Non mathy parents: which geometry?

[madteaparty]

WTMA w/ Aops

Wilson w/ Jurgensen (corrected, thanks crazyforlatin).

I had planned on the latter, but DS states he wants to stick with AoPS. I hate helping with math so my question is directed to the parents :) He basically has no idea of what he is signing up for, and I question the wisdom of dragging a kid through AOPS geometry when at this point he has no inclination for anything stem...thoughts?

Ps: we are doing Algebra A now with AoPs and plan to take the B class with WTMA. We plan on C&P this Summer...

Edited February 5, 2016 by madteaparty

[mathmarm]

Sorry I know that I dont qualify exactly, but i wonder: Can you order the book and let him preview what he's getting into?

Personally, I would let him try the AoPS class with the understanding that mom does NOT tutor geometry.

 

I'm just curious how would you feel if he wanted to read advanced/challenging literature but you,had already pegged him as a STEm kids and not a Humanity/Arts kid?

 

I will stop butting in shortly but I just want to point out that your kid is 11 and he is displaying an interest in a STEM discipline after having been exposed to a curriculum that is tailored for the M in STEM.

[crazyforlatin]

WTMA w/ Aops

Wilson w/ Jacobs?

I had planned on the latter, but DS states he wants to stick with AoPS. I hate helping with math so my question is directed to the parents :) He basically has no idea of what he is signing up for, and I question the wisdom of dragging a kid through AOPS geometry when at this point he has no inclination for anything stem...thoughts?

Ps: we are doing Algebra A now with AoPs and plan to take the B class with WTMA. We plan on C&P this Summer...

 

Wilson Hill uses Jurgensen, http://www.wilsonhillacademy.com/academics/geometry/

 

There might be a vendor who uses Jacobs for geometry. Oh right, Veritas Press online, http://www.veritaspress.com/browse-by-grade/eighth-grade/math.html

 

ETA: Is your son going to take the B class and AoPS geometry class during the fall? Or B class this fall with geometry in 2017-2018? 

 

 

Edited February 5, 2016 by crazyforlatin

[madteaparty]

Sorry I know that I dont qualify exactly, but i wonder: Can you order the book and let him preview what he's getting into?

Personally, I would let him try the AoPS class with the understanding that mom does NOT tutor geometry.

 

I'm just curious how would you feel if he wanted to read advanced/challenging literature but you,had already pegged him as a STEm kids and not a Humanity/Arts kid?

 

I will stop butting in shortly but I just want to point out that your kid is 11 and he is displaying an interest in a STEM discipline after having been exposed to a curriculum that is tailored for the M in STEM.

I don't want to peg him as anything.. I am pegging myself as lawyer mom that can do financial derivatives but can't calculate tip ;)

I find I'm carrying him through the trenches of AOPS and I want to lay down the load ;)

[madteaparty]

Wilson Hill uses Jurgensen, http://www.wilsonhillacademy.com/academics/geometry/

 

There might be a vendor who uses Jacobs for geometry. Oh right, Veritas Press online, http://www.veritaspress.com/browse-by-grade/eighth-grade/math.html

 

ETA: Is your son going to take the B class and AoPS geometry class during the fall? Or B class this fall with geometry in 2017-2018?

Both at same time, this next school year. We hope to get a head start on book this summer. I hope to travel 8th grade year so we are taking all the classes.

[mathmarm]

I don't want to peg him as anything.. I am pegging myself as lawyer mom that can do financial derivatives but can't calculate tip ;)

I find I'm carrying him through the trenches of AOPS and I want to lay down the load ;)

Don't sell yourself short. If you're a "lawyer mom" who can't calculate a tip and is able to carry (no matter how begrudgingly) your kid through the trenches of AoPS you've got some lean, mean, math chops girlfriend, whether you're impressed with them or not. :D

 

Again, I cant speak with experience as a non-mathy parent or as someone who's worked 1-on-1 with their kid for years, so you have to make the call that's best for your situation. If you are inclined to let him try the AoPS course but want to shield yourself from heavy duty involvement then maybe you could do a lighter over view of Geometry as the Algebra B course winds down or inter-sperse Geo with C and P. The Great Courses offers a geometry course that is like 30 video lectures with corresponding lessons in a workbook and comes with the answers in the back.

 

Also, by the time he's done with AoPS Algebra AB and Intro C & P he may be much more mathematically mature than he is now. Even mature enough to know that he doesn't want to do Geometry to that level of intensity when the time comes.

 

Edited February 6, 2016 by mathmarm

[Lilaclady]

AOPs geometry is tough. It is toughest of the introductory series. My dd did not take the class because she had a friend- very smart kid who struggled through the class. We decided to do the book at home at a slower pace than the class

I will say order the book and look at it and see if it something he wants to take. As far as I know they haven't split the class like they have with Algebra.

[prairiewindmomma]

My average math skills kid is using Koeberlein next year. Chalkdust sells it as a kit, or you can buy components separately.  I like the video instruction matched with complete answers for odd problems. Since there are plenty of problems to assign, only having answers to odds is not an issue for me.

 

http://www.chalkdust.com/geom5.html

 

We went through a number of texts (I have copies of AOPS, Holt, and a few others) and ds liked the layout of Koeberlein best. It is straightforward, adequate but not wordy, and isn't cluttered with a bunch of crappy graphics and sidebars.

[dereksurfs]

I don't want to peg him as anything.. I am pegging myself as lawyer mom that can do financial derivatives but can't calculate tip ;)

I find I'm carrying him through the trenches of AOPS and I want to lay down the load ;)

 

Do yourself a favor and go the Wilson Hill route.  We went there after AoPS Algebra and ds14 really liked it.  He can always return to AoPS for Algebra 2 as you planned.  Jurgensen is an excellent Geometry text and WHA did a great 'carrying the load.'  The teachers are very responsive to questions both inside and outside the classroom.  Ask yourself if you really want to wrestle 'with' him through AoPS geometry next year.  It is supposedly one of the more difficult texts they produce.  Sure, some go through it fine.  But every family situation is different.  It has to work for the both of you.

 

My 2c FWIW,

Edited February 7, 2016 by dereksurfs

[madteaparty]

Do yourself a favor and go the Wilson Hill route. We went there after AoPS Algebra and ds14 really liked it. He can always return to AoPS fro Algebra 2 as you planned. Jurgensen is an excellent Geometry text and WHA did a great 'carrying the load.' The teachers are very responsive to questions both inside and outside the classroom. Ask yourself if you really want to wrestle 'with' him through AoPS geometry next year. It is supposedly one of the more difficult texts they produce. Sure, some go through it fine. But every family situation is different. It has to work for the both of you.

 

My 2c FWIW,

Thank you, this helps me.

[wapiti]

Jurgensen is very straightforward and is a great choice.  I think it's relatively easy to figure out what the lesson is teaching, so that you could help him.  My concern with Jurgensen is that it might seem dry and boring after AoPS.  IIRC, this kid insisted on aops for algebra?

 

I would look at course policies, e.g. can you change your mind after the first few classes and get a refund.  OTOH, the AoPS online course would probably not be a great idea if he'd need your help - unlike using the book on its own where you can select problems, the challenge level is fixed.  I'd look closely at the WTMA class for AoPS with regard to how the course is set up, how much help he can get, selection of challenge problems and grading.

Edited February 6, 2016 by wapiti

[Emerald Stoker]

Just to throw another option into the mix: Kolbe does an online class with the Chakerian book.

[crazyforlatin]

Who is the WTMA Geometry teacher? I'm leaning towards this class, but I also would hope for a teacher who truly understands the subject matter. I think in other thread, someone mentioned group discussions - kids solving problems together.

[dereksurfs]

Who is the WTMA Geometry teacher? I'm leaning towards this class, but I also would hope for a teacher who truly understands the subject matter. I think in other thread, someone mentioned group discussions - kids solving problems together.

 

Hi, 

 

ds14 had Leslie Smith who was excellent.  She devoted the first ~ 30 minutes of the class going over homework problems.  She encouraged classroom interaction and discussion.  She would provide feedback on the proofs as well.  This included looking at elements such as efficiency as well as accuracy and logical flow.  

Edited February 6, 2016 by dereksurfs

[crazyforlatin]

Hi,

 

ds14 had Leslie Smith who was excellent. She devoted the first ~ 30 minutes of the class going over homework problems. She encouraged classroom interaction and discussion. She would provide feedback on the proofs as well. This included looking at elements such as efficiency as well as accuracy and logical flow.

Thanks, Derek, I was asking about WTM academy, but your comment on Leslie Smith is useful too since I'm considering Wilson Hill.

 

Derek, how much time per week outside of class should a student expect to spend on Wilson Hill's geometry?

[crazyforlatin]

DP

Edited February 6, 2016 by crazyforlatin

[dereksurfs]

Thanks, Derek, I was asking about WTM academy, but your comment on Leslie Smith is useful too since I'm considering Wilson Hill.

 

Derek, how much time per week outside of class should a student expect to spend on Wilson Hill's geometry?

 

Hm, I would say roughly 1-2 hours depending on the student and subject matter that particular week.  Our son just happens to be a slow, methodical thinker.  He likes to ponder concepts as well as work the problems.  I think this is at least in part carry over from AoPS.  But he probably inherits some of that from me as well. lol :p   So, he probably spends more time than the average student while maintaining a high A.  Though he doesn't do it for the grade, but for the understanding.  He just re-emphasized that with me today when discussing grades.  With Algebra 2 this year, I know he is spending more time than he did last year in Geometry.  I think its closer to 2 hours per day.   The main difference I'm noticing with these other classes from AoPS is the greater number of problems to be worked.  He had felt that was one of the weaknesses with AoPS, more conceptual development/theory with less practice.   There are obviously benefits with both approaches.

Edited February 7, 2016 by dereksurfs

[MAIMOM]

My older two complained about geometry the whole year. This year DD is using TT and has not complained once. I like that the instruction is given and then she is able to work the problems. The graded quizzes and tests is a huge plus for me as mom.  Just another option but it may not work with your plans for your DS.

[Haiku]

I'm probably not much help because I loathe geometry, but having a daughter who is very mathy and, let's face it, more knowledgeable about math than I am, I would suggest not holding your ds back simply because you don't like it and don't want to have to help. (I TOTALLY get it, which is why I chose TabletClass for geometry; I'm good with algebra I and II, but I am hopeless with geometry and do NOT want to have to be a teacher.) Is there a possibility of hiring a tutor for an hour a week to check in with your son and answer questions? I have a friend who tutors online for $30 an hour. He also accepts people on an as-needed basis, meaning you don't have to be a regular student for him to tutor you ad hoc. (I am not pushing him as a tutor; just pointing out that these things exist.)

 

I try to do what I can to allow dd to study at as a high a level as she wants an is able even if it is beyond my capabilities or interests. (That's why we will be outsourcing some things.)

 

Good luck!

[katilac]

He's only 11?

 

Why can't he just do AoPS algebra B next year? 

 

 

 

[madteaparty]

Thanks everyone, we are going with Wilson Hill.