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CadenceSophia

Is it possible that JUST the IP books are enough for SM?

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I did RS with my now 7 year old son through most of B. There were some good parts, but on a whole it really wasn't working out for us. I think I stuck with it for too long.  After reading Liping Ma's book this summer we switched to Singapore. I did post a thread about it back, oh, probably in July and was advised to put him into 2A. Well, I ordered level 1 and level 2 and thought level 1b IP book looked about right. We spent 2 months doing that. He hadn't done many problems on paper with RS so his fluency and confidence really improved. It was a great experience for both of us.

 

Now we have moved on to 2A. I started with the textbook, workbook, and IP. He HATES the textbook. I couldn't figure out a way to salvage it so I just gave up. I did read the HIGs for this year but there is just no need to do the activities they call for. This work is too easy for him. Even though he had never seen vertical multi-digit subtraction with renaming, it took him about 15 minutes and 4 practice problems to completely understand. I don't just mean the procedure. His mental math is stellar. His only weakness is that sometimes he does really bizarre shifting to solve problems in his head. He doesn't always find the most efficient way. For example: he was trying to help his sister with one of her math problems which required adding 3 + 4 +2. She added the numbers in order left to right. He said "But *littlesis*, you could have just taken that 2, given one to the 4, that makes 5 and the other 1 to the 3, that makes 4 so 9. See?" He is good on place value and can swap hundreds and thousands with the same ease.

We have been doing 2A for exactly a month now and we are 2/3 of the way through by total page numbers. Or, I should say we are almost finished with the workbook and have most of IP left. I am sure some amount of practice in the workbook is helpful but on a whole it has been a real slog. Trying to finish more problems just to get to something more interesting feels like a really bad way to do math.

 

My husband is of the mind that kids learn through repetition so we should keep going like this. I at least believe in finishing what you start so we will finish 2A in the way we had planned. I am looking at 2B and on and wondering if we really need to do the workbooks or every page of the workbooks. My eyes are set on BA and AoPS. I want to get there quickly because he needs some challenge. I also want to get there with preparation. 

 

Advice?

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We use the IP in place of the WB. We rarely touch the TB (I do skim it and the HIG, occasionally, to make sure I'm teaching the Singapore way, but my son gets math intuitively and rarely needs the TB/HIG lessons.

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my ds sounds like your ds. In fact, I was wondering the same thing. He flew through SM 1 and 2 workbook. I decided to do the IP a year behind, but now I'm thinking of just doing SM 3 IP and not the worbook. I've been doing it the way booksandboys are doing it. We haven't touched the textbook since 1a.

 

I think he'll be fine finishing with wkbk 2a and then IP 2b before starting with BA.

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We really didn't start using the textbook until 3rd and 4th grade. Ands when I say isn't the textbook, I really mean, he and I sitting together and doing a lesson and a few practice problems from the workbook. Then I assign him some corresponding workbook pages (but not necessarily all of them). I take any extra workbook pages and the IP pages and roll them into his independent work throughout the rest of the year as spiral review.

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I am glad I am not the only one thinking this way!  I am not really looking to switch to anything, just move along better (and faster) to keep him engaged and learning. He was previously working a grade to a grade and a half ahead and now I feel like I am the one slowing him down, not that he's met his match. 

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You might want to consider SM's Challenging Word Problems. IP has some but not enough for my son to really sink his teeth into and really get that math skills work out/challenge. I just add in a page a day to our math session. We use SM and BA in tandem like several others on this board. I use BA a level behind so that the focus is away from mastering the basic skills and concepts and more focused on a small amount of review and a lot of digging deeper. The approaches are different and equally valuable to me.

 

Maybe toss in a little Zaccaro in there as well?

 

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Yes, I had my kids do the end of chapter reviews in the textbooks and the corresponding IP pages. Then we add some miquon and life of Fred.

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You might want to consider SM's Challenging Word Problems. IP has some but not enough for my son to really sink his teeth into and really get that math skills work out/challenge. I just add in a page a day to our math session. We use SM and BA in tandem like several others on this board. I use BA a level behind so that the focus is away from mastering the basic skills and concepts and more focused on a small amount of review and a lot of digging deeper. The approaches are different and equally valuable to me.

 

Maybe toss in a little Zaccaro in there as well?

We do CWP on the white board every morning. I just bought Primary Grade Challenge Math and am waiting for it to arrive :) Did you start BA after SM 3b? I am itchy to get started but I don't want to jump too soon.

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We had the TB and HIG from our charter, but honestly never needed them. My DS did the IP and CWP through 3A, then we switched to BA. At this point, BA is our main math, and, other than CWP, we rarely use Singapore at all anymore.

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My ds was similar. If I opened the textbook, he would tell me that he didn't need any help. Flew through workbook and loved IP. The word problems were hard for him though.

 

I did not do this, but one option might be to get the test books for each unit and just see if your ds tests out.

 

(When ds was in ps, there was a pretest before each unit. Kids who got 90% or above did enrichment.)

 

Btw, I like your ds's reasoning for the addition problem. I do the same type of thing.

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My oldest was similar to your son. We didn't use Singapore, but Math in Focus (similar approach) and Singapore Challenging Word Problems.  She zipped through. At the beginning of first grade she would ask for more more more math and then she began to like it less and less. She complained that it was boring and too easy.  It was. By Easter we had covered 1A through 3B (not doing every problem, just enough to prove mastery). She was 6 and a half when the first Beast Academy book came out.  It was a breath of fresh air to both of us. She was back to loving math and while we've played with other things (Life of Fred, Zacarro, Miquon, Math Mammoth) because of BA's slow release schedule, we keep coming back to it. This year she'll start either Jousting Armadillos or AoPS prealgebra (I have both) and I'm so glad I didn't hold her back and make her hate math when that and science are her two favorite parts of the day.

 

All of that to say... Find a pace that works for your son. Keep him challenged and keep it fun. If you are reading the HIGs to make sure you are teaching it properly and the IP works for you, go with it. Don't insist on every problem when he has obviously mastered the material and this:

 

We really didn't start using the textbook until 3rd and 4th grade. Ands when I say isn't the textbook, I really mean, he and I sitting together and doing a lesson and a few practice problems from the workbook. Then I assign him some corresponding workbook pages (but not necessarily all of them). I take any extra workbook pages and the IP pages and roll them into his independent work throughout the rest of the year as spiral review.

 

We did this too because some concepts just got a little rusty if we didn't revisit them occasionally.

 

Good luck,

Teresa

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You should not do every problem in any workbook for the sake of completing the workbook.

 

For the child you described, IF you are instructing him easily without the textbook the IP might be enough.  I'd keep buying the HIG for each level and keep teaching.

 

Someone mentioned MEP, and I'd encourage you to consider it.  It's similar in pedagogy to Singapore, but the layout is different making it easier to skip the mindless stuff he doesn't need in order to spend time on truly challenging material.

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My oldest was similar to your son. We didn't use Singapore, but Math in Focus (similar approach) and Singapore Challenging Word Problems.  She zipped through. At the beginning of first grade she would ask for more more more math and then she began to like it less and less. She complained that it was boring and too easy.  It was. By Easter we had covered 1A through 3B (not doing every problem, just enough to prove mastery). She was 6 and a half when the first Beast Academy book came out.  It was a breath of fresh air to both of us. She was back to loving math and while we've played with other things (Life of Fred, Zacarro, Miquon, Math Mammoth) because of BA's slow release schedule, we keep coming back to it. This year she'll start either Jousting Armadillos or AoPS prealgebra (I have both) and I'm so glad I didn't hold her back and make her hate math when that and science are her two favorite parts of the day.

See I think he could cover the same ground but not with all of the pages I have been asking him to do. In the last month he did 150 workbook pages. That is kind of insane and I am not sure he can comfortably keep up that level of output or that I should even be asking him to. 

 

You should not do every problem in any workbook for the sake of completing the workbook.

 

For the child you described, IF you are instructing him easily without the textbook the IP might be enough.  I'd keep buying the HIG for each level and keep teaching.

 

Someone mentioned MEP, and I'd encourage you to consider it.  It's similar in pedagogy to Singapore, but the layout is different making it easier to skip the mindless stuff he doesn't need in order to spend time on truly challenging material.

 

Haha whoops. I am a complete box checker. I'll have to work on that :)

 

I have looked at MEP. I am very attracted to the pure math approach but we decided on Singapore for this kiddo this summer. With the goal of getting into BA in May/June, I don't have time or desire to switch. I have heard that the higher grades in MEP make a nice contrast to AoPS so we may end up there yet :)

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My older boy did the IP *only.*  Never touched the textbook or workbook, and I did not buy the HIG.  But older boy is pretty special in math, so I have learned not to suggest his path to others.  But I just wanted to let you know, that yes, there is someone else who has gone that path.

 

Ruth in NZ

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I started BA 3 in September and started SM IP 3a in November. No problem so far.

 

But if you are a box checker this may not suit you. For my ds has done the multiplication section in BA, and he will probably skip a lot problems when it comes up in IP.

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Math does not come that easily to my kids, but I do not make them do all of the workbook problems if I can see that they already get it and don't need more practice.  So I would definitely recommend cutting down on that.  I would also recommend checking out Beast Academy sooner rather than later.  My oldest dd started BA after Singapore PM 2A and the first half of RightStart C.  My biggest concern would be his frustration level.  If he can handle frustration I would start soon, or at least get the books to be ready to start as soon as you think he can do it.

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My dd sound a lot like the OP's dd. She has no patience for the textbook or the HIG activities. The completely shut her down. She has the textbook on hand for her reference and we refer to it when needed. She is very intuitive in math and very inflexible when it come to teaching. For now, I am proceeding with the "if it ain't broken" model, really because I have little choice.

 

Because we use the US ed, she can do every problem in the workbook without stress. She also does a section of Evan Moor Daily Math Practice each day to review a variety of concepts.

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