Mothering strategies

[purplejackmama]

I'm not the mother I had hoped to be. I think I care too much. I'm always worried about my kids "getting along" and I can't really handle it when they are upset. I abhor conflict, like avoid it all costs so I don't really know how to handle it with my kids.

 

My kids are 13b, 11g, 9b, and 4b. Can you give me practical advice for dealing with the following situations:

 

1 My kids are super competitive. It's really annoying. A simple fun uno game feels like Game 7 of the NBA finals. Someone always gets upset and then I'm left trying to referee.

 

2. Kids tattling to me about ridiculous stuff. Nothing I need to know about, then I'm in the middle. I get anxious and then usually get too upset to help.

 

My husband tells me I need to ignore this stuff, but I don't know how. I know that sounds ridiculous but I really can't figure out how.

 

I'm a hot mess. I was better at being mother before I was actually a mother.

 

Spent a lot of the day crying today. Thanks for any help.

[Garga]

I just keep at it. I constantly teach them how to respond. Constantly say what is appropriate and what isn't. It's tiring and wears me out, so I understand where you're coming from.

 

For example:

 

Hortense bumps Beauregard which causes him to splash his drink on the table.

Beauregard gets upset.

But Hortense didn't mean to do it and gets defensive.

They start to squabble.

 

I break in and say, "Hortense! Beauregard didn't mean to do it. It was an accident. But! Beauregard! When you accidentally make someone spill something the correct response is not, ' Well, I didn't mean it' in a snarky voice. The correct response is, 'Oh no! I didn't mean to do that. Let me help you clean it up.'"

 

All day long I'm doing this. It's getting better. It wears me out. I am an only child and I don't understand why they have to pick-pick-pick, but I set aside my frustration/dismay and keep teaching. Constantly.

 

My 13 year old is getting very good at being polite and not letting things get to him, but it's been years of teaching and modeling and having him repeat the correct responses after me.

[purplejackmama]

Oh Garga. Sigh. I wanted an easier answer. My weary heart is weary.

 

Thanks for the update on your 13 year old. That's encourages me.

[Calm37]

We actually did a conflict resolution course when my kids were about the age of your oldest two. I am an "avoider," too, and it is good to know that about yourself. I found the best thing about the course was that it gave us a vocabulary (this is that), some boundaries, and also helped one of my daughters develop the voice that she needed in order to make her feelings known. We used one that was definitely Christian content, The Young Peacemaker. I'm sure there are others if you need something that is secular. This helped me, too! I needed the boundaries as much as the kids did.

[purplejackmama]

We actually did a conflict resolution course when my kids were about the age of your oldest two. I am an "avoider," too, and it is good to know that about yourself. I found the best thing about the course was that it gave us a vocabulary (this is that), some boundaries, and also helped one of my daughters develop the voice that she needed in order to make her feelings known. We used one that was definitely Christian content, The Young Peacemaker. I'm sure there are others if you need something that is secular. This helped me, too! I needed the boundaries as much as the kids did.

I need this!! Tell me more. Did you do the course on your own or in a group setting?

[EndOfOrdinary]

I am in the thick of really learning boundaries. As such, I do not know how much this is going to help.

 

My therapist has me practice saying, "I'm sorry, that is not my problem. What could you do to fix it?" It has worked wonders with my son when he comes to me with ridiculously trivial things. It reversed the situation of everything being handled by Mom. Without the "What could you do to fix it," my son is left to his own devises to find an answer and that created far more problems that I actually had to be involved in.

 

We have Mom Time now, where I let Ds know that I am going to sit down and veg, or take a walk, or drink my tea with my book, or whatever for an allotted amount of time. He knows ahead of time that it is going to happen so he can ask for anything he needs. The rule is unless Ds is going to die, the police are involved, or something/someone is on fire you do not get to disturb me. It started with 15 minutes, but is now up to an hour. I also have to openly zone out or I find myself "helping" when I am not needed. This has been good so he can practice being self reliant.

 

Dh is a whole nother complicated issue, but Ds and I are really working on it. I have found that if I talk to him and he talks to me, we can help each other. There was a definite meltdown day that was horrid. I was a shining example of grace under stress. From that day on Ds has been much more open to seeing that SuperMom is definitely a role I cannot always play.

[purplejackmama]

EOO,

This is so helpful. I love your response. I'm going to carry this around on a notecard until it becomes my natural response.

 

I have DEFINITE boundary issues. Can you share any resources you are using.

 

Thanks so much. Much appreciated!

[gardenmom5]

I'm not the mother I had hoped to be. I think I care too much. I'm always worried about my kids "getting along" and I can't really handle it when they are upset. I abhor conflict, like avoid it all costs so I don't really know how to handle it with my kids.

 

My kids are 13b, 11g, 9b, and 4b. Can you give me practical advice for dealing with the following situations:

 

1 My kids are super competitive. It's really annoying. A simple fun uno game feels like Game 7 of the NBA finals. Someone always gets upset and then I'm left trying to referee.

 

2. Kids tattling to me about ridiculous stuff. Nothing I need to know about, then I'm in the middle. I get anxious and then usually get too upset to help.

 

My husband tells me I need to ignore this stuff, but I don't know how. I know that sounds ridiculous but I really can't figure out how.

 

I'm a hot mess. I was better at being mother before I was actually a mother.

 

Spent a lot of the day crying today. Thanks for any help.

1.  only those very close in age/ability are allowed to compete - then step back.  dh's family is like this. positively cutthroat when they were growing up.   make a list of rules for playing - involve them with making the list.  (including - games should be FUN, not destroy their siblings).  then - step back.  (if one with significantly more ability is taking advantage of one who is unable to defend themselves, then I would step-in.)

 

2.  if the stuff is ridiculous - instead of "being in the middle" - ask them what they think **they** should do about it.  guide them on problem solving - then, step back and let them do it.

 

if  you need to put in earplugs - do so.  if you need to say "gee, that's rough.  I have to LEAVE and run some errands.:"  do so, then LEAVE to prevent you from.  above all, if they are "just being boisterous kids", but no one is in any actually danger - do NOT feel guilty.  this is their opportunity to learn, and doing everything for them is a disservice.

[gardenmom5]

 .

 

We have Mom Time now, where I let Ds know that I am going to sit down and veg, or take a walk, or drink my tea with my book, or whatever for an allotted amount of time. He knows ahead of time that it is going to happen so he can ask for anything he needs. The rule is unless Ds is going to die, the police are involved, or something/someone is on fire you do not get to disturb me. It started with 15 minutes, but is now up to an hour. I also have to openly zone out or I find myself "helping" when I am not needed. This has been good so he can practice being self reliant.

 

I was really ill when the olders were young.  I let them know, If mom is taking a nap - the answer is "no". 

[BlsdMama]

I'm not the mother I had hoped to be. I think I care too much. I'm always worried about my kids "getting along" and I can't really handle it when they are upset. I abhor conflict, like avoid it all costs so I don't really know how to handle it with my kids.

 

My kids are 13b, 11g, 9b, and 4b. Can you give me practical advice for dealing with the following situations:

 

1 My kids are super competitive. It's really annoying. A simple fun uno game feels like Game 7 of the NBA finals. Someone always gets upset and then I'm left trying to referee.

 

2. Kids tattling to me about ridiculous stuff. Nothing I need to know about, then I'm in the middle. I get anxious and then usually get too upset to help.

 

My husband tells me I need to ignore this stuff, but I don't know how. I know that sounds ridiculous but I really can't figure out how.

 

I'm a hot mess. I was better at being mother before I was actually a mother.

 

Spent a lot of the day crying today. Thanks for any help.

 

 

1. I wouldn't referee 'cuz they get to continue.  I'd scoop up all the cards, say, "We'll try again tomorrow and see if you can act civil," and then assign them a chore.  Because, the end goal is to raise humans that can draw a line between competitive and being a good sport.

 

2. If someone is tattling to get the other person in trouble it's mean spirited.  I explain, "He might have gotten in trouble but because you are taking joy out of GETTING him in trouble, you can go do....." (Fill in chore.)  Because spitefulness is wrong and tattling makes whiny adults.

 

I would never ignore it.  Nip. It. Immediately.

 

I'm "punitively creative" perhaps?   I can think of about 100 things that makes children unhappy to do. If it was ONE child being difficult, they would sit there through the game and not get to play.  If it was more than one, we stop, we work.  No one is EVER allowed to get mad because they lose.  Heaven help you if call cheating and no one is.  Games are a really big deal around here and frankly it's a great way to learn with disappointment and to be congratulatory when you don't feel like it.  Go INTO the games knowing you're prepared to punish and follow through and that you will probably start five games this week and not finish a single one.  BUT keep your eye on the prize.  A week (or two) of misery is worth years of being able to play together!!!

 

Both of these problems have the same heart issues - self pride, putting onself in front of others, not caring about your sibling, and thinking yourself better than them.  

I keep in mind that I am teaching for the heart, not actions, so stop the child the moment he starts to pout or huff and puff and give a warning and let him know he's working himself up, but don't just wait for an action "big enough" to deserve punishment.  Nip it when it's small.

 

Edit - And I will add -there is no mercy given in games.  If you want to play with the big kids, rules apply to all.  You will probably lose and you'll do it well or don't play.  I don't play easy on my kids to be frank.  But I will tell you that they revel in beating me when it happens. :D  And I wholeheartedly congratulate them.  Look, winners need to be good winners, losers need to be good losers, and everyone needs to be good spirited competitors. It's okay to be frustrated with your own playing, it's not okay to blame others for your skill or luck.

Edited May 9, 2016 by BlsdMama

[happypamama]

Re: the tattling over dumb stuff.  First of all, I do not listen if they say, "Sibling is being mean/a jerk/annoying."  I want to hear specifics, like "Sibling took my toy" or "sibling won't let me do X."  That puts the focus on a particular behavior, rather than letting it encompass the whole personality.  Sibling might be acting like a jerk at that second, but he/she is not a jerk.  Second, sometimes just a "Hey, Sibling, knock it off/let your brother participate" is enough to take the wind out of the sails, or at least to make the sibling stop and take stock of his/her actions.  And third, for stuff that they're capable of working out themselves, I usually say, "If Mom intervenes, then you are both stuck with whatever Mom decides.  Is this really something you want my help with?"  Note: we aren't talking about the little guys there.  This usually applies to any of the older kids bickering about something pointless.  I assist little guys, usually by scripting what they should say first, and then by dealing with the sibling directly myself if words aren't making the point.

 

The competitive thing is just how some families are.  It seems especially common when the oldest two are a girl and boy, in some order.  My FOO has a girl (me) and a boy two years younger, and we have always been competitive about everything.  Never mind that we have very different skill sets.  My children are a girl first and a boy three years younger, and they're competitive too, despite different personalities and skills.  I try to remember that sometimes it's a good thing -- their competitiveness means that they spur each other to keep practicing and to keep learning when it comes to martial arts -- but it needs to be channeled appropriately, and everyone's skills and talents need to be recognized.  I would remind them that people aren't going to want to play games with them if they aren't gracious, and then I would back off.  Again, this applies to kids of similar abilities and levels.

[SKL]

I am somewhat better at ignoring stuff.  :)

 

About the competition type stuff, I tell my kids it's their choice to engage or not with the other person, but if they do, then they have to accept the logical outcomes.  This goes for games and lots of other things.  If they don't want to deal with their sibling's normal/reasonable reactions, then they need to leave the activity and maybe not be in the same room with sibling.

 

With the tattling, I know 99.99% of the time neither party is really guilty.  I mean, maybe they did that little thing they are accused of, but it was in reaction to some act against them, or it was a pure accident, or the "harmed" child already retaliated, or it's something they have done to each other so many times that it was accepted as "allowed" between them.  So my first question is, "what did you do to her first?"  Then more of the story comes out and usually everyone laughs and moves on.  If I intervene, it takes longer for the moment to pass, and it doesn't help anything.  The most I will do is just state / restate the obvious rule, e.g., "neither of you is allowed to poke the other in the eye."  :P  Again, if it doesn't stop, I suggest they play/work in separate rooms.

 

The above address truly minor issues.  If there is something that really needs to stop or that has just annoyed me too much, I will take away the thing/privilege from both of them until they figure out how to get along.  If that doesn't help, they can always go clean toilets in separate bathrooms.

 

Kids gotta learn how to get along without a traffic cop.  It's a life skill.  Let them figure it out.

[bettyandbob]

Tattling, my dh had this rule as a child and we used it for our DC.

 

The person tattling gets the same punishment as the person tattled on. Blood and danger are exempted.

 

Tattling is exhausting to you and it hurts the sibling relationships. So it is discouraged greatly in our house. Very occasionally someone would tattle and I'd remind them of the tattling rule. You do not want to reward a sibling for simply getting another sibling in trouble.

 

Doing this may mean some of your DC break your rules sometimes and you don't find out. Don't worry. You do find out when the rule breaking was important in some way and will be able to deal with it then.

[xixstar]

My favorite parenting book is PET Parent Effectiveness Training. They address who owns a problem to help you know how to respond or not. It also provides instruction on how to direct conversations to get the results that effectively solve the problems. If you're a book reader it might be a great tool to have. Being able to pause and recognize problem ownership makes it easier to engage or not in sibling issues and provides the language tools to resolve them.

[purplejackmama]

My favorite parenting book is PET Parent Effectiveness Training. They address who owns a problem to help you know how to respond or not. It also provides instruction on how to direct conversations to get the results that effectively solve the problems. If you're a book reader it might be a great tool to have. Being able to pause and recognize problem ownership makes it easier to engage or not in sibling issues and provides the language tools to resolve them.

Thank you. Just ordered it now.

[lllll]

nm

Edited May 16, 2016 by _ ?^..

[purplejackmama]

And, take heart, you can definitely learn to be a better mother. I did a wretched job with my oldest child. I thought all I had to do was correct the mistakes my own parents had made with me. He survived somehow, and I learned from some of my own mistakes and corrected them. It's a process. You'll get there.

 

:grouphug:

Thank you.

[lllll]

nm

Edited May 16, 2016 by _ ?^..

[SparklyUnicorn]

I tell them to knock it off.  And no I don't generally let them go at it.  I don't see anything wrong with this.  When exactly is it ok to scream, yell, and be mean?  So it does not seem to me that you are doing anything wrong. 

[73349]

When a kid does something annoying/inappropriate, I start from the assumption that he has not yet learned to do the behavior I want, has not realized he needs to apply it in this situation, or--really only if I've ruled those out--finds the misbehavior more rewarding right now than the desired behavior.

 

We defined specific rules for games (Those who lost say, "Congratulations"; the winner thanks them for playing.) and also made sure to include some cooperative games like Forbidden Island.

If siblings or friends are squabbling, you may need to make sure they know the underlying values you want to see in their interactions (kindness, respect, etc.) and then also model the words.

When they are just not handling it well, it's time to separate them. I have had to send DS's friends back over to their house a few times recently.

 

Instruct, model, draw the line. Over and over.

And over and over.

And remember they're not considered grown until 18 for some good reasons. Maturity really does take a long time.

[EndOfOrdinary]

EOO,

This is so helpful. I love your response. I'm going to carry this around on a notecard until it becomes my natural response.

 

I have DEFINITE boundary issues. Can you share any resources you are using.

 

Thanks so much. Much appreciated!

Parenting with Love and Logic has been a very good guidebook for me on what I wanted my child/parent relationship to look like. It has helped a lot.

 

I was really feeling like my son didn't care or love me. Why would he behave this way? Therapist explained that Ds has grown up with a mom who just did everything. Why would he magically realize it was too much? The situation has been created by me. By actively talking to Ds, he has really shifted over the last four months. He is not perfect. He is 11. But the shift is noticable.

 

Honestly, I openly talked with Ds about how I was not going to always be there in his life. He very much should desire to date, live by himself, go to college, have his own family, etc without me hovering everywhere. If he never learned how to handle things himself then that personal life would be much less enjoyable. If he did not take the time now, when consequences were pretty low to stumble and learn then it was going to be a lot harder later. This put it into the perspective of his life and why he should want to try doing things himself.

 

We also had the "remember that day when Mom lost it?" conversation. It was scary and she was a complete mess. That was because Mom was trying to be everything to everyone and eventually she cannot even handle being herself. I had to promise that I was going to do my best to not get in that place again. What it meant was for me to ask for help, to talk more about when something was really trying to me, and to even out the workload of our life.

 

Dh is another story all together. Therapist is pretty sure my lack of boundaries was one of the characteristics which attracted Dh to me. It is way more challenging. So I will say with multiple kiddos, you might have some who respond and some who are more than thrilled to have responsibilities assumed by someone else.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Aww, sweetie.  Be gentle on yourself.  I hate conflict as well.  I couldn't stand to have my kids fighting or being mean to each other.  When my kids were having a disagreement, I would tell them to peacefully work it out (in the most peaceful voice possible.)  When it was clear that one kid was taking advantage of another, I tried to coach conflict resolution.  "Was that a kind/fair/decent thing to do?"  "How could you have done that differently?"  "Was that really worth getting that upset over?"   "That was disappointing.  What would be a better way of expressing that?" 

 

We weren't perfect and I probably could have done more empathetic reflexive talk, but I do hate conflict.  It is no guarantee that everyone will always love each other, but it can help people learn how to treat each other better. 

[Lecka]

How to talk so kids will listen, how to listen so kids will talk is a good book. There is a companion book about sibling rivalry.

 

I went to a parenting class with Screamfree Parenting. I liked it. I did it with videos and a workbook, I don't know how the book is by itself.

 

It had a really interesting visual. There is a problem the child has. If you get between the child and the problem, then you are taking the burden of solving the problem from the kids. So you let the kids solve the problem. Otherwise you are making it your problem.

 

They had a drawing illustrating this.

 

It made it make sense to me, and I can ask myself a question "am I solving a problem that my child can solve on his own, or deal with on his own, or just live with it."

 

So, a lot of things fall in that category.

[purplejackmama]

I tell them to knock it off. And no I don't generally let them go at it. I don't see anything wrong with this. When exactly is it ok to scream, yell, and be mean? So it does not seem to me that you are doing anything wrong.

Well I'm going crazy. So that's the problem. ;)

[TammyS]

:grouphug:   I grew up with fighting siblings and I know how miserable it is for everyone.  Even my 2, that are 12 years apart argue sometimes (I occasionally have to ask the 17 year old if he realizes how dumb he sounds arguing with a 5 year old).

 

My friend with a lot of kids close in age is really good at handling this stuff.  She says:

 

1. I'm a mom and not a referee.  If you can't get along, the game goes away.  And she means it.

 

2. Unless a sibling is bleeding or on fire (or likely to be) tattlers get the same punishment (and she usually makes it some form of heavy labor that they have to do together).

 

Obviously, this is for regular bickering/brattiness, not for siblings abusing each other or in serious conflict that needs counseling.

[Garga]

Aww, sweetie. Be gentle on yourself. I hate conflict as well. I couldn't stand to have my kids fighting or being mean to each other. When my kids were having a disagreement, I would tell them to peacefully work it out (in the most peaceful voice possible.) When it was clear that one kid was taking advantage of another, I tried to coach conflict resolution. "Was that a kind/fair/decent thing to do?" "How could you have done that differently?" "Was that really worth getting that upset over?" "That was disappointing. What would be a better way of expressing that?"

 

We weren't perfect and I probably could have done more empathetic reflexive talk, but I do hate conflict. It is no guarantee that everyone will always love each other, but it can help people learn how to treat each other better.

That's how I do it, too. And I hate conflict, too. I just don't get how they even want to bicker. I hate the sound of it and the underlying bad will. So, I have them say the right words and ask the above questions. I have seen improvements. The oldest is much better and I have very high hopes for the youngest. It just takes deliberate training for lots of kids. Deliberate teaching of the correct way to handle conflict. I thought it would come more naturally, but it just doesn't. Edited May 10, 2016 by Garga

[purplejackmama]

Yes Garga!! I just thought it would come more naturally.

[purplejackmama]

Also, how do you handle things when they are being mean and hateful to one another? I drive myself crazy trying to redirect, calm them down, etc. Tonight my oldest says, "mom quit jumping in to everyone's fights!!" I thought this was really telling. Maybe I should just let them work it out? But I honestly can't handle the insults, jabs, and hostility.

 

I'm just so different from these people!! <Insert emoji that fits here>

[Garga]

Also, how do you handle things when they are being mean and hateful to one another?

I'm not sure. People say, "Let them resolve it themselves," but so often that doesn't work. Usually the fights are where one child is being completely unreasonable and the other child has no recourse to defend himself.

 

A dishes example:

 

DS13 is stacking the dishwasher while DS11 is handwashing the pots. DS11 (who is angry that he has to do this chore) harps on DS13 that DS13 is doing it wrong. And harps. And harps.

 

DS13 is trying to be non-argumentative, but DS11 Just Won't Stop. (This is very common.).

 

What exactly is DS13 supposed to do? He can say, "Please stop harping on me," which he does say. No change.

 

He could say (and does say), "When you say that it makes me feel like you're trying to make me look bad," but DS11 will just give a defiant so-what shrug.

 

There is really nothing that DS13 can do about DS11's very annoying, very prideful behavior. (It strongly comes across as "DS13, you're an idiot who can't even stack a dishwasher.")

 

So I step in. DS13 is trying to do the dishes as I told him to do. DS13 isn't screaming back (as he would have in the past, but he's gotten a lot better). What other recourse does DS13 have, other than to let his brother continue to berate him and harp on his dishwasher stacking abilities? And I've told them and told them NOT to criticize how people stack dishwashers because it's such a hot button in marriages and with room mates.

 

I step in. I tell DS11 that he's not being kind and to focus on his own part of the job and let DS13 focus on his. I tell him the correct way to make a suggesting if he absolutely must make one. I tell him that his tone is coming across as very judgemental and prideful and he doesn't mean to be that way, here's a better way to phrase it.

 

Oh, it's draining.

 

I just keep plugging away at the training. Sometimes we have to sit down and talk about the kind of people we want to be. We have to talk about the kind of home we want to live in.

 

OP, I have only the two. I think it's harder with your four. I do think that a lot of the book recommendations will be very helpful to you. I read the "How to talk so your kids will listen, and llisten so your kids will talk" book and it was very helpful to me. Read the books and know that what's happening isn't outside of the norm.

 

And I said it above and it's true: in the past few months, DS13 has turned a corner and isn't nearly as prickly as he used to be. He's really changed a lot. He's matured a lot in the past couple of months. So there is hope!

Edited May 10, 2016 by Garga

[SKL]

Also, how do you handle things when they are being mean and hateful to one another? I drive myself crazy trying to redirect, calm them down, etc. Tonight my oldest says, "mom quit jumping in to everyone's fights!!" I thought this was really telling. Maybe I should just let them work it out? But I honestly can't handle the insults, jabs, and hostility.

 

I'm just so different from these people!! <Insert emoji that fits here>

 

My kids usually aren't extreme to each other, but they do snipe at each other and fight over stupid things at times. 

 

I try to understand what is at the heart of the matter.  For my kids to be mean to each other (or to anyone), there is usually some underlying stressor.  I start asking questions - "did something happen at school to put you in a bad mood?" - that's usually it!  Or someone is ravenously hungry or getting sick.  A little understanding by Mom goes a long way.

 

If that doesn't stop it, I try to appeal to their sense of fairness.  "You wouldn't like it if someone said that to you."  I also ask them how they would feel I and another adult were talking that way.  Sometimes I say, "I think you should apologize for ____" and they usually will.

 

In the dishwasher example, I'd warn the offender and then if he didn't stop, he would be loading the dishwasher himself after finishing the hand washing.  "Since he's so much better at it."  I would find something else reasonable for the other kid to do, so he wasn't getting a reward (lest that provide incentive to provoke the next fight).

 

Today my kids got into a fuss.  They noticed that I needed gas.  Miss E knows how to pump gas; Miss A wanted to learn.  The plan was that MIss E would verbally explain the process and Miss A would do it.  Well, Miss E went ahead and did a bunch of it herself instead.  Miss A was upset enough to cry (rare for her in a sibling spat). Miss A was going to ban MIss E from her room.  (Miss E likes to sleep in Miss A's bed.)  I calmly told MIss E that her sister was rightly disappointed because Miss E had not done what she agreed to do.  I said that isn't peacemaking behavior.  Miss E tried to rationalize, but I said I thought she should apologize, so she did.  The apology was accepted and they were happy again.  If I had left it up to them, they would have made up eventually, but it would have taken longer and gotten on my nerves more.

[Garga]

 

In the dishwasher example, I'd warn the offender and then if he didn't stop, he would be loading the dishwasher himself after finishing the hand washing.  "Since he's so much better at it."  I would find something else reasonable for the other kid to do, so he wasn't getting a reward (lest that provide incentive to provoke the next fight).

 

 

 

 

Well, yes, this is the sort of thing I do (and did--though it backfired because the real problem is that DS11 needs to learn how to work with people, not alone. He was happy to work alone.  :huh:)

 

But telling the one child, "Now you have to work alone," is an example of the parent intervening.  And the OP asked about how you let kids resolve things on their own after her kid asked her to stop getting in the middle of their fights.  So many people say, "Don't come to me unless someone is bleeding.  Resolve it on your own."  But I'm not sure how that works, but I only have two.  Perhaps if I had a bunch of kids, that's just how it would have to be.  My example about the dishes was asking the same thing the OP asked: how do you let the kids resolve something on their own if one of them is being intractably mean and the other doesn't have any authority to make the first one be decent?

 

I don't think I have an answer to that other than I constantly am intervening and teaching them conflict resolution skills. 

[basketcase]

I don't really have anything to add, except that a kid of mine was crying recently because she was worried that if she played Risk with the family, she'd win again and her older brother would be mad at her. 😂 We had a nice little lesson about the consequences of being a poor winner or loser: no one wants to play with you!

[fairfarmhand]

Lots of helpful stuff, but  I want to add that you're taking this kid stuff way too personally. They are not bickering and tattling and being poor sports because you are a bad mom. They are doing it because they are immature little heathens :) and they need their mom to show them a better way. Jesus himself, had he had children, would have had to deal with many of these exact same behaviors. You can't entirely eliminate them with good parenting but you can guide and redirect.

 

Exhausting I know, but

 

IT'S NOT YOUR FAULT!

[fairfarmhand]

Also, how do you handle things when they are being mean and hateful to one another? I drive myself crazy trying to redirect, calm them down, etc. Tonight my oldest says, "mom quit jumping in to everyone's fights!!" I thought this was really telling. Maybe I should just let them work it out? But I honestly can't handle the insults, jabs, and hostility.

 

I'm just so different from these people!! <Insert emoji that fits here>

 

"I don't mind people resolving their conflicts in a mature way. That is great. But when people get immature, unkind, and ugly, that is a form of bullying and mom does not do bullying in this house."

 

I don't do everything of the "let them resolve arguments" because I have a very intense kid who must win at all costs. Her next youngest sister is much more mellow and will knuckle under rather than stand up for the fair and right thing. That creates a dynamic where my oldest always gets her way and the youngest gets used to being run over.

 

Not right at all. So we guide and redirect and counsel. and talk and listen and model.

[MegP]

I am far from a helicopter mom and do encourage my kids to solve their own problems when they are able, but learning to work things out and be kind is a skill that kids need to be taught. It takes years. It is not something that they are born knowing how to do or can learn how to do by the time they are 5. They need to be shown how to walk through the situation again, but this time, respond the right way. That requires a watchful and involved parent. And if you don't intervene, you (collective you) might be unaware if one child is bullying the other. The victim needs to learn to stand up for him or herself and the bully needs to learn to be kind and have self control. But if mom always tells the kids to go work things out on their own, they won't learn how to do this.

Edited May 10, 2016 by MegP

[lllll]

nm

Edited May 16, 2016 by _ ?^..

[SKL]

Well, yes, this is the sort of thing I do (and did--though it backfired because the real problem is that DS11 needs to learn how to work with people, not alone. He was happy to work alone.  :huh:)

 

But telling the one child, "Now you have to work alone," is an example of the parent intervening.  And the OP asked about how you let kids resolve things on their own after her kid asked her to stop getting in the middle of their fights.  So many people say, "Don't come to me unless someone is bleeding.  Resolve it on your own."  But I'm not sure how that works, but I only have two.  Perhaps if I had a bunch of kids, that's just how it would have to be.  My example about the dishes was asking the same thing the OP asked: how do you let the kids resolve something on their own if one of them is being intractably mean and the other doesn't have any authority to make the first one be decent?

 

I don't think I have an answer to that other than I constantly am intervening and teaching them conflict resolution skills. 

 

I thought I was answering a follow-up question about more extreme behavior, but maybe I got confused.

 

I don't say I never intervene.  I choose which battles I intervene in, and usually choose a more hands-off approach.  But sometimes it's about more than just teaching them how to work things out.  The gas incident was around bedtime and I wanted it to end quickly.  I don't like to end a day with people angry at each other.  Also, the offended child turned to me in tears of hurt (rare) so in our case, ignoring it would have seemed cold IMO.  If she was always crying to me about dumb little things, I probably would have reacted differently. 

 

My chosen reaction may not have been the best solution if the only goal was to get my kids to learn how to handle their own problems.  But I do think it was a teaching moment and I do think the offender learned something that will make things more peaceful going forward.

 

Regarding a child who prefers working alone but needs to learn how to work together, I think I'd first talk to him about that specific need.  Then with that specific goal in mind, I'd have him work up to it.  I'd provide an incentive, e.g., they have to work together to get xyz done before they can watch TV.  Insults etc. take minutes away.

 

I had a rule for a while that the next person who sniped at her sister would have to clean a toilet.  (We have 4 toilets, so there are plenty to go around.)  The peace in the house after that was amazing.  :P  It's starting up again; maybe I need to re-institute that rule.

[Garga]

I thought I was answering a follow-up question about more extreme behavior, but maybe I got confused.

 

I don't say I never intervene. I choose which battles I intervene in, and usually choose a more hands-off approach. But sometimes it's about more than just teaching them how to work things out. The gas incident was around bedtime and I wanted it to end quickly. I don't like to end a day with people angry at each other. Also, the offended child turned to me in tears of hurt (rare) so in our case, ignoring it would have seemed cold IMO. If she was always crying to me about dumb little things, I probably would have reacted differently.

 

My chosen reaction may not have been the best solution if the only goal was to get my kids to learn how to handle their own problems. But I do think it was a teaching moment and I do think the offender learned something that will make things more peaceful going forward.

 

Regarding a child who prefers working alone but needs to learn how to work together, I think I'd first talk to him about that specific need. Then with that specific goal in mind, I'd have him work up to it. I'd provide an incentive, e.g., they have to work together to get xyz done before they can watch TV. Insults etc. take minutes away.

 

I had a rule for a while that the next person who sniped at her sister would have to clean a toilet. (We have 4 toilets, so there are plenty to go around.) The peace in the house after that was amazing. :P It's starting up again; maybe I need to re-institute that rule.

Looking back at your posts I see what you referring to. I agree with what you've said. One does have to intervene to teach the kids how to behave llike a decent human. Some kids require a lot more intervention than others. :)

[TammyS]

 

 

Regarding a child who prefers working alone but needs to learn how to work together, I think I'd first talk to him about that specific need.  Then with that specific goal in mind, I'd have him work up to it.  I'd provide an incentive, e.g., they have to work together to get xyz done before they can watch TV.  Insults etc. take minutes away.

 

 

 

Personally, I think I'd separate those two things...needing to learn to work with others and treating others badly. 

 

I'm not entirely convince that we do always need to learn to work with others.  Some people really are more independent workers and I think pushing against that nature is just swimming upstream for no good reason.  So I'm not sure I'd spend a lot of time on that (admittedly, I'm an introvert and my kids are extroverts, so I haven't really had to deal with it much directly, as they prefer working with others...I've had a job for 3 year and I've literally never met my co-workers or boss).

 

But I would deal with being ugly to others as a behavior issue.  I really wouldn't care that the kid prefers to work alone, etc.  He's just not entitled to be ugly to people and that will bring consequences.

[HS Mom in NC]

My husband is an avoider from a family of avoiders.  I have to have conversations with him about how avoiding is cruel to everyone in the long run.  I use the analogy that behavior problems/dynamics are like cancer. What started out as stage 1 cancer could've been treated fairly easily with less pain if he had chosen not to avoid it but it's become stage 3 or stage 4 cancer that requires more invasive, painful  treatment because he was protecting his own comfort. He has a hard time accepting that his emotional comfort at the moment is not the greatest good. Pay me now or pay me later...with compounded interest. Read the Pied Piper to your kids.  Talk about what can happen when you don't do what you should when you should.

Petty stuff I ignore. Serious stuff gets intervention. Kids squabble and yell at each other sometimes.  If it's not a major deal then I don't intervene.  I'm not raising snowflakes.  Sometimes people in relationships people get frustrated and blow up. It's not the end of the word.  Cruel, mean, spiteful things are a big deal and require intervention.  I have a friend with the most emotionally fragile children (6 and 10) who cry like preschoolers over every perceived and minor little slight because she intervenes over every little thing and is deeply upset by the mere possibility of them experiencing emotional discomfort. No one's kids like them because they fall apart over everything.  She and I get together at coffee shops and talk about books without kids.

Everyone has to learn how to lose well and win well.  Poor sportsmanship has to have consequences. At my house we play a new game (my husband and 2 of my 3 daughters are big strategy gamers) transparently a few times.  Everyone's hand (or other secret information) is played face up or exposed.  Dad talks them through the game for each person explaining what should be kept in mind, what he best approach would be and why, the mechanics of the game, etc. After those introductory games you're on your own.  You can ask questions, but no one is going to bend the rules for you.  If you can't play civilly, you can't play.  Game over for you. If you're a bad winner or a bad loser you can't play next time and there may be loss of privileges if we deem it appropriate.

We don't punish with chores in general.  Chores are something everyone does whether they're well behaved or badly behaved because that's life. Everyone takes turns doing each chore (I have a rotating chart) because that's life. There are a few exceptions I have made and would make.  If my kids are assigned cleaning up the playroom and one kid sits around doing nothing or not much while the other kids are diligently cleaning, then the lazy kid gets to finish the job all by herself.

If one kid is harping on the other over how the other is loading the dishwasher, then I'd stick the harping kid with all the kitchen chores for a week because he's being critical, obnoxious and petty.  Maybe next time he'll be able to keep his mouth shut about how someone else is doing their job. At my house growing up, if you criticize how something is done (when it's being done adequately) you just volunteered to do it.

I also grew up with a policy where if you didn't clean the kid bathroom properly when it was your turn, you got to reclean the kid bathroom until you got it right (mom had all day-she'd clear her schedule) and you had to clean the adult bathroom in addition because you obviously needed the practice.  Oh, and if boys missed the toilet they got to scrub the toilet and the entire bathroom floor with an old toothbrush. I have 3 older brothers and a mother that didn't put up nonsense. Slackers and poor marksmen be warned!