Farrar Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Exactly - he can afford to pay back his loans at this point. Well, no, he likely can't. He waited so long that it's now probably actually too big. And since he's now a "well known critic" with a book deal, my guess is that there isn't some more lucrative job he could choose to take at this point like when he was younger. Not that I want to defend this guy. I mean... ugh. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Sounds like this guy needs to hang out with another winning couple we all know who "just want to be free" on the backs of others. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparklyUnicorn Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Default just means you're nine months or more behind on payments It doesn't mean they won't still come after you for the payments. He's just decided that being harassed by creditors is a price he's willing to pay to not pay his debt. Ah ok. Although I still don't understand it. I've heard of people having their wages garnished. Unless these were private loans. I did not read the article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne in CA Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 So does this clown have kids? I sure hope not because child support is another obligation that might have kept him from perusing his dreams. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HRAAB Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Sounds like this guy needs to hang out with another winning couple we all know who "just want to be free" on the backs of others. ??? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 ??? The Naughlers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Although this depends on the loan terms. Calvin's loans are essentially interest free - they only increase by the amount of inflation. So, for him, taking out the maximum loan and banking any excess makes sense. He will have a nest egg to take him through internships, graduate school, etc. He's very frugal, so I don't worry that he will waste money. The loans are paid back through the tax system and are automatically forgiven after 35 years. Gee, that sounds like it makes so much sense. If only our system made that much sense. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMV Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Ah ok. Although I still don't understand it. I've heard of people having their wages garnished. Unless these were private loans. I did not read the article. He isn't working in a job where he has wages that are easy to garnish. He gets paid for appearances, articles, and book royalties but these can be more difficult to garnish than someone who has a regular employer and receives a regular paycheck. I also think that he and his wife have been a bit creative with how they have accumulated assets and what is actually considered "his". 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amsunshine Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Although this depends on the loan terms. Calvin's loans are essentially interest free - they only increase by the amount of inflation. So, for him, taking out the maximum loan and banking any excess makes sense. He will have a nest egg to take him through internships, graduate school, etc. He's very frugal, so I don't worry that he will waste money. The loans are paid back through the tax system and are automatically forgiven after 35 years. Actually, this sounds like a much more civilized way to do things than how we do it on this side of the pond! 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Gee, that sounds like it makes so much sense. If only our system made that much sense. It was part of the compromise when fees were introduced and universal grants abolished. The idea is that people shouldn't be discouraged from entering low-paying worthwhile jobs (teaching, social work, paid employment in charities) by the fear of not paying back loans. ETA: the repayment only kicks in when the salary rises above a basic level, and is based on a percentage of salary, so it's less fast for those on lower incomes. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Sounds like this guy needs to hang out with another winning couple we all know who "just want to be free" on the backs of others. you mean you want him to lower his standard of living? and live in a three-sided stick structure with nothing but a tarp for a roof? that's open to the weather? and doesn't even have a toilet? there's a REASON he hasn't paid off his loans. those loan payments were in the way of living the lifestyle to which he wished to become (and now has) accustomed. how mean and cruel you are . . . . smh 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 you mean you want him to lower his standard of living? and live in a three-sided stick structure with nothing but a tarp for a roof? that's open to the weather? and doesn't even have a toilet? there's a REASON he hasn't paid off his loans. those loan payments were in the way of living the lifestyle to which he wished to become (and now has) accustomed. how mean and cruel you are . . . . smh GardenMom was joking and I missed it. Sorry!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparklyUnicorn Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 What does smh mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amsunshine Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 What does smh mean? shaking my head 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparklyUnicorn Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 shaking my head Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 It was part of the compromise when fees were introduced and universal grants abolished. The idea is that people shouldn't be discouraged from entering low-paying worthwhile jobs (teaching, social work, paid employment in charities) by the fear of not paying back loans. Or discouraged from trying to innovate or start a business, I would presume. Though that may just be an American attitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Stuff men hate Sydney Morning Herald South Memphis Hamburghut Supposedly monkeys haggle Sunrise Miraculous Harmony...that is my Daughter's name. She was born in a yurt. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Or discouraged from trying to innovate or start a business, I would presume. Though that may just be an American attitude. Why would lack of crushing debt discourage you from starting a business? I would think that it would free you up:"Hey look, while I am on a low income and my business is small, I don't have to pay back my debt. Once I've made it big, then the debt repayments kick in. Great!" On the other hand, society does need community-minded low-paid graduates. It's not great for the country if the graduates can only afford to design the best new widget. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SproutMamaK Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 you mean you want him to lower his standard of living? and live in a three-sided stick structure with nothing but a tarp for a roof? that's open to the weather? and doesn't even have a toilet? there's a REASON he hasn't paid off his loans. those loan payments were in the way of living the lifestyle to which he wished to become (and now has) accustomed. how mean and cruel you are . . . . smh Omg, relax, it was a freaking joke. Smh. I'm pretty sure gardenmom was joking, too. :) We really need to work on getting a universally recognized sarcasm font so that no one confuses sarcasm for genuine commentary anymore. I nominate Comic Sans. No one is tempted to take you seriously when you use Comic Sans. ;) 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Omg, relax, it was a freaking joke. Smh. I think she was also joking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Well, no, he likely can't. He waited so long that it's now probably actually too big. And since he's now a "well known critic" with a book deal, my guess is that there isn't some more lucrative job he could choose to take at this point like when he was younger. Not that I want to defend this guy. I mean... ugh. I know what you mean. I wonder what his total is, present day? Did the article say? I would hope they could garnish his income tax, but he probably has his income protected in some type of corporation. Sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I think she was also joking Slartibartfast Mentions Humor 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truscifi Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Omg, relax, it was a freaking joke. Smh. I thought she was being sarcastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I think she was also joking Really? Ok, that makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Why would lack of crushing debt discourage you from starting a business? I would think that it would free you up:"Hey look, while I am on a low income and my business is small, I don't have to pay back my debt. Once I've made it big, then the debt repayments kick in. Great!" On the other hand, society does need community-minded low-paid graduates. It's not great for the country if the graduates can only afford to design the best new widget. Sorry, yes, that's what I was saying. That it should be kept at a minimum like you say so that people aren't discouraged from entering lower paid but needed for society work OR from taking a potentially positive risk to start a business. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Really? Ok, that makes sense. Suddenly Moxie Harkens 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlsdMama Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 It took me 7 years of extremely lean living to pay off $85K of student loans plus interest. I don't regret any of it. What a great feeling to be done, though. I really admire you getting it done. My DH paid off $65k by signing his tail to the Army for four years and they paid part of his Masters degrees. We still have student loan debt but they are actually stupid tax, sigh. However, they've served a great purpose - We are adamant about our kids not racking up debt. So far, so good. On an off note, not paying is going to get tricky if you ever want to buy a house. Many mortgage programs (FHA and VA) now count 1% of your student loan debt as payment for your debt to income ratio even if you're in deferment or forbearance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlsdMama Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 shaking my head Lol. I always thought it was "smack my head" as in someone said something so silly I smacked my forehead. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I really admire you getting it done. My DH paid off $65k by signing his tail to the Army for four years and they paid part of his Masters degrees. We still have student loan debt but they are actually stupid tax, sigh. However, they've served a great purpose - We are adamant about our kids not racking up debt. So far, so good. On an off note, not paying is going to get tricky if you ever want to buy a house. Many mortgage programs (FHA and VA) now count 1% of your student loan debt as payment for your debt to income ratio even if you're in deferment or forbearance. I agree with this!! For sure DH and I have $150k in life lessons that will serve our kids well so in that way I have no regrets. Or, maybe I'm just making lemonade out of my lemons?? No student loans for our kids!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMV Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I know what you mean. I wonder what his total is, present day? Did the article say? I would hope they could garnish his income tax, but he probably has his income protected in some type of corporation. Sigh. I would be surprised if he has had income tax refunds for anyone to garnish. If his income is from self employment then, unless he is overpaying his quarterly tax payments, he won't have any excess to refund. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimm Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I have a pile of debt from my useless state college degree. And I pay it. But the idea of everyone bucking the system and colleges being forced to lower tuition, and this whole ridiculous situation coming apart is kind of appealing to me. At the same time, I do strongly believe that if you can't afford your degree, you better choose one that will make you money after school. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparklyUnicorn Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I have a pile of debt from my useless state college degree. And I pay it. But the idea of everyone bucking the system and colleges being forced to lower tuition, and this whole ridiculous situation coming apart is kind of appealing to me. At the same time, I do strongly believe that if you can't afford your degree, you better choose one that will make you money after school. I so feel you. It's hard to know that as a young person. This guy can't really quite use that excuse, but yeah... I think I still owe about 30K. I'm nearly 41. I am seeing no end in sight. *sigh* At least all of my husband's education was paid for. So that's nice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Sorry, yes, that's what I was saying. That it should be kept at a minimum like you say so that people aren't discouraged from entering lower paid but needed for society work OR from taking a potentially positive risk to start a business. Sorry - I was just dashing out the door and probably misread what you wrote. L 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan in TN Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 How many aspiring actors and singers wait tables and work "day jobs" while honing their skills and practicing their art in their "spare time"? Has this man never been to NY, LA, or Nashville? I am not sure I understand why getting a less fulfilling job to pay the bills means giving up your ability to write. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Or discouraged from trying to innovate or start a business, I would presume. Though that may just be an American attitude. that's just an excuse on why they can't start a business. we had lots of debt (lots) when dh started his business. it's doing very well - much better than if he'd just worked at "some job" for someone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 How many aspiring actors and singers wait tables and work "day jobs" while honing their skills and practicing their art in their "spare time"? Has this man never been to NY, LA, or Nashville? I am not sure I understand why getting a less fulfilling job to pay the bills means giving up your ability to write. it's also an opportunity to practice their desired craft. fake cheer while dealing with surly diners. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 my particular usefulness to society. If that article was indicative of his work, I think he may have overestimated his usefulness to society. :lol: I mean that more light-heartedly than it probably sounds. I don't think that *I* am particularly useful to society either. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 How many aspiring actors and singers wait tables and work "day jobs" while honing their skills and practicing their art in their "spare time"? Has this man never been to NY, LA, or Nashville? I am not sure I understand why getting a less fulfilling job to pay the bills means giving up your ability to write. As a writer in training, I agree. Get a job and write in your spare time, that's how many aspiring writers start. I think he has an agenda and wants to be the one to inspire the bubble to burst. Sorry, dude, grow a pair and pay your debt. There are legitimate reasons to default, but "I don't wanna pay" pouty crap is not one of them. He got the education, he's using his degree whether he thinks he is or not. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amsunshine Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 As a writer in training, I agree. Get a job and write in your spare time, that's how many aspiring writers start. I think he has an agenda and wants to be the one to inspire the bubble to burst. Sorry, dude, grow a pair and pay your debt. There are legitimate reasons to default, but "I don't wanna pay" pouty crap is not one of them. He got the education, he's using his degree whether he thinks he is or not. Absolutely. His "I don't wanna" mantra is insulting to those who have legitimate reasons to struggle underneath staggering loan debt. The bubble needs to burst, but if he thinks he is the poster child for that purpose, he is sadly mistaken. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparklyUnicorn Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 How many aspiring actors and singers wait tables and work "day jobs" while honing their skills and practicing their art in their "spare time"? Has this man never been to NY, LA, or Nashville? I am not sure I understand why getting a less fulfilling job to pay the bills means giving up your ability to write. Yeah I guess. I worked a lot while in school though. I mean WAY more than I had to work after graduating, but ugh. I still feel like all that hard work and not much in the end. I don't have regrets and yes I pay back my loans, but I might have made some different choices had I known better. Or I think I made the best choices I knew how to make at that time. I have mixed feelings about this. I really think the "system" is broken. I don't necessarily agree with what this guy did, but I am not entirely unsympathetic to it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SproutMamaK Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 "Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans:Because I didn't want to go through the bother of actually paying them."There, I saved everyone who hasn't read it yet from the trouble of actually reading the article. ;) 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 Having to take out loans, which other people are making a profit from, just to get a basic education, could be considered a reasonable thing to protest through non-payment. At least make the loans no-interest, payable as income reaches the median wage. Doesn't he have like two master's degrees though? That's above the basic education needed for a writer 30 years ago. Even now there is debate on whether a master's is a good investment. I can see both of sides of the debate on needing a bachelor's just to have a job now, but I think many people feel a master's is not a necessity unless you're going into a specialized field. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSNative Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 Having to take out loans, which other people are making a profit from, just to get a basic education, could be considered a reasonable thing to protest through non-payment. At least make the loans no-interest, payable as income reaches the median wage. He was happy to take their money, he just wasn't so happy not paying it back. Sorry, I don't think that then justifies his non-payment.I do think that college tuition is freaking ridiculous and growing at way too high a rate. Too many students taking out loans do not understand what they are signing. Some loans or credit cards now actually do have to spell out how much you will end up paying if you take x number of years to pay off. Itwould be great for students to see that in black and white pre-loan signing. Some people are also pushing for departments to list average salaries of their grads so that students can make informed decisions. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forget-Me-Not Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 Yes you can default on those loans. Default just means that you aren't paying and/or aren't paying enough in a timely enough manner. I think what you mean is that they won't forgive those loans.You're right, I worded poorly. I meant that you can't have them discharged in a bankruptcy. So, yeah, I guess you can technically default, but the debt follows you forever. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 He was happy to take their money, he just wasn't so happy not paying it back. Sorry, I don't think that then justifies his non-payment. I do think that college tuition is freaking ridiculous and growing at way too high a rate. I also think that too many students taking out loans do not understand what they are signing. I think some loans or credit cards now actually do have to spell out how much you will end up paying if you take x number of years to pay off. I think that would be great for students to see that in black and white pre-loan signing. Some people are also pushing for departments to list average salaries of their grads so that students can make informed decisions. Posted salaries would help but even that doesn't show kids what they will actually make after taxes and health insurance. Plus, aren't most kids stupidly optimistic?? I know we were. We knew we were borrowing a lot but it was no big deal! We'll make tons of money! It will be fine! Ha! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amsunshine Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 Posted salaries would help but even that doesn't show kids what they will actually make after taxes and health insurance. Plus, aren't most kids stupidly optimistic?? I know we were. We knew we were borrowing a lot but it was no big deal! We'll make tons of money! It will be fine! Ha! Yes, and there are those kids out there whose parents are completely uneducated or clueless, too. I have friends who are completely clueless about the financial implications of college/loans/scholarships right now. I feel bad for their kids. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trish Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 Having to take out loans, which other people are making a profit from, just to get a basic education, could be considered a reasonable thing to protest through non-payment. At least make the loans no-interest, payable as income reaches the median wage. Isn't this an Ivy League graduate? Times three? Or two? (I wasn't tempted to read his article either, notwithstanding the expensive writing skills) What's basic about that? Only about 40 percent of U.S. adults have at least an associate's degree. I'm not convinced money is the issue. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 OK, I'll bite, but my comments are general, not specific to this person. 1. What is the good of a government that can't provide basic services like education ? And no, I don't buy that most people can make it without a tertiary education, not any more. It is immoral, imo, to profiteer on the backs of students. At some point, when do we all stop pointing the finger at individuals who don't play, and point it at the real problem, the system as is currently designed ? 2. Actually, life as a creative is really tough. Yeah, yeah, I know no-one wants to hear it. 90% of creatives do not make money from their primary art, and make a living from associated jobs, which keep them from making their primary art. It's soul destroying, and it's not merely a case of 'sucks to be you, if you were any good the market would support you'. 3. So what kind of world do we want ? One where education is a money spinner, that exacerbates class difference ? One where ''art' is just entertainment, blockbusters only please ? Or the only artists we have are the ones who can pay off debt ? It's all about keeping elite choices for the elites. Ugh. Ugh. Ugh. I don't expect anyone to agree with me, and I don't plan on entering into an argument about it. PS It's not a sign of moral character that you paid down your debt faster than the next person either... We have talked a lot to our kids about these issues. Specifically, issues around: --Do you want to have your art be your job, where you have to do the art that other people are willing to pay you for, or do you want to have a "day job" that will pay enough that you can spend your off time doing the art that YOU want to do? --Do you want to go to the $65K private university, and come out with significant debt that must be paid, so that you have to take the most lucrative job available even if it's not really the one you want, or do you want to go to the $30K state school and come out much more financially stable, and thus able to take a lower-paying job you love? (The difference in price is $140K over four years.) Different people will make different choices on these issues, of course, and that's fine. The key is that they know that they've made a choice and are prepared to move forward with it, facing the challenges and appreciating the benefits of their chosen path. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldberry Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 It was part of the compromise when fees were introduced and universal grants abolished. The idea is that people shouldn't be discouraged from entering low-paying worthwhile jobs (teaching, social work, paid employment in charities) by the fear of not paying back loans. What a novel idea! In our country, we just mock those people for making a "stupid" career choice... :glare: I've had the "dream-killing" conversations with DD...there's a reason she has a Calvin and Hobbes quote for her email signature... Reality continues to ruin my life... ;) 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 OK, I'll bite, but my comments are general, not specific to this person. 1. What is the good of a government that can't provide basic services like education ? And no, I don't buy that most people can make it without a tertiary education, not any more. It is immoral, imo, to profiteer on the backs of students. At some point, when do we all stop pointing the finger at individuals who don't play, and point it at the real problem, the system as is currently designed ? 2. Actually, life as a creative is really tough. Yeah, yeah, I know no-one wants to hear it. 90% of creatives do not make money from their primary art, and make a living from associated jobs, which keep them from making their primary art. It's soul destroying, and it's not merely a case of 'sucks to be you, if you were any good the market would support you'. 3. So what kind of world do we want ? One where education is a money spinner, that exacerbates class difference ? One where ''art' is just entertainment, blockbusters only please ? Or the only artists we have are the ones who can pay off debt ? It's all about keeping elite choices for the elites. Ugh. Ugh. Ugh. I don't expect anyone to agree with me, and I don't plan on entering into an argument about it. PS It's not a sign of moral character that you paid down your debt faster than the next person either... I totally agree with all of this... ...Which is why the article ticked me off. He's a terrible, terrible spokesperson for these points. The system is messed up. But he was a middle class white guy who milked it to attend the ivy league three times and now wants us to feel sorry for him. It's like trying to garner sympathy for the ills of the health care system with a guy who stubbed his toe and wants us to see what an ordeal he's been through. Which is not to say that stubbed toe guy deserves our ire - the system is still the place I want it directed. But come on, he's trying to make a side show of himself and it's distracting from the real problem. Maybe even turning people against the real problem. 17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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