Math stamina and standardized testing (3rd grader)

[Squawky Acres]

I was wondering if there is a way to teach perseverance and stamina in doing math.  We just finished up our annual Stanford Achievement tests to comply with state requirements.  DD9 enjoyed her tests, and got excellent scores in many areas -- including "Math Problem Solving," a section that does include some calculations, but also has some cute pictures and a lot of interesting questions requiring thought and reasoning.  Her Math Computation score, however, was an absolute disaster (around the 50th percentile).  When presented with the section, there was a lot of eye-rolling and sighing, and exclamations of how she couldn't possibly do these "pages and pages" and "hours and hours" of "boring math problems."  And I really think that was the problem.  It was about an hour of problem after problem of straight computation.  She knew how to do most of the math, but she made careless errors (adding when it said to subtract, for example), as it just didn't hold her interest in the way that the problem solving section did, and I have never asked her to sit down and do math problems for an hour, so she didn't even know how to approach it.

 

Our current math program, RightStart, is very teacher-intensive and light on worksheets.  We are also about half a year "behind" in math, as I switched from Saxon 2 last year, and she only tested into RS C (which is the 2nd grade level) -- but I have had her working in the Kumon Multiplication and Division books to keep up with her 3rd grade-level skills.  Interestingly, she did very well with the multiplication and division.  Most of the disaster was with multi-digit subtraction -- more of a 2nd grade skill and something we have spent ALL YEAR DOING with RS C.

 

I really wanted to make sure she understood everything and did not have any gaps, but now I feel that maybe I was the one doing all the work and not requiring enough of her.  I'm afraid that I have neglected to teach her the hard work and discipline of simply working problems.  Is this something that anyone else is intentional about, and is this even a worthy goal?  I know that test scores are not the end-all, but she is a bright student, and I need to know that I am educating her at least as well as the public school.  I am feeling very discouraged.

Edited July 1, 2016 by Squawky Acres

[catz]

My kids were just like this.  I think my son jumped about 6 grade levels in standardized testing the year his accuracy caught up with his conceptual math ability.  I guess I'd keep chipping away and not get too caught up in an individual score if it seems like she's otherwise doing well.  Different curriculum have varying sequences.  I'd just make sure you were working on fact memorization.  I actually treated that separately than conceptual math.  We mostly just used online games.

 

(Coming clean - I have a math degree and am not thrilled with the progression of many elementary programs)

[Arcadia]

I would not expect a 9 year old to have a good attitude for an hour of problem after problem of straight computation.

 

I told my kids that they have to be careful when sitting for standardized test regardless of how dumb they think the questions are. It is their "get out of jail" card. One morning of being careful was a worthwhile tradeoff to them for not having extra drills.

 

As for whether carelessness due to boredom matters in the long term, I would honestly say it does. I tell my kids that if the bridge engineers are complacent because they are bored, what do they think might happen.

Also there are "boring" computations in physics, chemistry, statistics, economics, SAT and ACT. A simple careless error would cause the final answer to be wrong. On a test, it is just lower marks. On a job, it means dollars lost.

 

My DS10 was so overly careful that he is slow in finishing math. He might make a good auditor :P

My DS11 has learnt over the years to be more careful without reduction in speed.

 

I won't worry at her age. Just remind her to be careful. Teach her to check her work.

[Squawky Acres]

Thanks.  Going forward, I think I do need to make sure her math facts are solid.  She "mastered" addition/subtraction in her ReflexMath program, and is now working on multiplication/division.  Maybe she has forgotten some addition/subtraction facts in the meantime, or they are not automatic.  I have Kate's "Addition Facts that Stick," and am planning to run that six-week program with my 6-, 8, and 9-year-olds this summer.  They can all review them together.

 

We also need to have a talk about doing our best work, checking work, and being careful.  I don't want to replicate the test too much by forcing her to do hours of straight computation, but I could have her work on computation for ten minutes or so, and then check her answers.

 

 

[Tiramisu]

As a heads up, 50th percentile on a standardized test means average. It wasn't clear from your post if that was understood. Don't worry that her computation skills are an absolute disaster. They are right in the middle. If she has a weakness in math, this shows you've actually been doing a great job.

 

I wouldn't push too hard. For my kid with stamina issues, I found lightening up her workload increased stamina, and she makes the same type of mistakes as your DD. When kids like this feel pressure, they can shut down and start to hate their school work. So it's better to keep going steadily and not push. And make sure you are giving her a lot of praise and positive feedback. Let her know she's really doing fine, because she is.

 

One more thing, I had one kid who was very slow at learning her facts. Things didn't click until she was about ten and a half. But she was still terribly slow with her daily work. When she took a placement test for high school, they recommended honors math. I wouldn't believe it so we settled for the regular track and geometry in 9th grade. The whole year her math teacher told us we made a mistake, and she finished the year at the top of her class with an average above 100.

 

Keep doing what you're doing!

[Squawky Acres]

Thank you.  Yes, I'm sorry I wasn't clear.  I do understand that 50th percentile means average, but I hope to give her much more than an "average" education.  I am discouraged as it is significantly lower than her other scores, and (in my opinion) far below her capabilities.  

 

She does have some anxiety about math, but I have really tried to be encouraging -- and haven't discussed the test results with her.  I just asked her if she worked carefully and did her best, which she said that she had.

[Arcadia]

Anxiety does exacerbate carelessness. Math Minutes is useful and convenient for a quick practice on computation skills. It is a few minutes per day.

 

Link is about her level. You can buy a softcopy if you think it suits your purpose.

http://bbaeza.wikispaces.com/file/view/MM_GD_4.pdf

[fralala]

We also need to have a talk about doing our best work, checking work, and being careful.  I don't want to replicate the test too much by forcing her to do hours of straight computation, but I could have her work on computation for ten minutes or so, and then check her answers.

 

I had this talk with my daughter, and I also have her correct her own worksheets-- I tell her to put stars next to the problems she got right and circle the ones she got wrong. The poor kid has probably heard from me a million times "If it's too easy and boring, that means you have no excuses for getting them wrong!"

 

I do try to make all the memory drills for math fun to make up for my uncompromising attitude toward checking her own work, because I've noticed with her, complaints that math is easy and boring seem to come when she understands the concept perfectly but has not memorized well enough for the simple operations to be automatic. It's boring because it's taking her too long to do easy problems. So her worksheets tend to be short and have more complicated problems while we simultaneously play math facts Bingo and card games and computer games with the basic facts.

[catz]

Thank you.  Yes, I'm sorry I wasn't clear.  I do understand that 50th percentile means average, but I hope to give her much more than an "average" education.  I am discouraged as it is significantly lower than her other scores, and (in my opinion) far below her capabilities.  

 

She does have some anxiety about math, but I have really tried to be encouraging -- and haven't discussed the test results with her.  I just asked her if she worked carefully and did her best, which she said that she had.

 

I do think some of this stuff is developmental and progresses differently for different kids.  I do have a math degree.  I always got very high scores high school and beyond through grad level math classes.  That said, I was very mediocre in fact based speed math tests in elementary school.  I hate to see parents get too caught up by rubbing a kids nose in that fact when they will naturally get faster.  You can kill a love for math that way.  I had no problem once I got into pre-alg/alg.  By then all those facts were cemented and we weren't tested on time anymore under pressure.  I think kids that are  whole picture learners are not necessarily fast or strong memorizers and some of those things cement later FWIW.  Those same kids might be amazing in conceptual math skills.  I would definitely not be panicking about this in an 8 year old.  If your child is reaching high school age and struggling, that's different.

 

Spending 10 minutes a day on something like rocket math or timez attack worked great over the long term for my kids. 

Edited July 2, 2016 by WoolySocks

[Epicurean]

My DH is a math professor and his experience was similar to WoolySocks. Computation is just kind of tedious and hard for kids to do for a prolonged time.

 

I wonder how she would have done if you had broken up the section into ten minutes per day? The Stanford isn't timed, after all, and I hear that taking five or six days to complete it isn't unusual.

 

If you are really curious, you could wait a few months (let this testing experience fade from memory a bit) and give her a practice Stanford for just computation in ten minute increments to see if she scores any better.

[TracyP]

I have seen the same issue with my 10yo son. We have been testing since he was 7 (as required in my state) and this is the first year that his computation score caught up to the conceptual one. It sounds like you have a good plan. Between that and time I think you will see a lot of improvement.

[Hobbes]

We used Calculadders as kids and my DDs use them now. I've seen a huge leap in computation ability in my 8yo since we started them. We use Calculadder 4x a week and it's rarely over 5 minutes (the end goal is 2 minutes a sheet), so it's not a time-hog, but does get them rolling with the basic facts, which might be a help if you're looking for something like that?

 

That said, I don't know that DD would do well with a solid hour... I think she'd lose steam and make mistakes.