S/O Guns and Open Carry...is it a right just for White Men?

[albeto.]

To do what?  In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

 

I would call the police in a new york minute if I saw that. They could sort out if are any laws broken, but in my opinion, that woman was in danger.

 

"911 what is your emergency?"

 

"I'm on Main Street, at the cross of State, and there's a man with a weapon stalking a woman. He's following her everywhere and she looks frightened. I would go to her, but I'm afraid to. He could kill her. She looks terrified! He won't leave her alone!"

 

And I would stay on the phone until the police showed up and hopefully persuaded the man to leave, or escorted the woman home. 

 

Can you imagine what would happen if every time someone open carried, the police were called to a possible mass-murder killing spree about to happen? Police have to respond, and that would put pressure on them to encourage the citizens of their towns to calm the f*** down and stop freaking out just because they see a muslim ermerged we're all gonna die!!!1

[SKL]

In the community I grew up in, open carry would not be scary no matter who was carrying the guns.

 

In some high-crime areas, it would probably be scary no matter who was carrying the guns.

 

I had to answer "yes, other" for the second part because I do think we could use some more safety rules for all gun owners.  And I'm not a fan of big-ass semi-automatic weapons no matter who is carrying them.

 

As for that photo, that looks more like intimidation than protection to me.

[SKL]

Is it really "open carry" if one is masked?

[Wheres Toto]

I've lived most of my life in NJ where guns are pretty strictly regulated.  It would be extremely unusual to see a gun on anyone except law enforcement and concealed carry licenses are very difficult to get.  Guns can't be transported in cars without being locked in the trunk unloaded.

 

Open carry would make me uncomfortable.  The "open carry" in that picture should be illegal.

[TammyS]

I like guns.  I've had guns in the past.  I don't currently, because with young children in the house I would worry endlessly (yes, I know I can keep them locked, but I would still worry, because my children have proven to be amazingly smart at being amazingly stupid).  If we had concealed carry available here, I would get a permit and carry concealed (probably would have to keep the gun locked in the locked shed so I could sleep at night) when I go into town.  I wouldn't carry open, not because I believe it should be illegal (I don't), but because I don't want to tempt thieves to follow me home to steal my guns.

 

I agree that many times people carrying openly are just being idiots and showing off, but I don't believe in making laws against idiocy.

 

The guy in the picture above, if it's real, isn't just being an idiot.  He's harrassing that woman and there are laws against it.  Put the law to work.

[Hikin' Mama]

I would call the police in a new york minute if I saw that. They could sort out if are any laws broken, but in my opinion, that woman was in danger.

 

"911 what is your emergency?"

 

"I'm on Main Street, at the cross of State, and there's a man with a weapon stalking a woman. He's following her everywhere and she looks frightened. I would go to her, but I'm afraid to. He could kill her. She looks terrified! He won't leave her alone!"

 

And I would stay on the phone until the police showed up and hopefully persuaded the man to leave, or escorted the woman home.

 

Can you imagine what would happen if every time someone open carried, the police were called to a possible mass-murder killing spree about to happen? Police have to respond, and that would put pressure on them to encourage the citizens of their towns to calm the f*** down and stop freaking out just because they see a muslim ermerged we're all gonna die!!!1

albeto, I don't always agree with you, but on this post I'm 100% with ya!

[swimmermom3]

I would call the police in a new york minute if I saw that. They could sort out if are any laws broken, but in my opinion, that woman was in danger.

 

"911 what is your emergency?"

 

"I'm on Main Street, at the cross of State, and there's a man with a weapon stalking a woman. He's following her everywhere and she looks frightened. I would go to her, but I'm afraid to. He could kill her. She looks terrified! He won't leave her alone!"

 

And I would stay on the phone until the police showed up and hopefully persuaded the man to leave, or escorted the woman home. 

 

Can you imagine what would happen if every time someone open carried, the police were called to a possible mass-murder killing spree about to happen? Police have to respond, and that would put pressure on them to encourage the citizens of their towns to calm the f*** down and stop freaking out just because they see a muslim ermerged we're all gonna die!!!1

 

My oldest son was in Civil Air Patrol and several of the fathers took the boys shooting and they all earned their NRA or whatever the basic gun certification is. This was pretty hard on a non gun-loving family, but we preferred that he learn about them responsibly, and not behind our backs. He was comparing the photos from the article I posted and the photo of the guy following the woman. "See Mom, this guy is carrying his weapon responsibly." He took one look at the guy following the woman and was like "Whoooaa, bad man, bad gun owner."

 

[Mergath]

Question about "carrying" -- suppose a person is going hunting. Does it count as "carrying" as they bring the gun out of their house, drive in their truck, to their destination, and walk all around their hunting expedition, then drive home again? If so, I think that those sorts of activities should be fine (or at least parts of it) -- it would be odd if they had to carry them in cases or something to avoid "open carry" problems.

 

Open carry is illegal here, but there are exceptions for hunting. You have to have it in a case while you're driving around, but once you're out hunting, you can carry it openly. Open carrying in a public place here, though- even if it's only a bb gun- is either a misdemeanor or a felony, depending on the circumstances. If they legalized open carry here (which I can't ever see happening) I'd move. Dd would be terrified if there were constantly jerks hauling assault weapons around in the produce department of Walmart or whatever. That's crazy.

[MercyA]

You should absolutely not be allowed to wear a mask while you open carry. Those men are disgusting and that's harassment and a hate crime. He's not a white man carrying a gun, he's a man in a mask carrying a gun. What exactly is he hiding?

 

:iagree: He thinks he's a big man, following a woman around with a mask on.  :001_rolleyes: Coward. He needs some real men to sit him down for a little talk.

[MercyA]

Generally I think those who are carrying holstered weapons are not a threat.

 

:iagree: There is a huge difference, for me, between someone carrying a handgun in a holster and someone wearing a mask and toting around a big rifle with their hand near the trigger. The first has, at times, made me feel safer, but the second would likely cause me to leave the area and call the cops. 

[Little Women]

I would be uncomfortable with anybody open carrying around me.  If they were following me, I would call the cops!    I do believe in the 2nd amendment, at least theoretically, but it seems to me that anyone carrying a gun around like this ought to know that there is an implied threat in their actions.    In the case of following this woman around, it was sheer bullying.   

[goldberry]

Extremely relevant......

 

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_29064963/open-carry-becomes-focus-after-colorado-springs-shooting

 

Open carry becomes focus after Colorado Springs shooting rampage

Noah Harpham was spotted openly carrying a rifle before he killed 3 in Colorado Springs

Naomi Bettis told The Denver Post she called 911 after spotting her neightbor 33-year-old Noah Harpham, armed with a rifle on the street. She says a dispatcher explained Colorado allows public handling of firearms.  Harpham went on to kill three people.

 

... "Is this person exercising their rights or about to start a very serious situation in which someone is going to be killed?" said Jacki Kelley, spokeswoman for the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office. "We just don't know the difference."

 

 

[TechWife]

OK....added it. :)  I feel that way too. I remember when I used to go to Italy a lot by train, and being weirded out by the police officers/soldiers in the train station with their rifles.  It was just so strange/foreign to me.

 

I felt the same way in the Zurich airport. 

[TechWife]

Other than law enforcement, I've only seen open carry one time. It was at a gas station and there was a man getting gas who had a gun holstered. Being the person I am, my first thought was "What is he so insecure about?"It struck me as an immature thing to do - the equivalent of a teen squealing his tires when the light turns green. "Look at me! See how cool I am!" I doubt that was the effect that he had in mind. 

[mom2scouts]

The people I know put them in cases for transport and then carry just the gun while hunting. The thing with hunting is that you are not walking around where there are a bunch of other people. At least where I've hunted (I don't hunt anymore, not my thing), it's not like I'm walking down the sidewalk where someone else might wonder what the heck I'm doing with that gun. I'm out where the wild game is, and as such it is usually not heavily frequented by many other people.

 

This reminds me of something that happened at our local schools. Both our high school and middle school share a property with a road running beside both buildings. The road is actually part of the school property and just connects the various parking lots and fields. Just beyond one of the schools is a large wooded property. One day multiple police were called and there was a panic about a man near the school with a gun. It turned out to be some old hunter who had permission to hunt in the woods, but lived on the other side of the school property. He was casually strolling down the road with his hunting gun and didn't even realize he was on school property. I don't think he'll ever do that again.

[ikuradesuka]

To do what?  In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

 

Stalking?  He is harassing that poor woman.  Open carry and intimidation aren't the same things.  I don't care what color of skin is under that mask, that guy is highly inappropriate.  He's a vigilante looking for a fight.  Not okay.  At all.

 

And I'm okay with open carry, by any respectable looking person, of any color.  

[8circles]

When I see military with weapons I think maybe the area isn't very safe.

 

When I see civilians open carrying I think they're idiots & I avoid them.

 

Seeing police officers with their guns holstered is "normal" and elicits no particular response.

[mom@shiloh]

That picture is beyond belief to me.  It is hard for me to imagine that any rational person would do that.  The world is full of idiots.

[sewingmama]

I don't get the point of open carry. Do you just think...Oh I need to go get some milk and grab your rifle to take for protection or what? If you are on your way somewhere to use the gun can't you just leave it in the car? Why do you need one just walking down the street?

 

Anyway I'm from Australia so if I saw that guy I'd probably freeze and pee myself LOL. Even the police here don't walk about carrying guns like that..it scares people.

 

My DH went into a gun shop here ( yes we do have some) and there was nothing to look at...apparently they aren't allowed to actually display them and they will only bring one out for you to look at if you show them a permit first.

 

I was so weirded out in Canada seeing shooting ranges in shopping malls... and in the USA..seeing guns sold in Walmart like they were just shoes or underwear or something.

 

I don't know how people walk around feeling safe in the US...I guess you go buy yourself a gun lol

Edited December 4, 2015 by sewingmama

[Katy]

Stories of being afraid of holstered weapons or making judgments about their messages are so foreign to me. It would never occur to me to make a judgment about that.

 

There were times when I was a kid that my dad wouldn't let me go walking on our own property without a holstered weapon.  He was the chief of police.  Sometimes he would tell me why, other times he'd just insist. Other times he didn't care. Some of his reasons had to do with criminals targeting cops and their families.  Some of them had to do with wildlife (this was Florida, we had significant acreage with water, wildlife was a danger, especially in nesting season with alligators).  He never told us to stay inside and lock the doors though (except in case of bad weather or hurricanes).  We weren't taught to be afraid or restrict our actions, just that some times we needed to be more cautious than others.  I started shooting lessons at a very young age and martial arts just before middle school.

[AmandaVT]

I'm OK with hunters and LEO's. VT has very loose gun control laws and we have a lot of hunters. I live at the edge of a forest and during hunting season, it's very common to see hunters walking past my house with a rifle slung over their shoulder. We also hear gunshots regularly this time of year. Camo with bright orange accents and a hunting rifle doesn't bother me, but the picture Umsami posted would have me walking quickly away from that man in the opposite direction. Wouldn't matter what gender, race, or religion they were. 

 

My take on the 2nd amendment is that it should be amended to "the right to bear arms that existed in the 18th century"

[goldberry]

I posted the story from Colorado because I see that as a legitimate concern with open carry.  When a LEO in uniform has a weapon, I have no problem with it, because the intentions are clear.  When a random person has a weapon out in public, how is anyone supposed to know what the intentions are?

 

The fact that a person with a rifle was walking down the street with it in the middle of an urban area should have drawn a response from police.  Instead, it drew no response because "they were exercising a legal right".  Until he starting shooting people.  A little late. 

 

[ChocolateReignRemix]

Around here they have dogs for safety, since the authorities dont want you to kill home invaders or livestock/gas theives.

 

A previous poster mentioned that its legal to open carry, no need to call police. That isnt true in my state...they can open carry a long gun only en route to target practice or hunting area, or in the case of a self defense emergency. Any other use and they lose their permit plus whatever the law allows once intent is determined. They may not have the gun loaded en route, either. So, if I saw a twenty something on Main Street, weapon at the ready, you bet your boots I would call 911 and start recording.

 

Your silly police department, not wanting you to shoot at gas thieves and all.

[HomeAgain]

I'm only comfortable with open carry when we have stronger health care and better continual care for mental health patients in the U.S.  Right now the combination of the two situations we have makes me extremely uneasy.

[Greta]

To do what? In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

I live in an open carry state, unfortunately, and I would absolutely call that in. Carrying a gun and wearing a mask absolutely screams intent to do harm. Only people who are up to no good have reason to hide their faces.

[mom2scouts]

I live in an open carry state, unfortunately, and I would absolutely call that in. Carrying a gun and wearing a mask absolutely screams intent to do harm. Only people who are up to no good have reason to hide their faces.

 

I don't know. It gets cold in my open carry state and people cover their faces in cold weather. While I agree the guy in the picture looks like he's trying to be intimidating, I'm not sure the police would be able to do much other than watch him.

[Greta]

I don't know that it screams intent to do harm... but it certainly screams intent to intimidate, if nothing else.

I think I get what you're saying: that we don't know from the mask whether or not he actually intends to fire the gun. (Good enough chance that I'd still call it in, though.) But I would argue that he is in fact using that gun to cause harm: harassment, intimidation, stalking - all harmful. If what he intended to do was morally and legally sound, he'd have no reason to have that mask on.

Edited December 4, 2015 by Greta

[Greta]

I don't know. It gets cold in my open carry state and people cover their faces in cold weather. While I agree the guy in the picture looks like he's trying to be intimidating, I'm not sure the police would be able to do much other than watch him.

It doesn't get cold enough either here where I life or in TX where that happened for that to be a factor at all. The guy was clearly wearing the mask to hide his identity and to make himself look scary and intimidating. Maybe the police could do nothing. Probably the police would do nothing. But I'd still call it in, because first of all this kind of harassment and intimidation is ridiculous. And secondly, what if I didn't call it in and he did end up hurting her? I'm NOT about to err on the side of "this guy looks dangerous but he might not be". Call it in and let the police at least be given the chance to do their jobs.

[maryanne]

I don't think race would affect my opinion, but other factors would:

 

Guy (any race/ethnicity) with visible gun in holster/case going about ordinary-looking business (buying groceries, pumping gas, waiting patiently in line somewhere, etc): ok

Guy (any race/ethnicity) with gun in hand looking around at crowd: scary

Guy (any race/ethnicity) in mask: scary

[albeto.]

While I agree the guy in the picture looks like he's trying to be intimidating, I'm not sure the police would be able to do much other than watch him.

 

I would call the police for three reasons. The first is her immediate safety. God forbid this guy thinks he's justified in taunting her or entrapping her to inspire him to stand his ground. God forbid he's arguing inside that numskull of his and the side that hates immigrants (I know, right?) and/or muslims wins. God forbid he ate too many Twinkies and has a twitchy trigger finger and can't think straight. The police, at the very least, could offer some measure of protection for her.

 

My second reason would be to calm him down, distract him, send him home. He's clearly on the edge. A man with his wits about him doesn't decide to take justice into his own hands in such an irrational, frightened way. 

 

The third would be to inspire the local government authority to calm the citizens of town down. Justice does not work vigilante style, and this is a perfect example of why we do rely on courts of law to determine justice. There's nothing logical, rational, or reasonable about what the man is doing. He does not get the privilege of being judge, jury, and executioner when he feels threatened by muslims existing in his city. The police have to respond. Calling them out when people open carry for clearly intimidating purposes would lend to the social pressure to encourage citizens to calm down and not freak out just because a muslim (ermergehd!) lives in their midst. It's just not practical, and it's downright embarrassing. 

[ikuradesuka]

Brandishing a weapon?  Anything illegal about that?

 

It's his body language (and dress), not his gun that makes that picture so awful.

[KungFuPanda]

I find the photo disturbing, menacing, and creepy. I question the emotional stability of those who WANT to open carry. I also question the morals of anyone who sees the above photo, thinks it's ok and believes 'those people' should be watched. I also question the cult-like groups think in communities where nobody bats an eye at Jim Bob and Cooter walking around the Walmarts with their rifles at the ready.

 

I grew up in a culture that uses guns as a tool and doesn't fear them. My father and brothers are avid hunters. A good day in the woods can put meat on the table for weeks. I think it's a valuable life skill and a more humane and ecologically sound way to get meat. I have no problem with properly stored rifles being in the same house with children. It perplexes me to live in the burbs and hear on the news that the same community has both a hunger problem AND a deer problem. That's just nuts. Even WITH this background and mindset I think it's beyond weird that people WANT to walk around town and shops armed.

 

I'm not one who thinks it's necessary to disarm the citizenry, but no civilian needs to own a semi-automatic weapon, much less brandish it in public. Joe public does NOT need more ready access to a weapon than a soldier. Military weapons are locked down and highly controlled! I seriously question the judgement of people who think it's just dandy to parade around locked and loaded like that. It's a problem that inexplicably did not get nipped in the bud and has gotten insanely out of hand.

[KungFuPanda]

I'm only comfortable with open carry when we have stronger health care and better continual care for mental health patients in the U.S. Right now the combination of the two situations we have makes me extremely uneasy.

Maybe a government funded guns-for-health insurance campaign would be good all around :-)

[El...]

At our last home, I walked by an older lady in Walmart wearing a holstered handgun on her hip.  It was an open-carry state.  She was probably somebody's grandma, and a very nice person.  I still looked twice and wondered whether we should head the other way.

 

I'm a martial arts person.  I believe humans have a right to fight back against someone trying to hurt them - something deep, animalistic and righteously enraged.  However, wearing a gun in a peaceful place when it isn't your job... hmmm.  You are saying something to the world - and I think that statement is, "I am ready to kill anyone who does the wrong thing in my presence.  Not just stop them, not hurt them, but kill them outright and with the first strike/shot."  No one trains to shoot NOT to kill (and it would be farcical if they did, IMO).  I'm just not ready to make that sort of statement about the society in which I live. 

 

 

[foxbridgeacademy]

This is probably the only issue DH and I disagree on.  I am not comfortable with open carry for anybody.  You do not need your 9mm on your hip for everyone to see to run into the gas station but where I'm from the local boys think they do.  We've had 1 robbery (with fatality) and only a couple (without injury) in my area (50 mile radius) this past year.  We are rural but these mostly young and always white men think they're on the front lines. 

Dh does not see a problem with it although he hasn't owned anything other than a hunting rifle in the last 15 years.

 

 

[mom2scouts]

https://www.facebook.com/100004280534884/videos/576199202532759/

 

I found this today. Unlike the first picture posted in this thread, the threatening behavior isn't coming from the man open carrying.

 

ETA: There's some language that some might find offensive in the video.

Edited December 4, 2015 by mom2scouts

[albeto.]

At our last home, I walked by an older lady in Walmart wearing a holstered handgun on her hip.  It was an open-carry state.  She was probably somebody's grandma, and a very nice person.  I still looked twice and wondered whether we should head the other way.

 

I'm a martial arts person.  I believe humans have a right to fight back against someone trying to hurt them - something deep, animalistic and righteously enraged.  However, wearing a gun in a peaceful place when it isn't your job... hmmm.  You are saying something to the world - and I think that statement is, "I am ready to kill anyone who does the wrong thing in my presence.  Not just stop them, not hurt them, but kill them outright and with the first strike/shot."  No one trains to shoot NOT to kill (and it would be farcical if they did, IMO).  I'm just not ready to make that sort of statement about the society in which I live. 

 

I think the statement more reliably might be stated, "I am ready to kill anyone who does the wrong thing in my opinion." 

 

May Cthulhu have mercy on us all.

[Tanaqui]

It's his body language (and dress), not his gun that makes that picture so awful.

 

The gun isn't exactly helping.

 

[swimmermom3]

I think I get what you're saying: that we don't know from the mask whether or not he actually intends to fire the gun. (Good enough chance that I'd still call it in, though.) But I would argue that he is in fact using that gun to cause harm: harassment, intimidation, stalking - all harmful. If what he intended to do was morally and legally sound, he'd have no reason to have that mask on.

 

The guy has the gun at the ready, with his finger on the trigger, no?  Do responsible gun owners usually do that walking down the street?

 

[Joules]

https://www.facebook.com/100004280534884/videos/576199202532759/

 

I found this today. Unlike the first picture posted in this thread, the threatening behavior isn't coming from the man open carrying.

 

ETA: There's some language that some might find offensive in the video.

 

Wow, I think if I was an owner or customer of that business I would feel threatened by the man with the guns walking back and forth in front of my establishment, even if he never said a word.  I simply can't imagine the cops would have been so calm if the races of the proprietor and gunman had been switched.  

Edited December 4, 2015 by Joules

[Greta]

The guy has the gun at the ready, with his finger on the trigger, no? Do responsible gun owners usually do that walking down the street?

 

Yes, I was thinking about this after I posted. The way he's holding that gun is aggressive, one step short of pointing it at her. This is no good citizen exercising his legal rights. This guy is unhinged.

[mom2scouts]

The man with the guns wasn't "walking back and forth" in front of his business. He was just walking by on the sidewalk in an area with lots of regular pedestrian traffic. You may be right about the police reaction, but it would be because of the amount of black on black crime that takes place in that area. I wonder if this business owner ever stands up to the criminals in his neighborhood.

[swimmermom3]

https://www.facebook.com/100004280534884/videos/576199202532759/

 

I found this today. Unlike the first picture posted in this thread, the threatening behavior isn't coming from the man open carrying.

 

ETA: There's some language that some might find offensive in the video.

 

Did you watch the whole thing?  I can see where the one guy being riled up can seem threatening, but I am sorry, the guy with the two guns, one of which looked seriously menacing, who is wearing a ski cap and sunglasses is threatening as well, and I am not sure that the pat talk about being a Christian and Jesus telling us to love each other is really all that reassuring. Those guns are some serious "unlove."  Jesus says love your neighbor, but shoot him dead if he bugs you?

 

The dialogue after Gun Boy walked away was interesting, especially the comment that the right to bear arms wasn't equal and if someone black carried those same weapons down the street , the SWAT team would be called in.  The officer said that there had been town meetings about the guy, so obviously more than a few people in town had been upset by his way of exercising his rights under the Second Amendment.

 

I ride the fence on gun control. These guys make me say, "Take them all a way."  People who carry lethal weapons to compensate for shortages in other areas  of their life or as a publicity stunt, freak me out.  Again, they make me question their judgment.  On the other hand, the seriousness of some of the gun owners that participated in one of these threads a couple of months ago, made me realize that not everyone is posturing and that many gun owners are incredibly responsible in training with, securing, and carrying their weapons. You all need to make sure the zealots don't appear in public. 

 

[Guest]

Serious question, not a drop of sarcasm: Why do we need to make sure the zealots don't appear in public?

 

It isn't my job to patrol the safety and conduct of anyone but myself and those in my charge. I have enough to worry about without idiots and bigots. Why should my right to carry and defend my kids hinge on their public conduct? If that were the case we would have no rights at all, because there is always a swath of someones in every group who insist on messing it up for the rest.

 

It's the same scary logic that insists Muslims shouldn't be allowed to build a new mosque because some are used to incite violence or hatch terror plots. Their freedom doesn't rest on what the radical elements do wrong and it shouldn't. I vehemently reject such notions in religion, speech, arms hearing, property rights, and a bevy of others.

 

I'm really grateful my own safety and freedom isn't in the balance because of the misconduct or criminality of a small segment of the population. It never should be.

 

But circling back around, this is why I'm not generally supportive of open carry. Brandishing for the sake of intimidation or ego needs to stay criminal and open carry makes that more complicated to enforce. My goal is safety, not scaring others who don't feel the same way I do by displaying my piece.

Edited December 4, 2015 by Arctic Mama

[8circles]

Serious question, not a drop of sarcasm: Why do we need to make sure the zealots don't appear in public?

 

It isn't my job to patrol the safety and conduct of anyone but myself and those in my charge. I have enough to worry about without idiots and bigots. Why should my right to carry and defend my kids hinge on their public conduct? If that were the case we would have no rights at all, because there is always a swath of someones in every group who insist on messing it up for the rest.

 

It's the same scary logic that insists Muslims shouldn't be allowed to build a new mosque because some are used to incite violence or hatch terror plots. Their freedom doesn't rest on what the radical elements do wrong and it shouldn't. I vehemently reject such notions in religion, speech, arms hearing, property rights, and a bevy of others.

 

I'm really grateful my own safety and freedom isn't in the balance because of the misconduct or criminality of a small segment of the population. It never should be.

 

But circling back around, this is why I'm not generally supportive of open carry. Brandishing for the sake of intimidation or ego needs to stay criminal and open carry makes that more complicated to enforce. My goal is safety, not scaring others who don't feel the same way I do by displaying my piece.

 

You live in Alaska, right?  I understand you probably have some possible protection scenarios that I wouldn't have.  I have no issue with you having a firearm for this kind of protection.  Aside from the few comments about a civilian gun ban which most people, even gun control advocates, have said they don't want, which regulations would take away your right to protect yourself & your children?

[TammyS]

 It perplexes me to live in the burbs and hear on the news that the same community has both a hunger problem AND a deer problem

 

Where I live there is a program where hunters can deliver field dressed deer for butchering and distribution to food banks.

[TammyS]

 You all need to make sure the zealots don't appear in public. 

 

You know what?  We really don't. 

 

If every group is to be held responsible for the bad behavior of some members of that group (even assuming they really *are* members of that group), then there can be no group can exist.

[8circles]

OK - I was just able to watch this video again and hear more of the dialogue.  I find it absolutely frightening that this man thinks it's so important to normalize guns in public that this is what he does.  As if he's leading some behavior therapy session.  He was given a chance to say his piece and he says (rough paraphrase, like I said, it was difficult to hear)  God says to love people and do not be afraid.  What the hell?  Seriously, that man is disturbed.  & you think the people who recognize a gun in public as not-normal, threatening behavior, they are being threatening by being shocked and calling the police?  This is freedom, I guess.  'Murica!

 

https://www.facebook.com/100004280534884/videos/576199202532759/

 

I found this today. Unlike the first picture posted in this thread, the threatening behavior isn't coming from the man open carrying.

 

ETA: There's some language that some might find offensive in the video.

 

[swimmermom3]

Serious question, not a drop of sarcasm: Why do we need to make sure the zealots don't appear in public?

 

It isn't my job to patrol the safety and conduct of anyone but myself and those in my charge. I have enough to worry about without idiots and bigots. Why should my right to carry and defend my kids hinge on their public conduct? If that were the case we would have no rights at all, because there is always a swath of someones in every group who insist on messing it up for the rest.

 

It's the same scary logic that insists Muslims shouldn't be allowed to build a new mosque because some are used to incite violence or hatch terror plots. Their freedom doesn't rest on what the radical elements do wrong and it shouldn't. I vehemently reject such notions in religion, speech, arms hearing, property rights, and a bevy of others.

 

I'm really grateful my own safety and freedom isn't in the balance because of the misconduct or criminality of a small segment of the population. It never should be.

 

But circling back around, this is why I'm not generally supportive of open carry. Brandishing for the sake of intimidation or ego needs to stay criminal and open carry makes that more complicated to enforce. My goal is safety, not scaring others who don't feel the same way I do by displaying my piece.

 

You are right. I should have said that while it is this man's Constitutional right, he does not help the cause for maintaining the status quot regarding private gun ownership. I don't think he is helping the cause for responsible gun ownership.

 

In response to the first part that I have put in bold, I wish I could feel as grateful as you do, but I feel under the current system that my own safety and freedom are in the balance as well for exactly the same reason stated in the second part that I put in bold. I am not a particularly timid person, but if I see you with a gun out in the open at the grocery store, I would be a bit freaked out. Why? First, because there aren't any rules about safety instruction requirements. I have no clue if you have a clue. In Switzerland, everyone is required to have a clue. I can live with that. Second, if you are the loud-mouth in Starbuck's who is getting really irritated with the barista and you've got a gun, I am gonna walk away. Your right to not be afraid, can really translate into taking away many other citizens' right to not be afraid. But obviously you get that from your commentary.

 

I have often wondered how veterans with PTSD or victims of gun violence feel when going out in public in states that have open carry.

 

[mom2scouts]

OK - I was just able to watch this video again and hear more of the dialogue.  I find it absolutely frightening that this man thinks it's so important to normalize guns in public that this is what he does.  As if he's leading some behavior therapy session.  He was given a chance to say his piece and he says (rough paraphrase, like I said, it was difficult to hear)  God says to love people and do not be afraid.  What the hell?  Seriously, that man is disturbed.  & you think the people who recognize a gun in public as not-normal, threatening behavior, they are being threatening by being shocked and calling the police?  This is freedom, I guess.  'Murica!

 

I have an update on this story. The business owner was NOT the person who called the police. The man who was carrying called police because they would not let him pass on the sidewalk and were threatening him. Open carry is legal and that's why the police helped him pass the business. The man who was open carrying later asked the business owner if he was willing to sit down and calmly talk and they did. The business owner said he was just concerned that the man had bad intentions and that's why he yelled at him, but after talking later they left on good terms. The business owner's actions upset the open carry advocates and they now plan to do an "education walk" in that area. Instead of having one man carrying a gun, they'll now have a few dozen!

 

I think it's fine that the business owner was concerned and asked the man what he was doing. It's too bad he didn't do it in a more appropriate way or just call police. It the man with the gun was up to no good, the business owner may not be here now.

Edited December 5, 2015 by mom2scouts