Biggest stressor in 8th grade girls.....

[8filltheheart]

http://drtimjordan.com/2016/02/the-largest-stressor-for-8th-grade-girls-youll-be-surprised/

 

So sad. I'm glad this is not my kids' reality.

[Arcadia]

I think it is for all public school 8th graders rather than just the girls. They have to come up with a draft 4 year plan soon and placement tests are in spring of 8th grade.

 

ETA:

I don't think the biggest stress is about being popular and about having a boyfriend would be any better though.

Edited February 19, 2016 by Arcadia

[8filltheheart]

I agree that it is not just girls. But since that is what the article is about, I didn't want to change what was written. He has another article on the sidebar about colleges that equally addresses the "elite or failure" college syndrome.

[Arcadia]

He has another article on the sidebar about colleges that equally addresses the "elite or failure" college syndrome.

 

I do agree with you on the article.

 

The local parents here are worsening the stress on the middle income kids and it is not just Asian immigrant parents who do that.  Just the other day while waiting at the waiting area for my kids cello lessons to be over, a mom was being dismissive of a dad's child's future income potential for pursuing a degree in economics instead of STEM :(  The child is at college and not present in the conversation which was mostly one sided with the dad just being polite.

 

The music teachers at that school are good at teaching music and don't cross the line into academics.  The parents on the other hand can be real condescending even with their kids present.  My region also have two highly ranked universities (UCB, Stanford) which make it worse. The same dad was making a comment about a month ago that smart kids go to engineering in a resigned tone to another dad :(  My kids heard that and luckily didn't take it to heart.

 

We were at Stanford for AMC10/12.  The parents talk is crazy and the kids are almost all Asians. I am glad too my kids don't need to feel the Asian kids syndrome in public schools that my kids experienced in K to 2nd.

 

 

ETA:

The parental pressure at the music center where my kids take their theory and music composition lessons is just as bad across all race/ethnic groups.  Their music school does only practicum so we go to two places as practicum at the center cost more.

Edited February 19, 2016 by Arcadia

[madteaparty]

I do agree with you on the article.

 

The local parents here are worsening the stress on the middle income kids and it is not just Asian immigrant parents who do that. Just the other day while waiting at the waiting area for my kids cello lessons to be over, a mom was being dismissive of a dad's child's future income potential for pursuing a degree in economics instead of STEM :( The child is at college and not present in the conversation which was mostly one sided with the dad just being polite.

 

The music teachers at that school are good at teaching music and don't cross the line into academics. The parents on the other hand can be real condescending even with their kids present. My region also have two highly ranked universities (UCB, Stanford) which make it worse. The same dad was making a comment about a month ago that smart kids go to engineering in a resigned tone to another dad :( My kids heard that and luckily didn't take it to heart.

 

We were at Stanford for AMC10/12. The parents talk is crazy and the kids are almost all Asians. I am glad too my kids don't need to feel the Asian kids syndrome in public schools that my kids experienced in K to 2nd.

Such good manners too. With parents like that, those kids will go far. Smh.

[Heather in VA]

I'm not sure the point they are trying to make. This is a universal issue, not a gender specific ones. It's a real problem, especially the 'elite or failure'. Where I live it's an enormous problem that continues to get worse and is perpetuated by egotistical colleges and high-strung parents. But to write the article specifying that girls shouldn't have to worry like that makes it sound like it's ok for boys to be stressed about school but girls should slow down and take time to daydream. 

[scoutingmom]

I was confused about the "these days" part.... I remember a lot of concern the year before high school on selecting the school and the courses etc and that being influenced by what you wanted to do as an adult..... and that wasn't yesterday by any means....

 

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[SunshineMom]

I've been thinking about opting my kids out of the whole racket of college prep and sending my dd to spend a year abroad as an exchange student. I have a tendency to not follow the crowd.

[8filltheheart]

I was confused about the "these days" part.... I remember a lot of concern the year before high school on selecting the school and the courses etc and that being influenced by what you wanted to do as an adult..... and that wasn't yesterday by any means....

 

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I guess the environment you grew/grow up in makes a difference. Or maybe it is more awareness of what is occurring in many communities. There are areas right now where middle school is a pressure cooker focused on elite college admissions. High school is all about forming the competitive resume for top 20 college admissions.

 

I do not think 8th graders need to know what they want to do with their adult lives.making the decision to no take AP Human Geography or AP Environmental Science in 9th grade will not ruin your future life. Not taking 14 APs will not ruin your life. Attending a lower ranked school will not ruin your life.

 

The pressure for 11-13 yr olds to be the best in order to attend the best bc that is the only way to successful adult outcomes is unfortunately a very real scenario built on a false premise.

[Tree Frog]

In Texas, the legislature has decided that 8th graders should know which endorsement or endorsements they want as they head into college. So it's no longer "try what you want; see if there's anything that interests you," but rather "what are you going to do in college? Those are the classes you need to take in high school." The kids have to choose what their "specialty" will be in high school. Because of the prereq's, students have a difficult time changing their endorsement after their freshman year and nearly impossible after their sophomore year if they find they don't like what they've chosen to do. My son is fortunate; he pretty much knows what he wants to do. Those students who don't know, though, have a little more difficult time. There is a catch all endorsement, so no student will graduate without one, but I don't like the trend that kids need to know what they're going to do as adults when they're 13 years old.

[Heather in VA]

In Texas, the legislature has decided that 8th graders should know which endorsement or endorsements they want as they head into college. So it's no longer "try what you want; see if there's anything that interests you," but rather "what are you going to do in college? Those are the classes you need to take in high school." The kids have to choose what their "specialty" will be in high school. Because of the prereq's, students have a difficult time changing their endorsement after their freshman year and nearly impossible after their sophomore year if they find they don't like what they've chosen to do. My son is fortunate; he pretty much knows what he wants to do. Those students who don't know, though, have a little more difficult time. There is a catch all endorsement, so no student will graduate without one, but I don't like the trend that kids need to know what they're going to do as adults when they're 13 years old.

 

This is a trend toward the way the German school system has been for a long time. A student is put in a track very early and it is very difficult to switch tracks later. So late bloomers and those with special needs are behind the eight ball their entire lives. 

[madteaparty]

This is a trend toward the way the German school system has been for a long time. A student is put in a track very early and it is very difficult to switch tracks later. So late bloomers and those with special needs are behind the eight ball their entire lives.

And Swiss public schools too. I actually find it amusing when they call common core tests "high stakes"--they are not high stakes for anyone, certainly not the kids. If only something actually came of those tests. Our friends in Switzerland get to see whether their 4th grader gets to go to gymnasium and then university...

[Heather in VA]

And Swiss public schools too. I actually find it amusing when they call common core tests "high stakes"--they are not high stakes for anyone, certainly not the kids. If only something actually came of those tests. Our friends in Switzerland get to see whether their 4th grader gets to go to gymnasium and then university...

 

I'm not surprised other European countries are like this as well. My parents had friends who were German and their youngest got completely screwed over by this process. Their youngest son was very bright but a late bloomer. So very early on when he was assigned his 'track", it closed many doors for him. I think he was only 8 or 9. When he got into his 20s he had to work very hard to try to overcome the track he'd been placed on his entire life. 

[madteaparty]

I'm not surprised other European countries are like this as well. My parents had friends who were German and their youngest got completely screwed over by this process. Their youngest son was very bright but a late bloomer. So very early on when he was assigned his 'track", it closed many doors for him. I think he was only 8 or 9. When he got into his 20s he had to work very hard to try to overcome the track he'd been placed on his entire life.

You basically have to pay for private school if you have a kid like that.

[SporkUK]

I was confused about the "these days" part.... I remember a lot of concern the year before high school on selecting the school and the courses etc and that being influenced by what you wanted to do as an adult..... and that wasn't yesterday by any means....

 

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I had similar. I clearly recall a class in 8th grade being given a list of all the classes the high school had and an entire class plus homework over the weekend was devoted to us creating our four year high school plan and writing out why and how it would lead to our life goals. And this was well over a decade ago in a south Ohio middle school that led into a high school more known for drug issues, pregnancies and bomb threats than academic rigor near no elite Unis. It was just treated as what we should already know. I remember making the perfect uber-hard college-prep four year plan and struggling to explain why because my only reason was wanting to get out of there which they weren't too fond of. That idea that it is worse now than then make my stomach twist. 

[Carol in Cal.]

This is a real, genuine problem.  The author makes it sound like this is unnecessary, but for a lot of paths it is in fact crucial, unfortunately.

There are a lot of careers where whether you can get a good job in your field doesn't depend on whether you have a college degree or not, but rather whether you have a college degree from one of a fairly few really good universities, having done well there competitively in your field.  There is also little job security anymore, and almost no fallback 'good paying' trade union factory employment, so the downside risk of messing high school up and not getting into a really good program at a really good college is significant.

 

It is crazy to belittle that.  Decrying it is appropriate, but acting like it's not a problem just because it wasn't as much of a problem in the past is unrealistic.

[8filltheheart]

This is a real, genuine problem. The author makes it sound like this is unnecessary, but for a lot of paths it is in fact crucial, unfortunately.

There are a lot of careers where whether you can get a good job in your field doesn't depend on whether you have a college degree or not, but rather whether you have a college degree from one of a fairly few really good universities, having done well there competitively in your field. There is also little job security anymore, and almost no fallback 'good paying' trade union factory employment, so the downside risk of messing high school up and not getting into a really good program at a really good college is significant.

 

It is crazy to belittle that. Decrying it is appropriate, but acting like it's not a problem just because it wasn't as much of a problem in the past is unrealistic.

What are the "lot of careers" which necessitate a degree from a "fairly few universities"? Perhaps a handful of careers are "brand name aware", but most do not require a degree from an elite college. It is in states' interests to have good universities and most state flagships are. States like CA have many great schools; many smaller states have several solid public universities each.

 

Fwiw, I see a big difference between planning on taking a general college prep course load in high school and perpetuating the myth that only the tippy top competitive students will be successful. There are 4.0 valedictorians with 2400 SATs with 5 clubs, 2 instruments, and 400 volunteer hours who think their lives are over bc they got rejected by the top schools.

 

Kids can have a solid high school educational experience, attend a good university (not even a top100 university) and still have a great college education with internships, co-ops, research and graduate with good job prospects.

[Heather in VA]

What are the "lot of careers" which necessitate a degree from a "fairly few universities"? Perhaps a handful of careers are "brand name aware", but most do not require a degree from an elite college. It is in states' interests to have good universities and most state flagships are. States like CA have many great schools; many smaller states have several solid public universities each.

 

Fwiw, I see a big difference between planning on taking a general college prep course load in high school and perpetuating the myth that only the tippy top competitive students will be successful. There are 4.0 valedictorians with 2400 SATs with 5 clubs, 2 instruments, and 400 volunteer hours who think their lives are over bc they got rejected by the top schools.

 

Kids can have a solid high school educational experience, attend a good university (not even a top100 university) and still have a great college education with internships, co-ops, research and graduate with good job prospects.

 

In our area the problem is more than just kids being rejected by Ivy Leagues. I live in a state with a large number of very good public schools and yet kids are taught by the high schools that there are two acceptable schools to go to. You are cut some slack if you chose to go to an Ivy League. Other than that, your entire life should be geared to getting into one of those two places. It doesn't matter if they don't have your major or another school has a better program. It's about saying you went there. The high schools teach it. The parents teach it. The kids believe it. The colleges love it. But it can be so destructive. Our area has multiple suicides every year. One high school nearby had 8 kids commit suicide in a 3 year period. The attitude is so prevalent that recently someone asked my daughter why she wasn't applying to school X. 'You are so smart - why not go there?' was the question. When my daughter pointed out that they don't have her major, it was actually confusing to the person asking (an adult) why that really mattered. She told her to go to the "good school" and major in something else and then specialize in graduate school. What the heck kind of advice is that? But it's the norm. 

[8filltheheart]

In our area the problem is more than just kids being rejected by Ivy Leagues. I live in a state with a large number of very good public schools and yet kids are taught by the high schools that there are two acceptable schools to go to. You are cut some slack if you chose to go to an Ivy League. Other than that, your entire life should be geared to getting into one of those two places. It doesn't matter if they don't have your major or another school has a better program. It's about saying you went there. The high schools teach it. The parents teach it. The kids believe it. The colleges love it. But it can be so destructive. Our area has multiple suicides every year. One high school nearby had 8 kids commit suicide in a 3 year period. The attitude is so prevalent that recently someone asked my daughter why she wasn't applying to school X. 'You are so smart - why not go there?' was the question. When my daughter pointed out that they don't have her major, it was actually confusing to the person asking (an adult) why that really mattered. She told her to go to the "good school" and major in something else and then specialize in graduate school. What the heck kind of advice is that? But it's the norm.

Exactly. VA is actually one of the states I was thinking of. We moved from VA 3 yrs ago. There are several great schools, but my goodness, you would think a child's life was destroyed if they went to Mary Washington or VCU instead of UVA.

Edited February 22, 2016 by 8FillTheHeart

[regentrude]

I'm not surprised other European countries are like this as well. My parents had friends who were German and their youngest got completely screwed over by this process. Their youngest son was very bright but a late bloomer. So very early on when he was assigned his 'track", it closed many doors for him. I think he was only 8 or 9. When he got into his 20s he had to work very hard to try to overcome the track he'd been placed on his entire life. 

 

In Germany, there are many different possibilities for late bloomers and no doors are actually closed.

There are opportunities to switch tracks at certain points during the school career (details depend on state).

The not-college track kids graduate after 10th grade, the college prep after 12th (or 13ths in some states).. There are 3 year programs where a late bloomer graduating from 10th and wanting to go to college can complete the college prep diploma and essentially only lose one year. My niece did this; she had to stay in school just one year longer and then attended a university just like the kids who did the college prep track right away.

 

Also, any student wanting to attend college can apply sit the examination for the college prep high school final (Abitur) without ever having attended a college prep school or program.

 

The perception that doors are closed at an early age is incorrect. It just requires some initiative.

Edited February 22, 2016 by regentrude

[Heather in VA]

Exactly. VA is actually one of the states I was thinking of. We moved from VA 3 yrs ago. There are several great schools, but my goodness, you would think a child's life was destroyed if they went to Mary Washington or VCU instead of UVA.

 

No kidding. I don't know where in VA you live but I live in Fairfax County which is just a hot bed of education egotism. My daughter wants to study Forensic Chemistry. It is very important to do so at a school with an accredited program - there is a organization that accredits Forensic science programs. You can do to one that isn't but you won't be as marketable initially and you won't have as many internship opportunities. So in our area that means Virginia Commonwealth University and West Virginia University, which to my surprise has the #1 program in the nation. Who knew?? But people will not get off her back. People keep telling her to go to UVA or William and Mary. Seriously? It is completely incomprehensible to people that she doesn't want to go to either place and that neither would be appropriate for her major. My oldest, who is now a junior in college, had a similar problem. She chose her school because they had the highest pass rate for the NCLEX (she's a nursing major) and the most hands-on clinical time of all the programs we looked at. But people still don't understand why "a smart girl like her wouldn't go to UVA'. 

 

A friend of mine posted this article on her FB page a few months ago. It really sums up what kids in this area are being taught.

 

http://www.bustle.com/articles/122174-i-got-one-c-plus-in-high-school-it-changed-the-course-of-my-life?utm_source=FBOnsite&utm_medium=Facebook&utm_campaign=1

Edited February 22, 2016 by Heather in VA

[Carol in Cal.]

I used to work at a very large tech firm, and they only hired engineers from a few universities.

 

In fact, they paid for employees to go to college elsewhere, but didn't necessarily promote them into engineering if they got an engineeering degree--it largely depended on whether these degrees and grades would have gotten them an interview fresh out of college or not.  

 

This is not uncommon in that industry, which is economically a big driver of our economy.

 

Not everyone should do that, but people also shouldn't kid themselves about whether they are closing doors for themselves if they don't prepare to maybe be able to do that.  Of course, people also shouldn't assume that your life is over if one door you're not even interested in is closed to you, either.

 

I HATE the current system.  It is bad for all kids, overachievers, underachievers, average achievers, everyone.  It is just awful.  But denying what it is like is just putting your head in the sand.  It's like wanting to be a doctor and not wanting to take biology.  It takes what it takes. 

 

One great thing about this country, though, is that there are nonstandard 'late bloomer' paths into almost everything, but they are costly in terms of time, money, and effort.

 

 

 

Edited February 22, 2016 by Carol in Cal.

[Arcadia]

I used to work at a very large tech firm, and they only hired engineers from a few universities.

 

Internship too is affected for the companies in our region. It is all connections either from a professor that has connections to the company, or insider connections. One of hubby's ex-employer took interns mainly from the top few engineering schools because of connections. The professors help their students get the internships.

 

A friend's child from a local to us single digit rank college lost her job and was stuck without using a headhunter. My hubby helped her submit her resume internally but she was kind of snotty about it, while her mom is not snotty :(

 

The community colleges around our area are actually very good.  Many going for nursing degrees and studying at the local libraries which are well stocked with NCLEX prep books.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Arcadia

[8filltheheart]

My dh and ds are both engineers. They work with engineers across a full spectrum of schools and pay is relative to performance, not school for degree. FWIW, our ds graduated from a small tech state university, not a state flagship. He co-oped with students fro GA Tech, NCSU, and VA Tech. He was the one out of the 4 offered a job a graduation. He had multiple job offers to choose from.

 

ABET accredited programs guarantee a standard of education. A better way to evaluate schools rather than by man on the street recognition is to find out what corporations recruit on campus.

[Carol in Cal.]

 A better way to evaluate schools rather than by man on the street recognition is to find out what corporations recruit on campus.

This is excellent advice.

 

But my examples are still accurate.

 

I don't think anyone is saying that someone's life is over because they didn't position themselves properly in 8th grade to get into an elite university, but I do think that it has to be acknowledged that options are more limited the less you do this.  And that might be just fine, but it shouldn't be denied like the OP article seems to do.

[8filltheheart]

This is excellent advice.

 

But my examples are still accurate.

 

I don't think anyone is saying that someone's life is over because they didn't position themselves properly in 8th grade to get into an elite university, but I do think that it has to be acknowledged that options are more limited the less you do this. And that might be just fine, but it shouldn't be denied like the OP article seems to do.

Only if by your corp not recruiting from other schools meant that all other graduates from other schools had inferior career options. It is doubtful that one single employer is the only source of good engineering jobs. It is an awfully big country.

[Carol in Cal.]

Only if by your corp not recruiting from other schools meant that all other graduates from other schools had inferior career options. It is doubtful that one single employer is the only source of good engineering jobs. It is an awfully big country.

It's an awfully big firm, and it was fairly representative.

Definitely tech firms out here limit the universities that they recruit from and throw out applications from a lot of places.  That is well known, at least locally.

[8filltheheart]

It's an awfully big firm, and it was fairly representative.

Definitely tech firms out here limit the universities that they recruit from and throw out applications from a lot of places. That is well known, at least locally.

Unless it is the computer industry and the assumption is that every student who majors in CS wants to work in the SV, it is simply a single view. Not all students want to work in start ups or for tech giants, some CS majors are perfectly happy working for other companies. It is not as if they will be unemployed if not hired by a single company in a specific region of the country.

 

In other engineering fields like chem, mech, electrical, etc, it would be laughable to even begin to suggest a single corp's hiring practice was representative of the industry as a whole. Corps in those fields recruit from schools across the country. And some unheard of schools have their own niches. For example, if a kid wants to work in the aeronautical industry, UAH is not a bad place to be, but it is definitely not a man on the street school. (Neither is it at all competitive.)

Edited February 22, 2016 by 8FillTheHeart

[Carol in Cal.]

Unless it is the computer industry and the assumption is that every student who majors in CS wants to work in the SV, it is simply a single view. Not all students want to work in start ups or for tech giants, some CS majors are perfectly happy working for other companies. It is not as if they will be unemployed if not hired by a single company in a specific region of the country.

 

You're not reading what I'm writing carefully.

 

What I am saying is that some doors are closed.  That is undeniable.  I'm not saying that they are completely unemployable, but rather (again) that it's wise to evaluate how dominant the closing of doors is in choosing a major and college.  It follows that in general to keep your options as open as possible, unfortunately you have to take the right courses and excel from middle school on, which was not nearly so much the case when I was growing up.  I think that that is deplorable and I hate it, but I'm not going to pretend that it's not so.

 

And I was not even remotely talking about just CS majors--tech around here includes a lot of EE, Chem E, ME and other STEM majors as well.

 

And FWIW, for heaven's sake don't study something you absolutely hate.  Remember the nuclear engineering fiasco of the early 80s?  Lots of people went into nuclear because it was lucrative, and when the jobs dried up rather suddenly they had a major that they didn't enjoy in the first place that was no longer lucrative or even salable.  Not good at all.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Carol in Cal.

[daijobu]

 

What I am saying is that some doors are closed.  That is undeniable.  I'm not saying that they are completely unemployable, but rather (again) that it's wise to evaluate how dominant the closing of doors is in choosing a major and college.  

 

What also closes doors are a lack of marketable skills.  I read articles these days about students graduating in liberal arts (even from name schools), and ending up as baristas or in unpaid internships.  I've read about a student who graduated from Tulane with a degree in poli sci, who went back to school to pick up another undergraduate CS degree so he could finally get a real job.  

 

I wonder how many students end up at university hoping for a prestigious degree (engineering, sciences, vet school, med school, marine biology) but don't have the academic chops to pass their classes and drop down into an easier department.  

 

I want to keep my students' doors open, but I'm banking on their technical skills and letting the college applications fall where they may.  Wherever they end up I want them to excel and be capable of studying even the most difficult majors.  That way, whatever field they choose, it will be because they actually choose it, not because they couldn't hack something else.  

[8filltheheart]

You're not reading what I'm writing carefully.

 

What I am saying is that some doors are closed.  That is undeniable.  I'm not saying that they are completely unemployable, but rather (again) that it's wise to evaluate how dominant the closing of doors is in choosing a major and college.  It follows that in general to keep your options as open as possible, unfortunately you have to take the right courses and excel from middle school on, which was not nearly so much the case when I was growing up.  I think that that is deplorable and I hate it, but I'm not going to pretend that it's not so.

 

And I was not even remotely talking about just CS majors--tech around here includes a lot of EE, Chem E, ME and other STEM majors as well.

 

 

Actually I am carefully reading what you are saying.  There is not a single company that dominates across all those fields of engineering.  Therefore the practices of a single corporation does not represent hiring practices at large.  Engineering is one of the most employable fields across the spectrum of universities b/c of ABET accreditation.  What you might be seeing is a regional bias. It might be closing that company's doors or a region.  But that is not the same as suggesting that it is representative of hiring practices for engineers in an industry at large.

 

 used to work at a very large tech firm, and they only hired engineers from a few universities.

 

In fact, they paid for employees to go to college elsewhere, but didn't necessarily promote them into engineering if they got an engineeering degree--it largely depended on whether these degrees and grades would have gotten them an interview fresh out of college or not.  

 

This is not uncommon in that industry, which is economically a big driver of our economy.

 

Between my dh and my ds, we have experience with a few top global corporations for chemEs and what you are describing does not at all mesh with their experiences at those companies.  (And those same companies employ engineers across the different fields.  They work with just as many MEs and some EEs.) There is not a single category of schools that represent where they recruit.   (And considering how many places we have lived since my dh graduated from college, it is not a local situation, either.)

Edited February 22, 2016 by 8FillTheHeart

[sweetpea3829]

My word, how many adults are working in the field they wanted to work in as an 8th grader?

 

Should I start positioning my 9 yr old to work in the fields he thinks he wants to work in? What's the appropriate track for a kid who wants to be a deep sea diver AND an astronaut? Oh and the President, too.

[Arcadia]

What's the appropriate track for a kid who wants to be a deep sea diver AND an astronaut? Oh and the President, too.

Start with scuba diving and work towards deep sea diving and diving certifications and tag along for campaigns :lol:

I do have friends whose kids were heavily involved in the Illinois campaign office in the last presidential elections as 10 year olds. A friend of mine earned money being a scuba diving instructor before and during college.

 

https://www.padi.com/scuba-diving/padi-courses/course-catalog/specialty-diver/deep-diver/

 

The chance of selection for an astronaut is 1 to 1300 according to my NOVA news feed, the chance of president is undoubtably low but chance of being a politician is high. Deep sea diving has no barrier to entry other that costs which is not on the high side if you are already near dive sites.

 

ETA:

Many elementary kids aspire to be as rich as Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg and there are free entrepreneurship workshops for kids teaching them how to write a business plan and sell their ideas to venture capitalist.

 

The career question comes up once a year in public school K-8 during career week. Probably many wants to be an entrepreneur.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Arcadia

[sweetpea3829]

Start with scuba diving and work towards deep sea diving and diving certifications and tag along for campaigns :lol:

I do have friends whose kids were heavily involved in the Illinois campaign office in the last presidential elections as 10 year olds. A friend of mine earned money being a scuba diving instructor before and during college.

 

https://www.padi.com/scuba-diving/padi-courses/course-catalog/specialty-diver/deep-diver/

 

The chance of selection for an astronaut is 1 to 1300 according to my NOVA news feed, the chance of president is undoubtably low but chance of being a politician is high. Deep sea diving has no barrier to entry other that costs which is not on the high side if you are already near dive sites.

 

LOL!  We're land-locked!  Actually...that isn't entirely true.  We live in the Fingerlakes...I'm sure he could learn quite readily in one of the lakes....and Seneca Lake is very deep.  I believe the Navy has some kind of something or other they do at the bottom of Seneca.  

 

We are originally from RI.  I guess moving out of the Ocean State was a mistake!  If only I could have foreseen the future...we could have stayed and I could have started him on a deep sea diving track when he was a toddler!  

 

Oh wait...back then he wanted to be a heart surgeon.  

[J-rap]

Maybe we are out of the loop, but I have not seen that as an 8th grade girl issue at all.  My four girls had a pretty wide circle of friends in 8th grade, many public schooled, and this didn't seem to be a concern yet at that age.  I wonder if it depends on where you live.  We are in a small Midwestern town.

[Joker]

We're in a small Midwestern town as well. Yesterday, my 8th grade dd spent her math class using the scores from one normed test to calculate what her SAT scores will be and what colleges she can get into based on those scores. We made sure she understood how ridiculous we think that is. She also had to meet with her high school counselor to go over schedules and the first question she was asked was what she wanted for a career and where did she want to go to college. She feels everyone knows already so she is behind. We again had to point out how ridiculous it is at this stage.

[Janeway]

It is pitiful in my opinion, that these girls are so freaked out about this. I find the article to be a bit condescending. The boys are not stressed by having an academic plan, but the wee girls are? Perhaps their period took the blood from their brains and planning classes is just too derned much for them. (That was meant to be sarcastic). 

 

The situation is no different than it was 30 years ago. Either you are on a college bound track or you are not. Some kids will start with a college prep track and drop from it. They can still go to college with average level classes, they will just chose not to continue down the path of AP and such. Kids who freak out like the girls interviewed probably are not the ones that will end up taking AP classes in the end.

[sweetpea3829]

Actually, I have seen a bit of this, but not in the sense that is stressing out the students. It may be, but we aren't in the schools so I don't know.

 

What I do know is that I was told if I wish to ever enroll my son in our high school's STEM track in high school, he'll need to enroll in public school in 7th grade and begin the track then. He cannot test in at a later grade.

 

Personally, I find this to be ridiculous and I'm going to object to the school board. What if we had relocated from another district?

 

Their argument is that he won't have taken the right courses in middle school to meet the needs of the high school stem track. But that's bunk, and not for nothing, he will likely have taken those courses and then some, because he is ahead of grade level.

[Kuovonne]

It is a real issue in some places. Our regular local high school is bad.

One of the few afordable alternatives is a special public highschool that

requires you to basically declare a major when you apply. If you don't get

in as a freshman, you have practically no chance of getting in later. Lots of

kids are turned down, and there is a waiting list. These are *not* rich families

or families looking for AP classes. Just regular people trying to keep their

kids safe while they get a decent education.

 

The next school district over is a very different story. They have a special

'academy' in the public high school. The kids can have a regular college

prep track, including AP classes if they wish. Many of them don't know what

they want to do when they grow up, even as seniors.

[Tree Frog]

I had similar. I clearly recall a class in 8th grade being given a list of all the classes the high school had and an entire class plus homework over the weekend was devoted to us creating our four year high school plan and writing out why and how it would lead to our life goals. And this was well over a decade ago in a south Ohio middle school that led into a high school more known for drug issues, pregnancies and bomb threats than academic rigor near no elite Unis. It was just treated as what we should already know. I remember making the perfect uber-hard college-prep four year plan and struggling to explain why because my only reason was wanting to get out of there which they weren't too fond of. That idea that it is worse now than then make my stomach twist.

I also did a 4 year plan on high school. But if I wanted to try something different as an upperclassman, I could. The way it is for my son now is that if he wants to try something other than a math or science endorsement as a sophomore or junior, he would likely lose the endorsement because he wouldn't take the pre req for the class the following year. I believe it also could change what kind of diploma he would receive. As it is, he's having a hard time fitting band into his classes. If he hadn't taken alg 1 and geometry in middle school, he couldn't do a math endorsement and continue in band. That's what I don't like to see limited--because he's a stem kid who happens to also love band. I don't believe he should need to choose between them at the end of 8th grade.

 

Please forgive any typos. I'm on my phone and a little more difficult to type.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

In Germany, there are many different possibilities for late bloomers and no doors are actually closed.

There are opportunities to switch tracks at certain points during the school career (details depend on state).

The not-college track kids graduate after 10th grade, the college prep after 12th (or 13ths in some states).. There are 3 year programs where a late bloomer graduating from 10th and wanting to go to college can complete the college prep diploma and essentially only lose one year. My niece did this; she had to stay in school just one year longer and then attended a university just like the kids who did the college prep track right away.

 

Also, any student wanting to attend college can apply sit the examination for the college prep high school final (Abitur) without ever having attended a college prep school or program.

 

The perception that doors are closed at an early age is incorrect. It just requires some initiative.

 

Our distant cousin is a teacher in a technical subject in Germany.  I'm not forgetting if she is the high school level or at a Volkshochschul.  When their son got old enough that they needed to pick a path for him, they very intentionally picked a Gesamtschul so that he would have some flexibility to shift as his abilities and interests dictated.  Our cousin said she thought that this type of school was growing more popular at least in their part of Germany.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

My word, how many adults are working in the field they wanted to work in as an 8th grader?

 

Should I start positioning my 9 yr old to work in the fields he thinks he wants to work in? What's the appropriate track for a kid who wants to be a deep sea diver AND an astronaut? Oh and the President, too.

 

The application window for astronaut was recently open.  DS3 and I read through the job description on the USAJobs website.  I loved how much detail the job listing had, and that it was the same listing site that has all kinds of other government jobs.

 

I was especially tickled by the observation that astronaut candidates had to be willing to travel.

https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/ViewDetails/423817000/

[sweetpea3829]

The application window for astronaut was recently open. DS3 and I read through the job description on the USAJobs website. I loved how much detail the job listing had, and that it was the same listing site that has all kinds of other government jobs.

 

I was especially tickled by the observation that astronaut candidates had to be willing to travel.

https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/ViewDetails/423817000/

 

That's quite the salary range! I wonder if the upper limits are reserved for those candidates that come from certain schools.....

[Sebastian (a lady)]

That's quite the salary range! I wonder if the upper limits are reserved for those candidates that come from certain schools.....

 

I think in the fine print towards the bottom there was an explanation that astronauts who are still serving military officers are paid according to their military rank, time in service and special pays (flight pay, foreign language pay, etc).  Non-military astronauts are GS employees and would be paid according to that pay scale.

[sweetpea3829]

I think in the fine print towards the bottom there was an explanation that astronauts who are still serving military officers are paid according to their military rank, time in service and special pays (flight pay, foreign language pay, etc).  Non-military astronauts are GS employees and would be paid according to that pay scale.

 

 

Hehe...it was tongue in cheek because of the content of this thread.  ;-)  

[Mrs Twain]

Certainly kids do not need to have their whole lives planned out before high school in order to be a success. On the other hand, 8th grade is a little late to begin for certain pathways. Two of my kids have had a clear plan since about 5th/6th because one wants to go to a service academy, and the other wants to go to a magnet science high school +/- an Ivy League college.

[8filltheheart]

Thought I'd share these articles for any interested:

 

http://www.wsj.com/video/news-hub-state-schools-top-recruiter-rankings/E646CE3E-4F94-48EF-A73F-66A1E0E91503.html?mod=yahoo_free

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/pf_article_110656.html

[Arcadia]

I haven't watch the WSJ video but the yahoo article does enforce the name brand idea among parents.

 

This part is why local parents here aim for UCB as one of their choices for their kids

 

"Recruiters say graduates of top public universities are often among the most prepared and well-rounded academically, and companies have found they fit well into their corporate cultures and over time have the best track record in their firms."

 

This too is why parents are cautious.

 

" GE, for example, focuses on about 40 key schools—many of them state schools—to hire 2,200 summer interns; upwards of 80% of its new-graduate hires come from its internship pool, said Mr. Canale."

 

"The University of Michigan (No. 7) "was a huge selling point" in Google Inc.'s (NasdaqGS: GOOG - News) decision to open a sales and operations office in Ann Arbor, Mich., in September 2006, said recruiting manager Kyle Ewing. The company also opened an office in Pittsburgh where it hires computer-science graduates from Carnegie Mellon University (No. 10 overall, No. 1 for computer science), for the same reason."

[madteaparty]

 

Definitely tech firms out here limit the universities that they recruit from and throw out applications from a lot of places.  That is well known, at least locally.

this is also the case with (say) bulge bracket banks and large consulting firms. And the list of universities gets even shorter during a financial crisis...

 

My kid is going to be the proverbial English major, and that's fine, but I might give strong advice when it comes to choosing a graduate program,  just based on life experience.

[Tsuga]

I was confused about the "these days" part.... I remember a lot of concern the year before high school on selecting the school and the courses etc and that being influenced by what you wanted to do as an adult..... and that wasn't yesterday by any means....

 

Sent from my SM-T530NU using Tapatalk

 

By 8th grade I was very concerned about my future. We are not Asian, we are not rich. But I wanted to go to college and I believed that I needed to be at the top of my class to get scholarships.

 

 

 

On the other hand, 8th grade is a little late to begin for certain pathways. Two of my kids have had a clear plan since about 5th/6th because one wants to go to a service academy, and the other wants to go to a magnet science high school +/- an Ivy League college.

 

Yeah, you have to be really, really smart to make up for the math. My partner was kept in a magnet school through eighth. He had to take five sciences and five maths in HS to get where I was in virtue of just following the path set for me in 4th.