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SproutMamaK

Indulging my petty side: Jinger Duggar has a boyfriend.

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And he has a university education.

And he works as a professional athlete. (ETA: not that professional atheletes are inherently good people, lol, but my point was that he's supporting himself independently with needing to rely on the Duggar machine.)

And he lives in major cities.

With WalMarts.

 

I hate to click on anything that gives the Duggars more publicity, but I have a soft spot for Jinger.

 

Link (fair warning that this directs to TLC for those who would prefer not to give them any traffic.)

Edited by SproutMamaK
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Is he a gothardite?

Looks like it from the link. He and Ben Seewald have made religious videos together and he and Jinger met on a mission trip.

 

Ew.

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Is he a gothardite?

Recent convert, busily repenting from his ungodly ways. He's a pastor of some sort in Texas who does online videos to reach others. Publicity win for him and JimBob, whose show was renewed on the news of the newest courtship.

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Is he a gothardite?

 

I can't seem to find out. Certainly he's very religious from what I can see, but not sure if he's drunk the Gothard KoolAid.

 

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He just sounds like a conservative Christian to me. Unless he is associated with the activities of ATI I wouldn't automatically assume he belongs with them.

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Darn, I was hopeful for her. :(

Not with jb around. He gives me the creeps.

Not marrying a gothardite would require going against her parents as well as how she was raised.

And they aren't engaged yet.

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Recent convert, busily repenting from his ungodly ways. He's a pastor of some sort in Texas who does online videos to reach others. Publicity win for him and JimBob, whose show was renewed on the news of the newest courtship.

Gah.  :ack2:

 

Still no free Jinger.  Darn.

 

Edited by Audrey
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He just sounds like a conservative Christian to me. Unless he is associated with the activities of ATI I wouldn't automatically assume he belongs with them.

I'm sure JimBoob wouldn't have okayed the sale- sorry, I mean courtship- if this guy wasn't a pre-approved flavor of crazy.

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I'm sure JimBoob wouldn't have okayed the sale- sorry, I mean courtship- if this guy wasn't a pre-approved flavor of crazy.

 

She is 21, I read.  She can do whatever the heck she wants.  If she doesn't like him, don't you think all of the stuff happening in her family lately might scare her off? 

I do.  I guess I don't smear them all with the same brush. 

 

Oops:  Retraction.  She is 22, not 21, and is no longer considered to be a potential wife for that Bates kid.  This is someone new named Jeremy.  I watched a few seconds of the video and it does sound like she really admires him. That didn't sound JimBob approved to me.  Sounds like she approves. 

 

She is even older than I thought.  Most people do learn from the errors of those around them.  I think she will be even more careful. 

 

Edited by TranquilMind
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Who the heck is "Jinger"?  (Is that pronounced "Ginger"...and, why?  Or is it a nickname?  I don't remember hearing about this dd, not that I watch the show.  lol)

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It is pronounced Ginger. Because Duggar. She is the next youngest from Jessa.

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Well, I fell about halfway down the internet rabbit hole before I rescued myself and climbed back out. All I was able to uncover is that he is the son of "Grace Church of Downingtown" pastor Charles Vuolo. That, and that he used to play soccer for the San Antonio Scorpions, a team which went belly up this year.

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Ah, I see his sermons were from Grace Community Church here in San Antonio. I know several people who attend that church, and they aren't Gothardites, if that matters.

 

ETA: Oh, wait. There appears to be more than one Grace Community Church in SA. I'm not familiar with anyone who attends the one that posted his sermon. Sorry for the confusion.

Edited by Kinsa
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She is 21, I read. She can do whatever the heck she wants. If she doesn't like him, don't you think all of the stuff happening in her family lately might scare her off?

I do. I guess I don't smear them all with the same brush.

 

Oops: Retraction. She is 22, not 21, and is no longer considered to be a potential wife for that Bates kid. This is someone new named Jeremy. I watched a few seconds of the video and it does sound like she really admires him. That didn't sound JimBob approved to me. Sounds like she approves.

 

She is even older than I thought. Most people do learn from the errors of those around them. I think she will be even more careful.

 

If those girls actually did what they wanted, the oldest wouldn't still be stuck at home doing the cooking, cleaning, taking care of her siblings. Anna wouldn't still be married to Smuggar, because come on, who in their right mind stays married to a child molester when they have children of their own? They only do what daddy-dearest lets them do. That's how their super-special cult works.

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Do they call it a boyfriend if they are courting?  I don't follow the Duggars much at all, but I wish her well.

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Do they call it a boyfriend if they are courting? I don't follow the Duggars much at all, but I wish her well.

I believe the preferred term is "beau".

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Who the heck is "Jinger"?  (Is that pronounced "Ginger"...and, why?  Or is it a nickname?  I don't remember hearing about this dd, not that I watch the show.  lol)

 

Ah... I just watched the video and was enlightened to learn that her name is pronounced "Ginger"!  I've only ever heard her name the way I've pronounced it in my head, which was Jinger-rhymes-with-Ringer!

 

Jinger (Ginger) makes so much more sense!

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Recent convert, busily repenting from his ungodly ways. He's a pastor of some sort in Texas who does online videos to reach others. Publicity win for him and JimBob, whose show was renewed on the news of the newest courtship.

How lucky he got a university degree and a real job before realizing it was a sin. ;)

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How lucky he got a university degree and a real job before realizing it was a sin. ;)

And aren't team sports also a sin? I seem to recall reading that somewhere too...

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I always thought it was Jinger-rhymes-with-ringer too. I only ever heard of the Duggars here on the WTM forums - no one I know IRL watches the show or talks about them. I've never been interested in doing any googling of my own until the one son (can't even remember his name) was outed as a child molester. So, pretty much all of my Duggar knowledge comes from The Hive. 

 

Those adult children are certainly cult-trained as far as I can tell, and I can't imagine any of them going off on their own without first being de-programmed.

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She is 21, I read. She can do whatever the heck she wants. If she doesn't like him, don't you think all of the stuff happening in her family lately might scare her off?

I do. I guess I don't smear them all with the same brush.

 

Oops: Retraction. She is 22, not 21, and is no longer considered to be a potential wife for that Bates kid. This is someone new named Jeremy. I watched a few seconds of the video and it does sound like she really admires him. That didn't sound JimBob approved to me. Sounds like she approves.

 

She is even older than I thought. Most people do learn from the errors of those around them. I think she will be even more careful.

 

 

hahahahahahahahahah!

 

Like move to the City? Oh, wait, not...she just meant near a Walmart.

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And aren't team sports also a sin? I seem to recall reading that somewhere too...

Depends on the type of uniform. ;)

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I can only hope that Jim Bob is so desperate to keep his family "relevant" and in the media, that maybe he relaxed his "standards" a bit. Regardless of how old she is, as long as Jinger is "under her father's umbrella" she really doesn't have choices of her own. Jana is evidence of that. The whole thing is just sad.

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Depends on the type of uniform. ;)

 

Yeah, shorts were supposed to be all NIKE for them, but there were pics of Josh selling used cars in shorts in People a couple of weeks ago. I guess shorts < sex with hookers on the sin scale in the grand scheme of things.

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Who the heck is "Jinger"? (Is that pronounced "Ginger"...and, why? Or is it a nickname? I don't remember hearing about this dd, not that I watch the show. lol)

I pronounce it as if it rhymes with ringer. For the longest time I was baffled by her strange name. Then I read somewhere it is pronounced ginger. To this day I still hear it in my head as if it rhymes with ringer.

 

I hope, if they do marry that he realizes that he is in a big pool of crazy and he gets jinger out.

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I will try and be happy for her.  I hope he did not choose an extremely sheltered, brainwashed girl so that he could have a "helpmeet" that he could mold.  It's hard for me to figure out what a university educated, semi-pro athlete sees in such a sheltered girl who is, what, eight years younger than he is?   My dream is that he's at least fundie-lite, and lets Jinger pursue or even find out what her dreams are, and pursue them.  I do think it's good that he's not in Arkansas. 

 

Ah, I see his sermons were from Grace Community Church here in San Antonio. I know several people who attend that church, and they aren't Gothardites, if that matters.

ETA: Oh, wait. There appears to be more than one Grace Community Church in SA. I'm not familiar with anyone who attends the one that posted his sermon. Sorry for the confusion.

 

When I think of San Antonio, I think of Max Lucado who was once a favorite of mine.

 

 

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I saw this pop up in my Facebook feed and I was thinking he's pretty darn cute if that matters. ;-p

 

I'd love to see these girls have husbands who would steer them away from the Gothard garbage, and honestly, I think Ben does some things that probably aren't JimBob approved (rap music for one, even if it IS Christian rap). I know Ben has stated that he and Jessa will take their parents' advice into consideration, but will make decisions that work for their family.

 

I'm not surprised a Bates was out of the question. Some of those Bates kids are just off the handle. I mean one is married to the son of a HUGE Gothard follower, and she has been photographed in - gasp - blue jeans (and American Eagle ones at that, so they weren't a loose-fit variety). Her husband posted a picture of her on Facebook and seemed to be quite a fan. The oldest Bates son admitted on TV that he and his wife didn't wait until marriage to kiss. Pretty sure JimBob is not gonna have his girls being involved with such hoodlums. ;-p

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If those girls actually did what they wanted, the oldest wouldn't still be stuck at home doing the cooking, cleaning, taking care of her siblings. Anna wouldn't still be married to Smuggar, because come on, who in their right mind stays married to a child molester when they have children of their own? They only do what daddy-dearest lets them do. That's how their super-special cult works.

Maybe she likes cooking and staying home with her huge family?

 

People sure like doing other stuff that I find abominable. Who's to say?

 

About Anna, I don't know what's up with that.

Edited by TranquilMind
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Maybe she likes cooking and staying home with her huge family?

 

People sure like doing other stuff that I find abominable. Who's to say?

 

Or maybe, like other oldest daughters in her cult, it's her job to stay at home and take care of mommy and daddy (so they don't have to work) and her younger siblings. It's not like there's anything she can do about it after years of brainwashing...I mean, training.

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I pronounce it as if it rhymes with ringer. For the longest time I was baffled by her strange name. Then I read somewhere it is pronounced ginger. To this day I still hear it in my head as if it rhymes with ringer.

 

I hope, if they do marry that he realizes that he is in a big pool of crazy and he gets jinger out.

Well, if he really is a pro soccer player, I would imagine that he would say to JimBob, "I need my helpmeet with me", and she would travel with him. It would be so good for her, so exciting. She would have an opportunity to meet new people, experience some diversity, see a different perspective. Hopefully, it would be a doorway to leaving the cult.

 

Maybe, just maybe - showing a crazy moment of faith in humanity - some of the other team wives would reach out to her.

 

If he's seen the show, he either knows the crazy and likes her despite the parents and brother. I hope for that one. Or he hasn't seen it and somebody better Tivo or Hulu some episodes for him dang quick! I'd start with the "JimBob humps Michelle at putt putt golf" episode because its a good idea to know what date night might look like with those two as chaperones. I'd follow up with "Jessa's lunatic parents demonstrate kissing at her wedding ceremony" episode. 

 

I really hope though that this is Jinger's opportunity to forge a path for herself, and get out of the cult. But, I hope that if they marry, she loves him deeply and isn't just using it as an "out", and that he doesn't have any ulterior motives such as being a misogynist looking for a mouse wife. I knew a girl in high school whose parents were into Gothard, and she married the first non-gothard boy that came along. She was pretty up front that she was marrying to get out of the house. The ding dong married her anyway, and let's just say that the marriage was quite rapidly on the rocks, and ended in divorce at light speed. Sigh....not good.  So I don't wish that on either of them. 

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And aren't team sports also a sin? I seem to recall reading that somewhere too...

 

I'm pretty sure only for women. :lol:  I could always sort the craziest from the fairly normal families at my church camp based who was scandalized by me playing ball.  Though it was always fun to join the pick up games of the boys at camp and see who was most butt hurt that (depending on the sport) my hook shot or batting stance/swing bested most or all of the boys.  I had to find my entertainment where I could there.   :coolgleamA:

Edited by LucyStoner
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Actually, it would be odd if he was raised Gothard. All of the teachings actively discourage sports unless provided through a parochial school, one using Gothard approved curriculum like ACE, Bob Jones, and Abeka to name the big three that he supports, and frankly, by his standards, Abeka is "liberal", LOL.

 

As a general rule, sports are seen as detracting from discipleship and taking focus away from godly things. Music lessons are okay because the young student can eventually sing for god, play for god, lead worship. But sports is considered rather carnal, and not something to be pursued with any passion. I could see that his family maybe converted to Gothardism/ATI late so the passion and skill in soccer had already been developed thus the train had left the station. But doubt he would have been raised from a young age in it.

 

Gothard also teaches that it is a sin to miss Sunday or Wednesday services for anything secular related, nor should one give up a special activity at the church on any other day of the week in order to pursue a non-church activity.

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Does anyone know if it is an established fact that the Duggers subscribe to this creepy Gotherd cult? I don't know much about the Duggars but I'm just curious.

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Or maybe, like other oldest daughters in her cult, it's her job to stay at home and take care of mommy and daddy (so they don't have to work) and her younger siblings. It's not like there's anything she can do about it after years of brainwashing...I mean, training.

When you are 22, you can do something about it. Abused wives break away; so can she, if it is important enough.

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When you are 22, you can do something about it. Abused wives break away; so can she, if it is important enough.

 

This might actually be the most callous thing I've ever heard. It's unfeeling, and shows an appalling ignorance of the dynamics of abuse. "Breaking away" isn't as easy as saying "Eff you, Mom and Dad!"

 

She has no college degree, she has minimal job skills, and frankly, I doubt her education really holds up to high school level. She has no real social net outside of her family, and those other people she has are generally enmeshed in the same cult. She has no money of her own.

 

Leaving probably means leaving not just Mom and Dad, but all her younger siblings - possibly forever. This is a real risk. And she probably *loves* her parents. Even children who have been beaten to the point of broken bones often do, and frequently don't realize (even in adulthood) exactly how badly they've been abused.

 

You say "abused wives break away", but many of them don't. And even those who do often take months or years to get to the point where they realize that not only must they leave, but it is possible to leave. Mental abuse takes its toll on your ability to function as an independent being.

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Does anyone know if it is an established fact that the Duggers subscribe to this creepy Gotherd cult? I don't know much about the Duggars but I'm just curious.

Yes, it is confirmed. They have been spokeperson's for his curriculum for children as well as his ATI materials. They send their kids to his "boot camps". Josh went more than once, and so have Jana and Jinger. These are confirmed facts.

 

They have also preached strict adherence to many ATI directives, and the girls have interned during high school with BG himself. The girls' camp is here in Michigan. Many, many locals in the town have met the girls in the company of BG who prior to his fourth sex scandal (there were problems with him in the 70's, again in the 80's, and the 90's and early 2000's before the recent lawsuit) spent a lot of time at the girls' camp.

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Does anyone know if it is an established fact that the Duggers subscribe to this creepy Gothard cult? I don't know much about the Duggars but I'm just curious.

 

Here you go. You can probably get all the dirt over at FreeJinger. Those people keep amazing tabs on everything the Duggars have done publicly.

 

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When you are 22, you can do something about it. Abused wives break away; so can she, if it is important enough.

 

This just shows a fundamental misunderstanding of both abuse and brainwashing. If it was that easy to "break away," abuse wouldn't exist at all.

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Does anyone know if it is an established fact that the Duggers subscribe to this creepy Gotherd cult? I don't know much about the Duggars but I'm just curious.

 

Yes.  As recently as when the Josh Duggar scandal broke, they had links to ATI affiliated events on their site.  Jim Bob's political career was and the families'  political lobbying is right in the heart of BLP/ATI values.  If you go back and read OLD articles or check out their old websites on internet history sites/aggregators (internet archives, wayback machine etc) you will find the links between the two are strong.  They also condoned controversial Christian parenting books like Babywise (the non-sanitized version).  TLC at least somewhat sanitized their resource and link page once the show became popular and their producers realized it was potentially problematic.   Josh was sent to "rehab" with people and at places related to or owned by ATI/BLP/Gothard pre-scandal and all of the family of age to do so have attended or presented at ATI/BLP/Gothard events.  It is well established.  

Edited by LucyStoner
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This just shows a fundamental misunderstanding of both abuse and brainwashing. If it was that easy to "break away," abuse wouldn't exist at all.

Exactly, and despite what Tranquil says, statistics show that more abused women do NOT get out than do.

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This might actually be the most callous thing I've ever heard. It's unfeeling, and shows an appalling ignorance of the dynamics of abuse. "Breaking away" isn't as easy as saying "Eff you, Mom and Dad!"

 

She has no college degree, she has minimal job skills, and frankly, I doubt her education really holds up to high school level. She has no real social net outside of her family, and those other people she has are generally enmeshed in the same cult. She has no money of her own.

 

Leaving probably means leaving not just Mom and Dad, but all her younger siblings - possibly forever. This is a real risk. And she probably *loves* her parents. Even children who have been beaten to the point of broken bones often do, and frequently don't realize (even in adulthood) exactly how badly they've been abused.

 

You say "abused wives break away", but many of them don't. And even those who do often take months or years to get to the point where they realize that not only must they leave, but it is possible to leave. Mental abuse takes its toll on your ability to function as an independent being.

 

Quoting to indicate that I like this x1000.  

 

It is clueless to the point of cruelty to say that people who want to leave can leave.  Maybe they can.  Maybe they can't.  Maybe they will.  Maybe they won't.  It's not as simple as "breaking away".  

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Exactly, and despite what Tranquil says, statistics show that more abused women do NOT get out than do.

 

And leaving doesn't solve all their problems either. Many abused women are killed by their partners after leaving - that's not likely to be Jinger's problem, thankfully, but just about everything else on this list still applies.

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This might actually be the most callous thing I've ever heard. It's unfeeling, and shows an appalling ignorance of the dynamics of abuse. "Breaking away" isn't as easy as saying "Eff you, Mom and Dad!"

 

She has no college degree, she has minimal job skills, and frankly, I doubt her education really holds up to high school level. She has no real social net outside of her family, and those other people she has are generally enmeshed in the same cult. She has no money of her own.

 

Leaving probably means leaving not just Mom and Dad, but all her younger siblings - possibly forever. This is a real risk. And she probably *loves* her parents. Even children who have been beaten to the point of broken bones often do, and frequently don't realize (even in adulthood) exactly how badly they've been abused.

 

You say "abused wives break away", but many of them don't. And even those who do often take months or years to get to the point where they realize that not only must they leave, but it is possible to leave. Mental abuse takes its toll on your ability to function as an independent being.

Many DO break away.

 

i guess I don't see this situation as already hopeless, as you apparently do. Give the girl some credit. Wait and see what she does. It's so offensive to write off a 22 year old because of issues in her family or with other siblings. You know absolutely nothing about what friends she may have it what goals she holds. Maybe she is doing exactly what she wants. Time will tell.

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This just shows a fundamental misunderstanding of both abuse and brainwashing. If it was that easy to "break away," abuse wouldn't exist at all.

Whatever. You don't know everyone and what they have survived.

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Exactly, and despite what Tranquil says, statistics show that more abused women do NOT get out than do.

She is a young unmarried woman. She still has options. Regardless what some here seem to believe, you cannot force someone to say I do.

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