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WTMA WWS vs. WH FOEW


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Anyone have experience with both? Either? I am trying to decide for next year and with it, our middle school writing sequence.

 

We plan to do omnibus either through VP self paced or WH's Great Concersation classes. (7th grade+) I like that I have read WH FOEW can tie into that...

 

Why would one choose one class/sequence over the other?

 

From what I have seen of WH FOEW, it looks as though it is better for 7th grade so we would do something else for 6th. But what? Also, it appears WH covers writing and grammar? I am concerned about a 2 class per week course able to adequately cover both subjects...

 

Any help understanding either or both sequences would be appreciated!

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From what I have seen of WH FOEW, it looks as though it is better for 7th grade so we would do something else for 6th. But what? Also, it appears WH covers writing and grammar? I am concerned about a 2 class per week course able to adequately cover both subjects...

 

I've looked into FOEW fairly closely. My understanding is the grammar portion is only at the very beginning - just the first quarter or part of the first quarter - as a refresher or solidification for those coming in with weak grammar backgrounds. I believe it is mostly writing-with-literature or writing-through-literature-analysis.

 

We'll be going into FOEW with some of WWS under our belt already.

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I've looked into FOEW fairly closely. My understanding is the grammar portion is only at the very beginning - just the first quarter or part of the first quarter - as a refresher or solidification for those coming in with weak grammar backgrounds. I believe it is mostly writing-with-literature or writing-through-literature-analysis.

 

We'll be going into FOEW with some of WWS under our belt already.

Thank you. I'm wondering about doing a WWS 1 to FOEW progression...

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Thank you. I'm wondering about doing a WWS 1 to FOEW progression...

 

FOEW seems to require a more mature writer/mind. DD is now in EW1 and will likely be in EW2 for next year, 6th grade. I'm glad we will have some WWS background before learning how to write persuasively. Initially I was planning to jump ship from EW1 to either TPS Narnia or FOEW or something else. The writing in WWS1 has intensified in week 22, and although DD is more of a natural writer than a hesitant one, she still needs more writing experience, and I'm beginning to see how SWB's writing program can benefit her. You probably know that it's a parts to whole program. I did wonder about it a couple of weeks ago and started to read through threads from others who have used it, looked at samples for WWS2 and WWS3, and reread the massive writing thread by Ruth. I like the fact that WWS is very specific when it comes to these tools to be used in expository essays. Maybe it comes naturally for some writers. I think an older middle school student will benefit more from FOEW than a 6th grader. If you want to email Cindy Lange about your specific situation, she is very responsive and will probably give you her phone number so that you can discuss it with her.  

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My DD is currently enrolled in WTMA's Expository Writing 1 with Tom Hummel. It has been a smashing success, and we'll definitely continue with Expository Writing 2 next year. However, I'm really drawn to FOEW at WHA. What I like about it is that it would cover both literature and writing. I think, at least for us, it probably fits in after WWS 2. 

 

We are doing AG over two years, so she'll be finished with that after next year and will just use the high school reinforcement books. It seems like you would want a student mostly finished with grammar before beginning FOEW.

 

So, I think the sequence for my DD will be:

6th (age 10/11): AG + Expository Writing 1 + Literature class 

7Th (age 11/12): AG + Expository Writing 2 + Literature class 

8Th (age 12/13): Maybe FOEW + AG HS reinforcement book or maybe I'll just decide to stick with WTMA at that point!

 

 

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I am starting to get a bit concerned after reading this thread if FOEW is too advanced. We have done WWS1 and DS 12 wants something different for a year. I signed up for FOEW but am now wondering if persuasive writing will prove to be too difficult for him. Is there somebody who has taken the class that can weigh in. For reference, he has taken the LL8 class with online G3 and done well. 

Also we do not plan to take the Great Conversations class. Is skipping that going to affect the writing class? Appreciate all opinions.

Thanks, Ann.  

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I am starting to get a bit concerned after reading this thread if FOEW is too advanced. We have done WWS1 and DS 12 wants something different for a year. I signed up for FOEW but am now wondering if persuasive writing will prove to be too difficult for him. Is there somebody who has taken the class that can weigh in. For reference, he has taken the LL8 class with online G3 and done well. 

Also we do not plan to take the Great Conversations class. Is skipping that going to affect the writing class? Appreciate all opinions.

Thanks, Ann.  

 

From what I gather from emails with Cindy Lange, it's more to do with age than writing background, but obviously, an older middle school kid will have had more writing. She asked me DD's age, which is on the younger side, but I gave her a background of DD's other coursework. The reason why I decided to not enroll this year is that I think she'll get more out of it as a 7th grader than as a 6th grader. And, I want another year with WWS. Initially I was planning to make it a heavy writing year - I tend to put more focus on one area each year - by combining two writing classes, but if we are not dropping Greek and other subjects require more time, one writing class seems plenty for 6th grade, especially since EW2 seems to require more from the student. 

 

Ms. Lange has told me that FOEW starts out slowly and ramps up suddenly, so her advice is to pay attention during the first quarter. It's her way of acclimating kids to her class. I mentioned this before, but Ms. Lange is so great with emails and answers. 

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Full payment at this time is $630 for the year. (No separate enrollment cost.) Doesn't include any student materials that you have to buy like the AG student book or literature books that go along with the course. (One book has to be a specific edition, it says.)

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Full payment at this time is $630 for the year. (No separate enrollment cost.) Doesn't include any student materials that you have to buy like the AG student book or literature books that go along with the course. (One book has to be a specific edition, it says.)

FOEW uses AG? As in Analytical Grammar or something else?

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FOEW uses AG? As in Analytical Grammar or something else?

 

The very same. Obviously, I haven't had a kid take the class yet. However, the description on the sign-up page says it uses the Analytical Grammar student book. I believe they only use it at the very beginning of the year.

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I emailed with Ms Lange about FOEW for my 12yo dd and she indicated that they would not be using AG next year.  She said they were going to concentrate more on essay writing and less on grammar.  She said they were going to try and do a grammar review of some sort but at this point were not planning on using AG.

 

HTH,

 

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I emailed with Ms Lange about FOEW for my 12yo dd and she indicated that they would not be using AG next year. She said they were going to concentrate more on essay writing and less on grammar. She said they were going to try and do a grammar review of some sort but at this point were not planning on using AG.

 

HTH,

Ah, that's good to know. I plan to have DD take it the year after next; we'll be finished with AG by then and wanting to focus more on essay writing! Bingo!
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Thanks for all the info! So, for those researching and/or having taken the class (FOEW), would a 12 year old 7th grader who has taken EW1 set up well for this?

 

If we love EW1 we may just continue on with that, but I want to keep my option open for her to do FOEW in 7th, so I want to be sure what we do in 6th will set her up well for it.

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According to WHA grade chart, FOEW is for 8th graders. I agree with PP that it is for more mature students. The reading list includes some solid, challenging materials.

Ds will be a little short of 14 when the fall class starts. I think he will get a lot out of it. Ds did WWS 1 very successfully at home and learned a lot. Then he did a year of IEW SICC Level B writing and produced many solid, good essays. We went on to WWS 2 and finished 1/2 of it before switching to Lively Art of Writing. Unfortunately this school year I enrolled him in a local live class which is equivalent to the first 1/2 of WWS 1. With his strong background, he would have done well in FOEW if I had known this class and had been ready for him to take online classes.

With WWS 1 or WWS 2 completed, FOEW should be a good class to go on to.

My youngest will be 11 3/4 in the fall. But he is nowhere near ready for FOEW. He did IEW Student Writing Intensive Level A two years ago followed by Jump In. This year he is taking a local class for IEW SICC B. He will probably take TPS Narnia in the fall.

Edited by JadeOrchidSong
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