Car seat question for 8 year old

[MotherGoose]

Hi

My 8 year old is in a Graco 3 in 1 carseat, still with the 5 point harness.  It fits her fine (she's petite and weighs 45 pounds on a good day!)  We are needing to get another one for our other car, and of course the obvious answer is getting a plain booster (which all her friends use!)  And I see some people with kids her age or even younger just sitting them in the car with a seat belt.  What do you think?  As she's homeschooled, it's not like friends see her getting into the car every day at school or anything.  DH thinks it's crazy to have her in a 5 point still.  There is the aggravation factor of moving the carseat to other vehicles, but that doesn't happen very often either.  My 5 yo is barely 30 lbs, and as I understand it she needs to be in a 5 point till she weighs at least 40 lbs.  What do you think?

[Trish]

Based on a cursory check of safety laws by state, I'd guess she's ready for a booster seat.

 

http://www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/laws/childsafety_laws.html

 

 

 

 

[HelenNotOfTroy]

There is a check to see if your child is ready to sit in the car without a booster on this page http://www.thecarseatlady.com/booster_seats/booster_seats_4.html

Your 8 year old should be ready to sit in just a booster but that page has some guidelines for that also.

[Carrie12345]

The fact that she's petite is of more importance than her age (safety wise. Legally is a whole other story.)

 

Ds will be 7 in a couple of weeks.  At 48lbs, he's in a 5-pt . I have every intention of keeping him that way to the 65lb limit, and then using the checklist to see if he needs the backless or not.  I just don't see any benefit to NOT using one unless it's actually getting in the way of safety.

[LaxMom]

My guys just left their 5-pts behind for the belt-adjusting booster option. They're 9 and just over 60lbs. They have Safe-Go seats that convert by taking the back off and putting in a seatbelt tether that keeps the belt in position over their shoulder.

 

I agree that not being in the car all that often decreases the odds of being in an accident. I would not rely on that alone to protect my children when I have safety options available.

[G5052]

FWIW, mine used a 5-point Britax seat (good to 70 pounds) until they outgrew them. And they didn't sit in the front seat until they were 14 y.o. Did they complain? Yes. I overruled. But for many reasons, I'm very picky about this sort of thing. Safety is very important to me.

 

This site has some more information if you want more criteria to think about:  http://www.thecarseatlady.com/booster_seats/booster_seats_4.html

[craftyerin]

I would booster an 8yo unless she passes the 5-step test (in the link above).  I would not harness an 8yo. 

[MotherGoose]

I'm definitely not going to use only a seat belt.  She's in a 5 point now, and I intend to keep her in a 5 point in my car until she outgrows it, it's just for the other car I'm thinking about.  Legally I know she would be fine in just a booster.  It's safety that I'm concerned about.  

[Pamela H in Texas]

We stopped harnessing dd in our main vehicle recently. 

All three kids use boosters in other vehicles.  

 

Safety is about development more than size (other than belt-positioning which I assume everyone is going to address regardless).  My kids MIGHT make it to 50 pounds by ten (if we count the weight of wet clothing?).  They will use boosters at 10, but at some point, that is going to have to change regardless of size. Some people are just tiny.  The same goes the other way also.  My oldest was 47 pounds at 2 years old (and 5).  She still should have been in a carseat though the law only required til 40 pounds.  Developmentally, it still would have been best to have her rear-facing as a toddler also (I don't think that was probably possible in the 90s, but it is now and I'd highly recommend it). My 19yo was in a booster until almost 12 years old.

 

Anyway, I just think we have to use some common sense also.  We can't move toddlers out of seats just because they are chunky kids and we can't have kids learning to drive with a booster either.  

 

 

[SKL]

I'd keep her in the harness as long as it fits her and your lifestyle, in the car she most often rides in.

 

For the other car I'd buy an ordinary high-back booster (since she is petite).  In my state, and I think most of the USA, an 8yo does not legally need to be in anything more than a seat belt.  From all I've read, an 8yo is long past the age when there's a significant difference between the safety of a 5-point harness and a properly-fitted, properly-worn lap & shoulder belt.

[zoobie]

I'd look at whether the high-back booster fits her correctly and use it. From everything I researched a few years ago, if the child isn't flopping around, the booster is as safe as a harnessed seat for an older kid. We kept the older kids harnessed until they outgrew the Frontier, but that was at 6, and they couldn't fasten the belt without it locking up until then. The harness allowed them to fasten independently. My 8 year old is now out of a booster entirely, but he is 4' 9" and 90 lbs. He just recently stopped needing it in DH's vehicle for the belt not to hit his neck oddly with both feet on the floor, etc.

[kitten18]

I would buy a high-back booster. We have a Graco turbo-booster and a Cosco booster. I like the Graco much better.

[MotherGoose]

What are the benefits of a high back booster?  And yes, I have a friend who'd still need a booster if we went by height and she's 40 years old!  :)

[kitten18]

The back positions the belt at the shoulder so it comes down the middle of the chest and doesn't ride-up on the neck.

 

My dd is VERY petite and at 10 she still uses a high-back booster.

[ScoutTN]

Car-seat.org is a great source for information and dialogue regarding car seat choices.

[zoobie]

What are the benefits of a high back booster? And yes, I have a friend who'd still need a booster if we went by height and she's 40 years old! :)

http://carseatblog.com/8243/to-backless-or-not-to-backless-that-is-the-question/

 

Do you have headrests in the back seat? Side curtain air bags? Does she sleep in the car regularly? We opted to switch to backless after the Frontier was outgrown because we had headrests, air bags, and my [ginormous] kids' shoulders were crunched by the backs of the boosters. The seat belt fit correctly with a backless for mine.

[MomtoCandJ]

Dd1 (who 45 lbs) 5 yrs. has a backless booster in my car (it fits in the car with dd2's infant seat). She uses a high back booster for Dh's truck. Before dd2 was born dd1 used the high back in my car.

[ondreeuh]

I have the opposite problem - my 6 year old is 62# and our seat's harness limit is 65#. He is quite tall too (so physically would be fine in a belt-positioning booster) but I really like the harness. He just chills in his seat on long rides, and in a HBB he would probably do a lot more squirming. I wish I could harness longer.

 

I would be inclined to keep the harness until it bothered her. It really is safer than a seat belt, although a seat belt is technically "safe enough."

 

It's amazing how much our kids' sizes vary!

[Paige]

I'd get her a high back booster. There's some that can be latched in which makes them feel more secure. I'd get one that converts to backless just in case, but it's probably not necessary for a petite kid. My DS is 12, closer to 13, and is just now tall enough to not need a booster. He never outgrew the high back part and will go straight to the regular seat. He's actually still in it because we haven't gotten around to taking it out and it fits fine. His height is in his legs, not his torso. I think a 5pt would be overkill for a new seat. I wouldn't take her out of one, but they are expensive, bulky, hard to transfer, and she would probably be just fine in a regular booster.

[matrips]

My kids are 9yo and still in 5 point harness in my car. We have the britax frontiers. In dHs car, we finally went to booster seats at age 8 since he has a Prius. For the spare car at 8yo, I think a booster, if it fit well, would be fine. It will also give you a chance to observe if she can stay still, not wiggle around etc. my kids lose out every time on the list with #5- staying still the entire trip. Their car seats are comfy, they can sleep if they want, and they can't wiggle around or fight. I do cringe sometimes when I see them around other kids their age who sometimes don't even use boosters, but I don't think anyone has ridiculed them.

[SKL]

I don't think kids notice or care what kind of seats their 8yo peers are in nowadays.  I would not buy a new booster seat just to be more hip, LOL.

[staceyobu]

I did a lot of car seat research recently after we were in a wreck. Two things have been proven: rear facing as long as possible and boostering until they definitely meet qualifications to be without a seat. Extended forward harnessing is really speculative that it helps. Low back vs high back booster is also not proven that one is better than the other. A child that can correctly sit in a booster (usually around age 5-6) is perfectly safe in a booster.

[Arcadia]

My small for age 8 year old boy would fall out of his brother's high back booster (Frontier) if he falls asleep.  He has room to spare in his Frontier in harness mode.  My big for size 9 year old is still in his high back booster.  We convert the Frontier from harness to booster when he outgrew at 9 even though he is not matured enough to use it in harness mode.

 

[MotherGoose]

I think I'll look at high back booster then for her. This is a sensitive topic for me because of the whole "You sat on the Sears Roebuck catalog as a booster and you turned out fine" thing, and that my in laws put her in two seatbelts for "safety" when she was about 4 because they were too lazy to put in the car seat. And that she's tiny.

[Above The Rowan]

Here in Ontario, kids who are 4'9 and/or 8 yrs old and/or 80lbs can use just the seatbelt. That's what my son does now, if he had a booster he'd be incredibly uncomfortable in my partners little civic lol. He's a tall kid.

 

My 5yr old has a high back booster in my pickup and a backless booster in the civic (2 dr).

[skimomma]

My dd was also small and used a 5-point until she was 8 even though she was ready for a booster.  In our case, we had an older car with only lap belts in the back seat so it was a 5-point harness or basically nothing.  Luckily we replaced that car before she got too big for the 5-point.

 

That said, one thing to consider is that a booster really cannot be installed incorrectly while a 5-point can....and they often are.  So, in my mind, if the kid is big enough and mature enough for a booster, it is probably the better choice.  We used a high-back because we did not have side-curtain airbags and dd likes to sleep in the car.  By 10, she was big enough to go without a booster in most (but not all) cars.

[mom2scouts]

My 7 year old is small and she also rides in a 5 point harness.  For our second car, I just use a high back booster seat.

[kentuckymom]

I just want to add a vote to the "keep in a harness as long as possible in both cars" side. Yes, she MIGHT be as safe in a high back booster, buy why take the risk? My son, who is slightly above average in both height and weight for his age, was in a five point harness until a couple months after his 8th birthday. We only stopped harnessing him because he reached the weight limit for his seat and he'll use the seat as a high back booster until he's tall enough to ride with just the seatbelt. I'm kind of a carseat safety nut. We didn't turn our three year old around until a few months ago, and neither kid will be in the front seat until they're at least 12 years old. And don't even get me started on how lax the laws are here in Kentucky and how people STILL DON'T ABIDE BY THEM (I'm talking 2 year olds in the front seat without a booster).

 

All that said, putting her a high back booster in a car she rides in infrequently isn't a huge risk, and I wouldn't chafe at a local friend who did that, but, if cost isn't a big concern, go with the five point harness since she's petite. Whatever you do, I high recommend putting her in the five point harness seat whenever you travel long distances.

'

[AmandaVT]

Hmm...everything i've read on car-seat.org says that hbb's are just as safe as harnessed seats if the child sits correctly and the seat fits the car correctly. We had to switch DS at 5 and 47lbs to a hbb because we could not get a tight seatbelt install in our new car. We could get a great LATCH install, but the regulations changed with LATCH and the LATCH limits are lower now. So we needed to do a seatbelt install and couldn't get the darn thing tight. I researched a good bit and the car seat techs all told me that hbb was just as safe as long as the child meets all the height/weight requirements and sits properly. I'd put an 8 year old in a booster and feel comfortable with it.

[staceyobu]

 

That said, one thing to consider is that a booster really cannot be installed incorrectly while a 5-point can....and they often are.  So, in my mind, if the kid is big enough and mature enough for a booster, it is probably the better choice.  We used a high-back because we did not have side-curtain airbags and dd likes to sleep in the car.  By 10, she was big enough to go without a booster in most (but not all) cars.

 

 

I also wonder about this causing a decrease in safety in 5-points.  I know we have caught our kids' seats unbuckled (and therefore uninstalled).  And then we wonder how many times we had driven with them unbuckled.  I try to remember to check the seats every time we get in the car, but I don't know that I am 100% reliable.  The kids know they have to buckle themselves in their boosters, so that isn't forgotten.

 

I really wish they would up the latch requirements.  That would make such a difference in ease of getting a correct install. And, my kids can't accidentally unbuckle the latch connectors.

 

By unbuckled, I mean the seat unbuckled from the car. Not the kid unbuckled in the seat.

[MistyMountain]

Once they get to a certain age as long as they fit in the booster properly and can sit in it without shifting out of position a high back booster is just as safe as a 5 point harness seat. My dd is tiny for her age but I have her in a high back booster because the booster seat fits her and she sits in it without wiggling out of position. As long as the lap belt goes across the lap and not the belly and the shoulder strap is in the right spot I am comfortable with boosters from age 5 on if they can sit correctly. There is a definite safety difference between rear and forward facing but it isn't as clear between a booster and a 5 point harness. Some say there is no difference and there are even people who argue that boosters are safer because in an accident the whole body moves a little rather than the head.

[Runningmom80]

My DS is 7.5, 48 lbs and rides in a Maxi Rodi HBB full time. We got a new car and his gigantic frontier no longer fits in our car.  I also found the same thing, that after a certain age, I think it's 5, the harness is no longer thatmuch safer than a properly positioned seat belt.

[MotherGoose]

I got her a high back booster and we have used it a couple of times. She even fell asleep and kept her head back inside the rests so it worked well. In some ways it seems like it gives her more head protection than the 5 point.

[Seeking Squirrels]

A child that fits the belt well in a booster and is mature enough to stay put is just as safe in a booster as a 5 point harness. There is actually no evidence to point to one or the other being safer once a child is ready. Most are by 6 years old (though not all, my almost 6yo is not). Some boosters have better belt fit than others, it just depends on the child. Not all seats fit all kids the same.

 

For leaving the booster behind they need to pass the 5 step test. Bum back, knees bent at the edge of the seat. (Feet touching floor, but realistically this doesn't always happen. Some vehicles have very low floorboards/high seats) Belt low on hips touching thighs, belt across chest crossing mid shoulder, and stay that way the whole ride. For most kids the fit happens around 4'9".

[ondreeuh]

A 5 point harness has a tether and is held down by that plus latch or seatbelt. A booster requires use of seatbelt but what is holding the seat to the car? That's why I have trouble seeing a booster as secure as something that is strapped to the car itself.

 

Edited: I see your username has CPST in it so you might be a tech. Sorry for my ignorance. That was just my personal hang up with the booster as I compare the two.

 

In addition to your valid point, a 5-pt harness is assured of being fit correctly each time it's used, while the fit of a HBB is subject to the position of the kid at any given time. If the kid crosses legs, reaches over, falls asleep and slumps, those all affect seat belt placement.

 

I used to hang out on carseat.org, and at that time there was a constant refrain from the CPSTs that all carseats were equally safe because they had all passed the minimum standards. That is just completely illogical - and of course since that time some of the "safe" seats have been recalled.

[Laura Corin]

Hobbes was in a booster until he was twelve - he's small and the seat belt just didn't fit him until then.

 

L

[Seeking Squirrels]

In addition to your valid point, a 5-pt harness is assured of being fit correctly each time it's used, while the fit of a HBB is subject to the position of the kid at any given time. If the kid crosses legs, reaches over, falls asleep and slumps, those all affect seat belt placement.

 

I used to hang out on carseat.org, and at that time there was a constant refrain from the CPSTs that all carseats were equally safe because they had all passed the minimum standards. That is just completely illogical - and of course since that time some of the "safe" seats have been recalled.

True a booster is dependent on the child sitting correctly, but that is why maturity is a big marker for booster readiness. A child who squirms, reaches, twists around, or slumps while sleeping, is not ready for a booster and is definitely safer in a 5 point.

 

Forces to the spinal column are the biggest concern that brings some to prefer a booster over a 5 point once a child is ready. A 5 point restrains the torso so well that the head is able to extend much farther. Whereas a booster with a 3 point belt allows the torso to move some with the head. No the booster is not (usually) connected to the car. The main purpose of a booster is simply to boost the child to a height that the adult belt fits and restrains them properly.

 

As techs we are not supposed to show favoritism to any certain seat. It is true they all pass the same tests. Even the ones that say "side impact tested" have not passed extra tests. They are tested yes, but there are no standards set. Testing could be throwing a loaf of bread at it. We can speculate that certain features may provide added safety, but until all test results are made available, we cannot know. They very well might be much safer, but it could be bells and whistles. And even some of the perceived "better" seats get recalled. Someone could look at a scenera vs a radian and say that the scenera is too flexible and the radian is obviously stronger. But who's to say the scenera wouldn't give with crash forces better and the radian remain too rigid passing those forces to the child? Each crash scenario is different and there are many factors we just can't know. Safest is what is used properly. Even a 4 year old is safer in a properly used booster than a poorly installed and used 5 point.

[The Governess]

We have this booster:

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B004I5BU84/ref=mp_s_a_1_53?qid=1398952962&sr=8-53&pi=AC_SX110_SY165_QL70

 

It is a beast. Heavy, and it uses the latch system so it doesn't move around at all. The seatbelt positioner/headrest is adjustable, and the side head protection is great for naps. My youngest is using it now after my oldest graduated to a backless booster, and she'll probably be in it for a couple more years.

[gerka528]

My just turned 8 year old is using a low back booster and will be for quite a while.  She weighs in at 41 lbs.

[zoobie]

A 5 point harness has a tether and is held down by that plus latch or seatbelt. A booster requires use of seatbelt but what is holding the seat to the car? That's why I have trouble seeing a booster as secure as something that is strapped to the car itself.

 

Edited: I see your username has CPST in it so you might be a tech. Sorry for my ignorance. That was just my personal hang up with the booster as I compare the two.

Tether weight limits vary by car. Once my kids were old enough for a booster legally, they + car seat weight exceeded my vehicle's tether limit, and we had switched the Frontier to be attached via seat belt. They still rode with the 5-point harness, but essentially the harnessed seat was fastened to the car the same way it would have been in booster mode.

 

You're advised to secure your empty booster seats to keep them from becoming projectiles during an accident. Most people do not think about it. Them being tethered makes that easier and "safer."

 

Your vehicle's tether weight limit will be in the manual. If it's not clear whether the limit includes the weight of the car seat, you may want to call the car company. If it's an older car, be aware that today's seats are significantly heavier than they used to be. If the car assumed a 10 lb seat and has a tethered limit of 45 lb for child, and seats today are 25 lbs, you may want to re-install your seat with the seat belt before your child gets to 45 lbs.

 

Most of the techs I've read do not see a difference between a correctly installed tethered seat and a seat belt installed seat. Usually the tether is easier (therefore more likely to be done correctly), but people forget to check the weight limit and leave the seat tethered past its limits. At that point, the tether would be less safe.