needs to tell the aunt the dd is not going back to aunts house. Via txt for documentation.

 

If the mom is a drug user it is doubtful she will fight for custody. If I could stop paying cs I would do that too. If the mom gets an attorney or calls cops claiming 'kidnap' then you can respond then.

 

I mean did the mom notify Dh through proper channels that the dd was no longer living with her?

No offense, but there is a lot of terrible legal advice and logic in your post. Edited November 20, 2016 by ChocolateReignRemix

[ChocolateReignRemix]

Just as an example.....dss15 came to live with us this summer. 6 months ago. We still have nothing legal in place. I have been able to enroll him in a virtual state school, take him to several doctors etc. no one has asked for legal documents yet.

And that is because he is living with his father. It doesn't mean that there couldn't be a custody (and CS) issue down the road if she objects.

 

Based on what you have said before it doesn't sound like your situation will end badly, but advising others to do the same without knowing their exact situation, agreements in place, and applicable state laws is irresponsible.

[Jyhwkmama]

You really do need a lawyer, Foxbridgeacademy--a good one.

 

Get legal help ASAP.

[lllll]

nm

Edited November 30, 2016 by cathey

[Scarlett]

And that is because he is living with his father. It doesn't mean that there couldn't be a custody (and CS) issue down the road if she objects.

 

Based on what you have said before it doesn't sound like your situation will end badly, but advising others to do the same without knowing their exact situation, agreements in place, and applicable state laws is irresponsible.

Yes, is true, very one should do what they think is best. Getting an attorney probably won't hurt....but I can tell you it is very unlikely to help.

 

What do you think will happen if they don't contact an attorney? The 16 year old is with her father....and unless his rights have been terminated no court is going to think that is a bad thing when the other choices are the mom or aunt as described here.

 

The issue that is likely to cause legal problems is the cs especially if it is through the courts. It might be worth it to pay the $500 for another two years. (A full 24 months is over 10k) if you can find an attorney willing to work with you on the retainer to change custody and cs you might come out ahead financially....hard to say....having to get an attorney for court from another state might be costly.

[Scarlett]

No offense, but there is a lot of terrible legal advice and logic in your post.

No not really. Besides I am not an attorney and not giving legal advice. My my own advice.

 

What everyone 'thinks' family court looks like is very different from the reality. And by the time a kid is 16 the courts just dont care. They still care about cs....and like I said that is a different issue.

[RioSamba]

You have a complicated case, especially because you are dealing with two states. There is a federal act which governs interstate custody jurisdiction, and lays out rules regarding parental kidnapping. I am BEGGING you to get not one, but two attorneys. You need one in each state. Look for attorneys who specialize in family law and know the local judges well. There is the law, and then there are the judges. There is little recourse and oversight with these judges, so it is critical that you work with an attorney who knows how the system really works, not just how it is supposed to work.

 

You may obtain temporary emergency jurisdiction in your state, but it will be kicked back to the home state. Obtaining temporary emergency jurisdiction can sometimes really offend the home state court. Sometimes it's a good move. This is why you need two lawyers, they can figure out your first move. You need to be prepared to go to court in the home state.

 

No one can tell you exactly what to do, because these cases are complex and involve state and federal law, and the particulars of your situation. More importantly, they often turn on the whims of the judges in the juridicrion. It could be a nightmare, it could be easy, it could be something in between.

 

Sell something, borrow from family, do whatever you can to build a chunk of change quickly. Understand that every lawyer could fill their calendar with worthy pro bono cases, so don't ask them to do it for free. Tell them what you can pay today, and make clear that you will find a way to cover all hard costs. It's easier to say yes to a little money and a promise to pay costs than it is to no money and the knowledge that you are going to have to cough up your own money on top of it.

 

My heart goes out to your family. The bright spot is DSD's age. Many jurisdictions will simply let a 16 year old decide, but you need legal advice before you do anything.

[RioSamba]

No not really. Besides I am not an attorney and not giving legal advice. My my own advice.

 

What everyone 'thinks' family court looks like is very different from the reality. And by the time a kid is 16 the courts just dont care. They still care about cs....and like I said that is a different issue.

It really varies by jurisdiction. I'm watching a case right now where a nearly 16 year old is being forced to remain with her battering parent. This is a good kid, with evidence. In many jurisdictions, she would be free to choose. Not here. Internet advice on family law topics is a problem because jurisdictions vary wildly not only in their statutes, but in their practice.

[ChocolateReignRemix]

No not really. Besides I am not an attorney and not giving legal advice. My my own advice.

 

What everyone 'thinks' family court looks like is very different from the reality. And by the time a kid is 16 the courts just dont care. They still care about cs....and like I said that is a different issue.

 

Giving suggestions based on your sample size of one is irresponsible.

Edited November 20, 2016 by ChocolateReignRemix

[ChocolateReignRemix]

You have a complicated case, especially because you are dealing with two states. There is a federal act which governs interstate custody jurisdiction, and lays out rules regarding parental kidnapping. I am BEGGING you to get not one, but two attorneys. You need one in each state. Look for attorneys who specialize in family law and know the local judges well. There is the law, and then there are the judges. There is little recourse and oversight with these judges, so it is critical that you work with an attorney who knows how the system really works, not just how it is supposed to work.

 

You may obtain temporary emergency jurisdiction in your state, but it will be kicked back to the home state. Obtaining temporary emergency jurisdiction can sometimes really offend the home state court. Sometimes it's a good move. This is why you need two lawyers, they can figure out your first move. You need to be prepared to go to court in the home state.

 

No one can tell you exactly what to do, because these cases are complex and involve state and federal law, and the particulars of your situation. More importantly, they often turn on the whims of the judges in the juridicrion. It could be a nightmare, it could be easy, it could be something in between.

 

Sell something, borrow from family, do whatever you can to build a chunk of change quickly. Understand that every lawyer could fill their calendar with worthy pro bono cases, so don't ask them to do it for free. Tell them what you can pay today, and make clear that you will find a way to cover all hard costs. It's easier to say yes to a little money and a promise to pay costs than it is to no money and the knowledge that you are going to have to cough up your own money on top of it.

 

My heart goes out to your family. The bright spot is DSD's age. Many jurisdictions will simply let a 16 year old decide, but you need legal advice before you do anything.

Best advice in the thread.

[Scarlett]

Giving suggestions based on your sample size of one is irresponsible.

You give your suggestions and I will give mine.

[Seasider]

I wonder if the mother would fight for custody only because she would lose child support of dad won. And if it would be legal (and cheaper than a court fight...) to buy her off somehow...

I wouldn't try to buy her off, but I would do what it takes (PI, etc) to document that she is spending child support money on drugs.

[TranquilMind]

Here a child at 16 can choose which parent they want to live with. ( I think)

 

She can  go to her father's house (your house, right)?  She has this right and the Aunt can't report her for running away. The Aunt doesn't have formal custody, correct?

 

Then you will need to file for custody immediately and correctly for your jurisdiction. 

Edited November 20, 2016 by TranquilMind

[TranquilMind]

You have a complicated case, especially because you are dealing with two states. There is a federal act which governs interstate custody jurisdiction, and lays out rules regarding parental kidnapping. I am BEGGING you to get not one, but two attorneys. You need one in each state. Look for attorneys who specialize in family law and know the local judges well. There is the law, and then there are the judges. There is little recourse and oversight with these judges, so it is critical that you work with an attorney who knows how the system really works, not just how it is supposed to work.

 

You may obtain temporary emergency jurisdiction in your state, but it will be kicked back to the home state. Obtaining temporary emergency jurisdiction can sometimes really offend the home state court. Sometimes it's a good move. This is why you need two lawyers, they can figure out your first move. You need to be prepared to go to court in the home state.

 

No one can tell you exactly what to do, because these cases are complex and involve state and federal law, and the particulars of your situation. More importantly, they often turn on the whims of the judges in the juridicrion. It could be a nightmare, it could be easy, it could be something in between.

 

Sell something, borrow from family, do whatever you can to build a chunk of change quickly. Understand that every lawyer could fill their calendar with worthy pro bono cases, so don't ask them to do it for free. Tell them what you can pay today, and make clear that you will find a way to cover all hard costs. It's easier to say yes to a little money and a promise to pay costs than it is to no money and the knowledge that you are going to have to cough up your own money on top of it.

 

My heart goes out to your family. The bright spot is DSD's age. Many jurisdictions will simply let a 16 year old decide, but you need legal advice before you do anything.

This is good advice, and certainly the best advice as to how to handle this to cover all your bases. 

[ktgrok]

I think first, is to contact her, find mom's address, and send a certified letter (or an email, if she has email) or text if all else fails, saying DD is going to be staying with her father now. And wait for a response. Mom may say "fine" in which case, I wouldn't bother with a court, etc. No need if both parents agree and it is in writing. 

[foxbridgeacademy]

Thanks everyone for the advice, much appreciated. We absolutely do not have $$ for a lawyer, to do so would mean our car would be repossessed or we'd be evicted. But that's right now, DH will get a bonus in March that we will use for a lawyer.... but things have developed oddly.  

 

Come to find out the Aunt isn't actually blood related she is more of a family friend. So she has no say at all (although she is being very difficult for some weird reason, doesn't want to lose her babysitter?).  She called DSD's mom who eventually got in touch with DSD and DH also talked to her.  She's giving DH temporary custody as long as he continues to pay support (it's multi-state so it comes directly out of his paycheck). This is better than expected.  It will give DSD some time to make sure she wants to stay, also get her established in school, she can get a job, and then in March we'll file for full custody in our state.  The mother has never established residency in the state she's in right now, Indiana (she's been homeless since splitting with her XH in Ohio) and we're in TN.  So it would be up to TN I would think?  They'll be less likely to send her back to a mother in another state who has no home. Plus DSD is willing to throw her mother under the bus and tell the court system about how her mom physically abused her on a somewhat regular basis (full fist punches), the Aunt, the grandma, DSD's 1/2 brother, the XH, all have seen it and I think at least a couple of them would testify or at least write a letter.  So fingers crossed things work out. 

[LucyStoner]

While getting a lawyer is absolutely the best course of action, it is simply not financially attainable for everyone. That's the plain, hard truth. Not everyone has stuff to sell, the capacity to borrow and/or family and friends to help out money wise. It should not be a privilege to have legal representation in family law matters, but unfortunately it is one.

 

Most family law attorneys will give you a free or flat low fee consultation over the phone or even in person to answer questions. Some can help point you in the right direction if your only option is to do it all pro se.

 

I wish people who can find ways to afford attorneys would realize that that is not a viable option for a large number of people.

[mommytobees]

So, I kind of grazed through the responses and there is a lot of speculation and theory going on here.

 

First, you need to know what his CUSTODY papers say. Get them out and read every find detail. Before that, you can't DO much.

 

Now, what I would _expect_ to see in the current custody papers is something along the lines of: shared legal parenting and some form of allotment of visitation time. 

 

When was the last time she saw her mother. Tell her that she has to honestly answer these questions: a) last time she saw her mother; b) last time she slept under (any) roof of her mother's; c) when they became homeless; d) where her birth certificate is.

 

 

Were I you....and if he has shared legal custody. I wouldn't send her back. I would, however, file in your state for emergency orders (I just saw that you can't afford an attorney) due to abandonment. This has the potential of being tricky, but as long as he has shared legal custody, he is within his legal rights. (this isn't about kid's legal rights, sadly.)

 

Second...... and neither you or Dh can say this TO her.

 

She can just refuse to get back on the plane. And see to emancipate herself. She's 16.

 

Kris

 

[foxbridgeacademy]

There are no Custody papers.  It's a really messed up long story but they were never married. She left the state while she was pregnant, moved to Florida tried to give DSD up for adoption. DH stopped it tried to get custody but with little $$ and no lawyer all he got was an order for support.  He had DSD for about 6 months when she was 2y.o. because the mother had a drug problem but then she got DSD back after treatment, moved to various states and continued to collect C.S. DH has had phone contact with DSD but her mom wouldn't let her visit.  We tried to go through the court but she moved again and we kind of gave up (again no $$=no lawyer).  Now that DSD is older and we are finding out how awful her mom is DH is determined to keep her (we had no idea she was being abused). 

[Guest]

I haven't read the thread, so I might be repeating.

 

Get yourself a good family law lawyer and file for emergency custody. You ought to be able to get it done quickly with an "emergency" status. Be prepared to shell out a lot of money though.

[Scarlett]

There are no Custody papers.  It's a really messed up long story but they were never married. She left the state while she was pregnant, moved to Florida tried to give DSD up for adoption. DH stopped it tried to get custody but with little $$ and no lawyer all he got was an order for support.  He had DSD for about 6 months when she was 2y.o. because the mother had a drug problem but then she got DSD back after treatment, moved to various states and continued to collect C.S. DH has had phone contact with DSD but her mom wouldn't let her visit.  We tried to go through the court but she moved again and we kind of gave up (again no $$=no lawyer).  Now that DSD is older and we are finding out how awful her mom is DH is determined to keep her (we had no idea she was being abused). 

 

 

Disclaimer.....I am not an attorney.  I am disgusted by attorneys and courts right now.

 

What do you think the girl's mom will do when she finds out the girl is staying with her dad?  It cost a lot of money to launch a custody battle.  Do you think the mom would be agreeable if her cs continues?  

 

How long has the girl been with you guys?

[Sdel]

You must contact the mother and get her permission for the daughter to stay until you get a court order that gives the dad custody. If you don't do so you will be violating your custody orders and you've lost your case before you even begin. The mother has custody and she has the legal right to decide for the daughter to stay with the aunt and furthermore, has legally given aunt limited custody via a power of attorney.

 

If there is no legally binding orders, then by all means, possession is 9/10th of the law.

 

Sdel

[ChocolateReignRemix]

While getting a lawyer is absolutely the best course of action, it is simply not financially attainable for everyone. That's the plain, hard truth. Not everyone has stuff to sell, the capacity to borrow and/or family and friends to help out money wise. It should not be a privilege to have legal representation in family law matters, but unfortunately it is one.

 

Most family law attorneys will give you a free or flat low fee consultation over the phone or even in person to answer questions. Some can help point you in the right direction if your only option is to do it all pro se.

 

I wish people who can find ways to afford attorneys would realize that that is not a viable option for a large number of people.

 

That is fine, but people shouldn't be internet lawyers are give advice that can lead to legal difficulties down the road.  There simply is not enough information in the OP for even a family attorney to give real advice.

 

Your two sentences above the bolded are significantly more valuable that the pseudo legal advice others were providing in this thread.

[mommytobees]

Okay, having read your last update.....and I'll also state that this is NOT legal advice and you need to seek legal counsel....

 

I would be very careful. If he keeps her without a local order, he will be at risk of custodial interference. 

 

Ask around if someone knows of a family attorney that would help.

 

Does your husband have established paternity? Without it, you are *really* in a bad position. Right now, try to come up with the money to prove that she is his. If you can locally, try and get it done through the local court system. Otherwise, you can do an "at home" paternity test. Without established paternity, he has NO RIGHTS to the child.

 

Also, if there is a child support order, then he either has established paternity OR he has assumed paternity. In that case, don't worry about the paternity issue unless an attorney says to.

 

Also, you said, "abuse". I am a firm believe in what I'm about to say: you cannot in good conscience send her back to a situation where she is being abused.

 

If you cannot afford an attorney and/or can't find an attorney who will help at low-fee...I would give some serious consideration to taking her to talk to a social worker with Child Services.

 

I know this is hard. But, you can't look at this 16yo kid in the face and say, "sorry, I'm not willing to fight for you."

 

{{{hugs}}}

 

Kris

 

ETA: I can't read at this hour: "DH stopped it tried to get custody but with little $$ and no lawyer all he got was an order for support."

 

Never mind about the paternity issue...that was already taken care of.

Edited November 21, 2016 by mommytobees

[Scarlett]

That is fine, but people shouldn't be internet lawyers are give advice that can lead to legal difficulties down the road. There simply is not enough information in the OP for even a family attorney to give real advice.

 

Your two sentences above the bolded are significantly more valuable that the pseudo legal advice others were providing in this thread.

Whatever. I think the OP is aware I am not an attorney. I told her what I would do. I trust her to use her good sense to make the best decision she can make with the money she has to work with.

 

She is 16 years old. Although I am sure somewhere there is some parent paying attorneys to fight to force a 16 year old to live where she doesn't want to, more often when a mother is a drug addict who turns over care of said 16 year old to an aunt who is not much better able to care for said 16 year old.....and the 16 year old then decides to visit her father and further says she isn't going back to the aunts.....well I doubt in THAT situation anyone is going to jail on kidnapping. The WORST that will happen is the mother screams that she wants her dd back at which time the OP and her Dh can beg borrow or steal to pay for an attorney to fight the mother for custody.

 

And if that happens they will probably win and get to stop paying$500 a month in cs which might help offset the legal fees.

 

It is a nasty expensive process. I would lay low and see what happens when the aunt figures out the dd isnt coming back. And don't you think the aunt might be GLAD the dd is with her dad now since the aunt is struggling to take care of her own kids?.

Edited November 21, 2016 by Scarlett

[Sdel]

There are no Custody papers.  It's a really messed up long story but they were never married. She left the state while she was pregnant, moved to Florida tried to give DSD up for adoption. DH stopped it tried to get custody but with little $$ and no lawyer all he got was an order for support.  He had DSD for about 6 months when she was 2y.o. because the mother had a drug problem but then she got DSD back after treatment, moved to various states and continued to collect C.S. DH has had phone contact with DSD but her mom wouldn't let her visit.  We tried to go through the court but she moved again and we kind of gave up (again no $$=no lawyer).  Now that DSD is older and we are finding out how awful her mom is DH is determined to keep her (we had no idea she was being abused). 

 

This is BAD!! This actually means your DH might have NO legal rights at all.  Has he actually seen his name on her birth certificate?  

 

You have to understand how most states set parental obligations for fathers.....and that is through marriage.  In many states, if parents aren't married, the "father" has to prove paternity as part of his legal claim for custody, even if they are listed on the birth cert.  If they are married, in most states, the courts will assign the spouse as father to any children born during the marriage for purposes of custody/child support (this is why you aren't supposed to be allowed to divorce while pregnant).  

 

If is nice that you have permission from the mom to keep her, but you must understand you have very shaky legal standing to keep her and be making decisions for her.  Be very wary, especially since mom might be very unpredictable as far as her allowing custody in exchange for demands.

 

Sdel

 

ETA:  if your support order was done in FL, then FL is the state of jurisdiction as well.  

Edited November 21, 2016 by Sdel

[Scarlett]

This is BAD!! This actually means your DH might have NO legal rights at all. Has he actually seen his name on her birth certificate?

 

You have to understand how most states set parental obligations for fathers.....and that is through marriage. In many states, if parents aren't married, the "father" has to prove paternity as part of his legal claim for custody, even if they are listed on the birth cert. If they are married, in most states, the courts will assign the spouse as father to any children born during the marriage for purposes of custody/child support (this is why you aren't supposed to be allowed to divorce while pregnant).

 

If is nice that you have permission from the mom to keep her, but you must understand you have very shaky legal standing to keep her and be making decisions for her. Be very wary, especially since mom might be very unpredictable as far as her allowing custody in exchange for demands.

 

Sdel

He pays cs under order of the court. Pretty sure that means paternity is established.

[Sdel]

He pays cs under order of the court. Pretty sure that means paternity is established.

 

Not necessarily.  Many state agencies will obtain support orders when mother's apply for services if they don't have them already.   Otherwise he'd have actual custody orders, even if they are ancient temporary orders, and not just a support order.   

 

He has a support order, but no custody order to give him the actual rights?  You don't usually get one without the other, so my best guess is that a state agency is who got the support order through.

 

Sdel

[TechWife]

 

If there is no legally binding orders, then by all means, possession is 9/10th of the law.

 

 

People aren't possessions. 

[Scarlett]

Not necessarily. Many state agencies will obtain support orders when mother's apply for services if they don't have them already. Otherwise he'd have actual custody orders, even if they are ancient temporary orders, and not just a support order.

 

He has a support order, but no custody order to give him the actual rights? You don't usually get one without the other, so my best guess is that a state agency is who got the support order through.

 

Sdel

They wouldn't order support without paternity being established. i understand he has no custody or visitation but he is still her father.

[Sdel]

People aren't possessions. 

 

My court orders refer to when you have the kids as your period of possession.  It has nothing to do with owning an object, but who has what at what time.  Whoever has the kids at the time of the initial filing for custody generally winds up with them after the dust settles.

 

Sdel

Edited November 21, 2016 by Sdel

[Anne in CA]

People aren't possessions. 

That isn't how family court works IME. Family court is a place where the wisdom of Solomon is reversed. Who ever is willing to cut the kids in half often gets what they want.