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Eleven (11) dead at Paris newspaper after gunmen attack


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http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30710883

 

"Gunmen have attacked the Paris office of French satirical magazine Charlie Hebdo, killing 11 people and injuring 10, French officials say.

 

Witnesses spoke of sustained gunfire at the office as the attackers opened fire with assault rifles.

 

The satirical weekly has courted controversy in the past with its take on news and current affairs."

 

This is horrible. I feel sick.

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creekland, on 07 Jan 2015 - 04:16 AM, said:

Same here.  It's a sad world we're living in when individuals (or groups) impose the death penalty on others so readily and without remorse.

 

Live and let live is dying.

the death penalty?  you make it sound like it was a legal proceeding.  it. was. not.

 

it was hate-filled cold blooded murder.

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the death penalty?  you make it sound like it was a legal proceeding.  it. was. not.

 

it was hate-filled cold blooded murder.

 

I had no intent whatsoever of making it appear like anything legal.

 

At school, I've found kids catch the concept better when I relate such murders to the death penalty in this type of form.  They know the death penalty requires a heinous crime that is (hopefully) proven and deserves such a severe penalty.  It's kind of set in their minds already by high school age.

 

But with all the shootings lately, some were starting to justify a few of them - broke up with girlfriend?  Of course you'd feel emotional and want to show it.   :glare:   Disagree with what someone is doing?  Sometimes it can be justified.  :glare:  :glare:

 

When I make the connection to the death penalty over such "crimes" they "get it" and no longer see the justification in it at all.

 

At this point, I'm willing to use whatever it takes to get them to see the fallacy in all this "normal" that they are growing up with.

 

The connection is supposed to appear foolish.  What is happening IS foolish - deadly so.

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creekland, on 07 Jan 2015 - 05:04 AM, said:creekland, on 07 Jan 2015 - 05:04 AM, said:

I had no intent whatsoever of making it appear like anything legal.

 

At school, I've found kids catch the concept better when I relate such murders to the death penalty in this type of form.  They know the death penalty requires a heinous crime that is (hopefully) proven and deserves such a severe penalty.  It's kind of set in their minds already by high school age.

 

But with all the shootings lately, some were starting to justify a few of them - broke up with girlfriend?  Of course you'd feel emotional and want to show it.   :glare:   Disagree with what someone is doing?  Sometimes it can be justified.  :glare:  :glare:

 

When I make the connection to the death penalty over such "crimes" they "get it" and no longer see the justification in it at all.

 

At this point, I'm willing to use whatever it takes to get them to see the fallacy in all this "normal" that they are growing up with.

 

The connection is supposed to appear foolish.  What is happening IS foolish - deadly so.

I can see where you are dealing with clueless teenagers and trying to get the message through to them.  the hive is not filled with clueless teenagers who need things put in perspective.

 

I wasn't even able to articulate my horror at what happened.  I think even my referring to it as murder was just inadequate.  an act of war perhaps. . . .

 

eta: no, I don't think that is hyperbole.  these terrorist groups think they are legitimate political authorities, and seek to impose their will by force in the most heinous manner.  they attacked people in a sovereign country where they have no legal political authority.

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Same here. It's a sad world we're living in when individuals (or groups) impose the death penalty on others so readily and without remorse.

 

Live and let live is dying.

I got what you meant. I think that's a good, sobering way of looking at it.

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the death penalty?  you make it sound like it was a legal proceeding.  it. was. not.

 

it was hate-filled cold blooded murder.

 

I see it as a death penalty as well. A penalty issued through the "office" of vigilante justice, the penalty for blaspheme.

 

Blaspheme.

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My fondest hope is that these vile murderers are caught and put on trial so that their actions are help up for all to see. That will be the worst punishment for them. Certainly they hope to be gunned down themselves and become martyrs if they get caught. I really, really hope they do not get to become "martyrs" for their movement. I hope they lose all their dignity in the court process and rot in jail for all to see, the object of scorn that they deserve. 

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My fondest hope is that these vile murderers are caught and put on trial so that their actions are help up for all to see. That will be the worst punishment for them. Certainly they hope to be gunned down themselves and become martyrs if they get caught. I really, really hope they do not get to become "martyrs" for their movement. I hope they lose all their dignity in the court process and rot in jail for all to see, the object of scorn that they deserve. 

 

I'm just petty and peeved enough to hope the judge is a woman, too.

 

Anything to twist the proverbial knife into their repulsive, delusional, dangerous beliefs.

 

 

ETA: But on calmer reflection, I genuinely hope that blaspheme laws are completely overturned, and the value of freedom of speech, and a tolerance for criticism of ideas become the goal of 2015. This crap has got to end before we do ourselves in.

 

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

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Saw it this morning and was so disgusted and disheartened.  I was happily surprised by the number of Muslim orgs, Imams, etc. who came out strongly against it...even the Arab League and Al Azhar.

 

I only had one person on  my Facebook feed post any sort of conspiracy type posts (not really Muslims, must have been the CIA-type posts).

 

I wish CAIR and ISNA would post the Charlie HEbdo cartoons and say something along the lines that although we don't agree we these, we support free speech.  CAIR condemned the attacks, but I'd like to see something stronger.  But, my guess is they're afraid of offending their donor base.

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This is just so sad.  It breaks my heart.

 

Of course this morning my FB feed was filled with posts on how this was all the Democrats and Obama's fault.  WTF?  Quit making everything political and just mourn for the people lost and injured.

 

That's disgusting.  The day of the murders.   What on earth is wrong with people?

 

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This is just so sad.  It breaks my heart.

 

Of course this morning my FB feed was filled with posts on how this was all the Democrats and Obama's fault.  WTF?  Quit making everything political and just mourn for the people lost and injured.

 

 

That's insane. It is an entirely different country. People need to lay off the stupid.

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Well, they caught two of the gunmen and the third guy is dead.  Good.  I'm glad that there will be a trial.  I hope the French police can find out other information about the organization who planned this, etc.

 

I liked this piece by this guy   http://www.patheos.com/blogs/muslimahnextdoor/2015/01/jesuischarlie-when-will-clemency-and-kindness-prevail-over-extremism/#ixzz3OAprgTYe

 

One of the police officers who was killed was named Ahmed Merabet.  He was 42.  He was Muslim.  He was the guy who was shot execution style on the sidewalk.  http://dailycaller.com/2015/01/07/ahmed-merabet-cop-killed-in-paris-attacks-was-muslim/

 

I'll also point out that the bombing of the NAACP office in Colorado is not getting much press here.  Why? I find that extremely troubling.   http://www.newsweek.com/naacp-chapter-bombing-colorado-springs-deliberate-says-fbi-297399

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Very sad that something like this happened.  I don't believe in the right to walk through life and be kept safe from everything that will offend me.  I posted my support for the right of newspapers and magazines to publish these cartoons a few years ago on a facebook news story link.  I received threats from random facebook members.  Unfortunately, there are many more people like these gunmen out there.          

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umsami, on 07 Jan 2015 - 4:23 PM, said:

 

 

One of the police officers who was killed was named Ahmed Merabet.  He was 42.  He was Muslim.  He was the guy who was shot execution style on the sidewalk.  http://dailycaller.com/2015/01/07/ahmed-merabet-cop-killed-in-paris-attacks-was-muslim/

 

as I have pointed out to people - these monsters will kill anyone in their way. including muslims who do not support them, who they see as heretics.  I keep seeing links to the video of the (don't remember which country) police trainees who are lined up and slaughtered by isis.  like the teachers who tried to protect their students in the school that were massacred. they were all muslim, but just wanting to live their lives.  makes me sick.

 

and what people also need to be reminded of - most violent muslim deaths are at the hands of other muslims.

 

so - I can see why they showed him no mercy.  he was a police officer and they saw him as a heretic. says all you need to know about them.

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Absolutely dreadful. This struck really, really close to home as we caught it on the news--as we were leaving Paris on our Eurostar train. Our hotel was right near there:(

We happened to sit next to a man on the Eurostar who is a pilot living in Paris with his family. He has dual citizenship in France and Iraq, and he was terrified at how this will effect his Muslim family and young daughters, and devastated that it happened in his home city. Such a horrific thing:((

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Surviving journalists and ex-colleagues will band together to ensure Charlie Hebdo comes out next week. The best kind of defiance.

I'm so glad to hear this. I was hoping this was the case.

 

I am very troubled about the major media that won't republish the Charlie Hebdo cartoons. Despite all the "je suis Charlie" handwringing, if the media won't show these cartoons, they are acknowledging the cartoons should be censored.

 

http://money.cnn.com/2015/01/07/media/charlie-hebdo-terror-attack-media-mohammed-cartoons/index.html

 

I would like to find a way to pressure these media outlets to change their policies.

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Why? Of what value is that?

 

Because people tend to view things like this as a war against the West, when by far, the victims of Muslim extremists are other Muslims.  

 

I have seen some encouraging posts/tweets from Muslim organizations wanting to discuss issues regarding blasphemy in lieu of the bombings.  That could be very promising.  I've also seen many many posts along the lines of the cartoons are no where near as offensive as the killing of innocent people is.  

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I changed my profile pic on Facebook to a cartoon that features Muhammad up in heaven, with a Charlie Hebdo smilie (well frown) button.  There's a little knife sticking out...and the guys are saying..."We have avenged you! No one will dare to cartoon you ever again!"  and Mohammed (peace be upon him) is saying "Those people are $*)#() insane!"

 

You can see it here: http://mashable.com/2015/01/07/cartoonists-react-hebd-massacre/?utm_cid=mash-com-fb-main-link

 

 

None of my Muslim friends have threatened to kill me for having a cartoon featuring the Prophet.  Imagine that. ;)

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albeto., on 07 Jan 2015 - 8:08 PM, said:

Why? Of what value is that?

because there is a lot of rhetoric in the west equating all muslims as jihadists who will kill those who don't believe as they do.  as was pointed out earlier - the marches in Germany.   the fact is - there are many more who just want to live their lives and raise their families.  and they are as much at risk from these terrorists as the rest of us. 

 

to me, it's exactly the same as calling all blacks criminal thugs just because there are a fair percentage that are.  there are also honest and hardworking blacks, some of whom are even police officers.

 

or all Hispanics as illegal immigrants.  (and there are segments of the Hispanic population that assumes if you're Hispanic, you're here illegally and they can make money off you.  My ex-sil told me of her experiences when she lived in Miami. - she's Columbian -  she hated it and was glad to get away from there.)

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Word Nerd, on 07 Jan 2015 - 9:23 PM, said:

None of the suspects died. Earlier reports were unconfirmed and turned out to be wrong (at least based on current reports).

pity.  but probably better he couldn't receive the moniker of martyr among the nutso.  

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