Would you buy a house that a suicide had ocurred in?

[ktgrok]

I found out the wife of the man we bought our home from died in the dining room.  It's sad but I'm not creeped out by it.  People have to die somewhere and it's not unusual to assume that many houses have had deaths.

 

I don't think it's about death for me, but violence. Normal deaths/births/illness I'd be okay with. A house that had violence in it, be that child abuse or suicide or murder, would bother me. Not saying it is rational, just how it would be for me. 

[maize]

I don't think it's about death for me, but violence. Normal deaths/births/illness I'd be okay with. A house that had violence in it, be that child abuse or suicide or murder, would bother me. Not saying it is rational, just how it would be for me.

Yes, the fact of someone dying in a house does not bother me. Certain types of death, and certain other events or behaviors, do.

 

Emotional associations are real and valid reasons to choose or not choose a house. Logic is irrelevant.

[Joker]

Yes, it's not just a death. I lived in my grandparents house after they both died, one in the bed. That's not a big deal. The violence is another thing. 

 

IDK, maybe because I have a teen dd with anxiety and depression, who has been hospitalized to keep her from hurting herself, makes me feel more uneasy about it. We're currently searching and I would be quite angry to find out I had moved my dd into a home where a teen had just done what we worry about her also doing. 

 

We're also in the process of selling a home and I wouldn't feel right about not disclosing that information just in case someone might care. 

[foxbridgeacademy]

For those of you that think this needs to be disclosed - why? (And I'm not disagreeing, just trying to understand other perspectives.). Why do you, personally, feel it should be disclosed? Ghosts? Demons? One poster said as much, so I understand her perspective. Are you worried about media coverage or teens breaking in later to ghost hunt, or ... What exactly is the impairment? Where does it stop, if it's a feeling that negative events need to be disclosed? Should divorces be disclosed? DV? Natural deaths? Illness? Just curious here.

 

OP, honestly, I might disclose upfront, too, since this is a big issue for some. I'd never be happy knowing that the family that bought our house might have found out later and felt afraid or sad or that we were not upfront. So, yes, I'd probably disclose it. We don't buy/sell houses regularly though, and it's not a business for us. We sold a house last summer, and I still hope that the buyers are happy with their home.

Because disclosing is the right (honest/fair) thing to do, it would be IMO the moral thing to do.  

 

 

What needs to be disclosed? Recent death and especially violent death.  Divorce or even serious illness are common so no I wouldn't think that would be remarkable enough to remark on.

[luuknam]

There is a term for houses that have had an event like a suicide. The term, possibly, is "Impaired Real Estate".

  http://www.investopedia.com/terms/i/impairedasset.asp

 

My belief is that for a property  like that, when the Seller places it on the market, there should be FULL DISCLOSURE of what happened.  

 

Also, there should be an appropriate reduction in the Asking Price. If it were a "Normal" house, one could ask the Full Asking Price. For an Impaired House, probably a reduction in the Asking Price of approximately 20 or 30% would be appropriate.

 

CONSULT A REAL ESTATE ATTORNEY...

 

So, is a suicide causing a crash in home value something you can insure your house for, like a regular part of homeowners insurance? Because this idea seems very unfair. Sort of makes me wonder if you could sue the teen's parents for the "damage" they did to the house. Not that I'd want to sue them, it's tough enough for them already and they're probably not rich anyway, but really. Why on earth would you think it's sensible that if someone kills themselves in a house the living have to pay for that?

 

To answer the question, I'd rather not know about it at all, ever. I don't think it'd necessarily be a deal-breaker, but as someone who's lived with OCD-type suicidal thoughts for a long time in the past, I really would rather that people would not disclose, and if I didn't love the house, I probably would prefer to find another if they did disclose (or a neighbor disclosed it for them). Realistically though, I think that pretty quickly I'd get to the point of rarely thinking about it. That all assumes the house doesn't have a "bad vibe" to begin with, but I wouldn't put an offer on a house with a "bad vibe" anyway.

[luuknam]

What needs to be disclosed? Recent death and especially violent death.  Divorce or even serious illness are common so no I wouldn't think that would be remarkable enough to remark on.

 

Why would only uncommon things need to be disclosed? If 10% of people were to kill themselves tomorrow, would we then not have to disclose suicides anymore?

[Scarlett]

I was interested and saddened by the news that a 2 year old had drowned in our pool.  I was not freaked out in any way and it never occured to me to be upset by it.

[Lady Florida.]

I really don't understand why it matters. It didn't occur to me until this thread that my brother and I didn't disclose my mother's death when we sold her house. It never occurred to us to do so. As it turns out it's not required in Florida, but I really don't get why it should be required, and apparently is in some states. My mother didn't commit suicide and was not murdered, but as I've posted before her death in her home was both violent and unnatural. It was an uncommon death, so according to some posters here they would have wanted to know.

 

One of the elderly people who lived in the house we own now, died at home. It was illness related and we only know because the nephew who was selling the house told us. If he hadn't we wouldn't have know. Knowing didn't matter, but it also wouldn't have bothered us if we didn't know and found out after we bought the house.

[Spryte]

Because disclosing is the right (honest/fair) thing to do, it would be IMO the moral thing to do.

 

 

What needs to be disclosed? Recent death and especially violent death. Divorce or even serious illness are common so no I wouldn't think that would be remarkable enough to remark on.

Again, I'm not disagreeing - and I'd probably disclose it - but what exactly is not right/honest/fair about not disclosing? It doesn't impact the house, the structure, the neighborhood, presumably the value. Unless one believes in bad vibes, ghosts, bad energy, it doesn't impact the home itself.

 

Like I said above though, I have a sensitive DS and it would upset him to know about it, so I'd want to know in advance - and likely not buy for that reason. But I wouldn't view disclosure as being morally necessary.

 

I'm just curious why some feel disclosure is absolutely the only moral/right/honest thing to do. Do you think it's haunted? Worry about living people doing something to the property or inhabitants? What are the risks, to the buyer? Is this a superstitious thing? Emotional?

 

FWIW, we just bought, and we did have the opportunity to get to know the people from whom we bought. I am happy to know that they had a happy life here, and sold for a happy reason and not divorce. I particularly didn't want to buy a home from a divorcing couple. And I didn't want to look at foreclosures or short sales either - because I knew people would have been unhappy there. It isn't rational, but it's how I felt. So I'm not anti-irrational reasons for not wanting a house. :)

Edited May 15, 2016 by Spryte

[Joker]

So, I just found out a home in the area we have been looking belongs to a pedophile now in prison. It seems it was rented out to one of his people and children were filmed there. The news stories say cameras had been placed in bathrooms and bedrooms. We have now ruled that area out because... just because. Maybe we're weird. I don't want to live in a home where that happened. I also don't want to live in a home where someone, especially a teen, killed themselves. I could maybe see doing so if these were things that happened a long time ago, but not recently. 

 

FTR, my thoughts on this have been evolving as it's being discussed here and we are in the process of looking. I think I've become much pickier but thankfully not many homes have such a recent, violent history.

Edited May 15, 2016 by Joker

[Liz CA]

No, it would not matter to me. For the same reasons that I would buy a home where a person naturally passed away. It's part of life even though suicide is terrible, I would not be concerned that the poor boy's tortured soul could somehow impact me.

I hope this does not sound callous but I live right now in a home that was built around 1915 and I know that at least one person passed on in here. It is still a good home for us.

[KungFuPanda]

who's going to tell the little kids? the parents? probably not. busybody neighbor? maybe, but little kids generally steer clear of busybody neighbors because busybody neighbors are often of the school children should be neither seen NOR heard.

I figured that if people who don't even live there find out within 15 minutes of entering the cul-de-sac, it wouldn't take long for kids who live there to find out. I mean, the kids in the neighborhood probably know and will tell the new kids who live in THAT house.

[Tsuga]

Yes.

 

And while I don't see why it should be legally disclosed, OP, in your situation, I would consider disclosing it anyway in a discreet way to head off the neighbor. "There were unfortunate personal circumstances with previous renters that do not affect any material aspect of the home. Please contact the realtor regarding these details if interested, to respect the former renter's privacy."

 

I also agree with everyone that the busybody neighbor is nuts if she thinks she's getting anything other than a lower home value for this. Though, if she is old and just pays property taxes, maybe that's in her favor, especially if she has no kids to inherit the house.

Edited May 15, 2016 by Tsuga

[Arcadia]

I won't because I have a girlfriend who was inpatient for attempted suicide twice. It would be too depressing a reminder especially when neighbors are likely to gossip about it. We had a guy in our neighborhood shot his family in a murder-suicide case and everyone still remembers which house so many years later.

[historically accurate]

I would have no problem buying it; it doesn't affect the house physically and even though I don't know where I fall on the thought of ghosts, I can't imagine not buying the house on that fear.

 

The nosy neighbor might be a turnoff for me however.

 

It wouldn't ever have occurred to me to disclose it if I were selling it. For those who are saying it should be disclosed, is it just the last owner or is this property forever an "impaired property"? How long before it's just a normal house again?

 

Edited May 15, 2016 by beckyjo

[Lady Florida.]

Again, I'm not disagreeing - and I'd probably disclose it - but what exactly is not right/honest/fair about not disclosing? It doesn't impact the house, the structure, the neighborhood, presumably the value. Unless one believes in bad vibes, ghosts, bad energy, it doesn't impact the home itself.

 

<snip>

 

I'm just curious why some feel disclosure is absolutely the only moral/right/honest thing to do. Do you think it's haunted? Worry about living people doing something to the property or inhabitants? What are the risks, to the buyer? Is this a superstitious thing? Emotional?

 

 

 

^^^^ I too don't understand why it's the right or moral thing to do. ^^^^

[elegantlion]

Should it be disclosed? I don't know, but since the neighbor seems to be telling any potential buyers, I would be upfront. 

 

Death is different than suicide. I'm currently looking at homes. We wanted to look at one that I found out (via Internet) that the previous owner died in the house of leukemia. As a cancer survivor of lymphoma, I did give pause, but realized he died at home, surrounded by people who loved him according to information I found out. The house went under contract before we could see it. 

 

Suicide, particularly that of a teen, would be different *to me.* If I found out after moving in, I would be troubled and it would bring up too many emotions regarding suicide. I could list out the places my mind would go, those I cared about that died by suicide, my friends who lost family to it. It would spoil the joy that a new home is supposed to bring. If it had happened decades ago, it would soften the effect, but recently? I would find myself grieving for the parents and it would color my perception of my home. I would be upset that something like that had not been disclosed. 

 

I live in a 100 year old house, I would be naive to think that no one might have died here. In my childhood home, my great-grandmother died in the living room while living with us. It was a long time before I went into that room, but I did. 

 

Because the neighbor seems hell bent on everyone knowing, and it seems to be either the neighbor or the suicide driving people off, it seems logical to disclose the information in some manner before a serious offer is brought to the table. How, I don't know. The Realtor seems the  obvious choice to mention it. Then the buyers can assess whether it is an issue or not, the power of the neighbor is taken away, and the seller comes off as an honest person concerned about the next owners, not someone trying to keep a secret - I know you're not, but home buying and selling is so fraught with emotions, someone could easily misperceive the owners intentions. . 

 

This thread has shown that some people wouldn't care and others would be more upset to find out afterwards, while others would be upset to find out from the neighbor. I would take away the neighbor's power and disclose it. 

[sassenach]

My friend got a great deal on a house that had a suicide in the yard. I don't think there is any escaping that the home has lost value because of the suicide. I would take that lowball offer and move on.

[heartlikealion]

I have mixed feelings on disclosing it. Part of me feels like the tenants deserve to know. Part of me feels like if I toured the home, felt no bad vibes and never knew I would be fine and finding out would just mess with my head. I actually wanted this home blessed, but the idea of asking the priest to bless the home kinda weirded out dh (different faiths). He feels this house is fine (we rent) but my parents always had our homes blessed. It didn't matter what kind of vibes there were. They just did. I do have holy water here, though.

 

Anyway, I think I'd be really messed up if I didn't know, moved in, and then some locals told me about it after the fact. That is the real problem with not disclosing early on. Now I'm stuck with this house and I'm dwelling on something. I have OCD. I can't easily shake certain thoughts.

[happypamama]

My house is pre-Civil War, so it's fairly likely that someone died in it at some point.  However, I have never been told that for sure, and it doesn't bother me to think I sleep where someone may have died.  (I wonder if I'm the first person to have given birth in the house. . . probably not, actually.)

 

But a recent suicide?  I don't know why, but yes, that would creep me out.  Not because I believe in ghosts, but just because.  I would be turned off from the house.  However, I would prefer to find that on the disclosure ahead of time.

 

A gossipy neighbor would be a turn-off as well.  I hope they're able to figure out who it is and have a little talk with that person.

[gardenmom5]

Should it be disclosed? I don't know, but since the neighbor seems to be telling any potential buyers, I would be upfront. 

This thread has shown that some people wouldn't care and others would be more upset to find out afterwards, while others would be upset to find out from the neighbor. I would take away the neighbor's power and disclose it. 

 

I have mixed feelings on disclosure (since it does seem to upset some so much) - but it WOULD take away the power of the gossipy neighbor, so potential buyers might not realize what a busybody they'd be gaining as a neighbor.  (and that person would scare a lot of us away.)

[Guest]

Again, I'm not disagreeing - and I'd probably disclose it - but what exactly is not right/honest/fair about not disclosing? It doesn't impact the house, the structure, the neighborhood, presumably the value. Unless one believes in bad vibes, ghosts, bad energy, it doesn't impact the home itself.

 

Like I said above though, I have a sensitive DS and it would upset him to know about it, so I'd want to know in advance - and likely not buy for that reason. But I wouldn't view disclosure as being morally necessary.

 

I'm just curious why some feel disclosure is absolutely the only moral/right/honest thing to do. Do you think it's haunted? Worry about living people doing something to the property or inhabitants? What are the risks, to the buyer? Is this a superstitious thing? Emotional?

 

FWIW, we just bought, and we did have the opportunity to get to know the people from whom we bought. I am happy to know that they had a happy life here, and sold for a happy reason and not divorce. I particularly didn't want to buy a home from a divorcing couple. And I didn't want to look at foreclosures or short sales either - because I knew people would have been unhappy there. It isn't rational, but it's how I felt. So I'm not anti-irrational reasons for not wanting a house. :)

This is so odd to me. I'm not criticizing your feelings about this, but it's a very foreign view to me.

 

The property we live on was an incredible bargain when we bought it. But the reasons were quite sad. It had been a couple's dream property where they planned to build their dream home. But they were now divorcing, contentiously and were thus liquidating the joint asset. It's sad, but I never considered not buying this property since it was available for sad circumstances.

[happypamama]

So, I just found out a home in the area we have been looking belongs to a pedophile now in prison. It seems it was rented out to one of his people and children were filmed there. The news stories say cameras had been placed in bathrooms and bedrooms. We have now ruled that area out because... just because. Maybe we're weird. I don't want to live in a home where that happened. I also don't want to live in a home where someone, especially a teen, killed themselves. I could maybe see doing so if these were things that happened a long time ago, but not recently. 

 

FTR, my thoughts on this have been evolving as it's being discussed here and we are in the process of looking. I think I've become much pickier but thankfully not many homes have such a recent, violent history.

That would totally creep me out.  I don't have a rational reason as for why, but it would totally creep me out.  Maybe because when I sit in my house, I picture generations of families (and some of them live next door to me) having Christmas celebrations where we open gifts, other children running down the back hill where my children run, other mothers cooking dinner where I cook dinner. . .  It's a happy place, and especially given my house's age, I feel like I'm part of a chapter in a larger history, connected to something bigger than myself.

 

I would totally not be able to live in a house if I knew a pedophile had filmed children there.  I would not be able to rock my baby to sleep, knowing that other children might have been abused right there.  Or if I knew a teenager had killed himself.  I think I'd have a hard time getting those thoughts out of my head.  Those would not be happy chapters in the story of my home.  Just yuck.

 

Also, depending on the area, people will know the house as The House Where.  We can tell people that we live in the "old Jones family house," and people often know which one that is.  If you say you live at 123 Main Street, are people immediately going to say, "Oh, yeah, that's the one where that kid killed himself/that guy was arrested for child p*rn?"  Even if you're not associated with those things in any way, would you want people to associate your home with those things, or to have that brought up every time you gave your address?  I see why people would be creeped out.

[Mergath]

So, I just found out a home in the area we have been looking belongs to a pedophile now in prison. It seems it was rented out to one of his people and children were filmed there. The news stories say cameras had been placed in bathrooms and bedrooms. We have now ruled that area out because... just because. Maybe we're weird. I don't want to live in a home where that happened. I also don't want to live in a home where someone, especially a teen, killed themselves. I could maybe see doing so if these were things that happened a long time ago, but not recently. 

 

FTR, my thoughts on this have been evolving as it's being discussed here and we are in the process of looking. I think I've become much pickier but thankfully not many homes have such a recent, violent history.

 

In the situation with the pedophile, you never know who might turn up looking for the previous residents. When I was in college I had a guy try to break into my apartment because his dealer had lived there before I moved in, and the guy didn't know he'd moved. Not wanting to live in a place previously populated by criminals makes perfect sense to me.

[Lady Florida.]

On the other side, as a seller I'm glad the first person to try and buy our old house didn't get it. The woman was getting divorced and was using her huge settlement to buy the biggest house she could find (we OTOH, were downsizing). It was an in-your-face thing to her ex. I have no idea the details of the divorce and whether or not he was a total jerk but I didn't like the bitter feeling I kept getting from her. 

 

I was kind of glad when her financing didn't come through. Obviously we couldn't and wouldn't not sell to her but I really didn't want her to have it. I hated that house - it was too big and was terribly designed - but we did have happy memories there. Eventually a family with two teenagers bought it and they were really happy to have a house with a lot of property and room for the wife's mother. who was probably going to have to move in with them. 

 

It just felt better to have our house where we made happy memories, go to people who would also make happy memories there. Silly, I know. We would certainly have taken the money from the bitter divorcee, but I'm glad we didn't have to.

[mommaduck]

Being a long term renter and having been a military BRAT whose folks bought houses in areas we had no history in, you never know the full history of a house. Granted, you can get feelings from homes. Go with those. Even then, I've had to base my decision on finances and size instead. My husband says that I have a knack for picking out homes with characters...or rather with unseen characters. Eh, it's been 50/50...50% of the time we get something with either a vibe or activity. Anyhow, this is also why we have priests and house blessings of various forms.  And to be honest, any home that is over 150yrs old is going to have a lot of history...having lived in homes that were that old and known people to own homes that go back to colonial days.

 

To be quite honest though, the neighbour is what would keep me from buying. I CANNOT stand nosey neighbours. I have two, 90 and 91yr old, old Southern biddies that are nosey as heck. The other neighbours have avoided being outside because of them. So have I. I would not buy in this neighbourhood because of them.

Edited May 15, 2016 by mommaduck

[katilac]

who's going to tell the little  kids?  the parents?  probably not.  busybody neighbor?  maybe, but little kids generally steer clear of busybody neighbors because busybody neighbors are often of the school children should be neither seen NOR heard.

 

Any other little kid in the neighborhood, because they all know about it. 

 

OP, I think you are going to have to decide what you want more: to be rid of the house quickly, or to to get the maximum out of your investment. 

 

If you want to max your investment, you will probably have to rent it for at least a year, maybe longer,  before putting it back on the market. Fewer people will be bothered by a suicide deeper in the past, particularly if other people have lived there in the interim. 

 

If you want to get rid of the house quickly, then I would get the house blessed and disclose. Catholics routinely get a house blessed before moving in; dh and I did, and we aren't particularly religious. People are quite likely to find out even without the help of the nosey neighbor, and I agree that some people who wouldn't be bothered by the suicide will be bothered by non-disclosure. 

 

I wouldn't go marching up to potential buyers to let them know what happened, but I would be likely to tell them if they saw me outside and asked about the previous tenants. 

[ondreeuh]

Little update: we counter-offered, they countered back, and we gave them a take-it-or-leave-it price. There is still a lot of interest in the house, so if they walk then I will talk to our agent. Part of the issue is that the house is vacant with a lockbox, so our agent isn't usually involved in any showings. Making the info known would be difficult, short of a sign posted inside (which, honestly, sounds like we are the ones making a really big deal about it).

[Spryte]

This is so odd to me. I'm not criticizing your feelings about this, but it's a very foreign view to me.

 

The property we live on was an incredible bargain when we bought it. But the reasons were quite sad. It had been a couple's dream property where they planned to build their dream home. But they were now divorcing, contentiously and were thus liquidating the joint asset. It's sad, but I never considered not buying this property since it was available for sad circumstances.

I did say it was irrational. :)

[Farrar]

Might there be a way to disclose it more discreetly once there's an offer made? Perhaps with other information about the home? I agree with others that I don't think you really have to and I see no moral reason to... I guess I'm just still thinking about getting ahead of the neighbor and also about presenting yourselves as very open and honest. Like, hey, we don't have to tell you these things, but we don't want you to think we're hiding anything.

[Ottakee]

As to disclosure, could you just add it to the written disclosure checklist sheet? Then it is disclosed but not a big deal.

[Guest]

As to disclosure, could you just add it to the written disclosure checklist sheet? Then it is disclosed but not a big deal.

This is what I was thinking.

[marbel]

As to disclosure, could you just add it to the written disclosure checklist sheet? Then it is disclosed but not a big deal.

 

Yeah, that is what I was thinking too.  Not making a big pronouncement, just a normal disclosure item.   No drama.

 

It's been a long time (1998) but when we sold our house in CA we had to disclose anything that had the potential to bother anyone.  So, the barking Dobermans next door, and the occasional loud fights the people had - those had to be disclosed.  Since that was my first house, I thought it was standard, but have come to realize that disclosure everywhere doesn't mean the same thing (or did, then). 

 

[Ausmumof3]

That would totally creep me out. I don't have a rational reason as for why, but it would totally creep me out. Maybe because when I sit in my house, I picture generations of families (and some of them live next door to me) having Christmas celebrations where we open gifts, other children running down the back hill where my children run, other mothers cooking dinner where I cook dinner. . . It's a happy place, and especially given my house's age, I feel like I'm part of a chapter in a larger history, connected to something bigger than myself.

 

I would totally not be able to live in a house if I knew a pedophile had filmed children there. I would not be able to rock my baby to sleep, knowing that other children might have been abused right there. Or if I knew a teenager had killed himself. I think I'd have a hard time getting those thoughts out of my head. Those would not be happy chapters in the story of my home. Just yuck.

 

Also, depending on the area, people will know the house as The House Where. We can tell people that we live in the "old Jones family house," and people often know which one that is. If you say you live at 123 Main Street, are people immediately going to say, "Oh, yeah, that's the one where that kid killed himself/that guy was arrested for child p*rn?" Even if you're not associated with those things in any way, would you want people to associate your home with those things, or to have that brought up every time you gave your address? I see why people would be creeped out.

Friends have this situation. House opposite a playground. Guy is not currently in jail and still hangs around the area. Nasty stuff.

[Laura Corin]

In the situation with the pedophile, you never know who might turn up looking for the previous residents. When I was in college I had a guy try to break into my apartment because his dealer had lived there before I moved in, and the guy didn't know he'd moved. Not wanting to live in a place previously populated by criminals makes perfect sense to me.

 

And in the worst case, the police might want to dig for evidence in your garden.....  

[SharonM]

The law may not require you to tell about the death, but why not beat the nosy neighbor to the punch? You could have your realtor mention it and if people are put off by it they wouldnt look at it. I would save you some time, getting ready for a "sale" only to have the nosy neighbor ruin it for you.

I think I wouldnt care as much if it wasnt hidden, ykwim?

I dont think it would bother me or dh if the house was what we were looking for.

 

On the other hand, can you have a lawyer send a cease and desist letter? ( i dunno, just a thought)

[Tsuga]

Little update: we counter-offered, they countered back, and we gave them a take-it-or-leave-it price. There is still a lot of interest in the house, so if they walk then I will talk to our agent. Part of the issue is that the house is vacant with a lockbox, so our agent isn't usually involved in any showings. Making the info known would be difficult, short of a sign posted inside (which, honestly, sounds like we are the ones making a really big deal about it).

You can't put info on Zillow or Redfin: "contact realtor for additional details regarding previous tenants if interested"?

[poppy]

Again, I'm not disagreeing - and I'd probably disclose it - but what exactly is not right/honest/fair about not disclosing? It doesn't impact the house, the structure, the neighborhood, presumably the value. Unless one believes in bad vibes, ghosts, bad energy, it doesn't impact the home itself.

 

Like I said above though, I have a sensitive DS and it would upset him to know about it, so I'd want to know in advance - and likely not buy for that reason. But I wouldn't view disclosure as being morally necessary.

 

I'm just curious why some feel disclosure is absolutely the only moral/right/honest thing to do. Do you think it's haunted? Worry about living people doing something to the property or inhabitants? What are the risks, to the buyer? Is this a superstitious thing? Emotional?

 

FWIW, we just bought, and we did have the opportunity to get to know the people from whom we bought. I am happy to know that they had a happy life here, and sold for a happy reason and not divorce. I particularly didn't want to buy a home from a divorcing couple. And I didn't want to look at foreclosures or short sales either - because I knew people would have been unhappy there. It isn't rational, but it's how I felt. So I'm not anti-irrational reasons for not wanting a house. :)

 

I don't know if it's absolutely the right & moral thing to do- but - reading this thread, I do think a recent violent death can clearly impact resale value.   That's something new buyers should probably know.  

 

Certainly not every death, but something notorious or affecting young people would be a "maybe disclose" to me.

 

Lady Florida., I'm so sorry about your mom.

 

 

 

[PrincessMommy]

I must be the odd man out because I think I'd feel a little sad for the house.  Like it needs some happiness in its space to make up for all the sadness. 

[Murphy101]

A recent death of any kind shouldn't impact future sale UNLESS there's some crazy donkey butt neighbor freaking everyone out by telling them how someone died some awful bloody death in the place. I'm mean, sure you talk how awful that was and all the sudden people feel a bad vibe as they tour the place.

 

I guess if at some point we moved in and felt weirded out or jerk neighbor freaked my kid out explaining how someone died in their bedroom or something, I'd have the benefits of being Catholic. I'd call a priest in to bless and decide if more needed done.

 

Presuming of course I didn't get a weird vibe anyways even without knowing. I've refused to tour houses bc I just didn't feel they were for us. Silly, but that's a buyer prerogative.

[Tsuga]

I must be the odd man out because I think I'd feel a little sad for the house. Like it needs some happiness in its space to make up for all the sadness.

You aren't alone. There was a death related to the sale of the home we now live in and I feel very strongly that we can and should make it a happy home. Like it needs the music to continue (they also played instruments).

 

Silly but that is how I feel.

[annandatje]

....So would that be a dealbreaker for you? Would it be something you would want to know about before you even thought about an offer? Remember that this state does not require it to be disclosed. There is no evidence. The only effect this bit of knowledge has is in the buyer's mind.

 

The suicide would have no bearing upon my purchasing decision.  Would I want to know before buying house?  Wouldn't make a difference to me one way or the other as long as residue had been properly removed and cleaned and sanitized,which it has been.

 

[ondreeuh]

So the people who decided not to submit the offer at the last minute because of the suicide have now submitted an offer for the house next door. So I guess the nosy neighbor isn't the deterrent. They did lowball us on that house, but it was hard to price these homes because the property is so unique (the land is worth much more than the houses, and most lots with teeny yards have most of their value in the structures. If they won't come up then dh is ready to hire someone to paint trim and refinish the floors, since as our realtor says, no one these days seems to know how to open a can of paint. ;)

 

 

[Slojo]

^^^^ I too don't understand why it's the right or moral thing to do. ^^^^

 

Really, could someone explain the "moral thing"?  I can get my head around practical arguments or "as a courtesy" arguments, but I just don't think you are obligated to say anything, in a moral sense. Feels like an unfair burden to put on someone who had nothing to do with the unfortunate circumstances. A nice thing to do perhaps; maybe even a strategic thing to do, but I'm in the camp of seeing thousands of lives and life situations unfold in houses, and not all of them are going to be happy. All houses have history - to think that any house with more than 3 owners doesn't have some kind of history, including sad history, is asking a lot out of a house.

 

The only scenario in which I think there would be something to consider is the pedophile situation or other crime-related situation. That's only because if those people are still around or folks associated with those people are used to coming around, it may come back around in a way that is uncomfortable or puts you at risk. Someone dealt drugs out of that house? Um, no - because folks who were involved in that might come back around. But that can be looked up as part of crime stats for the area. But a suicide? That's just a really unfortunate personal tragedy - not really a central issue for the condition of the house itself. 

 

 

[scoutingmom]

Really, could someone explain the "moral thing"? I can get my head around practical arguments or "as a courtesy" arguments, but I just don't think you are obligated to say anything, in a moral sense. Feels like an unfair burden to put on someone who had nothing to do with the unfortunate circumstances. A nice thing to do perhaps; maybe even a strategic thing to do, but I'm in the camp of seeing thousands of lives and life situations unfold in houses, and not all of them are going to be happy. All houses have history - to think that any house with more than 3 owners doesn't have some kind of history, including sad history, is asking a lot out of a house.

 

The only scenario in which I think there would be something to consider is the pedophile situation or other crime-related situation. That's only because if those people are still around or folks associated with those people are used to coming around, it may come back around in a way that is uncomfortable or puts you at risk. Someone dealt drugs out of that house? Um, no - because folks who were involved in that might come back around. But that can be looked up as part of crime stats for the area. But a suicide? That's just a really unfortunate personal tragedy - not really a central issue for the condition of the house itself.

It is a moral issue because it affects some -a significant number - people's decision on whether or not they would buy the house and how comfortable they might feel living there. It is hiding something about the house that many people consider important.

 

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[plansrme]

 since as our realtor says, no one these days seems to know how to open a can of paint. ;)

 

Ain't that the truth.  Too much HGTV time for sure!  And, of course, we all know there's no such thing as  starter home any more; all young families must move straight into the house of their dreams.  But that's a whole 'nuther thread!

[Slojo]

It is a moral issue because it affects some -a significant number - people's decision on whether or not they would buy the house and how comfortable they might feel living there. It is hiding something about the house that many people consider important.

 

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Thank you for explaining, but surely that is not the only "emotional history" of the house that might need disclosing under this viewpoint. Also does the next owner also have to disclose (morally), or the owner after that -- or are they covered because it's one owner removed? Is there a year limit on it? If the OP would have hung onto the house for another 5 years, would they have to disclose (morally)? What other things that don't materially affect they house should be disclosed - abuse, infidelity, alcoholism, that someone living with AIDS lived there, that a couple's adult child was addicted to drugs and may have visited them while still an active addict (though the house itself wasn't a 'drug house')? It seems there are an infinite number of things that could be associated with bad vibes or unpleasant thoughts or people's prejudices that have nothing to do with the condition of the house. These things are terrible and unfortunate, but not really material (and seem like a real slippery slope of personal disclosures).  

 

It may be that I'm not particularly sensitive to superstition and/or kind of feel that if you are superstitious, then shouldn't your sixth sense kick in and tell you "this house is not for you" (or shouldn't you bring the priest or fortuneteller with you to the inspection if it's that important to you)?  I've gotten vibes before, sure. But I chalk it up to my vibes -- the other entity isn't obligated if there really is no actual harm to befall me, and it's just my own 'willies' getting in the way. Or shouldn't you seek out the neighbors if you want information about the neighborhood as opposed to them coming up to you unsolicited? Seems like an unfair burden on the seller that has nothing to do with the wiring or pipes or that the water heater is about to go.  

[poppy]

I think that is a bit snarky.

 

I once turned a house down (asked for a refund deposit) due something that many others would not find questionable.  After I put my deposit in, I learned this house -- which was on a lake -- was downstream from a Superfund site.  The local environmental board said "it's not a problem!" (But they did forbid swimming or fishing in that lake.... hmmmm).

 

I thought to myself, whether or not their are lingering health questions, I might never be able to sell this house. Despite it being a really lovely Foresquare, on a lake, in a great neighborhood.

 

When I asked for the deposit back, the current owner was aghast and upset.  She said she  had been trying to sell the place for over a year (FSBO) and kept running into exactly this problem.   That did not exactly make me regret my decision.

 

I don't think gunshot death falls into exactly the same category, but I don't think it is pure superstition to be inclined to avoid it.

[marbel]

Thank you for explaining, but surely that is not the only "emotional history" of the house that might need disclosing under this viewpoint. Also does the next owner also have to disclose (morally), or the owner after that -- or are they covered because it's one owner removed? Is there a year limit on it? If the OP would have hung onto the house for another 5 years, would they have to disclose (morally)? What other things that don't materially affect they house should be disclosed - abuse, infidelity, alcoholism, that someone living with AIDS lived there, that a couple's adult child was addicted to drugs and may have visited them while still an active addict (though the house itself wasn't a 'drug house')? It seems there are an infinite number of things that could be associated with bad vibes or unpleasant thoughts or people's prejudices that have nothing to do with the condition of the house. These things are terrible and unfortunate, but not really material (and seem like a real slippery slope of personal disclosures).  

 

<snip>

 

Several people have already said that it is the violence associated with the death that is the troublesome part.   Alcoholism, infidelity, and such really don't come close to comparing with that.  And I'm pretty sure some or most of them have said that it is not a completely rational response, but that it is their response.  

 

 

[Lady Florida.]

Several people have already said that it is the violence associated with the death that is the troublesome part.   Alcoholism, infidelity, and such really don't come close to comparing with that.  And I'm pretty sure some or most of them have said that it is not a completely rational response, but that it is their response.  

 

If they recognize that it's not a rational response then surely the owner/seller has no moral obligation to disclose the event. This is what some of us are questioning. Why a seller should have a moral responsibility to disclose something like this.