Gym/Swim/Dance/Sports Moms...Encouraging Hard Work at Practice

[JumpyTheFrog]

How do you encourage your kids (particularly distractible boys in the 9-10 range) to work hard at practice instead of being half-hearted when the coach isn't looking? Also, if your child is in an expensive sport like gymnastics, does this change your expectations of how how he should work compared to being in a cheap town soccer league?

 

Tigger naturally seems to be on the underachiever side...getting away with as little as he can in his school, chores, and at gymnastics practice. At meets, however, it's like Mr. Competitive Focused Game Face takes over. Of course everyone works harder at meets, but this is such an enormous difference that other parents comment on it. It's definitely evidence that he's not trying very hard at practice most of the time.

 

He's going to be ten soon, and I realize that many kids probably aren't very good at truly working hard at practice regularly at this age. I want to know what is reasonable for me to expect and how much I should push (or not). Does insisting on harder work at practice usually backfire at this age? Do I just need to wait for him to mature a few years?

[Lady Marmalade]

Do you have any tangible goals for your DS with his activity?

 

For my dance boy the results come out on the dance floor- the scores at competitions and critiques from judges help push him to do his best.  Moving up to a better team is the biggest goal my DS has. 

 

There are other boys who are happy where they are and work hard, but don't push themselves.  DS has specific goals in mind with how he'd like to score at competitions, and what team he'd like to be on next year.  He works harder in class when he knows there's a chance he'll bump up to the next level in dance for the next year.

[JumpyTheFrog]

Do you have any tangible goals for your DS with his activity?

 

Yes, I've spent the last three years asking him before most practices which gymnastics skills he needs to work on the most and which he's improved on recently. For the past two weeks, I've offered a small reward if I thought he worked hard at practice. I'm usually not a big fan of rewards, figuring a good score at a meet is a reward for hard work, but I thought I'd see if it would help. Since I started the chance to earn a reward, I've been specific about what counts as evidence of hard work: sticking the landings, even during the warm-up time, trying skills he tends to skip unless forced into it, etc.

[blondeviolin]

I don't push my swimmer. That's why I pay for him to be at the good club. His coaches should be pushing him. I just want to be the supportive/cheering mom. If I felt he could be pushed more at practice, I'd speak with his coaches.

[JumpyTheFrog]

His coach agrees that he doesn't work hard enough at practice. However, under the current practice set-up, the coach is usually working with one kid at a time while the others are elsewhere working by themselves. This coach is way, way better than the coach at our old gym, but the set-up isn't the best for a kid who needs a closer eye kept on him. We've been trying to make up for it with some private lessons, where Tigger can't get away with anything.

[GeoKitty]

I have a fifth grade level 5 gymnast.  She is always surprise how so many of the kids, particularly the younger ones and the boys, fool around at practice and don't take conditioning seriously.  Yet, they all pull off great scores at meets.  When a kid really goofs off, the coaches know.  If the coaches have spoken to you about it, then there might be a problem. If not, there is probably nothing to worry about.  

 

 Gymnastics is crazy expensive - money-wise, time-wise, family-commitment-wise.  If DD didn't love it, work hard, and basically live for it, we would be done with it.  

[SparklyUnicorn]

Well, I don't know how much that can be forced.  Either they are crazy passionate or they aren't.  My goal for that stuff really is exercise and fun.  If they are goofing off to the point of being annoying to the teacher and other kids I'd probably pull them from the activity.  if it's not like that, I'd let it go. 

 

My 2 cents of course.                                                

[AmandaVT]

Honestly, as a former gymnastics coach, don't try to do too much. The motivation has to be internal. I can't tell you how many kids came through with parents who would reward them for good practices, or good meets. They would be the parents trying to catch their kids eye on the sidelines and would call them over during practice to speak to them if they didn't think they were trying hard enough. The gymnasts would be more worried about their parents and would wait until mom or dad looked away and then goof off. They would also not pay attention to the coaches because they were keeping an eye on their parents. 

 

Have expectations for sure, but it's up to the gymnast to be motivated to work hard and the coach to motivate the gymnast as well as keep them busy. 

 

At some point, the gymnast will realize that there's someone in the gym working harder and getting better results. At that point, the less motivated will frequently find some some and work harder. 

 

I would definitely point out that gymnastics is a very expensive sport and he can goof off for free at home. Or he can do open gym or even the xcel program (which frequently requires less practice time and less $$) if he's interested in competing. He's old enough to have some input for sure. Just please don't be the mom on the sidelines giving your kid the stink eye! :-) 

[JumpyTheFrog]

If the coaches have spoken to you about it, then there might be a problem. If not, there is probably nothing to worry about.  

 

Whenever I ask the coach, he always mentions how Tigger needs to work harder at practice (and stretch more at home).

 

If they are goofing off to the point of being annoying to the teacher and other kids I'd probably pull them from the activity.  if it's not like that, I'd let it go.                                          

 

No, he rarely causes any problems behavior wise. He just tends to get away with sloppy form unless he's being watched. Tonight I'm watching his practice very carefully and he's working somewhat harder when he sees me looking. He does love gymnastics and almost never complains about it - not even conditioning. He's the most energetic person I've ever met, so he needs a sport that works him hard. He's usually happy after practice (unless he's starving).

[SparklyUnicorn]

Whenever I ask the coach, he always mentions how Tigger needs to work harder at practice (and stretch more at home).

 

 

No, he rarely causes any problems behavior wise. He just tends to get away with sloppy form unless he's being watched. Tonight I'm watching his practice very carefully and he's working somewhat harder when he sees me looking. He does love gymnastics and almost never complains about it - not even conditioning. He's the most energetic person I've ever met, so he needs a sport that works him hard. He's usually happy after practice (unless he's starving).

 

Well see I think that is ok.  I want my kids to love stuff and work super hard at it, but sometimes they don't.  So if he needs the physical activity then it is accomplishing the goal.  He may get to a point where he wants to work harder and he may not.  I had one in dance for four years.  He started off very interested.  After awhile he realized he didn't want to put in the required amount of effort.  So he moved onto other things.  He has put effort into stuff he valued (this is my 14 year old). 

[JumpyTheFrog]

I would definitely point out that gymnastics is a very expensive sport and he can goof off for free at home. Or he can do open gym or even the xcel program (which frequently requires less practice time and less $$) if he's interested in competing. He's old enough to have some input for sure. Just please don't be the mom on the sidelines giving your kid the stink eye! :-) 

 

Yeah, he had a teammate a few years ago who would be paid for scores at meets. We thought that was silly. The good score is the reward of hard work. I've hesitated this long to offer even a small reward to encourage hard work. I'm not sure if it's a good idea or nor, but I thought I'd try for a while.

 

There is no open gym time at this gym anymore. The other gym that has it doesn't let the kids use the equipment. Boys don't have an Xcel program - they either compete JO or quit after rec classes.

 

He does love the sport, but emotionally/self-control wise, he's a few years behind. He's distractible and has many symptoms of ADHD. He seems to need someone explicitly reminding him that he needs to work hard at every practice if he wants to get better. I have to work similarly hard to remind him about having a good attitude about math, eating enough at breakfast so that he doesn't turn into an angry monster, etc. Some kids can figure all this out on their own, but he needs me to point out what it obvious to most kids. That's what makes it harder for me to decide what is pushing too much.

[TechWife]

 

He does love the sport, but emotionally/self-control wise, he's a few years behind. He's distractible and has many symptoms of ADHD. He seems to need someone explicitly reminding him that he needs to work hard at every practice if he wants to get better. I have to work similarly hard to remind him about having a good attitude about math, eating enough at breakfast so that he doesn't turn into an angry monster, etc. Some kids can figure all this out on their own, but he needs me to point out what it obvious to most kids. That's what makes it harder for me to decide what is pushing too much.

 

I think this comes in the category of making sure you parent the kid you have.  Since you know he is a few years behind his age in self-control (emotional control is a facet of self-control), make sure your expectations are appropriate to where he is developmentally, not to where you think he should be, or where his age mates are, or where a teacher/coach thinks he needs to be. He is not going to jump from the maturity of a 6-7 year old to that of a 9-10 year old overnight. Three years of maturity is a significant amount of life at his age. He needs to progress through the maturity of a 7 year old, then 8 year old, then 9 year old and so on. This may or may not occur one year at a time - he may make a "jump" and move through those phases very quickly. But, he may not. 

 

The other things you mention, such as reminding him to eat properly and to do his work don't sound out of line for 9-10 year old boy. He is still learning.  

[Dmmetler]

9-10 was a hard age for my DD. She was starting to get much more social and want to spend more time with the other kids, and at the same time, the skills were getting harder and needed more concentration. What helped most was having a coach pull her aside and set intermediate goals, and really focus on those goals. At 11, she now gets frustrated with the 9-10 yr olds :)

[plansrme]

Two suggestions:

1.  Positive Pushing, which was written by a sports psychologist.  The Amazon reviews are pretty much spot on.  After having a kid in sports for a dozen years, and two and three for many of those years, I've never been steered wrong by his advice.

2.  Boys are just flaky at this age.  I think a lot of boys don't wake up and focus on their sport until they're closer to 12.  Some focus earlier, of course, but I've seen plenty of swimmers, especially, just sort of putz around until 12 and then turn it on and get really good by the time they're 16 or 17.

[nd293]

If they don't work hard at practice, I don't invest in expensive sports. Activities are a privilege, not a right. Ds no longer goes to gymnastics or ice-skating - he goes to the local leisure centre's indoor soccer 'coaching'. No matches, no pressure, just some activity and skills training at less than half the price of either of the others for double the time. If he ever expresses a desire to seriously work at any activity, I'll do my best to arrange it for him. (This applies to my older dd also - if her interest wanes she can take a break, but she can't keep going if she doesn't practice or participate enthusiastically.)

Edited February 10, 2016 by nd293

[Snickerdoodle]

Sloppy form will get you injured. 

 

However, maybe you need to drop him off and not be there during his session.   I've seen this dynamic before where the kid doesn't respect the coach as he should and always trying to catch the eye of the parent. 

 

 

[catz]

I don't know. This seems fairly age typical to me. My son is much more focused and invested in improving now as a freshman as he was as a 10 year old. And I wouldn't pull him if he were enjoying and otherwise benfitting from the activity. Some kids are more focused earlier than others which is fine.

Edited February 10, 2016 by WoolySocks

[Nan in Mass]

My three boys (now in their 20s) all were competative gymnasts well up into their teen. I just left stuff like that to their coaches. That's what you are paying them for. : ) Some years mine were more motivated to work hard than others. As long as your son is enjoying it, I would let his self discipline and motivation develop naturally. If he is a naturally energetic child, gymnastics is a really good place for him to learn that internal motivation. There is immediate, tangible results for his efforts, unlike, say, in math.

 

Nan

[Haiku]

How do you encourage your kids (particularly distractible boys in the 9-10 range) to work hard at practice instead of being half-hearted when the coach isn't looking? 

 

I don't. Sports are supposed to be fun. My dd has played hockey for 9 years. She has a lot of talent but is not driven in the area of sports. Sometimes she works very hard, and sometimes she doesn't. It's her activity, and I know from (my own personal) experience that when parents start interfering, it becomes unfun very quickly.

 

 

 

Also, if your child is in an expensive sport like gymnastics, does this change your expectations of how how he should work compared to being in a cheap town soccer league?

 

Nope. Hockey is expensive. I pay for it because my dd loves it and we are willing to pay for her to do something she loves. (My son also plays hockey, but he is very driven and always gives it his all. They are different people with different personalities and priorities.)

 

Now, if you're talking about standing around refusing to do anything, that's a completely different matter. But if you mean your son just not working as hard as he possibly could, then I wouldn't worry about it.

[Haiku]

Tonight I'm watching his practice very carefully and he's working somewhat harder when he sees me looking. 

 

There is a boy on my son's team whose mother has commented that she wishes she could put a headset in her son's helmet so she could talk to him while he's on the ice. She is waaaay too involved in her son's performance, and it causes problems because the boy is constantly looking at his mom and gauging her reaction, so his mind is not on the game. This happens during practice, too.

 

I would strongly encourage you not to give your son the message that your opinion of how he is performing is the one that matters.

[The Governess]

I don't have super driven, competitive kids, but they are both involved in competitive, time-consuming activities. My oldest will be 12 this year and she is becoming more self-motivated. I think with some kids, you have to foster that self-motivation, like its a skill that needs to be developed.

 

I have always encouraged my kids to set goals for themselves and choose rewards for when they reach them. They have learned how to pick goals (some short-term, some long-term) that will stretch them but are attainable with hard work. We talk about their progress and sometimes keep a progress chart. We celebrate with a small reward that they have picked in advance when a goal is reached.

 

I think having the child think about and set the goal themselves or with the help of a coach or instructor is the most important part. They need to be working toward their own goals rather than one that is parent-imposed.

[MysteryJen]

In swimming, hard work is more clearly linked to good results as kids get older. But at that age (9-11), there are always kids who don't work and miss practice and yet are fast. We try to promote a long view. We try to move the kids into setting their own goals by 10 or 11, so that I don't have to be super involved! So we make race goals (depending on age/ability) and practice goals. Sometimes those were simple and sometimes more complicated. For example, one year dd2 had a goal to to a flip turn every time in freestyle. One year, it was moving to a lane (without some friends) so she could learn to read the clock for herself. Sometimes it was adding a practice to her schedule. Ds3 had a goal this year of keeping up with the tallest kids (6-8 inches taller than he is) on every wall.

 

But in the end, goal setting and hard work have to come from the kid. You can scaffold and help, but it is on them. I recommend not watching practice, leaving it to the coaches. If performance suffers, then you can ask questions about practice habits.

 

Dd1 still sets practice goals (but I have no idea what they are). But she credits some new good races to her practice habits.

[JumpyTheFrog]

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I have ordered that book from the library.

 

I definitely don't want to be a parent that ruins the sport or distracts him during practice. I think I will start having him write down some goals of his own each month. It might be a good idea for me to watch less of practice as well. I don't want to do anything to ruin it for him because he really loves it and needs the exercise that 11 hours of practice per week gives. It's about impossible to find other sports at age 9 that how that much practice time.

[Haiku]

It might be a good idea for me to watch less of practice as well. 

 

I don't watch my dd practice because it's too tempting for me to give "advice" after practice.

[GeoKitty]

I do not watch practice.  If she wants to show me something at open gym, she will.  After practice I always ask her questions like:  Did you have fun?  Was practice great?  Were all your friends there?  Is there anything the coaches said that I need to know about?  Was there anything interesting that happened ?   And she usually just talks all about it.  

 

No awards either…. except I told her we would get frozen yogurt when she got her kip.  She got it the next day!   (And I have promised her a new leo when she gets her giant only because it is such a big deal)

And after competitions, no matter how she did, we go out for a meal or ice cream.

[Georgiana Daniels]

Two suggestions:

1.  Positive Pushing, which was written by a sports psychologist.  The Amazon reviews are pretty much spot on.  After having a kid in sports for a dozen years, and two and three for many of those years, I've never been steered wrong by his advice.

2.  Boys are just flaky at this age.  I think a lot of boys don't wake up and focus on their sport until they're closer to 12.  Some focus earlier, of course, but I've seen plenty of swimmers, especially, just sort of putz around until 12 and then turn it on and get really good by the time they're 16 or 17.

 

Thanks for the book suggestion! I'll be picking this up at the library, for sure.

[Nan in Mass]

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I have ordered that book from the library.

 

I definitely don't want to be a parent that ruins the sport or distracts him during practice. I think I will start having him write down some goals of his own each month. It might be a good idea for me to watch less of practice as well. I don't want to do anything to ruin it for him because he really loves it and needs the exercise that 11 hours of practice per week gives. It's about impossible to find other sports at age 9 that how that much practice time.

 

Thinking about this some more...

 

The teenage gymnasts I have known (my own and their teammates) all put SO much pressure on themselves.  At almost every meet, I saw older teenaged boys cry when they didn't do as well as they wanted.  The coaches said comforting things and stood between the boy and the audience until the boy got himself under control again.  These were the same boys that I had seen years earlier goofing off, not working that hard, the same ones I saw grit their teeth and keep going when they did something that hurt badly during practice.  Perhaps there is something about gymnastics that appealed to the higher strung boys?  At that point, with my own boys, I had to do a lot of coaching about gymnastics being just a sport, and work at keeping them from putting more pressure on themselves than necessary.  And my boys weren't particularly competitive minded.  Most of the time, they didn't really care that much about winning.  Their gym played that down, too.  It was disappointing themselves that they cared about.  It wasn't like that when they were little.  Some days they were inspired to try hard, but most of the time, they sort of put in the minimum.  They loved the intensity of gymnastics, the level of physical activity, and the stuff it taught them to do, but weren't driven to succeed, particularly.  I'm not sure why that changed when they became teens.  You may find yourself doing the opposite sort of coaching later, when your son is older. : )

 

I think probably there will come a time when either they are good despite goofing off, and the coach will tell them they could be great if they wanted to and put more pressure on them, or they will find they can't keep up with their teammates unless they try hard.  The problem might fix itself.

 

I agree about it being hard to find a common sport which works a child that young, that hard.  And that it would be a shame to ruin it for him, somehow.

 

Nan

[JumpyTheFrog]

The teenage gymnasts I have known (my own and their teammates) all put SO much pressure on themselves.  At almost every meet, I saw older teenaged boys cry when they didn't do as well as they wanted.  The coaches said comforting things and stood between the boy and the audience until the boy got himself under control again.  These were the same boys that I had seen years earlier goofing off, not working that hard, the same ones I saw grit their teeth and keep going when they did something that hurt badly during practice.  

 

Nan, thanks, this is so helpful! Some of Tigger's teammates at the old and new gym have already had issues with crying at meets (or sometimes even practice) because they are such perfectionists even at ages 8-10. He is definitely not like that right now, which is sometimes a relief. I wouldn't have thought it was common for boys to switch from goofing around to pushing themselves to so hard as teens. I knew that teens probably start to work harder, but I thought the super hard work of older gymnasts was mostly related to their personality (or the half-hearted ones dropping out around level 6).

 

Tigger can be incredibly persistent when he wants to be - usually when battling us about something. It sounds like it's quite possibly that he could put it to good use in another couple years without us needing to prod him in the mean time.

 

From what you've seen, did the switch tend to happen around a certain age? A certain level? Or was it all over the board?

 

Tigger likes level 5 more than level 4 and is always excited when the coach gives them a break and lets them try level 6 skills. Fortunately, he seems to be one of those kids who is more excited than scared of trying giants.

[Nan in Mass]

It varied quite a lot, as I remember.  That might be a good question to ask your coach.  I should think it would be a good sign that he likes the challenge of the higher levels.

 

When the boys were young and I asked our coach how they were doing, sometimes he would tell me they needed to work harder but he wasn't asking ME to make them work harder.  He was just answering my question about how they were doing.  And other times, he would tell me things he wanted me to do, work on something at home or whatever.  That might be something else you could ask - does the coach think you need to do anything or not?

 

The fear factor is a big one.  A coach told me that this is why they like to work with the kids so much when they are young.  One of my boys had a perfect gymnastics shaped body but didn't start until he was 11 and the fear eventually got to be too much for him.  The fearless and particularly coordinated one was also the one who was the least competitive (although plenty self-driven and most interested) and the one who grew to be long and lanky.  The youngest was the most competitively minded and self-disciplined (he works out and stretches in college, just to stay in shape), but also the most logical, and to him, when the risk of injury began to outweigh the thrill, he began to refuse to do certain things.  At the end of high school, he "retired" to the public high school girls team, where he whacked his feet a lot until he learned to bend his knees doing the uneven bars lol and refused even to try the beam.  (The coach recruited him for his vault.  He said his girls were all too scared to vault well.)  Anyway, our coach told me once that if he could combine my boys into one boy, he'd be Olympic material lol.

 

You could be really lucky - you could have one of those likable, easygoing, natural athletes who excels at everything they do without having to make huge sacrifices and without tying themselves into emotional knots and without the handicap of being a perfectionist. : )

 

Nan

 

ETA - My most persistent child was the one who has the most self-discipline now in his 20s.  That's a good sign, I think?  And my child who was the laziest and goofed off the most when he was younger was the one who was the most enthusiastic and the one who worked himself the hardest at gymnastics in his teens. So they definitely can change. : )  I saw others change, too.

 

PPS - Mine liked level 5 much better than the previous level, too.  That's when they began to really be able to do the fun things. 

Edited February 10, 2016 by Nan in Mass

[Mandamom]

Nan, thanks, this is so helpful! Some of Tigger's teammates at the old and new gym have already had issues with crying at meets (or sometimes even practice) because they are such perfectionists even at ages 8-10. 

 

I have to share that my daughter's team, gives an end of the year award to all of the gymnasts who did not cry at a meet, except for injuries. He has done it for 20 years. It is kind of a joke and we all laugh about it. The trophy is a bottle of Johnson's No More Tears shampoo (yes with shampoo in it) on a trophy base. 

 

Just thought I'd share. 

[JumpyTheFrog]

The coach wants him stretching twice a day, every day. Tigger needs my help to establish that habit. He lost a lot of flexibility after a summer growth spurt, plus we took a month off between gyms.

[Nan in Mass]

There were years when we all stretched together at home.  I reminded them of lots of things at home, for a very long time.  It is amazing how easily did-you-remember-to-stretch rolls off my tongue to this day lol. It doesn't surprise me at all that Tigger needed your help getting that habit established.  Or that you'd consistently need to double check that the habit was still in place. : )

 

When youngest (now a junior in college) came home for Christmas, he was excited to show me a really cool book he'd found.  It was an anatomy book for stretching!  : )

 

Nan 

[MrsWeasley]

His coach agrees that he doesn't work hard enough at practice. However, under the current practice set-up, the coach is usually working with one kid at a time while the others are elsewhere working by themselves. This coach is way, way better than the coach at our old gym, but the set-up isn't the best for a kid who needs a closer eye kept on him. We've been trying to make up for it with some private lessons, where Tigger can't get away with anything.

 

This kind of set up would really challenge my nine year old. My nine year old, too, struggles with social and emotional maturity, especially impulse control. She would really struggle staying on task, especially if she had peers to distract. 

 

My kids are Suzuki kids, where there's a lot of focus on parents as at-home teachers. I have a very hard time at group lessons taking off my teacher hat and enjoying my children play. However, when I can, honestly the group classes are some of the most rewarding parts of these activities. 

 

I'd really try to let go of your desire to push during group lessons and funnel that energy into somewhere you do have more influence, such as encouraging the stretching twice a day.

[JumpyTheFrog]

I'd really try to let go of your desire to push during group lessons and funnel that energy into somewhere you do have more influence, such as encouraging the stretching twice a day.

 

Yes, I think this is good advice. DH and I both want to get more flexible, so we've been wanting to have family stretching time every day. We need to do a better job getting in the habit.

[Nan in Mass]

Maybe you could have an audio book that you all listen to together while you are stretching.

[purplejackmama]

I don't push my swimmer. That's why I pay for him to be at the good club. His coaches should be pushing him. I just want to be the supportive/cheering mom. If I felt he could be pushed more at practice, I'd speak with his coaches.

Exactly this. I learned early on in our extra curricular life that I was needed to be the mom. That's it. The coaches can coach him. I find this especially true for homeschoolers, when we are everything else, just take w break and let the chips fall where they may.