Would You Say Something?

[Sandragood1]

So Im at our local Rec Center working on the 4-H garden. The local high school's flag corps are practicing beside me.

 

In the four weeks that this has been happening twice per week I haven't heard the coach say one nice thing. I have also heard him bemoan the small (and getting smaller) number of kids on the team. I think there were 5 yesterday.

 

If I had a dd on that team I'd pull her off and complain to the school. This guy doesn't know anything about coaching. He knows flag drills I assume but not coaching.

 

I probably won't do anything but it just irks me.

 

I'd like to say something, but what and to whom? The coach? The school? Maybe a parent at pick up?

 

It's poking my nose in but frankly the girls deserve better.

[TranquilMind]

I probably would contact the school and simply relay the facts, what I heard on what date, and tell them you thought someone should know. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

No, I wouldn't say anything unless I actually had a student on the team. 

 

ETA:  the dwindling numbers (and the reasons they give for dropping the team) would say more than anything you possibly could say. 

Edited July 22, 2016 by Jean in Newcastle

[regentrude]

I would assume somebody at the school notices that the kids no longer attend practices and asks them why. In my experience, teens will be vocal and complain about the coaching. 

Unless I had a child involved in the activity, I would not say anything.

Edited July 22, 2016 by regentrude

[SparklyUnicorn]

"not one nice thing" or verbally abusive?

 

If verbally abusive, yes I might call the school.  If just a major stick in the mud, no probably I wouldn't say anything.

 

But what a bummer for the kids.

 

 

[marbel]

I wouldn't say anything unless my kid was affected by it.  Even if you did, I doubt anyone at the school would take you seriously, since you have no reason to be involved. 

[Heatherwith4]

Verbally abusive - yes I'd call the school.

 

Just a jerk - I'd not say anything.

[MinivanMom]

Teen girls aren't generally known for being discreet about their opinions. If it's bad enough that girls are dropping out, then the school already knows or will find out very quickly. 

[TranquilMind]

I wouldn't say anything unless my kid was affected by it.  Even if you did, I doubt anyone at the school would take you seriously, since you have no reason to be involved. 

You are involved if it happens in your space.  She was right there working on a garden and overheard it all. 

Now true, we don't know exactly what she overheard.  Perhaps I determined it to be more abusive from her words than it actually was.  Not sure. 

 

 

[ktgrok]

I'll be in the minority and say I'd write a letter or email to the school and say something. 

[Rachel]

I'd say something. I recently overheard a camp counselor being pretty gruff with a group of preschool aged day campers. I said something to a worker I knew along the lines of, "This worker was speaking pretty roughly to these kids, she may have been having an off day and I only witnessed a small portion of that day, but it didn't seem appropriate." I later found out I was the third person to say something, it was addressed, and the next time I saw her around kids she was fine.

 

It may not have been my place to speak up, but by hearing from more than one person, it validated that something was going on at needed to be addressed. Teens may complain a lot but they also may not be taken as seriously by adults in positions of authority because teens do tend to complain a lot.

[SparklyUnicorn]

You are involved if it happens in your space.  She was right there working on a garden and overheard it all. 

Now true, we don't know exactly what she overheard.  Perhaps I determined it to be more abusive from her words than it actually was.  Not sure. 

 

 

 

Yeah I'm curious what was said.

 

I had a teacher who screamed at kids and called them stupid constantly.  I wish someone had said something.  I do not care if they were just walking by the door.  That's not right. 

[dirty ethel rackham]

I'll be in the minority and say I'd write a letter or email to the school and say something. 

 

I join you in this unpopular position. 

 

It may not have been my place to speak up, but by hearing from more than one person, it validated that something was going on at needed to be addressed. Teens may complain a lot but they also may not be taken as seriously by adults in positions of authority because teens do tend to complain a lot.

 

This!  The opinions of an outsider may validate the teens who do choose to speak up. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

Teen girls aren't generally known for being discreet about their opinions.

 

 

I have never heard this.  Where is this known?  Who knows this?  I wouldn't even know where to begin in terms of verifying if there is any truth to this. 

[OneStepAtATime]

Teen girls aren't generally known for being discreet about their opinions. If it's bad enough that girls are dropping out, then the school already knows or will find out very quickly.

Honestly I think this entirely depends on the teen.

 

I also agree that frequently teens may speak out but their opinion/observation/concern ends up being ignored/dismissed by authority figures. I think someone who has been around the practices several times but is not defending their particular child may find their own account may carry more weight since they are a neutral third party.

[Rebel Yell]

Honestly I think this entirely depends on the teen.

 

I also agree that frequently teens may speak out but their opinion/observation/concern ends up being ignored/dismissed by authority figures. I think someone who has been around the practices several times but is not defending their particular child may find their own account may carry more weight since they are a neutral third party.

Also, the coach could be a teacher and they'd perhaps rather quietly drop an activity they dreamed about rather than speak up and have trouble in classes next year.

 

I would speak up.

[TranquilMind]

Yeah I'm curious what was said.

 

I had a teacher who screamed at kids and called them stupid constantly.  I wish someone had said something.  I do not care if they were just walking by the door.  That's not right. 

 

I agree.  That's not right.  I saw it once in a hallway too and I was just visiting the school that day.  Yes, I mentioned it to the admissions person. 

 

[LucyStoner]

If the girls are complaining their complaints might be taken more seriously if paired with feedback from someone in the community. I don't know if I would or not. It would depend on what I was hearing. But if I did call, I'd call the principal.

[Riverland]

At the public schools my kids attended, teens could complain with very valid points until they were blue in the face. Sadly, my experience has been that students are treated very poorly by administration and a situation with a rotten coach or teacher is usually turned around and made to be the fault of the student.  

 

Now IF an adult complained or came in to back up their student, something MIGHT be done.

 

So, yes. I would say something. It would help validate the students' complaints.

[8circles]

I would assume somebody at the school notices that the kids no longer attend practices and asks them why. In my experience, teens will be vocal and complain about the coaching. 

Unless I had a child involved in the activity, I would not say anything.

 

Not in my experience.  Nobody would have 1) noticed 2) cared 3) listened to a word that was said.

[OneStepAtATime]

Not in my experience. Nobody would have 1) noticed 2) cared 3) listened to a word that was said.

I agree. My experience in school was similar.

[kitten18]

Teen girls aren't generally known for being discreet about their opinions. If it's bad enough that girls are dropping out, then the school already knows or will find out very quickly.

I taught teen girls for years and that is not my experience at all. They would often just drop out of things and no one would bother to find out why.

[MinivanMom]

I meant that the girls are complaining at home. Not many teen girls would approach the coach or complain up the line, but most will give their parents an earful about how terrible the coach is and how much they hate the practices. And most parents are going to want some sort of an explanation when their daughter suddenly wants to drop a school activity. Parents talk to each other and parents complain.

 

And no, I wouldn't get involved. These are high school age girls involved in an extracurricular activity they have the option to drop. These aren't small children, and it doesn't sound like abuse. There's just no compelling reason to get involved over a coach who hasn't said "one nice thing". If the situation's bad enough, the band director and/or school administrators will hear about it from the parents.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I meant that the girls are complaining at home. Not many teen girls would approach the coach or complain up the line, but most will give their parents an earful about how terrible the coach is and how much they hate the practices. And most parents are going to want some sort of an explanation when their daughter suddenly wants to drop a school activity. Parents talk to each other and parents complain.

 

And no, I wouldn't get involved. These are high school age girls involved in an extracurricular activity they have the option to drop. These aren't small children, and it doesn't sound like abuse. There's just no compelling reason to get involved over a coach who hasn't said "one nice thing". If the situation's bad enough, the band director and/or school administrators will hear about it from the parents.

 

I wasn't there so I don't know if saying something is warranted, but to the rest of it, you can't believe how many times I told my parents stuff about school officials and they did nothing about it.  I think they were under the impression they had no power to do anything and that nobody would listen to them.

 

It doesn't sound dire.  I think saying something is ok...I think saying nothing is ok.  I just have had many experiences of bad situations related to school where nobody seemed to give a darn.

[Rebel Yell]

I wasn't there so I don't know if saying something is warranted, but to the rest of it, you can't believe how many times I told my parents stuff about school officials and they did nothing about it. I think they were under the impression they had no power to do anything and that nobody would listen to them.

 

It doesn't sound dire. I think saying something is ok...I think saying nothing is ok. I just have had many experiences of bad situations related to school where nobody seemed to give a darn.

Agreed.

 

And so many times when teens, especially girls, complain, it is completely dismissed, or written off as the kids being lazy and not wanting to work.

 

My girls appreciate a firm/strict coach or instructor, but they would not tolerate mean or belittling.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I wasn't there so I don't know if saying something is warranted, but to the rest of it, you can't believe how many times I told my parents stuff about school officials and they did nothing about it.  I think they were under the impression they had no power to do anything and that nobody would listen to them.

 

It doesn't sound dire.  I think saying something is ok...I think saying nothing is ok.  I just have had many experiences of bad situations related to school where nobody seemed to give a darn.

I agree that either saying something or saying nothing is ok.  But my cynicism leans toward wondering why a school would care about the opinion of some stranger who happened to overhear a practice, esp. if what they are reporting is not actual abuse or a violation of some kind.  So my cynicism would cause me to not say anything because I hate being brushed off. 

 

 

[happypamama]

I think you're in a good position to say something. You're not a parent of one of the girls so you're impartial, and you've even listening long enough to know that it's not just an off day. Those girls deserve better. Maybe they or their parents HAVE complained but have been ignored. By taking a stand and saying something, you're telling girls that adults/people care. Don't we all keep discussing how girls don't report assault often enough, and how they often aren't believed when they do? This coach may not be actively abusive, but he's telling the girls they aren't worth much and setting them up to think they don't deserve better, and if they think they do, quitting is the only option. Who knows? But you have a chance to send the right message.

[marbel]

I agree that either saying something or saying nothing is ok.  But my cynicism leans toward wondering why a school would care about the opinion of some stranger who happened to overhear a practice, esp. if what they are reporting is not actual abuse or a violation of some kind.  So my cynicism would cause me to not say anything because I hate being brushed off. 

 

 

This is what I'm thinking.  If the girls/parents are not complaining, then why would the school care about the comments of some random woman who has no connection to the school at all?   If the girls/parents are complaining, but nothing is changing, then the school already either doesn't see a problem or doesn't care, so has no reason to care about the comments of some random woman. 

 

If it seemed like true child abuse, I would report it.  I've been through mandated reporter training for my state, and from the OP it doesn't sound like it rises to the level of abuse.  I could be wrong, though.

 

Edited July 23, 2016 by marbel

[Sandragood1]

Sorry I was unable to get back sooner. The coach is not abusive, though I think one particular girl has been close to tears once that I saw.

 

Thank you for your responses. I'm still thinking about it.

[marbel]

As a teen and even later, I was close to tears any time anyone said something the slightest bit critical to me.  Even at 60 I can start to cry easily, though I don't feel I am super sensitive.  I cried or nearly cried any time I thought a teacher was upset with me. (Which they rarely were, since I was so timid I never did anything.)  I'd feel bad for the girl, but mostly because I would see my young self in her.

 

I sound like I'm trying to talk you out of saying something.  I'm not.  I just don't think there's any point to it.  And, I wanted to comment about the girl crying, having lots of experience with that myself.  

[BarbecueMom]

I'm assuming we're talking about fall color guard? If not, disregard.

 

IME, tears and harsh instructors are not uncommon. Quitting, however, was pretty rare in my program, even with an instructor and choreographer AND directors who had short tempers. Is the high school marching band pretty competitive? Then they'll notice and make changes. A large band doing a field show with five flags won't look good in competition. If it's not, they may not even care how many stick it out. If it's the band director trying to handle the guard without a separate coach, then he's probably out of his element and needs an assistant. Whether there's a budget for one or not is another story.

 

I don't know whether I'd say something or not, but I'm surrounded by schools with competitive programs that likely pay $$$ for choreography or field shows and would act faster than I could track down the program.

[Alexigail]

Yes, I would say something.  I've emailed our local school about a teacher I heard berating some kids.  My kids don't attend school, but it was upsetting.  I don't see a downside to speaking up.

[gardenmom5]

call the school and let them know how this coach speaks to the students.

 

I was driving in front of the elementary school, and one older woman crossing guard helper was repeatedly chastising what looked to be a six year old for not walking fast enough.  she seemed fine to me.  I called the school to let them know - I never saw the woman again.

children shouldn't have to put up with being treated this way.   if an adult wouldn't have to tolerate that, why should a child?

[Haiku]

Absolutely I would say something. As a taxpayer and concerned citizen, I would call up and tell the principal, "I just wanted to let you know that the flag corps coach is not representing your school well. I've been working near where they practice for several weeks, and he's always negative with he girls. The number of girls on the team is dwindling. You should probably look into this."

 

Public school employees work for the public. The public has a right to comment on their job performance.

[gardenmom5]

I'd say something. I recently overheard a camp counselor being pretty gruff with a group of preschool aged day campers. I said something to a worker I knew along the lines of, "This worker was speaking pretty roughly to these kids, she may have been having an off day and I only witnessed a small portion of that day, but it didn't seem appropriate." I later found out I was the third person to say something, it was addressed, and the next time I saw her around kids she was fine.

 

It may not have been my place to speak up, but by hearing from more than one person, it validated that something was going on at needed to be addressed. Teens may complain a lot but they also may not be taken as seriously by adults in positions of authority because teens do tend to complain a lot.

 

this.

 

I meant that the girls are complaining at home. Not many teen girls would approach the coach or complain up the line, but most will give their parents an earful about how terrible the coach is and how much they hate the practices. And most parents are going to want some sort of an explanation when their daughter suddenly wants to drop a school activity. Parents talk to each other and parents complain.

 

And no, I wouldn't get involved. These are high school age girls involved in an extracurricular activity they have the option to drop. These aren't small children, and it doesn't sound like abuse. There's just no compelling reason to get involved over a coach who hasn't said "one nice thing". If the situation's bad enough, the band director and/or school administrators will hear about it from the parents.

maybe - but probably not. 

 

I agree that either saying something or saying nothing is ok.  But my cynicism leans toward wondering why a school would care about the opinion of some stranger who happened to overhear a practice, esp. if what they are reporting is not actual abuse or a violation of some kind.  So my cynicism would cause me to not say anything because I hate being brushed off. 

 

 

but this isn't a one-off.  it's 2x per week for four weeks = 8xs.  this is a community member, and this is the example of their school that is now out in the community.  if one teacher/coach is like this and nothing is done - parents with children at the school will start doing more wondering about how widespread it really is. if the principle is smart,  they'll deal with the perception.

Edited July 23, 2016 by gardenmom5

[Jean in Newcastle]

 

 

but this isn't a one-off.  it's 2x per week for four weeks = 8xs.  this is a community member, and this is the example of their school that is now out in the community.  if one teacher/coach is like this and nothing is done - parents with children at the school will start doing more wondering about how widespread it really is. if the principle is smart,  they'll deal with the perception.

 

Like I said, I don't see anything wrong with saying something to the school.  And I definitely would say something if it were truly abusive or I knew it to be violating school rules in some way (like sexual harassment).  The OP just said that he was negative all the time. 

[Sandragood1]

Well, I just returned from the 4-h garden.  The color guard was practicing again.  The coach seemed much better today.  Many positive comments.

 

On my way out, I passed by the two moms who were observing practice.  One I have never seen before.  The other has been there for all the previous practices, but never said anything other than relating comments like, "If you think this is hard, you should have seen when I was in color guard!"   I commented that this seemed a much better practice that the last.  That mom said that she had had a talk with the coach after the last session.

 

I'm so glad she spoke up for the girls!