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Officer that killed Tamir Rice found unfit for police work in previous job


ktgrok
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But wouldn't they have checked references from there?

It's likely any reference was not the person who wrote up that report or even saw it. Of course something like that should follow your career anywhere you go but I have to believe it didn't by some error. Believing they knowingly hired him after seeing that report is too terrible a thought.

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They verbally checked references, but didn't read his personnel file.  I was talking to a police officer friend who has more knowledge of the Tamir Rice case.  He told me that the reason the cops pulled up so close to the suspect was because there is an RTA stop right across the street and there were people there.  The officers were trying to put themselves between the suspect and bystanders.  When Rice was standing on the sidewalk and sitting in the pavilion, it appears from the video that he's pretty much alone in the area and that wasn't the case.  My friend also told me that Cleveland police have NO ongoing training!  He said that his department gives officers loads of training in dealing with mentally ill suspects and de-escalation, but Cleveland has cut its training budget to almost nothing and it shows in their response.

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I wonder if we will ever hear the honest reaction of the cop who was driving, who did not shoot Tamir.

 

Unfortunately when it comes to personnel stuff, people are not allowed to say much of anything.

 

I hope that this case leads to a rule that no cop is hired until all of his past personnel records are read by the hiring department.  And if someone refuses to authorize their file being transferred for this purpose, they can go find a different kind of job.

 

This is mind-boggling that they would hire someone to wield a deadly weapon in the community without checking further into his personnel file as a police officer in another town.  Quitting for "personal reasons" almost seems like a red flag in itself.  Is the Cleveland PD that desperate for new hires?  Or did this guy get some sort of recommendation because his dad was a NY cop?

 

So sad that the Rice family had to be victimized before this was found out and fixed.

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While you are suspended you go work for a different police force in order to have a clean reference to leap frog into a different force.  That is how these things happen.

 

 

 

http://www.thewire.com/national/2014/05/texas-cop-who-killed-two-people-in-two-years-has-actually-been-fired/362048/

 

The officer involved in these two incidences was already under investigation for major violations on a different force where he basically barged in on a crime scene where he was not supposed to be and drew his weapon on unarmed bystanders with other cops in the line of fire.  In the grandmother case, it isn't published, but he was in the company of another cop that was ordering him not to fire....

 

Stefanie

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I personally think a licensing and review board, like you have in nursing, would be a great addition for law enforcement.  

 

Stefanie

 

I think it is a great idea, in theory, the potential problem is that the members of the board might tend to defend problem law enforcement personnel rather than hold them accountable. Doctors have licensing and review boards but they seem to have to mess up pretty badly repeatedly before much is done and then they just move to a new state and start over.

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I think it is a great idea, in theory, the potential problem is that the members of the board might tend to defend problem law enforcement personnel rather than hold them accountable. Doctors have licensing and review boards but they seem to have to mess up pretty badly repeatedly before much is done and then they just move to a new state and start over.

 

Nothing is ever going to be perfect, but it would be one more tool.  A licensing and renewal process would at least ensure some standardization of education, require at least the exposure of officers to continuing education, provide an external review for hiring outside of references.  Even if the police officers are cleared, an officer with a long list of recorded complaints of the same type might be more thoroughly investigated before hire....and other departments could see if they were being currently investigated with another department before hire, even if they are in another state because the status of their license would be an open record.

 

It would also provide a way for an officers actions to be declared as wrong, even if the actions don't meet the legal requirements of a crime, which would, I think, go a long way. 

 

Stefanie

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It said that when he quit his file was marked eligible for rehire.  This was clearly not really quite true (I doubt that department would have rehired him, because geez, what an load of walking incompetance he was!)  Many basic reference checks just confirm start date, end date, salary and if the person is eligible for rehire.  I doubt the dude that wrote that memo gave him a reference. 

 

 

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One thing that occurs to me is that professions with licensing and review boards usually make continuing education a requirement that lies primarily with the professional.  My husband has to put in his hours regardless to keep his license and some of that is paid for by us and some is paid for by his employer.  It seems police, even in areas with high compensation, are accustomed to continuing education being their employer's obligation.  I am not saying that LE agencies shouldn't offer ongoing training and skill building but it's also on the individual too.  It should be a shared responsibility. 

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http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6271170

 

With all the talk about the black community, I wonder why the white community is acting like this?? Do we condemn them as a group as we seem to condemn the black community?

 

 

Where's the outrage from the white community!

 

....or perhaps we can see it as isolated incidents of violence and stupidity, and does not apply to white people in general. I wonder why it's so hard to use that same way of thinking to other groups of people.

 

I don't see us condemning the black community on this forum.  If you're referring to some posts where people pointed out crime statistics, those were always in response to other statistics (re police shootings etc.) that didn't make sense in isolation.  I think we all know that the majority in the black community are not in those statistics.

 

I don't view myself as "white community" btw.  I live in a multi-racial community and household and I don't view any community I participate in as having color borders.  I don't know how many people here think of themselves as "white community."

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I don't see us condemning the black community on this forum.  If you're referring to some posts where people pointed out crime statistics, those were always in response to other statistics (re police shootings etc.) that didn't make sense in isolation.  I think we all know that the majority in the black community are not in those statistics.

 

I don't view myself as "white community" btw.  I live in a multi-racial community and household and I don't view any community I participate in as having color borders.  I don't know how many people here think of themselves as "white community."

 

I live in a pretty white neighborhood and an all-white household and I still don't consider myself part of "the white community" whatever that is.  I don't think in terms of "the black community," "the Hispanic community," etc., either. 

 

There are mean, stupid, evil, ignorant people of every type.  Outrageous behavior isn't made more or less so because of the color of the peoples' skin.

 

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http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6271170

 

With all the talk about the black community, I wonder why the white community is acting like this?? Do we condemn them as a group as we seem to condemn the black community?

 

 

Where's the outrage from the white community!

 

....or perhaps we can see it as isolated incidents of violence and stupidity, and does not apply to white people in general. I wonder why it's so hard to use that same way of thinking to other groups of people.

Oh. My. That is appalling. We haven't really come that far now have we?

 

FTR when I say community I mean all of us in the boat together. If I mean some subset of the community I spell it out. And I am the last person to ever claim to be blind to color or living in a post racial world.

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One thing that occurs to me is that professions with licensing and review boards usually make continuing education a requirement that lies primarily with the professional.  My husband has to put in his hours regardless to keep his license and some of that is paid for by us and some is paid for by his employer.  It seems police, even in areas with high compensation, are accustomed to continuing education being their employer's obligation.  I am not saying that LE agencies shouldn't offer ongoing training and skill building but it's also on the individual too.  It should be a shared responsibility. 

 

Hmm. I wonder if this is true for teachers. I am concerned about what I found out are low starting salaries of officers in this area. I am guessing they have a hard time paying the bills. If they make a professional salary, then it makes more sense for them to be personally responsible for continuing ed. (I imagine this argument would apply to teachers as well in areas in which they are not paid well.)

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I think the whole 'I don't think of myself as part of any White community' is part of the problem. What is needed is a strong White community that will refuse to dehumanization of others that the system tries to build, White voices to unite against this rather than turning away from it. 

 

Until the history of race is recognised, until it is firmly entrenched in society to know that race is a social construct invented by White elites who pulled the poorer mass of White people into the 'White community' by giving benefits to excuse and give reason to what they were doing to the enslaved Black people, to the Indigenous people, to the world of people who were colonized and divide the poorer White communities from those communities which they had more in common with (see the early revolts by enslaved people were often joined by and supported by the local poor White communities) and the benefits that were given were in exchange for this division and for policing the other groups (many US police forces directly come from slave patrol forces that rich White people would bribe and conscript poorer White men into as are many across the colonized world and some in Europe). Until it is told everywhere that these White elites enslaved Africans because of their skills, because of their immunity through the long history of trade prior to the Atlantic Slave Trade, that the enslaved Blacks were doing the skilled work and were a key part of building the wealth and places where they were enslaved, Until it is no longer illegal to teach about solidarity and the histories of the peoples who were conquered in all schools, Until this is taught and known and accepted that these benefits are still given to this day and still given just as strictly - just enough to cause division, not enough to take away and very often cause the problems that most White people face, then these things will continue. Because the system has been built and is maintained this way, it isn't broken - this is how it was built to be - and until we can come together and build ourselves to recognise and stand together against this, this will keep happening. It happened in the Bristol and Montgomery Bus Boycotts (where out now praised civil rights leaders when marching were violently attacked, the news reports painted them as violent thugs even in suits, and the governments had folders of documents on how they were feeding children and teaching literacy and still the government pushed them out and in some cases killed them off). 

 

This cycle will continue until either it gets really violent from people feeling they have nothing else to lose (like the end of Apartheid or the Haitian Revolution) or when those who can't turn away and shrug that they aren't apart of the problem and pretend to be neutral stand together for a solution. There is no neutral in oppression, there is no neutral in this system, and we have to decide what it is that we want. 

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Spork, believe it or not, there have always been many white people (including elite whites) who were opposed to slavery and the other inhuman things that were done to people of color.

 

No, I think it is better we leave behind the idea that white people are "the white community."  It does far more harm than good IMO.

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I think the whole 'I don't think of myself as part of any White community' is part of the problem. What is needed is a strong White community that will refuse to dehumanization of others that the system tries to build, White voices to unite against this rather than turning away from it. 

 

Until the history of race is recognised, until it is firmly entrenched in society to know that race is a social construct invented by White elites who pulled the poorer mass of White people into the 'White community' by giving benefits to excuse and give reason to what they were doing to the enslaved Black people, to the Indigenous people, to the world of people who were colonized and divide the poorer White communities from those communities which they had more in common with (see the early revolts by enslaved people were often joined by and supported by the local poor White communities) and the benefits that were given were in exchange for this division and for policing the other groups (many US police forces directly come from slave patrol forces that rich White people would bribe and conscript poorer White men into as are many across the colonized world and some in Europe). Until it is told everywhere that these White elites enslaved Africans because of their skills, because of their immunity through the long history of trade prior to the Atlantic Slave Trade, that the enslaved Blacks were doing the skilled work and were a key part of building the wealth and places where they were enslaved, Until it is no longer illegal to teach about solidarity and the histories of the peoples who were conquered in all schools, Until this is taught and known and accepted that these benefits are still given to this day and still given just as strictly - just enough to cause division, not enough to take away and very often cause the problems that most White people face, then these things will continue. Because the system has been built and is maintained this way, it isn't broken - this is how it was built to be - and until we can come together and build ourselves to recognise and stand together against this, this will keep happening. It happened in the Bristol and Montgomery Bus Boycotts (where out now praised civil rights leaders when marching were violently attacked, the news reports painted them as violent thugs even in suits, and the governments had folders of documents on how they were feeding children and teaching literacy and still the government pushed them out and in some cases killed them off). 

 

This cycle will continue until either it gets really violent from people feeling they have nothing else to lose (like the end of Apartheid or the Haitian Revolution) or when those who can't turn away and shrug that they aren't apart of the problem and pretend to be neutral stand together for a solution. There is no neutral in oppression, there is no neutral in this system, and we have to decide what it is that we want. 

  You get it.....you really get it.  You can't change what you  don't acknowledge. Race has changed so much over the last 200 years. Irish used to be outside the white race and then later the Italians were allowed to enter into the "white community" (a community they were on the outside of too) so to boost the numbers against the growing African American population. People in charge make these rules up as they go and the everyday person believes it as fact. The first step is to  honestly admit what we believe and be open to a new way of thinking. 

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