In Need of Your Advice

[Sara bee]

I am not sure how to begin my story; it is a very long story. My daughter was attending regular school but she could not thrive academically and socially and so I started home schooling her in third grade. I am a professional teacher and I have formerly taught in high school.

 

Throughout our home schooling journey, my daughter has never shown a desire for learning although I always picked what I deemed as the best and most reputable programs and attended a very good home school coop. It has always been a struggle getting her ready for tests and she refused to do her Math practice. Instead she always reached for the solution manual. In the beginning, I tried not to hide the solution manuals because I expected her to mature and take education in her own hands. Unfortunately, even at seventh, eighth and nine grade, she always tried to cheat no matter where I had the solution manuals hidden. She always found a way. The irony is that she never struggled with a new introduced concept, especially Math. She always seemed to have excellent understanding and she seemed to do well in lesson practice.

 

Last year around March, when she was showing more defiance, carelessness and obstinacy; I decided that she should go back to school. The idea of going back to school always horrified her because I think she knew that she would not keep up and find the leniency and tolerance she found at home. The school she has been attending this year is a great school with very high standards. Upon registration, they refused to accept any of her home school credits of ninth grade and required that she takes grade nine main subjects. As a result, she is now taking classes for both grade 10 and grade 9. I was hoping that she would show a positive attitude towards her education but she became worse. She is failing both Chemistry and Algebra. She refuses to do homework and her score is almost zero. Her math level is that of a fifth grader I believe because she never wanted to do any practice throughout the years.

 

Now, I want to help her. Her counselor warned that it would not be easy for her to graduate high school with the amount of credits she has to recover (44 credits required to graduate from this particular high school) and the subjects she is deliberately failing. I do not know what to do with her. I am considering getting her into some online home school program over the summer and see how she does and decide to either keep her home or send her back to school. Knowing that sending her back to school means sending her to failure and a bleak future.

 

What should I do? What can I do for her to help her with her Math and Chemistry over the summer?

 

I apologize for the lengthy email although it actually does not reflect an iota of my pain and struggle. Thank you all. I am looking forward to learning from your insightful suggestions.

[prairiewindmomma]

You mention behavioral issues and educational ones. 

 

Is the counselor you mention educational (i.e. the school academic counselor) or are you both in counseling together with re: to your relationship and behavioral issues? I don't think kids inherently try to fail and self-destroy their lives (which is what you are suggesting) in a vacuum.  Regardless of whether she goes, I think you need to because the resentment you feel for your daughter pours off the page.

 

As far as academics go, I would ask her what she wants to do. You'll need her buy-in from the process.   Ask her what her plans are for the future.  Ask her how she is going to care for herself as an adult, and how she plans to spend her working years.  If she wants to study cosmetology or the like, I'd support the endeavor.  I'd look at all of the options with her: GED, community college, high school diploma, and go from there.

 

Once she decides what she wants to do, THEN I think you'll be in a better position to choose materials for remediation and graduation.

[Sara bee]

I meant the school counselor. I agree with you that no person tries to be inherently self-destructive. I always try to dig deep to find out why she makes these decisions. I suggested that we see a psychologist and that we both get counseling but she does not like the idea. I had wanted her to welcome the idea first before getting her into it.

 

I do discuss with her what her plans are about the future and what she would like to pursue. For years, she has been interested in the medical field but she has changed her mind recently. She is now discussing getting into law.

Edited April 22, 2016 by Sara bee

[8filltheheart]

I don't see how enrolling her in another academic scenario is going to work any better than any of the other options you have tried.  Finding out the root cause of the behavior is the only thing that is really going to make any difference at all.  She needs to meet with a psy and most likely have testing done to see if there are any underlying issues that are only being observed through her school behaviors.

[Sara bee]

I am afraid you are absolutely right. Should we see a psychiatrist or psychologist? 

[OneStepAtATime]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

You sound incredibly frustrated.  I understand.  I agree with up thread, what you need are answers for the real cause of these issues, which apparently have been around for years.

 

Have you considered the possibility that there may be an underlying learning issue that is undiagnosed?  That perhaps the reason she was struggling in school to begin with may have been some sort of underlying learning challenge that is not readily apparent to a layman?  Children can be exceedingly bright, even gifted, do well in many subjects, and still have an undiagnosed learning challenge that makes certain types of academics extremely challenging.  A layman, even a teacher, frequently does not have the background knowledge to tweak out that there is a true learning problem and frequently the child is then blamed for a bad attitude. Eventually they DO develop a bad attitude because no one understands why they are struggling, including themselves.  Better to act like academics don't matter than to admit they are stupid (which is what they may secretly fear, even though it isn't true).  There are many things that could have caused her to have trouble in school to begin with, things that might be addressed now to give her a fighting chance.

 

I agree with previous posters, at this point I would seek answers and probably counseling for both of you and I would probably step back from academics for the moment.  I think your child is demoralized and is defiant because she feels bad inside.  Just switching to another school setting (on-line, public school, homeschooling or whatever) is not going to net you a better result.  She has been having some issues with academics for years.   Find out why the struggles were there to begin with.  Kids don't usually choose to fail, but they can absolutely reach a point where they see no value in trying anymore.  Perhaps seek a private evaluation through a neuropsychologist.  Rule out learning challenges while you and she maybe get counseling.  

 

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

[quark]

I do discuss with her what her plans are about the future and what she would like to pursue. For years, she has been interested in the medical field but she has changed her mind recently. She is now discussing getting into law.

 

There's something that doesn't sound right and why I thought I would chance a reply...

 

What seemed strange to me is that her goals (i.e. medicine/ law) are the last thing I would have expected her to say given your description of her behavior towards academics. Were these goals decided upon on the spur of the moment? If wanting to be in the medical field for so long, was she serious about this, researching it, reading about it, wanting to watch TV shows about doctors etc? Or were these occupations suggested by a well meaning person? Do you know how and why she decided on these?

 

What does she do in her free time? Willingly?

 

edited to add...I forgot to send you and her :grouphug: . I'm really sorry for the pain this must be causing the both of you.

Edited April 22, 2016 by quark

[Arcadia]

Since it has been going on for so long, I would try hard to find out the root cause. Is it math anxiety and/or learning disability? Is something bothering her about academics? Is it perfectionism such that if perfect isn't possible the child just give up?

 

One of my kid gives up easily because of perfectionism mainly. On the surface he would look like a full time slacker and he does slack sometimes. I have to tomato stake that kid just to nudge and remind him how much progress he has made or he feels defected.

 

:grouphug:

 

What seemed strange to me is that her goals (i.e. medicine/ law) are the last thing I would have expected her to say given your description of her behavior towards academics.

I think if OP's daughter told the school guidance counselor her goal was Medicine, but struggle in school for algebra and chemistry, the counselor might have suggested Law as a more feasible goal.

 

ETA:

From OP's original thread, looks like her child won't take well to treating this year as 9th instead of 10th.

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/604738-lost-confused-and-in-dire-need-of-your-suggestions/?do=findComment&comment=6961199

Edited April 22, 2016 by Arcadia

[JanetC]

I am afraid you are absolutely right. Should we see a psychiatrist or psychologist?

I hate to say it, but at least near us, those who deal with teen issues all have wait lists. Go where you can get in. If you are seeing a psychologist and he or she feels medication is needed, they will refer you to an MD for that. Similarly, a psychiatrist would probably refer you to someone else for educational and LD evaluations. (Even a psychologist may do this: someone treating you for emotional issues will want someone impartial to do educational testing.)

 

Your pediatrician may be able to refer you to someone.

[OnMyOwn]

I am afraid you are absolutely right. Should we see a psychiatrist or psychologist?

The psychiatrists in my area do not seem to do talk therapy anymore. They only prescribe meds. i would start with a psychologist and they can refer you to a psych if meds are needed.

 

Sorry you are having a hard time!