S/o (sort of) Pet Ownership is Becoming Elitist.

[Spryte]

2 shelter dogs here. It took some searching because a lot of our local shelters have mostly pit mixes, and those aren't the right dogs for us. (I have nothing against them, really, but they're not for our family, sort of like PS.)

 

I think the fee was $125 - that included neuter/spay, first shots, microchips, worming, etc.

 

We did a local dog training class, for one of them, and applied what we learned to the other.

 

They eat basic dog food - nothing super expensive. They don't have special beds or gear or ... Anything. They have a big yard, lots of play time and walks, they live inside, with us.

 

They have regular vet care, and we will deal with emergencies as they arise. We cannot spend a small fortune on chemo or long-term expensive care. We would have to discuss and go from there. One dog has chronic ear infections and we are considering a deep clean and a pricier treatment but - that's after years of at home care, and we still haven't decided.

 

I don't think it has to be break the bank expensive to have pets. Though I suppose if one drops $1K on a pet, maybe one is more likely to want to buy everything at petsmart?

[fairfarmhand]

For those of you who need inexpensive vetting, go to a farm vet. They see ALL sorts of animals and ours has done fabulous work on our dogs. Most of the time, the cost is about half that of going to a small  animal vet.

 

And I can go there and say, "Here's my dog. All I want is shots. No exam this time."

 

And they say. "Ok. "

[hjffkj]

I'm a pet sitter and I have clients ranging from who the 1 percenters down to lower middle class families. what I see is that some income levels get caught up in the keeping up with the Jones group while others income levels just get a practical dog and do the bare minimum for their dogs. But none of the dogs seems happier than the others. I don't see dogs not taken care of because those people don't hire sitters.

[hornblower]

I probably don't belong in this thread. 

For those of you who say you get disdain about your pet care, I'm hearing a lot of disdain back at the type of pet guardian I am. 

I do pretty much organize my life around my pets. 

I foster for rescues. 

I help with fundraising & networking for rescue. 

My pets have what I think is pretty standard vet care but my vet bills are large.  I have two senior dogs now. They have needs for ongoing pain relief from arthritis and other old age issues.  Our rats and hamsters have had surgeries. 

I spend a lot of money on club, memberships in training associations. For competitions in dog sport & obed there are dues and trial fees etc etc. 

I buy lots of special gear for my pets. My new car was bought essentially based on how it would work for my dogs - both my current dogs & my sort of planned future dogs. 

 

I actually don't think it's a problem to buy a dog from a reputable breeder. 

I do think any mutt breeder is by definition NOT reputable & I cannot understand why anyone buys or supports that. 

I think there are tons of great dogs avail through shelters & rescues. I have done home visits for rescues & I've had home visits done on me. When I adopted my setter, just because I was involved in rescue & fostering, didn't really count. They still arranged someone to come see me and I filled out lots of forms & sent in lots of references. And I was glad - because that was a sign that I was dealing with a reputable rescue. 

I think way too many people get animals and dump them on a whim, or don't take care of them, or care for them a bit but then stop & I think far too many people consider pets to be disposable like old hockey equipment.  

Pets are family to me.  It is a privilege to have them in my life.  

It is an absolute disgrace how many pets are killed in shelters each year due to stupid people buying, breeding, not spaying, not caring. 

I think the standard of what is acceptable does need to change. A hundred years ago, in Anne of Green Gables it was acceptable to just pass an orphan around. For that matter, when Anne is living with Mrs Hammond, when she becomes widowed she just passes her kids around to a bunch of relatives. It's not ok. 

Anyway. I'll probably unsub from this thread pretty quickly. I find it too hurtful. 

[marbel]

 When we were looking for  our dog, we called several rescues that had dogs listed on petfinder.com.  Most of them required home visits before they'd approve us, etc.  We found our dog at a very different shelter. When I called, the woman snorted at me when I asked about home visits.  "I don't care what your home looks like!  I bet Mike Vick had a real nice house!  I want to see how you act with the dog when you come here."   And so we went, and we passed.   When we took him home, we had only two points of contact with the rescue:  a few days later when the woman called to see how we were all doing, and when I sent her proof that he'd been neutered.

 

I guess she was taking a chance. But I also think that people who run rescues/shelters get a feel for people.  

 

Re: paying a lot for medical care:  when our dog got sick (kidney failure), we spent more than I would have if it was just up to me, but I knew my husband and kids needed the vet to see what they could do.  I was the only one ready to be pet-free if our dog didn't make it, and if the end was near, I wanted the end to be quick. But the vets were very kind in the way they talked about costs, and always made it clear that we could stop treatment anytime up till the point when they said there was nothing else to do. Never did I feel pressured by the vets to do more; never did I feel an expectation that I should spend a vast sum on the dog.  

[Guest]

I'm sorry if I've had a role in upsetting you, Hornblower. I consider you the Hive Authority on animals (well, there are a couple others; Pawz and Spy car) and I would absolutely seek out your thoughts on an animal care question.

 

I can't imagine hamster surgery, though.

[Closeacademy]

All I was saying is that if my cat got sick we would choose to continue to make our house and car payments rather than pay for medical care.  She would probably get to live with us until she became so uncomfortable that she would need to be put down. Our cats have been with us 11 and 10 years since they were kittens.

 

Yes, our budget allows for pet food but I'd honestly have to decide whether to pay the car payment or shots for my cats right now.  And I used to buy them the expensive cat food but it was killing them.  They lost a ton of weight but once I couldn't afford it and fed them the cheap stuff they regained their health and put on weight again.  

 

I wish I could afford the expensive vet bills but I can't and the farm vet around here is the most expensive one of all where we'd probably spend closer to $600 for two cats to get yearly shots and a check-up.  

 

I do see my cats as family members but I also have to be realistic about finances and making sure the family has a place to live and food to eat..

[Miss Peregrine]

Lol! I remember those Gaines Burgers! I thought those were the height of posh dog living! Once, we got a box of them from a friend who no longer had her dog. I still remember spreading that "luxury" food on top of the Dog Chow. :)

I remember the commercial from when I was little. They way they crumbled the patty . . . I just never understood why my mom would not buy them for our dogs.

[BigMamaBird]

I had a notion that craigslist did not allow offers of free pets, which is not to say I have looked.

 

I actually have a weird, woo-woo idea about pets coming into our lives; it's a bit like the saying, "When the student is ready, the teacher appears." The two cats I do have and the two dogs I have owned "appeared" in my life when it was what I wanted. The cats were born to an associate of a friend of my husband - a very improbable link. But they were just what I was hoping for. The dogs came into my life similarly. I wanted a German Shepherd and my hairdresser's dog was having puppies. Even our dog's name was never in dispute, even though DH and I had not discussed it. We both independantly wanted a GSD named "Sergeant."

 

It was weird.

 

I do not know if we will get another dog, but I am just going to see if a dog turns up in our lives. If it doesn't happen that way, it probably won't happen at all.

 

I believe in Pet Woo-woo too.  You aren't alone!   :laugh:

[KungFuPanda]

Ok, I'm not one to keep my dog on a well-puppy schedule like I would my children. I got his puppy shots, and keep him legal, but I don't do every shot every year. I oddly have 5 friends who are vets; two who are at my house frequently, so the dog's health isn't neglected. I think some of these suburban vet schedules are designed to soak you. They got the idea from dentists. One friend said the reason dogs need shots so frequently is because nobody has bothered to run a study to see how long their shots last. Vets and pharmaceutical companies aren't going to finance a study that will prove your dog doesn't need X shot as frequently as it's currently recommended. I mean, I don't give my kids an mmr EVERY year, so I'm comfortable playing fast and loose with my dog's vaccine schedule.

 

Still, compared to people "back home" who get their dogs puppy shots and 'maybe' regular rabies vaccines, I look like a yuppie pet owner with my dogs seasonal allergy pills and whatnot :-/

[Pawz4me]

Do you agree?

 

I have mixed feeling about this, because I have loved dogs, cats and horses since childhood. I love to have pet dog(s) and cat(s) and have had one or the other or both in my life since I was a teenager. I'm not into horses anymore because they are too expensive, but that kind of segues right into what I am about to say.

 

When I was a teen, I was very concerned about the problems of inadequate pet ownership: indescriminant and accidental breeding, puppies and kittens as surprise presents, ignorant pet ownership and management, animal abuse via incorrect or non-existant training, ad infinitum. So I do see it as a good thing that there are far fewer unintended litters than there used to be and life-long pet ownership seems to be much more the norm than it once was.

 

However, pet ownership, most especially of dogs seems to be becoming an elite activity. If you want to acquire a puppy in the first place, this is no longer a simple or inexpensive/free event. The puppy I got when I was 16, my beloved sheltie/spitz mix, Nika, was acquired from a classified ad in the paper for free. She was a dear friend for 16 more years. I think it is actually impossible to get a free mutt this way anymore. Blessing/curse.

 

Now, every "mutt" I know was intentionally combined and costs a thousand dollars. Beag-a-Chons and Chow-a-Poos and Shepra-Doodles. (Yes I am being a little bit intentionally absurd.) But, having dropped a four-figure sum just to get your farcically Hypoallergenic dog, you have only scratched the surface of Responsible Pet Ownership because that first year's vet bills will set you back many hundreds. Plus obedience classes, grooming, toys, beds, idiotic leashes and the finest pet food. And a mini-fridge in the garage because you're feeding him Fresh Pet. He will have an anxiety disorder so you'll buy a Thundershirt and give him Prozac. Or have a canine psychologist work with him so he will stop eating the cat turds.

 

I don't really know what the solution is, and, like I said, I am happy that many more people consider carefully pet ownership than it once was and I do believe a much greater percentage of pets have a wonderful life than in decades past. But I do worry sometimes that having pets, especially dogs, is becoming a status symbol. I think fewer kids from working class or lower-middle (or even just frugal middle) will even grow up with a dog or cat. I find that sad.

 

I think by todays standards, I would not have had pets as a child and I would not have gotten my lovely Nika.

 

Am I wrong? Is it good? Should pets only belong to people with ample dough to buy them and who don't bat a lash at spending $900 on a mixed-breed dog?

 

I haven't read any of the other replies (yet), but no, I don't particularly agree.

 

My Shih Tzu has a champion pedigree that's really incredible. As in several of his ancestors have been at Westminster and all for many (many) generations back were champions. And he cost us a whopping $350 four and a half years ago from a very good breeder. The $1,000+ pups are either designer mutts or from puppy mills or tend to be breeds where c-sections are often needed (English bulldogs).

 

He's never been to a training class. I'm perfectly capable of training a dog.

 

He sleeps on our bed, so no extra expense at all for that.

 

He has a harness from WalMart that's about four years old and cost maybe $5 (although I admit I've been thinking of getting him a new one). He's using the same good quality leather leash that I've used with numerous dogs for a couple of decades. Maybe even longer! A good leather leash is money well spent.

 

He does occasionally eat Fresh Pet (or even better--frozen Nature's Variety Instinct raw), but it takes up a tiny space in our fridge or freezer. Not an issue. Mostly he eats what we eat. Tonight he had half a hamburger.

 

I'm glad things like ThunderShirts are around. They're actually a very inexpensive fix for many dogs who have noise phobia who in the past would have either likely done hundreds (if not thousands) of dollars of damage to their owners' homes or been euthanized (or killed by a car when they bolted). Since a ThunderShirt costs all of what -- $40 or $50? Seems like a really good bargain to me. I wish they'd been around back in the 1970's when my grandparents' GSD was dealing with thunder phobia (so no, it's not a new thing by any stretch of the imagination).

 

Behavioral medications like Prozac are pretty darn cheap, too. Most regular vets will prescribe them when needed. Few pets actually ever need to see a veterinary behaviorist. But I sure am glad they're available for those who do need them.

 

We have progressed in vet medicine (for physical and mental issues) just like we have for humans. And while there are some issues with that (increased costs, knowing when to say "enough") on the whole it's a very good thing.

Edited July 13, 2016 by Pawz4me

[SparklyUnicorn]

I see nothing wrong with what you do hornblower.  Everyone has their thing they care deeply about. 

 

 

[Guest]

For those of you who need inexpensive vetting, go to a farm vet. They see ALL sorts of animals and ours has done fabulous work on our dogs. Most of the time, the cost is about half that of going to a small animal vet.

 

And I can go there and say, "Here's my dog. All I want is shots. No exam this time."

 

And they say. "Ok. "

I did used to have a vet like this. It was a pretty long drive away and the guy was operating out of an old farmhouse in the midst of farmland/ag area. He had about fifty semi-feral cats hanging around. He was a very stoical, old school kind of guy, but was gentle and kind with the animals. He retired; the business was bought by a young female vet. The cat population vanished, the place got a facelift, and the fees went up exponentially. I stopped using this vet (although she was a very good woman) because it was no longer worth the long drive with animals getting car sick.

 

I do think it is reasonable for a vet to charge prices that make sense given the amount of education invested to become a vet. I do have nothing against it. But I do think it's a delicate subject, trying to inform a vet that you're not one of the "anything for Pookie-Poo" pet owners. When our dog, Sarge, was in his last couple of years, there were several ocassions where I/DH had to clarify that, while we love Sarge and don't want him to suffer needlessly, we also understood he was nearing the end of a normal lifespan and would not/could not invest thousands of dollars trying to extend his life.

[Guest]

Just FYI, I'm on "Like" probation now, so if anyone fails to get a Like from this point, it's nothing personal.

[Guest]

He has a harness from WalMart that's about four years old and cost maybe $5 (although I admit I've been thinking of getting him a new one). He's using the same good quality leather leash that I've used with numerous dogs for a couple of decades. Maybe even longer! A good leather leash is money well spent.

I love a good leather leash. It's those retractable ones I cannot stand.

 

Once, when I dog-sat my sister's dog for a week, I bought a leather leash and taught that dog to Heel because that damn snap-back foolishness with a dog who runs in circles is sheer idiocy.

[Guest]

I actually don't think it's a problem to buy a dog from a reputable breeder.

 

I do think any mutt breeder is by definition NOT reputable & I cannot understand why anyone buys or supports that.

 

I think there are tons of great dogs avail through shelters & rescues. I have done home visits for rescues & I've had home visits done on me. When I adopted my setter, just because I was involved in rescue & fostering, didn't really count. They still arranged someone to come see me and I filled out lots of forms & sent in lots of references. And I was glad - because that was a sign that I was dealing with a reputable rescue.

 

What do you think of breeders of intentional crosses? I'm not a fan, but it's not hard for me to see why they do it. People are clamoring for any kind of -oodle or -chon, largely because they think the dog won't shed and/or is hypoallergenic, and they don't understand the heritability of poodle hair or traits. My SIL recently got a Cavachon, which she thinks is a "breed." Or maybe not; I'm sure she understands it's a cross, but she speaks about it as if it is a breed; i.e, "this breed isn't yappy or hyper." KWIM? But I know crosses like this are enormously popular. Enormously.

[bettyandbob]

I got a hypoallergenic (poodle/bichon mix) from a rescue. We had to pay, $200 I think. I don't think paying something is bad. Owning a pet is a responsibility and can get expensive. In addition to pay in that fee the rescue interviewed us and had someone look at our home. They want to know we fully understand the costs and problems that could come up.

 

If people acquire pets for free, I don't think most will assess whether they can afford long term care for their pet.

[Audrey]

I agree with you, Quill.  It's a weird trend and not a good one.  An animal is not an accessory or a prize.  Sadly, I have known people who treat their own children in a similar fashion.  At least you can't breed and buy designer children (legally... yet).

[Ausmumof3]

I probably don't belong in this thread.

 

For those of you who say you get disdain about your pet care, I'm hearing a lot of disdain back at the type of pet guardian I am.

 

I do pretty much organize my life around my pets.

 

I foster for rescues.

 

I help with fundraising & networking for rescue.

 

My pets have what I think is pretty standard vet care but my vet bills are large. I have two senior dogs now. They have needs for ongoing pain relief from arthritis and other old age issues. Our rats and hamsters have had surgeries.

 

I spend a lot of money on club, memberships in training associations. For competitions in dog sport & obed there are dues and trial fees etc etc.

 

I buy lots of special gear for my pets. My new car was bought essentially based on how it would work for my dogs - both my current dogs & my sort of planned future dogs.

 

 

I actually don't think it's a problem to buy a dog from a reputable breeder.

 

I do think any mutt breeder is by definition NOT reputable & I cannot understand why anyone buys or supports that.

 

I think there are tons of great dogs avail through shelters & rescues. I have done home visits for rescues & I've had home visits done on me. When I adopted my setter, just because I was involved in rescue & fostering, didn't really count. They still arranged someone to come see me and I filled out lots of forms & sent in lots of references. And I was glad - because that was a sign that I was dealing with a reputable rescue.

 

I think way too many people get animals and dump them on a whim, or don't take care of them, or care for them a bit but then stop & I think far too many people consider pets to be disposable like old hockey equipment.

 

Pets are family to me. It is a privilege to have them in my life.

 

It is an absolute disgrace how many pets are killed in shelters each year due to stupid people buying, breeding, not spaying, not caring.

 

I think the standard of what is acceptable does need to change. A hundred years ago, in Anne of Green Gables it was acceptable to just pass an orphan around. For that matter, when Anne is living with Mrs Hammond, when she becomes widowed she just passes her kids around to a bunch of relatives. It's not ok.

 

Anyway. I'll probably unsub from this thread pretty quickly. I find it too hurtful.

This is my experience with breeders.

 

Our dog came from my sister who wanted one litter of pups from her female so that one of her children could have one of them. She vetted all owners, gave advice on training settling, worked hard to train and socialise the pups. She kept phone numbers and followed up with the owners at 12 months to see how the pups were going.

 

My friend bought a very expensive purebred chocolate lab from a breeder. It supposedly had a health warranty. Twelve months in the dog had developed major hip problems and couldn't walk. She spent a small fortune on x-Ray's etc and confirmed that this was the problem. She contacted the breeder who basically told her, medical expenses are all yours if you want to keep the pup, if you euthanase we will provide a replacement puppy. That's all! The breeder still breeds from the same parents who produced the pups with major health problems.

 

This is why I personally don't have a lot of time for expensive supposedly reputable breeders. There are irresponsible breeders and pet owners but they aren't necessarily nearly divided along the lines we think they are. Cost is definitely not the dividing line.

 

I also don't have a problem or any kind of disdain for anyone who does give their animals an extremely high level of expensive care. I do have a problem with people who guilt trip lower income families etc into thinking being able to afford that level of ongoing care is the only way to be a responsible pet owner.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I agree with you, Quill.  It's a weird trend and not a good one.  An animal is not an accessory or a prize.  Sadly, I have known people who treat their own children in a similar fashion.  At least you can't breed and buy designer children (legally... yet).

 

aww too bad...I'd like a much lower maintenance breed of child

 

:lol:

[hornblower]

What do you think of breeders of intentional crosses? I'm not a fan, but it's not hard for me to see why they do it. People are clamoring for any kind of -oodle or -chon, largely because they think the dog won't shed and/or is hypoallergenic, and they don't understand the heritability of poodle hair or traits. My SIL recently got a Cavachon, which she thinks is a "breed." Or maybe not; I'm sure she understands it's a cross, but she speaks about it as if it is a breed; i.e, "this breed isn't yappy or hyper." KWIM? But I know crosses like this are enormously popular. Enormously.

 

Absolutely opposed. 

 

The inventor of the doodle regrets it btw. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/canine-corner/201404/designer-dog-maker-regrets-his-creation

 

 

I'm not necessarily opposed to controlled outcrossing in the breeds which are suffering horrible genetic illnesses. That is a totally separate issue. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

My opinion:

 

Animals are not disposable. 

 

I don't think that they are  human either.  A  good owner will understand the needs of the species and breed.  Some breeds need a lot of companionship and exercise.  If you can't provide that, then either pony up the money for someone else to provide it (doggie daycare) or don't get that breed.

 

There are low(er) cost alternatives to special diets (for medical reasons).  I don't think that it is unreasonable to expect people to do some homework when faced with an unexpected need. 

 

Animals do need veterinarian care.  I do informed selective vaccination of my pets.  But I take into consideration the needs of any other animals that they might be exposed to.  (So if I were to do that hypothetical doggie daycare then I would vaccinate accordingly).  I also give a lot of my own vaccinations.  Except for rabies.  By law, that has to be done by the vet.  But even then there are discount vaccination programs available, if necessary.

 

When Libby was hit by a car I did a lot of the round the clock nursing care and even physical therapy because we could not afford it otherwise.  I did my homework.  I asked to be trained.  I took it seriously and did a good job.  The vets would not have judged if we had decided to euthanize her.  We set a time limit (with help from the vet in what that time limit would be) where certain medical milestones had to be met.  We took her quality of life into consideration.

 

I firmly think that animals need to be taught how to be good pets.  This varies by species.  You don't have to do expensive classes.  We have information overload on all of this via the internet, books and videos. 

 

I firmly think that children need to be taught how to handle pets.  I will absolutely not leave a pet unsupervised with a young child who does not know how to safely interact with an animal.  I think it is wrong to punish the pet if there are problems due to either the pet not being trained properly or the children not being trained properly.  For that matter, some adults need to be taught how to handle pets.  This is not a cut on them but a simple acknowledgement that we need to learn how to do things properly.  I seriously gnash my teeth when I see situations that could have been avoided from the start if people had done their due diligence. 

 

 

[hornblower]

This is my experience with breeders.

 

My definition of reputable breeder is not what you're referring to. Just because someone breeds a pb, even a registered one, and charges a lot of money doesn't make them a reputable breeder. 

 

I'm going out the door now but if someone wants later I can post what a reputable breeder is. It's a LOT more than this. 

 

 

As for the rest, there is boutique care & there is what I consider a basic standard of care. If you can't meet a basic standard of care, you shouldn't be getting a pet IMO. Now the problem is what is BASIC & that's I think what this thread is about. 

 

The def of basic is changing and evolving & I think that's a good thing. 

[liber]

Same with my grandfather.  And (not that I agree with this part at all) if a cat had kittens and they didn't want more cats they would kill them. 

 

My grandmother used to drown the kittens.  Put them in a nylon stocking in a bucket of water with a lid on top.  I remember digging in the garden and dug them up once when i was kid. 

[ktgrok]

Ok, I'm not one to keep my dog on a well-puppy schedule like I would my children. I got his puppy shots, and keep him legal, but I don't do every shot every year. I oddly have 5 friends who are vets; two who are at my house frequently, so the dog's health isn't neglected. I think some of these suburban vet schedules are designed to soak you. They got the idea from dentists. One friend said the reason dogs need shots so frequently is because nobody has bothered to run a study to see how long their shots last. Vets and pharmaceutical companies aren't going to finance a study that will prove your dog doesn't need X shot as frequently as it's currently recommended. I mean, I don't give my kids an mmr EVERY year, so I'm comfortable playing fast and loose with my dog's vaccine schedule.

 

Still, compared to people "back home" who get their dogs puppy shots and 'maybe' regular rabies vaccines, I look like a yuppie pet owner with my dogs seasonal allergy pills and whatnot :-/

 

Actually vets have been pushing for those very studies. We are now at every 3 years for many vaccines, and looking at longer. 

[Guest]

 

Absolutely opposed.

 

The inventor of the doodle regrets it btw. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/canine-corner/201404/designer-dog-maker-regrets-his-creation

 

 

I'm not necessarily opposed to controlled outcrossing in the breeds which are suffering horrible genetic illnesses. That is a totally separate issue.

Tangent: when I was a kid, maybe 12 or so, I read an article entitled, "What Man Has Done To Dogs." Vividly I remember that article, it had an enormous impact on me. It showed many breeds whose health has deteriorated due to selective breeding. I even devised a repair plan for several breeds. I was going to create a new, healthy version of a Bulldog, Boxer, Dachund, German Shepherd, Pekinese and a couple others, including a plan for breeding Doberman Pinschers and Great Danes that would have naturally erect ears. :D I always was a big dreamer.

[ktgrok]

For the record, Hornblower, I think it's wonderful that we have people like you, who can and do put so much effort, money, and time into their animals. And I think living in a home, with adequate food, regular veterinary care, vaccinations, heart worm prevention, and pain control for things like arthritis are in the "must do" column. (we have year round heart worm issues in my area...obviously other places are different). I do NOT think there is anything wrong with spending what you can to make your pet's life better. Or for being very into that lifestyle. I've done tracking with my dogs, I've worked as a dog trainer, I gave up a much more lucrative career path to become a licensed vet tech. I get animals being a passion as well as friends. I just think with so many dogs with no home at all I'd rather them go to a loving but less flush home than be euthanized at a shelter. Which means we need people of less means to also adopt. 

[Ausmumof3]

My definition of reputable breeder is not what you're referring to. Just because someone breeds a pb, even a registered one, and charges a lot of money doesn't make them a reputable breeder.

 

I'm going out the door now but if someone wants later I can post what a reputable breeder is. It's a LOT more than this.

 

 

As for the rest, there is boutique care & there is what I consider a basic standard of care. If you can't meet a basic standard of care, you shouldn't be getting a pet IMO. Now the problem is what is BASIC & that's I think what this thread is about.

 

The def of basic is changing and evolving & I think that's a good thing.

The breeder was supposedly reputable and ticked all the usual boxes though.

 

I guess what bothers me is the fact that with a shrinking pool of breeders and breeding dogs what happens to genetic diversity etc? What I see where I live with breeders is a generally very closed group and a lot of dogs with health issues probably due to inbreeding. On the flip side I also see the horrible situation like our neighbours whose poor dogs are producing two litters of pups every year for years on end and are basically just a money machine. Yuck.

 

I personally can see the benefits of a loved family pet having one litter of pups over a lifetime. It's not creating a massive amount of excess puppies, it increases the diversity over a breeder situation where one or two dogs are producing a large number of dogs. (And this gets worse with ai options as often one make may be the parent of a very large number of dogs). And with a smaller number of puppies the family is more likely to keep track of and care about the well being of the pups long term than someone who is "in the business".

 

Admittedly I don't know how it would be regulated to prevent horrible people like my neighbour but I do know that it's very easy to think you are doing all the right things in choosing a breeder and still end up with a bad situation.

[Guest]

 

Absolutely opposed.

 

The inventor of the doodle regrets it btw. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/canine-corner/201404/designer-dog-maker-regrets-his-creation

 

 

I'm not necessarily opposed to controlled outcrossing in the breeds which are suffering horrible genetic illnesses. That is a totally separate issue.

Fascinating article! I feel quite vindicates; these are all things I think and have (rarely, tentatively) said. I know SO many people who have intentional crosses, though, I have had to button my lip about this or upset the vast majority of dog-owning friends and family.

 

People really hate to hear they paid a grand for a mutt with goofy hair that still sheds.

[Guest]

Actually vets have been pushing for those very studies. We are now at every 3 years for many vaccines, and looking at longer.

Yes, when I took my kitty in, the vet was saying they do the Feline Leukemia vax less often now because there noticed cancer cells at the injection site. This kind of horrifies me, though.

[Katy]

I don't know. I think the problem is vets.  I've had vets guilt trip me for not going to extraordinary means for 20+ year old cats AFTER I'd already told them I wasn't interested in doing so. No, I don't want to spend thousands on a cat that is already well past his expected life span.  I want to make sure he's not in pain, and find an easy fix if there is one to make him more comfortable, and if not put him down.  Interferon therapy when you don't even have a diagnosis other than being 150 in human years is not something I'm willing to spring for when a cat is no longer able to move. I also won't do thousands in imaging studies after the x-rays yielded nothing, nor chemotherapy or many surgeries or anything else that costs more than a year of tuition at the in state university.  I also don't want to needlessly prolong an animal's suffering for my comfort. Some vets respect that.  Some vets act as if prolonging an animal's life at any expense is the only moral choice.

 

A family member had a dog that had bitten several people.  The whole family would get prepared to say goodbye to the dog, took him into the vet to get put down.  Each time the vet talked her out of it.  Let's try this expensive drug or this one.  Maybe the dog's not violent, maybe he's depressed.  It took the dog threatening a small child for that family to finally say absolutely not, we are not trying anything else.  Either you put this dog down or I'll call animal control because we've already had three bites that you ignored.  This dog is dangerous.  You cannot fix that with another expensive drug.  Stop trying to milk us for all the money we have or adopt him yourself, because he is dangerous and we're sick of your guilt trips.  Then this vet pretended to have not known about the biting.  Apparently she'd been violating state law, despite documenting the bites on the dog's chart.

 

I have several friends who are vets, but I will never understand valuing an animal's life span more than human well being or the animal's own suffering.

 

For that matter, for the cost of going to extraordinary means for one pet, you could probably sponsor the rescue of a hundred animals at any shelter.

[Saddlemomma]

Shelter dog is a whole other can of worms. In my area, shelters are the best place around if what you're dying to have is a Pit Bull/mix or a Beagle. I don't want either of those kinds of dogs. I really only want another GSD. But I don't want a German Shepherd that was given up because there is a high likelihood it is there for aggression.

 

There are GSD rescues, yes. But rescues for specific breeds are often more restrictive than adopting a child from Haiti. Oh, you work? Have small children over? Can't sleep with the dog in your bed? Rejected! And again, I think that's an elitist attitude. They want to adopt a dog out to someone who contracts to have doggie day care or is home every three hours.

 

I've had dogs all my life, mostly shelter dogs.  The best I've ever had have been GSD crosses.  You could try one of those from a rescue.  They tend to have the protective instincts, but are also very happy, friendly dogs as long as they feel you are comfortable with the other people around.

 

After our beloved Brody (GSD/Ch. Lab) died almost 2 yrs. ago, I was searching rescues for a new dog to help DD with her grief. Here in northern, ME, we have a real shortage of dogs.  Shelters here have to import dogs from kill-shelters down south.  Most of those are pitbull crosses.  Our insurance doesn't allow for pitbull anything.  Therefore we were going the rescue route.

 

DD picked out a very cute puppy described as a GSD/Gr. Pyr cross.  Now I've always had large breed dogs and crosses.  I took one look at her and knew there was neither of those breeds in her.  I also knew she wasn't a Husky because we always had at least one PB Husky growing up (Dad's favorite breed).  I know my dog breeds, but she stumped me.

 

After extensive research, I discovered she was a PB Carolina Dog (aka American Dingo).  I was fascinated and somewhat hesitant at the same time.  Having been "found" with her 5 siblings and taken to a TN shelter, I was fairly certain she was from a wild pack. Most shelters down south have no clue when they come across a Carolina Dog and constantly misidentify them as GSD crosses, Lab crosses, and everything in between.

 

Everything ended up great.  Because we were able to identify her breed and act accordingly with training, she has been an absolute joy to have.  She is endlessly fascinating and incredibly smarter - more so than any GSD mix I've ever had.  I wouldn't hesitate to get one of these dogs.

 

However, rescues aren't cheap either.  Zoey cost us $475 as a 4-month puppy. That's the most I've ever paid for a supposed mutt. DH wasn't very happy, but he went along for DD and me.  Now, Zoey is his natural hunting buddy; often killing the prey and bringing it to him without him ever having to train her or shoot it!

Edited July 13, 2016 by Saddlemomma2

[KungFuPanda]

I have no issues at all with intentional cross-breeds. A dog-allergic friend got a labradoodle a year ago. Her son gets a dog and she's not allergic. They've been delighted! They paid through the nose, but the dog was bred for temperament and arrived well-trained. Since they kept up the training, he's a delight to be around.

 

Human meddling is pretty much how we got all these specialized breeds anyway, so it's really the same thing in a modern setting. I don't get the snobbery around the older breeds while dismissing the newer ones especially considering the health issues with some breeds. How careful should you HAVE to be to get a healthy dog? If the system is THAT delicate, I think it's time for some more cross-breeding.

[Guest]

The breeder was supposedly reputable and ticked all the usual boxes though.

 

I guess what bothers me is the fact that with a shrinking pool of breeders and breeding dogs what happens to genetic diversity etc? What I see where I live with breeders is a generally very closed group and a lot of dogs with health issues probably due to inbreeding. On the flip side I also see the horrible situation like our neighbours whose poor dogs are producing two litters of pups every year for years on end and are basically just a money machine. Yuck.

 

I personally can see the benefits of a loved family pet having one litter of pups over a lifetime. It's not creating a massive amount of excess puppies, it increases the diversity over a breeder situation where one or two dogs are producing a large number of dogs. (And this gets worse with ai options as often one make may be the parent of a very large number of dogs). And with a smaller number of puppies the family is more likely to keep track of and care about the well being of the pups long term than someone who is "in the business".

 

Admittedly I don't know how it would be regulated to prevent horrible people like my neighbour but I do know that it's very easy to think you are doing all the right things in choosing a breeder and still end up with a bad situation.

I think this is a problem as well. This is part of what I meant by Blessing/Curse.

 

The accidentally-bred dogs and cats I have had in my lifetime were amazingly hardy. My Nika went for years and years with no vet visits. Most of her life, no need for medical attention. When I had her put down, at age 16, she still had no cancer or heart conditions, which seem to be ending a lot of pet lives nowadays. She was blind, deaf, had lost several teeth and probably had doggy Alzheimers, if that's a thing, but she was still alive and there was no evidence she was going to die naturally in the near future.

 

My Samantha kitty was like this, too. Barn-born kitty. Lived 14 years with barely any vet visits between the first year and the 14th year.

 

I think that whole Natural Selection concept - that's a good one. Darwin had something, there. ;)

[umsami]

I remember the commercial from when I was little. They way they crumbled the patty . . . I just never understood why my mom would not buy them for our dogs.

 

I think they were dog junk food.  LOL  This was before pet supermarkets and the such.  Alpo or Purina were the basic choices.  Oh, poor Paws got "Fit and Trim" when he was older.  Diet dog food.  I feel bad about that. 

 

I've had two cats who've adopted us.  They've all been taken to the vet, spayed, etc.  The first cat had teeth cleanings once she reached about seven.  Those were expensive, but I didn't have kids, so it didn't hurt too much financially.  When she was about 14, she got out and got injured very badly.  We took her to the emergency vet in Brooklyn.  They said it would be about $1200 and there were no guarantees.  DH was a resident back then, he made very little, but without a pause, he said do whatever you need to.  She died as they were bringing her back to me to say goodbye.  I'm not sure that they ever did anything (IVs, etc.) but we were still charged.   Foodwise, she only liked Iams....in the orange bag.  Oh, and Publix frosting. 

 

Kitty number two found us about two years after kitty one died.  She was spayed.  She's had one UTI which required amoxicillin and a special UTI-health cat food for a few months.  She's probably getting to the point of needing her teeth cleaned based on our first cat, but so far the vet hasn't said anything.  

 

Neither cat had super expensive vet bills for regular check ups.  I want to say around $100-$125/once per year.  When kitty two had her UTI, it was a $75 visit plus $10 or so for the amoxicillin.  The special cat food was maybe $20? 

 

Here in Florida, I see a lot of weekend shot clinics for dogs and cats.  Usually $25 or so for shots.  They show up in a van at a store or gas station.  We also have low cost spay/neuter programs. 

[wintermom]

I don't agree.  It doesn't cost anything near that to get a shelter dog.  And while it is important to take care of  your pets, there are ways to provide good care without it costing an arm and a leg. 

 

Pet products and services is a huge industry and continues to grow. Just look around at all the specialty pet stores and services that were not as common 10 or 20 years ago. I think it's more a matter of people want to spend money on things for their pets, and they're willing to spend more on purchasing the actual pet itself as well. Sure, you can try and do it more inexpensively, but it's still relatively costly to own a pet. Vet bills, food, grooming and boarding are not exactly cheap, and they are all part of the basic needs of most pets over the course of their lives.

Edited July 13, 2016 by wintermom

[Arcadia]

I was thinking of getting a bearded dragon. The cost of food and the electric bill for heating makes me think twice. We have fishes without air pump or filter so only the cost of fish food which is okay. Water is already included in our HOA payment.

[KungFuPanda]

Actually vets have been pushing for those very studies. We are now at every 3 years for many vaccines, and looking at longer.

I think most vets are awesome animal lovers and would like to see these studies done. I really think it's a matter of funding. WHO is interested enough to pay for it? It's slow going.

[Frances]

Shelter dog is a whole other can of worms. In my area, shelters are the best place around if what you're dying to have is a Pit Bull/mix or a Beagle. I don't want either of those kinds of dogs. I really only want another GSD. But I don't want a German Shepherd that was given up because there is a high likelihood it is there for aggression.

 

There are GSD rescues, yes. But rescues for specific breeds are often more restrictive than adopting a child from Haiti. Oh, you work? Have small children over? Can't sleep with the dog in your bed? Rejected! And again, I think that's an elitist attitude. They want to adopt a dog out to someone who contracts to have doggie day care or is home every three hours.

Saying this gently, but except in rare cases due to lifestyle or allergies, I don't really understand someone only wanting one specific breed of dog. Not wanting a big dog? Makes sense. Not wanting a small dog? Fine. Needing certain breed due to allergies? Ok. Looking for a guard dog? Several breeds qualify.

 

To me, temperament is absolutely the most important thing and that's why we've only gotten adult shelter and rescue dogs. The dogs were thoroughly assessed, we talked to the shelter workers and volunteers or the rescue hosts, and interacted with the dog several times. Absolutely no surprises.

 

Although I will admit my own prejudice. We've never owned a male dog.

[KungFuPanda]

I was thinking of getting a bearded dragon. The cost of food and the electric bill for heating makes me think twice. We have fishes without air pump or filter so only the cost of fish food which is okay. Water is already included in our HOA payment.

Leopard gecko?

[KungFuPanda]

Saying this gently, but except in rare cases due to lifestyle or allergies, I don't really understand someone only wanting one specific breed of dog. Not wanting a big dog? Makes sense. Not wanting a small dog? Fine. Needing certain breed due to allergies? Ok. Looking for a guard dog? Several breeds qualify.

 

To me, temperament is absolutely the most important thing and that's why we've only gotten adult shelter and rescue dogs. The dogs were thoroughly assessed, we talked to the shelter workers and volunteers or the rescue hosts, and interacted with the dog several times. Absolutely no surprises.

 

Although I will admit my own prejudice. We've never owned a male dog.

I totally get wanting a specific breed. I grew up with German shepherds. That's my idea of a real dog. They're these brilliant people pleasers who make you feel safe from snakes and salesmen. As an adult, we did the "right" thing and got a pound hound. It's a greyhound mix. He's crazy. He's afraid of thunder, the low-battery beep on the fire alarms, sudden movements, round foods, bathrooms, water hoses, febreeze, men, and goung out the front door unleashed. The list is longer, but you get the idea. I love him. He's family. He's just not terribly dog-like.

 

It's the preference for small dogs that confuses me. Large dogs seemed so much more relaxed and trainable and less of a constant tripping hazard.

[Guest]

Saying this gently, but except in rare cases due to lifestyle or allergies, I don't really understand someone only wanting one specific breed of dog. Not wanting a big dog? Makes sense. Not wanting a small dog? Fine. Needing certain breed due to allergies? Ok. Looking for a guard dog? Several breeds qualify.

 

To me, temperament is absolutely the most important thing and that's why we've only gotten adult shelter and rescue dogs. The dogs were thoroughly assessed, we talked to the shelter workers and volunteers or the rescue hosts, and interacted with the dog several times. Absolutely no surprises.

 

Although I will admit my own prejudice. We've never owned a male dog.

Well, it's not in the strictest sense; I would not care if it was a mix, for example. But a GSD fits with what we like the very best of all dogs that we know of. There are a couple other kinds of dog I like well enough to want one (Border Collie, Australian Shepherd...seeing a theme?), but for dog breeds that DH and I BOTH put very high on the list, GSD is the only breed.

 

I like an imposing breed. I like a large dog, but not a giant breed so much. I need a dog with a coat. I don't want curly hair, hair that mats easily, or ponderously long hair like Old English. Smart; highly trainable. Not a nervous or skittish breed. No howlers or extremely vocal dogs. No droolers. No dogs so exclusive I have to fly to Alberta just to see one. And okay, I want my dog to be handsome.

 

But, back to my Pet Ownership Woo-Woo, I'm not going to search to the ends of the earth to find the dog for me. If it is out there, I believe it will come into my life. I actually do accept the possibility that a non-GSD could come into my life and yet I will know that that is the dog for me, but truly - if The Universe has a non-GSD for me, I do believe it will occur naturally and I will know that this is my dog. :)

[Guest]

Leopard gecko?

Thats what i was going to say. Ds has one and my favorite thing is that they stay pretty small, so the 10-gallon continues to work.

[zaichiki]

Do you agree?

 

I have mixed feeling about this, because I have loved dogs, cats and horses since childhood. I love to have pet dog(s) and cat(s) and have had one or the other or both in my life since I was a teenager. I'm not into horses anymore because they are too expensive, but that kind of segues right into what I am about to say.

 

When I was a teen, I was very concerned about the problems of inadequate pet ownership: indescriminant and accidental breeding, puppies and kittens as surprise presents, ignorant pet ownership and management, animal abuse via incorrect or non-existant training, ad infinitum. So I do see it as a good thing that there are far fewer unintended litters than there used to be and life-long pet ownership seems to be much more the norm than it once was.

 

However, pet ownership, most especially of dogs seems to be becoming an elite activity. If you want to acquire a puppy in the first place, this is no longer a simple or inexpensive/free event. The puppy I got when I was 16, my beloved sheltie/spitz mix, Nika, was acquired from a classified ad in the paper for free. She was a dear friend for 16 more years. I think it is actually impossible to get a free mutt this way anymore. Blessing/curse.

 

Now, every "mutt" I know was intentionally combined and costs a thousand dollars. Beag-a-Chons and Chow-a-Poos and Shepra-Doodles. (Yes I am being a little bit intentionally absurd.) But, having dropped a four-figure sum just to get your farcically Hypoallergenic dog, you have only scratched the surface of Responsible Pet Ownership because that first year's vet bills will set you back many hundreds. Plus obedience classes, grooming, toys, beds, idiotic leashes and the finest pet food. And a mini-fridge in the garage because you're feeding him Fresh Pet. He will have an anxiety disorder so you'll buy a Thundershirt and give him Prozac. Or have a canine psychologist work with him so he will stop eating the cat turds.

 

I don't really know what the solution is, and, like I said, I am happy that many more people consider carefully pet ownership than it once was and I do believe a much greater percentage of pets have a wonderful life than in decades past. But I do worry sometimes that having pets, especially dogs, is becoming a status symbol. I think fewer kids from working class or lower-middle (or even just frugal middle) will even grow up with a dog or cat. I find that sad.

 

I think by todays standards, I would not have had pets as a child and I would not have gotten my lovely Nika.

 

Am I wrong? Is it good? Should pets only belong to people with ample dough to buy them and who don't bat a lash at spending $900 on a mixed-breed dog?

Elitist?!  For real?

I live in a rural area... lots of middle class and lower middle class people here.  Lots of pets. Very few appear to fit the descriptions above.

 

We actually have two "designer breed" dogs. They are "supposed to be" hypoallergenic, but they are NOT.  So please don't anyone believe a dog is hypoallergenic unless it's been proven for that particular dog.

 

Got these two from a rescue (found it on petfinder.com) for almost nothing. We have not brought them to obedience classes, though we have taken classes with previous dogs (all of our dogs have been rescues), so we know what we're doing... We bought our own clippers because we cannot afford $100 a month to pay a groomer for two little dogs. Bought no beds or toys (they sleep in our beds or on the floor and use the kids' old tennis balls).  

 

Our kids, like I said, live in a rural area and so we are surrounded by farms and by animals. We have a small farm with no disposable income for the types of house pets you described above.  Bu that doesn't mean no pets! Not counting the livestock, our kids have had dogs, rabbits, a cockatiel (a rescue) and parakeets (rescues), and a mouse.  Still need a cat to round things out -- ha!  Now it's true that we have spent more money, overall, on animals than most, but then... we do live on a farm.  The house pets have been quite inexpensive.

[redsquirrel]

For those of you who need inexpensive vetting, go to a farm vet. They see ALL sorts of animals and ours has done fabulous work on our dogs. Most of the time, the cost is about half that of going to a small  animal vet.

 

And I can go there and say, "Here's my dog. All I want is shots. No exam this time."

 

And they say. "Ok. "

 

I wouldn't count on that being the case everywhere. FIL is a horse vet.  He would tell you to bring the dog or cat or whatever in on his clinic day and charge you for an office visit at the same rate as any other vet in the area. 

 

If you have a vet who is giving you a price cut for seeing your dog b/c you only need shots, consider yourself a favoured customer. Which is a good thing! :001_smile:

Edited July 13, 2016 by redsquirrel

[Laurie4b]

I had a notion that craigslist did not allow offers of free pets, which is not to say I have looked.

 

I actually have a weird, woo-woo idea about pets coming into our lives; it's a bit like the saying, "When the student is ready, the teacher appears." The two cats I do have and the two dogs I have owned "appeared" in my life when it was what I wanted. The cats were born to an associate of a friend of my husband - a very improbable link. But they were just what I was hoping for. The dogs came into my life similarly. I wanted a German Shepherd and my hairdresser's dog was having puppies. Even our dog's name was never in dispute, even though DH and I had not discussed it. We both independantly wanted a GSD named "Sergeant."

 

It was weird.

 

I do not know if we will get another dog, but I am just going to see if a dog turns up in our lives. If it doesn't happen that way, it probably won't happen at all.

 

He had actually listed the dog for a mid-range adoption fee, but once he met us, he said he didn't really want the money, just to know his dog had a good home. He let us keep her for a week, then he came to our home to check it out before it was finalized. He emails now and then to ask how she is. 

 

Our old dog had died several months before and I really wanted a new one. Dh had reluctantly say ok. Ds found the ad. Dh adores this dog despite the fact she sheds and that was a non-negotiable. Oh well. :) 

[zaichiki]

I got a hypoallergenic (poodle/bichon mix) from a rescue.

 

For anyone looking -- just a heads up -- not all poodle/bichon crosses are hypoallergenic.

 

Our rescued poodle/bichon crosses (so say their vet records -- with one vet their whole lives before coming to us) are NOT hypollergenic.  We love them!  We adore them!  Allergic dd adores them!  We bathe them regularly and vacuum (dander only, because there's no shedding) often, but she sill needs to take allergy pills several days a week when she's home/around them.

 

Dd seems to have gotten more sensitive to them over time.  (When we first got them we thought she wasn't allergic to them because there was no reaction.)

[Anacharsis]

For my parents' generation, the resonant scene was that from Old Yeller, where taking a beloved pet out back to kill them yourself when they became a danger to themselves or others was seen as a rite of passage into adulthood. Norms now are moving towards sending modern Old Yellers to a veterinary medical specialist who may make an annual salary equivalent to their human counterparts.

 

It's always been a hard choice; the difference now I think is in advertising and isolation. If you live far away from your relatives, don't know your neighbors, and work keeps friendships superficial, the warmth of a beloved pet can be very precious. Unfortunately, marketers know this. There is a lot of money involved in pet end-of-life; as such, there is an incentive to change public opinion.

Edited July 13, 2016 by Anacharsis

[hornblower]

The breeder was supposedly reputable and ticked all the usual boxes though.

 

 

to me this is what a reputable breeder is: (source:  No Puppy Mills Canada).  

 

I'd also add - They rarely advertise. They frequently have wait lists for puppies.

 

I also have a personal bias for dogs that are titled in more than just conformation but that's a bit breed dependent too.... 

 

 

 

A reputable breeder:

• Takes responsible care of all of his or her dogs (breeding stock & puppies), and  provides:

a)       Companionship, affection, interaction & attention

b)       Nutritious quality dog food & fresh clean water

c)       Immunization

d)       Proper vet care

e)       Parasite prevention/treatment

f)        Grooming

g)       Exercise

h)       Socialization 

• Belongs to a national (and/or local) breed club.

• Abides by their breed club's Code of Ethics.

• Tests their breeding stock for any congenital diseases, conditions  (ie: hip dysplasia, Von Willebrand's Disease, retinal dyslasia, etc.),  and strives to eliminate genetic problems by breeding only sound dogs  (shown to be free of any serious physical conditions and/or temperament problems) .

•  Only breeds dogs that have excellent temperaments.

•   Is very knowledgeable about their breed.

•  Strives to better their breed.

•  Immunizes their puppies' Sires and Dams (& their Puppies) appropriate for location and age of pups/dogs.

• Screens potential owners thoroughly, and does not sell to those who are  unsuitable.*

  Educates potential owners, and discloses any pertinent information about  their breed.

• Has a spay & neuter contract or alters dogs prior to sale

•  Offers new puppy owners guidance and support (for the puppy's entire  lifetime).

• NEVER sells puppies to puppy brokers, pet shops or puppy outlets of any kind  (including so-called "Kennel Clubs"). Period.

•  Shows, trials and/or titles their dogs.

• Supports or participates in breed rescue work whenever possible.

• Never breeds out of greed (and never over-breeds).

• Will take back a puppy or dog back at any time.

   

   

   

  *A reputable breeder wants to know as much about you, your household, your schedule and your ability to properly care for a puppy (throughout its entire lifetime), this may include an application, reference and home check, as you want to know about the breeder's puppies.

[Tita Gidge]

I lived in an area of the country where one saw dog strollers more than baby strollers and dogs really were furry children/grandchildren.  There were pet chefs.  Probably the refrigerated food at Costco outsold the dry stuff.  It was insane.

 

 

Yes! This is exactly the same where I live :lol:

 

A lady a few streets over loved seeing my daughter in our Hotslings pouches.  I ended up selling them to her and we'd see her 'walking' her dogs in them. I bet she wishes she had known about dog strollers LOL. We see one guy on a bike who pulls his dog and his toddler in this contraption behind him. It's like a small tent on wheels.