umsami Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 So, I've been stewing about this for about a day. Wednesday, DH and I went to drive by a house we were considering renting, as we couldn't meet the realtor until later…and only DH was going to go. When we got there, we noticed a truck outside, and it turned out it was the owner. He seemed like a very nice guy… we talked a lot…everything seemed great. We liked the house, it was small but would work for our needs. We filled out the application, credit report, etc.. including providing a letter from our bank, stellar references from former landlords, etc., as well as a heft deposit (first month, last month, and one month security.) This was maybe 10:30 or 11:00 a.m. on Thursday. Thursday at 2:30 p.m. the realtor called and said that she couldn't tell me the reason, but the tenant had decided not to rent to us. There was nothing wrong on our application or any issues…and she hung up. Did I mention I was wearing a hijab when we met him? I mean that's the only thing that comes to mind, especially as the agent said there were no issues with our application and she couldn't tell me the reason. DH is a physician. Usually people like to rent to doctors. I know it's illegal to discriminate based on faith…. but I'm not sure if I want to do anything or not. It's not like we would want to rent his house anyway, but it kind of pisses me off that he is getting away with this? Do I just let it go….do something…. write a letter to him…. what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedmom4 Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 That would drive me absolutely insane until I knew the reason why. Hopefully the owner wasn't discriminating against your faith but it could be a reason. Of course the guy could just be strange and is super picky but it does sound suspicious. I hope you find out the reason at some point! And I hope you find an even better rental! Elise in NC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 You can report it to your state's fair housing authority. I would not write him a letter. The only non-discriminatory thing I can think of is if the house is too small to house a family of 6. Many rentals do have limits on the number of residents using a '2 plus 1' formula where a one bedroom would house 3 people, a two bedroom would house 5 people and a three bedroom would house 7 people. This is not mandated by law though and some landlords may want less people in the house due to wear and tear and noise issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoseInABook Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I wonder if it's the hijab or 4 kids mentioned in your siggie? I've heard of a lot of families with more than 2 kids having a hard time renting a place, especially a smaller one like you mentioned it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umsami Posted July 5, 2014 Author Share Posted July 5, 2014 I wonder if it's the hijab or 4 kids mentioned in your siggie? I've heard of a lot of families with more than 2 kids having a hard time renting a place, especially a smaller one like you mentioned it was. Well, it was a 3 bedroom, so I don't think it's that unusual to have two kids share a bedroom? I don't know. It could be something else….but we did have people tell us in other locals that the fire code wouldn't permit so many people in a building or what not. The "I can't tell you the reason" just seems so bizarre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneStepAtATime Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 So unfortunate! Ugh! I am so sorry, umsami! Maybe it was discrimination since they couldn't give you a reason. But maybe it was concern over having a larger family in the home than the homeowner was comfortable with.....not sure how you find out, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umsami Posted July 5, 2014 Author Share Posted July 5, 2014 I guess I'm willing to let it go…but it just annoys me. It sounds dorky, but we've moved a lot because of DH's career/schooling, and I was psyched that they had one room painted purple for DD and her younger sibling, and one room painted blue for the older boys. I feel bad that they've always had basically neutral beige/white rooms their entire lives because of all of our moving. We found a new place…which is fine…advantage of being closer to the beach....but we're back to neutrals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingiguana Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 We just rented out a house. We had 8 applicants. All would have been fine. But, well, we could only choose one. And the choosing was a bit random. We kind of based it on income, kind of on the pets, kind of on who called first and who seemed most interested, kind of on previous landlord recommendations. But the fact is that we turned down 7 very nice groups of people that we would have been happy to rent to. It's just... we couldn't rent to all of them. We don't feel so great about that, but there's not much we can do about it. So I'm not sure I'd read much of anything into it. If the rental market is tight, you're going to lose out a good portion of the time. You mentioned that you couldn't meet with the realtor immed -- it's entirely possible someone else dropped everything and got over there to see the house first. And that that's why they got the house. Unless it hasn't been rented to anyone at all.... But even then, it may be the number of people in your family -- and *that* may have to do with city codes about how many occupants there can be in a house of a certain size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysticmomma Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I'd let the realtor know you will file a letter of discrimination, perhaps that's showing your cards, but maybe she'll offer a reason then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I am so sorry. Really, though, I'm not sure what you COULD do. Even if it was because of your faith, the owner could easily give any reason. With that said, if it was because of your faith, what would pursuing this do? Do you really want a landlord that doesn't want you there? FWIW, I would not want to rent our home (3 bedrooms) to a family of 6. It is incurring wear and tear (more than "normal" with our family of 5, I would definitely hesitate big time to rent to a family larger than ours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysticmomma Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 It's illegal to refuse a rental in the us based on family size unless it specifically violates occupancy laws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbel Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I've applied for but not gotten a rental - as a single white woman with no kids or pets, great credit, etc. I've known others as well. I just assumed there were other applicants and I didn't make the cut. Like not getting jobs I was qualified for because there were other applicants who were just as qualified (or more so). Perhaps they chose not to give a reason because they were afraid any reason - even "we had a bunch of applicants and had to pick one" - would open them up to a complaint? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butter Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 The behavior of the real estate agent seems odd. I can't help but wonder if she was annoyed you went to the house without her. I wouldn't jump straight to religion being the reason and definitely wouldn't file a complaint due to an assumption. There may have been no reason given, and unless the owner is a complete idiot, even if religion was the reason, he sure as heck wouldn't have given it as the reason to the realtor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrittanyM Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 My husband is a realtor and he said there isn't anything you can do unless you can document that the place was rented to someone else. I'm sorry, that would be frustrating to me as well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 It's illegal to refuse a rental in the us based on family size unless it specifically violates occupancy laws. But we have no idea whether or not that was the reason. There may have been several qualified applicants, and the landlord chose between them. Realistically with all else being equal, if he had a choice between a professional, childless couple with no pets, and a professional family of six, it would make perfect sense that he would have chosen the childless couple. It's not discrimination for the landlord to choose whomever he considered to be the best applicants. Additionally, I'm a bit surprised that anyone thinks the hijab had anything to do with it, because the guy was friendly right from the start. I think it would be a bit ridiculous to even consider sending a letter or filing a discrimination complaint against the man without any evidence whatsoever. I have a feeling that this was probably a simple case of many people applying for the same rental property and the landlord making what he felt was the most practical and least risky choice of a new tenant. He may honestly not have had anything at all against umsami's family, but simply liked someone else better -- or maybe someone else offered to sign a long term lease on the property. Unfortunately, umsami will probably never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I really would write the fair housing authority and just say what you told us. The situation was fishy, you're not sure if there was really discrimination at play, but you suspect it, you no longer want to rent the house and don't want to pursue it further, but you wanted to let them know. If they discriminate against someone else, at least there will already be a record, right? By coincidence, all my mother's tenants have been Muslim for the house she rents, though she's not in a heavily Muslim area. I think she had other tenants at one point and they were horrible though. At this point, I think she only wants to rent to Muslim families because they've all been good tenants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefgazer Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 If I was a potential landlord, the hijab would not have even entered into the picture, but the kids would have, and so would any pets. I'd be afraid that a security deposit wouldn't cover any potential damage. Guy might have had a rough time with tenants with multiple kids or pets in that past and it's spooking him. Illegal or not, If someone doesn't want to rent their house you, the will cleverly find away not to. I'd let it go and move on; it's probably not worth your effort to pursue it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysticmomma Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 But we have no idea whether or not that was the reason. There may have been several qualified applicants, and the landlord chose between them. Realistically with all else being equal, if he had a choice between a professional, childless couple with no pets, and a professional family of six, it would make perfect sense that he would have chosen the childless couple. It's not discrimination for the landlord to choose whomever he considered to be the best applicants. Additionally, I'm a bit surprised that anyone thinks the hijab had anything to do with it, because the guy was friendly right from the start. I think it would be a bit ridiculous to even consider sending a letter or filing a discrimination complaint against the man without any evidence whatsoever. I have a feeling that this was probably a simple case of many people applying for the same rental property and the landlord making what he felt was the most practical and least risky choice of a new tenant. He may honestly not have had anything at all against umsami's family, but simply liked someone else better -- or maybe someone else offered to sign a long term lease on the property. Unfortunately, umsami will probably never know. I was referring to Aimee? She said "FWIW, I would not want to rent our home (3 bedrooms) to a family of 6. It is incurring wear and tear (more than "normal" with our family of 5, I would definitely hesitate big time to rent to a family larger than ours." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 The "I can't tell you the reason" just seems so bizarre. I would call your local fair housing folks, and ask for their advice. People here have given lots of reasons why the landlord might have chosen someone else, or refused you for legal reasons (occupancy, etc.), but none of these would have resulted in "I can't tell you the reason". The man you spoke to may have been fine with your hijab, but other voices (his spouse, etc.) may have also played a role in the decision. The realtor may have been trying to give you information without incriminating herself, you know? Talking to the fair housing people would give you accurate information about your rights, what might happen if you file a complaint, and so on. When your're in the midst of discrimination it's easy to brush it off, but you are likely to feel better down the line if you've at least taken the first step to follow up on this. Asking for info doesn't mean you have to file a complaint. But it will give you the opportunity to run the scenario by someone who is an expert in such things, which may help you to process the incident, if nothing else. And one day your kids may face a similar scenario. Model for them how to calmly and professionally follow up on it. It matters. Do it for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 We just rented out a house. We had 8 applicants. All would have been fine. But, well, we could only choose one. ... You mentioned that you couldn't meet with the realtor immed -- it's entirely possible someone else dropped everything and got over there to see the house first. And that that's why they got the house. ...But even then, it may be the number of people in your family -- and *that* may have to do with city codes about how many occupants there can be in a house of a certain size. See, with the exception of family size (which may also reflect possible discrimination), each of these things could easily and legally be explained by the realtor. "I'm sorry, there was another applicant for the house and the landlord has decided to rent it to them instead of you." But we have no idea whether or not that was the reason. ... Additionally, I'm a bit surprised that anyone thinks the hijab had anything to do with it, because the guy was friendly right from the start. I think it would be a bit ridiculous to even consider sending a letter or filing a discrimination complaint against the man without any evidence whatsoever. Catwoman, this is what discrimination often looks like. The house is taken, the restaurant is full, we're not taking any new wedding cake orders right now. One of the most frustrating things about discrimination for people in frequently-targeted groups is experiencing this kind of thing and wondering, each time, whether it's because of discrimination or not. On the one hand, there often could be another explanation. On the other hand, the cumulative evidence can often lead a rational person to assume that at least some of the incidents are, indeed, a result of discrimination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMamaBird Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 If the owner said to the Realtor "I don't want to rent to Muslims" or something of that sort, wouldn't she have a professional obligation to report discrimination? I don't know anything about the real estate business, but it seems like they'd have a vested interest in keeping their noses clean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 Catwoman, this is what discrimination often looks like. The house is taken, the restaurant is full, we're not taking any new wedding cake orders right now. One of the most frustrating things about discrimination for people in frequently-targeted groups is experiencing this kind of thing and wondering, each time, whether it's because of discrimination or not. On the one hand, there often could be another explanation. On the other hand, the cumulative evidence can often lead a rational person to assume that at least some of the incidents are, indeed, a result of discrimination. The thing is, if umsami files a complaint against this man without the slightest shred of evidence, isn't that wrong, too? Frankly, it seems a little paranoid to suspect that she was being discriminated against based on her hijab, when the man was friendly to both her and her dh when they met him. Could he have been discriminatory? Of course it's possible. It's always possible. But is it right to file a complaint against the man just because it's possible, even without any evidence at all? I just don't think so. It's kind of like when someone posts to ask if she should call CPS because she has a bad feeling about some parents she barely knows, but she has never actually witnessed anything that could be considered abusive. Is it possible that she's right? Sure it is. But do you report someone based on nothing more than a feeling? I don't believe that you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenade Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 The behavior of the real estate agent seems odd. I can't help but wonder if she was annoyed you went to the house without her. This was my first thought when reading the OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in Australia Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tap Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 Her saying "I can't tell you the reason" could also just mean....I don't know what the reason is, so I can tell you what I don't know. Only you would know what her tone of voice implied. It could also just be that she was asked to not disclose the reason by her client and she is honoring that. It could be your faith, but it could also be that they decided to rent to someone else, because they preferred them or it may have been a friend of the family/relative. Maybe not entirely ethical, but not necessarily illegal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlebug42 Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 Actually, even if his reasons are discriminatory, it may not be illegal. There is a loophole in federal fair housing laws called Mrs. Murphy's law. It states that if a person owns fewer than four rental units and lives in one of them, they are not bound by fair housing laws. They can deny anyone for any reason and don't have to explain it. http://fairhousing.foxrothschild.com/2013/04/articles/fha-basics/the-fhas-mrs-murphy-exemption-a-50-state-guide/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingiguana Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 See, with the exception of family size (which may also reflect possible discrimination), each of these things could easily and legally be explained by the realtor. "I'm sorry, there was another applicant for the house and the landlord has decided to rent it to them instead of you." But as a LL, I wouldn't be wanting to volunteer the information. Renters who are turned away can sometimes turn nasty. They may argue their case, for days on end, even if someone else has already signed a lease. The less said about the reason, the better, is often the best policy to follow. Because ANY reason may give someone a reason to continue to badger the landlord. Even if the majority of rejected tenants wouldn't go this route, there's enough potential to make most ll's wary. So, no, I don't think I would read any discrimination into this situation just because no reasons were given. UNLESS the op picked up some vibe that she's not mentioning. However, even if there were discrimination, I think it would likely be impossible to prove, given the information. Most landlords have been well briefed on the legalities. They either won't discriminate (because they've been educated, or just because they're not that kind of people), or if they do, they will know to cover their tracks pretty well. And if it was discrimination, if it were me being rejected from the rental, I don't think I'd want the hassle of renting from someone who was constantly finding fault with me for my religion/gender/skin tone/nationality/etc. It's all well and good to say stand up for your rights and all that, but the choice of where you live, and how much hassle you can handle day to day can hugely impact one's life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umsami Posted July 5, 2014 Author Share Posted July 5, 2014 You mentioned that you couldn't meet with the realtor immed -- it's entirely possible someone else dropped everything and got over there to see the house first. And that that's why they got the house. Unless it hasn't been rented to anyone at all.... But even then, it may be the number of people in your family -- and *that* may have to do with city codes about how many occupants there can be in a house of a certain size. No we offered to meet with the realtor at any time, but she couldn't meet until 6 p.m. that night. We were the first application in…and there were no others at that time. When we dropped off everything, the realtor told my husband she would call when we could pick up the keys and come back to sign the lease. That's why I'm so surprised. We've faced not getting a rental because of other families being first in line…or even a…"well, we'd prefer a smaller family size"… but the whole "we can't tell you the reason" after everything seemed fine is the strange thing. I can file a complaint, if I want to based on what I've read of the local housing laws. The owner may/may not be fined up to $10k if this is the first offense. I don't want to do that, actually. I don't think that accomplishes anything esp. if he was biased against Muslims (other than making him hate us more). I'm just bummed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysticmomma Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I think it starts a paper trail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie G Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 When we were landlording, we numbered applications when they came in. We had a list of the qualifications to rent and they were given that list when they viewed the property. Then when they turned in their application, in front of them we put their number...they might be the 6th application we had taken. Then we started going through applications and the first one who met all the requirements got first choice at the house. We did that to prevent people from being upset or complaining that we had discriminated. It helped that we had a very thorough list of requirements, such as being in your job for over a year, etc. Your realtor might have meant that she couldn't tell you a reason because there really wasn't any reason other than they had several qualified applicants and didn't choose you. But it was poorly worded- if that was the case she should have said that you weren't turned down, just that there was a pool of qualified applicants. I'm sorry it happened to you this way- it just leaves you questioning so many things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThisIsTheDay Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I don't think that accomplishes anything esp. if he was biased against Muslims (other than making him hate us more). I'm just bummed. I have no advice. Others have given possible alternative reasons why your application was declined. But you were the first and only app at that time, so your discrimination guess seems like the only possibility to me. And if that is true, I'm so sorry. :grouphug: :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spryte Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I'm sorry this happened to you, umsami. Whatever the reason you didn't get the house, it stinks. And if it was discrimination - it stinks even more. :grouphug: Your family sounds like a great family to have in a rental home. I hope you find the perfect house, in the perfect location, soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefgazer Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I think "the less said, the better" is also the standard when calling to ask why a person left their job. It opens an employer up to a lawsuit, no matter what they say, so they revert to saying that no information is their policy. That may be the case here. But as a LL, I wouldn't be wanting to volunteer the information. Renters who are turned away can sometimes turn nasty. They may argue their case, for days on end, even if someone else has already signed a lease. The less said about the reason, the better, is often the best policy to follow. Because ANY reason may give someone a reason to continue to badger the landlord. Even if the majority of rejected tenants wouldn't go this route, there's enough potential to make most ll's wary. So, no, I don't think I would read any discrimination into this situation just because no reasons were given. UNLESS the op picked up some vibe that she's not mentioning. However, even if there were discrimination, I think it would likely be impossible to prove, given the information. Most landlords have been well briefed on the legalities. They either won't discriminate (because they've been educated, or just because they're not that kind of people), or if they do, they will know to cover their tracks pretty well. And if it was discrimination, if it were me being rejected from the rental, I don't think I'd want the hassle of renting from someone who was constantly finding fault with me for my religion/gender/skin tone/nationality/etc. It's all well and good to say stand up for your rights and all that, but the choice of where you live, and how much hassle you can handle day to day can hugely impact one's life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katilac Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I guess I'm willing to let it go…but it just annoys me. It sounds dorky, but we've moved a lot because of DH's career/schooling, and I was psyched that they had one room painted purple for DD and her younger sibling, and one room painted blue for the older boys. I feel bad that they've always had basically neutral beige/white rooms their entire lives because of all of our moving. We found a new place…which is fine…advantage of being closer to the beach....but we're back to neutrals. No need for neutrals! It's cheap and easy to paint a bedroom, especially without furniture in it. I'd paint it a fun color before moving their stuff in, and repaint it neutral when I moved. Painting is not a big deal. We've painted and done other improvements and changes to rentals. It was worth the work and expense to us, because even a year is a long time to live somewhere that doesn't reflect you. We've never lost a deposit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ann.without.an.e Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I haven't read the replies so sorry if this is repetitive. Maybe there isn't a reason? Maybe they had several applications and simply picked one and not the others, but for no particular reason. Just trying to see the glass half full ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanny Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I hope that it has nothing to do with you religion. It looks from your sig that you and your DH have five (5) kids. That's a lot of wear and tear on a house, because of increased use of the bathrooms, etc. GL in finding a much better house, where your family will be welcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 You can report it to your state's fair housing authority. I would not write him a letter. The only non-discriminatory thing I can think of is if the house is too small to house a family of 6. Many rentals do have limits on the number of residents using a '2 plus 1' formula where a one bedroom would house 3 people, a two bedroom would house 5 people and a three bedroom would house 7 people. This is not mandated by law though and some landlords may want less people in the house due to wear and tear and noise issues. The size of the house is probably the issue. I show apartments for my folks and this summer there was prospective renter who had a fabulous application -- except that the number of people going to live there was too many. It was a 2 bedroom apartment. She had 6 people listed on the application. 2 adults and 4 kids. They planned to put all 4 kids in one bedroom. :( Landlords have to be so careful in how they deny prospectives.... it's too easy to offend. Don't be offended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 The thing is, if umsami files a complaint against this man without the slightest shred of evidence, isn't that wrong, too? The thing is, if umsami files a complaint against this man without the slightest shred of evidence, isn't that wrong, too? Frankly, it seems a little paranoid to suspect that she was being discriminated against based on her hijab, when the man was friendly to both her and her dh when they met him. Could he have been discriminatory? Of course it's possible. It's always possible. But is it right to file a complaint against the man just because it's possible, even without any evidence at all? I just don't think so. It's kind of like when someone posts to ask if she should call CPS because she has a bad feeling about some parents she barely knows, but she has never actually witnessed anything that could be considered abusive. Is it possible that she's right? Sure it is. But do you report someone based on nothing more than a feeling? I don't believe that you do. Catwoman, I agree that the case might not rise to the level of actually filing a complaint, though I don't think we can know that without more investigation. It's possible that evidence could be found if someone looked for it. (For example, *is* the house rented to someone else?) I did not suggest that the OP report the incident; I had only suggested that the OP call the fair housing folks and discuss it with them, gathering accurate information about the law in her area and their thoughts on the scenario before deciding how or if to move forward on it. (For example, was there a pattern of prior complaints about this landlord or this realtor?) They have more expertise on the issue, and the specifics of the local area, than we do here at the Hive. I don't think I am paranoid; it's more that I've seen way more than my fair share of housing discrimination, and I don't like it. I've had a realtor tell me that the owner of a house I was considering buying really wanted to sell it to me, because the other people who were interested were another race, and the owner did not want to sell to them because it would be a bad thing to do to the neighbors. (And then we realized the realtor *was* the owner, and had not disclosed that to us. Needless to say, we decided not to do business with the realtor.) When we moved once, one of dh's new co-workers pulled out a map and circled the areas where we could and could not live, based on our race. That information was then repeated by any number of other people in the area. We've had neighbors comment that certain people "don't belong in our neighborhood" because of their race. In one area, when calling potential landlords, the first question they asked, before we could get a word out, was whether or not we drove a pick-up truck, because they did not rent to people who drove a pick-up truck. (Yes, really - we experienced the same question from multiple landlords in that area. From what we understand, pick-up trucks were a marker for race and class - one that they could legally use to screen potential tenants, because pick-up truck owners are not a protected class.) Housing discrimination exists, and it stinks. That said, it exists more in some places than in others, and if you live in a welcoming area, it's hard to believe what goes on in some areas of our country. OP, I understand and respect your decision to put this incident behind you. I'm sorry you are left wondering what you did, if anything, or what aspect of your family, if anything, led to your losing the house. In America, of all places, it's sad that discrimination is an all-too-possible explanation for what you experienced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1GirlTwinBoys Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 If he was discriminating, why would he have gone to all the trouble of filling out paperwork and taking deposits??? Sometimes things just happen that has nothing to do with discrimination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amira Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I think it starts a paper trail.This. Even though housing discrimination is extremely difficult to prove, if someone does have a pattern of refusing homes, no one will ever know unless people start reporting smaller things (unless, of course, the landlord does something blatant). We're a family of five who's had trouble getting people to rent us 3-bedroom apartments. We've rented from landlords who've bragged about telling people they don't have anyone available when they call about an apartment if they have an accent or "sound black." I've known people who wouldn't think twice about refusing to rent to a woman wearing a hijab. I think housing discrimination is likely rampant in the US and it's worth at least mentioning a possible concern to the right people. Umsami probably can't prove anything, but what happened to her is concerning and it is perfectly reasonable to follow up with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiguirre Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 We filled out the application, credit report, etc.. including providing a letter from our bank, stellar references from former landlords, etc., as well as a heft deposit (first month, last month, and one month security.) This was maybe 10:30 or 11:00 a.m. on Thursday. Did he know that you have 4 kids and a cat before he took the application and the deposit? If he didn't, I think one of those could be why he turned you down. If he did know about those factors, you could file a discrimination complaint. But, he might have had an application from a couple with good jobs and no kids or pets an hour after you left. If I were a LL I'd pick the DINKs too. In his favor, I doubt he would have been friendly if he really didn't want to rent to Muslims. I'm glad you found another rental. Enjoy the beach! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer132 Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 If he had multiple potential renters, maybe he just chose someone else. That's happened to us before. I would try not to assume I was due to your faith, but I can see how you would wonder. I wear a headcovering, so I do know what it feel like to stand out a little. I hope you can find a better rental unit. Eta: can you just call the realtor and say your really wondering why you didn't get the house, that you want to know so it doesn't affect your attempt to rent another one? That way you can appease your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 perhaps his wife promised it to someone else first. we had this happen to us for a vacation rental, we put down deposits and everything - then I got a phone call saying it had already been booked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoobie Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I hope it wasn't because of your religion. It sucks that you even have to consider that in our country, and I'm sorry. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idnib Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 :grouphug: I'm Muslim but don't wear a hijab. I am, however, of the brown persuasion. :D When DH and I were looking for a rental we heard of one through a property management company web site. We parked down the street, walked to the house, and found the owner was working in the yard. We started chatting with her and she showed us the house and it was perfect for us. We loved the house. She asked us lots of questions, etc and we all hit it off. She also told us we were the first to stop by. She asked our credit scores and we didn't remember them exactly, but we had printouts at home because we check them every year. We drove home and got the printouts and dropped them through her mail slot because she wasn't there. We called her to follow up and she told us she was renting the place to someone else. We were really surprised because she had made it sound like the place was ours as long as out credit was good and we had the move-in money (we did). Long story short, it turned out the property manager was really angry with her for "going behind their backs" and having them list the house on their web site so we found it, but then working with us directly, which would cut their commission. I don't think she was being nefarious; we were all just excited and didn't really think of the implications. In the end, the PM was angry with her and I think she went along with a different renter to appease them; after all, they would be managing the property for her and she wanted to be on their good side. Your situation sounds similar. It sounds like you got along well with the owner, but were cutting the realtor out of the process and he probably had a contract with her. She's probably angry; hence her lack of a reason and her hanging up. I'm sorry this happened to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kroe1 Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 If he seemed interested enough to take your deposit and application, I doubt it has anything to do with the way you were dressed. He probably went inside and got a bad reference from someone you feel would give you a good one. He may have learned about occupancy size codes, too. (We can only have 4 maximum in our beach house per a city ordinance.) Of course, someone may have showed up and offered more money. I think I would let this one go and not assume clothing was involved. Based on the way you presented the event, clothing/religion is low on my suspect list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 Yeah, once in my case it was the MIL who had a scene and caused the rental to fall through because she wanted a relative to live there instead. You never know what goes on out of your sight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThisIsTheDay Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 No need for neutrals! It's cheap and easy to paint a bedroom, especially without furniture in it. I'd paint it a fun color before moving their stuff in, and repaint it neutral when I moved. Painting is not a big deal. We've painted and done other improvements and changes to rentals. It was worth the work and expense to us, because even a year is a long time to live somewhere that doesn't reflect you. We've never lost a deposit! Going a bit off topic here, but we've owned a couple of rentals. We would never grant tenants permission to paint (or make any other changes). If they did so without telling us, even if they did repaint, it would be a violation of the lease, and the chances are great that the walls would need to be repainted with the color that we chose to match the rest of the house. Based on a recent thread, I know several here would throw fits over this. ::shrug:: Just as they would be happier with another landlord, we would prefer other tenants. If a renter wants to paint or otherwise make a change to the interior, it would be in their best interest to double check with the owner first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FriedClams Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I would think that if the guy was welcoming and polite it's unlikely a religious issue. IMHO, pursuing legal action would be frivolous. If he HAD said something or was rude or abrasive when he met you in person - I'd definitely say something or call him on it. I just prefer to give people the benefit of the doubt, just as I would like someone to assume the best of me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katilac Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 Going a bit off topic here, but we've owned a couple of rentals. We would never grant tenants permission to paint (or make any other changes). If they did so without telling us, even if they did repaint, it would be a violation of the lease, and the chances are great that the walls would need to be repainted with the color that we chose to match the rest of the house. Based on a recent thread, I know several here would throw fits over this. ::shrug:: Just as they would be happier with another landlord, we would prefer other tenants. If a renter wants to paint or otherwise make a change to the interior, it would be in their best interest to double check with the owner first. I'm pretty sure it was always just white when we started, and white when we ended, lol. If our landlords had ever seemed to have chosen the paint color with some degree of care, we probably would have asked, but overall life was much simpler when we didn't ask for permission to paint or add a vent fan to a bathroom that didn't have one, etc. Of course, we knew we were taking a gamble with the deposit, but no one every objected to anything we did. Heck, I'm pretty sure no one ever noticed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.