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What exactly is the IB program?


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I put in an application for my DS for a school that is kind of supposed to be a daily G&T program. I can't remember the terminology but it's also supposed to be a pre-IB school. (It's 4th through 8th) I was mentioning it to a friend who said the IB is kind of a "global citizen" (maybe even a little left leaning) type ideology. Anyway, it made me think I should look into this more. The complaints she heard were from parents whose kids were in scouts and church activities where the "good citizen" thing was not only redundant but the school work wrt the global citizenship felt like busy work.

 

What say ye? I clearly don't know much about it.

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Well, my information is....<mumble somenumberofyears mumble> out of date.  But from my experience:

 

Global citizen?  Erm.  I don't know what that's supposed to mean.  IB is International Baccalaureate, it was started by Swiss ex-pats who wanted their kids to be able to go home to university (so I'm told) and the locl curricula weren't cutting it.  Naturally it has expanded since then.  It's offered in many languages, but the idea is that all over the world, it's the same curriculum.  Er...common core to the max?   :lol:    Anyway, if you take Higher Level math in Swaziland in English, or you take Higher Level math in France in French, it should be the same material.  Then when you apply to university in Moscow and say you've done Higher Level math, they know what you've covered and know whether they'll give you first year credit for it or not.  Or so the theory goes.  In practice, in my area schools did not give credit for it.  It was, however, good preparation for university-level courses.

 

I don't know that we covered much ideology.   :confused1:   It did a good deal of critical thinking, though.  And I can't remember stuff that I didn't agree with other than my English curriculum which focused on the existentialist writers.  I didn't care for that at all, but some kids liked it.  I suppose you could argue that's left-leaning?  It is a whole movement in literature, though.

 

Now, pre-IB at the time was only Grade 10.  So I have no idea what a grades 4-8 pre-IB school would be.  That's new.

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Calvin did it. The ideology was thinking globally rather than left leaning. And as the PP said: lots of questioning of assumptions and critical thinking. We think it is a pretty good programme.

 

The volunteering can be anything, so existing volunteering counts - no need for extra.

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I don't remember a lot of ideology.

 

For English we did World Lit, maybe that is part of it?  For history it was History of the Americas, which was naturally dominated by the US, really.  I think the ideology of the teachers themselves is much more likely to appear than any ideology from the curriculum.

 

There is a component that you have to do some community service (I feel like it was 50 hours over the course of 2 years?  I don't remember exactly); our school required 5 hours/class of community service to receive weighted credit anyway, so the IB requirement was irrelevant.  Maybe that is the global citizen thing?  although it seems more like a local citizen thing.

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In simple terms, it's a curriculum made up of six subjects (three at higher level and three at standard level) that leads to internationally-recognised assessments and exams.  In addition to the six subjects, there is a requirement for an extended essay and for work on the Theory of Knowledge.  Also needed are a certain number or hours of creativity, action and service.

 

That's it in a nutshell.

 

L

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In simple terms, it's a curriculum made up of six subjects (three at higher level and three at standard level) that leads to internationally-recognised assessments and exams.  In addition to the six subjects, there is a requirement for an extended essay and for work on the Theory of Knowledge.  Also needed are a certain number or hours of creativity, action and service.

 

That's it in a nutshell.

 

L

 

This. 

 

All my kids best friends are in the IB program in the next school district over. Laura's description is it in a nutshell very nicely. Instead of AP exams, the kids take IB exams. The work is set at a high level. There is a lot more writing and connections and a lot less worksheet and fill in the blanks. There is a lot more work. period. Compared to the standard high school education here, it is a solid program and the degree is recognized internationally. Colleges like it and noncompetitive colleges tend to reward IB diplomas with scholarships.

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ETA2:  I never did any busy work during my high school years.  Overall, the academics were very strong, especially so once the official IB program started.  I have no idea what a pre-IB program would look like at the grade school level.  The IB program itself is designed to be for the last two years of school (or at least when I went through).  There might be all sorts of globalism/international flair (i.e. "citizen of the world" type stuff) added at a lower level that is not present in the program itself to make this particular local program more distinctive.  From my experience, there is nothing very specific about preparing to do IB classes aside from very solid academics (on a level that is unfortunately not present in the schools in our area) combined with developing excellent time and stress management skills. 

 

There are three paths into the IB program here. One is just to test in at the high school level. The second, is to test into the standard gifted program, one pull out day/week in elementary and a few "honors" classes through middle school. The third, is a program that starts in 6th grade putting those kids into the same high school where the IB program is housed. They begin taking a full load of high school courses in 6-8th, then they end up with all the advanced IB classes by the time they are done, rather than the 3 standard level, 3 advanced required for the degree. I only know one girl who did this route. She is a senior in college now where she got a full ride scholarship. Academics were always her thing and she loved it.

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 The third, is a program that starts in 6th grade putting those kids into the same high school where the IB program is housed. They begin taking a full load of high school courses in 6-8th, then they end up with all the advanced IB classes by the time they are done, rather than the 3 standard level, 3 advanced required for the degree. I only know one girl who did this route. She is a senior in college now where she got a full ride scholarship. Academics were always her thing and she loved it.

 

That's a difficult path to take in the UK - the university application procedure discourages it.  Because you potentially get the same number of points per subject whether you take six highers or three highers and three standards, people who want to go to selective universities are highly recommended to go with the normal structure, so as not to risk getting lower marks on an ultra-challenging curriculum.  A university conditional offer of a place to an IB pupil is likely to be, for example, 36 points with at least sixes obtained in the higher subjects.

 

In general, I'm not a big fan of trying to game a system, but I think that the IB is challenging enough and there's no real need to push it if it will actually disadvantage you.....  US universities may be better at rewarding the extra challenge.

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Is IB Maths integrated?

 

Yes.  There are three kinds of maths (ETA - at my boys' school), all integrated: higher (for people who have the talent/interest to pursue a STEM degree/career); standard (good high school maths); studies (maths for people who are not good at/have no interest in maths).  Studies is a little higher in level than the IGCSE maths course that Calvin had done previously, but not much.  I had the impression that Studies was weighted towards statistics/life maths, but I didn't look at the curriculum in details.

 

This page might give you some clues.  Apparently there is another maths course higher than 'Higher' that my boys' school doesn't offer as a regular course.

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Yes.  There are three kinds of maths (ETA - at my boys' school), all integrated: higher (for people who have the talent/interest to pursue a STEM degree/career); standard (good high school maths); studies (maths for people who are not good at/have no interest in maths).  Studies is a little higher in level than the IGCSE maths course that Calvin had done previously, but not much.  I had the impression that Studies was weighted towards statistics/life maths, but I didn't look at the curriculum in details.

 

This page might give you some clues.  Apparently there is another maths course higher than 'Higher' that my boys' school doesn't offer as a regular course.

It is interesting that IB offers four levels of Mathematics (for an honors program) but the page you cite was written by some edu-crat type and says almost nothing in concrete terms.

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It is interesting that IB offers four levels of Mathematics (for an honors program) but the page you cite was written by some edu-crat type and says almost nothing in concrete terms.

 

That page is a general introduction.  I'm sure you can find the details if you want to spend the time on it.  

 

The IB may be used as an honours programme in some schools in the US, but it was designed as a comprehensive university preparation programme: every pupil at my sons' school follows it.  Thus it needs different levels within the programme.

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That's a difficult path to take in the UK - the university application procedure discourages it.  Because you potentially get the same number of points per subject whether you take six highers or three highers and three standards, people who want to go to selective universities are highly recommended to go with the normal structure, so as not to risk getting lower marks on an ultra-challenging curriculum.  A university conditional offer of a place to an IB pupil is likely to be, for example, 36 points with at least sixes obtained in the higher subjects.

 

In general, I'm not a big fan of trying to game a system, but I think that the IB is challenging enough and there's no real need to push it if it will actually disadvantage you.....  US universities may be better at rewarding the extra challenge.

 

That is interesting Laura.

 

The kids in that path here are highly gifted. The minimum IQ to apply is 150 and most are pretty far above that, as it is an application process with a set number being accepted each year and very competitive entry. For the family I know, they wanted to keep their dd with age mates, rather than accelerate her through school and graduate early and that program worked for her. She did all the normal high school stuff at all the normal ages (choirs, prom, social stuff) and graduated at 18, but still felt reasonably challenged by academics. I think it is difficult for highly gifted kids to find a path through high school that works for them. Each has their own drawbacks. Doing a standard IB path she would have graduated a couple of years early and that wasn't the right fit for her. I'm glad she wasn't penalized for the decision, but I think here it would be easy to explain that choice in college essays.

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 I think it is difficult for highly gifted kids to find a path through high school that works for them. Each has their own drawbacks. Doing a standard IB path she would have graduated a couple of years early and that wasn't the right fit for her. I'm glad she wasn't penalized for the decision, but I think here it would be easy to explain that choice in college essays.

 

That's interesting - I really don't know how the universities would react here.  It's not so much that one can't do it (one pupil in Calvin's year at school did four highers and two standards) but there is the fear that by increasing the challenge one reduces the marks, and (because we don't have transcripts) exam marks are really important for entry.  Essentially, the university says, 'We like you and will give you a place if you achieve X marks on the IB.'  Then the conditional offer is fulfilled when you get your results.

 

That being said, Calvin is in that IQ range, and there were definitely times when he could have done with more challenge.  I don't think challenge in science and maths would have pleased him, however..

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There is a huge variety in IB schools.  Be sure to find out what the average score is, and be suspicious if you can't get an answer.

 

Also, in parts of the USA it is common to insert an IB program into a failing or otherwise troubled school as a way to bring academic-minded kids into the school. Not necessarily a reason to reject the progam...just something to be aware of.

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There is a huge variety in IB schools.  Be sure to find out what the average score is, and be suspicious if you can't get an answer.

 

Also, in parts of the USA it is common to insert an IB program into a failing or otherwise troubled school as a way to bring academic-minded kids into the school. Not necessarily a reason to reject the progam...just something to be aware of.

 

I agree people need to check scores but how is the bolded even possible. It took at least two years for the three IB schools in my county to become IB schools. We were kept informed during the process and there was a big to do when they received certification (each at different times over several years). If failing schools are suddenly claiming IB status, I would assume they are not really certified.

 

ETA: And one of those three schools was our local middle school. So, they aren't even offering an actual diploma just a middle years program of study. It took them almost three years for that.

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Joker, I know that you are right that it takes time to get the IB program certified. I will just take a guess on how this happens, but it is only a guess. Perhaps the IB program certification is just that: a program certification. The rest of the school continues about its business.

 

My son went to IB within a school in Europe, and there was no overlap between the tiny IB department and the rest of the school. Different courses, different instructors.

 

In my local stateside district, the IB program is in one of the worst schools in the district. It is a tiny part of a big school. If my kid wanted to go to IB, that is where he is zoned for IB access. This is also true in the district next door, and it is true in my hometown (different state) district. These otherwise low-performing schools really do house certified IB programs.

 

Rethinking, I should have left the word "common" out of my comment. But it is not unheard of.

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  • 8 months later...

http://www.buzzfeed.com/jessicamisener/27-sure-signs-you-were-in-the-ib-program

 

Funny IB gifs for those who care to look at gifs related to IB program.

 

On a personal note, I did IB in high school, not middle. If it were an option I'd sign up the kids in a heartbeat if they were academically inclined/gifted, and the program was available to us. In high school it is a HUGE commitment not to taken lightly but it is highly regarded academically. World citizen thoughts on the high school level practically meant taking a foreign language for four years.

 

The program is great for encouraging thinking skills vs rote memorization (not that there is no memorization, of course).

 

I have no personal experience with the middle school program but I know the IB website has a section on it you can look up their requirements.

 

All programs that have been certified meet the standards, though in any school there will be good and bad teachers. The teachers for my program were all extremely motivated and dedicated teachers, despite teaching in a low income area. In high school the classes are college level for the last couple years.

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In Canada, in High School, in the 90's -- it was basically an academic acceleration program. You covered basic high school at a more rapid pace, then covered material that is usually not included in high school. It didn't have any noticeable ideology: just lots of homework. It required academic skills, dedication and academic-style intelligence.

 

The result was that you could submit to universities a good grade in a specific HS IB class as a sort of transfer credit at the beginning of your university career. However, harder work and higher expectations might bring your overall grades down, so it was somewhat risky, unless you were sure you could excel at IB, not just do fairly well at it.

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In Canada, in High School, in the 90's -- it was basically an academic acceleration program. You covered basic high school at a more rapid pace, then covered material that is usually not included in high school. It didn't have any noticeable ideology: just lots of homework. It required academic skills, dedication and academic-style intelligence.

 

The result was that you could submit to universities a good grade in a specific HS IB class as a sort of transfer credit at the beginning of your university career. However, harder work and higher expectations might bring your overall grades down, so it was somewhat risky, unless you were sure you could excel at IB, not just do fairly well at it.

My school weighed IB classes 2 points above regular classes. I think I'm recalling correctly :). So a C in an IB class was a 4.0.

 

Some universities grant one year of credit for an IB diploma.

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