Is there not an Ebola in Dallas thread yet?

[Χά�ων]

The bold is why I have not enrolled my son in public school. For him, if would be life or death.

Zero tolerance policies come to mind. Some school districts, thankfully only one of the school districts in our county has this (but there are plenty more out there in the US), require a doctor's notice for any absence. Period. The student upon being found absent from school is automatically assigned detention and this is not excused until the letter from the doctor comes. Of course, it really ticks the doctors' off because they don't want to be wasting their time filling out forms for kids with the stomach bug which tends to run 24 hours or miserable with the common flu, or symptomatic with flu but having a light case and unless the kid is really dehydrated, shouldn't be in their waiting rooms when they really can't be treated anyway. It's crazy! Of course it costs the parents money because the doc can't be wasting time doing it for free, so an office call is charged even if there is nothing that can be done for the patient. In the case of teens who could be home alone for the duration of the ailment, the parent has to stay home to prove the kid isn't just "skipping school" which is always the accusation from administrators, and they have to be present at the doc's office because minors can't sign the financial paperwork much less the medical stuff.

 

Add to that employers who are adamantly opposed to their employees being off to take care of a sick kid, and the situation is nuts. It ends up with parents sending kids to school when they know they absolutely should not do so...well for some. I know parents who also truly don't care. Period. End of discussion. They simply do not care if kid is exposing everyone else to illness or not. Sigh....our whole culture is completely out of whack on this.

 

Tying school funding to per head attendance is just ridiculous. It costs money to have that school open whether or not the kid attends. Send the money. Let the sick kid stay home. Yah, some parents are lazy and will let kids skip school for the sake of skipping school. But, having policies does not cure those parents of their lack of parenting skills. Stop punishing everyone else!

 

Entero D68, the CDC reported on Wednesday that four patients are confirmed to have died from the virus.

 

Annually, RSV kills 66,000-199,000 children worldwide.

 

RSV kills 10,000 elderly American patients per year.

 

From 1976 to 2007, influenza killed a low of 3000 people to a high of 49,000 annually in the US.

 

The three worst killing communicable diseases (albeit the first two have a more limited mode of transmission) in the African region are HIV/AIDS, malaria, and Tuberculousis. These three count for 88% of all disease related deaths.

 

(statistics taken from the WHO, CDC, and All Africa.com)

 

Given that we've had five cases of TB in one of our county school districts a couple of years ago, and it's on the rise, thousands of cases of flu, RSV, and now a confirmed case of entero here as well, I think that these deserve a lot more concern than they get.

 

But, with funding as an issue, as always the pursuit of money will trump human health and safety, so the schools won't do anything to stop the spread that's for certain. They will most definitely try to strong arm parents into not taking precautions either.

 

Ebola just isn't the killer that the above diseases are, but people are used to living with the risk so no one cares. It's the unknown that scares everyone even if the unknown is not as lethal on this soil or as easily transmitted.

 

Sometimes I wonder if the US would be better served to school solidly through the summer...with long recesses for the vitamin D production and fresh air, and then take the three months off in the dead of RSV/Flu weather. I have a feeling that alone would greatly reduce the pediatric cases and risk. It might not do much for the elderly, but it could protect the kids a lot more. Plus, think about this....you get to take your Disney World Vacation in January, not June! If you live in Antarctica (ahem, I mean Michigan :D) this would be a welcome change in scheduling! Plus, no school busses and teenage drivers on snow and ice up here. I could really get behind this! :)

 

[Halftime Hope]

It is a desperate, desperate shame that we, collectively, governments and NGOs and charitable organizations and individuals together, did not invest the money and expertise and resources to deal with this effectively when the problem was small and localized and Over There.  It will certainly be more difficult now that it is larger and here.  I believe we can, but it will be harder.

 

 

This exactly.   Well put.

[Lolly]

If it doesn't have bacon it isn't breakfast.  I cannot be moved from that position so do not even try.

Cupcakes can have bacon. And, maple flavored icing...

[creekland]

 

On travel.   I was on the first plane into Taiwan after the SARS problem.  As you got off the plane ropes funneled people into a single-file.  There was a remote temperate sensor that looked a bit like a radar gun.  It took the temp of people as they walked by, and they didn't even have to slow down.  It was showing green or something good when everyone near me walked by.  But, I assume if someone was too high they'd get shuttled into an "extra attention" area.  I wouldn't mind something like this on all international flights as they come in, and when possible at the gate before people get on.  

 

And Liberia currently tests the temperature of everyone getting ON planes.  That's how they know he was not running a fever at the time.  (This was on NBC news (TV) if anyone is looking for confirmation or where I got the info.)

[LucyStoner]

Where I live there have been huge issues with school policy on illness. If your child is home sick they call you. They harass you. They demand you bring your child in even if they have a cough/fever/etc. I have had many friends complain about this.

 

For example, I have a friend that had 4k/kinder kids. They were sick. She kept them home. The school called and insisted she bring them in. She told the school she was giving them another day to recover and if they didn't she was taking them to the doctor. The school told her she was failing her children by allowing them to be at home instead of in class learning. She is a young mother. She got scared. She brought them to school. 2 days later they were both a lot worse and she kept them home again. She took them to the doctor. It was a viral infection and the older one ended up in pretty bad shape, It took 2 weeks to recover and another month before they really acted like themselves again. She kept them home for another week then sent them back to school even though the older one still didn't feel well. The school kept calling and harassing her about not bringing her kids back to school for the remaining days they were home and she felt like a really bad parent for keeping them home that week. The stress was so high, she ended up homeschooling the next year.

 

When did this change? Is this common in other parts of the country? Is it tied to funding? When I was in school you stayed home if you were sick. And especially if you had a doctor's note it was an excused absence.

It's my understanding that it is a funding thing. Apparently some districts tie attendance rates to the schools budget. A few even tie it to bonuses.

[hornblower]

"The airport is remarkably quiet these days.

 

Most airlines have cancelled all commercial flights to Liberia because of Ebola fears.

 

Only two airlines continue to fly into Liberia.

 

A few cargo flights are landing, with Ebola aid supplies from United Nations agencies and other sources, but those flights are still relatively infrequent, despite the massive global publicity about the Ebola crisis.

 

On Saturday, only two parked airplanes could be seen in the entire airport, but a small joint force of U.S. army and air-force troops were preparing for future flights."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/us-troops-arrive-in-west-africa-to-help-fight-ebola-outbreak/article20822003/

[BrookValley.]

Ok, your sob story about traffic (undoubtedly around DC) and the fact that you do have special talents I enjoy means I will share my prize with you.  Next time, take I 81 north and come at us from the west for less traffic.  Trying to come here from the east or south can require humor all by itself.

 

 

Unless you are looking for youngsters I can't really help you.  Once my boys started growing up and moving away we really cut back our herd.  At our peak we had 28 here and were doing our own starting, etc.  Now we have 8 and sell them young.  I have one  chestnut 2 year old filly that will head into training this fall/winter if not sold - but she's likely to grow into a large, and one buckskin yearling filly that will stay here another year unless the person who stopped in a week ago (after seeing her in the pasture) decides to buy her.  She's supposedly thinking about it, but seemed a little more serious than the usual drive by.

 

Oh - we also have this year's babies... a colt & filly... but I'm thinking you don't want THAT young.

 

My other three are my broodmares and my stallion.  At this point, they aren't for sale.  I have hopes that my health will get better.

 

Best wishes on your search.  Good ponies can be difficult to find.  When my boys were young we traveled out of state to pick up some nice ones at prices we could afford.

 

Thanks! Yes, I need something broke. Or at least partly broke. Eldest is 7 and wants to start moving up and doing more...I have some great ladies who can ride/train for me (I'm too tall to ride the ponies, unless they are top-of-the line large), but I would still need one that was started.

 

I have hopes that your health will get better, too. :grouphug:

[FaithManor]

I'm not getting what you guys are saying about a travel ban having to be US-imposed or worldwide??  A travel ban in the case of quarantine is to close down the affected area, which can be as small as a town, or really early on, a house.  It has nothing to do with the US or other countries, and it matters not if they came in through another country, because they don't get out of there to anywhere at all, especially to other third world countries where it would not be so easily contained - this has nothing to do with the US! If they had instituted a travel ban out of the affected (much smaller) area when it first happened - imho the WHO should have stepped in and suggested that very early on - it could possibly have been contained and not gotten to the cities in the original countries.  The pregnant woman who infected the US guy got it from someone who had traveled to the city from outside.  Now a whole bunch of other people in her building are already dead from having contracted it from her, and then each other.  Just since then.  Yes, it would have been inconvenient and costly.  They probably would have had to bring food and water in.  But less inconvenient and costly than what's going on there now that it's spreading and pretty much out of control?

 

The aid workers who got medflighted out would not have to be part of a travel ban, because they go directly to a hospital.  Apparently healthy aid workers that wanted to leave could just have a 21-day quarantine (hotel, or even home).  Quarantines used to be commonplace before antibiotics and vaccines, because they are effective in limiting highly communicable disease for which there is no cure.  My mom remembers Quarantine signs hung on classmates' doors when they got the measles. We're used to having a cure for everything, so they've fallen out of favor, but we don't have a cure or treatment for this (although some of the newer stuff does look promising, we're not there yet).

 

In the case of something like enterovirus, it's impractical because no one's even sure if they have it till they're hospitalized and already effectively quarantined (and it's probably also contagious before you are symptomatic).  Hopefully they'll figure out a vaccine for that one.

 

 

This is not what was suggested though. What was put forth was a suggestion on a ban in and out of the affected countries period. Of course flights in and out of these areas are not direct. Also, in order to be effective it would require a military presence on the borders of these areas to prevent other modes of travel, and well, the only way to make it effective is to be willing to shoot those attempting to make a run for it. Inevitably, someone is going to decide they don't want to stay put, and well, that means....a lot of us are not for that.

 

I mean, the movie Outbreak was unrealistic except that in one thing. If you are truly determined, absolutely determined to prevent the spread of a virus outside of a town or city, outside of a country, then you have to be willing to siege it with military and police, and enforce it at all cost. Someone is going to want to leave. Someone is going to panic. Someone is going to risk it to leave because humans don't do "caged" very well. We here may not imagine it that way. We here may see our National Guard, our police, our first responders telling us to stay put as for our own good, and the populace, as a whole, is fairly likely to obey. This is absolutely not the case in undeveloped nations. The peoples there many times have no trust of governments or their employees even in the form of health care workers much less military.

 

Liberia is not America. It's not France, it's not Greece, it's not even Mexico...I don't want to be rude to the people of Liberia who are suffering. But, well, they just don't have a reason to trust their own government much less NATO or the UN, so yes, you are going to have to be willing to kill some people in order to "keep them in".

 

My grandmother remembers her house being quarantined when her older brother came down with diphtheria. He died of it.  His little body was placed in a box at the road and men in masks and gloves came to take it away to cremate his remains. They had to remain until the cost was clear for the rest of them. It takes willing participants. It takes basically, a foundationally educated public with enough understanding of modes of transmission to be willing to remain where they are.

[maize]

And from what we are learning about Texas, we think that the population would stay quarantined?  ;)

 

I was teaching at a university that had measles outbreak in one of the dorms.  Of course for measles there is an immunization and everyone under a certain age had to have it or produce their immunization card to demonstrate that they had had a booster within a certain time frame.  Life cannot be completely disrupted for a "what if" scenario.  Classes went on and the public health threat was contained.

 

Nope, I don't think there is a chance in the world the quarantine would actually hold. 

 

And I think trying to impose one would cause a lot of disruption that could possibly lead to greater spread of the disease.

 

Not to mention lots of other unintended consequences.

 

The truth is that education and readily accessible healthcare will probably do the most to contain this disease both here and overseas. 

[Guest]

Who precisely is going to impose this travel ban? It is not as if the US has some kind of authority to tell people in other countries they cannot cross their own borders. Only Liberia could impose a rule that people cannot leave Liberia for any reason, though even they could likely not enforce it. And do we really think it is desirable foe governments to behave in such strong-handed ways? Does their constitution even allow for such drastic measures? That also seems like a way to prevent any further foreign aid...who is going to send aid workers in if they are forbidden to leave? I would not volunteer for such an assignment!

 

Am I remembering incorrectly, or was there a travel ban in place some years ago?  

 

Also, can't the U.S. restrict incoming passengers if they wanted to?  Like, if people were from certain countries?  I'm almost afraid to ask, but I am curious.  

 

I think it would undesirable use of government force if it was willy-nilly.  Suppose this does turn into a huge outbreak... at what point would you recommend a travel ban?

[Guest]

Okay, I don't want to dog pile b/c I've appreciated the on-topic parts of this thread  :glare: , but I've got to point out that your post did not reflect that before you went back to edit it.  So, all snarkiness aside, it's probably a good idea to pay attention to your wording.

 

Early on in this thread (and I believe in the locked one), I clarified what I meant by travel ban.  I shouldn't have needed to be that specific again (I'm used to having conversations with people where you don't have to add disclaimers and continually reiterate and clarify... usually people just get what you mean)!  I only edited because I knew if I didn't, that whole conversation would start again, but even with editing, it looks like it started again, anyway.  

[Χά�ων]

Ok, here's the ICS (International Chili Society) take on it:

 

http://www.chilicookoff.com/history/history_of_chili.asp

 

"There may not be an answer. There are, however, certain facts that one cannot overlook. The mixture of meat, beans, peppers, and herbs was known to the Incas, Aztecs, and Mayan Indians long before Columbus and the conquistadores."

 

Note the important word beans in there.   ;)

 

They go on with more for those interested.

Am I the only one shocked that there is an International Chili Society? 

[Guest]

I'm not getting what you guys are saying about a travel ban having to be US-imposed or worldwide??  A travel ban in the case of quarantine is to close down the affected area, which can be as small as a town, or really early on, a house.  It has nothing to do with the US or other countries, and it matters not if they came in through another country, because they don't get out of there to anywhere at all, especially to other third world countries where it would not be so easily contained - this has nothing to do with the US! If they had instituted a travel ban out of the affected (much smaller) area when it first happened - imho the WHO should have stepped in and suggested that very early on - it could possibly have been contained and not gotten to the cities in the original countries.  The pregnant woman who infected the US guy got it from someone who had traveled to the city from outside.  Now a whole bunch of other people in her building are already dead from having contracted it from her, and then each other.  Just since then.  Yes, it would have been inconvenient and costly.  They probably would have had to bring food and water in.  But less inconvenient and costly than what's going on there now that it's spreading and pretty much out of control?

 

The aid workers who got medflighted out would not have to be part of a travel ban, because they go directly to a hospital.  Apparently healthy aid workers that wanted to leave could just have a 21-day quarantine (hotel, or even home).  Quarantines used to be commonplace before antibiotics and vaccines, because they are effective in limiting highly communicable disease for which there is no cure.  My mom remembers Quarantine signs hung on classmates' doors when they got the measles. We're used to having a cure for everything, so they've fallen out of favor, but we don't have a cure or treatment for this (although some of the newer stuff does look promising, we're not there yet).

 

In the case of something like enterovirus, it's impractical because no one's even sure if they have it till they're hospitalized and already effectively quarantined (and it's probably also contagious before you are symptomatic).  Hopefully they'll figure out a vaccine for that one.

 

 

That's exactly why I was so upset that these (now 100) contacts in Dallas are not being quarantined (only his four family members and the EMT's?).  Sure, it would be annoying to quarantine 100 people, but it would be better than what the countries in Africa are now facing.  There is the possibility that ebola could spread in Dallas and further.

[Matryoshka]

The *practical* difficulties with travel bans -- that most flights to/from Africa route through third countries, that travelers across European borders don't go through passport control, that the physical planes route through multiple countries before coming here, etc. -- are all real.

 

The more fundamental difficulty with travel bans is that Liberia, and other Ebola-affected countries, and transit airport countries, and indeed all other countries, are sovereign.  The US does not have the authority to close other countries' borders, or shut down other nation's airlines.

 

Yeesh.  A travel ban would have to be from there, to everywhere.  Like closing the airports in those countries to commercial passenger flights.  Then all the other objections are moot.

[Violet Crown]

I just want to point out that this thread has been hostile to vegans and vegetarians.

 

I make a kickin' vegan chili.

Except, out of respect to our Texan boardies, we will call it awesome southwestern veggie soup!

Here in l'ÃŽle d'Austin, organic vegan chili is common. Dh makes Frito pie with it. Organic Fritos, I'm sure; haven't checked.

 

More and more I meet homeschooling Texans who made the decision because a child's health or family travel made compliance with the absence policies impossible. No doubt this idiotic policy increases enrollment at private schools also.

 

If the Dallas Ebola scare raises awareness of the policy (see? on topic!), that will be a good thing. I doubt that this incident in itself will convince people to homeschool, but it will certainly be a tipping point for families already toying with the thought. And many families may discover, in providing 'bridge' teaching during the temporary withdrawal, that it it's kind of fun.

 

And from what we are learning about Texas, we think that the population would stay quarantined? ;)

 

I don't understand. Why would we want to leave?

[Χά�ων]

I think the hysterical view points are being fed by 24/7 news and social media. 

[hjffkj]

Any sort of mass travel ban is not practical but that fact that this man made it so far without being asked if he had been in direct contact with people suffering from Ebola show gross negligence on so many levels. He should not have made it on the plane in the first place since he was just in direct contact with victims. That's very different than just coming from an affected area. Since he made it on the plane he should have been detained or closely observed for a certain period of time once getting into the country. He should have never been able to leave the hospital the first time.

 

If he was asked if he had been exposed to Ebola directly at any point from leaving his country to being admitted to the hospital then he should be held accountable if anyone dies because of his lie.

[Amira]

We're going to need a lot more than medical and humanitarian people flying into Liberia.  Food, clothing, and other basic needs still need to be supplied either by air, overland, or by sea.  People need to be there to help build better infrastructure.  And then you'll need people to support all of those people- as I've said, I know people in Liberia who aren't there for humanitarian or medical reasons, but they are providing necessary support for those who are.  As others have mentioned, airlines have already chosen to cut back greatly on fights into Liberia and I think that's as good as it's going to get. The restrictions already in place have affected the lives of people in Liberia already. And I don't think we can patrol the airspace around Liberia and other afflicted countries so carefully that we can ensure that no flights are leaving them. And what about people leaving by sea or overland, then flying on from another point?  Is it the best use of the world's resources to focus on stopping Ebola's spread throughout the world, or within Liberia?  I think it's the latter, but travel bans would detract from that.

 

The vast majority of people in Liberia haven't been exposed to Ebola and are no threat to anyone else.   

 

 

[Violet Crown]

The BBC is reporting that the Liberian government plans to prosecute the man for saying he had no sick relatives, when in fact he did. Sorry no link (I'm on my phone); maybe someone else can link it?

[Matryoshka]

The BBC is reporting that the Liberian government plans to prosecute the man for saying he had no sick relatives, when in fact he did. Sorry no link (I'm on my phone); maybe someone else can link it?

 

Well, it wasn't his relative, but his landlady - I think he rented his apartment from her or her family.  So, a technicality.

 

[hjffkj]

The BBC is reporting that the Liberian government plans to prosecute the man for saying he had no sick relatives, when in fact he did. Sorry no link (I'm on my phone); maybe someone else can link it?

Well I had no idea he had lied. If that is true he should be prosecuted.

[maize]

Any sort of mass travel ban is not practical but that fact that this man made it so far without being asked if he had been in direct contact with people suffering from Ebola show gross negligence on so many levels. He should not have made it on the plane in the first place since he was just in direct contact with victims. That's very different than just coming from an affected area. Since he made it on the plane he should have been detained or closely observed for a certain period of time once getting into the country. He should have never been able to leave the hospital the first time.

 

If he was asked if he had been exposed to Ebola directly at any point from leaving his country to being admitted to the hospital then he should be held accountable if anyone dies because of his lie.

 

If he wanted to get to the US he would have just lied (and maybe did lie) about contact.

[Pawz4me]

That's exactly why I was so upset that these (now 100) contacts in Dallas are not being quarantined (only his four family members and the EMT's?).  Sure, it would be annoying to quarantine 100 people, but it would be better than what the countries in Africa are now facing.  There is the possibility that ebola could spread in Dallas and further.

 

There is no need to quarantine anyone he came into contact with BEFORE he started exhibiting symptoms.  He was not contagious until that point.

 

This morning NPR interviewed an infectious disease specialist from U of Texas.  He said that it takes awhile (didn't define "awhile") even after a person begins running a fever before they're contagious.  He said that public health officials are monitoring those people twice a day, taking their temperature.

[Slartibartfast]

And I don't even have ADHD.  Just imagine what I would be like if I did.  ;)

 

I do love me some multiple party conversations, though.  :D

 

 

I do.  :leaving:

 

I am pretty easy to distract.

[creekland]

Am I the only one shocked that there is an International Chili Society? 

 

Google is your friend.

 

School just ended here, so I'm off for a while.  I fully expect another 250 posts to catch up on sometime... but I'm not sure I'll HAVE time to catch up later.  Sometimes I actually do work for a living.  ;)

[hjffkj]

There is no need to quarantine anyone he came into contact with BEFORE he started exhibiting symptoms. He was not contagious until that point.

 

This morning NPR interviewed an infectious disease specialist from U of Texas. He said that it takes awhile (didn't define "awhile") even after a person begins running a fever before they're contagious. He said that public health officials are monitoring those people twice a day, taking their temperature.

The problem now is that who knows exactly when he become contagious. Assuming reports that he lied on forms about being in contact with Ebola sufferers he may have likely kept his symptoms hidden too for as long as he could in order to ensure he made it to the US.

 

Not saying I believe that but that can't be ruled out knowing that he lied to get here.

[ChocolateReignRemix]

The problem now is that who knows exactly when he become contagious. Assuming reports that he lied on forms about being in contact with Ebola sufferers he may have likely kept his symptoms hidden too for as long as he could in order to ensure he made it to the US.

 

Not saying I believe that but that can't be ruled out knowing that he lied to get here.

 

Actually it can be ruled out based on the time frame.

[mathnerd]

A travel ban? The US government has to work really hard to keep this one Dallas family exposed to ebola inside their house! These people tried to leave their home despite being told not to. I don't think that many people in the affected countries are going to sit inside their homes or not go about their businesses (including internationally) because they were told to.
 
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/ebola-patients-family-ordered-stay-inside-leave/story?id=25912405

 

This poster is neither an epidemiologist, an infectious disease dr, nor a specialist in ebola.  She is ridiculing the way the nation is handling something bc SHE feels its a crisis.

I am ignorant of the past history of posters here and what the group dynamics here are, but, to be fair, not many of us on these boards are epidemiologists either. So, we should not assume that Ebola is a non-problem for Americans (because the government said so). Screwups happen in the First World countries too (I remember the immediate aftermath of Katrina very well). From casually glancing at the headlines today, the number of exposed people has exponentially risen to 100 from 18 yesterday and the local school district is trying to calm down panicked parents because the exposed child rode the school bus and went to school before they stopped that from happening.

So, even if there is no epidemic of ebola, there will be some Americans who are going to get the disease and the drug makers are still working on a mass solution. And there will be many who will flee their countries to seek better medical treatment in America. We are in for a long season of ebola discussion and news.

 

ETA: to be clear, I did not mean that 100 people are exposed to ebola in Dallas now. I meant that 100 people are "possibly exposed" and are under observation.

[Pawz4me]

The problem now is that who knows exactly when he become contagious. Assuming reports that he lied on forms about being in contact with Ebola sufferers he may have likely kept his symptoms hidden too for as long as he could in order to ensure he made it to the US.

 

Not saying I believe that but that can't be ruled out knowing that he lied to get here.

 

His temperature was taken when he left Liberia.  Assuming whoever did that didn't screw up, then we know he didn't have a fever then.

[hjffkj]

Actually it can be ruled out based on the time frame.

What timeframe?

[Slartibartfast]

 

 

Chicken?  Um... why BBQ chicken?  There are so many other great ways to have it!

 

Ribs?  Anywhere that doesn't use a dry rub - dry BBQ is just plain wrong.

 

 

 

 

There is no reason to put, "why BBQ ____?" in a sentence. One should always BBQ something. Chickens are placed in a smoker whole and turn out *amazing*

 

One should always dry rub something before smoking it. If one wants to put sauce on it afterwards that is their decision. 

[texasmama]

There is no reason to put, "why BBQ ____?" in a sentence. One should always BBQ something. Chickens are placed in a smoker whole and turn out *amazing*

 

One should always dry rub something before smoking it. If one wants to put sauce on it afterwards that is their decision. 

I'm with you on this one, too.

 

Every time we find a point of agreement, I feel that we are just a little bit closer to healing the TX/OK wound. (States, not college football teams - that is unfixable.)  Let's think of ourselves as ambassadors of goodwill, shall we?

[Violet Crown]

Well, it wasn't his relative, but his landlady - I think he rented his apartment from her or her family. So, a technicality.

 

This seems to be a different person, who was a relative.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-29467489

 

"When he left the country last month, Liberian national Thomas Eric Duncan filled in a questionnaire saying that none of his relatives were sick.

 

But Liberia's assistant health minister said he had taken a sick relative to a clinic in a wheelbarrow."

[Violet Crown]

Every time we find a point of agreement, I feel that we are just a little bit closer to healing the TX/OK wound.

And when the Red River finally runs dry from the drought, we'll be pretty much united!

[Guest]

Well I had no idea he had lied. If that is true he should be prosecuted.

 

 

A travel ban? The US government has to work really hard to keep this one Dallas family exposed to ebola inside their house! These people tried to leave their home despite being told not to. I don't think that many people in the affected countries are going to sit inside their homes or not go about their businesses (including internationally) because they were told to.

 

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/ebola-patients-family-ordered-stay-inside-leave/story?id=25912405

 

 

 

I am ignorant of the past history of posters here and what the group dynamics here are, but, to be fair, not many of us on these boards are epidemiologists either. So, we should not assume that Ebola is a non-problem for Americans (because the government said so). Screwups happen in the First World countries too (I remember the immediate aftermath of Katrina very well). From casually glancing at the headlines today, the number of exposed people has exponentially risen to 100 from 18 yesterday and the local school district is trying to calm down panicked parents because the exposed child rode the school bus and went to school before they stopped that from happening.

 

So, even if there is no epidemic of ebola, there will be some Americans who are going to get the disease and the drug makers are still working on a mass solution. And there will be many who will flee their countries to seek better medical treatment in America. We are in for a long season of ebola discussion and news.

 

Wow, this story just keeps unfolding!

 

Disclaimer: My comment is not meant to be racist or discriminatory in any way, shape or form.  I just mean that I am surprised at these unexpected developments.

[FaithManor]

And when the Red River finally runs dry from the drought, we'll be pretty much united!

 

As a Midwesterner, I am not certain how I feel about "healing the wounds". The Tex/OK corral showdown is really quite entertaining. :D

[Guest]

There is no need to quarantine anyone he came into contact with BEFORE he started exhibiting symptoms.  He was not contagious until that point.

 

This morning NPR interviewed an infectious disease specialist from U of Texas.  He said that it takes awhile (didn't define "awhile") even after a person begins running a fever before they're contagious.  He said that public health officials are monitoring those people twice a day, taking their temperature.

 

How are these people being monitored?  What if their temperature spikes and symptoms appear rapidly between these temperature checks, but the individual is not worried about it?

[Χά�ων]

How are these people being monitored?  What if their temperature spikes and symptoms appear rapidly between these temperature checks, but the individual is not worried about it?

OK, really? They have most likely been notified that they have been exposed. And you are wondering if they would not be worried if they suddenly show symptoms? I am certain they will seek medical attention as needed if that should arise. 

[Lolly]

His temperature was taken when he left Liberia.  Assuming whoever did that didn't screw up, then we know he didn't have a fever then.

You know, perhaps people disembarking from planes on flights originating in countries with ebola should also have their temps taken on disembarkment. Yeah, what about if they go onto another plane from that point...Can't be perfect, but hey, it might be one step safer.

[Guest]

OK, really? They have most likely been notified that they have been exposed. And you are wondering if they would not be worried if they suddenly show symptoms? I am certain they will seek medical attention as needed if that should arise. 

 

If you don't like anything I say, why do you keep responding to me?

 

As we can see, some people don't like to be controlled.  His family just tried to leave and had to be forced (?) to stay in the apartment.  Some people don't do the right thing.  All of this could have been prevented.

[Χά�ων]

If you don't like anything I say, why do you keep responding to me?

 

As we can see, some people don't like to be controlled.  His family just tried to leave and had to be forced (?) to stay in the apartment.  Some people don't do the right thing.  All of this could have been prevented.

I am going to ask, why are you so afraid of this? What media sources are you so tuned into that have you so scared that no matter what anyone says you are freaking out?

[Lolly]

How are these people being monitored?  What if their temperature spikes and symptoms appear rapidly between these temperature checks, but the individual is not worried about it?

I believe they are checking temps twice a day. There is a period of time after the temp rises where they are still not contagious, so it isn't an instantaneous thing. I think they are just doing the best they can. It wouldn't be realistic to keep a 24 hr monitor running. At some point, you have to trust a little bit (that the person will do the right thing.) If they prove to be untrustworthy (like...say...doing things they have been told not to do because of the risk...) I would hope that further restrictions would be imposed.

[Trish]

There is no need to quarantine anyone he came into contact with BEFORE he started exhibiting symptoms.  He was not contagious until that point.

 

This morning NPR interviewed an infectious disease specialist from U of Texas.  He said that it takes awhile (didn't define "awhile") even after a person begins running a fever before they're contagious.  He said that public health officials are monitoring those people twice a day, taking their temperature.

 

His travel was fairly long, from Liberia to Brussels to Dulles to Dallas. He could've had no symptoms at the start. (or not. Who's to know how much he was lying about?) It had been four days since  he  had contact with the sick person, and the median time for start of symptoms is five days.

 

According to what you're saying there's "no need" to quarantine the exposed schoolchildren. And  yet they are.

[Guest]

I am going to ask, why are you so afraid of this? What media sources are you so tuned into that have you so scared that no matter what anyone says you are freaking out?

 

I have family and friends in Dallas and the surrounding area.  They are very worried.  My media sources are just news stations that everyone else is listening to, and several people on here have posted links to news articles.

 

Why does it matter, anyway?

[unsinkable]

His travel was fairly long, from Liberia to Brussels to Dulles to Dallas. He could've had no symptoms at the start. (or not. Who's to know how much he was lying about?) It had been four days since he had contact with the sick person, and the median time for start of symptoms is five days.

 

According to what you're saying there's "no need" to quarantine the exposed schoolchildren. And yet they are.

I think/believe/feel that we will get on top of this in the US. I'm more worried about infected people flying from an infected nation to another 3rd world nation with limited resources and overcrowded regions.

 

Just reading your list of cities reminded me of that. What if his end city was a place that couldn't handle an outbreak?

[Guest]

I believe they are checking temps twice a day. There is a period of time after the temp rises where they are still not contagious, so it isn't an instantaneous thing. I think they are just doing the best they can. It wouldn't be realistic to keep a 24 hr monitor running. At some point, you have to trust a little bit (that the person will do the right thing.) If they prove to be untrustworthy (like...say...doing things they have been told not to do because of the risk...) I would hope that further restrictions would be imposed.

 

 

Does anyone know why his family tried to leave?  That's what makes me so untrusting... stuff like that.  And the fact that this man knew he had contact with ebola patients before he flew here, but came anyway, and proceeded to have contact with an estimated 100+ people.  That doesn't give me a lot of faith in people.  The story keeps unfolding with new developments that are quite surprising.

[Katy]

Can someone fill me in on the source that the family tried to leave?

 

Since the family is who called the CDC, I'm suspicious of stories that are critical of them.

 

I can't believe the hospital hasn't taken more responsibility.

[Jean in Newcastle]

The problem now is that who knows exactly when he become contagious. Assuming reports that he lied on forms about being in contact with Ebola sufferers he may have likely kept his symptoms hidden too for as long as he could in order to ensure he made it to the US.

 

Not saying I believe that but that can't be ruled out knowing that he lied to get here.

He had to have his temperature taken to get on the airplane out of Liberia.  He couldn't lie about that.  So no, he was not contagious.

[Lolly]

Does anyone know why his family tried to leave?  That's what makes me so untrusting... stuff like that.  And the fact that this man knew he had contact with ebola patients before he flew here, but came anyway, and proceeded to have contact with an estimated 100+ people.  That doesn't give me a lot of faith in people.  The story keeps unfolding with new developments that are quite surprising.

 

I would just be guessing, but being cooped up in a house is not very easy and extremely stressful. At some point, Jinnah, we have to realize that there isn't much control over things. Imposing super high restrictions on people is difficult, costly, and (to a great extent) unfair. It is...unAmerican. It is so easy to have contact with a hundred people. Panic does no good. We just have to hope for the best and realize that in many ways, this disease is unlike others we are more familiar with. The flu, for example, is more contagious BEFORE symptoms present. With ebola, we DO have warning. 

[unsinkable]

Can someone fill me in on the source that the family tried to leave?

 

Since the family is who called the CDC, I'm suspicious of stories that are critical of them.

 

I can't believe the hospital hasn't taken more responsibility.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/ebola-patients-family-ordered-stay-inside-leave/story?id=25912405