Can the same credit hours count toward two classes?

[Garga]

We are studying World Literature for English in 9th grade next year. I'm having a very difficult time finding books that my very sensitive upcoming 9th grader will be able to handle. Because of that, I'm not sure that I'll have enough books to discuss and write about to cover a full 160 credit hour class.

 

However, I was planning on having him do a bunch of essay writing for other classes.

 

Can I count the time he spends on writing any essay toward both English and the other class?  Or is that totally cheating?  I mean, instead of there being 160 hours of English plus 160 hours of another class for a total of 320 hours for those two classes, it might be only say...280 hours for both, because they overlap. 

 

Or do I need to come up with something else to do for English class separate from other classes? 

 

 

Hang on....I just realized something...I was only counting writing and discussion time for the English class.  Do I also count the hours it takes him to physically read the book?  He's not the fastest reader.  So, if it takes him 8 hours to read a book, do I count that as 8 hours toward his English class?

[Cosmos]

No, don't count the same hours twice.

 

But you can divide hours. Perhaps you want to spend time on the history essays revising and working on grammar and rhetorical style. Then you could count some of the essay time toward history and some toward English composition.

 

And yes, you can count the hours spent reading. If you don't want to track the actual hours he spends reading, you can look up how long the audiobook is and adjust it using an appropriate multiplier.

[Garga]

No, don't count the same hours twice.

 

But you can divide hours. Perhaps you want to spend time on the history essays revising and working on grammar and rhetorical style. Then you could count some of the essay time toward history and some toward English composition.

 

And yes, you can count the hours spent reading. If you don't want to track the actual hours he spends reading, you can look up how long the audiobook is and adjust it using an appropriate multiplier.

 

 

Thank you!  It did seem underhanded to me, but I've seen a few history curriculums that claim they are both history and literature and I wondered how they pulled it off since they didn't seem cover enough hours for both.

 

But good news on the reading time counting toward the class.  Thanks!

[DebbS]

You shouldn't count them twice, but consider that a 1 credit course is anywhere from 120 on the low end  to 180 hours on the high end. So, you can take some of the history hours spent on the essay writing and count it towards the English credit. My kids covered history & literature for a time period and wrote essays that integrated them. For each year they got 1 history credit, 1 literature credit and .5 english composition credits. All together the 2.5 credits took about 450 hours or 15 hours/wk to complete.

[Lori D.]

On 4/28/2016 at 5:36 PM, Garga said:

We are studying World Literature for English in 9th grade next year. I'm having a very difficult time finding books that my very sensitive upcoming 9th grader will be able to handle. Because of that, I'm not sure that I'll have enough books to discuss and write about to cover a full 160 credit hour class.

However, I was planning on having him do a bunch of essay writing for other classes.

Can I count the time he spends on writing any essay toward both English and the other class?  Or is that totally cheating?  I mean, instead of there being 160 hours of English plus 160 hours of another class for a total of 320 hours for those two classes, it might be only say...280 hours for both, because they overlap. 

Or do I need to come up with something else to do for English class separate from other classes? 

Hang on....I just realized something...I was only counting writing and discussion time for the English class.  Do I also count the hours it takes him to physically read the book?  He's not the fastest reader.  So, if it takes him 8 hours to read a book, do I count that as 8 hours toward his English class?

Actually, yes, you can double dip (or rather, "split out") -- writing done for History can *also* count towards the Writing portion of the English credit. (Example: research and final paper = History; the writing process & mechanics = English). Every homeschooling family gets to decide this for themselves. I've heard this discussed before at homeschooling convention seminars, and what it boils down to is:

1. Your school, your rules.

2. If you are covering aspects of writing in the research, paper organization, outlining, rough draft and revision writing, proof-editing, etc., when writing a paper for another subject such as History, it can count towards Composition (English credit), so you may count assignment towards both subjects if you wish (see #1).

3. Don't use double dipping (splitting out) to skimp on hours or use your double dipping to get away with "lite" credits

I would just point to dual enrollment/dual credit as another of the rare times at which you are allowed to "double dip" -- the same class/work counts for credit both for high school *and* for college. ?

However, I think that what I am calling "double dipping" is what the previous posters are all calling "splitting" -- assigning some of the hours on a paper done for History towards the History credit, and the mechanics aspect of writing the paper towards the English credit. So, "po-TAY-to / po-TAH-to" -- the end result is the same. 

No, not all of your English writing assignments need to be completely separate from other subjects -- that is called writing across the curriculum. And it's a good idea to do a variety of types of writing assignments: literary analysis essays and reader responses (Literature portion of English credit); research papers, persuasive essays, short paragraph answers to prompts (English, History, Gov't, and other Humanities credits). Even practice of timed essays from a prompt in practice for SAT/ACT testing can count towards the English credit, as well as college application essays and essays for scholarship applications.

JMO: The one assignment I would not double dip on is Science lab reports, as that is writing that is very exclusively subject-specific. Also, I would not double dip for test questions that require essay answers, as that is writing that is part of a test for a specific subject.

And yes, you can count the hours used towards reading Literature as part of the English credit and hours used towards reading History as part of the History credit, etc. If you have a struggling reader or a super-slow reader, then perhaps only count some of the reading hours so you're not shorting yourself of the other activities that make up the English (or History) credit. In other words, just be careful you are doing a good balance of a variety of activities with your credit hours:  reading, writing (essays, research papers, short answer paragraphs, reader responses, etc.), discussion, quizzes/tests, power point presentation, other projects or output, etc.

JMO, but if you're coming out at at approximately 300 hours total towards English and History, and it is roughly about 150 of those hours for EACH subject, that falls right on average for credit hours. The main thing is to shoot for consistency -- you want most of your credits to "match", so if going for average, if most of your credits fall in the range of 135-165 hours, you're there. What you don't want is your English credit coming in at 120 hours and your history credit coming in at 180 hours. Here's a rough credit-hour guide:

.   .   .   .   .   . minimum .   average . maximum
1.00 credit .  .  . 120 .  .  . 150 .  .  . 180  hours
0.75 credit .  .  .  90  .  .  . 115 .  .  . 135  hours
0.66 credit .  .  .  80  .  .  . 100 .  .  . 120  hours
0.50 credit .  .  .  60  .  .  .  75  .  .  .   90  hours
0.33 credit .  .  .  40  .  .  .  50  .  .  .   60  hours
0.25 credit .  .  .  30 .  .  . 35-45 .  .  . 45  hours

120 hours = "Carnegie credit", which is the minimum amount of "teacher contact hours" -- it is assumed additional hours of work are done outside of the classroom/teacher contact.

150 hours = the "sweet spot" average, of working for about 50 min./day, 5x/week (or 60-65 min/day, 4x/week), for 36 weeks.

180 hours = requirement of a majority of public schools -- class meets 1 hour/day, 5x/week for 36 weeks = 180 hours; however, the reality is that most public school classes actually meet for 45-50 minutes, with at least 5 minutes per class typically spent on administrative or non-teaching things. And on some days, class does not meet due to assemblies or other activities. That drops the total classroom hours down closer to 125-145 hours -- thus, weekly homework hours brings the total back up to 180-hours.

Counting hours is not really needed if you have a textbook program (typically Science, Math, and some History or English programs), but if you are going with a DIY program, it is useful as a guide so you don't short your student on credit if you find you are going way over the maximum (180 hours), or fall short of the minimum (120 hours), or find your course is inconsistent with the majority of your other coursework.

BEST of luck in deciding how to proceed with your credit accounting, Garga! ? Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited September 25, 2018 by Lori D.

[regentrude]

FWIW, we did integrated history and literature. I found it impossible to decide whether a particular work belongs to "history" or to "literature". We did enough hours to fill two credits and split them into one credit for history and one for English. I explained our approach in the school profile.

Time for reading absolutely counts.

[Haiku]

Time for reading absolutely counts.

I would disagree with this. When I was in school, and when my DD was in school, reading novels was done outside of school and did not count as classroom time. Imo, if you count reading hours, and you stick to a standard count of credit hours, you are not giving your child a full course of instruction. Even in 8th grade and 7th grades, I require my kids to do their lit reading on their own time.

[Grantmom]

Sorry to tag onto the OPs questions, but so I just wanted to ask then, do you count ALL of the hours spent on that subject towards this hour count?  For example, completing homework or even studying for a test for it?  I feel like there are some courses this year that we spent way more than 180 hours on, but I felt like we had a hard time fitting everything in.  I am just wondering if I need to adjust things a bit.

Edited April 29, 2016 by Grantmom

[Cosmos]

I would disagree with this. When I was in school, and when my DD was in school, reading novels was done outside of school and did not count as classroom time. Imo, if you count reading hours, and you stick to a standard count of credit hours, you are not giving your child a full course of instruction. Even in 8th grade and 7th grades, I require my kids to do their lit reading on their own time.

 

Lots of things are done outside of classroom time in a school: math homework, science lab write-ups, reading the history textbook, writing papers, etc. And reading literature. 

 

But "classroom time" is also less than what most of us would count as a homeschool credit. When I was in school, classroom time was 43 minutes a day for 36 weeks. Taking out the time lost to assemblies, class parties, and other non-academic work, that comes to only about 120 hours of actual work. Only by including the work done outside of class would the total come to 160 or 180 hours. In a homeschool setting, we usually don't divide work into "in class" and "homework" but the total work done comes out about the same.

 

I have found, however, that in our homeschool the English hours need to be pretty high to get done what I consider a full credit. My ds' English hours this year will be over 200. 

[Grantmom]

We probably underestimate ourselves a lot and overestimate how much time gets actually spent in a high school classroom.  In my mind, I am thinking about one hour of work as being an actual hour of focused, sitting at the desk kind of work.

[Carrie12345]

My feeling is that a lot depends on the individual student, too.  I'm fully aware that my dd could drag out 3 hours of reading for an entire day.  I also know she could get through what might be considered 3 hours of reading in 2 or less. Same for any other form of work, too.  And, without having attendance, questions from 20-something students, or papers to collect, I can easily boil 47 minutes of "class time" down to 15-20 minutes of instruction.

 

My intent is to take actual class time (as applicable), estimated home instruction, and expected "homework" hours to come up with our rough final number.  Whether she's faster or slower is up to her.

[regentrude]

I would disagree with this. When I was in school, and when my DD was in school, reading novels was done outside of school and did not count as classroom time. Imo, if you count reading hours, and you stick to a standard count of credit hours, you are not giving your child a full course of instruction. Even in 8th grade and 7th grades, I require my kids to do their lit reading on their own time.

 

In many high school classes, ALL reading is done in class. A friend of mine is an English teacher; they are not allowed to assign any reading for homework.

 

And then there are self study independent courses where the majority of the time is spent reading, even in college. In my opinion, reading is the most important component of any English course.

Edited April 29, 2016 by regentrude

[regentrude]

Sorry to tag onto the OPs questions, but so I just wanted to ask then, do you count ALL of the hours spent on that subject towards this hour count?  For example, completing homework or even studying for a test for it?  I feel like there are some courses this year that we spent way more than 180 hours on, but I felt like we had a hard time fitting everything in.  I am just wondering if I need to adjust things a bit.

 

I count all time spent on working for the course. There is not such thing as "homework" in a homeschool - it is daily work, period. That is when the actual learning happens in math, so it would make no sense not to count it. Studying for tests? Sure. In school kids would spend class time on review. It is impossible to puzzle out what is "studying", what is "working problems" or "taking notes on the reading" or "reviewing notes". It is all learning.

 

But then, with my second, I no longer worry about counting hours. I have a rough idea how much work I consider credit worthy, and that gets done. With DD, I did count because she was my first.

Edited April 29, 2016 by regentrude

[SparklyUnicorn]

I'd count it, but then I don't believe learning has to be completely compartmentalized and I like the idea of not getting hung up on which book counts for what.

 

 

[Haiku]

But then, with my second, I no longer worry about counting hours. 

 

I don't count hours, either, but for someone who does, I could see a situation where a slow reader pends half the "class hours" on reading, and that leaves little time for actual instruction and work on the rest of what comprises an English credit. I guess it depends on how strictly one counts hours and whether they feel they are "done" once the hours are met.

[regentrude]

I don't count hours, either, but for someone who does, I could see a situation where a slow reader pends half the "class hours" on reading, and that leaves little time for actual instruction and work on the rest of what comprises an English credit. I guess it depends on how strictly one counts hours and whether they feel they are "done" once the hours are met.

 

I would certainly adjust the course content for a slow reader and not expect this student to cover the same amount of material that my freakishly fast speed reader can blaze through.

I see this as an advantage of homeschooling: the ability to challenge a strong student (who would cover the standard content in a fraction of the time) and to tailor a course to a student's strengths and weaknesses. I do not design identical classes for my two kids.

[foxbridgeacademy]

I have a slow reader and I don't count hours.  I figure up how much I want to get through for the year (of reading) how many assignments I want him to do then I plan it out.  I leave some wiggle room to cut back if he gets overwhelmed and that's a credit IMO. 

 

Oh, and I would definitely count the historical book and essay for both History and Composition.

Edited April 29, 2016 by foxbridgeacademy

[Chrysalis Academy]

I would disagree with this. When I was in school, and when my DD was in school, reading novels was done outside of school and did not count as classroom time. Imo, if you count reading hours, and you stick to a standard count of credit hours, you are not giving your child a full course of instruction. Even in 8th grade and 7th grades, I require my kids to do their lit reading on their own time.

 

I always assumed - till I read differently here - that reading time didn't count, I figured it was like the homework students do in high school.  However, I get the argument that a "class hour" at ps is not equal to 60 minutes, whereas our homeschool hours are.  So I decided, I guess, that I would count reading time, but make sure that we lean toward the 180 hours per credit end of the spectrum, rather than the lighter end. My kid is a fast reader, so I'm not worried about it eating up too much of the time.

 

I have to say, I'm finding counting hours both easier and more useful than I thought it would be. We have several non-traditional credits going, and I"m not sure how I would figure out how much credit to award for those at least if I didn't count hours. I don't think it's necessary for every subject, and we may drop it for some, but for right now it's really helping us get on the same page about expectations.

[Lori D.]

On 4/29/2016 at 5:03 AM, TaraTheLiberator said:

I would disagree with this. When I was in school, and when my DD was in school, reading novels was done outside of school and did not count as classroom time. Imo, if you count reading hours, and you stick to a standard count of credit hours, you are not giving your child a full course of instruction. Even in 8th grade and 7th grades, I require my kids to do their lit reading on their own time.

 

Hmmm... I think I agree for elementary grades, which is reading for fluency and comprehension. But, for our family, I disagree about high school.

At the high school level, reading texts for Science and History is part of how you are learning -- you are being instructed by the text, and would not be able to go on and do experiments for Science, or take tests / write papers / give presentations for History in a meaningful way without having learned that foundational/background material -- so that seems very logical to count those reading hours as part of the credit.

I think it is very similar for Literature at the high school. You are reading in a very different way than at the elementary grades; you are reading in much more of a WEM way -- thoughtfully, with re-reading and annotating, with discussion, with analysis. Teaching your high school students how to engage with the text (the work of Literature) and having them practice that by doing it IS a big part of the learning process for Literature; guess I don't see why that would NOT count towards the educational hours for a credit. You would not be able to go on and write an analysis essay (which is counted towards the credit) without having first engaged with the text and learned something from the text.

But, I also agree with you in that I did not count *all* our reading hours towards the English credit, as we were counting discussion, analysis, and writing towards the credit, too. JMO, and just for my family! ? I think it is perfectly fine for families to choose which way to go on this. ?

Edited September 25, 2018 by Lori D.

[Lolly]

People actually LITERALLY count hours? I have never counted an hour in my life for school. I line up what is required and they did it. When it was finished, it was finished.

[regentrude]

People actually LITERALLY count hours? I have never counted an hour in my life for school. I line up what is required and they did it. When it was finished, it was finished.

 

1. Some states require logging of hours.

2. Especially for beginning homeschoolers, it is difficult to decide "what is required" for a self designed course. How does one know how much to require? Counting hours can be a valuable guide in determining whether planned work is a reasonable credit, too light, or too ambitious. (For homeschoolers using canned predesigned courses, this is not an issue)

 

[Chrysalis Academy]

People actually LITERALLY count hours? I have never counted an hour in my life for school. I line up what is required and they did it. When it was finished, it was finished.

 

:lol: We just started, so I don't actually know what I''m talking about at all. But, dd has a to-do list for the week and I have her jot down about how long she spent on the item when she checks it off. Then I throw it into a spreadsheet that does all the work of calculating. It doesn't take very long, and it is helping me figure out how long it takes to do things, hence what is a reasonable amount of work to assign.  It also makes it easy for me to give her credit for her time spent on creative writing, theater, etc which she spends many hours on, but that aren't really standard topics with an accepted S&S. Our science is very out-of-the-boxy, too. So counting hours actually makes me feel *more* free to follow rabbit trails, take advantage of serendipitous opportunities, etc. because I don't have a standard, laid out amount of material that I feel that I must complete in order to award a credit.

 

Different strokes, is all.

[Lolly]

1. Some states require logging of hours.

2. Especially for beginning homeschoolers, it is difficult to decide "what is required" for a self designed course. How does one know how much to require? Counting hours can be a valuable guide in determining whether planned work is a reasonable credit, too light, or too ambitious. (For homeschoolers using canned predesigned courses, this is not an issue)

 

1. As a ridiculous rule, I would ignore it and just make something up to turn in. Because I am bad like that... I checked off days on a calendar that we had school and counted them as 7 hours of school.

 

2. I would just wing it. If my dc were not spending enough time with their work, I would increase what I required. If they were too stressed and it was taking too long, I would cut it back. It doesn't require writing down hours. It also isn't at all fair. Some students, like dd21b, work extremely quickly and efficiently. I could count on her taking half the time as one would assume it would take to finish most required coursework. Others, like dd21a, take much longer than average. Is it fair to require 21b to do twice as much work in order to receive credit for a class? Not in my opinion. (I did require more of her in school though. She also received more credits while working less hours.)

 

This really just isn't something that makes any sense to me.

[Lori D.]

...This really just isn't something that makes any sense to me.

 

Glad you didn't need it, and you found a method that worked great for you and the needs for your unique students. That's the blessing of homeschooling -- many ways to achieve the many different goals. :)

[SparklyUnicorn]

1. Some states require logging of hours.

2. Especially for beginning homeschoolers, it is difficult to decide "what is required" for a self designed course. How does one know how much to require? Counting hours can be a valuable guide in determining whether planned work is a reasonable credit, too light, or too ambitious. (For homeschoolers using canned predesigned courses, this is not an issue)

 

 

Our state technically requires this.  I still don't do it.

 

I am confident we are doing at least the required numbers of hours though.  I can't imagine how I'd count it. 

 

They already ask for too much and do nothing for me other than be a thorn in my side so they can bite me on this requirement. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

 

 

This really just isn't something that makes any sense to me.

 

Of course it doesn't.  It only makes sense to school administrators.

[Mom22ns]

1. As a ridiculous rule, I would ignore it and just make something up to turn in. Because I am bad like that... I checked off days on a calendar that we had school and counted them as 7 hours of school.

 

2. I would just wing it. If my dc were not spending enough time with their work, I would increase what I required. If they were too stressed and it was taking too long, I would cut it back. It doesn't require writing down hours. It also isn't at all fair. Some students, like dd21b, work extremely quickly and efficiently. I could count on her taking half the time as one would assume it would take to finish most required coursework. Others, like dd21a, take much longer than average. Is it fair to require 21b to do twice as much work in order to receive credit for a class? Not in my opinion. (I did require more of her in school though. She also received more credits while working less hours.)

 

This really just isn't something that makes any sense to me.

 

It really isn't that big of a deal. My state requires it. It is never turned in unless you are charged with educational neglect. I did do it and I found it took a minute or two a day. It was easy and then I had that documentation and reasonably accurate numbers to judge our hours spent on each class. There were some classes, that I found we were spending inordinate amounts of time on and scaled back the following year. There were other classes I decided to only count as .5 credit or not give credit for at all because they really didn't spend the time I expected. 

 

In our state, there is no testing, there is no counting day, there is very, very little required of homeschoolers. We track hours. It is ok, really.

[Ellie]

We are studying World Literature for English in 9th grade next year. I'm having a very difficult time finding books that my very sensitive upcoming 9th grader will be able to handle. Because of that, I'm not sure that I'll have enough books to discuss and write about to cover a full 160 credit hour class.

 

However, I was planning on having him do a bunch of essay writing for other classes.

 

Can I count the time he spends on writing any essay toward both English and the other class?  Or is that totally cheating?  I mean, instead of there being 160 hours of English plus 160 hours of another class for a total of 320 hours for those two classes, it might be only say...280 hours for both, because they overlap. 

 

Or do I need to come up with something else to do for English class separate from other classes? 

 

 

Hang on....I just realized something...I was only counting writing and discussion time for the English class.  Do I also count the hours it takes him to physically read the book?  He's not the fastest reader.  So, if it takes him 8 hours to read a book, do I count that as 8 hours toward his English class?

 

Ok, here's my question: Generally, a high school *English* course includes literature and composition, which would mean that if you were counting hours, half of the hours would come from composition, half from literature, so 80 hours for lit, 80 hours for composition. Is that what you were thinking? Or were you really thinking 160 hours for lit *plus* 160 hours for composition?

 

In English, there so much other writing than essays, or discussions of works read. Your dc should be writing a variety of things, as well as reading a variety of things. Surely, if you're including poetry and short stories and plays and whatnot, you can find enough things for your dc to read; and your dc should be writing poetry and short stories and plays and whatnot.

 

[foxbridgeacademy]

Of course it doesn't.  It only makes sense to school administrators.

:iagree: they live in a whole other World where things happen as planned and children sit still and quiet for an hour at a time.

[Garga]

Ok, here's my question: Generally, a high school *English* course includes literature and composition, which would mean that if you were counting hours, half of the hours would come from composition, half from literature, so 80 hours for lit, 80 hours for composition. Is that what you were thinking? Or were you really thinking 160 hours for lit *plus* 160 hours for composition?

 

In English, there so much other writing than essays, or discussions of works read. Your dc should be writing a variety of things, as well as reading a variety of things. Surely, if you're including poetry and short stories and plays and whatnot, you can find enough things for your dc to read; and your dc should be writing poetry and short stories and plays and whatnot.

 

You are so right! I've been chewing on this in the past couple of days since I wrote this thread and realizing that I'm going to add more than just "reading" and "writing about what we read." I'm going to add discussion time, I'm going to add reading and writing poetry, I'm going to add a couple of creative writing papers. It recently came to my attention that my son isn't taking the time to read things slowly enough to have good reading comprehenion (like for math word problems), so I'm going to get him a "reading comprehension" workbook for us to play with.

 

Once I decided to add the poetry, reading comprehension, some creative writing, and just yesterday at the library book sale found a wonderful anthology of short stories, I realized we're probably ok. I'm still glad I wrote this thread because I've learned a lot from it. But I think I'm good now.

 

Oh--and I did know that it was 1/2 reading/analysing and 1/2 writing. :). But you are so right that I was forgetting that the writing part isn't only about the literature.

Edited April 30, 2016 by Garga

[Garga]

Hmmm… I think I agree for elementary grades, which is reading for fluency and comprehension. But, for our family, I disagree about high school.

 

At the high school level, reading texts for Science and History is part of how you are learning -- you are being instructed by the text, and would not be able to go on and do experiments for Science, or take tests / write papers / give presentations for History in a meaningful way without having learned that foundational/background material -- so that seems very logical to count those reading hours as part of the credit.

 

I think it is very similar for Literature at the high school. You are reading in a very different way than at the elementary grades; you are reading in much more of a WEM way -- thoughtfully, with re-reading and annotating, with discussion, with analysis. Teaching your high school students how to engage with the text (the work of Literature) and having them practice that by doing it IS a big part of the learning process for Literature; guess I don't see why that would NOT count towards the educational hours for a credit… You would not be able to go on and write an analysis essay (which is counted towards the credit) without having first engaged with the text and learned something from the text.

 

JMO, and just for my family! :) I think it is perfectly fine for families to choose which way to go on this. :)

Yes! My son doesn't read for pleasure, except for maybe 3 books a year. And even then, I often have to prompt him and say, "Why don't you read your book for a while?"

 

He reads what I make him read for school, but as soon as the time I've set aside for it is done, he quickly tosses the book aside and won't read it until I tell him to pick it up again. I've done my very best to find engaging books that get lots of great reviews (and my own reviews) for being good or interesting, etc. I'm not bogging him down with Plutarch.

 

That's ok for elementary and middle school, but for high school we need to up our game. The books he'll need to read are on a different level than what he's used to. I'll have him read the books in small segments and then immediately discuss them and talk about whatever words he's not used to, and discuss the themes, etc. We won't be reading these books for entertainment. We'll be reading them for education. We'll need to stop often and reflect upon what we've read. He'll be annotating and considering ways to create essays about the books.

 

So, within reason, I'm comfortable counting the reading hours. If he's extra slow, I might not count the entire time he takes. I'll try to guage how long a middle-of-the-road reader takes. I read lightning fast, so perhaps I'll average our speeds for reading and count that time toward reading.

Edited April 30, 2016 by Garga

[SparklyUnicorn]

I've followed the rules for 10 years.  You know what that got me?  Nothing.  Nothing at all.  The local CC did not care about my required paperwork.  That wasn't proof of anything to them.  So why am I doing this?

 

I've stopped caring about their stupid rules. 

[Garga]

People actually LITERALLY count hours? I have never counted an hour in my life for school. I line up what is required and they did it. When it was finished, it was finished.

You don't? I don't mean that to be snarky. I just mean, when they say that a high school credit is between 150-180 hours, I thought that meant literal hours. Colleges count credits as hours as well.

 

For my state, we report either 180 days of instruction OR 990 hours of instruction. I have found that I start the year thinking, "Oh, these 180 days will be a breeze!" But by about February, I realize we've taken off more time than I realized due to Christmas or vacations or "dad's home today!" or a mental break,etc.

 

I need guidelines to keep me on track. I *want* to hit the 180 days and I find it a challenge. If I don't create a goal, I know myself and know that I might miss it.

 

The 160 hours for an English credit will be my goal. Without it, I'm pretty sure I'll get to the end of the year and realize I did less than I thought. Of course (of course!) this is not true for everyone. But it is true for me. I didn't even blink at the idea that the hours should actually be counted, both because that's in the name "credit hours" so it seemed self-evident, and because I need the goal to keep me on track. :)

[Luckymama]

I don't count hours or days. The state requires us to report number of days schooled (same requirement for brick and mortar schools, btw) so I always just enter 180. We have no other record keeping requirements.

 

We don't take "just because" breaks, so if we start school at the end of August when school begins here, have a short week at Thanksgiving, take two-ish weeks off at Christmas/New Years (depending on when the holidays land), take a week off sometime during the early spring, and finish mid to late May, we will have spent more time schooling than the public and private schools in our state. When we began homeschooling, we were tied to her older siblings' school calendars. We maintained that kind of rhythm.

 

Dd works at least six hours a day, not including the time spent at her university class (50 min 4x a week). She spreads that time out during the day and sometimes works after she gets home from extracurriculars.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Maybe one way to look at it is do you think your plan as is leads to the necessary preparation for your child's goals. 

 

Sometimes I think less is more.  We could spend 10 hours a day studying and amass a very impressive list of stuff we covered in a year, but how much will be retained?  How much is really needed to develop the necessary skills?

 

Not that I know exactly what that is, but as much as I'd like to learn literally EVERYTHING and never have gaps, etc. I know that is not going to happen. 

[Lori D.]

On 4/30/2016 at 11:06 AM, Garga said:

... I'll have him read the books in small segments and then immediately discuss them and talk about whatever words he's not used to, and discuss the themes, etc. We won't be reading these books for entertainment. We'll be reading them for education. We'll need to stop often and reflect upon what we've read. He'll be annotating and considering ways to create essays about the books.

Sounds great! 

I found it very hard to make my DSs do annotating -- where it really worked was with short stories (Windows to the World was a GREAT program for that and for teaching how to write a literary analysis) -- esp. all 3 of reading/annotating on our own and then coming back together to discuss our findings.

A great "stepping stone" program for "upping your game" is Movies as Literature -- sometimes it is easier to see cinematic elements and how they support themes or reveal character in the film, and once you feel comfortable with how cinematic devices support deeper things in a film, then move to looking at literary elements (mood, imagery, conflict, etc.) and analyze how they are supporting themes or revealing character in a novel (or a poem, or a short story)… You might also go through Figuratively Speaking to learn some of the basic literary elements and to be able to start looking for them and seeing what they are doing in the Literature. Also, if DS is a very black & white thinker, going through How to Read Literature Like a Professor together might be helpful.

Perhaps start your first quarter or semester of the new school year working mostly out Movies as Literature, and doing some short stories intermixed, and then in the second semester move on to novels. I'd wait on poetry and plays until you have a year under your belt, or use some very guided help with poetry -- it is so strongly driven by imagery and metaphor that black & white thinkers or very logical/mathy people can have a very tough time "getting" that poetry is not a like a math equation and has a "single meaning". Two helpful resources for starting you off with poetry: Progeny Press: Introduction to Poetry: Forms and Elements, and, Classical Academic Press (CAP): Art of Poetry.

We did a lot of our Literature aloud together (plays are esp. fun to take on characters and let your "inner thespian" loose ? ) -- reading it aloud together by alternating pages, and discussing/pointing out things as we saw them, and then taking some time after reading to go through info or discussion questions from a Lit. guide and and getting into analysis. Doing it that way, by the time it came time for DSs to write about the Lit., they had something to say. ?

Also helpful is creating a unit (or semester, or a year) of Literature around a genre or author or idea of high interest to your DS. Our DSs' favorite year of high school Lit. was our DIY "Worldviews in Classic Sci-Fi Lit". Perhaps for your DS that might be Horror, Mystery, or Dystopia (genre-based), or the works of Lovecraft or Hemingway (author-based), or Asian Lit. (ethnic/country-based), or reading works and then watching the film adaptations of those works and comparing (idea-based)...

Below are a few threads that might be of help in jump starting you with ideas. ? Enjoy your Literature adventures together! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Why does my DD have lots to say… (until I ask her to write it down) -- specific ideas for getting a student started with annotating; see esp. posts #1, 5, 6, and 18
TWEM -- Nan in Mass & others on how they transition into doing high school lit, plus ideas for more than "just reading"
Doing Literature with my 9th grader
Resource to help student understand meaning in literature -- post #3 has specific ideas for jumpstarting discussion
If you're frustrated with discussing history and literature with a high school student -- how to do reader response papers
8FillTheHeart: Let's talk Literature -- big picture type of conversation thread about goals for high school Literature
I need ammunition of why you need to learn to write a literary criticism paper
Socratic discussion problems introverts -- ideas when it's just 2 of you discussing or you have a reluctant "discusser"
Ideas for a Unique Literature Course -- ideas for how to make a DIY Lit.

Past threads of discussion on specific books:
Sir Gawain and the Green Knight -- need input please
Jane Eyre and boys
What's up with Wuthering Heights

Edited September 25, 2018 by Lori D.

[Chrysalis Academy]

You don't? I don't mean that to be snarky. I just mean, when they say that a high school credit is between 150-180 hours, I thought that meant literal hours. Colleges count credits as hours as well.

 

For my state, we report either 180 days of instruction OR 990 hours of instruction. I have found that I start the year thinking, "Oh, these 180 days will be a breeze!" But by about February, I realize we've taken off more time than I realized due to Christmas or vacations or "dad's home today!" or a mental break,etc.

 

I need guidelines to keep me on track. I *want* to hit the 180 days and I find it a challenge. If I don't create a goal, I know myself and know that I might miss it.

 

The 160 hours for an English credit will be my goal. Without it, I'm pretty sure I'll get to the end of the year and realize I did less than I thought. Of course (of course!) this is not true for everyone. But it is true for me. I didn't even blink at the idea that the hours should actually be counted, both because that's in the name "credit hours" so it seemed self-evident, and because I need the goal to keep me on track. :)

 

I found the same thing with counting days. if I don't count camps or things like that, I find it surprisingly tricky to reach 180 days.  We do it, but I know that because I count. If I just stopped when we felt done, we'd do way less - it seems like we've always been finishing up curriculum in April.

 

Counting hours will be interesting. It's quite freeing, really, because when you work on a subject, whatever it is, whenever it is, you count the time. Not just during set days or hours, but whenever it happens.  It's certainly enlightening to realize how time is actually being spent, and on what. I found the same thing when I started tracking our spending - it's enlightening to see what you are *actually* doing vs. what you might think you are doing.

[Lolly]

You don't? I don't mean that to be snarky. I just mean, when they say that a high school credit is between 150-180 hours, I thought that meant literal hours. Colleges count credits as hours as well.

 

For my state, we report either 180 days of instruction OR 990 hours of instruction. I have found that I start the year thinking, "Oh, these 180 days will be a breeze!" But by about February, I realize we've taken off more time than I realized due to Christmas or vacations or "dad's home today!" or a mental break,etc.

 

I need guidelines to keep me on track. I *want* to hit the 180 days and I find it a challenge. If I don't create a goal, I know myself and know that I might miss it.

 

The 160 hours for an English credit will be my goal. Without it, I'm pretty sure I'll get to the end of the year and realize I did less than I thought. Of course (of course!) this is not true for everyone. But it is true for me. I didn't even blink at the idea that the hours should actually be counted, both because that's in the name "credit hours" so it seemed self-evident, and because I need the goal to keep me on track. :)

 

No, I didn't. We were required to have 180 days of instruction. I just marked days off on a calendar. Usually I did it at the end of the semester. Once, I did it before we started school for the entire year. I have no ideas what days we actually had school. Yes, I lied. It was a stupid rule. All that mattered to me was that we covered the material. While colleges have semester hours for classes, some classes do not require student attendance. My kids have been shocked with home many students do not attend class. One of my girls has a class this semester where you fail if you miss more than X days. It is written in the syllabus. (Wellness I believe.) They are working out during class. Being in class is critical. One girl in her class has not attended other than for tests. She has A's on all the tests. She is going to fail because she did not meet the attendance requirement. Another class has no attendance penalties. There are few people in class other than on test days. Those kids get the grades they receive on the tests. They may not be putting in nearly the number of hours that class would be having them rack up. Learning a subject/class is not dependent on the number of hours spent on the material. Some kids may be able to get through an algebra book in 6 weeks. Others may take 2 years. It is the material covered that matters, not the number of hours put into the class.

[regentrude]

No, I didn't. We were required to have 180 days of instruction. I just marked days off on a calendar. Usually I did it at the end of the semester. Once, I did it before we started school for the entire year. I have no ideas what days we actually had school. Yes, I lied. It was a stupid rule. All that mattered to me was that we covered the material. ... Learning a subject/class is not dependent on the number of hours spent on the material. Some kids may be able to get through an algebra book in 6 weeks. Others may take 2 years. It is the material covered that matters, not the number of hours put into the class.

 

I agree completely - but how do you decide how much material to cover? It is easy for courses with standardized content like math and science - if you work through the physics textbook and mastered the problem solving, that's the credit, no matter how little time it took. But home designed courses that are out of the box? I admit that I find it very difficult to judge what is a reasonable amount of material to cover, and there are no "standards". The amount of time spent was a useful guideline for developing my own courses.

And yes, I do expect more from a strong student who could cover an average high school course in a fraction of the time. My goal is to challenge my students, not to race through easy material and get done fast. Just how much of a challenge is reasonable, that to determine, looking at the time spent for the course is very helpful for a parent without previous experience.

 

(I teach for a living and know how many years it takes to have a good judgement of appropriate work load and difficulty when designing a new course. And that's with an established canon.)

 

Edited May 1, 2016 by regentrude

[foxbridgeacademy]

Never counted hours or days.  I've often meant to, in the past but I forget or it's just too burdensome.  We do the work on the days we work until they seem like they're done.  We're not behind, in fact we're right on grade level and we've been doing this for 9+ years.  I did start to worry at the beginning of this year because DS is in High School but so far not as much trouble as I expected.  We're pretty laid back compared to a lot of others (or even compared to ourselves a few years ago) I'm starting to trust them to learn on their own.  There's no way I'd be able to track that.

Edited May 1, 2016 by foxbridgeacademy

[Lolly]

I agree completely - but how do you decide how much material to cover? It is easy for courses with standardized content like math and science - if you work through the physics textbook and mastered the problem solving, that's the credit, no matter how little time it took. But home designed courses that are out of the box? I admit that I find it very difficult to judge what is a reasonable amount of material to cover, and there are no "standards". The amount of time spent was a useful guideline for developing my own courses.

And yes, I do expect more from a strong student who could cover an average high school course in a fraction of the time. My goal is to challenge my students, not to race through easy material and get done fast. Just how much of a challenge is reasonable, that to determine, looking at the time spent for the course is very helpful for a parent without previous experience.

 

(I teach for a living and know how many years it takes to have a good judgement of appropriate work load and difficulty when designing a new course. And that's with an established canon.)

 

 

It's a home designed class, so whatever you choose is what it is. If you find it is less material than you thought, you add. If it is too much, you take away. If it is too much and they are enjoying it immensely, you just let them go with it. You can increase the credit hours, or you can just leave it as originally designed and figure it as hobby time. The whole point of high school is to learn, know how to learn, and be prepared for college if it is the next step. The paperwork should be an after thought.

 

Eh, I am just relaxed about it all. Just personality differences most likely. If it makes people more comfortable to count hours, more power to them. I've just never known anyone to actually do it. I've been suggested to several people as someone for their friends to talk to when they are considering homeschooling. They have all been overwhelmed with the idea of all the requirements (which aren't all that much, but come down to technicality stuff like this). I dislike that regulations like this scare people away from homeschooling. It isn't what it is about. It is too easy to get caught up in the recordkeeping and red tape and leave the learning behind. In fact, that is one of the problems with public schools... The last mother I counseled left me with a whole new idea of what school was. She has now finished her first year of homeschooling her son successfully and happily without having to worry so much about the red tape.

Edited May 1, 2016 by Lolly

[regentrude]

It's a home designed class, so whatever you choose is what it is. If you find it is less material than you thought, you add. If it is too much, you take away. If it is too much and they are enjoying it immensely, you just let them go with it. You can increase the credit hours, or you can just leave it as originally designed and figure it as hobby time. The whole point of high school is to learn and be prepared for college if it is the next step.

 

And how do you determine whether it is "less" or "too much"  if you are not keeping track of the time spent?

 

The paperwork should be an after thought...It is too easy to get caught up in the recordkeeping

 

Sure, but the paperwork becomes very important if you aim for a highly selective school and want to make sure the content in the courses makes the student competetive. I am very glad I kept meticulous records because it made writing those course descriptions much easier.

It all depends on the goals. For a kid who is not competing for admission at a school that rejects over 90% of applicants, I can be a lot more relaxed and don't have to worry about demonstrating rigor.

As for record keeping: it's simple and just took a few minutes each week. If that scares people away from homeschooling, I don't know ....

Edited May 1, 2016 by regentrude

[Lolly]

And how do you determine whether it is "less" or "too much"  if you are not keeping track of the time spent?

 

 

Sure, but the paperwork becomes very important if you aim for a highly selective school and want to make sure the content in the courses makes the student competetive. I am very glad I kept meticulous records because it made writing those course descriptions much easier.

It all depends on the goals. For a kid who is not competing for admission at a school that rejects over 90% of applicants, I can be a lot more relaxed and don't have to worry about demonstrating rigor.

As for record keeping: it's simple and just took a few minutes each week. If that scares people away from homeschooling, I don't know ....

 

Gut. Student response. Knowing your kid to a good extent. Is complaining normal for them? Are they overly stressed? Do they have no/too much free time? Are they spending too much time on this one area? You can easily do that without writing down each hour spent on each task. Basic communication with your teen will usually be sufficient to judge.

 

I'm a good bser. I could wing it. Not true for everyone. Having content written down for a class is far different from each hour spent. Just putting down the expected # hours for a class would be all they would look for, if they cared. True that my kids did not aim for highly selective schools. We discouraged that actually. We are not believers in Ivy educations. Our more selective state schools were happy with test scores, extra-curriculars, and basic classes with grades. They did not want to have minutely detailed transcripts submitted. I would say that is true for 95% of colleges if not more.

Edited May 1, 2016 by Lolly

[regentrude]

Gut. Student response. Knowing your kid to a good extent. Is complaining normal for them? Are they overly stressed? Do they have no/too much free time? Are they spending too much time on this one area? You can easily do that without writing down each hour spent on each task. Basic communication with your teen will usually be sufficient to judge.

 

I am confused. I can only know they are spending too much time on xyz if I know how much time they spend on xyz.

 

Talking to a teen is certainly helpful. So is having them keep track of time spent. We - kids included - found that extremely helpful, because it allowed us to see where time was spent on task, and where time was wasted. After all, I am not sitting with my high schoolers while they do school work; I have a job. So, I required a certain amount of time spent on concentrated academic work, because that allowed me to educate them at the level they were capable of. Using an average curriculum that is completed by a gifted learner in half the time is not my goal for high school - but judging how much to expect required knowing how long they worked.

 

 

 Having content written down for a class is far different from each hour spent. Just putting down the expected # hours for a class would be all they would look for, if they cared.

 

That is not at all what I meant. I am certainly not telling the college "look, my kid spent 200 hours for her English credit". But it did allow me to judge whether the work load was sufficiently rigorous. I don't know what the "expected hours" for any class are if I have not had this very student go through this very course.

 

You say you are good at bsing. So, please tell me how YOU decided on the work load for home designed courses without actually keeping track of how much time your students work. I can't wrap my mind around how that would work. Unless I'd use a course developed by somebody else for somebody else's students. Which is not why I homeschool.

Edited May 1, 2016 by regentrude

[Lolly]

 So, please tell me how YOU decided on the work load for home designed courses without actually keeping track of how much time your students work. I can't wrap my mind around how that would work. Unless I'd use a course developed by somebody else for somebody else's students. Which is not why I homeschool.

 

 I admit, I am at home and keep an eye on what/when my kids are working. Most of them preferred to work outside of their bedrooms. I notice what they are working on. Usually, they tended to be on a schedule of sorts that just naturally evolved. If they were spending two hours a day on one subject, I would notice it. If they tended to take one day a week and use that entire day for one subject, it would catch my attention. If X came to me and complained or bragged about his history work taking up all of his time, I would look into why. So, I guess technically I was keeping track of how much time they worked. I just did it in my head. There was no formal recording of X spent 1 hour working on math problems today. That is keeping track of hours to me. A casual observation is not.  My kids were athletes, so with NCAA requirements, I did usually have a standard curriculum as a base. I added/subtracted from that as needed/wanted/desired/interest led.

 

edit: I thought of a more specific example. One of my girls decided she wanted to learn about architecture while in high school. We found 3 books that seemed to be an appropriate level for a beginner at a high school level. She read them taking notes. We took a few trips to look at specific buildings in the extended area. She decided on a research topic after reading one book completely, and sections of the other two. She wrote an in depth research paper on that topic. I believe it was about 8 pages total length. I did not specify a length. If it had been only a couple of pages, I would have asked for another paper to be produced on a different topic (probably two more). But, with the depth and time she took on the one, it was sufficient work. She added a few more sources to the three we had when researching. I did submit this one to an outside source for grading. (I am a bit biased when it comes to her writing.) I gave her a credit for her work. This one I have no idea how many hours she put into it total. None. I have no idea what a high school level architecture class should cover. I still don't. And, I don't actually care. Dd studied. Dd learned. Dd got a credit. The credit is the least of those three things. She still has those three books on her shelf in her apartment at school. I believe she still pulls one in particular out and looks through it. I also must admit that I learned a lot. I don't remember exactly what the paper was about, but I still know what a buttress and flying buttress are and the difference in the two. And, the history of gargoyles...quite interesting stuff. Oh, and the physics behind the arch. Not in the paper, just a kid who learned something cool excitedly chattering on that one. That was a fun year with her. Since this was not a core class, I didn't have to worry about NCAA accepting anything/could have free reign and not worry about if it would be accepted or not.

Edited May 2, 2016 by Lolly

[MerryAtHope]

I sometimes counted the same paper towards both history and English, but not the same *time*--I counted the research and basic write-up for history, and the construction, revision, and polishing for writing. (I didn't keep meticulous track of time--I just basically told my kids, "while you're working on this phase  of the paper, do it during your regular history time" or "do this for writing this week." So... it was pretty painless to designate the time).

 

When I "count time," I only do so roughly. I usually give my kids a basic goal, such as, "spend 45 minutes to an hour on this subject. If you finish sooner than 45 minutes, start work on the next section/chapter etc... If it's taking longer than an hour and 15 minutes, come see me." So--it's a very low-maintenance way of keeping track of time. It does put the onus on my kids--but it's pretty obvious if they aren't putting in time, and we never really had an issue with that.

 

Each day when I checked my kids' math, science, and writing, I also looked through their history notes, saw progress in reading a book by their bookmark (which also helped me to know where they were in the story as we discussed it), and quickly jotted these things down. (I keep a very simple weekly record using a table format in MS Word. For each subject, I might put a page number or chapter number completed, or just a check mark to show they did it that day. This satisfies my inner box-checker.)

 

It's literally almost no time in addition to checking their other work, but it helps me to know where we are in their school year and if we're more or less on track with where I thought we'd be by that time. So in my system, I know quickly that each "day" averages out to about an hour per subject. 

 

I do have a 1-on-1 meeting with my kids each day, and that might be anywhere from 10 minutes to an hour, depending on what subjects we end up discussing and how much help or discussion is needed. I never worry about trying to count that time--if I had to track time, I'd probably ballpark that aspect as about 30 minutes per class (for most classes) per week. 

Edited May 1, 2016 by MerryAtHope

[Cosmos]

 I admit, I am at home and keep an eye on what/when my kids are working. Most of them preferred to work outside of their bedrooms. I notice what they are working on. Usually, they tended to be on a schedule of sorts that just naturally evolved. If they were spending two hours a day on one subject, I would notice it. If they tended to take one day a week and use that entire day for one subject, it would catch my attention. If X came to me and complained or bragged about his history work taking up all of his time, I would look into why. So, I guess technically I was keeping track of how much time they worked. I just did it in my head. There was no formal recording of X spent 1 hour working on math problems today. That is keeping track of hours to me. A casual observation is not.  My kids were athletes, so with NCAA requirements, I did usually have a standard curriculum as a base. I added/subtracted from that as needed/wanted/desired/interest led.

 

That's great that you have a method that worked for you. I don't think anyone is trying to convince you to change your method. But you called counting hours ridiculous and stated that it didn't make any sense to you, so others have taken the time explain why it is beneficial for them. Are you trying to convince those who find it useful that they are wrong?

[Lolly]

That's great that you have a method that worked for you. I don't think anyone is trying to convince you to change your method. But you called counting hours ridiculous and stated that it didn't make any sense to you, so others have taken the time explain why it is beneficial for them. Are you trying to convince those who find it useful that they are wrong?

 

No. Just stated that I didn't realize anyone actually counted hours. I truly have never met anyone who did, and I do know a lot of people who homeschool. From that point, I was pretty much just answering questions. I do admit to having a problem with not ignoring posts that are directed to me.

 

"Just personality differences most likely. If it makes people more comfortable to count hours, more power to them." A quote from one of my posts above. See, not trying to convince anyone they are wrong.

 

Also, I never called counting hours ridiculous. Only place I used the word ridiculous--"As a ridiculous rule, I would ignore it and just make something up to turn in.". I find it ridiculous for the state to have rules that dictate the number of hours required for a class to be considered completed. I find it ridiculous that the state dictates a certain number of days are required for a subject to be considered to be enough to move forward a grade. If someone else finds it beneficial to themselves, then (as I quoted myself above) that's great.

 

 

Edited May 2, 2016 by Lolly

[LisaKinVA]

My poor LEGOManiac has been an experiment from beginning until the end.  When I began planning his high school hours/credits, I looked at what he *could* accomplish in an hour for things like English and History.  Math was easy, we finish the Algebra 1 book, 1 credit.  Finish the Science text, do the required questions, quizzes/tests, labs, 1 credit.  But, my estimation of what should be expected for a high school credit was a bit excessive.  

 

This past year, I have had a major learning experience with the local school.  My son can complete nearly twice the expected work in the same time frame as what the school expects.  

 

When he was little, I struggled with finding the right amount of work -- it took me years to recognize that just because a child *could* do more assigned work, it didn't mean I should expect that.  Apparently, that note to self was lost when planning high school.

 

Because I have a tendency to plan "high," I did post a question here (is this too much).  At that point, the courses were general ideas.  I hadn't really dug into them.  While I know I could have handled that level of school work with ease -- I also realized that my assumptions about what ds should do may be off.  It was hard hearing that yes, it probably was too much.  I came up with "scale down plans" and things which could be dropped, and focused in on what really should get accomplished, as well as where he really needed the extra challenge.  About the same time, I also started pre-planning certain coursework, and realized just how much it was in total.  On an individual level, taking Calc BC in one year might not be too much.  Pairing Calc BC with APES, also not too much.  But then, when everything else got layered on top of it, even with a couple of "fun" classes, it was a bear of lots of intense, focused study -- and no margin, if something didn't click right away.  It definitely had the potential of setting my kid up for failure, and me for constant frustration with trying to keep him on track.

 

I've found that I need reminders (especially since I'm still relatively new to the whole high-school/AP areas...I'm much more relaxed with my 1st and 3rd graders than I ever was with my oldest two, so I'm hoping by the time they reach middle/high school I will be super chill and confident).

 

When it comes to counting things for two credits, yes they definitely can count.  However, like some PP suggested, how that looks on a transcript/course description might vary.

 

I started out with separate credits for HIstory, English and Literature.  English Composition used Writing with Skill, Killgallon, Abeka Grammar, Spelling and Vocab, plus some shorter readings for comprehension/literary technique. History (for the credit) was a text with lectures, and some regular essays.  So, the English Credit was light and the history credit was light, but there was a 3rd Literature component. Literature encompassed texts both that were historical or reflected a particular time period, there were six focused studies, and close to 20 books (of varying lengths), plus movies & plays.  The work (books studied) definitely overlapped both history and English. If I were to assign things to primarily one or the other, it is easy to see both history and English taking well more than 200 hours to complete (there was one hour a day in English, History and Lit scheduled x 190 days).  Yes, I figured out that it was too much, and we backed things down this year -- but his English credit is still over 200 hours, and his history is around 150-160.

 

 

[Grantmom]

I can completely relate.  Uncharted territory for me too, and I feel bad sometimes for my oldest child as I have had to figure everything out as I go along!  But, at the same time, I feel like if we listen to them and adjust, and readjust, we are doing better than the school because we are individualizing it to our child.