Nobel Prize for Literature awarded to Bob Dylan

[Robin M]

Dylan has been awarded the 2016 Nobel Prize for literature for 

 

for having created new poetic expressions within the great American song tradition

 

 

and according to the secretary of the academy, he is a great poet in the English speaking tradition.

 

Surprised or think he deserves it???

 

 

 

 

[redsquirrel]

I'm surprised  because it's a bold choice. His name has been bandied about for while as a potential winner, but I never expected he would actually win!  As for 'deserving to win' that isn't something I would even try to answer. There are always people who deserve to win many prizes who don't. I am quite certain I don't even know a quarter of the names of writers who should be considered.  I would HATE to have to pick someone to win that prize in any given year.

[6packofun]

I had to Google because I wasn't sure if it was posthumous.  lol  Didn't realize he was still alive...

 

I don't know his work well enough to consider it worthy, but the Nobel choices have ceased to be very meaningful to me in many years.  At least certain categories. :P

[redsquirrel]

I had to Google because I wasn't sure if it was posthumous.  lol  Didn't realize he was still alive...

 

I don't know his work well enough to consider it worthy, but the Nobel choices have ceased to be very meaningful to me in many years.  At least certain categories. :p

 

Just FYI, the Nobel can only be given to a living recipient. But, if someone dies between the time when the prize is decided and receives it, they won't take it away.  Which I guess is nice of them, lol.

 

I guess there was one person in a group of three who were awarded a science prize who died had three days before the prize was announced. It caused a kerfuffle.

 

But the living winner part is what causes angst among some people who are in contention. 

 

Doris Lessing was quite elderly when she won and the first thing she said was to tell the committee that they cut it pretty damn close, lol.

[Amira]

I love that he received the award.

[Spryte]

I'm happy for him.

[scholastica]

I don't know. This is the list of winners. https://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/literature/laureates/. Bob Dylan doesn't fit for me. He's a great songwriter, but on the level of the rest of these people? I don't think so. It's just my opinion, though, which isn't worth much, if anything.

[enchantedhome]

I am an ENORMOUS Bob Dylan fan, so I'm completely biased, but yeah, well-deserved and long time coming. My DH who does not enjoy Bob's music has long said he's one of the best writers in the English language, ever. I concur.  :hurray:

[Guest]

I can think of so many more inspiring, original authors, even in songwriting. But oh well :)

[TracyP]

My initial reaction was surprise, but I absolutely think he deserves it.

 

I am a Hibbing girl. My family has a couple fun Dylan stories that have been passed down from when my grandpa was in school with him. I'm thrilled for him!!

[kroe1]

I agree that he is a fabulous writer.

 

"Lily, Rosemary, and the Jack of Hearts" is my favorite, though, which many do not consider a literary masterpiece.

[Spy Car]

Both. Bob Dylan's music was in my life from my earliest memories. The folk albums were the soundtrack to my early childhood. I remember when he "when electric" in 1965. The great trilogy of Bringing It All Back Home—Highway 61 Revisited—Blonde on Blonde were played constantly (and still are) by me. Saw him in concert the first in 1974 (I was 16) with The Band. Literally a life-long fan.

 

My number one favorite musician. No close second.

 

So, I'm thrilled. But surprised. But thrilled. Suprised :D

 

Bill 

Edited October 13, 2016 by Spy Car

[rebcoola]

Now I have to watch "Dangerous minds"  again.

[Zuzu822]

Just FYI, the Nobel can only be given to a living recipient. But, if someone dies between the time when the prize is decided and receives it, they won't take it away.  Which I guess is nice of them, lol.

 

I guess there was one person in a group of three who were awarded a science prize who died had three days before the prize was announced. It caused a kerfuffle.

 

But the living winner part is what causes angst among some people who are in contention. 

 

Doris Lessing was quite elderly when she won and the first thing she said was to tell the committee that they cut it pretty damn close, lol.

 

I think I heard a Radiolab about that science winner...not too long ago.

 

Oh, it was The Moth. Is that the same person you were thinking of? https://themoth.org/stories/ralph-was-right Must be since it's so rare, right? I remember it was such a moving story. As they usually are.  :crying:

 

Edited to add link and info.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Zuzu822

[Spy Car]

Bob Dylan is a great singer IMO. A classically trained type voice? obviously not. But he's got something special as a vocalist.

 

Bill

 

 

[TranquilMind]

Dylan has been awarded the 2016 Nobel Prize for literature for 

 

 

and according to the secretary of the academy, he is a great poet in the English speaking tradition.

 

Surprised or think he deserves it???

 

How does it feel

How does it feel

To be on your own

With no direction home

A complete unknown

Just like a rolling stone?

Sounds of my childhood.

Good for him!  He is an interesting choice.  Though I guess I always think of those winners as some obscure old men. But he IS an old man!

 

Time is flying.  I saw a  cartoon where people in the nursing home were having an argument.  Half were shouting, "The STONES!" and the other half were shouting, "The Beatles!"

 

Oh my goodness.  Just yesterday, it was Glenn Miller or Harry James?  (Boy, I am really dating myself now, but that's my mom's music). 

[Stacia]

If they had a category for poetry, I could see his stuff fitting there.

 

But literature? No.

[Bluegoat]

I don't know.   I am ok with considering poetry as under the literature award, and I guess I am ok with songs being a type of poetry.

 

And I like Bob Dylan's songs.

 

But I'm not sure I'd say he is the greatest living songwriter poet.  Though - he does have a lot of good songs.  But I sometimes feel like they have a rather populist side to them.

[scholastica]

lol, on the Irvine Welsh tweet in reaction, which I won't link here lest Dylan fans descend upon me in ire. But yeah. Basically. I think the Nobel Prize has jumped the shark.

I was thinking this this morning when I heard this news. All I could think was that it might be an attempt stay relevant. Instead, they've made the award irrelevant.

[Stacia]

lol, on the Irvine Welsh tweet in reaction, which I won't link here lest Dylan fans descend upon me in ire.

 

I just looked it up.

 

:lol:

 

(Too funny. And right on.)

Edited October 14, 2016 by Stacia

[Little Nyssa]

No. it's just wrong- not his category.

[redsquirrel]

If they had a category for poetry, I could see his stuff fitting there.

 

But literature? No.

 

But, but but...many poets HAVE won this exact award. I think the most recent was the great Seamus Heaney? 

 

No, another poet won the year after Heaney won

 

http://www.poetseers.org/nobel-prize-for-literature/

 

I thought the same thing...that if Dylan won then what about Joni Mitchell, but Alice Monroe won recently, so Canada is going to have to wait a very long time for their next one.

 

ETA: my beloved TS Eliot won for his poetry, and no one can convince me he didn't deserve it

Edited October 14, 2016 by redsquirrel

[Stacia]

Some of the poets listed, though, also wrote prose, plays, & other pieces too.

[Paula in MS]

Bob Dylan is a great singer IMO. A classically trained type voice? obviously not. But he's got something special as a vocalist.

 

Bill

 

 

When he can remember the words to the songs.....

The only time I saw him in concert, he was not with it at all, but he is a fantastic song writer.

[Stacia]

I think Stacia meant if there was another category, outside of Literature, for Poetry.

 

Yes.

 

I guess I can see music (words) falling under the category of poetry, but not really under literature.

 

Poetry (written as poetry, not music) could more easily lean toward literature, imo.

 

So, I guess that w/ that reasoning (of mine), I see musical work like Dylan's to be two steps away from literature (whereas poetry would be one step away).

 

I'm probably not making sense, but there you have it. Lol.

[redsquirrel]

I think Stacia meant if there was another category, outside of Literature, for Poetry. 

 

Even then, there are better poets...

 

yes, but my point is that poetry is literature. There is no need for a separate category. Poets, novelists, playwrights, short story writers have all won and all fall under the category of literature.  Last year's winner is a Russian non fiction writer.

 

So all kinds of literature are eligible.

 

I'm just glad the winner is more accessible than usual.  I usually try to read at least one book or collection of the winner and sometimes it isn't available in English, or is really obscure.  The French guy, who won two years ago...sheesh, lol.   Honestly, I like Dylan's writing better. And I REALLY like it better than Lessing's work, hands down.

[redsquirrel]

And on this I agree 100%.

 

I can't get into the Dylan vs Lessing thing. Or my head will explode :)

 

:lol:

 

Right there with you, lol.

[Stacia]

yes, but my point is that poetry is literature. There is no need for a separate category. Poets, novelists, playwrights, short story writers have all won and all fall under the category of literature.  Last year's winner is a Russian non fiction writer.

 

So all kinds of literature are eligible.

 

I'm just glad the winner is more accessible than usual.  I usually try to read at least one book or collection of the winner and sometimes it isn't available in English, or is really obscure.  The French guy, who won two years ago...sheesh, lol.   Honestly, I like Dylan's writing better. And I REALLY like it better than Lessing's work, hands down.

 

Hey, I read some of Modiano's stuff! Lol.

 

I agree that the category of literature can be broad. But I think including music is stretching it a bit far. (Heck, I'm no real fan of poetry, but I can understand the argument that it fits in the category of literature.) Maybe I'm outdated & it's not stretching it to include songs. I'm just giving my opinion that I think there are better writers of literature (or poetry or non-fiction or plays, yada, yada) who could have or should have been awarded.

 

And, if Dylan is a contender (& a winner), I think the category needs to expand to include things like rap, to be fair. That's an oral storytelling form too.

 

Jmho.

[Stacia]

And, I'm guessing that had, say, Run-D.M.C. won the Nobel for their body of work, there would be more division & outcry than there is over Dylan.

 

Just hypothesizing....

Edited October 14, 2016 by Stacia

[HomeMum]

I genuinely thought it was a joke. The more I've read about it the more I appreciate this decision.

[creekland]

I like the decision.  I also like his songs, though I'm not as fond of his voice.  I suppose that's personal preference.  

 

Poetry put to music is still literature to me.

[LucyStoner]

This morning when I started my car I heard a list of Dylan's work and was like "did Bob Dylan die?!" I turned off the engine when I pulled into the loading zone by my door and didn't hear about the prize until we were on the road and the loop of stories repeated. I don't have strong feelings for or against the decision. It is surprising and unexpected but I don't think it is undeserved or a bad pick either. I'm very familiar with his work because my parents raised us on it.

 

I don't diminish lyrics as not being literature. His work in book form (some of which I was assigned in high school) holds up without the music.

Edited October 14, 2016 by LucyStoner

[Spy Car]

Eh, nothing more special than Waits or Cohen.

 

I happen to love both Tom Waits and Leonard Cohen, but don't know that either would have had a career if Bob Dylan hadn't blazed the path.

 

Cohen was signed to Columbia (Dylan's label) by John Hammond (who had a lot of clout after discovering Dylan, amongst other talents).

 

Bill

[ktgrok]

If they had a category for poetry, I could see his stuff fitting there.

 

But literature? No.

 

Isn't poetry a type of literature???

[Spy Car]

Isn't poetry a type of literature???

 

Why yes, it is.

 

Bill

[Little Nyssa]

If anyone is interested in reading any of the actual literature makers suggested for the prize this year, you could do worse than Ngugi wa Thiong'o.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2006/sep/09/featuresreviews.guardianreview21

 

Also working with an oral tradition :)

I've been reading him lately & learned a lot from him.

[Audrey]

Dylan has been awarded the 2016 Nobel Prize for literature for 

 

 

and according to the secretary of the academy, he is a great poet in the English speaking tradition.

 

Surprised or think he deserves it???

The Nobel prize isn't about who is or isn't an author, a poet, a scientist, an activist... It's about who is an exceptional model of contribution and genius in a certain field.

 

And... besides that... just because the words are accompanied by music, doesn't invalidate them as poetry.

 

And... some people sure do have a big ol' fat bunch of sour grapes. :001_rolleyes:

Edited October 14, 2016 by Audrey

[Audrey]

Hey, I read some of Modiano's stuff! Lol.

 

I agree that the category of literature can be broad. But I think including music is stretching it a bit far. (Heck, I'm no real fan of poetry, but I can understand the argument that it fits in the category of literature.) Maybe I'm outdated & it's not stretching it to include songs. I'm just giving my opinion that I think there are better writers of literature (or poetry or non-fiction or plays, yada, yada) who could have or should have been awarded.

 

And, if Dylan is a contender (& a winner), I think the category needs to expand to include things like rap, to be fair. That's an oral storytelling form too.

 

Jmho.

Would it help to explain that music and lyrics are two separate parts of a song? They aren't including music in the literature category. The music of the song is the instrumental accompaniment. The human voice is also an instrument when singing. The melody (or harmony or counter point, etc.) that the voice is following is also music. The lyrics are the part that are the poetry. The Nobel committee isn't awarding him on his creation of music, but on his creation of lyrics (poetry).

[LucyStoner]

I think the idea that Dylan "isn't original" is laughable. He's been copied quite a bit and he has influenced a huge number of other poet songwriters. That other very famous people have followed him doesn't undo that in many areas, Dylan did it first. I would say he is definitely exceptional.

 

Maybe Joan Baez and Dylan should have won together, like scientists so often do, lol.

 

And anyways I am glad that he won the Nobel Prize and is not instead dead like I so incorrectly assumed from the radio snippet I posted about before. :P

Edited October 14, 2016 by LucyStoner

[SKL]

I'm a Dylan fan, but I believe there are many people more deserving than he.

 

But I don't think the Nobel prize decision process is fair anyway, so who cares ....

[Bluegoat]

As far as music vs poetry, I would be hesitant to separate them in any way.  I would not say words and music could be seperate, because poetry written for singing has to take the nature of singing the words into consideration.

 

But also, though a lot of what we think of poetry today is spoken, historically that isn't especially the case - and with very old poetry that was mainly oral, it was often sung and that is why it is in poetic form.  But even more recently, a lot of Burns poetry was meant to be sung, or the Beat poets sung their poems.

 

 

[Bluegoat]

Does anyone think that Dylan, like Satre, will refuse the prize ? I hope he at least donates the cash.

 

This is another aspect that irks - big prizes like this often reward writers of substance who have lived with financial insecurity their entire productive lives. But Dylan is a commercial artist. His music has made him money. He has a substantial net worth. Whether he deserves the prize or not, he certainly doesn't need the cash.

 

Yeah - I don't know how likely he is to donate the cash.  He doesn't seem to be the sort of person who is uninterested in making a lot of money from his music because he has enough already.