Are these books suitable for high school? (Simply Charlotte Mason)

[morningcoffee]

I'm thinking of using SCM Middle Ages Guide for my oldest (15 y.o.). 

 

It is designed to keep the whole family in the same historical period so it combines readings suitable for a "family study" with additional reading lists for the different ages. It looks very well organized in the way it does this but I will only be using it with my high school student. 

 

Do you think it is up to high school standard? 

 

And if I'm not using it with younger children, should I be allocating my high schooler's time (and my resources) to the family books? 

 

Here's the booklist. I won't be using it for bible so I haven't included those books. 

 

Family books:

Famous Men of the Middle Ages, edited by Rob Shearer  

Famous Men of the Renaissance and Reformation by Rob Shearer  

Castle by David Macaulay  

Cathedral by David Macaulay  

Ink on His Fingers by Louise Vernon

The Man Who Laid the Egg by Louise Vernon (The story of Erasmus.)  

The Beggars’ Bible by Louise Vernon (The story of John Wyclif.)  

Thunderstorm in Church by Louise Vernon (The story of Martin Luther.)

The Bible Smuggler by Louise Vernon (The story of William Tyndale.)  

Reformation Time Line from Rose Publishing  

Around the World in a Hundred Years by Jean Fritz  

Christopher Columbus by Bennie Rhodes  

 

High School Books (grades 10 - 12): 

The Lantern Bearers by Rosemary Sutcliff

Men of Iron by Howard Pyle  

Voices of the Renaissance and Reformation, edited by Rob Shearer (A collection of original source documents from famous men who lived during the Renaissance and Reformation).

The Black Arrow by Robert Louis Stevenson

The Second Mrs. Giaconda by E. L. Konigsburg

The King’s Fifth by Scott O’Dell

 

 

[Loesje22000]

We did the first 2 terms of it as part of our grade 8 1/2 year while wrapping up the last grade 8 exams.

Dd read some of the family readings, all the 6-9 & 10-12 selections,, but not her bible & geography curriculum.

 

To our goals, in our context, I found the Highschool selections weak.

But scm is also not my style of history.

We are now using MOH 3, also not a favorite of mine.

[Holly]

We will be continuing with SCM for high school (DD will be in 9th grade next year).  We are currently using this history module, but not the high school books.  I do think some selections are a bit on the young side, but I'm okay with it.   :blush:   We actually put aside Famous Men for this year because everyone was having a difficult time with it, so personally, I found these books to be high school level.  Currently, we are using SOTW 2 instead of the Famous Men books, and the next time we get back to this time period, I plan on having my HS students read through Famous Men on their own and use SOTW as our family reading spine.  

 

Some possible options for you to "beef it up" would be to substitute a few books or add in an extra book or two.  We always seem to sub a few books each year for a variety of reasons. You could also have your oldest read SWB's History of the Medieval World instead of the family books (or in addition to).  Another possibility would be to add in a couple documentaries.  I'm sure there are several available on this time period.  These notebook pages would be good too.  They have an essay time question & mini timeline for each topic.

 

I imagine SCM would be too light for many here, but it's been a great fit for my DC who aren't into history.  They'd much rather spend school time on art & science.  I plan on continuing with SCM history through high school, possibly adding in some extras as needed.  I like to personalize the individual student's booklist so it fits their individual abilities.  SCM gives me a good starting place and keeps everyone somewhat together, which is important to me.  

[ChocolateMomster]

No, I don't think it's up to high school standard. I'd expect more advanced selections; my 8 year old son just finished Men of Iron. Many of the books mentioned are ones I'm planning on using this coming year with my 6 and 8 year old.

Edited March 16, 2016 by ChocolateMomster

[SparklyUnicorn]

You can see inside these books at Christian book dot com.  The reading level seems a bit low for high school.  That said, if it was the only subject with lower level books I don't think that's terrible.  I got a lot out of reading SOTW and those aren't written at a high school level.  And I prefer this sort of stuff over traditional PS style texts.  Those are so annoying and dry to read. 

[Liza Q]

 

You could also have your oldest read SWB's History of the Medieval World instead of the family books (or in addition to).  Another possibility would be to add in a couple documentaries.  I'm sure there are several available on this time period.  These notebook pages would be good too.  They have an essay time question & mini timeline for each topic.

 

ITA.

 

I do want to say that The Lantern Bearers is a powerful book and I did assign it to my girls when they were in High School. They read several Sutcliff books in 6th-8th grade but I saved this one (as well as The Mark of the Horse Lord) for High School. Assigning a few easy reads each year is fun, so it's not all Beowulf and The Song of Roland, kwim?

 

 

[8filltheheart]

I cannot imagine using that list for high school. My kids read those books between ages 8-13. My 8th grader read through Famous Men of Rome to prep for the National Latin Exam. I would not consider that series an appropriate high school history base. They are really more of an introduction for elementary/early middle school kids. (IOW, I wouldn't have counted FMR as a history text for an 8th grader.) They will leave huge gaps and not provide a good overview.

 

My high schoolers are just functioning on a completely different level than the list you have posted.

[Penelope]

The Famous Men books are used for upper elementary level in the Memoria Press curriculum, and although we don't do straight Memoria Press, that is when I used them.

 

But I am also not a fan of the heavy use of historical fiction as part of academic work. I think that is fine for young children, or for a student that has reading difficulties and does not read much outside of school work. But I feel that a normal child can read those types of books if he likes, on his own time. I am not going to criticize anyone who feels differently about it, but I would have trouble categorizing that course as colleg prep for sure.

[Bluegoat]

I would not be crazy about that list, although I actually like a lot of SCM products. 

 

As far as the family list, some of them might be fine - visual books like Cathedral can be great for all ages.  But others, like The Beggar's Bible, I think are just poor choices for anyone.

 

But I am with Penelope - I don't think fiction is history.  It can be nice to use as "fun" reads to go along with real history, if it is well written it will give some ambience, and for some people it really helps put things in order if there are no good narrative histories, but it is, in the end, fiction.

[morningcoffee]

Some possible options for you to "beef it up" would be to substitute a few books or add in an extra book or two.  We always seem to sub a few books each year for a variety of reasons. You could also have your oldest read SWB's History of the Medieval World instead of the family books (or in addition to).  Another possibility would be to add in a couple documentaries.  I'm sure there are several available on this time period.  These notebook pages would be good too.  They have an essay time question & mini timeline for each topic.

 

Thanks Holly .... I just bought the notebook pages. Great value for less than $1  :001_smile: 

[happypamama]

While I have not yet finalized my history and lit plans for my rising ninth grader, I will say that my lists for her look different from that one. At least several of them look more like middle school level than high school. I'm planning to use Famous Men with my second and sixth graders next year. The ninth grader might listen in if she chooses, but it'll be a bonus fun thing for her, rather than core history/lit work.

[katilac]

Definitely not a high school level list.

 

On the family list, I don't see too much that I would bother with for a high schooler, other than looking through the castle and cathedral books as a fun extra. The "Famous Men" series is not suitable as a high school spine, imo. 

 

I'm all for some fun or easier stuff in high school, particularly when you are going for exposure, but this is almost all markedly below level.

 

Where are Dante, Milton, Locke, Chaucer? 

[Penelope]

Out of curiosity, I looked at the page from their website. It seems a little strange that there is not really an increase in difficulty between the middle school and high school lists.

 

For the same year, here is the list for grades 7-9:

The Book of Arthur by Howard Pyle

Book of Centuries

Discovering Doctrine by Sonya Shafer

In Freedom’s Cause: A Story of Wallace and Bruce by G. A. Henty

Life in the Word by Sonya Shafer

The Magna Charta by James Daugherty

The Prince and the Pauper by Mark Twain

The Shining Company by Rosemary Sutcliff

The Story of King Arthur and His Knights by Howard Pyle

The White Stag by Kate Seredy

 

Most of their literature selections for high school seem to be more on level. It's just a very different choice for history. But it is a free list, and different people are looking for different things.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Penelope

[happypamama]

Just as a comparison, this is what History Odyssey lists for Level 3 Middle Ages, for history/literature (about a credit of history and half of a language arts credit, or a whole one if you add a writing program), which is about 10th grade level, give or take a bit.

 

In addition to the spine of The New History of the World, they recommend:

How to Read a Abook

Beowulf

The Song of Roland

The Travels by Marco Polo

1066: The Year of the Conquest

Life in a Medieval City

Sir Gawain and the Green Knight

The Inferno by Dante Alighieri

The Canterbury Tales by Geoffrey Chaucer

The Prince by Niccolo Machiavelli

Hamlet by William Shakespeare

Essays by Michel de Montaigne

[Harriet Vane]

Definitely not a high school list. Sorry.

[brehon]

What is your goal for your dd? I would consider what you've listed as middle school at best. I just can't see spending money on a program for a high schooler that isn't really at a high school level. If you have to add a lot to beef it up, you might as well spend the money you would have used for the SCM program and put it to something better suited to HS.

[Laura Corin]

I cannot imagine using that list for high school. My kids read those books between ages 8-13. My 8th grader read through Famous Men of Rome to prep for the National Latin Exam. I would not consider that series an appropriate high school history base. They are really more of an introduction for elementary/early middle school kids. (IOW, I wouldn't have counted FMR as a history text for an 8th grader.) They will leave huge gaps and not provide a good overview.

 

My high schoolers are just functioning on a completely different level than the list you have posted.

 

I agree.  I don't know the history books that were listed, but from 14 onwards my boys were reading adult texts, not young adult.  For reference, Hobbes (at school, studying for national standardised exams) has been studying R K Narayan's The English Teacher, Chesterton's An Inspector Calls, Macbeth and a selection of adult poetry of the 19th and 20th century