...

[Southern Ivy]

Yeah, we don't call them chores in our family. Its not like "Hey, Jr. come do your chores, lovey" it's just tasks that he does throughout the day. Tasks that we intentionally guide him to do and have been working on with him for months.

 

But I feel like I can't win. Jr is both "spoiled rotten" and "a slave" according to some people. Its very tiresome.

 

Jr. does not want for anything. He has lots of stuff (not an EXCESSIVE) amount, but he does have a lot. Mostly in the form of household accommodations such as preschool furniture, toddler kitchen, a playroom, etc...

 

When a certain relative visits we get snide comments about him being spoiled/over indulged and then we get the double whammy of how expecting Jr to expend effort to take care of himself is some awful, draconian thing to do. Ugh!

 

I'm just feeling frazzled and dreading the Xmas get-together.

Seriously, who cares what some people think? Unless they are the ones raising him, they get no say. 

 

Your son does more than my 3.5 year old. However, she loves to help me and I let her. It sounds to me like what you are doing is similar to what I do. As I do jobs that she is capable of learning, I include her. I don't expect it to be perfect and I make a game of it. Based on your explanations, I don't think you expect him to be perfect either. :)

 

ETA: I think some are a bit bothered by the term "chores". I think it brings to mind that you are giving him a list and sending him off on his own to make his way in the world. Which, based on your explanations, isn't what your are doing. 

Edited December 19, 2015 by Southern Ivy

[Garga]

To me, it all depends on how it's done. If it's a fun game, then I think you're doing fine. If you have to get stern and forceful about it, then back off.

 

In my mind, I'm seeing you guys working side by side and it's all a bit of fun. But perhaps it's not like that. Perhaps the little boy is deeply unhappy and you're standing over him telling him he missed some crumbs.

 

If it's done lightheartedly, with lots of help and hugs, then I think your list is fine. Actually, I wish I had done more of that with my littles: had them clean more, but made it all into a fun game.

 

But if it's done in a way that seems to break his spirit, then back off. If there are looks of distress from him, or tears, I'd back off. If he's a little resistant and needs to be gently refocused, then you're good. But if it's a power struggle, then back off.

 

Is there anyone who sees how you guys interact a lot, whom you trust (whom you trust) that would give you an honest (honest) assessment of what it looks like to them? You don't want to ask a yes-man who will tell you what you want to hear, and you don't want to ask someone who is combative. Is there an objective observer who will say, "You're good," or, "Well, to me, DS looks kind of sad and upset when you make him do x."

Edited December 19, 2015 by Garga

[tampamommy]

This is an interesting thread. Regarding your original question, and now having read the whole thread, it sounds like normal things that many 2 yo enjoy doing along with Mommy or Daddy during the day. My children did some of those things as part of their play at that age. You also clarified that you don't call them "chores" and that you do these things together. Certainly I would never expect children to just "remember" chores. I would not do well without a daily reminder list of things to do myself!!

During their growing up years, my dc learned to all indoors and outdoors chores at various ages. I have full confidence they are prepared to take care of their own dwellings/land someday.

Having said that, when they began high school, I began volunteering to "take chores back" from them. While they still helped when needed/asked to, I wanted them to focus on their academics and other activities. It turns out that both of them had very ambitious goals, and a lot of time was required for them to build many credentials that would open the doors they aimed for. They weren't sitting there eating bonbons while I cleaned the bathrooms!  Given that they were both appreciative and hard-working, I was happy to resume these responsibilities.

Gently...there is a bigger issue here..I think one of the things you may want to spend time thinking about is the fear you seem to indicate regarding what your family members say about how you are choosing to raise your child. This is just the beginning of your journey, especially if you decide to homeschool Junior. If unsolicited/rude/inappropriate comments are going to bother you, it seems that you need to decide to either get to the mental place where they don't bother you...or strap in tight for a bumpy ride for the next 20 years. And get used to being stressed out a lot.

When my dc were young, I was amazed at some of the things that came out of people's mouths. I decided not to let those negative comments bother me. I just politely disagreed, did not get sucked into a debate about decisions that were mine to make and not other people's, and above all, did not feel the need to justify my family's decisions to others. What was also amazing to observe is how some of the more outspoken individuals turned 180 degrees on their opinions as my dc grew up and they saw how they "turned out." I am sure a lot of the older moms on these boards have had the same experience.

So with the benefit of hindsight, if I were you, that is the issue I would suggest you and dh come to terms on; over the years, it will become much more all-encompassing than just Junior's "chores."

HTH!

[Audrey]

Yes, there are, and child-sized dustpans as well. You can buy them in toystores.

 

I did not know that!

 

But then, I don't think it would occur to me to look for them there, just as it would not occur to me that dustpans and brooms would be children's toys.  :blink:

Edited December 19, 2015 by Audrey

[mathmarm]

So is your MIL doing the bragging and then other family members are getting up in arms? Or are the grandparents JR.s stays with during the day the ones causing problems?

 

Just so that we are clear: My Husbands parents are not the problem. In general my husbands parents and siblings are really good in-laws. Its mostly adult cousins who are grief-causing bastards.

 

Its a combo of things.

1) There are a few relatives on Hubbies side who have gleaned information about Jr from a combo of: visiting with either us or my in-laws (who babysit Jr during the day) and thus witnessing Jr. 'in action'.

 

2) Grandma is not shy about bragging on any of her grand-babies. (Not just Jr.)

 

3) The one who I had a big argument with is a "certified" Early childcare-specialist and a know it all. She has to comment and rate every thing that she sees our child do. She has advise about everything and if I am honest, she annoys me.

 

Also, I think that this cousin she knows that we are the 'weakest link' so to speak. For example, My BIL is a "curse you out first, ask clarifying questions later" type of dad. You seriously do NOT pick at or mess with his kids, ever. Or he will eat you up and might bother to clarify the situation once he's s#it you out later.

 

4) The other couple have both degrees/experience in child-related fields and kids ranging in age from like 10mo to 10 years so they "know what they are talking about" and can't be told different.

 

5) Hubby isn't phased by people like his cousins. He is used to them and can weather the storm of (nasty) opinions and be just fine. Me? Not so much.

 

I just feel so judged in general. It seems like I can never get anything right by some peoples estimation. I am either a-spoiling the bejezus out of the boy, b-ruled by fear (quick clarification, I mean for doing things like putting him in Infant Swim, or using a child leash. this is NOT in response to a comment in this thread) or c-some overbearing Tiger-mom whose kid will hate her by the start of preschool.

 

Its just a stressful and frazzled time of the year for me, I guess. Plus, I think I'm just dreading meeting back up with this cousin after I embarrassed myself so badly last time. I really shouldn't have even engaged her in an argument but she got under my skin and I lost my cool. Now I just feel like an idiot...

 

ETA: I don't know why this post keeps messing up. I've tried to submit it like 5 times, if this does not work then so be it...

Edited December 19, 2015 by mathmarm

[Audrey]

 

 

Jr has his own handbroom, it looks a lot like this, and he actually enjoys the whole "sweep the steps" task.

 

He plays on the steps a lot, often he piles up leaves, sticks and dirt on the steps. Since he was constantly making a mess in this one place, we started having him to help us clean up after himself. Eventually it grew to be a task that he looked forward to and he will get mad if he sees anyone else sweeping the steps because he wants to do it with his special sweeper.

 

As to how he manages it: He kneels (sometimes he sits, but mostly he kneels) on the second-to top step and sweeps the top step. Then he goes down a step and sweeps the 2nd-to-top step. Rinse and repeat until the steps are swept.

 

Again, in our house we don't call them "chores". They are just the tasks that we look to involve him in regularly. We do intend to help him learn to care for himself, so we don't see them as chores per se, I just can't think of a better word for them...

 

 

Skills.  I would call most of what is on your list "skills."   At that age, it is developmentally appropriate for children to begin learning skills like that which require gross and fine motor skills and which enable some age-appropriate independency. 

[ktgrok]

I can't imagine having a 2 yr old wash dishes as a required thing. For fun, sometimes, to splash in the water? Sure. But as a chore, no. I don't expect each person to wash their own dishes after a meal, so it seems odd to me. I mean, do you and your husband wash your dishes separately from each other? If not, why does your son?

 

 

[Audrey]

Just so that we are clear: My Husbands parents are not the problem. In general my husbands parents and siblings are really good in-laws. Its mostly adult cousins who are grief-causing bastards.

 

Its a combo of things.

1) There are a few relatives on Hubbies side who have gleaned information about Jr from a combo of: visiting with either us or my in-laws (who babysit Jr during the day) and thus witnessing Jr. 'in action'.

 

2) Grandma is not shy about bragging on any of her grand-babies. (Not just Jr.)

 

3) The one who I had a big argument with is a "certified" Early childcare-specialist and a know it all. She has to comment and rate every thing that she sees our child do. She has advise about everything and if I am honest, she annoys me.

 

Also, I think that this cousin she knows that we are the 'weakest link' so to speak. For example, My BIL is a "curse you out first, ask clarifying questions later" type of dad. You seriously do NOT pick at or mess with his kids, ever. Or he will eat you up and might bother to clarify the situation once he's s#it you out later.

 

4) The other couple have both degrees/experience in child-related fields and kids ranging in age from like 10mo to 10 years so they "know what they are talking about" and can't be told different.

 

5) Hubby isn't phased by people like his cousins. He is used to them and can weather the storm of (nasty) opinions and be just fine. Me? Not so much.

 

I just feel so judged in general. It seems like I can never get anything right by some peoples estimation. I am either a-spoiling the bejezus out of the boy, b-ruled by fear or c-some overbearing Tiger-mom whose kid will hate her by the start of preschool.

 

Its just a stressful and frazzled time of the year for me, I guess. Plus, I think I'm just dreading meeting back up with this cousin after I embarrassed myself so badly last time. I really shouldn't have even engaged her in an argument but she got under my skin and I lost my cool. Now I just feel like an idiot...

 

ETA: I don't know why this post keeps messing up. I've tried to submit it like 5 times, if this does not work then so be it...

 

 

Hmm... it sounds to me like you're letting other people's views on your life get under your skin too much.  I look at people's opinions like this (and that's what these people are giving you -- their opinions):

 

If you matter to me, I will consider your opinion thoughtfully and I reserve the right to reject it in part or in whole, or to accept it in part or in whole.  I will take the time to discuss your opinion with you if I am considering accepting something you have to say.  If I am rejecting it, I will tell you so politely, but in a manner that makes it clear that you are heard, but I disagree and we must agree to disagree.

 

If you don't matter to me, you and your opinion can go f--- yourselves. I may or may not state that outright to you.

 

So, what you need to ask yourself is: do these people really matter to you? 

 

And, of course... that's just my opinion on how to handle it.  You can tell me to go f--- myself and that's okay, too. 

[ktgrok]

it might just be the way you phrase things, or they are hearing them from Grandma. 

 

"We expect these things and hold him accountable for them" is VERY different in my mind from "He's learning how to do these things" or "He likes to help us set the table/sweep the steps". 

[Guest]

That list is closer to what my four year olds do, but my to year olds can do much of it with assistance. They love helping alongside at that stage and it is exactly right to teach them to do it and get the taking ownership of th house and tasks as their own - children love feeling important, needed, and useful.

 

Provided he can manage them and you are helping I see no issue. Just ignore your family.

[Rosie_0801]

Its just a stressful and frazzled time of the year for me, I guess. Plus, I think I'm just dreading meeting back up with this cousin after I embarrassed myself so badly last time. I really shouldn't have even engaged her in an argument but she got under my skin and I lost my cool. Now I just feel like an idiot...

 

Do yourself a favour and don't apologise, ok?

 

Leave her thinking you'll chew her out again if she can't mind her business.

[Guest]

What Rosie said!

[maize]

I think your expectations are very high, but I cannot say for sure whether they are healthy or not without actually watching your lives and seeing how the relationship and interactions Work in practice. It is possible they are OK in the context of your family and your child.

 

While your relatives' comments seem rude and overboard, it is possible they are perceiving that your expectations are not developmentally appropriate for a two year old. They are certainly beyond what I would expect of a child that age.

 

So--I don't think anyone here can really answer your question, but i think you are wise to be considering whether your expectations might be too high. FWIW, in general I would say it is very appropriate for a two year old to be quite dependent and nudging towards independence at that age is probably not necessary.

 

Your child is very, very young; if he were mine I would just let him enjoy exploring his safe, loving environment and I would enjoy him being little; he will grow up soon enough.

Edited December 19, 2015 by maize

[MerryAtHope]

We use light-weight plastic dishes and before a meal, we set the required dishes in a basket on the table. Jr. sits on the table and passes out the dishes, and now each person gets a plate, fork, spoon, cup, etc...

 

Just so that we are clear, he doesn't set the table correctly just yet, but he has got the 1-1 correspondence down and each person gets one of each type of dish.

 

Sounds adorable!

 

But I feel like I can't win. Jr is both "spoiled rotten" and "a slave" according to some people. Its very tiresome.

 

It's not something you need to win. You get to raise your kids, and they get to raise theirs, and that's all there is to it. In fact, I would even put up that boundary, stating clearly and succinctly that your parenting isn't up for debate. "Thanks for your input, but we'll raise our kids the way we see fit, and you raise your kids the way you see fit." And pass the bean dip. My mom actually had a similar talk with my Grandma. She just simply said, "We'll get along a lot better if you don't tell me how to raise my kids." My grandma may be different from your relatives in that she actually respected my mom for saying that and did try really hard to not say what to do. 

 

I love the idea of using humor to deflect--sometimes that's something I can do, and sometimes it just doesn't come to me. Either way, though, set the boundary.

 

Here's a solution: 

 

"I like my kid and he likes me, so I don't care about your opinion, Relative. Would you like some bean dip?"

 

 

And you feel like you can't win because you can't win. If he turns out alright, they will forget they ever said anything negative. 

 

This is good too.

 

I just feel so judged in general. It seems like I can never get anything right by some peoples estimation. I am either a-spoiling the bejezus out of the boy, b-ruled by fear (quick clarification, I mean for doing things like putting him in Infant Swim, or using a child leash. this is NOT in response to a comment in this thread) or c-some overbearing Tiger-mom whose kid will hate her by the start of preschool.

 

Its just a stressful and frazzled time of the year for me, I guess. Plus, I think I'm just dreading meeting back up with this cousin after I embarrassed myself so badly last time. I really shouldn't have even engaged her in an argument but she got under my skin and I lost my cool. Now I just feel like an idiot...

 

ETA: I don't know why this post keeps messing up. I've tried to submit it like 5 times, if this does not work then so be it...

 

Cousin may have had it coming, and it may keep things nicer next time. Maybe cousin will have learned not to pick on your parenting. Time will tell. If you really feel badly, you could always pull your cousin aside and say, "I'm sorry for how I responded last time, that was inappropriate. Let's just agree not to discuss my parenting and enjoy our time together." You can apologize and set up that boundary too.

 

If I may...people are going to have opinions about how you raise your kids, educate your kids, dress your kids, what activities they are involved in...on and on. There will always be someone who disagrees. So, in that regard, yes, thicker skin is warranted. You can't let it upset you every time someone has disparaging things to say (or you know they are thinking them) etc... But I do think healthy boundaries are important, because the nature of the way they expressed their comments (purposefully insulting and polarizing) is not appropriate. It's fine to let them know that. And make some really good bean dip...

[Rachel]

I just feel so judged in general. It seems like I can never get anything right by some peoples estimation. I am either a-spoiling the bejezus out of the boy, b-ruled by fear (quick clarification, I mean for doing things like putting him in Infant Swim, or using a child leash. this is NOT in response to a comment in this thread) or c-some overbearing Tiger-mom whose kid will hate her by the start of preschool.

This is what I suspected. You need to have confidence you are doing a good job parenting, from your threads you put thought into what you are doing. Have confidence that you are an expert on your child and you have your child's best interests in mind. You will make mistakes along the way, but correct them when you realize it. Your child just needs to feel loved.

 

Don't listen to parenting advice from anyone else unless you ask them a specific question. Nosy cousins need to be ignored. Who cares if they judge you for doing things differently than they do, they had their chance, now it's your turn. Limit your contact with them if needed.

 

Think of it this way, do you let them give you unsolicited advice about your job? I doubt it. You probably have a few trusted people you turn to when you need advice. When they start to say "junior should..." politely respond that if you need parenting help you will let them know, then walk away. You don't need to explain your parenting decisions to anyone other than your husband and possibly the grandparents providing regular child care. If you project the image you don't want or need parenting advice, they will be less likely to give it.

 

Hang in there you are doing just fine!

[MerryAtHope]

 (with the exception of sweeping -- really?  How does a toddler manage a broom?  Are there teeny toddler brooms?)

 

One of my very first memories (which I don't know if it's a true memory or one from seeing the home video) is of wearing a little red dress and sweeping our front sidewalk with a full-sized broom. I was 1.5, and according to my parents I wanted to sweep. I'm smiling in the video. I'm sure my "sweeping" didn't accomplish much though!

[MomtoCandJ]

Yes, there are, and child-sized dustpans as well. You can buy them in toystores.

Yup the girls have a broom that used to sing (dd1 killed it when she left it on the porch and it got snowed on). I though about buying another one for dd2 because she likes to sweep the little area in front of the door

[Guest]

Let the comments roll off your back. Engage if you need to, to provide the person some acknowledgement, but do NOT let it get to you.  I had a person say to my face that DS would hate me in x years if I kept on the road we were on.  :001_rolleyes:  It bothered me for about 5 minutes until I realized that 1) she is not me, 2) her kids are not any close to being my kid and 3) so on and so forth.

 

You know Jr.  You know his abilities, personality and such.  And you know how your little family works and fits together and it's wonderful that you've found a way to get things done while engaging Jr.  Be confident and continue marching to the beat of your own drummer :)

[Guest]

And time helps too.

 

I got some of this from my inlaws when my first was little, but as I had more kids and they aged the results spoke for themselves. Now they report back to me how great the kids were hen they were over and what cheerful helpers they were, how polite, engaging, etc. They also gleefully report the comments of their friends who contrast our kids with their own grandkids.

 

You'd think this would stop the comments from them but they still opine on my parenting from time to time. Much, much less though, and now that I can see the kids aren't ruined I helps me ignore them ;)

[momto10blessings]

I probably shouldn't even be reading this thread because I can't fathom the concept of a 2yo having a chore list. :svengo:

My 2.5 year old most definitely can't wash her own dishes

[TammyS]

Repeat after me: "If you want to choose how to raise a child, get pregnant and pop out your own.  Shut up about mine."

 

That is the only thing that will ever work.  You are never going to convince other people, but you will make yourself miserable trying to explain/defend/convert/whatever.   Just take it off the table for discussion.  They don't get an opinion.

 

Do I think you are asking too much?  No.  But then I'm the hard*ss of all the parents I know, so don't take me as a measure.  And it doesn't really matter anyway.  You are the only one who is there with your child doing this stuff and you are the only one who can answer honestly whether you are stressing him out, or letting him slack, or asking him to work up to his potential.  No one else can, or should, attempt an answer to that.

[Laura Corin]

 

 

For example, if I am cooking and I see he has left his shoes in the middle of the floor and Jr is just laying in the floor coloring, I'll tell him. "Oh, baby, please get your shoes and line them up by the door."

 

 

I wouldn't break in on his activity unless it's really necessary.  At this age, you want to be building attention span - it's crucial for academic success - so any time he is concentrating, let him be.  'Just lying on the floor colouring' is the work of a 2yo.  Wait until he is between activities before asking him to move his shoes.

Edited December 20, 2015 by Laura Corin

[Anne in CA]

I think it is unlikely that your ds is going to resent you. You don't sound like you are forcing him to do things he is not developmentally ready to do, you are helping him develop life habits which are going to make your life a lot easier since both parents work. Resentment generally comes in when one child has to do things that other children in the family don't. That is not the case here and he is too young to know that most people do not expect a child his age to do some of the things you are requesting he does. So I don't see how he could be resentful.

 

Also, it sounds like you are watching to see what he is capable of before you require it. My ds did not have the motor skills to do some of the things your ds is doing and my ds was very advanced in many areas at that age. He *could not* have brushed his own teeth up to standards or emptied his little potty without spilling some. So, if your ds can do that I think, why not do it then? Just because many kids are not capable of doing it does not mean you shouldn't start off training your child the way you want.

 

You are probably going to run into a lot of judgement no matter what you do. It is part of parenting. I got a LOT of judgement for how I raised my two older children when they were teens. They were great teens and people complained that I was too heavy handed with them. Well, they were my kids. I was raising them the way I thought best. I would do a lot of things over if I could, but keeping a close eye on my teens is not one of them. Maria Montessori said that between the ages of 12 and 18 kids need as much supervision as from age 2 to age 6. I believe it, lol.

 

I had a lot of people who think I am too hard on my youngest now, and she is very responsible and independent and has WAY more freedom than my other two kids did at her age. I still get people who think I am a tyrant. Oh well. Yes, it hurts and I don't like being judged, but for better or worse I judge other parents at times too. There is a boy who likes dd whose parents buy alcohol for parties. I judge them. I will not allow dd to go to their house. Judging is part of keeping kids safe.

[Tanaqui]

But then, I don't think it would occur to me to look for them there, just as it would not occur to me that dustpans and brooms would be children's toys.  :blink:

 

Bizarre as it seems to adults, many small children do enjoy sweeping up. They don't think of it as a chore or as working (well, unless they have to spend all day on it when they'd rather do something else), they think of it as being grown-up, copying what Mom and Dad do.

[SeaConquest]

It sounds excessive for a 2 year old to me, but it really isn't any of my business (or your relatives' business). It also sounds like very first-time-motherish behavior. I called 911 after my oldest rolled off the bed during a diaper change. When the paramedics arrived, they more or less laughed at me. I also took my oldest to the ped when he had his first cold at 9 months. The ped told me that I needed another kid. He was totally right, but I wanted to strangle him at the time.

 

If you want to chill out a little, your kid will honestly still be just fine. If you are happy with how things are going, then carry on confidently and just let the comments roll off your back.

Edited December 20, 2015 by SeaConquest

[SKL]

I think even in this thread, if you hadn't headed it with talk about "my standards," it would have been read differently.  :)

 

As a parent, it's been a long time since I've had "standards," LOL.  My kids show me what they can do and I mostly go with he flow.  My goal is that they can do everything for themselves before they enter college.  :P  And to be considerate of others.

[SKL]

I'm 49 and I remember having a little broom and mop and apron as a tot - and many fond memories of using them.  ;)

[Gil]

Honestly OP, I suggest you practice polite and brutally direct ways of telling people to STFU and mind their own !@#$ing business. You are going to need to know how to do both if you are going to remain in the parent-game for another 18 years. In case you don't know, I am firmly in the camp that believes that there is nothing abusive about teaching your able-bodied child to clean up after themselves. There just isn't, and all the cute slogans in the world about enjoying those baby-days are not going to change my mind about that. I don't enjoy my kids any less because they are actually required to do some work around the house. Teaching my toddlers to clean up has actually helped me to enjoy my kids more as they have gotten older because they don't know any different and are very helpful and responsible around the house, thus allowing our time together to be spent being together doing things that we enjoy, vs slogging through backed-up housework.

 

I know I'm going to catch grief for this, but whatever it must be said. If anyone, and I mean anyone compared my child to a "house negro" or called my son "Cinderfella" I'd come perilously close to loosing my civic freedom. Just...no. Absolutely not going to fly with me. I'd have to think very hard about my sons in order to avoid a felony. Very hard.

 

If that is the type of verbally abusive BS you are putting up with, I would march into the next family gathering with my head held WAY high and not apologize because someone clearly deserved to be told slap-off and I'd be proud to have let her have it without strangling her. I agree with Rosie, don't apologize to the Cousin. I think it may be best for everyone if she keeps her trap shut for fear of being told off again.

 

Anyway, I'm going to assume that you have the presence of mind to give your child the means and support to accomplish each task. So whatever, even if your list was 2x as long, I'd say no its not too much for your 2yo, if your 2yo is doing those things. From your posts on this forum, you are clearly in your right mind.

Nobody in their right mind marches a 2 year old to the sink and says "wash your dishes" and stares them down until the task i done.

I'm going to assume that you are providing your child a reasonable and safe way to clean up his little dishes so even washing the dishes if fine by me.

 

OP, you need to grow a thicker skin, set some boundaries and relax. You can't be all things to all people, and your job is to be a wife to your husband and a mom to that kid. You don't owe random people an explanation, justification, apology, allegiance, NOR do you need the seal of approval of every jack-a$$ you encounter.

 

But really, who wants the Official Seal of Approval of a Jack-a$$?

[abba12]

I can totally relate OP

 

For the record, my kids probably have a comparable list to yours at that age. They don't do their dishes or set table, but they do bring in groceries and help hang their own laundry on the hangers and put it away, and they spot-clean the tiles instead of me mopping more frequently. And a lot of those self care tasks apply. I have a good friend who's kids do the same. In certain circles it's not unusual at all.

 

Most of this is done as a fun game, but, if they fuss and whine they are still required (gently, with encouragement)  to do it because the last thing I want to teach is that whining and throwing a tantrum will get them out of chores. Everyone pitches in at our house, even the 1 year olds. So they are required, and occasionally there is negative feelings, but the majority of the time they enjoy helping and find the tasks fun.

 

Try to avoid using the word chores, it has certain connotations. These things are learning 'independence' in our house,. the independence to clean up after themselves, get themselves dressed, perform self care tasks, it's all independence for us. So rather than say my kids have chores, I say my kids are learning to be very independent. (well, the older two also have a couple of chores now, but they're separate categories.)

 

As for learning not to let others judgment bother you, there's nothing for that but time. When my eldest was 2 I struggled with constant criticisms from everywhere. Now, I see the results coming from my choices, the things I said I was aiming for with my 'weird' decisions at 2 are beginning to show a little fruit now in my eldest, and it turns out I was right and the nayayers were wrong. I don't care so much what others think any more, especially the people you just can't win with, like when they say we are SO LUCKY because our kids are a, b and c, totally disregarding that parenting had anything to do with it whatsoever, and then they proceed to complain about how their kids are not a, b and c, all the while insisting they couldn't possibly parent their kids or deal with the issues the way I do because my kids are just sooo special and I'm lucky. My parenting is apparently wrong in every way but my kids are amazing despite it because we're lucky.... and no one sees the logical contradiction here? I've just learned to take 'lucky' as a personal complement from people who can't acknowledge that different methods have different benefits, drawbacks, and different timelines of development altogether. The latter being a concept that my mother in law still doesn't understand since her kids raised in constant fear of being spanked for any minor infraction were obedient from the time they could speak, and mine didn't become reliably obedient until they were 3 or 4, but both did reach that goal, and I actually saw my kids taking longer to reach that point as a GOOD thing because it meant their eventual obedience was inwardly motivated rather than based on nothing but fear, a concept she will never comprehend.  Anyway, I've gone onto a tangent here that has very little to do with your topic.... 

 

Raising kids is scary, important business. No one wants to feel like they did it 'wrong', so they try to pull down anyone who does it differently to them to make themselves feel better about doing it 'right'. Hence, the mummy wars. You obviously see that there are multiple ways to raise a healthy, happy adult and all are equally valid, so don't let them draw you into their game. You know what you're doing for your family, your household, your lifestyle, and that doesn't have to look the same as anyone else. 

[GailV]

Okay, I just skimmed a bunch of the answer, but

 

WOW THIS SOUNDS LIKE MONTESSORI! How very cool! I have the impression you're doing these things together, by the way, just like people pay a Montessori preschool teacher to do.

 

I remember hanging up little hooks for coats low down where the kids could reach, for example, but I never called it a "chore" to hang up a coat.

 

Yes, all the brooms and dustpans and other equipment are available in tiny sizes at astronomical prices in Montessori catalogs. Kudos to the OP for finding reasonably priced options that work well.

[Gil]

I did not know that!

 

But then, I don't think it would occur to me to look for them there, just as it would not occur to me that dustpans and brooms would be children's toys.  :blink:

 

Really? Do your kids play with mock household items such as food and dishes? Do they never pretend to clean their dishes or playhouse? I am surprised that you have never heard of them. My sister really wanted a realistic toy vacuum growing up. I don't remember what it was called, but it was red and black and in the Toys R Us magazine, it was pictured as having a light on the front of it like the fancy real vacuum cleaners  did. She knew the name and specs for it like that kid in A Christmas Story knew the specs for the BB gun that he wanted. She pined for that toy vacuum for 2 or 3 years.

 

I bought a very light-weight REAL vacuum for my boys when they were young (3 or 4ish?) because I had them vacuuming the floor.

 

[Jean in Newcastle]

I think that one of the best things you can do for your family and your own health is to learn to laugh.  If people start to get uptight about about a leash, laugh.  I did when the post office employee went "postal" on me when ds(2 at the time) was wearing a leash and told me that I was treating my son like a dog.  I laughed, told him that he knew how to sit too and told ds to sit, which he did happily.  Everyone in the post office laughed with me except for the embarrassed postal employee.  If they get uptight about your son learning to copy you, then laugh and point to how happy he is to learn to do things for himself.  Laughing can help you to not take yourself too seriously too which is a good thing too.  I wish I had learned that a bit earlier when I had my first child.  Because honestly, if he is happy and wants to copy you, great.  But if he doesn't, it really isn't going to ruin him at 2 years old and make him a slacker for life.  Being able to laugh at situations and to be relaxed about them helps you to make better decisions because it helps you to stay objective. 

 

I think the other best thing you can do for your family is to learn to set boundaries.  Differences of opinion are part of life.  Calling abusive names and having racist/bigoted attitudes should not have to be tolerated.  That is where I would stop laughing and would very calmly leave the party with my family no matter what others think. 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2015 by Jean in Newcastle

[nd293]

While I personally think that the list is rather extensive, it's also true that all except a few (the bathroom, sweeping and folding laundry came to

mind) would be done by the 3 year olds attending 6 hours a day at the Montessori school my children attend. These children would be free to play outside in the dirt but 'making a mess' indoors is not really part of their educational experience, and when they make it they most certainly clean it up.

[Jean in Newcastle]

The emptying the potty makes me uncomfortable for hygiene reasons for a child that age. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

dp

Edited December 20, 2015 by Jean in Newcastle

[foxbridgeacademy]

I'm feeling really stressed right now and I am looking for a (gentle) reality check.

We are always trying to nudge Jr. towards independence but some vocal members of my (extended) family think that we are pushing him too hard on the chore front and I'm tired of the snide comments and feeling insecure. I would like to get an idea if we are being unreasonable or not.

 

My son has excellent fine and gross motor control, as much energy as any 2 year old and can focus in spurts.

 

Jr gets support but he is held (mostly) responsible for:

• Getting his clothes from the drawer in the morning (we lay them out in advance)
• Brushing his teeth and washing his face (we supervise him)
• Post breakfast clean-up, which is wiping his toddler table, washing his (2-4) breakfast dishes and picking up crumbs from the floor.
• Tidying his toys
• Feeding himself at each meal (wiping the table space where he ate)
• Washing his hands when needed (still needs supervision)
• Putting books away in the basket/ on the shelf (very adept at this)
• Helping clean the bathroom
• folding his clothes, handtowels and towels
• lining up his shoes
• dumping pee from his potty (he poops in the toilet)
• sweeping the outside steps
• setting the table (unless we have a lot of guests. Duh)
• being a "good helper" when asked with misc. chores.

 

 

 

 

This is only what I'd do with my DS at 2.....

Getting his clothes, as in "go get dressed honey your clothes are in the top drawer" sure, but I wouldn't expect him to think of it himself.

Hygiene type stuff only if reminded and we do it together

I can see having him bring me their dishes and letting him rinse them, if he wants too.  Wiping off table yes, sweep up crumbs probably not.  I'm sure he's capable but this might be a bit too far especially since I'd want to sweep the floor myself later.  Maybe switch to having him hold the dust pan sometimes?

Picking up toys as a helper not as the main cleaner though.  Toys and books spread out can seem overwhelming.

I'd let him wipe down the sink in he bathroom, fold the washcloths, match socks, help sweep the steps and set the table. Under no circumstances would he empty his own potty.  I would think that would be plenty of stuff for a 2 yr. old and wouldn't ask much else.

 

Here's the thing though, that's what I'd do.  If what you're doing works for you then you might want to tell the family in no uncertain terms hat they are being rude, you are the parent, and they need to keep their opinions to themselves. After all he's your kid, it's your house, you should be able to do what works for you until it doesn't work.

[lmrich]

Just stop calling them chores. He is just being part of your family. You are doing the right thing, with the added bonus of spending time with your son doing those things. When my kids were little, they loved to help. My three year old once got a Barbie vacuum. It worked great! She was so proud to vacuum after dinner with her vacuum. 

[almondbutterandjelly]

Gently, these are not "chores" or "responsibilities" exactly.  Changing the wording will make it sound more typical and more realistic.  I think your phrasing really makes it sound like more than it is.  

• Getting his clothes from the drawer in the morning (we lay them out in advance)
• Brushing his teeth and washing his face (we supervise him)

          This is called "Getting Ready for the Day," as in, Jr. can mostly get ready for the day by himself!

• Post breakfast clean-up, which is wiping his toddler table, washing his (2-4) breakfast dishes and picking up crumbs from the floor.
• folding his clothes, handtowels and towels
• being a "good helper" when asked with misc. chores.

          This is "helping me clean up and fold laundry.  Such a good helper!"

• Tidying his toys
• Putting books away in the basket/ on the shelf (very adept at this)
• lining up his shoes

           We like to sing the clean up song together when we put things away.

• Feeding himself at each meal (wiping the table space where he ate)

          This isn't really even worth mentioning.  He feeds himself (I think even some babies can do this, can't they?) and then helps you clean up, as already mentioned.

• Washing his hands when needed (still needs supervision)     
• dumping pee from his potty (he poops in the toilet)

          Junior is potty-trained for the most part.

 

• Helping clean the bathroom

         He's such a good helper.  He likes to operate the spritzy bottle when I'm cleaning the bathroom.

• sweeping the outside steps

        He likes to play with the broom on the outside steps.

• setting the table (unless we have a lot of guests. Duh)

        Junior helps us set the table.

 

Edited December 20, 2015 by perkybunch

[Tsuga]

I'm feeling really stressed right now and I am looking for a (gentle) reality check.

We are always trying to nudge Jr. towards independence but some vocal members of my (extended) family think that we are pushing him too hard on the chore front and I'm tired of the snide comments and feeling insecure. I would like to get an idea if we are being unreasonable or not.

 

My son has excellent fine and gross motor control, as much energy as any 2 year old and can focus in spurts.

 

Jr gets support but he is held (mostly) responsible for:

• Getting his clothes from the drawer in the morning (we lay them out in advance)
• Brushing his teeth and washing his face (we supervise him)
• Post breakfast clean-up, which is wiping his toddler table, washing his (2-4) breakfast dishes and picking up crumbs from the floor.
• Tidying his toys
• Feeding himself at each meal (wiping the table space where he ate)
• Washing his hands when needed (still needs supervision)
• Putting books away in the basket/ on the shelf (very adept at this)
• Helping clean the bathroom
• folding his clothes, handtowels and towels
• lining up his shoes
• dumping pee from his potty (he poops in the toilet)
• sweeping the outside steps
• setting the table (unless we have a lot of guests. Duh)
• being a "good helper" when asked with misc. chores.

On multiple occasions a family-member has said that I am raising my child to be a janitor, he's going to rebel, and calling him "little Cinder-fella" which just really irks me. However, at a recent gathering an in-law and I got into an argument when Hubby mentioned that we don't reward Jr. for doing his chores (we shy away from punishment and reward in-general). She was appalled that a toddler has "chores" and compared us to Nazis, I don't particularly like this relative anyway, so I snapped back, I'm embarrassed to say that it got so bad that she was crying before the end cause we are "treating the child like a house-negro" (ie, a slave) and setting our son up to burn out from too much stress, order, etc...According to her, kids need messes for creativity, I obviously disagree.

 

Jr is capable of each of these tasks. He does not spend hours and hours cleaning, we are not beating and berating him if he does not do a task as asked the first time. However, he does not always want to do a chore. Sometimes he resists or whines, but we encourage him and help him through the task anyway. However, now I am conflicted about whether I am being too strict or expecting too much. Also now I am dreading the family get togethers in a week because I feel embarrassed and judged and I know that certain members do not approve of the way that we are (trying to) raise our son.

 

 

My son is not "spoiled" but he is definitely doted on. He is a badly, wanted and long-awaited bio-child of two working adults. He has many toys, clothes, books, and has lots and lots and lots and lots of play time. He gets loads of positive attention from us every day. He does not have "chore time" rather he does chores throughout the day/week when told. Nothing takes more than 10 minutes, but most tasks are about 3-5 minutes or less. But, he really does have plenty. He's a very privileged little boy. We try and keep a balance in how we are rearing him.

 

But what do I do? Do I ease up by lowering my standards of expectation for my boy, or do I grow a tougher skin? If that chore list does seem obsessive for a 2year old, then what are more reasonable standards for a 2yo?

 

Man am I dreading the upcoming family gathering...

 

I have no idea, but I know I did that in a dedicated way for about 5 years with my kids and not only did everyone say it was too much, they were right. I grew exhausted and they grew immune to my cajoling, begging, nagging, bribing, teaching, modeling, following-up, starring, talking about, explaining, etc. It has not taught them good habits.

 

It has taught them they will never be good enough so not to bother. It has taught them that if they whine for a full hour, we will inevitably miss at least one chore per day. I sincerely regret anything I asked them to do alone up until now.

 

I wish I had just had them pick up their rooms and let it be.

 

I feel I wasted hours and hours of relationship time when I could have just brushed their teeth and been done with it. Then they learn that's non-negotiable and that mom loves them.

 

Instead, they learned all the different ways to respond to my punishments, cajoling, bribing, begging, nagging, teaching,explaining and any other possible method you could find in a parenting book.

 

It was a huge mistake.

 

They are not in any way clean or responsible because of it. Like me, they prioritize books, music, and social activities over cleaning, end of story.

 

So, i don't know if it's "too much" but in my case, it was a total waste of precious time with my kids. I believe it may have damaged our relationships forever. To me, it's not worth a fight. I'd rather a kid who was bad at loading the dishwasher or setting a table, than a kid who hated their mother because "nothing was ever good enough for her" and I fear that we did set upon that path early on and I'm sorry about it.

 

Even now with academics it is HARD to back off. I'm trying.

 

 

[nrg]

Reading your post, the first thing that came to mind was the approach used by Montessori in the practical life part of education. Young children, when the tasks are presented just as things we do together rather than as chores or as undesirable, love to work hard and develop new skills and feel a part of things. Your list looks like a day in a Montessori class for preschoolers--as long as it feels that way and not like asking him to share in the undesirable tasks of life.

 

Changing your language around the relatives, call his day filled with "activities," may help with their understanding.

[SereneHome]

Well, since your 2 yr old does more than my 3 children combined - what the heck do I know?  I had a whole thread going on how to "encourage" my children to do certain tasks.

 

And as much as I wish I started with my kids a bit earlier - I think your list is too much.  May be not so much in the tasks, but expectations.  What I mean is - where do you go from here?  He is 2.  So what are his jobs going to be at 5?  Cooking complete meals and doing his laundry? Will he be mowing the lawn by 7?

 

I don't think there is necessarily a problem with having kids to do things if they are able to,  but I wonder where things would end up. 

 

I try to look at the big picture and figure out where I want things to be in 15 yrs - and then base my decisions on that.

 

As far as people saying things - well, I do the "polite ignore" most of the time.   Works like a charm

[SereneHome]

I have no idea, but I know I did that in a dedicated way for about 5 years with my kids and not only did everyone say it was too much, they were right. I grew exhausted and they grew immune to my cajoling, begging, nagging, bribing, teaching, modeling, following-up, starring, talking about, explaining, etc. It has not taught them good habits.

 

It has taught them they will never be good enough so not to bother. It has taught them that if they whine for a full hour, we will inevitably miss at least one chore per day. I sincerely regret anything I asked them to do alone up until now.

 

I wish I had just had them pick up their rooms and let it be.

 

I feel I wasted hours and hours of relationship time when I could have just brushed their teeth and been done with it. Then they learn that's non-negotiable and that mom loves them.

 

Instead, they learned all the different ways to respond to my punishments, cajoling, bribing, begging, nagging, teaching,explaining and any other possible method you could find in a parenting book.

 

It was a huge mistake.

 

They are not in any way clean or responsible because of it. Like me, they prioritize books, music, and social activities over cleaning, end of story.

 

So, i don't know if it's "too much" but in my case, it was a total waste of precious time with my kids. I believe it may have damaged our relationships forever. To me, it's not worth a fight. I'd rather a kid who was bad at loading the dishwasher or setting a table, than a kid who hated their mother because "nothing was ever good enough for her" and I fear that we did set upon that path early on and I'm sorry about it.

 

Even now with academics it is HARD to back off. I'm trying.

 

I didn't want to "like" your post bc it didn't seem appropriate, but I wanted to thank you so so much for sharing this.

 

I feel like I was doing exactly what you described and I am so hoping I am not too late to fix things. 

 

I hope and I think you are wrong and that your relationship with your kids is not damaged forever.   I think the fact that you realized that while they were still kids and made changes will make huge impact on them.  At least I really hope so.

 

 

[Audrey]

Really? Do your kids play with mock household items such as food and dishes? Do they never pretend to clean their dishes or playhouse? I am surprised that you have never heard of them. My sister really wanted a realistic toy vacuum growing up. I don't remember what it was called, but it was red and black and in the Toys R Us magazine, it was pictured as having a light on the front of it like the fancy real vacuum cleaners  did. She knew the name and specs for it like that kid in A Christmas Story knew the specs for the BB gun that he wanted. She pined for that toy vacuum for 2 or 3 years.

 

I bought a very light-weight REAL vacuum for my boys when they were young (3 or 4ish?) because I had them vacuuming the floor.

 

 

 

No, he never did play with mock household items.  It didn't occur to me that play needed to be an imitation of work.  I suppose he did do household "chores" with me as a tot, but it was with real things and he just helped (as much as a tot could). 

 

I will admit, though, that I did go buy him his own feed bucket, as he toddled around after us at barn chores and there was no way he was going to be able to lift 20kg buckets of feed like his dad, no matter how hard he tried. 

 

For the most part, I don't consider fake household items to be very fun toys.  I realise that many people have given their tots fake kitchen things and such -- yet still, the idea of brooms for tots leaves me bemused -- but I never did give him things like that nor would I.  That's not my idea of fun play.  To each her own, though, and you are perfectly welcome to make your own choices for your children's as their mother. 

Edited December 20, 2015 by Audrey

[Guest]

And as much as I wish I started with my kids a bit earlier - I think your list is too much. May be not so much in the tasks, but expectations. What I mean is - where do you go from here? He is 2. So what are his jobs going to be at 5? Cooking complete meals and doing his laundry? Will he be mowing the lawn by 7?

 

I don't think there is necessarily a problem with having kids to do things if they are able to, but I wonder where things would end up.

 

I try to look at the big picture and figure out where I want things to be in 15 yrs - and then base my decisions on that.

 

Huh???

Chores are not academics. There is no linear progression or planning involved. Chores are based on what's needed and the physical/mental capabilities of the people involved.

 

DS is still doing the same things he's been doing since 2 or 3, albeit now he can do them completely independently (when he's not being braindead). In fact, since he grew a few inches recently, I just added a whole brand new chore: taking out the trash from the can since he's now tall enough to lift the bag completely out. He asked to start mowing, but that's proven a little too difficult so I let him quit.

[SKL]

I am trying to remember what my kids did at 2yo.  I don't remember everything, but I know that before their 2nd birthday, they were nearly toilet independent, fully dressed themselves each day, and used regular tableware (no sippy cups, bibs, etc.).  I remember that when they went to group activities, the other adults were surprised that I expected them to do these things and to hang their own coat on a hook etc.  I also set things up around the house so they could do a lot for themselves, like get their own water to drink.  I remember them "helping" with all sorts of household and outdoor tasks, depending on what I had time to help them do.

 

At the time, I probably envisioned giving them lots of "responsibilities" by school age, but it didn't work out that way.  I mean, they have responsibilities - school, homework, music practice, keeping their fish alive, getting ready for activities on time etc.  But until recently, they haven't been required to do "chores" without being asked.  Our home wasn't set up for it, and it wasn't a big deal to me.  They still have plenty of time to figure it out before they face the world on their own.

[SereneHome]

Huh???

Chores are not academics. There is no linear progression or planning involved. Chores are based on what's needed and the physical/mental capabilities of the people involved.

 

DS is still doing the same things he's been doing since 2 or 3, albeit now he can do them completely independently (when he's not being braindead). In fact, since he grew a few inches recently, I just added a whole brand new chore: taking out the trash from the can since he's now tall enough to lift the bag completely out. He asked to start mowing, but that's proven a little too difficult so I let him quit.

 

To me, it's not about chores, it's about expectations.  If I expect my 2 yr old to clean a toilet, what will I be expecting him to do at 10?  And yes, to me, it's about progression of things.  I can't imagine my kid at 10 doing only the things he was doing at 2.  So, yes, *I* would be thinking  - hmmm....where am I going from here, what is my end goal.

 

But as I said - that's just me and I don't pretend to know what I am doing in this area.  But that's my thought process right now

[Tanaqui]

I realise that many people have given their tots fake kitchen things and such -- yet still, the idea of brooms for tots leaves me bemused -- but I never did give him things like that nor would I.  That's not my idea of fun play.

 

Not mine either, but when my girls were little they used to, no joke, clap and cheer when I said they could sweep up. Even today, with mopping, if I haul out the bucket it's "Oh, can *I* mop?" Sure, sweetie, you can mop. Knock yourself out.... :001_rolleyes:

 

I keep trying to remember that my goal is to get them the things THEY enjoy, not the things I think I would have enjoyed at their age. It's cute when a five year old gets Mommy a toy truck for her birthday because that's what she likes to play with. It's somewhat less cute when Mommy gets her daughter a doll because she thinks her kiddo ought to like dolls, when really, Little Sweetie asked for a truck... or a broom, I guess.

 

(Actually, I had a toy broom too. I used it to be a witch. My fun thing that I loved doing was dusting and washing windows. There's just something about those jobs...!)

[Guest]

I am trying to remember what my kids did at 2yo. I don't remember everything, but I know that before their 2nd birthday, they were nearly toilet independent, fully dressed themselves each day, and used regular tableware (no sippy cups, bibs, etc.). I remember that when they went to group activities, the other adults were surprised that I expected them to do these things and to hang their own coat on a hook etc. I also set things up around the house so they could do a lot for themselves, like get their own water to drink. I remember them "helping" with all sorts of household and outdoor tasks, depending on what I had time to help them do.

 

At the time, I probably envisioned giving them lots of "responsibilities" by school age, but it didn't work out that way. I mean, they have responsibilities - school, homework, music practice, keeping their fish alive, getting ready for activities on time etc. But until recently, they haven't been required to do "chores" without being asked. Our home wasn't set up for it, and it wasn't a big deal to me. They still have plenty of time to figure it out before they face the world on their own.

Neither me nor my friends expect chores to be done without reminders or being asked. Thats having REALLY high expectations, IMO :). In my house, the only thing that is truly expected is that DS will stop whatever he is doing when I realize something needs to be done. For example, if I'm cooking and the trash is full, I'll tell DS and I do expect him to stop playing/reading/whatever and come and take care of it.

[SKL]

And I also tried to remember when my mom started giving me "regular chores."  The first one I remember was when I was 9.  I ended up having quite a lot of chores by the time I was 12, including housework and baby care.  So I think my kids have not been ruined by not having daily chores since preschool.  ;)

[zoobie]

The list as you originally typed it out does seem...stringent? When you actually explain and break it down, it's a different story. I thought, oh. Montessori. He's just following you around and there's a running dialogue of what "we" are doing. My kids have all loved tiny sweepers and have been equally useless about actually sweeping anything helpful up with them. My older two went through Montessori primary and loved it. They were cheerful helpers as little kids. Junior may take a snarky left turn at tweendom, so beware. At any rate, I don't think people are reacting to what he's capable of, but maybe how his abilities and responsibilities are framed. It doesn't have to be a "chore list." People also may be reacting to a perception of uprtghtness and inflexibility. Try to relax a bit. As Jean said, laugh. You can laugh and set boundaries at the same time. ;) Don't take yourself or Junior or especially those jerky relatives too seriously.

Edited December 20, 2015 by zoobie