Disagreement with dh over makeup.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Maybe invest in some really good makeup remover wipes.  Seriously this is a strange thing to get so hung up on. 

 

I agree ideally you'd be on the same page, but he doesn't seem to even want to hear you out. 

[J-rap]

I'd bring it up with my husband in private, and remind him what a great gal she is and that winged eye-liner is trivial.

 

But, I also know that everyone has their "thing" that for whatever reason they don't want to see on their children.  If you absolutely can't talk him out of it, then your options are:  to go against him and tell her to do it with your backing and let the chips fall where they may;  tell her she has your support, BUT for some reason it's an issue that is important to your husband, so at least take it off before your husband comes home;  stand by your husband (and maybe help your daughter understand that you really do NOT think it's a big deal, but that it's important to your husband and that sometimes parents just need to support each other (and that in two years she can do what she wants with winged eyeliner!)

 

Because I'm a person who absolutely hates to make waves, I'd probably go with #2.  (That is, after I had already talked to my husband in private and tried to change his mind.)  I wouldn't be unkind or mean about my husband when discussing it with my daughter, but I'd frame it in a way that helped her understand that he's really acting with her best interest in mind, he loves her, and that he's not perfect.  I'd probably throw some light-hearted humor into it all too.

 

I had to hide my 3rd ear piercing from my dad for 3 years (back in the 70's), but my mother knew and was secretly pleased.   :)  Because my mother made it simply a funny secret that we shared, I never got mad at my dad or blamed him for anything.  I just figured it was one of those things that bugged him, no big deal.   :)

[SparklyUnicorn]

Although "children".  That's the key.  Maybe by some strict technical definition this is a child, but not really.  If she were 12 or 13..sure...but 16? 

[Joker]

I'm trying to raise my dds to be independent, confident women who can take care of themselves and are able to stand up for themselves. I also want them to have good, healthy relationships of their own.

 

I can't imagine the message it would send to let dh be so irrational about something so trivial and to actually bend to his will on this to avoid making waves. If he refuses to listen to you, I would really push counseling to let him know how irrational his thinking is on this.

[Junie]

I'm confused by this line.  What exactly does it mean? 

 

What I meant is that if you get a job or go into the military or whatever, you are subject to their authority (including, sometimes, a dress code).  It is the woman's choice whether she wants to put herself under that authority or not.

[goldberry]

Another vote for private conversation with DH. DH has had a few viewpoints that seemed overboard to me, and we talked about them privately.  He knows I spend most of the time with DD and that I have a good vibe of how she reacts to things.  We discussed how she would/might react and I convinced him that it wasn't worth where he was going.  

[Tita Gidge]

I can't keep up with the posts, lol.

 

Trust me when I say I have defended her. I told him last night very matter-of-factly that I do not support his punishment(no makeup for x amount of days) or even his stance on this. I told him that he is damaging their relationship further. That this is not a character issue for her but the way he is treating her is bad character on his part.

 

All I got was a text this morning that we need to be a team, with a subtext that I need to back him up.

 

Maybe it's time for you and DD to dig up some 60s or 70s-fabulous photos of Dad in all of his trendy glory. :lol:

[Kiara.I]

All I got was a text this morning that we need to be a team, with a subtext that I need to back him up.

 

Mmm.

Does he generally in other circumstances feel that the he's the captain of the team and therefore all the backing up comes from you?

Because you could equally tell him that you need to be a team so he needs to back YOU up.  (Another poster pointed that out already...)

 

Really, to that I'd probably say something like,

"It would be great if we were a team on this.  But I utterly disagree with your position and cannot support it.  Would you like to be a team by supporting my position instead?"

 

Have you sat him down and asked him to dig into the interests and motivations that are underlying his position?  It can be a tricky conversation to have, but if you can do it well he might start to be a little bit more communicative and might eventually come to realize that actually, his position is not a logical outflow of his interests and motivations.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Maybe it's time for you and DD to dig up some 60s or 70s-fabulous photos of Dad in all of his trendy glory. :lol:

 

Oh yeah!!

 

My husband commented on our son's long hair...like he should cut that mop.  I agree in a way, but I don't tell my kids how to wear their hair.  But what my DH either forgot or I dunno...denies...is that there was a time he had very similar looking long hair.  I saw pictures of it.

[goldberry]

Yeah, my dd wanted to wear some really gigantic, bright red stilettos to an interview with a college advisor about a scholarship. My dh stepped in and told her that the shoes weren't a good idea. I agreed with him on that. I told her that she needs every part of her appearance to reflect that she's a serious student with a professional demeanor. Interviews aren't the best time to demonstrate flashy fashion sense unless you're applying for a job in maybe the creative world.

 

I don't know if it makes a difference or not to college advisors, but people do judge by appearances at times. I did want to at least mention that the shoes might put her at a disadvantage. I left the ultimate choice up to her and she did change.

 

This is the world we live in. Sometimes we have to play the game.

 

I have a flashy, fashionista DD and I have had similar conversations with her. 

[Mama Geek]

I never said the father was right and I never said the mother was right.  I said they need to as parents decide and be united.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I never said the father was right and I never said the mother was right.  I said they need to as parents decide and be united.

 

Sure, but he is being completely unreasonable.  Doesn't sound like he is even willing to talk about it.  It's more like..I'm right so start agreeing with me.

[goldberry]

I can't keep up with the posts, lol.

 

Trust me when I say I have defended her. I told him last night very matter-of-factly that I do not support his punishment(no makeup for x amount of days) or even his stance on this. I told him that he is damaging their relationship further. That this is not a character issue for her but the way he is treating her is bad character on his part.

 

All I got was a text this morning that we need to be a team, with a subtext that I need to back him up.

 

I would have another private conversation with him and pull out the "female" card.  That since he is not a female, he might not understand the effect this can have on your daughter (especially the judgment of "trashy") and therefore he should listen to your perspective on this. Tell him you would support him if it was just an opinion issue, but that since you are a female you understand that this is a body-ownership issue at this age and an important time in her development, and in their relationship.

 

Again - privately.  I doubt he will hear what you say if it is said in front of DD.

[SKL]

I'm not actually sure make-up styles are even something Mom & Dad need to be on the same page about.  And a 16yo is old enough that a parental disagreement isn't going to confuse her or make her manipulative.  She can see each parent as the individual they are.

[Lady Florida.]

Maybe it's time for you and DD to dig up some 60s or 70s-fabulous photos of Dad in all of his trendy glory. :lol:

 

Haha! Yes, ds told us we're not allowed to comment on his hair after he saw photos of me with 80s big hair and dh with with a 70s white man's afro.  :lol:  :smilielol5:

Edited June 23, 2016 by Lady Florida.

[goldberry]

Maybe it's time for you and DD to dig up some 60s or 70s-fabulous photos of Dad in all of his trendy glory. :lol:

 

I have one of my husband as a teenager in a pale blue suit and winged hair...   He could give John Travolta a run for his money!

[Miss Peregrine]

Why is he grasping for control like this? Has he always been this concerned about her appearance? Has something set him off?

 

IMHO, at 16 eyeliner is her choice alone.

 

Do you expect her to leave home and go to college in 2 years?

He has always tried to micromanage. But yes, the past two weeks in our house/family have seen huge changes with lifelong repercussions from some of our children. He is grasping at anything and everything to get control.

[DesertBlossom]

Because she is 16, his focus needs to be on their relationship. For starters, she needs to know that he loves her no matter what, even if she makes choices he isn't particularly fond of. If he chooses this hill to die on, it will affect their relationship during times when it actually matters, and then it's too late.

 

I don't remember my dad ever commenting on anything I wore, except once when he said my dress was too short. (And it was, because I had gone through a growth spurt and it no longer fit well) If my dad was ever to say anything it would be more like "you're too pretty to need that much makeup." But that was it. Enough to let me know he wasn't a fan, but he also wasn't going to try to make me do anything. And I think that goes a long way when it comes to influencing your teenagers. You have to have a respectful relationship with them if you want to have any hope of them caring about your opinions.

 

Which makes me think of another story... while we were driving DH noticed a girl walking down the street with one of those wide-necked, hanging-off-your-shoulder type shirts (is there a name for those?) and he says "man, I would be so mad if someone stretched out my shirt like that." I erupted into full belly laughs because my dad would have said something just like that to express his dislike for the shirt without being insulting. I told DH he officially reached old man status.

[marbel]

Have read only a few replies.

 

My daughter wears heavier makeup than her dad and I would like, including the eyeliner.  She does it well, though, and we either let it go or compliment her on it when it looks nice.  (She also spends her own money on makeup; I've never given her a dime for it except when I've given it as a gift.)

 

But, I remember when I was in high school.  The girls who wore the heavy black winged eyeliner were the "bad girls" - the girls who "slept around," got pg in high school, etc., etc.  So I had a negative association with that for a long time.   I got over it. 

 

Maybe your husband has a negative association like I did.  So maybe approaching him on it that way may help?  Help him see that It's not "bad girls" who are wearing it? 

 

Feel free to ignore me if I am repeating what others have said or if my comment doesn't ring true for your situation. 

 

:grouphug: :grouphug:

[Miss Peregrine]

Mmm.

Does he generally in other circumstances feel that the he's the captain of the team and therefore all the backing up comes from you?

Because you could equally tell him that you need to be a team so he needs to back YOU up.  (Another poster pointed that out already...)

 

Really, to that I'd probably say something like,

"It would be great if we were a team on this.  But I utterly disagree with your position and cannot support it.  Would you like to be a team by supporting my position instead?"

 

Have you sat him down and asked him to dig into the interests and motivations that are underlying his position?  It can be a tricky conversation to have, but if you can do it well he might start to be a little bit more communicative and might eventually come to realize that actually, his position is not a logical outflow of his interests and motivations.

He says that if one person has an issue with something then the other person needs to back it up. To that I said, "I really neeeeeeed her to wear winged eyeliner. You need to back me up." For some reason, he didn't think that was funny. :lol:

[SparklyUnicorn]

He has always tried to micromanage. But yes, the past two weeks in our house/family have seen huge changes with lifelong repercussions from some of our children. He is grasping at anything and everything to get control.

 

Well, maybe let him calm down a bit. 

[Joules]

He has always tried to micromanage. But yes, the past two weeks in our house/family have seen huge changes with lifelong repercussions from some of our children. He is grasping at anything and everything to get control.

 

I think this is the fundamental problem.  

 

I would explain exactly that to dd: "Dad can't control X and Y, his world is falling apart, and he is grasping at anything he thinks he *can* control.  I'm sorry you are getting caught in the middle."  If it were reasonably true, I'd go so far as to tell her that her dad doesn't really think she is trashy, he is just lashing out.

 

IMHO, he is completely in the wrong here, but if he is going to continue with his tantrums, dd needs to understand that he is human and where it is all coming from (I'm just assuming she knows what is going on with the rest of the family.)

 

And, as I said before, your dh needs to face up to what's *really* bothering him, and I'm almost positive that is not eyeliner!

[Corraleno]

He says that if one person has an issue with something then the other person needs to back it up. To that I said, "I really neeeeeeed her to wear winged eyeliner. You need to back me up." For some reason, he didn't think that was funny. :lol:

 

"I have a serious issue with you damaging your relationship with your daughter over a trivial issue that has nothing to do with what's really bothering you. I need you to deal with the real issues rather than punishing DD for something completely unrelated and unimportant, and I need you to back me up on this."

 

 

SaveSave

Edited June 23, 2016 by Corraleno

[foxbridgeacademy]

I'm going to respectfully disagree with most of y'all on this.

 

I think that you should respect your husband's decision on this.  It is something that he obviously feels strongly about, so why make a big deal of it?  By allowing her to go against his wishes you might be teaching your daughter to disrespect/disobey him.

 

I'm not a fan of winged eyeliner, but I don't think it looks "trashy".  I think that it looks like special occasion makeup -- for example prom, but not everyday going to classes. Maybe y'all can come to a compromise that she can wear it for certain occasions/activities but not every day?

Seriously? Just because he's dad/man doesn't make him right or even give him the right to be obeyed.  By that same token I think he should respect the wife's decision on this.

 

This isn't life or death it's make up.

 

It's obviously something the daughter feels strongly about and she had made a decision that should be respected because she is a human being with rights to her own body.  We are not here to control our children, especially a 16 year old.  We are here to parent them, guide them, help them make the best decisions, and stand up to bullies.  The husband is being unreasonable, the daughter should not have to cower and "obey" (I HATE that word) just because he wants to be in charge and control her.  Now your idea for a compromise is good but only if you can, with out to much coercion, convince DD that it is the best thing.  We are not raising children, we are raising future adults with future adult rights and responsibilities.  We have to give them room, while they are still in a safe and loving environment, to make choices good or bad. Don't wait until they wrench that control and freedom from you and throw themselves to the wolves of the World.  

 

*If you couldn't tell I feel really strongly about this particular topic.   :rolleyes:

Edited June 23, 2016 by foxbridgeacademy

[foxbridgeacademy]

He has always tried to micromanage. But yes, the past two weeks in our house/family have seen huge changes with lifelong repercussions from some of our children. He is grasping at anything and everything to get control.

..... hmmm, now with this info.... I'd change my tactic a bit.  I have no problem asking DC to adjust their behavior for a short period of time if their dad is going through something tough. We're a family, it's what you do. But there would be no demanding and it would have to be voluntary on the kid's part.  

[ErinE]

All I got was a text this morning that we need to be a team, with a subtext that I need to back him up.

 

Send back a text, "I agree! So DD wearing eyeliner isn't a big deal."

Edited June 23, 2016 by ErinE

[SparklyUnicorn]

What I meant is that if you get a job or go into the military or whatever, you are subject to their authority (including, sometimes, a dress code).  It is the woman's choice whether she wants to put herself under that authority or not.

 

Ah ok.

 

 

[MyLittleBears]

What if you gently impressed upon him how if he tries to grasp too much control, especially on really petty things like eyeliner, he will push her away and thereby loosing more control. It would have the opposite effect and maybe in more damaging in ways than he is aware.  

Father/daughter relationships can be complex but I think if she sees her dad as loving and gentle, she will try to please him in small things.  

 

[Tita Gidge]

My little girl is 11 and is the only girl. She has a lot of older brothers with a lot of strong opinions and a lot of over-sharing of those opinions re: girls' appearances.

 

I would never want her to change what she likes or who she feels she is because of something anyone said to or about her, especially a male. And yet I think it's important for her to understand how some of her choices are perceived ... whether it's how she dresses, how she does (or doesn't) follow social hygiene norms, how she speaks, etc. And not just from males, but from a range of sub-populations: professionals, women, peers, etc.

Conversely I think it's important for my sons to know how females (and others) perceive THEIR choices in dress, hygiene, speech, etc. Our loved ones won't represent the whole of their gender, or age, or profession, or _______, but the insight they do offer is worth hearing. Sometimes it will be dead on, sometimes it will be way off. The point isn't to alter one's choice but to make it with a greater awareness of insights we may not have, be privy to, or have thought about previously.

 

To me this is empowering the child. Empowerment isn't encouraging her to write off an opinion she disagrees with or dragging her through our tunnel vision over an emotionally-loaded word. Choice is empowering. Knowledge is empowering. Awareness is empowering. We don't have to be ignore or be afraid of being open to outside perspectives. We don't need to charge into battle and challenge those perspectives to the death as a primary course of action! 

 

Dad made one comment and used an adjective to describe the eyeliner (not to describe his daughter) during a time we know there are outside factors exacerbating his natural tendencies. He's not at his parenting best right now. That could describe any of the rest of us at any given point in our parenting careers. We can agree he's being unreasonable. But to negate his opinion because he used a hot-button word is not doing the child - or their relationship - any favors, either.

[Katy]

The more I think about this the more upset I get for her. I'd google "wheel of power and control," print it, and have a down to the mat discussion about what control and emotional abuse means. 

 

I rarely disagree with DH  (frankly, he says "ask your mom" about style discussions), but he doesn't get to control things he has no business controlling just because he's upset about other situations.  And if he didn't get that in less than 5 minutes AND APOLOGIZE to DD for being emotionally abusive and controlling, I'd have the same discussion with her, tell her he is VERY wrong, and get between them to the point of calling it abusive in front of ALL the children if he didn't back down.

 

I think you teach people how to treat you, and if you let him get away with this nonsense, it will get worse and it will teach DD to sneak around because you're not on her side either.  Or worse, teach her it's okay for men to act this way.  She gets to control her own body, without rude abusive commentary from him.

[Greta]

He has always tried to micromanage. But yes, the past two weeks in our house/family have seen huge changes with lifelong repercussions from some of our children. He is grasping at anything and everything to get control.

 

 

This context does make his reaction more understandable.  But it doesn't make it any more right.  He has my empathy, truly.  But if I were doing something that was likely to damage my relationship with my daughter because I was distraught in the midst of another crisis, I would want someone to step in and tell me to knock it off.  It sounds like you have tried to do just that, and he isn't listening.  That's really hard.  :grouphug:  I don't know what else to suggest!  If you could have him read fairfarmhand's very wise words in post #96 (or otherwise convey that information to him), that might help him to see that what he's doing here is not what he intends or thinks he's doing.

[Ailaena]

 

I don't think anybody has mentioned this, but your dh is teaching your daughter to lie to him. She is getting practice being deceitful. He noticed she wiped it off this time, but she will get better at it. And hopefully it will be the only thing she ever lies about, but I would hate to set precedence.

 

And as much as I ABSOLUTLEY agree with everybody else, I would be very frank with dd and maybe explain to her the reasons behind his reaction to makeup, and maybe go easy for a few days. Or I may not, just depends.

[FaithManor]

I don't think we're going to come to an agreement here, because I would never teach that to my daughter. Her body is hers, period. She can choose to follow a dress code when she's older if she wants to work for a company that has one, but no authority figure gets to control her body. That's a dangerous message for a young woman, imo.

Amen and Amen and Amen and Amen!!!!

 

Girls get enough messages that are anti-female, men should control your clothes, your face, your body, the colors you wear, the....no thanks. Bad enough to get it out there in the world without getting it at home from dad.

 

Sorry dad. Get a clue and stop hurting your kid says THE HIVE, a bevy of thousands of parents pooling what amounts to millions and millions of woman/man hours dealing with parenting and education issues. Just back down dude.  :chillpill:

 

Peregrine, you can read that part to him.  :)

[FaithManor]

This context does make his reaction more understandable.  But it doesn't make it any more right.  He has my empathy, truly.  But if I were doing something that was likely to damage my relationship with my daughter because I was distraught in the midst of another crisis, I would want someone to step in and tell me to knock it off.  It sounds like you have tried to do just that, and he isn't listening.  That's really hard.   :grouphug:  I don't know what else to suggest!  If you could have him read fairfarmhand's very wise words in post #96 (or otherwise convey that information to him), that might help him to see that what he's doing here is not what he intends or thinks he's doing.

And unfortunately, it sets this dd up for even more harm because she will feel the pain of being even more micromanaged/punished for the decisions of other siblings which is beyond her control. It could end with distrust and disdain not only to her relationship to her dad, but with those sibs as she may blame them for her situation becoming worse.

 

Seriously, daddy may need to find someone to talk to where he can air his feelings without taking it out on the kids at home.

[Lady Florida.]

He has always tried to micromanage. But yes, the past two weeks in our house/family have seen huge changes with lifelong repercussions from some of our children. He is grasping at anything and everything to get control.

 

:grouphug: That's hard, and probably does make it more difficult to reason with him.

 

I think this is the fundamental problem.  

 

I would explain exactly that to dd: "Dad can't control X and Y, his world is falling apart, and he is grasping at anything he thinks he *can* control.  I'm sorry you are getting caught in the middle."  If it were reasonably true, I'd go so far as to tell her that her dad doesn't really think she is trashy, he is just lashing out.

 

IMHO, he is completely in the wrong here, but if he is going to continue with his tantrums, dd needs to understand that he is human and where it is all coming from (I'm just assuming she knows what is going on with the rest of the family.)

 

And, as I said before, your dh needs to face up to what's *really* bothering him, and I'm almost positive that is not eyeliner!

 

OP, this sounds like a good way to help your dd understand where her dad is coming from. He's still wrong and I still don't think you and her should give in to him, but it might help her figure out how to approach him and discuss it with him.

 

What if you gently impressed upon him how if he tries to grasp too much control, especially on really petty things like eyeliner, he will push her away and thereby loosing more control. It would have the opposite effect and maybe in more damaging in ways than he is aware.  

Father/daughter relationships can be complex but I think if she sees her dad as loving and gentle, she will try to please him in small things.  

 

 

 

This context does make his reaction more understandable.  But it doesn't make it any more right.  He has my empathy, truly.  But if I were doing something that was likely to damage my relationship with my daughter because I was distraught in the midst of another crisis, I would want someone to step in and tell me to knock it off.  It sounds like you have tried to do just that, and he isn't listening.  That's really hard.   :grouphug:  I don't know what else to suggest!  If you could have him read fairfarmhand's very wise words in post #96 (or otherwise convey that information to him), that might help him to see that what he's doing here is not what he intends or thinks he's doing.

 

I agree with both of these posts.

[MinivanMom]

He has always tried to micromanage. But yes, the past two weeks in our house/family have seen huge changes with lifelong repercussions from some of our children. He is grasping at anything and everything to get control.

 

I am going to repeat my suggestion that now would be a good time for counseling. It sounds like your husband needs some help in dealing with this crisis so that he doesn't take it out on the 16-yr-old. I would just go ahead and schedule an appointment for the two of you. I wouldn't take 16-yr-old along, because it really isn't about her. This counseling is for the two of you to cope with whatever has happened with the other children.

 

I think you've gotten good suggestion on how to discuss the crisis with your 16-yr-old so that she understands why dad is so upset and that none of this is really about her eyeliner. I would still back her up 100% on wearing her eyeliner however she wants, and I would be sure that your husband knows that you are backing her 100%. I'm a little disturbed that he would think "no makeup" is an appropriate punishment for the eyeliner. That seems dangerously close to parents who force their daughter to chop off their hair in an unflattering style as punishment. 

[amy g.]

I've been known to say, "I'm sorry. You do not have permission to treat my child that way."

 

I've said it to strangers. I've said it to my mother. I've said it to husband. The last time I said it to my 6 year old, she tearfully said, "I'm your child too."

 

If my husband disrespected my kids that way, I would give him just that one warning. If he continued to behave like a jerk, I'd quietly get in the car with my kids and have a nice mini vacation at a hotel while he cooled off.

 

Yes. I'm that extreme.

 

No one is allowed to treat my children badly. Ever.

 

Of course, fortunately Dh would never act that way over eyeliner. Nothing is more important to him than to be close to his kids. And he knows I have a hair trigger.

 

At least my kids know that momma always has their backs.

 

Now, when there are real behavior issues, I handle them so Dh never has to be a disciplinarian. He is free to just enjoy his happy, well-behaved kids.

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

I can't keep up with the posts, lol.

 

Trust me when I say I have defended her. I told him last night very matter-of-factly that I do not support his punishment(no makeup for x amount of days) or even his stance on this. I told him that he is damaging their relationship further. That this is not a character issue for her but the way he is treating her is bad character on his part.

 

All I got was a text this morning that we need to be a team, with a subtext that I need to back him up.

Yeah, nope. You don't need to back him up. She doesn't need two parents telling her she is trashy.

[Ausmumof3]

Except that this isn't true. Many workplaces have dress codes/appearance standards. I don't know that many places have codes about eyeliner (probably not), but the principle is that sometimes people can tell you that you can/can't do something with your own appearance.

Difference is you can choose whether or not you want to work in that workplace. The dd doesn't have much choice over whether orb not she lives at home (well maybe she does but it's a bit drastic to move out of home over makeup). Also you are only at work part of the day and you are free to dress however afterwards.

[Ellie]

Dd16 likes to wear winged eyeliner. She does it well and it looks good on her. I have zero problem with it. Dh said it looks trashy(?) and she is not allowed to wear it.

 

When he sees it, he makes her wipe it off. They get into am argument because it doesn't just wipe off easily. He says,"well, don't put it on in the first place. "

 

She wore it yesterday when she and I went out for a bit. Unbeknownst to me, she snuck upstairs and wiped some off when we got home. I don't condone the sneakiness. I expected her to just face the consequence of wearing it.

 

I think dh, in light of other recent family events, is just grasping control wherever he can. He says I'm not supporting his decision. I'm not.

 

How to resolve something like this?

 

If your dh doesn't want her to wear it, then you shouldn't let her wear it, unless and until you and he can come to some sort of agreement. Whether he is right or wrong, you are in error by allowing her to do something that he has clearly said he does not want her to do. That's the resolution. Right or wrong, grasping control where he can or not, you must support him. You would be angry if he allowed your dd to do something you had told her not to do; how can you do that to him?

 

That he thinks it is trashy is irrelevant for the moment. You would not be agreeing that she is trashy; you would be supporting her father's decision.

 

Since I have not seen how she wears it, I cannot say whether it is trashy or not. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Context is everything. 

Edited June 23, 2016 by Ellie

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

If your dh doesn't want her to wear it, then you shouldn't let her wear it, unless and until you and he can come to some sort of agreement. Whether he is right or wrong, you are in error by allowing her to do something that he has clearly said he does not want her to do. That's the resolution. Right or wrong, grasping control where he can or not, you must support him. You would be angry if he allowed your dd to do something you had told her not to do; how can you do that to him?

 

That he thinks it is trashy is irrelevant for the moment. You would not be agreeing that she is trashy; you would be supporting her father's decision.

 

Since I have not seen how she wears it, I cannot say whether it is trashy or not. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Context is everything.

Nope, not trashy.

 

No woman (or man) is trash.

[purplejackmama]

I did defend her. Dh could tell she wiped it off and started a huge argument. I told him I didn't care if she wore it like that. In fact, I hadn't even noticed because it's not on my radar. He always complains about it and I always say I don't care. Yesterday it became a huge thing.

I'm sorry you're stuck in the middle. Been there, it sucks.

 

Did you post last week about bombshells being dropped at your house? Maybe I'm confusing your screen name? Any who if it was you, could these events be related. Do other life things feel out of control and hubby is trying to grab on to something! anything! to feel some sort of control?

 

I might be way off base. Just talking to an Internet stranger outloud :)

[Miss Peregrine]

If your dh doesn't want her to wear it, then you shouldn't let her wear it, unless and until you and he can come to some sort of agreement. Whether he is right or wrong, you are in error by allowing her to do something that he has clearly said he does not want her to do. That's the resolution. Right or wrong, grasping control where he can or not, you must support him. You would be angry if he allowed your dd to do something you had told her not to do; how can you do that to him?

 

That he thinks it is trashy is irrelevant for the moment. You would not be agreeing that she is trashy; you would be supporting her father's decision.

 

Since I have not seen how she wears it, I cannot say whether it is trashy or not. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Context is everything. 

I wouldn't categorically make a decision like that and then bully the other person into agreeing with me. If I thought something need to be addressed I would talk it over with him. 

[Miss Peregrine]

I'm sorry you're stuck in the middle. Been there, it sucks.

 

Did you post last week about bombshells being dropped at your house? Maybe I'm confusing your screen name? Any who if it was you, could these events be related. Do other life things feel out of control and hubby is trying to grab on to something! anything! to feel some sort of control?

 

I might be way off base. Just talking to an Internet stranger outloud :)

Yes, I posted upthread that I believe that this is what is going on. 

 

ETA: I'm out of likes. I like your post. :)

Edited June 23, 2016 by Miss Peregrine

[ErinE]

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Edited November 8, 2016 by ErinE

[SKL]

Given the background info about many stresses, I would take 16yo aside gently and explain how Dad's behavior is a reaction to really difficult things.  That I don't agree with him, and I'll work on him, but maybe this isn't the best time to fight about it.  Some empathy on both sides can't hurt.

[Guest]

If your dh doesn't want her to wear it, then you shouldn't let her wear it, unless and until you and he can come to some sort of agreement. Whether he is right or wrong, you are in error by allowing her to do something that he has clearly said he does not want her to do. That's the resolution. Right or wrong, grasping control where he can or not, you must support him. You would be angry if he allowed your dd to do something you had told her not to do; how can you do that to him?

 

That he thinks it is trashy is irrelevant for the moment. You would not be agreeing that she is trashy; you would be supporting her father's decision.

 

Since I have not seen how she wears it, I cannot say whether it is trashy or not. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Context is everything.

That is so far from how my marriage works it is comical. being the adult male in the family doesn't make you infallible. If DH is acting a fool, it is my place to let him know.

[dirty ethel rackham]

If your dh doesn't want her to wear it, then you shouldn't let her wear it, unless and until you and he can come to some sort of agreement. Whether he is right or wrong, you are in error by allowing her to do something that he has clearly said he does not want her to do. That's the resolution. Right or wrong, grasping control where he can or not, you must support him. You would be angry if he allowed your dd to do something you had told her not to do; how can you do that to him?

 

That he thinks it is trashy is irrelevant for the moment. You would not be agreeing that she is trashy; you would be supporting her father's decision.

 

Since I have not seen how she wears it, I cannot say whether it is trashy or not. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Context is everything. 

 

Why should she support his decision?  We are not talking about a young child.  We are talking about an almost adult, who should be able to make decisions about her own appearance.  I simply cannot see why he can be a jerk and she is supposed to roll over.  And grasping control where he has no right is a hill to die on.  I want my kid to have make their own decisions and to have agency in their own lives (especially my daughters who have more societal pressures that remove that agency.)    And him thinking it is trashy is completely relevant.  Nobody calls my kid trashy ... not a stranger and certainly not someone who is related to me.  I don't stand for that.  I think it is in the family's best interest for the OP to tell her dh that he risks his relationship with his dd when he treats her with such disrespect.  Respect needs to be earned.  Calling someone trashy and having a tantrum over eyeliner is not worthy of respect. 

[ChocolateReignRemix]

If your dh doesn't want her to wear it, then you shouldn't let her wear it, unless and until you and he can come to some sort of agreement. Whether he is right or wrong, you are in error by allowing her to do something that he has clearly said he does not want her to do. That's the resolution. Right or wrong, grasping control where he can or not, you must support him. You would be angry if he allowed your dd to do something you had told her not to do; how can you do that to him?

 

That he thinks it is trashy is irrelevant for the moment. You would not be agreeing that she is trashy; you would be supporting her father's decision.

 

Since I have not seen how she wears it, I cannot say whether it is trashy or not. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. Context is everything.

If my husband is wrong, supporting him "just because" would not be fair to my child.

[Corraleno]

IMO, insisting that the daughter give in, because "dad is stressed right now," teaches the dad that it's OK to deal with stress by taking your frustrations out on a child who has done nothing wrong, which is not healthy for either him or his relationship with the child. It also teaches the daughter that stress is a legitimate excuse for men to treat women badly. So if someday she has a boyfriend who says demeaning things or tries to control her, but uses the excuse that he's "just really stressed right now," will she remember "oh yeah, that's one of the perks of being a man, I'll just shut up and take it"? It's never OK to be rude and controlling towards someone just because you're "stressed out."