Veteran moms of many, share your wisdom please

maize · March 13, 2015

I'm hoping to glean from experienced moms of large or largish families. I am finding life to be increasingly complex as I have more school aged children, at different stages of education, while continuing to juggle the significant needs of babies and toddlers.

If you have been-there-done-that, please share how you found balance and made things work to meet the various family and educational needs without completely burning out yourself.

OneStepAtATime · March 13, 2015

O.k. as you know I don't have a ton of kids. And you may not be looking for suggestions for curriculum at all. But there are homeschool families here that have been using Trail Guides to Learning to streamline their day and I dabbled with it, too, and was incredibly impressed. Have you ever looked at it?

I know you already have some great programs you are using but this might help you. It covers nearly every subject but math and can be used with multiple ages/stages at the same time. Paths of Settlement was the one we started with. It can be used with 2nd graders all the way up through Middle school, using the same TM and support materials. With tweaking you could probably use it with a 1st grader and certainly with a High Schooler if that were necessary (although at this point I don't think you need that). You just print out the supplemental worksheets for whatever age child you need and follow the TM. Keep folders for each child and print out the worksheets on a Sunday. You are done with prep for the week in about 30 minutes, except for any materials you might need for the science experiments.

Here is a review that might help:

http://www.weirdunsocializedhomeschoolers.com/review-and-giveaway-trail-guide-to/

ETA, I mean families with a lot of kids have used it successfully. And there is a really active yahoo support group that the creators also participate in.

maize · March 13, 2015

Thank you OneStep, I have never looked closely at that program so I will go do some research on it :)

As you know we have a busy extracurricular schedule, that is one area I really need to simplify. I want to provide the best opportunities I can for each child, but have to also make the overall commitment level and schedule work for the whole family.

OneStepAtATime · March 13, 2015

I totally understand. I admire you greatly for all the wonderful things you have been able to provide for your kids.

What was great about Trail Guides for me, and what seems to have been a successful choice for a couple of families I know with lots of kids, was that it is really hands-on but honestly shouldn't take much time to prep. It gives a great flow to the day, can be modified on the fly, and covers a lot of material in quite a bit of depth, but over an extended period of time, in smaller chunks, so it isn't overwhelming. If we had known what we were doing when we started homeschooling, and hadn't had to spend so much of our energies on remediation for dyslexia/dyscalculia, we would still be using this program. In fact, I still think I would like to go back to it when we circle around to U.S. history again (although I love that it does present some World History in the U.S. history to provide context for what was happening in the States).

BlsdMama · March 13, 2015

Maize,

I'll be honest I made a serious attempt to use all the "combining" curriculum out there. Bless their sweet, well-meaning hearts, just an FYI, "combining" middle school, elementary, and upper levels is never going to happen. My days were filled with trying to explain what too old curriculum meant to little people and adding on, supplementing, whatever word you want to use, for older children. It required a lot of organization, notes, planning (because I didn't buy all the books but utilized the library.)

I've simplified.

I actually have essentially gone back to how I did school when I had a few children.

There are a few things that have really WORKED for me and it's what I do.

1. We read lit according to a time period but I don't get wrapped up in perfect order.

2. I use a spine specific to the age.

For youngers, that's SOTW. For my middle girls, they have used both Streams of Civilization and the Genevieve Foster books. Then we made a list (at the beginning of the year) of lit I wanted them to read this year and they are steadily working through the list. Simplified. I'm not matching up absolutely everything, creating worksheets from nothing, etc.

I have also found the IEW books arranged for the time period slide nicely in here without me having to reinvent the wheel. Now, if I had two kids I'd carefully teach writing, pull subjects from their reading, and make it all fit together. But I don't. It's okay. I actually had small panic attacks (and larger ones) when my older kids were young about not MATCHING EVERYTHING. No more. (And the oldest made Dean's list at university this first sememster, so I'm officially giving myself the okay. Apparently not doing all the matching of every assignment did not permanently damage her ability to read, write, and learn.)

3. If you find a math and it's working, stay with it. Be faithful. It's all good. You open cans and cans of worms by constantly switching math curriculum, IMO. YMMV.

4. Heavy outside "stuff" for non-older children we've found unbelievably taxing. My oldest children did piano, guitar, trampoline & tumbling, tumbling & tap, AWANAS, and soccer, and soccer, and more soccer, oh and summer t-ball and softball, some of which we helped coach. I no longer do the insanity because they no longer wish to have careers as pianists, guitar players, professional trampolinists, gymnasts, professional Bible quizzers - though I'd still be involved with AWANS, I felt that was worthwhile, nor are they professional athletes. I think everything you do with kiddos should be an investment - meaning there is some kind of return. For your family you might find these things are *investing* we found they were just leeches. My most "energetic" years as a schooler were years where I spent more time in the home, doing just select activities. I am actually going to have to totally re-vamp this next year and drive every day. I'll let you know how that goes. :driving:

So, now with one graduated and the another will be done with school at home next year except for writing and SAT prep, I feel pretty confident in my plans for the little people.

1. Get them reading. Not just reading, but READING. The sooner and more solid they can read, the better. This is at all costs. Do not skimp on reading ability, prosody, ability to read aloud, etc., in order to cover other curricula. Skip all curricula if you can do nothing other than get them reading solidly. I say this and half my kids are dyslexic. I'm remediating them. No excuses. Reading is the single most important skill you give them for academic success. Hit it, hit it again, and continue until they are PHENOMENAL readers.

2. Read or sleep. That is a rule we've had since like 2000 or 2001. At naptime, there is 1-2 HOURS you can read or sleep. You will do one or the other. Eventually even haters will choose to read. This will go back to the first tip. Create readers. We also bought them night time reading lights and "awarded" them to readers so that readers get to stay up a little later and read more. They thought it was a privilege. It was actually in our best interests. LOL. ;)

3. Pick their books. Until they are much, much older, pick their books. And when they are much, much older, still oversee their books. Ana is in college, we still talk about what she's reading. I don't pick anymore, I'm sure the professors would frown on it, lol, but we still discuss.

In K-5, everything else can be lightweight. Your first goal is reading, strong reading, and reading worthwhile things, classical literature, etc. Read aloud. Please, please, please, if you make time for something, read aloud. It has been proven this helps to make good writers. In my opinion, and someone will come and argue with me, you would be better served to skip writing programs until the fifth grade if you don't have time and just read aloud. A lot.

I picked books, so a lot of times my kids didn't do science. I just picked interesting science, non fiction books. Someone could argue, but my kids still tested very high on standardized tests in science. It worked for me. It also cut down on my teaching so that I could read aloud. See above.

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

Middle school - focus on writing. Focus on this like you did reading in elementary grades because it's foundational for high school success as reading was for middle school success. I like IEW for grade 5-7. But Christian has done Writing with Skill and that has been great for him. I also like PWN the SAT Essay, but really, truly that's for 10th+. IEWs essay programs for high school is great. But do make sure you hit writing strong in middle.

I will tell you I think grammar is important. I know that many don't think so, but assuming you have non-dyslexics, I really love Rod & Staff. :001_tt1: I have my kids do 1-2 years below their grade level so that it's not terribly hard for them and borders on self-teaching with a little help, but our oldest is the biggest fan of Rod & Staff. She's been taking Latin, Russian, and linguistic classes this year and having a solid grammar foundation has been very valuable.

Essentially what I'm saying is decide what is optional, what is fun and good, what is FOUNDATIONAL.

Reading in elementary is foundational.

Grammar in mid-elementary to lower middle is foundational.

Writing in middle is foundational.

I believe you CAN do more with less. The fewer frivolous things you do, the more foundational things you can cover WELL. And I actually think this is the perk of a large family. You simply don't have the ability to cover all things so you have to choose. In being forced to choose, you make sure you cover those foundational things more than adequately. It's a good thing.

KeriJ · March 13, 2015

Maize,

I'll be honest I made a serious attempt to use all the "combining" curriculum out there. Bless their sweet, well-meaning hearts, just an FYI, "combining" middle school, elementary, and upper levels is never going to happen. My days were filled with trying to explain what too old curriculum meant to little people and adding on, supplementing, whatever word you want to use, for older children. It required a lot of organization, notes, planning (because I didn't buy all the books but utilized the library.)

I've simplified.

I actually have essentially gone back to how I did school when I had a few children.

There are a few things that have really WORKED for me and it's what I do.

1. We read lit according to a time period but I don't get wrapped up in perfect order.

2. I use a spine specific to the age.

For youngers, that's SOTW. For my middle girls, they have used both Streams of Civilization and the Genevieve Foster books. Then we made a list (at the beginning of the year) of lit I wanted them to read this year and they are steadily working through the list. Simplified. I'm not matching up absolutely everything, creating worksheets from nothing, etc.

I have also found the IEW books arranged for the time period slide nicely in here without me having to reinvent the wheel. Now, if I had two kids I'd carefully teach writing, pull subjects from their reading, and make it all fit together. But I don't. It's okay. I actually had small panic attacks (and larger ones) when my older kids were young about not MATCHING EVERYTHING. No more. (And the oldest made Dean's list at university this first sememster, so I'm officially giving myself the okay. Apparently not doing all the matching of every assignment did not permanently damage her ability to read, write, and learn.)

3. If you find a math and it's working, stay with it. Be faithful. It's all good. You open cans and cans of worms by constantly switching math curriculum, IMO. YMMV.

4. Heavy outside "stuff" for non-older children we've found unbelievably taxing. My oldest children did piano, guitar, trampoline & tumbling, tumbling & tap, AWANAS, and soccer, and soccer, and more soccer, oh and summer t-ball and softball, some of which we helped coach. I no longer do the insanity because they no longer wish to have careers as pianists, guitar players, professional trampolinists, gymnasts, professional Bible quizzers - though I'd still be involved with AWANS, I felt that was worthwhile, nor are they professional athletes. I think everything you do with kiddos should be an investment - meaning there is some kind of return. For your family you might find these things are *investing* we found they were just leeches. My most "energetic" years as a schooler were years where I spent more time in the home, doing just select activities. I am actually going to have to totally re-vamp this next year and drive every day. I'll let you know how that goes. :driving:

So, now with one graduated and the another will be done with school at home next year except for writing and SAT prep, I feel pretty confident in my plans for the little people.

1. Get them reading. Not just reading, but READING. The sooner and more solid they can read, the better. This is at all costs. Do not skimp on reading ability, prosody, ability to read aloud, etc., in order to cover other curricula. Skip all curricula if you can do nothing other than get them reading solidly. I say this and half my kids are dyslexic. I'm remediating them. No excuses. Reading is the single most important skill you give them for academic success. Hit it, hit it again, and continue until they are PHENOMENAL readers.

2. Read or sleep. That is a rule we've had since like 2000 or 2001. At naptime, there is 1-2 HOURS you can read or sleep. You will do one or the other. Eventually even haters will choose to read. This will go back to the first tip. Create readers. We also bought them night time reading lights and "awarded" them to readers so that readers get to stay up a little later and read more. They thought it was a privilege. It was actually in our best interests. LOL. ;)

3. Pick their books. Until they are much, much older, pick their books. And when they are much, much older, still oversee their books. Ana is in college, we still talk about what she's reading. I don't pick anymore, I'm sure the professors would frown on it, lol, but we still discuss.

In K-5, everything else can be lightweight. Your first goal is reading, strong reading, and reading worthwhile things, classical literature, etc. Read aloud. Please, please, please, if you make time for something, read aloud. It has been proven this helps to make good writers. In my opinion, and someone will come and argue with me, you would be better served to skip writing programs until the fifth grade if you don't have time and just read aloud. A lot.

I picked books, so a lot of times my kids didn't do science. I just picked interesting science, non fiction books. Someone could argue, but my kids still tested very high on standardized tests in science. It worked for me. It also cut down on my teaching so that I could read aloud. See above.

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

Middle school - focus on writing. Focus on this like you did reading in elementary grades because it's foundational for high school success as reading was for middle school success. I like IEW for grade 5-7. But Christian has done Writing with Skill and that has been great for him. I also like PWN the SAT Essay, but really, truly that's for 10th+. IEWs essay programs for high school is great. But do make sure you hit writing strong in middle.

I will tell you I think grammar is important. I know that many don't think so, but assuming you have non-dyslexics, I really love Rod & Staff. :001_tt1: I have my kids do 1-2 years below their grade level so that it's not terribly hard for them and borders on self-teaching with a little help, but our oldest is the biggest fan of Rod & Staff. She's been taking Latin, Russian, and linguistic classes this year and having a solid grammar foundation has been very valuable.

Essentially what I'm saying is decide what is optional, what is fun and good, what is FOUNDATIONAL.

Reading in elementary is foundational.

Grammar in mid-elementary to lower middle is foundational.

Writing in middle is foundational.

I believe you CAN do more with less. The fewer frivolous things you do, the more foundational things you can cover WELL. And I actually think this is the perk of a large family. You simply don't have the ability to cover all things so you have to choose. In being forced to choose, you make sure you cover those foundational things more than adequately. It's a good thing.

I'm thinking of saving this post to re-read often. I liked it that much!

Mommy to monkeys · March 13, 2015

Maize,

I'll be honest I made a serious attempt to use all the "combining" curriculum out there. Bless their sweet, well-meaning hearts, just an FYI, "combining" middle school, elementary, and upper levels is never going to happen. My days were filled with trying to explain what too old curriculum meant to little people and adding on, supplementing, whatever word you want to use, for older children. It required a lot of organization, notes, planning (because I didn't buy all the books but utilized the library.)

I've simplified.

I actually have essentially gone back to how I did school when I had a few children.

There are a few things that have really WORKED for me and it's what I do.

1. We read lit according to a time period but I don't get wrapped up in perfect order.

2. I use a spine specific to the age.

For youngers, that's SOTW. For my middle girls, they have used both Streams of Civilization and the Genevieve Foster books. Then we made a list (at the beginning of the year) of lit I wanted them to read this year and they are steadily working through the list. Simplified. I'm not matching up absolutely everything, creating worksheets from nothing, etc.

I have also found the IEW books arranged for the time period slide nicely in here without me having to reinvent the wheel. Now, if I had two kids I'd carefully teach writing, pull subjects from their reading, and make it all fit together. But I don't. It's okay. I actually had small panic attacks (and larger ones) when my older kids were young about not MATCHING EVERYTHING. No more. (And the oldest made Dean's list at university this first sememster, so I'm officially giving myself the okay. Apparently not doing all the matching of every assignment did not permanently damage her ability to read, write, and learn.)

3. If you find a math and it's working, stay with it. Be faithful. It's all good. You open cans and cans of worms by constantly switching math curriculum, IMO. YMMV.

4. Heavy outside "stuff" for non-older children we've found unbelievably taxing. My oldest children did piano, guitar, trampoline & tumbling, tumbling & tap, AWANAS, and soccer, and soccer, and more soccer, oh and summer t-ball and softball, some of which we helped coach. I no longer do the insanity because they no longer wish to have careers as pianists, guitar players, professional trampolinists, gymnasts, professional Bible quizzers - though I'd still be involved with AWANS, I felt that was worthwhile, nor are they professional athletes. I think everything you do with kiddos should be an investment - meaning there is some kind of return. For your family you might find these things are *investing* we found they were just leeches. My most "energetic" years as a schooler were years where I spent more time in the home, doing just select activities. I am actually going to have to totally re-vamp this next year and drive every day. I'll let you know how that goes. :driving:

So, now with one graduated and the another will be done with school at home next year except for writing and SAT prep, I feel pretty confident in my plans for the little people.

1. Get them reading. Not just reading, but READING. The sooner and more solid they can read, the better. This is at all costs. Do not skimp on reading ability, prosody, ability to read aloud, etc., in order to cover other curricula. Skip all curricula if you can do nothing other than get them reading solidly. I say this and half my kids are dyslexic. I'm remediating them. No excuses. Reading is the single most important skill you give them for academic success. Hit it, hit it again, and continue until they are PHENOMENAL readers.

2. Read or sleep. That is a rule we've had since like 2000 or 2001. At naptime, there is 1-2 HOURS you can read or sleep. You will do one or the other. Eventually even haters will choose to read. This will go back to the first tip. Create readers. We also bought them night time reading lights and "awarded" them to readers so that readers get to stay up a little later and read more. They thought it was a privilege. It was actually in our best interests. LOL. ;)

3. Pick their books. Until they are much, much older, pick their books. And when they are much, much older, still oversee their books. Ana is in college, we still talk about what she's reading. I don't pick anymore, I'm sure the professors would frown on it, lol, but we still discuss.

In K-5, everything else can be lightweight. Your first goal is reading, strong reading, and reading worthwhile things, classical literature, etc. Read aloud. Please, please, please, if you make time for something, read aloud. It has been proven this helps to make good writers. In my opinion, and someone will come and argue with me, you would be better served to skip writing programs until the fifth grade if you don't have time and just read aloud. A lot.

I picked books, so a lot of times my kids didn't do science. I just picked interesting science, non fiction books. Someone could argue, but my kids still tested very high on standardized tests in science. It worked for me. It also cut down on my teaching so that I could read aloud. See above.

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

Middle school - focus on writing. Focus on this like you did reading in elementary grades because it's foundational for high school success as reading was for middle school success. I like IEW for grade 5-7. But Christian has done Writing with Skill and that has been great for him. I also like PWN the SAT Essay, but really, truly that's for 10th+. IEWs essay programs for high school is great. But do make sure you hit writing strong in middle.

I will tell you I think grammar is important. I know that many don't think so, but assuming you have non-dyslexics, I really love Rod & Staff. :001_tt1: I have my kids do 1-2 years below their grade level so that it's not terribly hard for them and borders on self-teaching with a little help, but our oldest is the biggest fan of Rod & Staff. She's been taking Latin, Russian, and linguistic classes this year and having a solid grammar foundation has been very valuable.

Essentially what I'm saying is decide what is optional, what is fun and good, what is FOUNDATIONAL.

Reading in elementary is foundational.

Grammar in mid-elementary to lower middle is foundational.

Writing in middle is foundational.

I believe you CAN do more with less. The fewer frivolous things you do, the more foundational things you can cover WELL. And I actually think this is the perk of a large family. You simply don't have the ability to cover all things so you have to choose. In being forced to choose, you make sure you cover those foundational things more than adequately. It's a good thing.

This is so very very helpful. Like KeriJ I'm going to need to come back to this again. Doing less with more and truly simplifying has longtime been a desire of mine and yet fully implementing that ideal has eluded me a bit.

OneStepAtATime · March 13, 2015

BLSDMama you rock!

In fact, if it is o.k. with you, BLSDMama, I will print this and pass it on to a mom who is struggling in our local homeschooling community.

Best wishes, everyone. Good luck, Maize. :)

stm4him · March 14, 2015

I don't know if I count yet as a veteran mom since I haven't graduated anyone yet and am only about 2 years and 1 1/2 kiddos ahead of you, but I will chime in with what I am currently learning. Classical Conversations worked very well for us for 3 1/2 years because we focused on the 3R's, memorization from all subjects, and reading great books of choice loosely related to our topics for the year. I often taught in groups or at least the same subject for everyone at the same time. Little ones sat at the table for 20 minutes or so and were then dismissed and the next two for 30 minutes and the last two stayed for 40 minutes or so. No matter what had happened in the year I could always say we learned a lot and progressed in the 3R's. We often focused on language arts more strongly throughout the traditional schoolyear and math throughout the summer. After I began to have health issues I tried to hang on to continuing CC but after a year and a half and another pregnancy I just couldn't do it anymore. Then I had a bit of a crisis in terms of not knowing how to homeschool without CC and in the midst of my health issues with all the different needs, etc. and went to all workbooks and then to all computer schooling. Neither were authentically me so neither worked for very long (though one program I have respect for still and the other I do not.)

I love reading educational theory and so that both does me good and at times confuses or concerns me. There have been so many "successful" ways to homeschool that look utterly and completely different from each other that I don't worry so much if I am doing it "right". I do still worry that I may disappoint my own expectations for my children.

That being said, I feel like I am slowly gaining ground and finding a rhythm these days. I am finding the most satisfaction from short, consistent lessons for the young ones and consistent checking of the work of the olders daily. I am finding that consistent read aloud time at night is really enriching for all of us. They each get to choose a picture book or one chapter of a chapter book for me to read. I find that focusing on the 3 R's is most important for me to feel satisfied with our day. I add in a FEW MINUTES of Latin and Greek daily to fulfill one of my desires for my children without being overly cumbersome. I would like to do the same with music theory and typing soon. I find that drawing skills are the most important foundation for art and other subjects too. I think spending time drawing is more important than any other art skills and is practically free. I don't think they need a lot of lessons, but I think they need consistent practice while looking at something while they draw (vs. drawing from their heads.) We learn nature study and geography through drawing maps and pictures from The Country Diary of an Edwardian Lady. For us, history and fine arts come pretty naturally and find their way into our days without hardly any effort for me. Right now I am not nearly as good at incorporating science, but my third and fourth kiddos are much more wired for science so I am hoping that their personalities will naturally bring more science to our days soon.

What has been healthy for ME (because I have no choice but to pay attention to this now) is to STAY HOME as much as possible and delegate as much as I can to my husband and children. When we can afford it I get cleaning help. My oldest daughter attends choir once a week plus concerts throughout the year and my boys are in boys choir once a week. Both do one or two trips each year so they get to travel. Other than that we go to church. Once a week when I drive my daughter to choir I go run errands and usually bring one other child with me for "special time". Being outside is huge for my spirits and theirs. When it is beautiful outside we try to do as much school outside as we can and take lots of breaks. When it is rainy or cold outside we can do more cleaning or schoolwork or other bigger hands-on projects the kids want to do. We moved to a 15 acre piece of land with a barn and we got chickens. We have two ponds and a path through our woods. This SETTING has done WONDERS for us. My kids have fun every day because it is like living at a park. They love to go on adventures, build things, climb trees, go on walks, go fishing, make picnics, and on and on and on. I know this isn't possible for everyone but it was HUGE for us. We no longer feel like we need to go everywhere to occupy ourselves. Their childhood here is so precious and they are each other's best friends. Not that they weren't before, but it is even deeper now.

We have a "smaller" house compared to some with large families. We are about to have 8 children in a 2000 square foot house. They have a week's worth of clothes and about 4 pairs of shoes (tennis shoes, church shoes, rain/mud boots, and flip flops). They have bare minimum toys and lots of books. We have very little clutter and all of our curriculum and school supplies fit in one pantry (not walk in) and one large but narrow cabinet. The fewer things we own the easier it is for us to restore and maintain order and focus on enjoying life with each other. These may sound simple, but they are huge in terms of our lifestyle.

My kids take care of each other and learn to cook early. They each have a buddy they are responsible for helping throughout the day. I care less about things that used to matter to me like matching clothes. I sweep the floors almost daily, mop weekly, and do 2-3 loads of laundry daily. Our meals are done by my oldest or my husband and they are very simple. We have eggs for breakfast almost every day and they make their own lunch (either a sandwich or beans from a can with cheese and sour cream or leftovers).

I totally agree about focusing on certain things at certain ages and not trying to teach all of them all the subjects. My goal is to get them to become independent learners by teaching them to read and write first. I am currently not concerned about how much formal math instruction they get before age 8. I want them to learn handwriting and how to read. For me because of the way I teach, spelling goes hand and hand with reading so I feel that is most important. Then at age 8, third grade, or whenever they can pick up and read just about anything I will add in math instruction, the little bit of daily Latin and Greek, and grammar instead of phonics. As I said, I also think a little music theory and typing are worthwhile as well IF the 3 R's are getting accomplished consistently. I will focus more on writing in middle or high school. Other than these subjects I will either give them a reading list or assign a certain amount of daily reading in Bible, fiction, and nonfiction.

Most of our school years we have had a daily devotion or group time for learning things like manners, hymns, catechism, character, etc. We need to pick this up again. I have learned that this is best when the baby is down for a nap and that it isn't necessary to require my younger ones to attend, or at least not for the entire time.

Finally, the more I RELAX and focus on enjoying them and our time together, as well as enjoying life in general at our own pace with as few outside obligations as possible the more at peace I am with what we are doing and how they are turning out. I do still have freak out sessions at times (especially about math) but then I hop on here and get some advice or new direction and I am refreshed and calmed. God already has this worked out. I just need to be faithful to love my children and seek His guidance and rest in His plans. If all I do is equip them to self-educate and love learning they can do whatever it is they feel led to do in life. Their faith, their character, and their relationship with us and each other are most important of course.

This is the basic layout of our day right now:

My husband gets them up and started on chores and breakfast and getting dressed.

When I wake up I take my supplements and call my six year old in to read to me for 30 minutes from her reader.

Then I get up and eat, make my bed, get dressed, etc. By the time I am done my oldest two are usually done with math and bring it in to me to check and go over mistakes or concepts they need help with. Then they go eat and take a break before starting their language arts subjects.

I call my 8 year old to work with me on math and then he eats and takes a break as well.

I call my 6 year old to work with me on skip counting and handwriting/spelling.

When my oldest three are done with their language arts (including Latin and Greek) I check over those.

We spend the rest of the day outside or doing chores, silent reading time, following our own interests, etc.

In the evening after dinner we do read aloud and currently we are following that with a history documentary until bedtime.

As I said, I want to add in a few more independent subjects and our group time for a little while when the toddler naps. But I am happy that the rest is going consistently well :-)

happypamama · March 14, 2015

BlsdMama, that was amazing and helpful! I wish you'd post it on a blog somewhere so I could share it with my local support group.

lllll · March 14, 2015

..

Another Lynn · March 15, 2015

Well, our hs'ing was kind of messy, to say the least. It really began to come together when I discovered WTM. But my (5)dc were ages 6yo to 16yo by that time. So that threw a monkey wrench into the whole process - again - and it was still messy.

Our dc mostly worked individually with my checking their work and such. They were all at different levels, even in WTM. Some could read faster than others, so even though we might all have been doing Ancients, I never held back a child if they were reading faster down the list of books than other of our dc were. Same in all their subjects. Some flew through things, while others crept, methodically and meticulously, like snails, through ALL their subjects. I let them all go at their own paces.

At some point, I began to feel like they were indeed all off doing their own things, and I wanted to have some kind of gathering daily where we did something, although I wasn't sure what. I just knew I wanted more discussion about what they were each learning. So I began with Bible time. We gathered at lunch and listened to sermons on tape as we ate. Then, we discussed the teaching afterwards. This went so well, and the dc enjoyed it so much, that I did the same thing in other subjects, although not all subjects all at the same time.

I usually had a group time every day. I used this for books I thought they would get more out of when done together. For example, we did a couple of extra logic books that way. We went around the table reading the material aloud with discussion, then they would work the problems (there or for the next day), and finally we went back around the table with each child working a problem on the board as we went through the problem set. All dc would comment on the work on the board, explaining why they thought it was incorrect if they thought the answer was wrong. If it was correct, I asked if anyone had missed it. If someone had, I asked them to explain why and what they had done. More discussion, etc. And so on. We did a variety of books in many subjects this way - logic, Bible, math, sentence diagramming, Spelling Power and WRTR, hermeneutics, manners, self defense, a few Great Books, etc. - but never as a substitute for their individual work. They each always had their own work they did at their own paces.

Even for the little ones, it gave them a time where they could talk about what they were learning and, even, apply it. And, sometimes, the younger ones actually taught the older ones. And that happened much more than you would think it would, too. ;)

Yes! I've gradually gotten to a similar place - a together time of shared things - Bible, hymns, poetry, read alouds, diagramming, etc., but everyone still has a full slate of their own work afterwards.

Another Lynn · March 15, 2015

Maize,

I'll be honest I made a serious attempt to use all the "combining" curriculum out there. Bless their sweet, well-meaning hearts, just an FYI, "combining" middle school, elementary, and upper levels is never going to happen. My days were filled with trying to explain what too old curriculum meant to little people and adding on, supplementing, whatever word you want to use, for older children. It required a lot of organization, notes, planning (because I didn't buy all the books but utilized the library.)

I've simplified.

I actually have essentially gone back to how I did school when I had a few children.

There are a few things that have really WORKED for me and it's what I do.

1. We read lit according to a time period but I don't get wrapped up in perfect order.

2. I use a spine specific to the age.

For youngers, that's SOTW. For my middle girls, they have used both Streams of Civilization and the Genevieve Foster books. Then we made a list (at the beginning of the year) of lit I wanted them to read this year and they are steadily working through the list. Simplified. I'm not matching up absolutely everything, creating worksheets from nothing, etc.

I have also found the IEW books arranged for the time period slide nicely in here without me having to reinvent the wheel. Now, if I had two kids I'd carefully teach writing, pull subjects from their reading, and make it all fit together. But I don't. It's okay. I actually had small panic attacks (and larger ones) when my older kids were young about not MATCHING EVERYTHING. No more. (And the oldest made Dean's list at university this first sememster, so I'm officially giving myself the okay. Apparently not doing all the matching of every assignment did not permanently damage her ability to read, write, and learn.)

3. If you find a math and it's working, stay with it. Be faithful. It's all good. You open cans and cans of worms by constantly switching math curriculum, IMO. YMMV.

4. Heavy outside "stuff" for non-older children we've found unbelievably taxing. My oldest children did piano, guitar, trampoline & tumbling, tumbling & tap, AWANAS, and soccer, and soccer, and more soccer, oh and summer t-ball and softball, some of which we helped coach. I no longer do the insanity because they no longer wish to have careers as pianists, guitar players, professional trampolinists, gymnasts, professional Bible quizzers - though I'd still be involved with AWANS, I felt that was worthwhile, nor are they professional athletes. I think everything you do with kiddos should be an investment - meaning there is some kind of return. For your family you might find these things are *investing* we found they were just leeches. My most "energetic" years as a schooler were years where I spent more time in the home, doing just select activities. I am actually going to have to totally re-vamp this next year and drive every day. I'll let you know how that goes. :driving:

So, now with one graduated and the another will be done with school at home next year except for writing and SAT prep, I feel pretty confident in my plans for the little people.

1. Get them reading. Not just reading, but READING. The sooner and more solid they can read, the better. This is at all costs. Do not skimp on reading ability, prosody, ability to read aloud, etc., in order to cover other curricula. Skip all curricula if you can do nothing other than get them reading solidly. I say this and half my kids are dyslexic. I'm remediating them. No excuses. Reading is the single most important skill you give them for academic success. Hit it, hit it again, and continue until they are PHENOMENAL readers.

2. Read or sleep. That is a rule we've had since like 2000 or 2001. At naptime, there is 1-2 HOURS you can read or sleep. You will do one or the other. Eventually even haters will choose to read. This will go back to the first tip. Create readers. We also bought them night time reading lights and "awarded" them to readers so that readers get to stay up a little later and read more. They thought it was a privilege. It was actually in our best interests. LOL. ;)

3. Pick their books. Until they are much, much older, pick their books. And when they are much, much older, still oversee their books. Ana is in college, we still talk about what she's reading. I don't pick anymore, I'm sure the professors would frown on it, lol, but we still discuss.

In K-5, everything else can be lightweight. Your first goal is reading, strong reading, and reading worthwhile things, classical literature, etc. Read aloud. Please, please, please, if you make time for something, read aloud. It has been proven this helps to make good writers. In my opinion, and someone will come and argue with me, you would be better served to skip writing programs until the fifth grade if you don't have time and just read aloud. A lot.

I picked books, so a lot of times my kids didn't do science. I just picked interesting science, non fiction books. Someone could argue, but my kids still tested very high on standardized tests in science. It worked for me. It also cut down on my teaching so that I could read aloud. See above.

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

Middle school - focus on writing. Focus on this like you did reading in elementary grades because it's foundational for high school success as reading was for middle school success. I like IEW for grade 5-7. But Christian has done Writing with Skill and that has been great for him. I also like PWN the SAT Essay, but really, truly that's for 10th+. IEWs essay programs for high school is great. But do make sure you hit writing strong in middle.

I will tell you I think grammar is important. I know that many don't think so, but assuming you have non-dyslexics, I really love Rod & Staff. :001_tt1: I have my kids do 1-2 years below their grade level so that it's not terribly hard for them and borders on self-teaching with a little help, but our oldest is the biggest fan of Rod & Staff. She's been taking Latin, Russian, and linguistic classes this year and having a solid grammar foundation has been very valuable.

Essentially what I'm saying is decide what is optional, what is fun and good, what is FOUNDATIONAL.

Reading in elementary is foundational.

Grammar in mid-elementary to lower middle is foundational.

Writing in middle is foundational.

I believe you CAN do more with less. The fewer frivolous things you do, the more foundational things you can cover WELL. And I actually think this is the perk of a large family. You simply don't have the ability to cover all things so you have to choose. In being forced to choose, you make sure you cover those foundational things more than adequately. It's a good thing.

This is so good, it's worth quoting again....

I can totally support: 1) pre-eminence of read alouds, 2) establishing habit of school 3) using some resources at a level slightly easier than the level of the child.

I might add, whatever you cut or skip on a hectic day, never, never, never skip math.

KeriJ · June 6, 2017

wanted to bump this. :)

lots of little ducklings · June 6, 2017

Maize,

I'll be honest I made a serious attempt to use all the "combining" curriculum out there. Bless their sweet, well-meaning hearts, just an FYI, "combining" middle school, elementary, and upper levels is never going to happen. My days were filled with trying to explain what too old curriculum meant to little people and adding on, supplementing, whatever word you want to use, for older children. It required a lot of organization, notes, planning (because I didn't buy all the books but utilized the library.)

I've simplified.

I actually have essentially gone back to how I did school when I had a few children.

There are a few things that have really WORKED for me and it's what I do.

1. We read lit according to a time period but I don't get wrapped up in perfect order.

2. I use a spine specific to the age.

For youngers, that's SOTW. For my middle girls, they have used both Streams of Civilization and the Genevieve Foster books. Then we made a list (at the beginning of the year) of lit I wanted them to read this year and they are steadily working through the list. Simplified. I'm not matching up absolutely everything, creating worksheets from nothing, etc.

I have also found the IEW books arranged for the time period slide nicely in here without me having to reinvent the wheel. Now, if I had two kids I'd carefully teach writing, pull subjects from their reading, and make it all fit together. But I don't. It's okay. I actually had small panic attacks (and larger ones) when my older kids were young about not MATCHING EVERYTHING. No more. (And the oldest made Dean's list at university this first sememster, so I'm officially giving myself the okay. Apparently not doing all the matching of every assignment did not permanently damage her ability to read, write, and learn.)

3. If you find a math and it's working, stay with it. Be faithful. It's all good. You open cans and cans of worms by constantly switching math curriculum, IMO. YMMV.

4. Heavy outside "stuff" for non-older children we've found unbelievably taxing. My oldest children did piano, guitar, trampoline & tumbling, tumbling & tap, AWANAS, and soccer, and soccer, and more soccer, oh and summer t-ball and softball, some of which we helped coach. I no longer do the insanity because they no longer wish to have careers as pianists, guitar players, professional trampolinists, gymnasts, professional Bible quizzers - though I'd still be involved with AWANS, I felt that was worthwhile, nor are they professional athletes. I think everything you do with kiddos should be an investment - meaning there is some kind of return. For your family you might find these things are *investing* we found they were just leeches. My most "energetic" years as a schooler were years where I spent more time in the home, doing just select activities. I am actually going to have to totally re-vamp this next year and drive every day. I'll let you know how that goes. :driving:

So, now with one graduated and the another will be done with school at home next year except for writing and SAT prep, I feel pretty confident in my plans for the little people.

1. Get them reading. Not just reading, but READING. The sooner and more solid they can read, the better. This is at all costs. Do not skimp on reading ability, prosody, ability to read aloud, etc., in order to cover other curricula. Skip all curricula if you can do nothing other than get them reading solidly. I say this and half my kids are dyslexic. I'm remediating them. No excuses. Reading is the single most important skill you give them for academic success. Hit it, hit it again, and continue until they are PHENOMENAL readers.

2. Read or sleep. That is a rule we've had since like 2000 or 2001. At naptime, there is 1-2 HOURS you can read or sleep. You will do one or the other. Eventually even haters will choose to read. This will go back to the first tip. Create readers. We also bought them night time reading lights and "awarded" them to readers so that readers get to stay up a little later and read more. They thought it was a privilege. It was actually in our best interests. LOL. ;)

3. Pick their books. Until they are much, much older, pick their books. And when they are much, much older, still oversee their books. Ana is in college, we still talk about what she's reading. I don't pick anymore, I'm sure the professors would frown on it, lol, but we still discuss.

In K-5, everything else can be lightweight. Your first goal is reading, strong reading, and reading worthwhile things, classical literature, etc. Read aloud. Please, please, please, if you make time for something, read aloud. It has been proven this helps to make good writers. In my opinion, and someone will come and argue with me, you would be better served to skip writing programs until the fifth grade if you don't have time and just read aloud. A lot.

I picked books, so a lot of times my kids didn't do science. I just picked interesting science, non fiction books. Someone could argue, but my kids still tested very high on standardized tests in science. It worked for me. It also cut down on my teaching so that I could read aloud. See above.

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

Middle school - focus on writing. Focus on this like you did reading in elementary grades because it's foundational for high school success as reading was for middle school success. I like IEW for grade 5-7. But Christian has done Writing with Skill and that has been great for him. I also like PWN the SAT Essay, but really, truly that's for 10th+. IEWs essay programs for high school is great. But do make sure you hit writing strong in middle.

I will tell you I think grammar is important. I know that many don't think so, but assuming you have non-dyslexics, I really love Rod & Staff. :001_tt1: I have my kids do 1-2 years below their grade level so that it's not terribly hard for them and borders on self-teaching with a little help, but our oldest is the biggest fan of Rod & Staff. She's been taking Latin, Russian, and linguistic classes this year and having a solid grammar foundation has been very valuable.

Essentially what I'm saying is decide what is optional, what is fun and good, what is FOUNDATIONAL.

Reading in elementary is foundational.

Grammar in mid-elementary to lower middle is foundational.

Writing in middle is foundational.

I believe you CAN do more with less. The fewer frivolous things you do, the more foundational things you can cover WELL. And I actually think this is the perk of a large family. You simply don't have the ability to cover all things so you have to choose. In being forced to choose, you make sure you cover those foundational things more than adequately. It's a good thing.

I just saved this entire post onto my desktop.

Thank you for such fantastic advice!

MotherGoose · June 7, 2017

Maize,

I'll be honest I made a serious attempt to use all the "combining" curriculum out there. Bless their sweet, well-meaning hearts, just an FYI, "combining" middle school, elementary, and upper levels is never going to happen. My days were filled with trying to explain what too old curriculum meant to little people and adding on, supplementing, whatever word you want to use, for older children. It required a lot of organization, notes, planning (because I didn't buy all the books but utilized the library.)

I've simplified.

I actually have essentially gone back to how I did school when I had a few children.

There are a few things that have really WORKED for me and it's what I do.

1. We read lit according to a time period but I don't get wrapped up in perfect order.

2. I use a spine specific to the age.

For youngers, that's SOTW. For my middle girls, they have used both Streams of Civilization and the Genevieve Foster books. Then we made a list (at the beginning of the year) of lit I wanted them to read this year and they are steadily working through the list. Simplified. I'm not matching up absolutely everything, creating worksheets from nothing, etc.

I have also found the IEW books arranged for the time period slide nicely in here without me having to reinvent the wheel. Now, if I had two kids I'd carefully teach writing, pull subjects from their reading, and make it all fit together. But I don't. It's okay. I actually had small panic attacks (and larger ones) when my older kids were young about not MATCHING EVERYTHING. No more. (And the oldest made Dean's list at university this first sememster, so I'm officially giving myself the okay. Apparently not doing all the matching of every assignment did not permanently damage her ability to read, write, and learn.)

3. If you find a math and it's working, stay with it. Be faithful. It's all good. You open cans and cans of worms by constantly switching math curriculum, IMO. YMMV.

4. Heavy outside "stuff" for non-older children we've found unbelievably taxing. My oldest children did piano, guitar, trampoline & tumbling, tumbling & tap, AWANAS, and soccer, and soccer, and more soccer, oh and summer t-ball and softball, some of which we helped coach. I no longer do the insanity because they no longer wish to have careers as pianists, guitar players, professional trampolinists, gymnasts, professional Bible quizzers - though I'd still be involved with AWANS, I felt that was worthwhile, nor are they professional athletes. I think everything you do with kiddos should be an investment - meaning there is some kind of return. For your family you might find these things are *investing* we found they were just leeches. My most "energetic" years as a schooler were years where I spent more time in the home, doing just select activities. I am actually going to have to totally re-vamp this next year and drive every day. I'll let you know how that goes. :driving:

So, now with one graduated and the another will be done with school at home next year except for writing and SAT prep, I feel pretty confident in my plans for the little people.

1. Get them reading. Not just reading, but READING. The sooner and more solid they can read, the better. This is at all costs. Do not skimp on reading ability, prosody, ability to read aloud, etc., in order to cover other curricula. Skip all curricula if you can do nothing other than get them reading solidly. I say this and half my kids are dyslexic. I'm remediating them. No excuses. Reading is the single most important skill you give them for academic success. Hit it, hit it again, and continue until they are PHENOMENAL readers.

2. Read or sleep. That is a rule we've had since like 2000 or 2001. At naptime, there is 1-2 HOURS you can read or sleep. You will do one or the other. Eventually even haters will choose to read. This will go back to the first tip. Create readers. We also bought them night time reading lights and "awarded" them to readers so that readers get to stay up a little later and read more. They thought it was a privilege. It was actually in our best interests. LOL. ;)

3. Pick their books. Until they are much, much older, pick their books. And when they are much, much older, still oversee their books. Ana is in college, we still talk about what she's reading. I don't pick anymore, I'm sure the professors would frown on it, lol, but we still discuss.

In K-5, everything else can be lightweight. Your first goal is reading, strong reading, and reading worthwhile things, classical literature, etc. Read aloud. Please, please, please, if you make time for something, read aloud. It has been proven this helps to make good writers. In my opinion, and someone will come and argue with me, you would be better served to skip writing programs until the fifth grade if you don't have time and just read aloud. A lot.

I picked books, so a lot of times my kids didn't do science. I just picked interesting science, non fiction books. Someone could argue, but my kids still tested very high on standardized tests in science. It worked for me. It also cut down on my teaching so that I could read aloud. See above.

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

Middle school - focus on writing. Focus on this like you did reading in elementary grades because it's foundational for high school success as reading was for middle school success. I like IEW for grade 5-7. But Christian has done Writing with Skill and that has been great for him. I also like PWN the SAT Essay, but really, truly that's for 10th+. IEWs essay programs for high school is great. But do make sure you hit writing strong in middle.

I will tell you I think grammar is important. I know that many don't think so, but assuming you have non-dyslexics, I really love Rod & Staff. :001_tt1: I have my kids do 1-2 years below their grade level so that it's not terribly hard for them and borders on self-teaching with a little help, but our oldest is the biggest fan of Rod & Staff. She's been taking Latin, Russian, and linguistic classes this year and having a solid grammar foundation has been very valuable.

Essentially what I'm saying is decide what is optional, what is fun and good, what is FOUNDATIONAL.

Reading in elementary is foundational.

Grammar in mid-elementary to lower middle is foundational.

Writing in middle is foundational.

I believe you CAN do more with less. The fewer frivolous things you do, the more foundational things you can cover WELL. And I actually think this is the perk of a large family. You simply don't have the ability to cover all things so you have to choose. In being forced to choose, you make sure you cover those foundational things more than adequately. It's a good thing.

This post needs to have a five star rating or something :)

MotherGoose · June 7, 2017

I don't know if I count yet as a veteran mom since I haven't graduated anyone yet and am only about 2 years and 1 1/2 kiddos ahead of you, but I will chime in with what I am currently learning. Classical Conversations worked very well for us for 3 1/2 years because we focused on the 3R's, memorization from all subjects, and reading great books of choice loosely related to our topics for the year. I often taught in groups or at least the same subject for everyone at the same time. Little ones sat at the table for 20 minutes or so and were then dismissed and the next two for 30 minutes and the last two stayed for 40 minutes or so. No matter what had happened in the year I could always say we learned a lot and progressed in the 3R's. We often focused on language arts more strongly throughout the traditional schoolyear and math throughout the summer. After I began to have health issues I tried to hang on to continuing CC but after a year and a half and another pregnancy I just couldn't do it anymore. Then I had a bit of a crisis in terms of not knowing how to homeschool without CC and in the midst of my health issues with all the different needs, etc. and went to all workbooks and then to all computer schooling. Neither were authentically me so neither worked for very long (though one program I have respect for still and the other I do not.)

I love reading educational theory and so that both does me good and at times confuses or concerns me. There have been so many "successful" ways to homeschool that look utterly and completely different from each other that I don't worry so much if I am doing it "right". I do still worry that I may disappoint my own expectations for my children.

That being said, I feel like I am slowly gaining ground and finding a rhythm these days. I am finding the most satisfaction from short, consistent lessons for the young ones and consistent checking of the work of the olders daily. I am finding that consistent read aloud time at night is really enriching for all of us. They each get to choose a picture book or one chapter of a chapter book for me to read. I find that focusing on the 3 R's is most important for me to feel satisfied with our day. I add in a FEW MINUTES of Latin and Greek daily to fulfill one of my desires for my children without being overly cumbersome. I would like to do the same with music theory and typing soon. I find that drawing skills are the most important foundation for art and other subjects too. I think spending time drawing is more important than any other art skills and is practically free. I don't think they need a lot of lessons, but I think they need consistent practice while looking at something while they draw (vs. drawing from their heads.) We learn nature study and geography through drawing maps and pictures from The Country Diary of an Edwardian Lady. For us, history and fine arts come pretty naturally and find their way into our days without hardly any effort for me. Right now I am not nearly as good at incorporating science, but my third and fourth kiddos are much more wired for science so I am hoping that their personalities will naturally bring more science to our days soon.

What has been healthy for ME (because I have no choice but to pay attention to this now) is to STAY HOME as much as possible and delegate as much as I can to my husband and children. When we can afford it I get cleaning help. My oldest daughter attends choir once a week plus concerts throughout the year and my boys are in boys choir once a week. Both do one or two trips each year so they get to travel. Other than that we go to church. Once a week when I drive my daughter to choir I go run errands and usually bring one other child with me for "special time". Being outside is huge for my spirits and theirs. When it is beautiful outside we try to do as much school outside as we can and take lots of breaks. When it is rainy or cold outside we can do more cleaning or schoolwork or other bigger hands-on projects the kids want to do. We moved to a 15 acre piece of land with a barn and we got chickens. We have two ponds and a path through our woods. This SETTING has done WONDERS for us. My kids have fun every day because it is like living at a park. They love to go on adventures, build things, climb trees, go on walks, go fishing, make picnics, and on and on and on. I know this isn't possible for everyone but it was HUGE for us. We no longer feel like we need to go everywhere to occupy ourselves. Their childhood here is so precious and they are each other's best friends. Not that they weren't before, but it is even deeper now.

We have a "smaller" house compared to some with large families. We are about to have 8 children in a 2000 square foot house. They have a week's worth of clothes and about 4 pairs of shoes (tennis shoes, church shoes, rain/mud boots, and flip flops). They have bare minimum toys and lots of books. We have very little clutter and all of our curriculum and school supplies fit in one pantry (not walk in) and one large but narrow cabinet. The fewer things we own the easier it is for us to restore and maintain order and focus on enjoying life with each other. These may sound simple, but they are huge in terms of our lifestyle.

My kids take care of each other and learn to cook early. They each have a buddy they are responsible for helping throughout the day. I care less about things that used to matter to me like matching clothes. I sweep the floors almost daily, mop weekly, and do 2-3 loads of laundry daily. Our meals are done by my oldest or my husband and they are very simple. We have eggs for breakfast almost every day and they make their own lunch (either a sandwich or beans from a can with cheese and sour cream or leftovers).

I totally agree about focusing on certain things at certain ages and not trying to teach all of them all the subjects. My goal is to get them to become independent learners by teaching them to read and write first. I am currently not concerned about how much formal math instruction they get before age 8. I want them to learn handwriting and how to read. For me because of the way I teach, spelling goes hand and hand with reading so I feel that is most important. Then at age 8, third grade, or whenever they can pick up and read just about anything I will add in math instruction, the little bit of daily Latin and Greek, and grammar instead of phonics. As I said, I also think a little music theory and typing are worthwhile as well IF the 3 R's are getting accomplished consistently. I will focus more on writing in middle or high school. Other than these subjects I will either give them a reading list or assign a certain amount of daily reading in Bible, fiction, and nonfiction.

Most of our school years we have had a daily devotion or group time for learning things like manners, hymns, catechism, character, etc. We need to pick this up again. I have learned that this is best when the baby is down for a nap and that it isn't necessary to require my younger ones to attend, or at least not for the entire time.

Finally, the more I RELAX and focus on enjoying them and our time together, as well as enjoying life in general at our own pace with as few outside obligations as possible the more at peace I am with what we are doing and how they are turning out. I do still have freak out sessions at times (especially about math) but then I hop on here and get some advice or new direction and I am refreshed and calmed. God already has this worked out. I just need to be faithful to love my children and seek His guidance and rest in His plans. If all I do is equip them to self-educate and love learning they can do whatever it is they feel led to do in life. Their faith, their character, and their relationship with us and each other are most important of course.

This is the basic layout of our day right now:

My husband gets them up and started on chores and breakfast and getting dressed.

When I wake up I take my supplements and call my six year old in to read to me for 30 minutes from her reader.

Then I get up and eat, make my bed, get dressed, etc. By the time I am done my oldest two are usually done with math and bring it in to me to check and go over mistakes or concepts they need help with. Then they go eat and take a break before starting their language arts subjects.

I call my 8 year old to work with me on math and then he eats and takes a break as well.

I call my 6 year old to work with me on skip counting and handwriting/spelling.

When my oldest three are done with their language arts (including Latin and Greek) I check over those.

We spend the rest of the day outside or doing chores, silent reading time, following our own interests, etc.

In the evening after dinner we do read aloud and currently we are following that with a history documentary until bedtime.

As I said, I want to add in a few more independent subjects and our group time for a little while when the toddler naps. But I am happy that the rest is going consistently well :-)

ðŸ’• This too.

vaquitita · June 8, 2017

Maize,

I'll be honest I made a serious attempt to use all the "combining" curriculum out there. Bless their sweet, well-meaning hearts, just an FYI, "combining" middle school, elementary, and upper levels is never going to happen. My days were filled with trying to explain what too old curriculum meant to little people and adding on, supplementing, whatever word you want to use, for older children. It required a lot of organization, notes, planning (because I didn't buy all the books but utilized the library.)

I've simplified.

I actually have essentially gone back to how I did school when I had a few children.

There are a few things that have really WORKED for me and it's what I do.

1. We read lit according to a time period but I don't get wrapped up in perfect order.

2. I use a spine specific to the age.

For youngers, that's SOTW. For my middle girls, they have used both Streams of Civilization and the Genevieve Foster books. Then we made a list (at the beginning of the year) of lit I wanted them to read this year and they are steadily working through the list. Simplified. I'm not matching up absolutely everything, creating worksheets from nothing, etc.

I have also found the IEW books arranged for the time period slide nicely in here without me having to reinvent the wheel. Now, if I had two kids I'd carefully teach writing, pull subjects from their reading, and make it all fit together. But I don't. It's okay. I actually had small panic attacks (and larger ones) when my older kids were young about not MATCHING EVERYTHING. No more. (And the oldest made Dean's list at university this first sememster, so I'm officially giving myself the okay. Apparently not doing all the matching of every assignment did not permanently damage her ability to read, write, and learn.)

3. If you find a math and it's working, stay with it. Be faithful. It's all good. You open cans and cans of worms by constantly switching math curriculum, IMO. YMMV.

4. Heavy outside "stuff" for non-older children we've found unbelievably taxing. My oldest children did piano, guitar, trampoline & tumbling, tumbling & tap, AWANAS, and soccer, and soccer, and more soccer, oh and summer t-ball and softball, some of which we helped coach. I no longer do the insanity because they no longer wish to have careers as pianists, guitar players, professional trampolinists, gymnasts, professional Bible quizzers - though I'd still be involved with AWANS, I felt that was worthwhile, nor are they professional athletes. I think everything you do with kiddos should be an investment - meaning there is some kind of return. For your family you might find these things are *investing* we found they were just leeches. My most "energetic" years as a schooler were years where I spent more time in the home, doing just select activities. I am actually going to have to totally re-vamp this next year and drive every day. I'll let you know how that goes. :driving:

So, now with one graduated and the another will be done with school at home next year except for writing and SAT prep, I feel pretty confident in my plans for the little people.

1. Get them reading. Not just reading, but READING. The sooner and more solid they can read, the better. This is at all costs. Do not skimp on reading ability, prosody, ability to read aloud, etc., in order to cover other curricula. Skip all curricula if you can do nothing other than get them reading solidly. I say this and half my kids are dyslexic. I'm remediating them. No excuses. Reading is the single most important skill you give them for academic success. Hit it, hit it again, and continue until they are PHENOMENAL readers.

2. Read or sleep. That is a rule we've had since like 2000 or 2001. At naptime, there is 1-2 HOURS you can read or sleep. You will do one or the other. Eventually even haters will choose to read. This will go back to the first tip. Create readers. We also bought them night time reading lights and "awarded" them to readers so that readers get to stay up a little later and read more. They thought it was a privilege. It was actually in our best interests. LOL. ;)

3. Pick their books. Until they are much, much older, pick their books. And when they are much, much older, still oversee their books. Ana is in college, we still talk about what she's reading. I don't pick anymore, I'm sure the professors would frown on it, lol, but we still discuss.

In K-5, everything else can be lightweight. Your first goal is reading, strong reading, and reading worthwhile things, classical literature, etc. Read aloud. Please, please, please, if you make time for something, read aloud. It has been proven this helps to make good writers. In my opinion, and someone will come and argue with me, you would be better served to skip writing programs until the fifth grade if you don't have time and just read aloud. A lot.

I picked books, so a lot of times my kids didn't do science. I just picked interesting science, non fiction books. Someone could argue, but my kids still tested very high on standardized tests in science. It worked for me. It also cut down on my teaching so that I could read aloud. See above.

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

Middle school - focus on writing. Focus on this like you did reading in elementary grades because it's foundational for high school success as reading was for middle school success. I like IEW for grade 5-7. But Christian has done Writing with Skill and that has been great for him. I also like PWN the SAT Essay, but really, truly that's for 10th+. IEWs essay programs for high school is great. But do make sure you hit writing strong in middle.

I will tell you I think grammar is important. I know that many don't think so, but assuming you have non-dyslexics, I really love Rod & Staff. :001_tt1: I have my kids do 1-2 years below their grade level so that it's not terribly hard for them and borders on self-teaching with a little help, but our oldest is the biggest fan of Rod & Staff. She's been taking Latin, Russian, and linguistic classes this year and having a solid grammar foundation has been very valuable.

Essentially what I'm saying is decide what is optional, what is fun and good, what is FOUNDATIONAL.

Reading in elementary is foundational.

Grammar in mid-elementary to lower middle is foundational.

Writing in middle is foundational.

I believe you CAN do more with less. The fewer frivolous things you do, the more foundational things you can cover WELL. And I actually think this is the perk of a large family. You simply don't have the ability to cover all things so you have to choose. In being forced to choose, you make sure you cover those foundational things more than adequately. It's a good thing.

Well I love all of this, but I'm particularly intrigued by this part:

I will tell you that I had my kiddos and still have them do workbooks. Why? No educational reason whatsoever. I have them do workbooks so that at a young age they get in the habit of waking up, doing chores, getting dressed, and doing school. It simply creates a habit. I don't really think there's that much value in them at all. They are, IMO, busy work. But the IDEA of waking up and doing school without complaining or fussing is absolutely INVALUABLE. MCP books, Explode the Code, HWoT, Rod & Staff workbooks for "beneath" their working level for re-inforcing ideas, whatever is easy, inexpensive, and you like. ;)

I have pretty much done the opposite of this and I must say my oldest is whiney and lazy. I am rather interested in trying this. If I give them workbooks 1-2 years below, then I'll know they can do it and can do it themselves and can tell them to just suck it up and do it. It's very intriguing idea... I'm guessing that one busy work workbook on top of their regular work would be enough?

BlsdMama · June 13, 2017

Well I love all of this, but I'm particularly intrigued by this part:

I have pretty much done the opposite of this and I must say my oldest is whiney and lazy. I am rather interested in trying this. If I give them workbooks 1-2 years below, then I'll know they can do it and can do it themselves and can tell them to just suck it up and do it. It's very intriguing idea... I'm guessing that one busy work workbook on top of their regular work would be enough?

So let's talk this out so you can see where I am coming from....

You say you have a whining, lazy child who fights you on the work he/she has and you hope, by adding more work, that you will inspire them to love it? I doubt that will happen. I suggest that you revamp a little, temporarily. My youngest kids think they love and adore doing school. I do the bare minimum in sit down work, like a crazy, tiny amount. What age are we talking here?

Now, do they do work? Absolutely. We read aloud, we discuss, they do ETC, they do little math workbooks. (I am thinking of my upcoming 2nd and my last year's 3rd grader right now.) What am I doing? Just habit training.

So if your end goal is to retrain the HABIT of the ATTITUDE he/she has during school, then tossing on more work so that you know they can do it and hold them accountable won't work. It will result in more whining, more resentment, more fuss. Minimize the work to the most important things and let them catch on to the value of getting their work done, having time to read or listen to audio books, have value in their interests and hobbies, spend time reading together. It is very inspiring. Then add in something else. Then later, something else. (Not too fast.) Your end goal is to be on the same time, working together for a happy home and success and joy. Keep in mind as well that Rod & Staff two levels below grade level is still a solid education, just much more manageable as mostly independent work.

ETA: I peeked. Okay, your oldest is 11. So, you are right there in that first year of middle school. Let me ask - how is his reading and his ATTITUDE towards reading? That's the first goal. Then let's talk about writing and writing ability. That is your next couple years going forward as well as continue massive reading and reading aloud. And, all the while, now make steady progress in Math.

Is it laziness? Or is it difficult? Sometimes those two things can look similar.

Talk to me about his reading and reading habits and then I can help a little more. ;)

Edited June 13, 2017 by BlsdMama

vaquitita · June 15, 2017

Well I didn't think adding more work would make him love school. Lol. It was more of a get used to working even when you don't feel like it. :D The thing is I know that in the past I have cut back his work load when he's whined about stuff. His work has always been cut back to the most important things. He just wants to get his school done as fast as possible because it's interfering with his Lego play.

Reading... He reads pretty well and likes reading. He says he likes math, but always complains when doing it. He dislikes writing. Tho just this week he did start writing a book.

Because of his complaining I find myself hesitating to assign him daily spelling and grammar and writing next year. ðŸ™„

Eta: I guess I don't really mean busy work. But I've tried cutting back to the bare minimum and trying to get them to like school, that's what I've done all along, but it hasn't worked. Well, I guess if you ask them about individual subjects, they do like most of them. Except writing and math. They like history and science (except the year I tried having them write about it) and reading.

Edited June 15, 2017 by vaquitita

Another Lynn · June 15, 2017

vaquitita,

I found myself smiling as I read about your oldest. He sounds so much like my 18yo. Writing, math, and science were our nemesis. No amount of tweaking made the school tug of war better. He just wanted to read or play. But you know what he did in highschool? Started writing books on his own. :laugh: (He never did love math and science, fwiw). Most of the hindsight I have with that one probably goes back younger than 11 (wish I had known about CLE for math sooner; wish I had never wasted his time trying various programs like HOD and TOG, wish I had just known the path better - when to push and when to back off.) Other than that, get the dreaded subjects done first thing. Find your most efficient grammar and do it first thing. Consider whether he needs to continue with a spelling program or not. Let him free write for a year. Just make sure math gets done everyday. Encourage/require plenty of reading. Read really good books aloud. Keep history and science in whatever form they like it. And then let them get to the legos. (My 18 and 15yo currently have a lego thing spread on the floor of their room. I think much of that fed into the books they are both writing. :D )

June 15, 2017

vaquitita,

I found myself smiling as I read about your oldest. He sounds so much like my 18yo. Writing, math, and science were our nemesis. No amount of tweaking made the school tug of war better. He just wanted to read or play. But you know what he did in highschool? Started writing books on his own. :laugh: (He never did love math and science, fwiw). Most of the hindsight I have with that one probably goes back younger than 11 (wish I had known about CLE for math sooner; wish I had never wasted his time trying various programs like HOD and TOG, wish I had just known the path better - when to push and when to back off.) Other than that, get the dreaded subjects done first thing. Find your most efficient grammar and do it first thing. Consider whether he needs to continue with a spelling program or not. Let him free write for a year. Just make sure math gets done everyday. Encourage/require plenty of reading. Read really good books aloud. Keep history and science in whatever form they like it. And then let them get to the legos. (My 18 and 15yo currently have a lego thing spread on the floor of their room. I think much of that fed into the books they are both writing. :D )

Oh my word I have to save this post. It sounds like my five year old is going to be similar!! He's already saying, "Let's just get this done Mom. I need to go work on my legos." And then he buckles down and knocks it all out and off he goes, whereas my daughters will string it along all day.

vaquitita · June 15, 2017

vaquitita,

I found myself smiling as I read about your oldest. He sounds so much like my 18yo. Writing, math, and science were our nemesis. No amount of tweaking made the school tug of war better. He just wanted to read or play. But you know what he did in highschool? Started writing books on his own. :laugh: (He never did love math and science, fwiw). Most of the hindsight I have with that one probably goes back younger than 11 (wish I had known about CLE for math sooner; wish I had never wasted his time trying various programs like HOD and TOG, wish I had just known the path better - when to push and when to back off.) Other than that, get the dreaded subjects done first thing. Find your most efficient grammar and do it first thing. Consider whether he needs to continue with a spelling program or not. Let him free write for a year. Just make sure math gets done everyday. Encourage/require plenty of reading. Read really good books aloud. Keep history and science in whatever form they like it. And then let them get to the legos. (My 18 and 15yo currently have a lego thing spread on the floor of their room. I think much of that fed into the books they are both writing. :D )

Doing the disliked subjects first is an idea... Right now we start with the fun stuff, an hour of read alouds for lit, history, etc. But maybe getting that yucky stuff out of the way first, dangling the carrot of read aloud time as soon as they're done might motivate them. :D

The Well-Trained Mind Extended Guide

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