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Buying a harp...


alef
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My six year old wants to take harp lessons, I have found a Suzuki harp teacher in the area and we have a small lap harp she can begin with (3 octaves). The teacher said that will be fine to start out with but by the time her students are about half way through Suzuki book 2 she wants them to have a pedal harp to practice on.

 

Yikes! I was hoping we could just move up to a larger lever harp and make do with that for several years, there are nice used lever harps to be had in the $2,500 range. But a pedal harp? Even the smaller pedals harps seem to run around $10,000 used. 

 

Are there harpists or parents of harpists who can give me some insight into this? I don't see a way to afford $10,000 in the next few years. I told dd we were opening a savings account now and maybe by the time she's a teenager...

 

I'm sure even renting is expensive, I have always bought my musical instruments rather than rented because it seems like a better deal. Is it just that the Suzuki program assumes students have a pedal harp available? Maybe if she doesn't follow the Suzuki program she can get by with a lever harp for a few more years...

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I am not familiar with Suzuki harp, but I know many harp students do not start on pedal harp until 8th or 9th grade. Looking toward the future, lessons, instruments, and replacement strings are going to be a big expense so start saving now ;). But I don't think there is any reason you need to fork over the money for a pedal harp at this age. Pedal harps take a great deal of finger strength and it's hard to imaging a 7yo or 8yo who could manage it.

 

The harp is glorious, though, and by all means you should encourage your dd in it. When the time comes you can just see if her teacher is willing to work with you in that area.

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I am not familiar with Suzuki harp, but I know many harp students do not start on pedal harp until 8th or 9th grade. Looking toward the future, lessons, instruments, and replacement strings are going to be a big expense so start saving now ;). But I don't think there is any reason you need to fork over the money for a pedal harp at this age. Pedal harps take a great deal of finger strength and it's hard to imaging a 7yo or 8yo who could manage it.

 

The harp is glorious, though, and by all means you should encourage your dd in it. When the time comes you can just see if her teacher is willing to work with you in that area.

 

OK, glad to know I'm not way off track thinking a young child shouldn't need a pedal harp. I'm guessing it has to do with Suzuki repertoire...

 

There is another harp teacher in the area that I have considered, but she does not have experience teaching young children; that is the advantage of working with a Suzuki teacher. Maybe we'll just have to start out and see what happens in a year or two. I'm very drawn to folk music myself, so I could see going more that route, but if dd wants to play concert harp I want her to be able to.

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Harps are insanely expensive. They are very expensive to keep up, too. A full set of strings for dd's concert grand run about $450 on sale (once a year sale), and those are the 'seconds' (sound perfect, but have visual imperfections). Then you have to have the 'harp guys' maintain the thing every couple years 'regulating' it for another few hundred. And that is just routine maintenance . . .

 

Fwiw, Ime, most girls aren't big enough physically to handle a pedal harp until they are about twelve, so hope for your dd to grow slowly.

 

Virtually all serious orchestral harpists play on Lyon and Healy harps. Per the advice of our teachers, we have always had l&h harps. My dd's teachers had her begin on a Lyon and Healy lever harp since they have the same high string tension as the pedal harps. Otherwise, if the child gets used to playing on an 'easier' feeling harp, the transition to pedal harp can be rough.

 

My dd started at six on a Lyon and Healy folk harp. That was a decade ago, and i I think I paid around $2500 (new) and it s current value is still around $2000ish. They no longer make that model, but the Troubador is just a bit larger and is a really great little harp. Lots of adults use them, and most teachers keep one or two on hand for lever harp lessons as well as renting. If I were buying a harp now for a beginner, I'd get a Troubador because they are such solid little harps and it'd be a cinch to sell if needed. The Troubador will hold its value without a doubt and be easy to sell if desired, although if she progresses to a pedal harp, she will likely want to keep it, too. If you can find a used one, and your teacher can check it over for you (or send you to the 'harp guy' to check it for you), then buying used would be a no-lose solution.

 

Btw, get insurance on the harps once you are spending more than you can afford to lose. The insurance is is quite cheap (relatively speaking, lol) available through the American Harp Society.

 

Essentially, your teacher is prepping you to spend big $$. If you wait to age 11 or 12, she will be big enough for a concert grand, which means she can take that harp to college, orchestras, etc. If you get a smaller pedal harp, plan to trade up. Lyon and Healy has trade in programs.

 

A l&h cgi pedal harp will run around $20k minimum. So, save up now.

 

For years, I have often half joked that if dd isn't going to practice her harp anymore, woohoo, let's sell it and I can get my dream kitchen. Lol, now we are actually building my dream kitchen and a music room, lol.

 

So, anyway, harps are crazy expensive. Everything about them. And inconvenient. And bulky, awkward, and fragile. But, there is nothing so beautiful. And, paying gigs are pretty easy to come by. And they pay well. :)

 

Pm me if you have other questions.

 

Enjoy!

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I didn't take Suzuki harp lessons. I started harp in 4th grade using a rented lever harp. After a year, I received my own harp, still a lever harp (5 octaves). I usually used a pedal harp at lessons. I played for five years, and never had a problem using a lever harp. I didn't find it difficult to switch between the lever harp at home & the pedal harp at lessons. A small number of pieces had to be rearranged to play on the lever harp. In my case a smaller harp was preferable, because I had to transport the harp between home and school several times a week for band. I can't imagine regularly transporting a pedal harp. The school planned to rent me a pedal harp for high school, but I quit after 8th grade.

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My daughter just started taking harp this fall. We are renting a beautiful L&H Troubadour. It's really a lovely harp, but even it's a little too big for her. I have her sitting on a tall kitchen stool to get her to the correct height and then she has a stepstool to set her feet on so they aren't dangling. I can't even imagine her with a pedal harp at this point. She's nearly 10, but she would be way too small to get her arms around it. We were told (by both her teacher & at the harp store) that it would probably be 3-5 yrs before she was advanced enough to need a pedal harp. That gives her time to grow and us time to save. The store we bought from allows us to apply 100% of the rent toward the purchase price, so we felt good about renting initially. We will probable pay the balance at the end of the year if dd is still happy and wanting to continue. They also allow us to trade the lever harp back in within 5 yrs, and it's value will go toward the purchase of a pedal harp. I don't know if we'll want to do that or keep the lever harp, but it's a pretty good policy.

 

I don't know anything about Suzuki harp, but it seems like a big jump to go from a lap harp to a pedal harp. Is this an issue with playing the Suzuki repertoire? One of the criticisms I've heard about Suzuki piano is that the sequence of songs was done with the violin in mind, so it doesn't transfer smoothly to piano in terms of difficulty. I don't have the experience to know whether that's true or not (my kids take traditional piano lessons), but I wonder if maybe there is a similar issue with transferring Suzuki to harp. Have you had an opportunity to speak to the other harp teacher? I wouldn't dismiss her just because she normally teaches older students. If she has a gentle personality and a positive manner, then it could wind up being a good situation.

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Harps are insanely expensive. They are very expensive to keep up, too. A full set of strings for dd's concert grand run about $450 on sale (once a year sale), and those are the 'seconds' (sound perfect, but have visual imperfections). Then you have to have the 'harp guys' maintain the thing every couple years 'regulating' it for another few hundred. And that is just routine maintenance . . .

 

Fwiw, Ime, most girls aren't big enough physically to handle a pedal harp until they are about twelve, so hope for your dd to grow slowly.

 

Virtually all serious orchestral harpists play on Lyon and Healy harps. Per the advice of our teachers, we have always had l&h harps. My dd's teachers had her begin on a Lyon and Healy lever harp since they have the same high string tension as the pedal harps. Otherwise, if the child gets used to playing on an 'easier' feeling harp, the transition to pedal harp can be rough.

 

My dd started at six on a Lyon and Healy folk harp. That was a decade ago, and i I think I paid around $2500 (new) and it s current value is still around $2000ish. They no longer make that model, but the Troubador is just a bit larger and is a really great little harp. Lots of adults use them, and most teachers keep one or two on hand for lever harp lessons as well as renting. If I were buying a harp now for a beginner, I'd get a Troubador because they are such solid little harps and it'd be a cinch to sell if needed. The Troubador will hold its value without a doubt and be easy to sell if desired, although if she progresses to a pedal harp, she will likely want to keep it, too. If you can find a used one, and your teacher can check it over for you (or send you to the 'harp guy' to check it for you), then buying used would be a no-lose solution.

 

Btw, get insurance on the harps once you are spending more than you can afford to lose. The insurance is is quite cheap (relatively speaking, lol) available through the American Harp Society.

 

Essentially, your teacher is prepping you to spend big $$. If you wait to age 11 or 12, she will be big enough for a concert grand, which means she can take that harp to college, orchestras, etc. If you get a smaller pedal harp, plan to trade up. Lyon and Healy has trade in programs.

 

A l&h cgi pedal harp will run around $20k minimum. So, save up now.

 

For years, I have often half joked that if dd isn't going to practice her harp anymore, woohoo, let's sell it and I can get my dream kitchen. Lol, now we are actually building my dream kitchen and a music room, lol.

 

So, anyway, harps are crazy expensive. Everything about them. And inconvenient. And bulky, awkward, and fragile. But, there is nothing so beautiful. And, paying gigs are pretty easy to come by. And they pay well. :)

 

Pm me if you have other questions.

 

Enjoy!

 

Thank you so much for sharing your experience. The harps I was looking at (online, I haven't been to the store yet) were L & H Ogden models, it looks like they are a step down from the Troubadours (is the Ogden what your daughter used by chance?). I wonder how much difference there is, the Ogden is certainly more affordable. I was looking at used harps here. I wonder if their bounty program applies to used harps? I'll have to ask. We live within driving distance of a Lyon and Healy store but I haven't been there before. I think we will start with what we have and keep putting money in that savings account :)

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My daughter just started taking harp this fall. We are renting a beautiful L&H Troubadour. It's really a lovely harp, but even it's a little too big for her. I have her sitting on a tall kitchen stool to get her to the correct height and then she has a stepstool to set her feet on so they aren't dangling. I can't even imagine her with a pedal harp at this point. She's nearly 10, but she would be way too small to get her arms around it. We were told (by both her teacher & at the harp store) that it would probably be 3-5 yrs before she was advanced enough to need a pedal harp. That gives her time to grow and us time to save. The store we bought from allows us to apply 100% of the rent toward the purchase price, so we felt good about renting initially. We will probable pay the balance at the end of the year if dd is still happy and wanting to continue. They also allow us to trade the lever harp back in within 5 yrs, and it's value will go toward the purchase of a pedal harp. I don't know if we'll want to do that or keep the lever harp, but it's a pretty good policy.

 

I don't know anything about Suzuki harp, but it seems like a big jump to go from a lap harp to a pedal harp. Is this an issue with playing the Suzuki repertoire? One of the criticisms I've heard about Suzuki piano is that the sequence of songs was done with the violin in mind, so it doesn't transfer smoothly to piano in terms of difficulty. I don't have the experience to know whether that's true or not (my kids take traditional piano lessons), but I wonder if maybe there is a similar issue with transferring Suzuki to harp. Have you had an opportunity to speak to the other harp teacher? I wouldn't dismiss her just because she normally teaches older students. If she has a gentle personality and a positive manner, then it could wind up being a good situation.

 

I think the other teacher might work out, we may do a trial with both and see which seems a better fit. The Suzuki teacher has more years of teaching experience, in addition to experience with younger children. I don't know how dedicated she is to the Suzuki method and repertoire. I agree that Suzuki does not work the same way on piano as on violin. 

 

I'm sitting here thinking maybe we should just hold off for a year. That would save us close to $1000 in lesson fees that we could put towards a nicer harp, and dd being a year older might make things easier.

 

Hmmm, lots to think about. 

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Thank you so much for sharing your experience. The harps I was looking at (online, I haven't been to the store yet) were L & H Ogden models, it looks like they are a step down from the Troubadours (is the Ogden what your daughter used by chance?). I wonder how much difference there is, the Ogden is certainly more affordable. I was looking at used harps here. I wonder if their bounty program applies to used harps? I'll have to ask. We live within driving distance of a Lyon and Healy store but I haven't been there before. I think we will start with what we have and keep putting money in that savings account :)

 

I just googled it, and it looks to me like the Ogden replaced the Folk Harp. We bought the Folk Harp in about 2003, and I think they stopped making it (and started making the Ogden) a few years ago. They are very similar, but the Ogden has several subtle improvements. 

 

Definitely consider buying a used harp if a teacher will help you find it. Their sound generally improves with age, so age is not generally a negative with harps. A good harp tech can easily evaluate it and tell you what, if any, work it needs. Lever harps are pretty straight-forward (unlike the deep mysteries of the pedal harp, lol), so it isn't hard for someone to evaluate it. Frankly, your teacher can likely do a decent job telling you if anything is wrong with a lever harp. 

 

We ended up buying a 1916 harp for dd's concert grand. :) We spent more on the repairs/rebuild than we did on the initial purchase, and that was for a fully functioning working harp to start with! But, at the end of the day, we have a harp with a spectacular sound that gets raves from anyone in the know, plus we got a gold harp, which is a show-stopper anywhere she performs, when we would have never spent the extra 20k for the gold if we were buying new. (I tried not to keep track, but I think we ended up paying, all told, maybe 30-40% more than we would have if we'd just bought a new unornamented CG from L&H, but at least 30% LESS than what a gold one would have cost new.) 

 

Just for fun, look at the photos of the rebuild here: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.202747126534279.51421.202217259920599&type=3

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I just googled it, and it looks to me like the Ogden replaced the Folk Harp. We bought the Folk Harp in about 2003, and I think they stopped making it (and started making the Ogden) a few years ago. They are very similar, but the Ogden has several subtle improvements. 

 

Definitely consider buying a used harp if a teacher will help you find it. Their sound generally improves with age, so age is not generally a negative with harps. A good harp tech can easily evaluate it and tell you what, if any, work it needs. Lever harps are pretty straight-forward (unlike the deep mysteries of the pedal harp, lol), so it isn't hard for someone to evaluate it. Frankly, your teacher can likely do a decent job telling you if anything is wrong with a lever harp. 

 

We ended up buying a 1916 harp for dd's concert grand. :) We spent more on the repairs/rebuild than we did on the initial purchase, and that was for a fully functioning working harp to start with! But, at the end of the day, we have a harp with a spectacular sound that gets raves from anyone in the know, plus we got a gold harp, which is a show-stopper anywhere she performs, when we would have never spent the extra 20k for the gold if we were buying new. (I tried not to keep track, but I think we ended up paying, all told, maybe 30-40% more than we would have if we'd just bought a new unornamented CG from L&H, but at least 30% LESS than what a gold one would have cost new.) 

 

Just for fun, look at the photos of the rebuild here: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.202747126534279.51421.202217259920599&type=3

 

Thanks for sharing the photos, that really is a beautiful harp.

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I think the other teacher might work out, we may do a trial with both and see which seems a better fit. The Suzuki teacher has more years of teaching experience, in addition to experience with younger children. I don't know how dedicated she is to the Suzuki method and repertoire. I agree that Suzuki does not work the same way on piano as on violin. 

 

I'm sitting here thinking maybe we should just hold off for a year. That would save us close to $1000 in lesson fees that we could put towards a nicer harp, and dd being a year older might make things easier.

 

Hmmm, lots to think about. 

Your daughter is 6? Our experience has been that it's better to wait. I don't mean waiting until 12 or anything like that, but sometimes being 7, 8, or 9 can make such a difference compared to starting at 4, 5, or 6. This isn't true for every child - obviously some children are musically precocious and highly committed - but I've found it to be generally true for my kids and for our friends who are also serious about music. The slightly later start is often balanced by slightly quicker progress.

 

After starting our oldest on piano at 6, we have gradually drifted toward slightly later starting ages with our younger children. The original plan was to let our daughter add harp (or switch to harp) when she was 8, but we wound up waiting until she was 9 and I don't have any regrets about that at this point. It has been helpful to have the piano background, and she has the age and maturity to really jump in with harp. Dd's biggest frustration in the first couple of months was the teacher moving super s - l - o -w - l - y to make sure dd was mastering the technique. Now that she has mastered basic technique (and built up some callouses) she is progressing relatively quickly and sounds just beautiful already. Harp (unlike some strings or woodwinds) is a wonderfully forgiving instrument; even when you are a beginner, it sounds beautiful.

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I just googled it, and it looks to me like the Ogden replaced the Folk Harp. We bought the Folk Harp in about 2003, and I think they stopped making it (and started making the Ogden) a few years ago. They are very similar, but the Ogden has several subtle improvements. 

 

Definitely consider buying a used harp if a teacher will help you find it. Their sound generally improves with age, so age is not generally a negative with harps. A good harp tech can easily evaluate it and tell you what, if any, work it needs. Lever harps are pretty straight-forward (unlike the deep mysteries of the pedal harp, lol), so it isn't hard for someone to evaluate it. Frankly, your teacher can likely do a decent job telling you if anything is wrong with a lever harp. 

 

We ended up buying a 1916 harp for dd's concert grand. :) We spent more on the repairs/rebuild than we did on the initial purchase, and that was for a fully functioning working harp to start with! But, at the end of the day, we have a harp with a spectacular sound that gets raves from anyone in the know, plus we got a gold harp, which is a show-stopper anywhere she performs, when we would have never spent the extra 20k for the gold if we were buying new. (I tried not to keep track, but I think we ended up paying, all told, maybe 30-40% more than we would have if we'd just bought a new unornamented CG from L&H, but at least 30% LESS than what a gold one would have cost new.) 

 

Just for fun, look at the photos of the rebuild here: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.202747126534279.51421.202217259920599&type=3

 

What a beautiful harp!

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I've found a Lyon and Healy Folk Harp for sale in my area for $1600. I wonder if I should go ahead and jump on that as a harp my dd could use for a few years? It would probably need a new set of strings but is otherwise in good condition. Thoughts?

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I've found a Lyon and Healy Folk Harp for sale in my area for $1600. I wonder if I should go ahead and jump on that as a harp my dd could use for a few years? It would probably need a new set of strings but is otherwise in good condition. Thoughts?

 

Sounds like a great move to me. I'd do it!

 

DD's folk harp has served her very well for this decade and is still going strong.

 

Ideally, you should check with your dd's teacher and get her OK and you should, ideally, have the teacher take a look/listen before you commit. If it is local, then the owner would likely agree to meet you (with harp) at a location and time convenient to your teacher, then you will pay your teacher her regular lesson fee for the hour to evaluate the harp. (Your teacher might not charge, but you should offer!) Then, so long as it checks out, you give the owner their check.

 

I think the Folk Harp is a really nice little harp. My dd still uses it sometimes for low-key ensemble playing when we don't want the hassle/risk/effort involved in lugging the big harp around. So, IME, you are likely to get lots of good out of it, and, besides, it should be easy to sell if/when you need to.

 

New strings for the folk harp should be around $250ish. In fact, right about now is the once a year sale on strings.at Vanderbilt, so when you get the harp, call Vanderbilt and find out when the sale starts, and be sure to buy them then. I think it is January-ish, and is the only way to get any discount on strings that I know of. It's like 20% so it's worth the trouble! All you have to do is tell them what kind of harp it is, and they will have a whole set of strings for it, and will generally give you an option of the slightly cheaper "imperfect" bow brand (go with those, they are really just fine) or the full price perfect ones. 

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Sounds like a great move to me. I'd do it!

 

DD's folk harp has served her very well for this decade and is still going strong.

 

Ideally, you should check with your dd's teacher and get her OK and you should, ideally, have the teacher take a look/listen before you commit. If it is local, then the owner would likely agree to meet you (with harp) at a location and time convenient to your teacher, then you will pay your teacher her regular lesson fee for the hour to evaluate the harp. (Your teacher might not charge, but you should offer!) Then, so long as it checks out, you give the owner their check.

 

I think the Folk Harp is a really nice little harp. My dd still uses it sometimes for low-key ensemble playing when we don't want the hassle/risk/effort involved in lugging the big harp around. So, IME, you are likely to get lots of good out of it, and, besides, it should be easy to sell if/when you need to.

 

New strings for the folk harp should be around $250ish. In fact, right about now is the once a year sale on strings.at Vanderbilt, so when you get the harp, call Vanderbilt and find out when the sale starts, and be sure to buy them then. I think it is January-ish, and is the only way to get any discount on strings that I know of. It's like 20% so it's worth the trouble! All you have to do is tell them what kind of harp it is, and they will have a whole set of strings for it, and will generally give you an option of the slightly cheaper "imperfect" bow brand (go with those, they are really just fine) or the full price perfect ones. 

 

It's about sixty miles away, further than I drive very often. The family selling did offer to give me their harp teacher's number so I could at least get her opinion. I will ask both the teachers we are considering for dd, they can at least tell me what they think of the model. It does sound like this harp has served your daughter well, that is very encouraging! I talked to my husband about it and he said he would trust my judgment. Good man there...

 

Thank you for the tip on strings! Now I just need to go through finances and decide whether we really can afford this right now.

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